I'd be into that for sure! Tp hear the difference between 60s Blackface, 70s Silverface and 80s-90s "red knobs" Twins would be awesome. I LOVE my 89' Red Knobs Twin :)
Dan playing through all three of those amps at once will forever go down as one of the greatest moments of this show. Balls to the walls inspirational playing.
Loved this episode. There's a reason the classics are classics. So many attempts to improve on the OCD and tubescreamer and while they may end up as some worthwhile variations, no improvement is necessary.
Here's an idea for an episode: get Rabea or someone else on board and look at classic metal amps. For example, Jcm800, 5150, Dual Rectifier, see how they do pedals and whether they might also be used for other genres such as jazz or blues
+Mannes That would be a lot of views. I love the Dual Rec’s clean and pushed sounds more than the heavy stuff - perfect in jazz or blues, or country! (Mick here)
Great idea! would be awesome. I have another: a pickups episode, everything about tone, height, output, all that stuff. It´s would be very helpful for many people.
Guys, the bit on frequencies with the EQ pedal is without a doubt one of the most essential bits of information you have ever put into a video. I kind of can't believe you waited so long to do it. Knowing and understanding frequencies is the secret of going from, "Something doesn't sound right here," to "Ready to go".
I'm guessing that the G2 and Quartermasters must be your big sellers Dan, but I think that 3 2 1 of yours is an absolute unsung hero for of the show and a really clever piece of kit.
Great job with the editing on the video. So much work with all of the pedal and amp switching. It sure makes it easier for the viewer to know what is going on with all of the different sounds. Thanks and keep up the good work!
Jeez guys, that bit on frequencies was hands-down the most informative thing you have every talked about/taught. I can't believe you waited so many years to go over this! Understanding frequencies and how they interact is the key to going from, "Hold on something doesn't sound right here," to "Yeah, that's sounding good!" Keep up the good work.
So far this has worked on a Cali76, Muffroom Cloud, and CBA Brothers. Dan was right though! To be fair any very nice flexible drive with MIDI control was gonna sell itself to me at that point though, but the other two were definitely a TPS inspired prod. Just bought a new amp though so I'm very much enjoying this is a "principles" episode, rather than a "look at all this cool stuff you could buy" episode. If only I could buy the fingers Landreth! :D
i been playing for years and never had a strat, never wanted one and was always a proud gibson guy. Mick of all people got me to finally take the plunge after such a long time and i ended up, yep you guessed it, getting the exact same configuration he has: sonic blue/ rosewood/ mint pickguard etc. (although mine is a bit cheaper)
I hate you guys for releasing videos in December. I now want more stuff. I think the ONLY video of yours I will watch from here on in are any wish list list you have.
This is probably my favorite thing to watch now. You guys are so good at producing this. The edits are perfect and appropriate without being so heavy handed and distracting. Either Dan and Mick are getting more comfortable playing on a video or they're getting better and better at playing, not that they weren't always great players. Between Dan's relevant knowledge of the pedal building and what goes where and what goes better with this and why vs what Mick has picked up from working the industry, where this came from and what that means etc.. I'm about to have a whole closet full of these damn shirts.
Really cool video! Since I've discovered you guys channel, I've been binge watching your shows. I've easily learned more from that pedal show, than I have through my whole guitar journey. Can't thank you guys enough!!
This show has gotten so much better, I love everything about you guy. At the same time, that Biffy section will always be my favorite moment. It’s like Dan just goes to that space that I feel we all strive to get to. Thank you always for sharing your moments with us!
Thanks for this guys. I own the DLS and run it in Super Bass mode at 18v into a NOS Tweed Blues Junior, with preamp set between 9-12 o'clock. Not sure how "Marhsally" it is, but it definitely changes the feel of the amp, and fuzzes seem to react better than just straight into the amp. I would love to see the modes of the DLS explored in a future video. Cheers!
Since the first Pedal Show, I have been working to improve my ear. This video was brilliant in helping me distinguish tones and begin to verbalize the differences. Thank you so much!
Every time I think this show can't get better it does. The section with the EQ was genius & I'll understand the terminology so much better in future.Thank you.
A lot of fun going on there. Interesting that the guitar that drew out the differences in the amps best was Dan's Telecaster. Suggestion: If you can lay your hands on them Catalinbreads' 'Foundation Overdrive' series would make for a fascinating follow up to this episode. I own a Formula 5 and a Formula 5e4 - the former does an amazing 'small tweed on the edge of disintegration' sound whilst the latter adds a nice clean-ish Bassman character to your tone. Much as I'd love to own a selection of classic amps I just don't have the space so pedals and a Victory V40 seems the next best alternative to me. As/when/if you get around to it I'd love to hear your take on these pedals.
would love to see an episode on tube differences- whenever I start researching and reading up on them I get lost without actually hearing them. huge fan of the show guys. keep it up!!
+TheSphericalGuy We talked about it.We don’t have one that tells the story well enough. I was trying the get the one in Logic to work, but the differences weren’t massively obvious. Cheers!
I think the stock EQ plug-in with the analyzer engaged should be detailed enough. Perhaps the differences simply aren't that massive visually, but it really only takes a couple of dB's up or down for our ears to pick it up, particularly in the mid range. Have a good weekend lads!
Great show guys. This midrange thing took me years to learn and a lot of MONEY too! To keep a long story short, about ten years back I played in an alt country band with a tele and a fender DRRI. Great overall sound but I couldn't get the warm overdrive- the kind that sounds like it's cozied up to your ears- the way I was hearing it on all my fav records from bands like Wilco, Son Volt, Drive By Truckers etc. I ran through dozens of pedals - no good. Finally I ditched the DRRI and went through a series of "gain" amps- vox, marshal etc. What I found out is that yeah, you can get "that" sound easily with the right amp- and if that's that what you want, just get the amp you want. An AC15 is actually cheaper than a fender DRRI, so just buy one! But, more importantly, I discovered that its really the speaker that matters when you are getting into drive and gain. You "can" get warm drive sound from a fender- IF you put a British flavored speaker in there. It won't be exactly like a Marshal, but it will be very good- and maybe better depending on how versatile you need / how much headroom you need at other times. The thing about this video is that I'm guessing that your super reverb has alnico speakers, which sound a lot more British(esque) - aka less mid scooped, brighter upper mids- than those old gold label eminence speaker that so many fender amps came with ten plus years ago. If you were using my old DRRI with the eminence gold label speakers, there'd be a much more dramatic difference between the fender and the other two amps. Those speakers just sound dark and mid scooped, and- IMHO- just couldn't get a "warm" overdrive sound to save their lives. Now I notice that many stock fenders these days are shipping with Celestions, and I totally understand why.
Hi Guys. Love your show and I'd like to contribute something. You are correct that Fender developed the Tweed line with ever increasing power as new models. The Brown and Cream years were experimentation in Tremolo and tone circuitry as well as establishing the levels of negative feedback to achieve Clean with high levels of Headroom. This culminated in the Blackface which, as a series, was meant to get a very similar tone at a very wide range of volumes since before Blackface, and especially with Tweeds, a gigging musician needed several amps to get the same tone and dynamic response at a widely ranging size of venues since PAs tended to be vocal only back then.. One of the main design features that accomplished that in Blackface was placing the Volume control AFTER the Tone Stack and eliminating the Direct-Coupled Cathode Follower which was meant to be an impedance matching stage but also introduce a Limiter effect that causes a bandpass "squeeze", sometimes sounding like a very mild wah effect.. These preamp changes did exactly what they were designed to do but have a downside. Because a Tweed, especially the 30 Watt and up models, caused considerable tonal and dynamic response changes with Volume settings, both on the amp and at the guitar, they don't work well to behave the same over a wide spectrum BUT that very characteristic makes them more "vocal" where response and tonality are powerfully affected by volume settings and pick attack, palm dampening, fingering variations etc etc. Marshall copied the 4x10 Bassman at a very opportune time, when PAs got much, much larger and more capable and soon followed by miking everything, and providing multiple separate monitor mixes. The meant a guitar player could use his favorite Tweed or Marshall just about anywhere and let the PA handle FOH while he could enjoy the expressive vocal-like dynamics of the earlier design. This is what the technical difference is between Blackface and Tweed and all it's derivatives Marshall/Vox/HiWatt ad infinitum that anyone can verify just by plugging in and playing with the Volume/Gain knob. .
The way i would make fender sound more marshally, is by setting dls as close to a CLEAN marshall as possible to create platform, and then add ocd for a gain, it should work well either before or after dls.
The many of horror part is one of the best moments of the show so far. Other personal favs include anything showcasing wet/dry, like that reverse ping pong malarkey :D
How appropriate. I spent the day trying different combinations of mid-pushed & scooped pedals and/or amp settings. Best tone I got was a Tube Screamer (set SRV-style) into a Blues Driver with the tone rolled back and a fairly flat (relatively speaking, ofc) Bassbreaker15. Classic pedals! Gonna try a Jetter Red Shift next week.
Y'all are the absolute best! I always learn more about amps and pedals from watching you both. Plus this episode, helped me out so much with understanding ODs with amps. Thank y'all much!
Have you heard of AMT pedals from Russia? They make famous amps preamp replicas into pedal format. That into a real amp FX return seem to get great results for lots of people.
I really have to give a big thumbs up to my Egnater Tweaker. I really can get any sound out of it. Been using it for a few years and extremely pleased. From Andy Timmons fender clean with a strat to guns n roses on a Les Paul or Foo fighters ac30. It's so good and can come much much closer than any of those pedals, and is perfect for when you only have room and money for a single amp, but like a diverse range of music and love tone.
+Javier Aldan I ve seen vids but it kinda ,sorta sounded close. But I never had the chance to try one. +Rc Dad / Sultans of Wing yeah I was checking some demos the other day but to tell you the truth I wasnt impressed. Heard some models have loop issues with pedals.
It was great seeing those amps back to back, and actually naming their differences regarding bass, mids and tremble. Also, putting numbers on it, with more or less precision, using the MXR EQ was really helpful. The pedal choices were good as well, since everyone "knows" what a TS does, what the OCD does etc., allowing us to have sort of a baseline for the sound. That said, the Many of horror moment was killer! My god, it was impossible not to get excited watching the video, I can only imagine being in the room. PS: Marshall+OCD is -the- sound of rock, amazing
You should do a part 2 to this with a couple of extension cabs to isolate the actual amps by using the same speakers. A lot can be said about the enormous difference speakers can make.
+Steve Macneil We make this point many times. But who carries an extension cab for their Super Reverb or AC30?! The whole point of this is that the sound of an amp is the whole thing, not just the electronics. Cheers!
Shoving the stick farther-not further!-up my ass... Technically, all these amps cut mids as compared to no tone stack. The Marshall attentuates mids the least. It's also worth noting that "mids" is centered around 800Hz in the Marshall and Vox and more like 600Hz for the Fender.
Thank you gentlemen. I am always delighted when you two get into the technical aspects of amps, pedals, and guitars. I loved hearing those amps side by side.
This is just pure brilliant, funny, extremely in depth, you guys are really helping me to understand my guitar sounds and also i am noticing things in a mix i never realised were there. Thank you so much, I’ll continue to watch and spread the word on your videos each time they come out !
Thank you James, very kind of you to say. So glad you’re finding the shows useful! We just try to be a springboard to help everybody ask questions that will get them to where they want to be a little more quickly. It’s a journey, but hopefully we can help make it a fun one! Thanks for watching.
I don't mean to interrupt but where's the second part of the Analogman video? The one where you geek out on the fuzzes? I've been dying to understand the Sunface variations...
Coming back on the pickup request, some kind of tonal overview of each of the major and semi major types / tone groups, also with things like the history of the Strat selector switch, how Strat single coils differ from Teles, differences between say 50s, 60s & 70s pickup sounds, etc. along with the common mods (humbuckers in Tele neck, LP humbuckers split, out of phase, etc.), would be great & super useful. Especially considering swapping out pickups is something many try as a first or second mod. Thanks.
+Dean Johnston There’s Something here Dean. Certainly in a basic comparison. Trouble is, contrary to a lot of the crap you might read online, the host guitar makes a massive difference, so you’re never comparing apples with apples. That said, there are definitely some generalities that would be bloomin’ useful and interesting to demo. Not least for me and Dan... thanks as ever for watching!
Hiya! Yeah, I get your drift, a lot of variables in the mix. Still, it could be informative; perhaps along the lines of the current "mid scooped vs pushed' episode, where some assumptions might get reconsidered. Incidentally, I noted on the recent Anderton's blindfold challenge with Lee Anderton playing Strats, that while he instantly identified the one with a humbucker in the bridge position, he still posed it as a question - "Oh, is that a humbucker?" as opposed to 'Hey, that's a humbucker!' At the time I thought that was interesting. Cheers.
Hi again. While I remember, tell Dan that just down the road from where I live in Japan is a junk yard with a Mazda Roadpacer in it - aka HJ Premier with a rotary motor in it. Depending on his degree of bogan-ness, he may or may not find that fascinating...
Great video! I know my way around a 3-band EQ but I've always really shied away from graphic EQs somewhat because I just wasn't sure how each band works or matters, so that little snippet's really inspired me to persevere with that and see what I can do for my sounds. Thanks, guys.
Duessy > OCD > Marshall... that sound was epic! Also, found it very interesting how much more the Tele seemed to accentuate some of the frequency differences especially when the TS9 was being used.
Is there any way y’all could show what makes other vintage style amps (supro, Gibson, silver tone) so unique compared to the more common amps? Also maybe compare that with reissue stuff? I have a new thunderbolt so I’m curious to see how it differs from Marshall, Fender, and Vox.
There's a great channel called The Guitologist who's an amp tech and he's got a shitload of videos of him playing/working on valcos, harmonys, magnatones, gibsons, you name it.
Dan & Mick, have you thought about getting a sound/guitar tech in, to talk about venue set up issues ? How many of us have been to a gig where the sound was really bad with very unhappy musicians ? And how may gigs have we been to where the sound is amazing and musicians are really enjoying themselves with no issues. I have been to a venue where one band had fantastic sound quality and another band on a different night had awful sound. Is the band using amps/set up etc that are wrong for the venue or is it the techs fault ?
That Pedal Show . Oh. Good! Best sound I ever came across was the Japanese metal band Vow Wow, with the British bassist Neil Murray. They were light years ahead of any other band at the time. I can remember seeing computers on stage, which was very unusual for a metal band.
I love hearing dan play the I Feel Fine riff into that vox. That and Mick playing the Brian May stuff gives me a half formed idea for a show- classic or famous tones/combos- mick can do full on SRV with the super and the TS. Beatles or queen or many many others for the vox and plenty of choices for the Marshall + les paul. I suppose this sort of thing pops up in lots of episodes when you guys say there it is, that's the tone, but I feel like there's more that could be fun. Like I said, half formed idea.
Found it !!! I've been re-watching a load of TPS vids to find that Biffy Clyro reference. 32:29 I had meant to follow it up the first time when I got distracted by a visitor. I suddenly found out quite how many TPS episodes I watch in a week ...
Hands down favorite guitar amp: Fender Super Six. Awesome amp. A friend of mine had one and it was gnarly. He ran it along with an ac30. Sounded bigger than god.
That Pedal Show were you running the EQ on 9 volts or 18? I accidentally ran mine on 9 instead of 18 and the sliders didn’t light up, but it also sounded a lot different.
Absolutely brilliant show guys. The frequency discussion in relation to pedals and amps is so fundamental to an electric guitarist whether that is recording, playing live or at home. Great Job!
That was a very interesting show! I’m finally realizing how important the amp is... 🤓 Mick, your playing and the eq stuff was awesome! The OCD sounded killer on Dan’s hands! Thanks! Cheers!
Just reading the title, I expected two things: An EQ pedal and a spectrum analyzer. You did realize you needed a EQ pedal, but I think it would’ve helped a lot to have a spectrum analyzer too. Not only to show us a visual representation to go along with what we’re hearing, but it probably would have helped you dial some things in quicker.
My little story: As someone who really didn't know about amps in a technical way I purchased a Friedman Smallbox 50 and was quite happy with it for a long while. Recently you guys went crazy over the Laney LA30Bl head and i decided that; 2 amps (owning 2 amps) wasn't yet in the realm of the pathological and that the Laney wasn't too expensive (a third of what the Friedman was going for), i took the plunge. The Laney taught me a lot about what i want from an amp. It is so open and expressive and makes the Friedman sound like it has a blanket over it. I don't want to make this a negative post on Friedman, it is voiced exactly how it should be and is an amp par excellence. This is only to suggest that the compression level of an amp is so totally important to its feel and tone. From the Laney i get so much attack and singing tones when playing clean but it does need help to get into classic crunch. I have discovered that a compression pedal is the key to "getting it all" from 1 amp. I cannot and never will be able to get a compressed amp to open up, I can't make the Friedman do anything other than that compressed marshall thing, but with a good compression pedal (i own the Cali76) i can get an "open amp" to do the compressed crunch thing- in effect getting 2 kinds of very different amps in one. At this stage I would advise anyone who wants or is forced to have 1 single amp to look into Open (no master volume) amps and simply buy a good quality compression pedal to go with it. ( i don't think master volume amps with their master volume knobs dimed sound at all as open and expressive as their non-master counterparts) I don't know (dan/mick) if this can be made into a video or discussion topic but this "discovery" totally made me reevaluate everything i thought about amp selection. The question of whether to get master volume/compressed amp OR an open amp (and then throw a good compression pedal in front of it) is a point i don't think many people consider or even know about. Test it out for yourselves boys- try some master volume/compressed marshally thing against non-master open amp (bring back the laney 30) with a compression pedal and OD and see if you can get each to mimic the other. - can you get the master volume/compressed amp to sound like the non master amp(dime the master volume knob) -can you get the non-master amp to sound like the master volume/compressed amp (stick a cali76 and OD box in front of it)
I’m might answer this more fully tomorrow. Mick here. But after a quick pre-sleep skim read, I think I know exactly where you’re coming from. That realisation is real, and it’s deep. And once you’ve had it, it’s very hard to ever go back. Hmmmmm
Thank you for showcasing the Marshall's clean sound (on many episodes, not just this one). My 45+ year old vintage Marshall sounds so sweet clean, and with tons of headroom to spare. To too many guitarists Marshalls are synonymous with a heavy overdriven sound. Great informative video!
Since I´ve been watching That Pedal Show, I love friday so much more than before. Honestly, my favorite channel on RUclips. Thank you, guys. Greetings from Spain!
This is a bit misleading, the biggest difference in the frequency response of these three amps isn't the circuit itself, it's the speakers and the cabinet. Not ignoring the different tone stacks which give a "signature" eq curve, but really, the biggest difference when it comes to chime, low end, vocal quality, girth it's the speakers/cab. Not sure if you mentioned this, but people should understand that trying to cop a dirty Marshall sound through a pair of Jensens or JBLs is simply futile. Same as trying to get extended string chime through a 4x12 Greenback cab.
+dass101 We discuss this in the video... in fact a big part of the whole point of the video is to say that amps are about sooooo much more than EQ and gain. It’s the whole thing.... and that includes the speakers! They’re absolutely instrumental in our perception of those classic amp tones (not that these were especially classic today). Nevertheless, I feel like we can challenge this perception too. I have an idea. (Mick here). :0)
This is why I like multi-effect amp modelers for the fact that they showcase for you in an abbreviated way how different the characteristics between amps are. Like they made it very obvious for me, as an amateur player, that the reason most introductory metal players are never satisfied with tone and end up with mid scoops and too much gain is because most cheap amps have crappy gain response. On my Zoom G3 I can cycle through and tell some amp models just lend themselves to metal and others won't sound good even if I drop a ton of distortion pedals in front of them. Others make great metal sounds with the pedals even though they're clean without. It's not the same as having the real amp, but for a person with a budget of $200 or less, it's a great learning experience.
Hi Mick! I’ve just recently come to this realization since I started watching you guys. Not that you guys have crap guitars or amps, but the knowledge I’ve gained from watching your videos with frequencies, and how certain guitars and pedals react to different amps, etc....it’s helped me in my never ending quest for THAT tone, so thanks guys!! :)
+Johnferickson1973 Nice one John! I was ‘lucky’ enough to realise it early on when I started gigging. My need was to be heard and to sound good. A new guitar wouldn’t do that for me... but amps. Oh dear. That’s where the obsession began! Thanks for watching.
Thank you guys for featuring the Bad Bob Boost during this episode. It is an incredible full range boost that sounds glorious when pushing an amp over the edge. Analogman will even put one into a pedal like the Ibanez SD-9 or OD-9 so you can have dirt and boost in one shell.
"Sorry honey, no Christmas for the family this year. Daddy needs two more amps and a 10 band EQ."
+David Woods hahahah
Please make an episode about Fender amps and their differences, from Bassman to Twin, Deluxe, Neil Young whizzer, etc...
+Andrea Alesi We could do most of that. Neil Young not so much!
That Pedal Show lol, no room for the MagnaTone cab I guess ;)
Andrea Alesi yes, we need this
I'd be into that for sure! Tp hear the difference between 60s Blackface, 70s Silverface and 80s-90s "red knobs" Twins would be awesome. I LOVE my 89' Red Knobs Twin :)
Isn't Neil youngs electric sound just a completely dimed tweed style amp?
My favorite episode so far! That moment at 33:07 hitting the Plexi with the OCD gave me chills!!!
Dan playing through all three of those amps at once will forever go down as one of the greatest moments of this show. Balls to the walls inspirational playing.
Mick, you just get better and better. Never stop.
+David Dyte Ah man, that’s very kind David. Thank you. Hope you’re all good mate. :0)
Very welcome, sir. I'm getting by, practicing hard!
Yessir!
Loved this episode. There's a reason the classics are classics. So many attempts to improve on the OCD and tubescreamer and while they may end up as some worthwhile variations, no improvement is necessary.
Step 1: Cut a hole in a box
Step 2: Put your amp in that box
Step 3: Open the box
It’s an amp in a box!
+John Sargent You for prime minister!
Wow, the Duesy -> OCD -> Plexi combo sounded fantastic. Like, really fantastic.
Here's an idea for an episode: get Rabea or someone else on board and look at classic metal amps. For example, Jcm800, 5150, Dual Rectifier, see how they do pedals and whether they might also be used for other genres such as jazz or blues
+Mannes That would be a lot of views. I love the Dual Rec’s clean and pushed sounds more than the heavy stuff - perfect in jazz or blues, or country! (Mick here)
And get some of the pedals that are supposed to replicate them (evh 5150, wampler triple wreck, etc) and see if they do 🤘🏻🎸
Great idea! would be awesome. I have another: a pickups episode, everything about tone, height, output, all that stuff. It´s would be very helpful for many people.
Ditto that. The pickup idea I mean.
Dean Johnston .....Ditto that Ditto! Atb, Dazza.
Time between every show feels longer and longer in my heart. I'm really grateful to have this channel existing. Thank you guys!
I think you proved your point with the OCD in the 3 amps that a pedal doesn't have a sound. Very cool and extremely imformative video!
That OCD through the Plexi is seriously one of the best tones I've ever heard.
Yay!
Holy shit, that intro was probably the best playing I've ever heard from Mick.
Guys, the bit on frequencies with the EQ pedal is without a doubt one of the most essential bits of information you have ever put into a video. I kind of can't believe you waited so long to do it. Knowing and understanding frequencies is the secret of going from, "Something doesn't sound right here," to "Ready to go".
I'm guessing that the G2 and Quartermasters must be your big sellers Dan, but I think that 3 2 1 of yours is an absolute unsung hero for of the show and a really clever piece of kit.
My favorite aspect of TPS is how excited and joyful you guys get. :D
Great job with the editing on the video. So much work with all of the pedal and amp switching. It sure makes it easier for the viewer to know what is going on with all of the different sounds. Thanks and keep up the good work!
+Bharata Dasa Simon says THANK YOU!
Jeez guys, that bit on frequencies was hands-down the most informative thing you have every talked about/taught. I can't believe you waited so many years to go over this! Understanding frequencies and how they interact is the key to going from, "Hold on something doesn't sound right here," to "Yeah, that's sounding good!" Keep up the good work.
I hate when Dan thinks something is amazing, then I need to buy it...
+tunaXonXtoast hahahaha
So far this has worked on a Cali76, Muffroom Cloud, and CBA Brothers. Dan was right though! To be fair any very nice flexible drive with MIDI control was gonna sell itself to me at that point though, but the other two were definitely a TPS inspired prod. Just bought a new amp though so I'm very much enjoying this is a "principles" episode, rather than a "look at all this cool stuff you could buy" episode. If only I could buy the fingers Landreth! :D
i been playing for years and never had a strat, never wanted one and was always a proud gibson guy. Mick of all people got me to finally take the plunge after such a long time and i ended up, yep you guessed it, getting the exact same configuration he has: sonic blue/ rosewood/ mint pickguard etc. (although mine is a bit cheaper)
I hate you guys for releasing videos in December. I now want more stuff. I think the ONLY video of yours I will watch from here on in are any wish list list you have.
I never buy anything without the Dan approval of “THAT IS AWESOME!!!”
This has got to be one of the best tone and guitar videos on the internet...wow
Guys...that episode is a masterpiece! Really thank you for what you're doing!
This is probably my favorite thing to watch now. You guys are so good at producing this. The edits are perfect and appropriate without being so heavy handed and distracting. Either Dan and Mick are getting more comfortable playing on a video or they're getting better and better at playing, not that they weren't always great players. Between Dan's relevant knowledge of the pedal building and what goes where and what goes better with this and why vs what Mick has picked up from working the industry, where this came from and what that means etc.. I'm about to have a whole closet full of these damn shirts.
The Biffy Clyro bit in the middle of this. Best guitar moment in RUclips history. Simple as. Just.....stunning. Bravo gentlemen, bravo.
I keep coming back to this video just to hear the Biffy riff going into the OCD through all 3 amps, I love it!
Really cool video! Since I've discovered you guys channel, I've been binge watching your shows. I've easily learned more from that pedal show, than I have through my whole guitar journey. Can't thank you guys enough!!
+Jacob Burr Awesome! Glad you’re finding it helpful Jacob. Thank you for watching!
Agreed here. Learned so much in the last year basically due to this show. Cheers!
This show has gotten so much better, I love everything about you guy. At the same time, that Biffy section will always be my favorite moment. It’s like Dan just goes to that space that I feel we all strive to get to. Thank you always for sharing your moments with us!
Thanks for this guys. I own the DLS and run it in Super Bass mode at 18v into a NOS
Tweed Blues Junior, with preamp set between 9-12 o'clock. Not sure how "Marhsally" it is, but it definitely changes the feel of the amp, and fuzzes seem to react better than just straight into the amp. I would love to see the modes of the DLS explored in a future video. Cheers!
Since the first Pedal Show, I have been working to improve my ear. This video was brilliant in helping me distinguish tones and begin to verbalize the differences. Thank you so much!
Chills when you broke out the Many Of Horror riff, Dan.
+Vince Tuckwood ah, cheers V, one of my all time fav bands
So cool. Had to look it up. Prefer Dan’s tone with the 3 amps and OCD tho
Brilliant as always guys. As someone who will likely never be able to afford a truly great amp, I really enjoy listening to yours.
Such a great episode! Dan and Mick: your shows on amps and the pedals that go with them have helped me so much on my guitar journey! Thanks again
Hey Mick and Dan, Thankyou for your kindness, and taking the time, effort and energy to put on this episode. cheers
+tweed guitar our pleasure mr tweed :)
Plexi+OCD= incredible tone! I bought an OCD because of TPS and it’s an amazing asset on my board!
Every time I think this show can't get better it does. The section with the EQ was genius & I'll understand the terminology so much better in future.Thank you.
A lot of fun going on there. Interesting that the guitar that drew out the differences in the amps best was Dan's Telecaster.
Suggestion: If you can lay your hands on them Catalinbreads' 'Foundation Overdrive' series would make for a fascinating follow up to this episode. I own a Formula 5 and a Formula 5e4 - the former does an amazing 'small tweed on the edge of disintegration' sound whilst the latter adds a nice clean-ish Bassman character to your tone. Much as I'd love to own a selection of classic amps I just don't have the space so pedals and a Victory V40 seems the next best alternative to me. As/when/if you get around to it I'd love to hear your take on these pedals.
would love to see an episode on tube differences- whenever I start researching and reading up on them I get lost without actually hearing them. huge fan of the show guys. keep it up!!
Would be interesting to actually see a spectrum analysis of the amps output in a DAW. Thanks for a great episode!
I was thinking the same thing. A spectrum visual would give so many clues to what they were trying to show here.
Agreed here.
+TheSphericalGuy We talked about it.We don’t have one that tells the story well enough. I was trying the get the one in Logic to work, but the differences weren’t massively obvious. Cheers!
I think the stock EQ plug-in with the analyzer engaged should be detailed enough. Perhaps the differences simply aren't that massive visually, but it really only takes a couple of dB's up or down for our ears to pick it up, particularly in the mid range. Have a good weekend lads!
www.premierguitar.com/articles/23003-the-recording-guitarist-is-it-a-sin-to-scoop-your-mids?page=2 Something like that.....
Great show guys. This midrange thing took me years to learn and a lot of MONEY too! To keep a long story short, about ten years back I played in an alt country band with a tele and a fender DRRI. Great overall sound but I couldn't get the warm overdrive- the kind that sounds like it's cozied up to your ears- the way I was hearing it on all my fav records from bands like Wilco, Son Volt, Drive By Truckers etc. I ran through dozens of pedals - no good. Finally I ditched the DRRI and went through a series of "gain" amps- vox, marshal etc. What I found out is that yeah, you can get "that" sound easily with the right amp- and if that's that what you want, just get the amp you want. An AC15 is actually cheaper than a fender DRRI, so just buy one! But, more importantly, I discovered that its really the speaker that matters when you are getting into drive and gain. You "can" get warm drive sound from a fender- IF you put a British flavored speaker in there. It won't be exactly like a Marshal, but it will be very good- and maybe better depending on how versatile you need / how much headroom you need at other times. The thing about this video is that I'm guessing that your super reverb has alnico speakers, which sound a lot more British(esque) - aka less mid scooped, brighter upper mids- than those old gold label eminence speaker that so many fender amps came with ten plus years ago. If you were using my old DRRI with the eminence gold label speakers, there'd be a much more dramatic difference between the fender and the other two amps. Those speakers just sound dark and mid scooped, and- IMHO- just couldn't get a "warm" overdrive sound to save their lives. Now I notice that many stock fenders these days are shipping with Celestions, and I totally understand why.
You're doing god's work here boys. Nicely done!!
+Terry Rogers Aj, thanks Terry :)
Hi Guys. Love your show and I'd like to contribute something. You are correct that Fender developed the Tweed line with ever increasing power as new models. The Brown and Cream years were experimentation in Tremolo and tone circuitry as well as establishing the levels of negative feedback to achieve Clean with high levels of Headroom. This culminated in the Blackface which, as a series, was meant to get a very similar tone at a very wide range of volumes since before Blackface, and especially with Tweeds, a gigging musician needed several amps to get the same tone and dynamic response at a widely ranging size of venues since PAs tended to be vocal only back then.. One of the main design features that accomplished that in Blackface was placing the Volume control AFTER the Tone Stack and eliminating the Direct-Coupled Cathode Follower which was meant to be an impedance matching stage but also introduce a Limiter effect that causes a bandpass "squeeze", sometimes sounding like a very mild wah effect..
These preamp changes did exactly what they were designed to do but have a downside. Because a Tweed, especially the 30 Watt and up models, caused considerable tonal and dynamic response changes with Volume settings, both on the amp and at the guitar, they don't work well to behave the same over a wide spectrum BUT that very characteristic makes them more "vocal" where response and tonality are powerfully affected by volume settings and pick attack, palm dampening, fingering variations etc etc. Marshall copied the 4x10 Bassman at a very opportune time, when PAs got much, much larger and more capable and soon followed by miking everything, and providing multiple separate monitor mixes. The meant a guitar player could use his favorite Tweed or Marshall just about anywhere and let the PA handle FOH while he could enjoy the expressive vocal-like dynamics of the earlier design.
This is what the technical difference is between Blackface and Tweed and all it's derivatives Marshall/Vox/HiWatt ad infinitum that anyone can verify just by plugging in and playing with the Volume/Gain knob. .
The way i would make fender sound more marshally, is by setting dls as close to a CLEAN marshall as possible to create platform, and then add ocd for a gain, it should work well either before or after dls.
The many of horror part is one of the best moments of the show so far. Other personal favs include anything showcasing wet/dry, like that reverse ping pong malarkey :D
I've got an uncle... .:: stares into the distance ::.
How appropriate. I spent the day trying different combinations of mid-pushed & scooped pedals and/or amp settings. Best tone I got was a Tube Screamer (set SRV-style) into a Blues Driver with the tone rolled back and a fairly flat (relatively speaking, ofc) Bassbreaker15. Classic pedals! Gonna try a Jetter Red Shift next week.
I need a whole show about the Fender Stratocaster through the Fender Twin Amp.
Y'all are the absolute best! I always learn more about amps and pedals from watching you both. Plus this episode, helped me out so much with understanding ODs with amps. Thank y'all much!
+Gafar Bello ah, cheers G, you’re so welcome :)
Most frustrating thing: trying to make your amp sound like something else.
+johno doh yep, forget it ;)
Have you heard of AMT pedals from Russia? They make famous amps preamp replicas into pedal format. That into a real amp FX return seem to get great results for lots of people.
I really have to give a big thumbs up to my Egnater Tweaker. I really can get any sound out of it. Been using it for a few years and extremely pleased. From Andy Timmons fender clean with a strat to guns n roses on a Les Paul or Foo fighters ac30. It's so good and can come much much closer than any of those pedals, and is perfect for when you only have room and money for a single amp, but like a diverse range of music and love tone.
+Javier Aldan
I ve seen vids but it kinda ,sorta sounded close. But I never had the chance to try one.
+Rc Dad / Sultans of Wing
yeah I was checking some demos the other day but to tell you the truth I wasnt impressed. Heard some models have loop issues with pedals.
It was great seeing those amps back to back, and actually naming their differences regarding bass, mids and tremble. Also, putting numbers on it, with more or less precision, using the MXR EQ was really helpful. The pedal choices were good as well, since everyone "knows" what a TS does, what the OCD does etc., allowing us to have sort of a baseline for the sound.
That said, the Many of horror moment was killer! My god, it was impossible not to get excited watching the video, I can only imagine being in the room.
PS: Marshall+OCD is -the- sound of rock, amazing
You should do a part 2 to this with a couple of extension cabs to isolate the actual amps by using the same speakers. A lot can be said about the enormous difference speakers can make.
+Steve Macneil We make this point many times. But who carries an extension cab for their Super Reverb or AC30?! The whole point of this is that the sound of an amp is the whole thing, not just the electronics. Cheers!
That Pedal Show very good point!
Most appreciated the way you both admitted you love more your amps than your axes !! Something I’ve always questioned for myself...
When Mick hit the ocd on that biffy riff, I saw Jesus.
I love Friday mornings, get to wake up to a new video... weekly Christmas.
Shoving the stick farther-not further!-up my ass... Technically, all these amps cut mids as compared to no tone stack. The Marshall attentuates mids the least. It's also worth noting that "mids" is centered around 800Hz in the Marshall and Vox and more like 600Hz for the Fender.
Love this
You know, on any streaming media platform, this is the best episodic show around. Another great show, boys.
+Stuart Bowlerwell ah, the way to a musicians heart, is through his fragile ego ;) thanks so much Stu :)
My favorite video of yours so far. I also care wayyyy more about my amps than my guitars haha.
Thank you gentlemen. I am always delighted when you two get into the technical aspects of amps, pedals, and guitars. I loved hearing those amps side by side.
33:40 Clearly the answer to "Fender, Vox, or Marshall?" is "YES!"
+Joe Zabrowski indeed :)
This is just pure brilliant, funny, extremely in depth, you guys are really helping me to understand my guitar sounds and also i am noticing things in a mix i never realised were there. Thank you so much, I’ll continue to watch and spread the word on your videos each time they come out !
Thank you James, very kind of you to say. So glad you’re finding the shows useful! We just try to be a springboard to help everybody ask questions that will get them to where they want to be a little more quickly. It’s a journey, but hopefully we can help make it a fun one! Thanks for watching.
I don't mean to interrupt but where's the second part of the Analogman video? The one where you geek out on the fuzzes? I've been dying to understand the Sunface variations...
+Andres Kütt Hi Andreas. It will be in the next couple of weeks. Haven’t finished the edit yet. Cheers!
Thanks! Looking forward to it!
These guys are both so great! That intro should tell you all you need to know about Micks musicality. so freakin good!
Coming back on the pickup request, some kind of tonal overview of each of the major and semi major types / tone groups, also with things like the history of the Strat selector switch, how Strat single coils differ from Teles, differences between say 50s, 60s & 70s pickup sounds, etc. along with the common mods (humbuckers in Tele neck, LP humbuckers split, out of phase, etc.), would be great & super useful. Especially considering swapping out pickups is something many try as a first or second mod. Thanks.
+Dean Johnston There’s Something here Dean. Certainly in a basic comparison. Trouble is, contrary to a lot of the crap you might read online, the host guitar makes a massive difference, so you’re never comparing apples with apples.
That said, there are definitely some generalities that would be bloomin’ useful and interesting to demo. Not least for me and Dan... thanks as ever for watching!
Hiya! Yeah, I get your drift, a lot of variables in the mix. Still, it could be informative; perhaps along the lines of the current "mid scooped vs pushed' episode, where some assumptions might get reconsidered.
Incidentally, I noted on the recent Anderton's blindfold challenge with Lee Anderton playing Strats, that while he instantly identified the one with a humbucker in the bridge position, he still posed it as a question - "Oh, is that a humbucker?" as opposed to 'Hey, that's a humbucker!' At the time I thought that was interesting. Cheers.
Hi again. While I remember, tell Dan that just down the road from where I live in Japan is a junk yard with a Mazda Roadpacer in it - aka HJ Premier with a rotary motor in it. Depending on his degree of bogan-ness, he may or may not find that fascinating...
13 mins in, & they all sound great. What am I going to buy?! I'll wait till I reach the end, & then buy a t-shirt. Amazing work as always guys!
Guys if you haven't already can you talk about the Brown sound? Thank you for such great videos.
Great video! I know my way around a 3-band EQ but I've always really shied away from graphic EQs somewhat because I just wasn't sure how each band works or matters, so that little snippet's really inspired me to persevere with that and see what I can do for my sounds. Thanks, guys.
A tube screamer into an OCD into a lightly compressing amp is my happy place.
Duessy > OCD > Marshall... that sound was epic!
Also, found it very interesting how much more the Tele seemed to accentuate some of the frequency differences especially when the TS9 was being used.
Is there any way y’all could show what makes other vintage style amps (supro, Gibson, silver tone) so unique compared to the more common amps? Also maybe compare that with reissue stuff? I have a new thunderbolt so I’m curious to see how it differs from Marshall, Fender, and Vox.
yea i always wonder how Dan>Supro would react also. Ive got the rhythm master and love it.
Ampegs too?
There's a great channel called The Guitologist who's an amp tech and he's got a shitload of videos of him playing/working on valcos, harmonys, magnatones, gibsons, you name it.
Cool I’ll check it out!
Yeah I just think it would be interesting to see
That 32 min bit of biffy is one of my fave bits of TPS ever. Amazing.
All I know after this episode is that I want a Plexi.
Me too. And the Fender. But not the Vox. Oh, and I will def buy the OCD and the MXR.
I didn’t think you chaps could transcend the glory that was the Echoplex episode but you’ve done it. My favourite show so far!
Biffy fuckin Clyro!
+xJoooNx Mon the BIFF!!!!!
thanks to Dan, i'm now big fan of Biffy Clyro...can't stop listening..
The song Many of Horror is just... to use a Dan term... Mega! Gets me every time I hear it.
Biffy... the spoiler of every Metal Zone joke! :-)
How could I miss this video for so long? Pure fun to watch! Thank you guys! And thumbs up for the editing! 👌🏻
Dan & Mick, have you thought about getting a sound/guitar tech in, to talk about venue set up issues ? How many of us have been to a gig where the sound was really bad with very unhappy musicians ? And how may gigs have we been to where the sound is amazing and musicians are really enjoying themselves with no issues. I have been to a venue where one band had fantastic sound quality and another band on a different night had awful sound. Is the band using amps/set up etc that are wrong for the venue or is it the techs fault ?
+Richard Huckle yes, we’re going to do this, should be ace! Cheers Richard
That Pedal Show . Oh. Good! Best sound I ever came across was the Japanese metal band Vow Wow, with the British bassist Neil Murray. They were light years ahead of any other band at the time. I can remember seeing computers on stage, which was very unusual for a metal band.
I love hearing dan play the I Feel Fine riff into that vox. That and Mick playing the Brian May stuff gives me a half formed idea for a show- classic or famous tones/combos- mick can do full on SRV with the super and the TS. Beatles or queen or many many others for the vox and plenty of choices for the Marshall + les paul. I suppose this sort of thing pops up in lots of episodes when you guys say there it is, that's the tone, but I feel like there's more that could be fun. Like I said, half formed idea.
Now that we have Mick's Moans we need Dangents or Dan's Tangents.
+Sloe Poke hahaha! Yes!
Found it !!! I've been re-watching a load of TPS vids to find that Biffy Clyro reference. 32:29
I had meant to follow it up the first time when I got distracted by a visitor.
I suddenly found out quite how many TPS episodes I watch in a week ...
I was hoping to learn what frequency character my amp has... instead I learnt that I need to listen to Biffy Clyro 👌
+Benjamin Thorpe ha! It’s a valuable lesson :)
Benjamin Thorpe Run your own tests. You have the amp - describe what you think is it's character. Make a video and tell us if you like or dislike it
Surfey-Liker it was a joke...
Benjamin Thorpe Oops! Sorry :-)
Hands down favorite guitar amp: Fender Super Six. Awesome amp. A friend of mine had one and it was gnarly. He ran it along with an ac30. Sounded bigger than god.
Guys, I'm guessing you disconnected the retina-scorching LEDs on the MXR 10-band EQ to make the pedal easier on the eye?
+ForViewingOnly We We’re confused that they weren’t working. Maybe there’s a switch?!
That Pedal Show were you running the EQ on 9 volts or 18? I accidentally ran mine on 9 instead of 18 and the sliders didn’t light up, but it also sounded a lot different.
Is this another "mic'ing half a JC120" boo-boo! 🤣
What the hell where MXR thinking with those LEDs?
This video was super helpful and made me pick up my guitar for an hour which is the best!
53:22 And your bird can sing
Absolutely brilliant show guys. The frequency discussion in relation to pedals and amps is so fundamental to an electric guitarist whether that is recording, playing live or at home. Great Job!
+Peter Jessop cheers Pete :)
Mind including Hiwatt amp some day? :)
We’re going to buy one. Need to find one. :0)
That was a very interesting show!
I’m finally realizing how important the amp is... 🤓
Mick, your playing and the eq stuff was awesome! The OCD sounded killer on Dan’s hands!
Thanks! Cheers!
I love these education videos! (Even if they meander a bit.. :) Never stop guys!
+ReiCow Meandering Is The Nee Straight Line
+That Pedal Show New. Bludie awto corroct
Wow, auto-correcting new to nee - impressive. Do you spend a lot of time referring to married women's maiden names?
This is definitely the most fundamental and important video you guys have produced to date. Very well played.
+Todd Claybaugh cheers Todd :)
Just reading the title, I expected two things: An EQ pedal and a spectrum analyzer. You did realize you needed a EQ pedal, but I think it would’ve helped a lot to have a spectrum analyzer too. Not only to show us a visual representation to go along with what we’re hearing, but it probably would have helped you dial some things in quicker.
Robert Fisher visual aids can also inspire confirmation bias
My little story:
As someone who really didn't know about amps in a technical way I purchased a Friedman Smallbox 50 and was quite happy with it for a long while. Recently you guys went crazy over the Laney LA30Bl head and i decided that; 2 amps (owning 2 amps) wasn't yet in the realm of the pathological and that the Laney wasn't too expensive (a third of what the Friedman was going for), i took the plunge. The Laney taught me a lot about what i want from an amp. It is so open and expressive and makes the Friedman sound like it has a blanket over it. I don't want to make this a negative post on Friedman, it is voiced exactly how it should be and is an amp par excellence. This is only to suggest that the compression level of an amp is so totally important to its feel and tone. From the Laney i get so much attack and singing tones when playing clean but it does need help to get into classic crunch. I have discovered that a compression pedal is the key to "getting it all" from 1 amp. I cannot and never will be able to get a compressed amp to open up, I can't make the Friedman do anything other than that compressed marshall thing, but with a good compression pedal (i own the Cali76) i can get an "open amp" to do the compressed crunch thing- in effect getting 2 kinds of very different amps in one. At this stage I would advise anyone who wants or is forced to have 1 single amp to look into Open (no master volume) amps and simply buy a good quality compression pedal to go with it. ( i don't think master volume amps with their master volume knobs dimed sound at all as open and expressive as their non-master counterparts)
I don't know (dan/mick) if this can be made into a video or discussion topic but this "discovery" totally made me reevaluate everything i thought about amp selection. The question of whether to get master volume/compressed amp OR an open amp (and then throw a good compression pedal in front of it) is a point i don't think many people consider or even know about.
Test it out for yourselves boys- try some master volume/compressed marshally thing against non-master open amp (bring back the laney 30) with a compression pedal and OD and see if you can get each to mimic the other.
- can you get the master volume/compressed amp to sound like the non master amp(dime the master volume knob)
-can you get the non-master amp to sound like the master volume/compressed amp (stick a cali76 and OD box in front of it)
I’m might answer this more fully tomorrow. Mick here. But after a quick pre-sleep skim read, I think I know exactly where you’re coming from. That realisation is real, and it’s deep. And once you’ve had it, it’s very hard to ever go back. Hmmmmm
It's serious when you're using the guitar to point at things.
Thank you for showcasing the Marshall's clean sound (on many episodes, not just this one). My 45+ year old vintage Marshall sounds so sweet clean, and with tons of headroom to spare. To too many guitarists Marshalls are synonymous with a heavy overdriven sound. Great informative video!
+Wade Adkins we love the clean sound of a plexi :)
This is just to say...
I have eaten
The stealthy plums
That were in the icebox
Poetry, innit.
would they be salty plums?
+Claire Temple Eee. Art in words.
Since I´ve been watching That Pedal Show, I love friday so much more than before. Honestly, my favorite channel on RUclips.
Thank you, guys. Greetings from Spain!
+Antonio Alejandro Hernández Pérez ah, cheers mate
So let me get this right. The tiny little brown things got bigger and bigger?
+terasankka Yeah. And harder to hide down your pants.
I am bit puzzled why guitarist would want that? (ill get me coat)
yes, and after they got bigger, sometimes the began to poke out
Man, it’s the best day of the week when a new episode shows up. And yesterday was Thanksgiving here in the States. Yep, TPS beats Turkey Day.
+Steve Hedrick Happy Thanksgiving Steve! We don’t do it here, so it’s all a bit confusing.
My wife thinks I have a man crush on you guys.
+Andy Reynolds she’s a perceptive lady ;)
Almost injured myself laughing at Dan laughing at "little brown ones" and not even blazed. 🤣
This is a bit misleading, the biggest difference in the frequency response of these three amps isn't the circuit itself, it's the speakers and the cabinet. Not ignoring the different tone stacks which give a "signature" eq curve, but really, the biggest difference when it comes to chime, low end, vocal quality, girth it's the speakers/cab. Not sure if you mentioned this, but people should understand that trying to cop a dirty Marshall sound through a pair of Jensens or JBLs is simply futile. Same as trying to get extended string chime through a 4x12 Greenback cab.
+dass101 We discuss this in the video... in fact a big part of the whole point of the video is to say that amps are about sooooo much more than EQ and gain. It’s the whole thing.... and that includes the speakers! They’re absolutely instrumental in our perception of those classic amp tones (not that these were especially classic today).
Nevertheless, I feel like we can challenge this perception too. I have an idea. (Mick here). :0)
A speaker episode would be great!
But how do we keep it “The Pedal Show”? Speaker pedals! Haha 👍🏻
This is why I like multi-effect amp modelers for the fact that they showcase for you in an abbreviated way how different the characteristics between amps are.
Like they made it very obvious for me, as an amateur player, that the reason most introductory metal players are never satisfied with tone and end up with mid scoops and too much gain is because most cheap amps have crappy gain response.
On my Zoom G3 I can cycle through and tell some amp models just lend themselves to metal and others won't sound good even if I drop a ton of distortion pedals in front of them. Others make great metal sounds with the pedals even though they're clean without. It's not the same as having the real amp, but for a person with a budget of $200 or less, it's a great learning experience.
A crap guitar can sound great through a good amp, an amazing guitar will sound like poop through a crappy amp
+Johnferickson1973 I entirely agree. Mick here!
Hi Mick! I’ve just recently come to this realization since I started watching you guys. Not that you guys have crap guitars or amps, but the knowledge I’ve gained from watching your videos with frequencies, and how certain guitars and pedals react to different amps, etc....it’s helped me in my never ending quest for THAT tone, so thanks guys!! :)
+Johnferickson1973 Nice one John! I was ‘lucky’ enough to realise it early on when I started gigging. My need was to be heard and to sound good. A new guitar wouldn’t do that for me... but amps. Oh dear. That’s where the obsession began! Thanks for watching.
🤘🤓👍
Thank you guys for featuring the Bad Bob Boost during this episode. It is an incredible full range boost that sounds glorious when pushing an amp over the edge. Analogman will even put one into a pedal like the Ibanez SD-9 or OD-9 so you can have dirt and boost in one shell.
+Brian Rodman I have that very OD-9 Brian - it’s been a revelation! (Mick here). :0)