Dr. Allen Davis: The Investigative Judgment - Fact or Fiction? (Pt. 1)
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- Опубликовано: 4 фев 2025
- In what has transformed into a short video series, I’ll be discussing the Investigative Judgment, one of the major doctrines of Seventh-day Adventism. In fact, this doctrine is unique to the denomination, and is born out of two failed visions by Ellen White: the shut door and seven-year theory, the latter of which was actually a confirmation of Joseph Bates’s erroneous ideas.
This study will be much more detailed than others I’ve done on this channel. I will conduct a critical analysis of the SDA understanding of the subject, as well as a rigorous examination of biblical texts that dismantle the teaching.
I attended a local evangelical for the first time in my life on a Sunday last week. I was late but I did manage to catch their communion service. It was an emotional experience for me, I really did feel the Spirit move and for the first time in my life I felt free from the curse of the Law. This is a new testimony that I have that simply cannot keep silent on. Praise the living Lord Jesus Christ who intercedes for our sins CONTINUALLY despite our morally corrupt and depraved natures!
Please pray for me and my family as we navigate our way out of SDA'ism.
Much credit to you, Myles (Answering Adventism), Colleen/Nikki (Former Adventist), and AcademyApologia.
Thx for your testimony! We’ll pray for your journey and your closer walk with the Savior! 🙏🏻
allen is not helping you out of adventism ,by the time he is done with you you will remember this message.you are better studying with a christian who is not former SDA,who is growing with an open mind than asking formers SDA
@thebookofrevelationstudypr8411 Your words demonstrate the mind of a very sick and twisted person, who purports to be a Christian, but actually is only a sanctimonious fox.
@@thebookofrevelationstudypr8411 Both Allen and the pastors at my newly adopted church have helped me immensely over the past 11 months. Our family continues to grow in our understanding re the true gospel of Jesus Christ in our post SDA lives.
@ajw9975 This individual comments from time to time, and generally says nothing of substance.
I appreciate your kind words. I’m happy to know, your journey out of the cult has thus far been rewarding.
Now it is getting interesting, let the cards fall where they may! Ellen White is a very hard pill to swallow and last time I checked I just could not find a thing in my NKJV or KJV that referred me to her for knowledge or advice. Dr. Davis kept this information coming as many Adventist and X-Adventist need this to settle the mind and get to "Biblical Truth"! Thank you Sir, looking forward to hearing your research.
Dr.Allen Davis believes that born again Christians do not have to worry whether they are saved or not..& that they can have a full assurance that Christ has saved them..is Dr. Davis
also saving that this assurance is permanent & that he now believes in "once you are saved, that you will always be saved"?..security in Christ & assurance
af salvation are separate doctrines..
a born again Christian is saved forever..but
he may or may not be assured of that fact..
nevertheless, the Holy
Spirit wants all Christians to rest in their knowledge of Christ as the faithful Shephard of the redeemed..that He never loses His children.. that they
are all kept safe & saved by His power
forever & ever...I am
Southern Baptist..we
have no problem in
believing in the eternal security of the believer..or in the
preservation of the saints & that doctrine comes from the bible alone..we are not Calvinists at all.
@charlesmargolin2226 Let's briefly examine what you've said that warrants my comment.
- "Dr.Allen Davis believes that born again Christians do not have to worry whether they are saved or not..& that they can have a full assurance that Christ has saved them. [I]s Dr. Davis also sa[y]ing that this assurance is permanent & that he now believes in 'once you are saved, that you will always be saved'?" *First off, let's make sure you understand me correctly. Assurance in Christ means just that: His sacrifice and finished work are all that's needed for the repentant sinner to be saved. Within that construct, the willing suppliant must remain connected, but note, it's really God and Jesus who are holding on to the believer. Is the believer free to release and walk away? Of course. Permanence of salvation is not based upon what God or Jesus have done or will do; rather, it's about whether or not the believer chooses to remain in a saving relationship.*
- "Security in Christ & assurance of salvation are separate doctrines." *I disagree. Please provide some evidence as to why you think this is so. Salvation is forever (again, if the believer so chooses), and the Bible gives clear hope and assurance of this fact: "He that hath the Son hath life; [and] he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God." (1 John 5:12-13 KJV) I don't see how this idea is missed, unless the person's over-concern for him- or herself blinds the individual from the truth. The two go hand-in-hand.*
- "...we have no problem in believing in the eternal security of the believer..." *Which one is it then? Again, security and assurance, when accepted by faith, should be the same thing. Only the one who doesn't trust God would question his or her salvation. This is demonic doctrine of SDA-ism's Investigative Judgment.*
BOTTOM LINE: Please ask questions instead of making assumptions. I'm always happy to answer plainly and thoroughly.
@@DrAD767the problem or question needs to be answered one question at a time..(#1)..humans are body
& soul & spirit..& they are
separate..a lost person has a dead spirit..dead in trespasses & sins..Christ cannot dwell in a dead spot or a spot defiled by sin..& the scrptures say that whatever God does, He does forever..so..when a lost person prays & asks Christ to come into His heart forever to stay..
Christ brings his dead spirit to life & then He cleanses it forever..past & present & future sins ..in advance..
setting up an eternal & unending relationship
with Christ..unconditioally
& irrevocably..(2)..there is
no one day at a time salvation..or..let me try this out for a couple of weeks..it
is like a marriage..for better
or worse..until death..(#3)..
there is a sin unto physical death for a Christion..if a new Christian sins out of igmorance.., Christ will tell that itnis wrong..& if he doesn't atop, then Crist will chastise him & will eventually shorten his life physically if he doesnt stop..& he or she will then go into heaven prematurely & will be unhappy during the 1000
yrs..& will get a new heart &
mind..so that everyone will be equally happy in the new heaven & new earth forever..
(#4)..i think that i have asked the question before, but you
keep ignoring what i am saying..you read fast & do
not think about what you are reading..like dyxlexia..you talk slowly & speak & think clearly..
but someing is wrong with your ability to discern the spirits..no offense is intended...could be your paleo or keto diet with very little carbohydrates. (?)..or because of the use of synthetic vitamins.(?)..i eat
all organically frown foods & grass fed organic fat free milk & free range organic chicken egg whites..no meat or fish..just grains & nuts & seeds & herbs & spices.& fruits...i do not use the oils of nut butters..i have a garden & compost peels & weeds & leaves & limbs, etc to make rich soil..that is the only fertizer that i use..i do not use any vitamins or pills..i only use a slow cooker...i do not fry or bake or use oils
Between you, Dr Davis, Jim Baber, and Dr Steve Daily, it’s possible to get a firm grasp on the slippery doctrines of SDA. Thank-you for your efforts.
Continue on your journey sir. I love to see and listen to honest people.
First! Thanks for all the great content you've produced so far, Dr. Allen. I knew you on SDAQ&A and am enjoying the content, keep up the good work, sir! Saludos desde Argentina
Hello Dr. Davis,
This presentation is very much appreciated! Outstanding work!
(I am a Haitian evangelist who lives in a commune where the majority of the population has been bewitched by 7th Day Adventism.)
The true Gospel of grace through faith in Christ is an offense to the legalist!
Great presentation, Dr Davis. What bothers me about the Investigative Judgment is that not only are the Ten Commandments going to judge you when your name comes up but also your wasted moments. The moments you are wasting not perpetuating Ellen’s “light”. It really is the most perfect doctrine for a false prophet to emerge under.
I have two more presentations I’m finalizing on the subject, and I’ve kinda danced on what you’ve shared, but your succinctness hits the mark. May I quote you? (I don’t wanna be like Ellen….)
@@DrAD767 Sure. One of the last scenes in my 5th video (@50:22)demonstrates this by showing the GC and her writings side by side where you can see the thoughts run together.
@@TesttheProphet there is no such things written in the bible about the investigative judgement.
1st john 2:2 and he ( jesus CHRIST) is the propitiation for our sins and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
2nd john 9 whosoever transgressed, and abideth not in the doctrine of CHRIST, HATH NOT GOD.
@reynaldoguarra5690 Yes, he realizes and understands that. He’s highlighting the erroneous SDA error.
Clear, plain, obvious biblical truth. A child could grasp it. And also great point about the 7 year Shut Door period which is often overlooked and their twisting of any “judgment” passages to hitch 1844 to.
One would think, right? It simply amazes me, how folk want to remain stuck in this system, and yet, I understand, it's a cult. It has its own economy, its own social structure, its own education system, its own healthcare system, etc. To remove oneself from the cult means to be out of plumb with friends, associates, family, etc. You know all about this fact.
For me, I've grown mentally weary of all the mindless attacks and lack of critical thinking. Like Elijah, I often feel like I'm the only one left standing for God and truth.
I work in Chattanooga,TN. A hub for Adventist, because of the college here Southern Adventist University. We have very smart people here who are Adventist, just like Mormons. I believe that the Gospel of Christ is a spiritual revelation not a knowledge based revelation. Most Adventist I work with have no idea what this doctrine is , yet it shaped every biblical doctrine they believe.
I became almost home less after I decided to leave SDA Cult. Yet I know I don't live for this world. I wish I would die but not depend on their umbilical and anti christian doctrines.
Good morning (11:47a.m here in Panama) Dr. Davis. May God Almighty continue blessing, keeping and guiding you and your family.
I've been discovering & praying about these things so much lately. I'm almost convinced it's a miraculous confirmation from God that I'm not only on the right track but also not alone. It's been a painful, lonely, and very inconvenient journey but it's also amazing to me how incredible pure, objective truth from God is! I love it. Thank you for following Godly integrity - say a fast prayer for mine. 🙂
You are indeed in our prayers. It's not an easy exodus, but once you're outside the walls of SDA-ism, it becomes more and more clear how cultish its beliefs actually are.
I know my Sheep and they hear my voice . In this verse is no investigation . God is all knowing , the beginning and the end . He knew from before creation who will be there and who will not . The thief on the cross next to him was told that he will be in the Kingdom today .
No. This is a result of a minor interpretation from the Greek. It actually is a little ambiguous. But since it is clear that Jesus did not go to Paradise on that day, the comma is probably in the wrong place, knowing that the original wording had no comma. "I tell you this day, you shall be with Me in Paradise."
Hi Dr. Allen, I'm a third generation SDA and I studied this topic in dept because I feel if this doctrine does not stand scrutiny the whole SDA doctrine collapsed.
Albion F. Ballenger made far more sense than her defence. When Ballenger challenge her on this doctrine she went of defensive.
Hi Isaac, prior to this information we all watched tonight I made a comment to Dr. Davis that anytime this subject is questioned by or with an Adventist they seem to go on the defense! This why it is important to have a man with great research skills like Dr. Davis explain in detail what is really happening here: this is needed badly and this man is standing up to the plate!
@@doug6072 What is most important is for each of us to be Bereans and search the scriptures for ourselves.
Yes, studying for ourselves is the most important thing to do. Sadly, most people don’t know how to study, nor do they use consistent hermeneutics.
May God bless Dr Davis more to teach his gospel truth to his people .
May God bless Dr Davis more to teach his gospel truth to his people .
Excellent and informative presentation. These truths are very difficult to comprehend for many Adventists. Cognitive dissonance will drive them to rip the presenter into small pieces, rather than face the facts. Facts are very stubborn, no matter how long and hard you ignore them, they stay putt. SDAs need to take their eyes off Ellen White and her writings, and place them on Christ and His Holy Word, the Bible.
There are a lot of things about this doctrine that make literally no sense whatsoever. One thing that comes to mind, the idea that Jesus first takes up the cases of the dead to judge their lives. And then at some point he switches to taking up the cases of the living. Well at the time he switches, does he magically stop every death on earth so he can take up the cases of the living. There are people dying every second of time all across the world. Every day about 160,000 people around the world.
@DavidTschoepe - Yes, I too have wondered the exact same thing.
See my post of 8/6/24 (Danielocarey9392).
Crystal clear! Thank you Dr. Allen.
Hello, Dr. Davis. The fan behind you gives you a halo. Thank you for your insight on Ellen White. The early pioneers were very intelligent people and they are worth reading about and through their writings. Learning about Ellen White's massive copying of other authors of her day and her false prophetic claims in the 1840s has turned me inside out on the idea of being part of the elect. Maybe finding out about E.G.W.s fallen condition has reaffirmed my stance on the idea of being part of the elect. Thank you for posting these videos. They are for people like me. Also, I am certain about the passages from Revelation 12:17 and 14:12 that the original keeping of the seventh-day Sabbath is a requirement of God blessing the seventh day and sanctifying it. Please comment on this for me for I am without a church that sees things without the massive interference Ellen White puts on a person's faith. To stay would make me into an actor and I have enough problems being single and having a life-changing lower lumbar fusion surgery coming up next month. Please opine on my choice of leaving and now walking alone in a faith that is greater than at any time in my life. Thanks, Dr. Davis.
I hope these videos help you break free from the trap that is SDA-ism. It’s so sinister how they rope a person in with their purported Bible knowledge, and then introduce EGW in such a way to make it appear her writings agree with the sacred text. Her writings do agree with their skewed interpretation, but that’s about it. It’s a self-licking ice cream cone.
Fabulous presentation, Dr. Davis!
You have the facts and present them succinctly and accurately. We must pray for our brothers and sisters who are so deeply deluded by Adventism.
I would love to hear your exegesis of Dan. 8:14
I so appreciate your videos. Should be very interesting your video about the Branch Davidions and Waco. I always have been interested in that situation.
Thumbs up brother 👍really well explained keep preaching brother and God bless!
Matthew's 11:13 law and prophet is until john
Ellen White is not a Biblical Prophet of God.
Brother Myles Christian would love to have you on his Podcast this I know. Our Lord and God Jesus Christ would bless so many. May God bless you immensely.
No, he really wouldn’t. I’ve done two shows with him, and he’s taken them down. We disagree on the trinity issue.
❤ AMEN AND AMEN KEEP IT COMING
I was very close to joining SDA. I was skeptical of EGW overall, but it was the investigative judgement that REALLY convinced me that something was wrong! I’m so grateful for the discernment I’ve been blessed with!
I still honor the Shabbat, because it is biblical but the SOP is not from the Most High!
Exactly! Thx for sharing.
Well done A. D.
New Covenant Research
Blessings Brother, you put a lot in this vid and my mind is still unzipping the file. 😅
I'll just say thanks for the moment, it's been a busy day.
🤠👍
Now THAT made me chuckle!
@RandomTChance - I agree, and I found I kept needing to pause then rewind back some to re-listen again trying to process the content.
Please tell me what the books in heaven are for that we are judged out of.
Figurative language. Again, I ask you, What is the Gospel? Where did we see the fulfillment of God’s judgment?
Also, read Daniel 7:9-14, carefully, and compare it to Revelation 5. There is nothing in Daniel that isn’t in Revelation when it concerns the saints and the Son of Man.
I think this is a valid question in this matter. I wish it could be answered.
With due respect to you Dr Davis you are failing to understand the concept of the investigative judgement.
At some point you are saying the doctrine embarrasses the church. Let me tell trust does not embarrass. You again talk about Pastor Steve Bohr explaining the concept starting from Genesis and you say you commend Pastor Bohr for trying to save the denomination. I think this is embarrassing on you part because Pastor was explaining God's truth.
To take Bohr's argument further you must read the parable of in Mathew 22 regarding the father who organizes a wedding for his son. While the guests were all in the wedding room before the wedding could happen the further came to check the guests if they had the wedding garment. That represents the investigative judgement.
Dr I think you need to take further time and not rush to listen to the explanation of the concept. God will surely help you understand.
Regards
I understand the IJ completely. It's a form of meritocracy. When you read Revelation, especially Rev 14:7, you'll notice God's judgment had already come -- it was not for 1844. Yehovah's judgment came at the cross: the world was condemned; at the same time, it was saved. The question now becomes, "Do you choose life, or do you choose death?"
Those who choose life accept the finished work of Christ on the cross (read Rev 12 carefully). Those who choose death refuse His work and they'd rather try to save themselves by their works -- infused righteousness.
This does not mean one doesn't walk in the spirit and perform the works thereof (i.e., true religion cf. Jas 1:27). God forbid! Rather, they enter into the finished work of Christ and minister His righteousness to others, so they too might accept Yehovah. Think of it this way: Just as Jesus said, "If you've seen me, you've seen the Father," in the same way we should be able to proclaim, "If you've seen me, then you've seen Yehovah's work in me via Jesus."
It's in that manner every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of Yehovah our Father.
How is it then that when Jesus returns He will bring His rewards with Him if He has not made some form of judgement?
Please leep them coming. I do have trouble keeping up though, Maybe a little slower talking would be better for me but not complaining.. I never mind long videos, I prefer them to really short ones.
I just listened to an interview with Desmond Doss on the Investigative Judgment. He was living until a few years ago. Doctor Allen has officially joined the camp of Desmond Doss. From what little I have heard, they seem to be in total agreement.
I think you mean Dr. Desmond Ford. Although Doss was a good and brave man, I would not put him into the camp of the biblically discerning.
That said, the late Dr. Ford and I would’ve agreed on some things, but the issue of EGW would’ve been a contention, in that, I think her place is anywhere but in the hands of a true Bible student. Dr. Ford was spot on when he stated, if the SDA church ever puts her on par with Scripture, or if belief in her purported prophetic status is required for membership (i.e., a fundamental belief), then the church would be a cult.
That’s exactly where things are as of 1981.
Keep Sabbath. Don't kill people. Read the Bible. Leave White's books on the shelf. See my post of 8/6/24 (Danielocarey9392).
@@DrAD767 Yes, of course it is Ford. What I was referring to mainly was the disbelief in the Investigative Judgement. What I concluded for my position, after listening to his views on the I.J. was, it's for the purpose of Jesus choosing his bride. He has every right to be sure he is allowing someone into eternity who deserves to be there. Perhaps most importantly, that they will not reintroduce sin. That has to do with His purpose for the I..J. and likely outweighs any other purpose we may see in it. I don't think that idea came directly from Ellen White, but everything else she has said about I.J. helps me to understand it.
In the Great Controversy book there is mention of angels and heavenly beings watching events play out on earth in order to determine if God is just. This does not make sense at all- for one thing why would such highly intelligent beings need thousands of years to understand God's character.
Because that idea fits into the skewed narrative.
God is allowing the proof. But the angels already know it, even if they are fallen ones. See my post of 8/6/24 (Danielocarey9392).
We HAVE BEEN RECONCILED to God. Romans 5: 8-12, 2Corinthians 5: 17-20
Colossians 1:22
This idea even by itself makes the whole trash heap that is called the Investigative Judgment collapse. God is not Reconciling us to himself thru some investigative process in heaven started 200 years ago, he did it 2000 years ago in the life, death and resurrection of Jesus Christ our Lord.
Yup, and I’m going to cover this aspect in the next video.
@@DrAD767 looking forward to that video! When I stumbled upon Des Ford and his teaching on the IJ doctrine about 6 months ago, and then started to re-read the scriptures again, I’ll never forget reading Hebrews 9 and the scales falling from my eyes. And I’ve never looked back. Since then I have been one by one untying all the knots that Adventism has bound me with over the years. Steve Daily, Des Ford, Myles from Answering Adventism and so many more have helped along my journey. I’m glad to have found you along the way also. I’m still an active member of the SDA church, mostly because I love my local church community so much. But, theologically I can barely call myself Adventist now, other than I still observe the Sabbath (though due to re-reading Hebrews 4 my views have changed dramatically even on that issue) and I still hold to the annihilation of the wicked doctrine. Blessings my brother. May God bless your ministry. I hope many more Adventists will come to know the true Gospel thru your channel.
@@blueticks8423 Hey Brother, it's good to hear you're growing in Grace.
Blessings 🕊️
True. See my post of 8/6/24 (Danielocarey9392).
I am always looking forward to your presentations and appreciate your effort to speak what you believe is the truth about this particular denomination. I am still a novice when it comes to understanding Biblical concepts. I’ve been following you since your first video. I believe that Jesus alone is the way and as he says in the book of John 6. What denomination would you recommend to someone who is still learning about Jesus like myself?
No denomination. Find a church that sticks to the Bible. As a novice, if you hear Ellen White, get up and leave. That will be your clue they don’t stick to the Bible.
@@DrAD767 Hello! What do you think about the trinity and nontrinity in sda?
@@knimra5958 Put your question in the main Comment Section. They don't always show up in these threads. 🤷🕊️
@@knimra5958 Thx for your question. Here are my theological thoughts re: the matter. If you search YT, you'll find more about what I think.
There is but one God, the Great Jehovah, who is the Supreme Deity and Creator of the Universe. He is eternal: without beginning and without end. He is holy, loving, merciful, just, and compassionate. He desires all would come to Him in the manner He has prescribed - thru His only-begotten Son, Jesus Christ.
Jesus Christ is the Son of God and the Savior of the world; the only mediator between God and man. He is begotten of God; not made. He is eternal and He, like the Great Jehovah, is deity. (He is fully divine, and yet subject to Jehovah, who bows to no one.) As mankind’s Savior, Jesus became man - in the likeness of sinful flesh - that He might redeem humanity, as a man, and that His life and death would be the propitiation for sin and sinners. He took upon Himself the fallen flesh of man, and yet, being born of the spirit of God, possessed and partook of the divine nature - all without sin, either in thought or in deed - demonstrating how anyone who might submit himself to God (NOTE: not a keeping of commandments to earn God’s favor), completely, would be legally justified unto eternal life. Jesus Christ’s atonement on the cross was both necessary and sufficient. His life, death, and resurrection fulfilled ALL the holy days of Jehovah, described in the Old Testament, as a completed work. Thus, He has sat down at the right hand of God and He, as the ladder between heaven and earth, is the conduit of heaven’s blessings to man and man’s supplications to God. He is how God speaks to us in the last days.
The spirit of God is the power of God in Christ, in the believer: how one is born again. This spirit will transform, guide, instruct, reprove, and empower the repentant sinner to live a life after the similitude of Jesus Christ, the Son of God. This empowerment is what the Bible calls grace, that is, the power of God keeping the believer connected and hidden in Christ by faith, which is a surrendered life to the will of God.
The above statement, after years of study, is the position I take on the trinitarian issue.
@@DrAD767 Amen! and Beautifully stated!❤
Thks for you presentation. Most helpful. However can I suggest you slow down a little in future talks to allow time to assess the various points you make, please?
Thank you so much for this presentation..I was 11 years an adventist and was blinded. Thank God He opened my eyes. I belief only the Word...EG White was not a prophet according to Deuteronomy 13..
See my post of 8/6/24 (Danielocarey9392).
1 Corinthians 8:3 But whoever loves God is known by God !
Id agree about Stephen bohr, i grew up listening to him. He still is my father's favorite sda pastor.
I can't find any information on you. Could you please share your 'biography', how you acquired the title of "Dr.", are you associated with a particular 'faith group"? Thank you, David Adams, Mobile, AL
- 27-year USAF veteran
- Ph.D. in Ecclesiology; M. S. Applied Mathematics
- No faith group; former Seventh-Day Adventist
- Flight instructor: single- & multi-engine; instrument
- Married w/ six children
Now….how about you? Thx 🙂
@@DrAD767 Raised in the UMC until I joined the Navy in 1976. Attended churches (primarily Baptist) Sunday mornings, Sunday nights, Wednesday nights, participated in men's groups and Christian groups such as the Pathfinders, Navigators, claimed to be a fundamental Bible believing Christian for 38+ years but NEVER EVER LIVED like a Christian . . . . then about three years ago, God called me to repentance. First thing I did was go get my Bible and even though at one time, I had several, I could not find even one . . . . so I went and bought one. Next I read 1 John. 1 John 2:4 says if you CLAIM to be a Christian but do not LIVE like a Christian, you are a LIAR and the truth is not in you. I was a LIAR those 38+ years. Started listening to Christian RUclips messages. Came across John Bradshaw, Adrian Rogers. John Bradshaw is (in my opinion) a GREAT evangelist and President of It is Written. Found out that means he is SDA. Found out the SDA has doctrines in conflict with the Baptist doctrines. I think he has a solid argument on the Sabbath, unsure of soul sleep, then there is the doctine of the Investigative Judgment (which for a LOT of reasons just doesn't make sense), the doctrine of whether hell ends or is eternal.
Then I came across you. Is your Ph.D from SDA or another school? Do you associate with or attend a certain church or is that private?
Currently attending a very conservative UMC which left the UMC and is now called Christ United, a Methodist Community in Mobile, AL. The founding pastor was there 35 years. The UMC I grew up in changed pastors every two years, sometimes even after one year. They teach the Bible as THE Authority - unlike the Bloomington, Indiana First United Methodist Church which is all pro LJBQ+, teaches the flood, Adams and Eve, Jonah were not real, even had a message saying satan was the 'ultimate truth giver"!
Definitely LIVING like a Christian every day these days. When God got me right, He impressed upon me judgment IS coming and time IS running out. NO Christian wants ANYONE to go to hell or be lost. So I eagerly share that with anyone who might listen. Even if judgment doesn't come for another ten years or ten decades, it won't matter to the person who is dead next week.
Finally, I hope anyone interested in listening to good solid Christian messages will google Adrian Rogers and John Bradshaw. John Bradshaw has some GREAT messages, especially the ones that (appear) to have no specific SDA or Ellen White references. Two messages by Adrian Rogers are "Four Lies That Ruined the World (I believed ALL four lies before God got me right) and "Why Did Jesus Choose Judas.
I know this was a longer reply than you hoped for, hope you don't mind . . .
Also, It is Written allows people to submit questions. I have submitted a few and (supposedly) John Bradshaw himself has replied to several of them. So I submitted a question to It is Written, do they know who Dr. Allen Davis is. I will let you know if I get a reply.
Thank you for your reply.
David Adams, Mobile, AL
Thank you for sharing this info. A little more from/about me:
- CEO at Amazing Facts, 2012 - 2015
- Provost/VP of Academics at Weimar University, 2015-2017
- Received my Ph.D. from Regent University, Virginia Beach VA
- Received my Applied Math masters at the Air Force Institute of Technology, Wright-Patterson AFB OH
- Heretic (per SDAs ) since 2022
Doctrinal points:
- I accept the Bible as fact, historically; some language is figurative to teach an eternal lesson
- The Bible is the final authority about faith, living, and salvation
- I patently reject the following from SDA-ism: tritheism; Investigative Judgment; "Levitical" Jesus; EGW, vegetarianism/veganism requirement; twisted eschatology (e.g., Sunday as mark of the beast, Sabbath as the Seal of God); Last Generation Theology; false Gospel of infused righteousness, vice imparted righteousness
- I'm okay with their understanding of the state of the dead and hellfire, as these are historic Christian positions, although no longer mainstream
- Every day is a decision; every day is judgment day. This is not to think, saved, then not saved, but rather, each day we're presented with opportunities to choose for God and the Gospel. Is the motivation to walk in the spirit, becoming salt & light, and relieving suffering to the glory of God the Father, or is the flesh the driver?
I've known John Bradshaw for 15 years or so, and he's a nice guy. That said, having worked closely with all the "bigwigs" of SDA-ism, I'm dubious about their motivations and what they purport to believe. I don't want to say overly much in the negative, but I will say, follow the money.
I would encourage you to watch this video, as it pretty much sums up my simple understanding of the Bible and the Gospel: ruclips.net/video/BmjqX-9-DGg/видео.html
Feel free to ask me questions on this channel, anywhere you have them.
Cheers, AD
@@DrAD767 Re: "follow the money." . . . that is probably true of most churches, temples, charities . . . . I have been in churches where if you gave 100% of your income, then got a second job since you had no money left from your first job, they would have no shame (or hestitation!) asking you, "Brother, are you tithing on your second job?" . . . .
People or leaders like John Bradshaw get to travel all over the world. Doesn't make me think less or more of him. At least he is not like some others that use the money on theirselves and have no shame about it.
Yup...they travel all over the world. On whose dime, their own? Hardly. As Gospel workers, I believe the Bible teaches us to be tentmakers, not relying on others to fund our livelihood.
As soon as someone asks me to give money, I get leery of ill intent. Like I said, I've been there. I ran the -- at the time -- $20 million per year, Amazing Facts ministry. Again, without saying too much, think federal government and the superfluous and wasteful spending. There's no difference in the church, from all I have witnessed.
Dr Davis, I was a 3rd generation SDA; I left in 1980. I knew about the Investigative Judgement. I can't recall hearing about the 7 YEAR THEORY in a (sermon) or in SABBATH SCHOOL. Can you give me short consise' review of what is the 7 YEAR THEORY?? Thank You.
The 7-year theory was a thought concocted (mostly) by Joseph Bates, and initially embraced by James White. Ellen endorsed the position based upon the Shut-Door Theory, which stated, anyone who rejected Miller's message, and moreover the subsequent explanation of Jesus not coming to the earth, but rather moving into the Most Holy Place, were shut out of God's saving power. In Early Writings, EGW wrote:
"I saw the Father rise from the throne, [See page 92.] and in a flaming chariot go into the holy of holies within the veil, and sit down. Then Jesus rose up from the throne, and the most of those who were bowed down arose with Him. I did not see one ray of light pass from Jesus to the careless multitude after He arose, and they were left in perfect darkness. Those who arose when Jesus did, kept their eyes fixed on Him as He left the throne and led them out a little way. Then He raised His right arm, and we heard His lovely voice saying, “Wait here; I am going to My Father to receive the kingdom; keep your garments spotless, and in a little while I will return from the wedding and receive you to Myself.” Then a cloudy chariot, with wheels like flaming fire, surrounded by angels, came to where Jesus was. He stepped into the chariot and was borne to the holiest, where the Father sat. There I beheld Jesus, a great High Priest, standing before the Father. On the hem of His garment was a bell and a pomegranate, a bell and a pomegranate. Those who rose up with Jesus would send up their faith to Him in the holiest, and pray, 'My Father, give us Thy Spirit.' Then Jesus would breathe upon them the Holy Ghost. In that breath was light, power, and much love, joy, and peace.
"I turned to look at the company who were still bowed before the throne; they did not know that Jesus had left it. Satan appeared to be by the throne, trying to carry on the work of God. I saw them look up to the throne, and pray, 'Father, give us Thy Spirit.' Satan would then breathe upon them an unholy influence; in it there was light and much power, but no sweet love, joy, and peace. Satan's object was to keep them deceived and to draw back and deceive God's children." (pp. 55, 56)
The people who didn't accept Jesus moving to the MHP were actually now praying to and serving satan. In keeping with the theory, of the shut-door, these people now believed they were to be preparing themselves for Jesus' return on Oct 22, 1851. Once that prophecy failed, then the collective minds of J. White, U. Smith, and J. Loughborough came together and proffered and sold the people a bill of goods we now understand to be the Investigative Judgment, which is really a protracted understanding of what the people were to be doing during the seven years between 1844 and 1851.
@@DrAD767 Thank You so much. When Jesus died on The Cross the veil (curtain) was torn in half. I use the Mo'.Synod NIV Study Bible; (Concordia)/ The Spirit Of The Reformation Study Bible/ & the Cultural Backgrounds Study Bible NRSV'; (Cokesbury') Matthew Henry Commentary. My Spirit of the Reformation Study Bible, in the (Cliff Notes) RE THE VEIL, The Veil in the Earthly Temple was a SYMBOL of (separation) between God & Man; becuz' of Adam & Eve's fall to sin in Genesis 3: So if the VEIL was torn, we would have (direct access) to Jesus, Our Melchizedek High Priest. So Dr'. Allen, when EGW says that Jesus Goes into the Most Holy Place in 1844, is (She) SAYING that Jesus Goes through the Veil. Does EGW see a Heavenly VEIL?? If there a Veil in heaven, is that heavenly Veil torn?? Is the (veil) GONE?? Thank you for being there'.
I clearly understand the doctrine of the investigative judgemment.
What does this statement mean?
@@DrAD767“Behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me” is a line from the Bible, Revelation 22:12-13:
REALLY ROMANS 5,11 WE JOY IN THE LORD IN WHOM WE HAVE NOW RECEIVED THE ATONEMENT.
ACCORDING TO LEVITICUS 23 THE ATONEMENT WAS A CÉRÉMONIAL LAW WHICH ADVENTISM CLAIMS WERE NAILED TO THE CROSS. HOW CAN LAWS THAT WERE NAILED TO THE CROSS BE ONGOING? Y R U STILL WORKING WHEN ACCORDING TO THE LAW ON THE DAY OF ATONEMENT NO WORK WAS PERMITTED 😮😮😮
The Investigative Judgement summarized:
• Jesus’ death on the cross did not provide a complete atonement for sin; it only bought you some time so you could show that you can live a perfect life a like He did
• All of your actions and thoughts will be be open to judgement in the IJ
• If you are shown to be lacking in your merit at the IJ, you will be tossed into the lake of fire and consumed.
• Nobody can know for sure - no matter what type of life they’ve lived - as to whether they’re going to heaven or headed to hell until that Recording Angel spills the beans at the IJ
Creative? Yes.
Biblical? No.
Nailed it
Before you came to this full revelation of the faith Do you believe that you were born again? Do you believe you would have been saved has you stayed in the denomination unknowingly following false doctrine? I ask as I have many family and friends stuck in this. I wonder if they have accepted a different spirit as the scripture is said or if they will be saved. Once I was born again, my spirit grieved sitting through the sermons. I knew it was false (in my new born again spirit) before I even knew by looking up EGW or anything else.
Hey Friend,
there's an FAF QnA from 2016, I think. Colleen Tinker says that there are those who have accepted Christ in spite of Adventism. I used to tell my SDA friend that there are Christians in every religion. Some are just in bondage. I hope those you care about listen to you one day and pray they hear Christ's call too.
Blessings 🕊️
Thanks Dr Davis this presentation is irrefutable,, it is shocking and sickening the lenghts that SDA go to to defend and shield EGW but deny scripture May God use these videos to deliver people trapped in this movement
Dr Allen, do you have any document published on this subject? I want to take a deeper dive on this doctrine.
I don't have a document, per se, other than what you hear in parts 1-3, which is a script/narrative I wrote. Is that what you're requesting?
@@DrAD767
I would be interested in that transcript if you do not mind!!
It’s been 3 years that l have been studying different subjects on the denomination because l think l was thought wrong starting with the 3 in 1 God.
Please share your email, and I’ll send the document.
I finally figured out what has been eluding me. I guess you could say I was slightly indoctrinated into seeing Jesus'sacrifice as relating to the Day of Atonement in some way. It never sat right with me however. I have always seen Christ's crucifixion as relating to the Passover as you point out.
Psalm 34:20 KJV
He keepeth all his bones: not one of them is broken.
😢
What happens when you throw a goat off a cliff?
Bones are broken!
Finally I have unzipped that part of the file that was eluding me. It all makes sense now. The Day of Atonement is not to even be considered in light of this prophecy.
Thank you for the perspective and getting me to think outside the box.
Blessings Brother 🙏
See my post of 8/6/24 (Danielocarey9392). And understand that the SDA basic mistake is Ellen White's status. Would God lift up a person to tell people intimate thoughts of Bible characters when the Bible leaves these things out? Are her writings scripture... or not.
Hi Dr Allen
What scripture do the SDA use to confirm the sanctuary in heaven?? I can't find any?
Thank you so much for your teachings. God bless you brother❤🇿🇦🇿🇦
They use Hebrews chapters 8 & 9, predominantly. They fail to carefully examine Ch. 10, as well as everything leading up to Ch. 8.
@DrAD767 Thank you so much. I will go and study these scriptures carefully.
Bless you my brother, I will see you in Heaven 💖🇿🇦🇿🇦🇿🇦
Hebrews 8:2: The heavenly sanctuary was "pitched by the Lord, and not by man".
Hebrews 8:5: The earthly sanctuary was a "copy and shadow of the heavenly things".
Hebrews 9:24: "For Christ has entered, not into holy places made with hands, which are copies of true things, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God on our behalf".
Revelation 11:19: "God's sanctuary in heaven was opened, and the ark of His covenant appeared in His sanctuary".
Revelation 14:15, 17, 18: Angels come out of the temple in heaven.
“1 Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens; 2 A minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man. ”
Hebrews 8:1-2 KJV
The Bible said so, not SDAs.
Your context is lacking. Please read Heb 1:1-4, as well as Heb 10:1-14.
Pastor I am not sure what the seven year prophecy means . Where does this come from?????
I discuss it in the first Ellen White video I did.
Dr. Scholar why will the saints judge the word - what is the purpose? “Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? ”
1 Corinthians 6:2 KJV
Context. You’ve cherry-picked the verse and made it a pretext for a false doctrine.
When did Judgment occur? The answer lies in Jn 12 & Rev 12.
Thank you Dr Allen
Here's something I was thinking about
The word salvation is in 3 forms
Saved from the penalty of sin
Saved from the power of sin
Saved from the presence of sin
Doesn't this mean that the utmost salvation will come when Christ finally vindicates from the presence of sin and how he is saving us from the power of sin by having faith in him
So how do you see this thinking
Doesn't it mean the salvation work has not fully ended or Christ has made provision for salvation at his death but will finally erradicate sin from our presence
Thank you
Eager to hear from you
Thx again for your comment. When you claim the word salvation is in three forms, could show me where you derive that from Scripture? The word, σῴζω (sozo), is used 110 times in 103 verses in the NT, and is generally employed in the manner of a present reality one can experience. The penalty-power-presence idea is an SDA cliché one hears frequently in evangelistic series and such, and is stated that way to give credence to the investigative judgment. In the same way, the SDAs convey justification, sanctification, and glorification. But we don't find distinct dispensations for these ideas.
When one comes to Christ, is he only partially saved, as SDAs purport? No. Paul tells us, "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." (Rom 10:13 KJV) And again, "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God:" (Eph 2:8 KJV) In the former, the implication is, it's a reality as soon as the repentant man makes confession. In the latter, it demonstrates a present condition. In other passages, when it appears Paul is talking about future event, it's essentially on until the sinner becomes penitent: "For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life." (Rom 5:10 KJV)
The SDA denomination is good at twisting Scripture just enough to invoke doubt and fear. That's the nature of the Investigative Judgment. Of course, once God establishes the new heaven and earth and crowns Jesus as king of this realm, then of course, the presence of sin shall be gone, although the memory of what God did thru Christ will be ever on the minds of the redeemed.
Pastor as a minister I thought you would understand Christ's work of justification, sanctification and when Jeaus comes our glorification or when jesus makes us immortal. Jesus cannot forgive anyone who is not first sanctified . Jeaus is faithful and just to forgive and cleanse us from ALL our unrighteousness IF WE CONFESS AND FORSAKE OUR SINS FIRST. 1John 1,9 Prov 2813. I thought all theologians knew this to be glorified at Christ's coming. We are saved by what Jesus has done FOR us at the Cross, what Jesus can do IN OR WITH us today amd what Jesus will do TO US at His coming . This is all Biblical . I don't know where you can say it is not.
Show me in scriptures Where confessed sins R placed on satan ? @@EricHort-cx1jp
Here is a link to Stephen Bohr's defense of the Investigative Judgment. I just left a comment on that video asking him if he knew of you and your three part series (I have watched Parts 1 and 2, will watch part 3 by 11/23) and what his response was. I told him I would be posting a link to his video to see your response to his video.
ruclips.net/video/4lY-efzA71k/видео.html
Thank you for your time.
David Adams, Mobile, AL
Stephen Bohr and I know each other very well. I doubt my videos are still on SUM TV, but you might be able to find them.
I was tagged to be the Secrets Unsealed Pres, upon leaving Weimar in 2017, but extenuating circumstances prevented it.
Anyway, I’m well aware of his defense, and though he uses the Bible, he’s really using Ellen White.
@@DrAD767 OK, I googled SUM TV, found it and see it is part of the Secrets Unsealed Ministry (duh, me . . . Secrets Unsealed Ministry = S U M . . . . ). In their "About" page, it has a paragraph about their beliefs which includes (copied and pasted here) - " . . . the full inspiration of the writings of Ellen G. White . . . " which John Bradshaw has said it not equivalent to the Bible or in comparison to the Latter Days Saints about the writings of Joseph Smith, on the same level. This statement seems to be in conflict with that.
Still think John Bradshaw is an excellent evangelist and despite making angry some of my Baptist friends for still listening to him, I just ignore any references he gives to Ellen White or SDA doctrines that are in conflict with Baptist doctrine (except for the Sabbath for which I think he presents a very strong argument. Indeed, if there were a Baptist or conservative Methodist church that did Saturday services, I would go there . . . .
In his testimony, John Bradshaw was raised Roman Catholic and MIGHT have become a Baptist IF the Baptist church he visited had not had some issues . . . . he then read the Great Controversy and after that, became SDA.
"It Is Written" is a program/ministry designed to draw in from other faith groups. Generally speaking, folk aren't "converted" by this group. Said another way, it's a sheep-stealing ministry, not a kingdom-growing one. John Bradshaw was specifically selected when Mark Finley -- his predecessor -- moved to be the General Conference President's senior/personal advisor. Before Finley was the founder, George Vandeman.
I understand Bradshaw is a good speaker and is very affable; at the same time, his theology is not completely Bible-based, but rather filtered through the writings and opinions of Ellen White. *ALL* of the bigwig SDA evangelists/preachers/teachers fall into this category, some more than others.
Further, for Bradshaw and IIW to state, "full inspiration" is not equivalent to the Bible or how the LDS elevate Joseph Smith, quite frankly, is both dishonest and deceptive. Please look at SDA Fundamental Belief #18, which SDAs, ostensibly, are to embrace without wavering:
"The Scriptures testify that one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit is prophecy. This gift is an identifying mark of the remnant church and we believe it was manifested in the ministry of Ellen G. White. *Her writings speak with prophetic authority and provide comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction to the church.* They also make clear that the Bible is the standard by which all teaching and experience must be tested." (Num. 12:6; 2 Chron. 20:20; Amos 3:7; Joel 2:28, 29; Acts 2:14-21; 2 Tim. 3:16, 17; Heb. 1:1-3; Rev. 12:17; 19:10; 22:8, 9, emphasis added)
Clearly, there's no wiggle room for interpretation. Notice also, the near-exact language as 2 Tim 3:16, 17. SDAs have toned down the rhetoric because in the past, the phraseology of "continuing voice" was part of the FB, and was removed -- if memory serves -- in 2005. If Bradshaw posits otherwise, he should then remove his membership. Also, what he won't readily state is, IIW receives some funding from the SDA organization.
Finally, it's very easy for a Roman Catholic to become an SDA. The salvation concept (i.e., soteriology) is nearly identical: infused righteousness (i.e., made perfect over time) versus imparted righteousness -- all Jesus' efforts.
BOTTOM LINE: I think there's only so much to which you can listen before the battlefield gets really dangerous. State of the dead, hell fire, etc., aren't salvational issues, whereas the Investigative Judgment, Sunday Mark of the Beast, Sabbath as the Seal, Tritheism, etc., are.
As I've shared before, if you have questions, please feel free to ask me, and I'll provide a biblical answer. If I don't know, I'll be honest and tell you so.
Have you and Myles from AnsweringAdventistism ever thought of doing a video together?
@FlyingGentile Your handle makes me chuckle....no doubt! Anyway, re: Myles....yes, we've spoken and I did three videos with him in 2023.
@@DrAD767 sorry if it is a silly name. I love aviation (currently a student pilot), currently in the airforce (ANG) looking to commission and fly there after getting my degree this December. I choose it after I left the SDA church, realizing that being a gentle doesn't just mean someone who is pagan and eats pork 😅. I felt I was misled to it's meaning growing up, so I wanted to embrace it because there are so many people born into homes that never experienced Christ yet he put me in a home who knew Jesus...although my parents believe in a false prophet. I will be looking for his playlist for conversations you both had. I just found your channel today and plenty of notes 📝 to be had here, you got a sub from me 👍🏾. Thank you so much for what you do. I'd love to sit and have a conversation with you in the new heavens and earth.
No, I don't think it's silly at all. That said, I would ask you to read Romans 2, and then ask yourself if you're truly a gentile.
Anyway....good on ya for pursuing your passion! I spent a career in the USAF, flying both KC-135s and C-5s. I'm also a CFI/CFII in both single- and multi-engine airplanes. Keep your focus, and realize, as a public servant in the ANG, you're serving at a higher calling than most will ever realize, at least temporally. Use that opportunity to spread the truth as it is in Christ Jesus.
Thx for the sub!
I am not able to watch this video in its entirety. But my thoughts are: 1, cleansing the sanctuary can only be the type or the anti-type, none of which is something happening in heaven. 2, Rev 14:6 cannot have anything to do with the Son's judging.
So, #1: In the sanctuary in Israel, there were 6-stations laid out in the shape of a cross. And on the annual Day of Atonement the Sanctuary was cleansed through a depth of acts of animal sacrifices, and other rituals. The extent was a visual image of Christ being sacrificed for the sins of Israel. But this day was the last part of what went on all year- daily sacrifices. The sanctuary was away from the habitation of the people.
Therefore, this can be called the type (biblical typology). Moses was a type of Christ. The antitype was Christ Himself. And we then can say that the Day of Atonement cleansed the Sanctuary (type). But this was the way to belong to God's family prior to Christ's blood sacrifice (Col 2:15). At Christ's sacrifice on the cross this was a permanent Day of Atonement. Daily sacrifices were not required anymore. Jesua did the work prophesied for ages. He is the antitype- or the permanent atoning sacrifice. The work is done.
Now #2: Rev 14:6 says "Fear God. Give glory to Him. For the hour of His judgment is come." We are to fear the Father, and give Him glory. It is not about Jeshua judging here. This is executive judgment, or the executing of rewards or punishment. Then the next wording says, "AND worship the one who made land and see and fountains of water." This (after the AND) part speaks of another person, the Son, who is the Creator (John 1, Hebrews 1). Yes, all authority is given to Christ. But this verse isn't about this.
Good insight...thank you. One other thing to consider is, when carefully examined, one will see the typical Day of Atonement wasn't so much about the cleansing of the sanctuary, as it was a close of probation. Those who were awaiting the emergence of the high priest typified those waiting for the return of Jesus Christ in the last days of earth's history. Upon the high priest's emergence from the tabernacle (the anti-type being Jesus departing heaven), the people rejoiced, for they knew their sins were completely forgiven, Azazel was destroyed, and they were free to live in harmony.
I have 3 questions.
1. What if you are wrong Dr Davis about Ellen's relationship with God or SDA church?
2. Forget the word "Investigative," nt in bible; is there a "judgment?" If yes, when?
3. If 2300 isn't connected to the judgment, what does it mean?
Thx for your questions. My brief thoughts.
1) I’ve thought about that idea very carefully. Her relationship with the SDA church was controlling; just read her “testimonies”. With God, well…of course I can’t judge that. What I can say is, her writings were at times abusive, spiritually. We don’t read of such vitriol in the Scriptures. Also, she grossly misrepresented God by saying she spoke for Him.
2) Of course there’s a judgment. Think about this idea: God both judged sin and sinners at the cross; in the same act, He offered them salvation. When we’re convicted and realize our need of Him, that itself is a judgment. Further, the judgment at the Parousia is condemnation of the unrighteous, that is, those who refused God’s solution for sin.
3) The more I examine the 2300 days, the more I see it connected to Antiochus Epiphanes IV. Also, it cannot be 2300 years, because there is no basis for such a calculation except for tradition.
Did you experience having a vision like Daniel?
I don't understand the point of your question.
@@DrAD767that was Daniel’s reaction before…He didn’t understand the point of his vision in Dan 8. The understanding later on has been unsealed but not at time of Daniel but at the end time.
I doubt that the lecturer have received the vision from God to understand the ereb boqer vision of Daniel 8 which Daniel himself struggled to understand
@calvinmariano9414 You may doubt all you want. The 2300 days ending in 1844, and moreover, the Investigative Judgment, are both unbiblical heresies that destroy the Gospel. You might not like it, but it is so.
@@DrAD767you can explain it the more, but I investigated this subject. The parallelism with chapter 7 explains that it is the heavenly events 1844 or not.
Thank you Dr
I am not an Adventist nor have I ever been. I cannot speak on all the things said in this video. Are you saying that there is not a heavenly sanctuary? As it is in various places of the Old Testament and New Testament. I will try to find them all. But at the moment I was able to locate where Paul speaks on this in Hebrews chapters 8 and 9. Hebrews 8:1-2 Paul states Jesus, our high priest is in heaven at the right hand of the majesty in heavens; and He is minister of the sanctuary and the “true” tabernacle pitched by the Lord not by man…..meaning in heaven. 8:4 goes on to very that it is not on earth by stating “if He were on earth, He should not be a priest”. 8:5 explains that Moses was given/shown a pattern to follow….. a pattern shown to him by God….this would be a pattern of the heavenly sanctuary. Hebrew 9:1-10 speak on the earthly sanctuary. 9:11 goes on to say Christ is high priest by a greater and more perfect tabernacle….again being of heaven, not earth. 9:12 states He entered once into the holy place. 9:24 Christ did not enter into the holy places made with hands…but into heaven itself. Further more I do believe there is some type of judgement that God does, as the bible states that God makes a decision to give the martyrs white robes and tell them to rest a while longer….a decision that is clearly saying they are worthy of those white robes. So a judgement was made before the end time judgement. There are many areas in the Bible that mention God has made some type of judging type decision on the dead. What are these judgements? Like in Luke 16:19-31 when Lazarus with Lazarus being on the side with Abraham and the rich man being in hades. Thank you.
Thx for your comment. My thoughts follow:
1) There is indeed a heavenly sanctuary -- Hebrews 8 mentions it. However, the SDAs do err, believing Jesus is a Levitical High Priest affecting some ongoing atonement, when the Bible is clear in Romans 5: "And not only [so], but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement." (Romans 5:11 KJV) Jesus is not after the order of Aaron, but rather, after the order of Melchizedek.
2) The pattern given to Moses in Exo 25:8, was for the purpose of Israel to understand the plan of salvation. Please notice, priests were to minister throughout the year in the holy place (i.e., the first apartment); they never partook in the service in the most holy place (i.e., thru the veil in the presence of the mercy seat). This act was reserved for the high priest, of whom Jesus is *THE* antitype. This one job the high priest did, annually. SDAs contend, Jesus acted as High Priest in the first apartment from AD 34 to 1844, when at that time, the Father picked up and moved into the most holy. There is no biblical example of this idea in the yearly sanctuary service. JEHOVAH's throne (i.e., the mercy seat) was ever the object of attention: throughout the year with the veil in place; on the Day of Atonement with it moved aside.
3) Re: Heb 9:12, the KJV states "holy place", and yet, a more careful reading of the Greek helps us understand -- within context -- this holy place meant with the veil removed: Jesus had passed thru it as the eternal High Priest. The Aramaic reads as follows in Heb 9:7-12:
"But into the *inner tabernacle,* once a year only, the high priest entered, with the blood which he offered for himself and for the sins of the people. And by this the Ruach haKodesh indicated that the way to the Set Aprt (places) was not yet manifested as long as the first tabernacle was standing: and it was a symbol for that time during which oblation and sacrifices were offered that could not make perfect the conscience of him who offered them: but (they consisted) only in food and drink and in the ablutions of diverse things which were flesh ordinances, and were set up until the time of restoration. But the Mashiyach who came was a High Priest of the good things which He created: and He entered into the *great and perfect tabernacle* which was not make with hands and was not of these created things. And He did not enter with the blood of goats and calves; but with the blood of Himself He entered once into the *sanctuary* and obtained eternal redemption."
Please notice the consistency of the text: inner tabernacle (great and perfect) and sanctuary were where Jesus entered with His own blood once, for the purpose of eternal redemption. And yet, just like the Roman Catholics, the SDAs want to perpetuate this offering ad infinitum.
4) Is there a judgment? Of course! However, that judgment was meted out at the cross. In that one act, JEHOVAH both judged and saved the world in Christ. To reject Him invites death; to accept Him brings life. Whatever decision a human has made (for those who are dead), makes, or will make will determine JEHOVAH's final decision. Speaking of our place with JEHOVAH when deciding to partake of communion, Paul wrote: "For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged. But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world." (1 Corinthians 11:31-32 KJV) And, of course, the communion is symbolic of the cross.
I hope this response helps you.
How do you know?
“I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.” (2 Tim 1:12)
Listen and learn.
There cannot be a correct understanding in regards to this topic without looking at it through a proper understanding of feasts days and Gods literal creation in connection to judgement and santfication. I pray all will study and ask Father to lead. Please, all who hear this, just study the word. Do not listen to anyone (including me) outside of studying and asking Father for light. Diregard your resentments, biases and credentials etc.. Be blessed as we all continue to strive.
That is indeed a point to consider, and yet, one cannot cross-pollenate feasts. The Passover CANNOT be used for the Atonement in the feast calendar. God didn’t do it, but sadly, EGW and her proponents did.
Christ died once and for all@@DrAD767 but that did not STOP pentecost from taking place at the appointed time.We had to WAIT FOR IT for its appointed time .WAIT!There was no NEW sacrifice at PENTECOST in the fulfilment when Christ had ascended and poured out the HOLY SPIRIT. at the appointed time.His Passover sacrifice was adequate ....the appointed time for fulfilment of day of atonement will require no new sacrifice and Neither fulfilment of of feasts of tabernacles requires any new sacrifice ...SAINTS will dwell withl God)feasts of tabanacles) and that fulfilment has NOT YET HAPPENED as it the last event in plan of salvation ...day of atonement is NOT DAY OF PASSOVER ....Pentecost was not Passover and yet WITHOUT PASSOVER PENTECOST WOULD NOT HAPPEN.The Sacrifice by Christ was needed to MAKE ALL THESE HAPPEN.Feast were used to teach plan of salvation in symbols...CHRIST WAS NEVER BURNT ON ALTER OF BURNT OFFERING ..that was imagery pointing to an actual reality .......the symbols in the sanctuary has limitations to teach and yet they provide a frame to understand plan of salvation ........Paul then contrast Christ superiority over the imagery used...Paul says His blood is better than of goats and bulls ...His blood can cleanse ,His sanctuary is better as NOT BUILT BY MAN( which means we cannot compare the shadow sanctuary by Moses to Gods REALITY sanctuary but we can see the PATTERN OF HIS MINISTRY using Moses sanctuary symbols ...Paul says Christ s priesthood s better ....the BLANK part of your presentation is you dont deal with WHAT IS THE APPOINTED TIME FOR DAY OF ATONEMENT ......day of atonement happens closer to feasts of tabernacles which means it happens before we eventually dwell with God( feasts of tabernacles)....YOU DONT DEAL with what day of atonement actually means in plan of salvation .MOST PEOPLE CONFLATE DAY OF ATONEMENT WITH PASSOVER ....DONE DEAL and they close their study!done deal ! they dont blink and eye to the fact THAT WE ARE STILL HERE ON EARTH and have NOT GONE TO HEAVEN DESPITE CALVARY ....CALVARY WAS NOT THE END OF THE SEVEN Step PLAN BUT THE BEGINNING of those steps....we are still here !had the feast of tabanacles been fulfilled we would be in heaven !but WE ARE NOT!no new sacrifice would be needed BUT THE APPOINTED TIME FOR FULFILMENT OF FEASTS OF TABERNACLES HAS NOT HAPPENED .....CALVAERY SACRIFICE IS FRESH ALL THROUGHOUT THE PLAN OF SALVATION......THE LAMB IN REVELATION 5:6 IS PRESENTLY CONTINUOUSLY PRESENTING A FRESH SACRIFICE ....PRESENT CONTINUOUS!so the feast where a guideline ,a frame of Christ s work,so was the sanctuary symbols were prophetic landmarks in symbols ,.......you dont believe the cherubim in heaven are made up of gold do you ?....but you get the picture they are guardians of the throne in revelation 4...you dont believe there is a table of showbread in heaven do you ?...but you can see the throne in revelation 4 at the table of showbread position while in front of the throne (rEvelation 4:5) SEVEN LAMPS (Holy Spirit ) was present!...you can see those SEVEN LAMPS BEING SENT TO EARTH(see revelation 5:6 last part) which is what PENTECOST IS IN SYMBOLS..IT IS THE PLACEMENT OF LAMPS(HOLYS SPIRIT) ON CANDLESTICK(CHURCH)......the sanctuary was God s means to teach plan of salvation.....he used VISIBLE represantations to teach what was YET TO COME!.......if I were you I would pause and get the substance of truth on these subjects and give adventists a better alternative ...right now I was rather disappointed ...you dont need adventists to see biblical truths.....but if you go public about how lost SDA is you need not present substandard substitutes either .you think evangelicals dont read too?
One more thing I heard lots lots of sDA sermon what I got from their sermons is this if you love Jesus we obey him and because of obedience we do what he ask nothing less nothing more .that's not work that's how we show it's our love for him .
That’s not what they really believe. It’s what they say, but when you press them, they’ll tell you, you HAVE to obey for salvation, not because Jesus has saved you. Also, they reject Jesus as the Son of God. They instead call Him, God the Son. It’s unbiblical. I would even say, it’s heresy.
Dr. Davis..do you believe that there are unfallen worlds? Also, when were the angels created? And did the war in Heaven take place during the creation week? The fact that there is night and darkness in creation does this imply that the fallen angels were already upon the earth? My understanding that in the new earth there will no longer be night and darkness..
@brandonqualls2769 I do believe there are other worlds; it would be myopic to think there aren’t. Are they unfallen? I don’t know for certain, because my thinking along those lines is still tainted by SDA-ism. I can go either way in that line of thinking right now.
When were the angels created? Whether it was prior to Genesis 1:1 or after, it doesn’t really matter. They are part of the creation, and I don’t believe there was a fall prior to Gen 2:3. I am of the opinion, satan’s fall and rebellion happened after Gen 2, and before Gen 3.
As for the “war in heaven,” I believe - based solely upon the text we read in Rev 12 - this event occurred after Jesus Christ’s ascension.
Re: darkness and light, please read Rev 21 carefully. Notice it states, there’s no need for sun or moon, because Jehovah and the Lamb are the light. This doesn’t mean there won’t be a sun or moon, nor does it mean the day and night won’t exist as described in Gen 1. This portion of the book describes the temple. What happens outside the temple? Again, I’m uncertain, and yet, I would think it’s along the lines of “in the beginning…”
Thx for your question, Brandon. I enjoy the dialogue.
🙏🏽
the beauty of scripture is that we still have to deal with difficult texts without Ellen White and without adventists ....for example DOES scripture teach a judgement of saints ?..........ecclesiastics 3:17 I said to myself,
“God will bring into judgment
both the righteous and the wicked,
for there will be a time for every activity,
a time to judge every deed.” wa s this poetry without meaningful meaning ?...do we believe half of this text?...the judgement of the wicked which we see in revelation 20 .?....and we discard the other words like ...."God will bring into judgment
both the righteous and the wicked,".......WE DELETE THE WORD "RIGHTEOUS" from the text....and we DELETE THE WORD "BOTH".what about Paul talking to corinthian Christians ?....He tells believers and says .......For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each of us may receive what is due us for the things done while in the body, whether good or bad.....WHY WOULD BELIEVERS OF CORINTH BE TAUGHT ABOUT JUDGEMENT OF BELIEVERS ? why repeat the same message in message in romans 14:10 ......the subject of judgment is not likeable ......but if I quote this text by Paul we like it!.....In his letter to the church in Corinth, the apostle Paul tells us that believers will not only judge the world but also judge angels: “Or do you not know that the saints will judge the world ... Do you not know that we are to judge angels? How much more, then, matters pertaining to this life,,,,,,,,Most likely, the meaning of this passage is that believers in heaven will take part in the judgment of the fallen angels and will share in His authority, including His authority over the fallen angels Revelation 20:4....if we fast forward to revelation 20 we see Christ s words being fulfilled spoken in mathew ...Jesus said to them, “Truly, I say to you, in the new world, when the Son of Man will sit on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.......in revelation 20 Christ sits on his throne .....4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge.!!! we read these verses with HOPE when its judgement of the wicked ....but we TRY TO EXPLAIN AWAY THE JUDGEMENT OF SAINTS VERSES .....
Daniel 7 shows a judgement where books are opened and SAINTS RECEIVE JUDGMENT IN THEIR FAVOUR ......A LEGAL PROCESS is presented........WHY ARE SAINTS GIVEN THE KINGDOM AFTER A LEGAL PROCESS ?WHY ......IS NOT CALVARY AS OUR ARGUMENT ENOUGH ?WHY DO WE NEED A LEGAL PROCESS IN DANIEL 7...... ..Grace is not emancipation from the law, but it is emancipation from sin and from the penalty of the law. Grace provides salvation not by canceling the requirements of the law, but by cooperating with the law. The law condemns the transgressor; grace meets the penalty and sets the sinner free. Grace honors the law by presenting the perfect obedience of Christ in place of the sinner’s disobedience. Grace does not lessen the authority of the law, but recognizes and maintains its authority by satisfying its claims.Grace delivers the sinner from the condemnation of the law in order that he or she may obey and honor the law by a new and holy life......AHA!!!!! The plan of salvation has a court session ...THE PLAN OF SALVATION HAS PASSOVER(death burial,resurrection} ,PENTECOST(Ascension,inauguration ,Holy Spirit out pouring),A CALL TO THE COMING COURT SESSION,( feast of trumpets) A COURT SESSION(Day of atonement),AND SAINTS THEN ARE GIVEN THE KINGDOM AND DWELL WITH GOD( fEAsT OF TABERNACLES).....The Jews knew what the day of atonement was .........Yom Kippur, or the Day of Atonement is the heaviest, most serious and solemn day in the Levitical calendar, and with good reason. Rabbinical Jewish tradition holds that God opens the Books of Life and Death on this day and judges all mankind yearly for their sins, and that one will have a good year or a bad year depending on their standing with God......The jews understood this because the day of atonement happened yearly ...but it pointed in plan of salvation as being the last session before second advent of Christ ....JUDGEMENT SCENE in Daniel 7 is last session before Christ comes ...revelation 20 throwing of Satan into abyss is part of day of atonement closing .....the goat of azazel was never sacrificed but thrown into wilderness by a strong person......The court session in DANIEL 7 happens in heaven, and THE TIME CAME WHEN THE SAINST WERE GIVEN THE KINGDOM which we see in revelation 20:4
WE ARE not to choose what we want to hear about plan of salvation.....Gods plan never ENDED AT CALVARY otherwise he would have given us just passover ONLY IN THE SANCTUARY ......IF YOU DONT BELIEVE THE SAINTS ARE JUDGED( but not condemned) AND THEN JUDGEMENT IS FOUND IN THEIR FAVOUR ,PLEASE SKIP THOSE VERSES TOO .Christ took our condemnation but we must show evidence THAT we believed in him .....THIS VERSE MAKES OUR JUDGMENT MORE COMFORTING....5 The one who is victorious will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out the name of that person from the book of life, but will acknowledge that name before my Father and his angels.......John 5-22… For the FATHER judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgement unto the Son.:.....we can see the wicked being condemned in revelation 20 by a judgment process and the RIGHTEOUS being awarded IN DANIEL 7 BY A JUDGMENT PROCESS .the judgment in revelation 20 is POST ADVENT of Christ and the judgment in Daniel 7 is PREADVENT ....we dont need adventist for this point...even "got questions" noticed it !!!......THERE ARE NO DATES SUPPLIED IN DANIEL 7 but the event of judgement in Daniel 7 happens post Roman Empire fall, post little horn activity .....and we would do well t o acknowledge those verses ........that we dont know the dates in DANIEL 7...but judgment takes place for sure...we dont need to be adventists to accept it or deny it.......we can reject those verses without needing Ellen White ....we simply NATURALLY HATE LIGHT....forget Ellen white focus and read your bible and wake up...there are many non adventist who are reading the bible and seeing DANIEL 7 as it is and asking them selves questions .......
BEAUTIFUL- this man is making it seem as though the INVESTIGATIVE JUDGMENT originated with Ellen White - Paul told Felix "There is a JUDGMENT to come, John said the 3rd Angel said the JUDGMENT has come.
The IJ was “validated” by EGW. It was founded by Edson, Crozier, J. White, Bates et al. Please read your SDA history.
Also, you’re referring to the first angel’s message; even then, it doesn’t appear you understand it, except for what SDA doctrine tells you.
Leviticus 16v
27 And the bullock for the sin offering, and the goat for the sin offering, whose blood was brought in to make atonement in the holy place, shall one carry forth WITHOUT THE CAMP; and they shall burn in the fire their skins, and their flesh, and their dung.
How curious is that and why was it done necessary to be outside the camp?
But both the bull and the Lord’s goat were offered INSIDE the tabernacle, and the blood offered inside the holiest. Further, this offering was not the same as the Passover offering, and thus, they don’t correlate. I do find it interesting how the bull and Lord’s goat, which were sin offerings were taken outside the camp, and yet the ram offering - burnt offering - was to make atonement (cf. Lev 1); a fitting symbol and connexion to Abraham.
To your statement that there is no proof of a sanctuary in heaven, how will u explain Rev.8:3-5 and Rev.9:13, and Heb.8:5 and 9:11,22-24?
It’s allegorical, in that, John and Paul respectively paint a picture the Hebrew audience could understand: How the ONE act of God in Christ brought the entire plan of salvation to a necessary and sufficient fulfillment.
Succinct explanation. Bravo. @@DrAD767
@@DrAD767 allegorical- symbolism. Adventists seem to be literalists that struggle interpreting an author’s meaning.
Only when it serves them. Their failure to be consistent is appalling. I sit in SS and so many folk conflate parables, figurative vs. literal, etc. They really have little training in how to read the Bible, and read it properly.
@@DrAD767 to say this is to deny that Christ is ministering in the heavenly sanctuary pitched by God Hebrews 8:2.5 ..I humbly recommend you to the word of his grace
What do you believe in sir? If to you is an errors corrected
I think the next presentation will be eye-opening, and it will become evident what I believe. The short answer is, the Bible, and the Bible only.
Amen!!
Do you believe in that old masonic white Ellen white. She was a lying fraud,,a conartist,,a fanatic,,a mad woman with a severe mental illness. Many Adventists are waking up to the apostate teachings of this damnable cult. From young Robert.
“There is no heavenly in the Bible” ??? How do you explain -- Bible texts like...
psalm 11:4 The LORD is in his holy temple, the LORD'S throne is in heaven: his eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men.
Psalms 102:19 For he hath looked down from the height of his sanctuary; from heaven did the LORD behold the earth.
Revelation 11:19 Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple.
Here we have 3 very clear verses which states a sanctuary in heaven??
What do you think Dr Allen 👍
It’s all allegorical. The heavenly sanctuary is Heaven itself.
Heb 9:24
@ Im sorry I don't understand? Can you elaborate a bit? I am explaining to a friend?
The sanctuary of which we read in Exodus 25 and what Paul describes in Hebrews 9 is a model -- a dumbed down one at that -- of Heaven itself. It also lays out the plan of salvation; moreover, the believer's pathway to reconciliation, which is Christ alone.
Christ *SAT DOWN* upon His finished work, following His ascension into Heaven itself. There is no further "work" of investigation to be done. God judged the world in John 12 and Rev 12: His judgment was a thing that was past tense in Rev 14:7, when John wrote the passage.
The question is: Will we as sinful humanity accept God's solution for sin in the finished work of Jesus? Will we get on the ladder of Truth, which is the only way to God?
People get ready, there's a train a comin'.....don't need no ticket, you just get onboard.
@@DrAD767 thanks for the explanation bud, helpful
Remember, the sacrifice of Christ did not take place "in faith" as did the typical sacrifices within the Jewish system of the sanctuary. Jesus' sacrifice came at the hands of the Romans, outside the gate, because he was not a Jewish sacrifice, and Jesus was not "taken" as a sacrifice, but instead, He gave himself as a sacrifice for the whole world, not just for the jews. Therefore, his anti-typical sacrifice for the sins of the whole world would take time to be received and accepted by those who witnessed it, and also it would take time for them to understand it. That being said then, wouldn't that change the timing of the results of His sacrifice in terms of becoming manifested in the lives of those who eventually would come to exhibit faith in Him?
I'm reading a disconnect in logic. How can Jesus be the anti-type if his sacrifice wasn't "in faith"? Please think about this, because I believe once you give it a little more critical thinking -- which you're doing already -- you'll see it. Think of what Paul calls Jesus.
Thank you sir!
Greetings from Kamloops BC Canada 🍁
Chaplain James 🙏🏼📖🙏🏼
Here is the problem people don't understand, but let's ask a couple questions first so we get the whole understanding of why Jesus has to investigate.
1.) Was Jesus a human being, and by a human being, I mean flesh and blood with a human mind? The answer is yes!
2.) Was Jesus fully God? Spiritually yes, physically, no. The Bible says he gave up his omnipresence and omnipotence to become human. In the spiritual sense through constant communication with his Father, he was in fact spiritually God, but his body and mind were flesh and blood just like ours.
3.) What did the angel say to the disciples when Jesus ascended to heaven? Acts 1:11 which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. So, we see from this verse Jesus is human when he returns, a perfected human, but human none the less.
4.) Was Jesus human when he ascended into heaven? Yes! While Jesus was fully God before becoming human he had all foreknowledge of everything that has happened and would happen. He knew as God who would be saved and lost at the second coming, However, when Jesus was born as a human being he gave up all the foreknowledge he once had as God. Jesus had to be fully human, live a life based on pure faith, and be tempted in all things as we are so that he could demonstrate to us how we can live a sinless life through faith and submission to the Father's will in heaven just as he did.
5.) What most people tend to not stop and think about is that Jesus while fully God spiritually is still human and without the foreknowledge he gave up when he became human. That being said the investigative judgment makes sense because since Christ is in heaven as a perfected human, and the Bible calls him the first fruit, as a human with no foreknowledge of those who are saved and lost that he gave up when he became human he has to perform this investigative work to know who is saved and lost according to everything that has been written in the Lambs book of Life. This is what non-Adventists don't understand or stop and think about. If they did they might see the investigative judgment in a new light.
Dare I say most SDAs don't stop and think about these things when it comes to the I.J.
Hmmm....my thoughts:
1) Agreed
2) EGW wrote that; the Bible doesn't say such a thing re: His omnipresence or omnipotence. As for being spiritually God, Jesus is ontologically "God", meaning He is divine. He is not JEHOVAH.
3) Agreed
4) Again re: the foreknowledge, this is EGW, not the Bible. Concerning His humanity, yup....I agree. As for living a sinless life, again that's EGW. What the Bible teaches is being *in Christ* so that He might present us faultless. It says *NOTHING* about humanity attaining to such a thing.
5) Jesus knows precisely who are His and who are not. Read John 10. I submit, He's not aware of when He is to return, but that really doesn't matter anyway, except to show though He is divine, He is not the only true God of whom we read in Jn 17:3. The rest of "5" is an attempt to validate EGW et al., but the problem is His work is finished -- He sat down upon His ascension (cf. Heb 1:2). All issues were decided at the cross: JEHOVAH both declared judgment and salvation: judgment against the devil and his angels, as well as sin itself; salvation to those who accept His solution for sin.
The IJ is but a perturbation of Roman Catholic soteriology: infused righteousness via works of the law, which can save no on. Rather, the Bible teaches forensic righteousness (i.e., the righteousness of Christ) placed upon the believer upon receiving Christ (for Him has the Father sealed), and the believer is then sealed by the Holy Spirit (cf. Eph 1:13; 4:30), which Paul, John, and Peter tell us is the spirit of Jesus Himself.
Think on these things.
Where does the Bible say Jesus had/has no foreknowledge ?
Hello Dr. Allen Davis. May God bless you greatly in the name of Jesus. Some of the criticisms you place as contradictions of doctrine have well-established answers in Adventist doctrine, which are answered honestly in the scriptures. Respectfully and without ill intent, could it not have been a little longer and more effort to understand these details? Even though it is Laodicea, I have great affection for the Adventist church.
Thx for your comment and question. After nearly 30 years, I understood *ALL* of SDA doctrine quite well. In short, it's not biblical. It's based upon EGW et al., who incorrectly embraced a Levitical priesthood for Jesus' work of intercession/mediation. This position takes the beauty of the Gospel and twists it into cultish legalism. If you haven't done so in awhile, please read your Fundamental Beliefs. When you step back and carefully examine the denomination's doctrine, you'll find numerous areas where the Bible and SDA-ism are at odds.
@@DrAD767 I'm so glad you responded. I really like your story. The health reform was very significant in my life and that of my wife. It transformed the way she lives, and knowing Jesus is a balm for me. I understand the objections. I think that the one about Jesus' priesthood being different from the Levitical one is a strong one. However, he is called the high priest, which Melkisedek was not. That's why I understand that there are parallels between the two priesthoods. In fact, it's impossible not to typify priests and high priests in Christ. So I don't see how this could be an impossible objection. I usually watch channels of Adventist critics. I don't usually interact, but for some reason I felt comfortable writing. I watch these channels because I sincerely want to get closer to Christ, and if I'm wrong, I want to change. However, I see objective answers to the questions. For example, at the feast of dedication, the high priest also went to the Most Holy Place. In other words, there's no problem with Jesus going to the Most Holy Place after his death. Is there anything in your videos that you would objectively recommend as an error? Something that cannot be resolved by other Bible verses? If so, please point it out to me. As I said, I really like your channel. I have been listening to it in the car on my way to work. May God bless you greatly.
The texts rightly states I WILL PUT MY LAW in their jearts stop adding to scriptures the text never said 10 Commandements
That law is simple: Love YHWH with every fiber of your being; and love your neighbor as yourself. Only by being born again Jesus is this possible.
Sincerity is no substitute for sound doctrine.
©Rudy Briskar
I would definitely agree with you. Would you be willing to provide some context and further fidelity re: your statement?
@@DrAD767 yes, they are sincere as are Mormons and Jehovahs Witnesses to their own peril. They hold tight to heretical doctrines. Some do abandon their "faith" for the Truth of Jesus.
So there are only 2 ways. Was she a prophet or God or not!!! If as you are saying she wasn’t a real prophet then it means that it was not the Spirit of the Lord that guided her on all her writings but the spirit of another. There is not way around it. It is a serious statement that you are making.
I realize this is a serious matter, and therefore, I am quite serious about what I've shared. Think about it for a moment....how might you -- if you were a sociopathic person -- try to control a group of religious/faithful people? Simple, simply state God showed you this or that, or told you this or that. I'm not judging her motivations or even her sincerity, at least not early on in her so-called ministry. I actually believe she was sincere and got caught up in her own press and the influence of those men who used her to their own end. In her latter years, once most of the early patriarchs were dead and gone, she was now the "prophet" and she called the shots. Even today, her voice rings from the grave.
Thank you.🇨🇦
My opinion only....
1844 marked the start of the time of the end. Dan. 12:14
Look at the advances in technology and science 100 years after 1844.
Compare that to the same advances from 1744 to 1844.
Thx for your comment. I’ll address more later, but for now, what makes you believe 1844 is significant?
@@DrAD767 According to Goldsteins book...1844 "fits" the 2300 day prophecy.
The 180th anniversary of the "Great Disappointment' came and went here in Loma Linda without a peep.
@iczerman Thx. For me, I put as much stock in Goldstein as I do in EGW or Madam Helena Blavatsky.
@@DrAD767 I see your point.
I sticking to my guns about 1844 being a pivotal year when a "renaissance"in science,technology and freedom of thought began.
My evidence is only anecdotal.
@iczerman Sure, I get it. That said, have you watched my video on 1844?
“Behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me” is a line from the Bible, Revelation 22:12-13:
Without judgment how can Jesus bring his reward immediately ? the word invetsigative might not be found leteraly but by Bible and Jesus factual we can knew that right now our every act was judge, Jesus our hight priest is in most holy place ...
It is clear to me, you don’t understand the Gospel. Has not God judged us all as sinners and lost? Has He not provided a solution to this problem? Those who come to
Christ and are reborn have already passed thru judgment. Otherwise, how then can John so boldly write,
“1 John 5:11-13 (KJV) 11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12 He that hath the Son hath life; [and] he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. 13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that *ye have eternal life* and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.”
SDAs don’t understand the finished work of Jesus (cf. Heb 1:1-4), and this fact makes them a people most miserable.
When does your name come up for review?
CHRIST IS OMNIPRÉSENT AND OMNIPOTENT HE KNOWS ALL THINGS HE DOES NOT NEED TO INVESTIGATE TO KNOW
@@charnelallan7159 then why judgment is needed ??
@@charnelallan7159
Please read this...
Revelation 14:7. ESV And he said with a loud voice, "Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of his judgment has come, and worship him who made heaven and earth, the sea and the springs of water."
Sir I appreciate your message but do you think it was necessary to say a women with a messed up head injury…… I don’t think that has anything to do with her theological flaws far more people said these things besides her almost 30 yrs later I can understand you’re anger but sarcasm after being in the denominator for so long is not a good look…….. whether you think so or not….
I appreciate your input - thx. I do believe it’s significant to highlight the fact she had a significant head injury that resulted in cataleptic fits, hysteria, and ecstatics. These facts were recorded by several independent physicians.
My reason for mentioning it is because of so many outlandish statements and the acceptance of odd practices (e.g., phrenology), it’s important for EGW’s readers to know her physical and mental challenges, and how they affected her counsel, especially until 1875, the year she had her last vision.
....I have to say her head injury was amazing to produce a book such as steps to Christ ,and desire of ages...I would be happy to have such a head injury .Its funny how we copy and past all the diagnosis without and MRI Brian or EEG and we come up with inferred conclusions without evidence..I give these adventist s credit for recognising that Daniel 8:14 IS NOT ANTIOCUS...that much I respect them!
How was the day of atonement fulfilled at calvary when this work was specifically carried out by the high priest?
Christ was not a priest while here on earth.
Hebrews 8:4 KJV - For if he were on earth, he should not be a priest, seeing that there are priests that offer gifts according to the law:
And since the bible clearly teaches this fact, we see that Jesus began his ministration as priest after his resurrection. And being that it was after his crucifixion and resurreection when was the day of atonement fulfilled and how? Scripture please vs mansplaining.
You know, I was very much interested in sharing some thoughts with you. However, your insolence and the pejorative “mansplaining” nonsense has simply caused me to set aside my pen. I have more than supported the matter in ALL THREE videos, as well as the threads. How about taking the time to view them and read?
@@DrAD767 mansplaining is a term used to imply more of the man speaking versus the scripture. I encourage you to allow the text to explain themselves versus you explaining away their meaning.
2 Peter 1:20 KJV - Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
You did a lot of that in this video.
The SDA solution is proof-texting, which is NOT allowing the scripture to speak for itself. Also, the EGW lens isn’t the answer. Consistent hermeneutics and examining scripture within its context and texture is what I do and did. This method is generally foreign to the SDA paradigm.
@DrAD767 I would entertain that if it were not for the following. Without the Spirit of God dwelling in us Truth is evasive and not understood by the natural man. And the Bible itself teaches us how to study it.
1 Corinthians 2:13 KJV - Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
Lastly, you do realize that almost all who hide behind "faulty hermeneutics " held by SDA have a problem with the simple english word remember?
It takes no special enlightened scholarly understanding of how to study the Bible to remember the word remember.
Exodus 20:8 KJV - Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Now last I recalled God said that they who turn their ears from hearing the law even their prayers are an abomination.
Proverbs 28:9 KJV - He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.
Now of course this is referring to the wilful rebellious. So how can a teacher who does not even comprehend the word remember make such claims of superior hermeneutics?
SMH….changing the subject simply because you cannot intelligently respond to my point is a defensive tactic. Further, insulting my intelligence via ad hominem attacks is no way to garner my willingness to engage.
Now, if what I’ve said to you is all what you’ve heard before, and I’m simply another deceived soul, then why bother stopping by and commenting? If it’s only SSDD, along the lines of Brimsmead and Ford, then why even make an effort to share your voice? Clearly, you haven’t provided one shred of evidence to counter my claims, only your disagreement and opinion.
I suggest you move along and troll elsewhere, where folks of lesser intellect might just take the bait and give you a platform.
With all respect I don't know where you get it from but no where in SDA Fund does it teach salvation by works or merit. We teach sinners cannot keep a holy law without CHRISTS MERITS. which makes obedience more important if Jesus has offered His grace and power Phil 4,13. Also no one can judge another's motives for why by Gods grace we k 5:53 eep this moral law that judges our characters only God can do this The Sabbath is not a person it is a DAY. God invites us to keep this DAY WITH HIM. Ex 20:8-11. Six DAYS we are to work but the 7th DAY is the Sabbath we are told to keep holy and not work on this DAY.. Nehemiah got angry because people were profaning this DAY. New 13:16-21. SDAs did not " set up" this day - God Hinself did. Also Gods judgment is fulfilled or closes at the end of the worldnwhen Gods angels do their work os ent HAS ALREADY closed what separating wheat from tares etc and garlthering the wheat into Gods barn .. If the judgm
Everything you’ve written falls within the flawed framework of the defunct great controversy theme. I pity the fact you’ve allowed yourself to be deceived. If you cannot see Jesus’ finished work and the FACT he is our rest, then you don’t understand the Gospel.
the work will be finished when we all gather in heaven @@DrAD767 .....Christ has NOT YET SUBDUED HIS ENEMIES ..he sat at The Father s right hand and said UNTIL he makes his enemies his footstool ..THE SAINST ARE STILL HERE !we haven't entered the feast of tabernacle fulfilment ...ITS not yet !......Christ is OUR REST and has always been.....we dont stop multiplying and filling the earth because Christ is our REST!..we continue What God purposed in genesis and we dont STOP HAVING A SEVEN DAY CYCLE ...the sun sets and rises as set in motion in genesis and days becomes weeks and etc and our WE DONT STOP our weekly rest just because Christ is our rest.we dont discard honouring our parents because we ARE NO LONGER UNDER THE LAW ...we dont steal UNDER GRACE ...we dont covert our neighbours wife under grace !...Christ has died to enabe us to live a holy life and not REST IN DOING NOTHING ...we still work !we dont say Christ is our REST!...The NOT TIRED GOD AFTER WORKING FOR SIX DAYS SETS A PATTERN FOR MANKIND IN GENESIS 2:1-3HE SETS A PATTERN FOR MARRIAGE WAY EBFORE SIN AND SETS THE WEEKLY CYLCIE WAY BEFORE SIN.....the sabbath keeping Jews who found NO REST IN THE WILDERNESS DID NOT BELIEVE.*they had no spiritual REST*....we can find NO REST IF WE DONT BELIEVE even if we keep the sabbath!....Hebrews 3:19
So we see that they were not able to enter, because of their unbelief.... SPIRITUAL REST does not mean we are emancipated from physical REST PATTERN ....just because God can provide everything does not mean we STOP WORKING too ...that work pattern is still there........THE WEEKLY REST Is for MANKIND...its always been before sin!...there is no great controversy theme about the Sabbath in genesis 2:1-3.......you are pandering to feelings not facts in some of your responses ...
Satan is trying to debunk the investigative judgment because he wants people to deceive them by false belief that once saved always saved. This demonic doctrine encourage people to believe that they are saved once and for all while continue living a sinful life devoid of repentance. Whereas investigative judgment points us to have a constant faith in Jesus by abiding in Him because we are to be judged according to our works Rev. 20:13. And it is the law as the standard of His judgment. James 2:12.
No. You really don’t understand, not to mention, you’re out of your depth.
The IJ is focused on self and what one can do with God’s help. That’s a false Gospel. It focuses on infused righteousness, rather than imparted righteousness.
Read your Bible, find the *REAL* Jesus, and be saved. Stop trying to save yourself.
Ellen White in Daystar 24 1846 is talking about the wicked world of the past who refused God’s offer of mercy and therefore were rejected, she is not referring to the wicked contemporaries of the Advent people!
Keep reading. She’s clear: Those Christians who didn’t buy into Millerism were, in her sick mind, lost. That is, until it was no longer convenient to keep the door shut.
@@DrAD767
She’s not saying that the probation of the wicked who have not seen the light to reject it is closed, she’s referring to the Christians who saw, understood and accepted the light but later refused to follow the light.
@michaelbrutsche75 The piece you might be missing is, she changed her mind completely in Oct 1851. Further, there was no light in Miller at all. In fact, he renounced his date-setting. Had she been a true seer, she would’ve never bought into it herself. Again, I implore you, stick to the Bible. If you read it absent of the EGW lens, you’ll draw a completely different conclusion than the IJ.
Please, understand that if you’ve come to Christ and have surrendered to Him, God has already judged you.
@@DrAD767
No, she’s not talking about the Christians who didn’t buy into millerism, she is speaking of those who accepted the light and then later refused to keep their eyes on the light. She is NOT speaking of the wicked who have never come to the light, or other Christians who did not understood or accept it!
@@DrAD767
What is significant of her changing her mind ?
the only thing Jesus is doing in Heaven at the right hand of the Father is his intercessory work for those that are his. There is nothing needed outside of the cross Christ has to do to complete Atonement. There is a pre advent judgment, so those in Christ can rise from the grave, and those alive meet him in the air, when he returns, and a judgment for the wicked to be thrown into the fire. The "Investigative Judgment " is not biblical.
100% agree! Thx for sharing your thoughts.
May i asked? If you disagree
With what Ellen what wrote?how you write?
Ellen saw herself as a lesser light. Although she never explicitly said so, she saw herself as a prophet. Heb 1:1-4 betrays any such thought.
Taken word by word, verse by verse, chapter by chapter, Galatians tells us that we are no longer living under the levetical mosaic covenant. In the same way the whole book of Hebrews tells us how and why thisbwas accomplished. Indeed, Jesus is our eternal rest. He is a high priest and king under the order of Melchizedek whereby His atoning sacrifice is finished. As a result, he has sat down on the right hand of God the Father, waiting for his enemies to be made a footstool before he returns. Jesus is not up, walking around dressed up as a levitical priest in an imaginary most holy place in some imaginary temple. Because of Jesus i am spiritually eternally at rest. He dwells in me and through his spirit, i will produce fruits.
The IJ...what an ingenius, insideously evil money making machine to rebuild the White Estate wealth after peoples of that time having literally "sold their farms" and even suicides after the failed prophecies of 1843/1844/1851.
Ex SDA as of February 2024 after 30 years of living in fear.
Sir the book of the law contained the entire 613 commandements of God. Including thé décalogue 😮
Lets vheck scriptures.
Deuteronomy, 30, 10
If u obey the Lord ur God to keep his commandements and his statues which r written IN THÉ BOOK OF THÉ LAW.
I'm not of what your point is in this comment. Please clarify.
I am responding to a comment that thé Book Of thé Law did not contain thé décalogue
Ah...thx. People who say such silly things want their cake and to eat it, too. The separation of ceremonial, moral, civil law, etc., is the legalist's attempt to keep people in bondage.
Well it is amazing the Bible I have got and the subsequently the 10 other Bible's that are with the Bible I've got actually state that Christ is coming with his reward. If you have a look at plain English if someone is coming with his reward then obviously there must've been a judgement before he comes to find out who is going to receive the reward and it states the righteous will receive their reward and the people who are not righteous will receive their reward also. So the investigative judgement is in every Bible I know of. It's got nothing to do with Seventh-day Adventists. It has got to do with scripture simple
The IJ has everything to do with SDA-ism, control, and a cult-like behavior. Your posts themselves exhibit it. You mention other Bibles, and yet, fail to properly exegete the text. I suggest not listening to EGW, Stephen Bohr et al. They all just want your money. Listen to JEHOVAH, in Christ. He wants your heart.
@@DrAD767 the church is a hospital for saints, it's not a five star hotel for sinners. But again you haven't answered my question how do you know went to repent and why do you repent.
@brianholloway1451 God has given us redemption - which we don’t deserve - in Christ because all have sinned and come short of His glory. We then repent because our hearts are moved by the prompting of the spirit that pleads with us. The soul who hears then becomes crucified with Christ, presents his body a living sacrifice, and gives his life to true religion by walking in the spirit and producing the fruit thereof. If and when he or she stumbles, the individual returns with a penitent heart to the one who is his or her Advocate. Nowhere does the Bible say the sinner will become perfect. Rather, it says the repentant sinner becomes hidden in Christ and clothed with His righteousness; only then is he faultless before God. Never - *NEVER!* - will the repentant sinner stand before JEHOVAH without a mediator.
@@DrAD767 you mentioned here we then repent because our hearts are moved by the prompting of the holy spirit that played with us. Well that's exactly right but didn't Jesus put the 10 commandments in your heart or did he only put nine? And then I little bit further along you state if and when he or she stumbles, the individual returns with a pen and part two the one who is his or her advocate obviously that is Jesus. And you are right again about the repentant sinner is absolutely faultless if they stay in Christ. But how do you know when you have come away from Christ only when you go away from the 10 commandments because scripture tells you sing is the transgression of the 10 commandments. So again I ask you how do you know when you need to repent. If you do away with the 10 commandments
@brianholloway1451 Which commandment do you believe I’m omitting?
THE HOLY KING JAMES BIBLE HER HUSBAND TOLD US IN THE PAPERWORK HE SAID SHE ELLEN COLOURED IT ALL UP
They don’t teach the investigative judgment in depth unless you start digging and read the Bible yourself. I learned about it after coming across some RUclips video. After years of being part of this church(cult), we decided to leave the church.
I’m so glad to read, you and yours saw the light. You’re absolutely right, this doctrine isn’t taught during the 27-part brainwashing session. It isn’t until you get into the more in-depth doctrines that it’s made evident.
The character is own of God. The incarnation of the God 💯.
ALL the prophetic The divine time is over before five hundred years ago. Full lights moon one night Divine time running now by judgement of the God 💯. DIVINE time accept judge didn't of God 💯. So need Divine time justice of the God of all the humans.
What are you attempting to say?
❤
Why do you not begin your presentations with prayer?
What makes you think I don’t? Does a person have to pray on camera for it to count? Didn’t Jesus say, “Enter into your closet” for prayer and pray to our Father in secret?
All my dear Christ follower of SDA hold fast your faith in christ and the commandment of God it is the work of satan to abolished the law of God out of his people ... to fight against truth of God is satan ans his agwnts greatest work ... Revelation 12:17 (NIV):
"The dragon was enraged at the woman and went off to wage war against the rest of her offspring-those who keep God’s commands and hold fast their testimony about Jesus."
*Key Points:*
1. Satan's anger: The dragon (Satan) is furious due to being cast out of heaven (Revelation 12:9).
2. Targeting believers: Satan directs his wrath toward Christians, the "rest of her offspring."
3. Characteristics of believers:
- Keep God's commands (obedience).
- Hold fast their testimony about Jesus (faithfulness).
*Symbolism:*
1. Woman: Israel (Revelation 12:1-6).
2. Dragon: Satan (Revelation 12:9).
3. Offspring: Believers in Jesus Christ.
*Implications:*
1. Persecution: Satan seeks to harm and intimidate Christians.
2. Faithfulness: Believers must remain steadfast in obedience and testimony.
3. Protection: God shields His people (Revelation 12:14-16).
Daniel 7:25
Sounds like the typical SDA propaganda.
The law of Moses and the law of God in regards to thé old covenant R. ONE IN THE SAME.
Lets check Bible
1. 1st kings 2 3 And keep thé charge of thé Lord to walk in his ways to keep his statues and his commandements and his judgements as it IS written in Thé Law Of Moses.
2. Nehemiah 10, 29
They clave to their brethren, their nobles and entered into an oath and into a curse to walk in God's Law which was given by Moses and to observe and do All The Commandements.
3. 2nd King's 14, 6
But the children of the murderers he slew not according unto that written in thé book of the law.( Thou shall not kill.)
Adventism has a false dychotomy of thé term law . The décalogue was the exécutive summary of thé law. The books of the law provided judgements, rules régulations, do's and donts .
Basic eg.
The 4th commandement say remember thé Sabbath day to keep it holy.
The torah/ book of the provided info on how to keep. If u throw out thé book u throw away the rules governing the old covenant. It was one unit.
THERE IS 22 MILLION SDA _ERS. Some like ME do not believe in the GHOUL lesser light to HELL.SHE will put back into OLD TESTAMENT BONDAGE.
YOU ARE MISSING THE POINT
AND YOU ARE DOCTOR!!!!!!
Again, there’s no communication happening here.
Please enlighten us your highness Raphael
Mista lost his Dr with God
He does not know what SDA believe on investigative judgement.
This ignorant comment demonstrates YOU don’t. Sir, I was the one to whom the experts came to better understand it. You need to educate yourself regarding to whom it is you speak.
8:32 8:38 8:38
What?
Another misinformed soul misrepresenting a denomination in which he obviously claims to be familiar with. Smh. These evangelicals are uniting as prophecy said they would using deception, lies and misrepresentation to undermine the clear text of scripture. His intro is needed due to a lack of solid Bible.
You have NO IDEA of what you speak or with whom you’re dealing.
@DrAD767 oh yes I do. The spirit is the same. Seen and heard of all of this before since the 60's and 70's well into the 80's and presently. Brisnsmead, Ford and the rest. Nothing new under the sun.
Ecclesiastes 3:15 KJV - That which hath been is now; and that which is to be hath already been; and God requireth that which is past.
The 3 angels are being prophesied again and now the history must repeat itself as it was when proclaimed in 1844 of the spring. It's reoccurring all around the world. And this time there will be no tarrying of the vision.
1844 has no basis in fact or prophecy; I’ve already shown this to be the case. It’s contrived to fit Miller’s error and to put Jesus in a Levitical priesthood. Ford was spot on re: the IJ’s fallacy and shaky foundation.
@DrAD767 question. The Gospel. Is there a starting and ending point? And if so can you identify those?
That’s not the salient issue, actually. What’s germane to the discussion is, do YOU know what the gospel is? Can you define it? (HINT: it’s not Rev 14:6-12.)
You are dead wrong my friend and grossly disguided and deceived, leading many souls astray, you bring no one text from the Bible to support your conjectures. God have mercy
First, we’re not friends. Second, are you really that dull?! Have you even paid attention? These videos are chock full of Bible text that refutes EGW and SDA-ism.
If you have a legit argument with scriptural support, then please provide it. Otherwise, be on your way. I don’t have time for brainwashed, narrow-minded SDAs any longer.
I am not Seven day Adventist .but most of us have to study Old Testament unless and untill you don't have understanding of this you will have hard time to understand investigate judgement .if you think it's not necessary ti believe in that why God the father ask Moses to make exactly same pattern of sanctuary on earth and follow it .i think ppl should be more studying the Bible and basically Daniel and revelation and try to connect the dots .give a try you will not regret it .
Seventh day adventists do not compare atonement with the death of Jesus. The death of Jesus is anti typical to the individual sacrifice offered on the courtyard of the sanctuary when a sinner comes to the sanctuary. the investigative judgement is comparable to the day of atonement not the day of atonement compared to death of jesus on cross. The investigative judgement is valid if one studies the sanctuary properly.
All matters were settled at the cross. What is there to investigate? The day of atonement is about the faithful waiting for the return of Christ. Period.
Knowing the day and hour of Christs coming does not necessarily mean that one would be alive at that time. You can know something will happen, but not in your lifetime.
??? Context please
With reference to the quote from The Daystar at around the 15 min mark, you stated “Jesus would return in Ellen Whites lifetime.”
It was a prophetic statement but there’s no indication that she believed Jesus would return in her life time. EGW was not on the path, she was in vision. The statement is full of symbolism eg. The people are not literally walking on a path in the air.
Have you read what you’ve written? What part of “we” and “us” in her “vision” isn’t clear to you? She pictures herself in the “vision”!
Good grief! The credence you give this woman shows you’re in a cult.
@@sherylwilson6705 “They fell all the way along the path one after another until we heard the voice of God like many waters, which gave us the day and hour of Jesus’ coming.”
To whom then is egw referring when she says WE and US? You can’t have it both ways.
Maybe I’m still learning and trying to understand everything. Your harsh and judgemental words to me do not sound very Christlike.
You seem to me like the accuser of the brethren. I’m definitely not in a cult.
Your personal attacks on Ellen White's health and looks reveal more about your character than her doctrinal position.
This video is over a year old, and so I don’t know what I might’ve said about her looks. Her health was bad, so there’s no apology for the fact she wasn’t well mentally.
As for my character, shame on you for your judgmental attitude and complete lack of Christian understanding. Just because you don’t agree with me, doesn’t mean I’m wrong. In fact, I’m not. And, deep down, you probably realize that.
Like many who defend this witch, you say nothing of substance, and so I bid you to the door - don’t let it hit you in the backside.
@ You are so predictable. The tone of your reply proves the point of my initial comment. The spirit I see coming out of you is certainly not from Christ. You need to repent,walk and talk humbly before God. In fact, before the door hits me on the way out, let me just let you in on this. I am a non-trinitarian and have been longer than you yourself have been. You have no idea about my understanding of scripture which far exceeds your rudimentary, simplistic understanding. Also, for the record , I don’t believe in the investigative judgment as outlined by the SDA church which is the reason I watched your video- I am not supporting EGW on this issue. We may have some common ground there. However, your attitude towards people who challenge you is disgusting, pathetic and down right abusive. Look at how you responded to my comment. You should be ashamed of yourself. I WILL pray for you.
First, let me state, my attitude towards people is always a neutral approach, until antagonists like yourself invoke a response you don't like. So, let me say, you need a higher level of EQ. Or, said another way: Grow a set.
Second, Your time as a non-trinitarian is a non sequitur, for one, and second, you have no idea how long I've believed what I've embraced. For you to call my understanding rudimentary and simplistic, again demonstrates an immaturity of character to which I simply won't give any further attention.
Third: Disgusting, pathetic, down right abusive. Go back and look at your first comment; perhaps you'll see your sanctimonious & gross buffoonery. Common ground or not, you took a jab, which I aptly parried. The fact you didn't like my dismissal of your arrogance demonstrates all I need to know. You had a chance to say something of substance; instead, you showed yourself a pompous ass.
Finally, please save your prayers for yourself. I certainly don't want or need your false piety; moreover, I don't need another person who believes I need to repent, and walk humbly before my God, not realizing to further engage is to cast my pearls before swine. You don't know me, nor do you remotely understand my mission. Your aim is simply to bully. Had you taken a different tone from the outset -- and again, had a modicum of EQ -- I'd have gladly engaged with you.
Good day, Sir/Ma'am, whichever applies.