There Will Never Be Another Yadier Molina
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- Опубликовано: 28 мар 2024
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As a Cubs fan for nearly 30years, lemme say this without bias, Yadi is a hall of famer. No f*cking doubt about it.
Respect. -cards fan.
As a pirates fan I 2nd that
As another cubs fan,, I also third that
As a Reds fan there is absolutely no doubt about it Yadi was one of a kind and a definite Hall of famer
Hey I’m a Cards fan. Pulled for the Cubs in 16! I’m not a hater. I miss Yadi.
Yadi is the best defensive catcher in baseball history, if he’s not first ballot, u can toss the entire HOF in the trash
bullshit
@@minrityreprt6302 oh yeah? name a better defensive catcher
@@_e5598 Johnny Bench.
@minrityreprt6302 another first ballot catcher from when teams had less data on base stealing (ran more). Almost like Bench is a perfect argument for why Molina is also a first-ballot pick
@@_e5598 exactly, we don’t need to tear one down to lift the other, both are first ballot worthy
Yadi is 1 of 10 catchers with 2000+ hits. His counting stats arnt great but being 1 of 10 guys is no joke.
I wasn’t sure Molina would make the HOF, but they put Mauer in on first ballot so it looks good for Yadi
Is Posey safe then
Munson should probably get in through the Veteran's Committee one of these years
His counting stats along with his elite tier defensive stats is why he is a 1st ballot HOF catcher.
well if you’re in the league for 20 years, as an MLB player you would think that you could get at least 100 hits a season
@@willerickson9138 if it was that easy wouldnt more than ten guys in the past 100+ years done it?
as a lifelong cubs fan i can say anyone who says yadi isnt a hall of famer doesnt know baseball
As a cub fan I also agree.
I'm not saying the dude was trash but Munson is not in and he was far better in his prime
I'd actually put Posey in there before Molina too (to be fair I think Posey is pretty safe)
The Yadi/Pujols defensive combination was f'ing insane. They almost had a supernatural way of communicating with each other.
@@DanielSong39no. No way. Munson had his career cut short , I watched him play and he was damn good, but better? Get outta here, posey had some of the qualities defensively and offensively he was superior but the Giants suffered when he wasn't available due to injury which was a whole lot and a career cut short .I think posey is a h.o.f. yes but this is the most physically demanding position in baseball and yadi answered the call day after day year after year like few have ever done.this guy had so much effect on every game and every year he played , I sometimes wonder when people make such statements if they actually understand the game or have they played at least little league to understand the position. BTW, I agree that Munson should get strong consideration and not be ause anything offensively but he was the first captain of the Yankees since Lou Gehrig and that's huge considering the players in between that never recieved that honor. You can look at a fanbase like the Cardinals who similarly live eat and breath baseball and Noone including Stan the Man gets more respect and love and quite frankly a little worried not having him on this team for the immediate future. And jeez , the first year in 20 without him? Worst season in 30+ years followed
Coincidence? I think not
As a lifelong Reds fan, I second this. Yadi was an absolute menace, 19 season is unbelievable durability for a catcher. Dude deserves the HoF
As a life long Astros fan. I will simply say Yadi has a baseball for a brain, velcro for a left hand and a cannon for a right arm. I always liked him as a player.
I could watch yadier molina throw out runners all day, every throw is so good.
I was thinking the same thing. that throw to first is dam near poetry in motion.
What made his throw outs different is he didn't rely on the fast ball to do it. He would often throw runners out on breaking balls and balls that hit the dirt. He wasn't relying on the fast ball to throw runners out.
If Ozzie Smith got into the HOF solely for his defense, then guys like Yadi and Andruw Jones absolutely deserve to be in.
To be fair if Ozzie hadn't start to work on his offense after being traded to the Cardinals, even his great defense would not have been enough to get him to the HOF.
Andruw Jones should've retired a few years earlier in regards to his HOF chances, he really fell off at the end, I'm not knocking him he's someone I enjoyed watching it's sad honestly that he might never make it in
Offensively there is no comparison between ozzie and yadi , so your comment was crazy because Andrew jones is in a different stratosphere from both of those guys
@@iamhungey12345 I don't know about that, Ozzie is statistically the best defensive player of all time at any position. I think that alone warrants a HOF induction
@@james4401- So was Mark Belanger for his time and he's not in due to his Mendoza line level hitting. If Ozzie hit like that, he'd never stand a chance for the HOF no matter how good his defense was. Hitting is still the key to position player's chance to get enshrined and keep in mind the guy batted .262 lifetime which was good for middle infielder for his time outside of exceptions like Ripken and Yount and was a threat on the base path as well.
The man was the greatest fielding catcher ever, basically a pitching coach, and a leader/captain of an entire team for years. He was amazing and a privilege to watch.
After this last season, it became hard to deny his greatness. Anchored a poor rotation for most of two decades.
If our rotation continues to blow, at least the silver lining is that his HOF is even more strengthened.
No doubt. The Cards are really feeling the impact he made on the entire organization now.
Yadi is first ballot IMO, and I think he’s going to get it.
100%
If Joe Mauer is a first ballot Hall of Fame "catcher" and Yadier Molina isn't, then the whole thing is a farce.
His pitch framing is indeed elite, but I notice something the Molina brothers do that most of the best framers right now don’t do. They just catch the ball in the spot. They don’t yank or pull back into the zone. No fooling the umps just making them do their job. It’s beautiful to watch honestly.
They catch it in the spot and subtly bring it to the right area. There's movement in their framing but it's extremely smooth to the point it's almost indistinguishable. Yadi was so damn good at stealing a strike from minor, indistinguishable movements in his framing.
Agreed! This method of pitch framing is so cringe worthy.. bro your pitcher dotted the corner don’t then move it 8” to the center of the plate.. let the umpire see he threw a perfect pitch with a subtle frame. When I played baseball I always prided myself on my framing ability, really hate this new technique!
@@chaost4544 It's really hard to describe, but it is beautiful to watch. They don't necessarily catch the ball in the pocket, but with whatever edge of the mitt they need to use to frame the pitch. If you watched Yadi in his latter years, he wasn't able to do it as well and had more PBs. It was a great trick though.
@@jeffreywilliams2584 it's very hard to describe but it's glaringly noticeable when watching other catchers work who don't have soft hands.
I mean, the pitch right at the start at 0:31 he clearly yanks it back, he's just so much smoother and understated about it than most guys today.
I remember when yadi was a rookie, Tony La Russia said in a press conference, I don't care if he gets a single hit all year, he's our #1 catcher
If Yadier doesn't get in first ballot, I'm gonna throw hands. Not only is there decent proof to show he's the best defensive catcher of all time, he might just be the greatest defensive player of all time irregardless of position.
I hope he takes over as manager for the Cardinals and has a 2nd HOF career as a manager.
I think he'll get in but certainly not a hot take to suggest that Buster Posey was a better player
@@DanielSong39 Buster Posey was unquestionably better offensively. The question is how much do you value Yadier Molina defense...
@@VACATETHE48Obviously a lot but is it worth 30 WAR compared to Posey
Posey is not horrid on defense
@@DanielSong39 Correct, but a similar comparison would be comparing George Brett, a fantastic 3B offensively and defensively, to Brooks Robinson who was meh with the bat but the greatest defensive player at this position.
It's a much closer comparison than anyone really gives credit for. I think both are hall of famers, but I only think one is a no doubter (Molina).
@@VACATETHE48Posey is a no doubter
He won an MVP and has 3 World Series rings, fair or not those will get him in
Nothing is 100% though since he can get Kevin Browned, linked to PEDs, gambling, or politics
One minor quibble: the Cardinals' ace in Molina's early years was Chris Carpenter, not Adam Wainwright. Waino didn't debut until a couple years after Yadi and didn't become a regular starter for the Cards until 2007.
Also a fun stat for you: the 0.43 difference in ERA when Yadi was behind the plate adds up to approximately 874 earned runs prevented when you scale up to the number of innings he played. Baseball-Reference seems to equate roughly 10.2 runs to one win above either replacement or average, so that would mean that Yadier Molina earns roughly 86 bWAR from his game-calling, putting him close to 130 for his career. That's Stan the Man territory, top-10 all-time among position players (although if you applied the same math to other catchers, there might be other players ahead of him).
Got to meet Chris Carpenter as a kid! Still one of my favorite pitchers till this day. The story of how Adam got Chris into Christianity will always be an amazing story
This is a really cool analysis, I had never thought to quantify this. It is astounding how much better starting pitchers performed with Yadi behind the dish compared to any other catcher.
Praise be to king Jesus@@luke.benfield
Shocked that the number nerds don’t already factor that in their WAR calculations. Makes me take Fangraphs and Baseball reference a lot less seriously
@@bramstedt8997 There seems to be a general consensus among us "number nerds"-irrationally so, might I add-that catcher ERA is basically meaningless. And I think that's extremely silly because, for the most part, the catcher determines what pitches are thrown. What's unfortunate is, without expert Retrosheet knowledge, actually doing a full historical analysis on that is basically impossible.
For what it's worth, Fangraphs does have Yadi rated as the most valuable defender in MLB history, and they do add catcher framing to his value for an additional ~13 WAR over Baseball-Reference if I recall correctly.
STL Cardinals resident and fan for 60+ years. IMO absolutely, no doubt the best catcher the team has ever had, the best in baseball during his time with the Cardinals and I believe a future hall of famer. No doubt in my mind! He was just exceptional!
he was one of a kind . Hell of a catcher . Goat if i had to venture a guess . Thanks for sharing!
Sorry Pudge is goat, Yadi is probably 4th or 5th. Bench, Piazza, Carter, and Fisk all have cases for being better. I personally have him at 4th.
@@nobeardthepirate9172fifth is actually insane
@@jackkrysl175 in the sense of it being low or high?
If you're talking strictly defense and game calling I'd say he's in the Top 5
@@nobeardthepirate9172 I think he’s top 3
It speaks numbers how when he was there the pitching staff was okay, and when he left the same pitching staff became one of the worst in recent history
Definitely not a coincidence....
Yadi is probably the catcher I would put in off an intangible more than anyone else. The fact people were so afraid to steal on him speaks volumes, and though it's not quantifiable how many runs this prevented, it probably was more than his WAR would make you think.
People are giving him credit for another 15-20 "invisible" WAR for his game calling and scouting
Discouraging base stealing is counted in the dWAR stats
His ability to hold runners from 1st to 3rd and 2nd to home saved TON of runs for the Cardinals pitching staff in his 19 year career as a Cardinal. He not only discouraged steals but discouraged runners doing anything on the base path in any offensive scenario.
Obvious first ballot guy. People must not realize just how much better he made every pitcher that pitched to him
If you watched nearly every game played by Molina like me, you would have seen all of the things that Yadi did that can't be measured. I noticed early in his career that he hit in big moments. I was at a Nats-Cards game in DC and started a "Yadi" chant behind their dugout while he was batting. He hit a grand slam.
Lifelong Heartland rugby fan here. Yadi really knew how to play this game.
Depending on your age, the best defensive catcher of all time is either Bench, Pudge or Yadi. Whoever was playing when you were 12 is the one you'll think is best.
Came here to defend Pudge….and yeah, I’ll own the fact that this is part of why. 😂
I was 12 when Bench was great but still have to give it to Yadi because I live a hour away from St. Louis and am a huge Cardinal fan.
Not a Cards fan but a YMolina fan. Playing baseball's most demanding position, career .300 ba in the playoffs, 2168 hits, 354 caught stealing, career 40.3% caught stealing, top 3 defensive catcher of all-time, etc. He will be a 1st ballot HOFer in 2027.
“Thou shalt not steal”.💪
I wish everyone could feel how he got Puerto Rico feeling on that 2017 WBC. Our island was pumped up, everyone dying their hair blonde it was a sight to behold. He’s truly a one of a kind player that I grew up watching. I may be biased but yes best catcher in MLB 🇵🇷🇵🇷🇵🇷
If Yadi doesn’t get in it will be a sad day. Im not saying he is unanimous first ballot or anything but doing what he did defensively for as long as he did is nuts. I think that’s why you won’t see another Yadi (at least for a while).
Offense is king and lots of good/great hitting catchers get moved to less physically demanding positions or spend lots of time at DH these days.
Yadi was the total defensive package and did well enough on offense. Someone like Salvy who doesn’t have great framing stats did have a great arm for example. Posey while good defensively was known for his bat for sure. Yadi could call/block/frame/throw. A lot of modern catchers can’t say that
every line ends with a lift in your voice and i can’t unhear it.
All this and a genuinely great heart. His charitable foundation helped many people, particularly children, in his time. He was respected throughout baseball. Hall of Fame? Does the sun rise each morning?
the catch and throw at :45 is something that should be on display at Cooperstown my god is that poetry in motion I could watch that all day long
As a Cubs fan Our most hated rival was the dead birds, but this guy I have nothing but respect for
16:55 should be the stat that stands out more than anything. 513 fewer attempts to steal, with Yadi behind the plate is insane. I'd say if someone went back and counted all the extra runs he saved by throwing out runners( I.E. threw out the runner, followed by an XBH or homerun), it would be an absurdly high number over his career. He's certainly the most valuable catcher of his era. No question. 1st ballot, hands down.
TOP 3 defensive catcher all time as a cards fan he was always clutch when we needed a rally and dude called the game since like '08 pitching and head coach didn't tell Yadi what the pitcher should throw Yadi knew what the pitcher should throw he also was making defensive adjustments from behind the plate telling people to shift and telling the 1st and 3rd base when a breaking ball was coming to expect the ball coming their way. Dude ran the pitching and defense he was the coach
So many great catchers played in the late 2000's - early 2010's, incredible that Yadi still stands out
Molina was the first baseball name I learned besides as a kid living in western NY you’d hear a rod and jeter
GOAT catcher and game manager
Great wall of Yadi. Dude was a beast behind the plate. Much respect
Yadier Molina was my favorite player before he retired. I grew up watching him, Pujols, and Wainwright play and have always had Yadi and my number 1. Now that all three are gone, the leaders of the clubhouse are Goldy and Nado, who are great but Yadi did somethin magical to everyone.
I think it is absolutely amazing that he is now a coach in our system to help once young catchers and now a washed catcher that can’t hit for his life
Definitely a hall of Famer (along with Waino and Pujols) maybe not 1st ballot because of his poor offensive stats but those numbers don’t show all that he gave to those pivotal mid 2000s and early 2010s teams
#yadi4hof
His offensive numbers arent even that poor. And his defensive numbers are legit top 5 all time for all positions, not just catchers
Bro literally said yadi isn’t 1st ballot. Are you restarted
I'm from southwest Ohio and back in the 1970's my team had this guy named Bench. He was a pretty good catcher, too.
The Reds almost drafted Molina... In fact it was Johnny Bench who pushed for him. Could you imagine a world where Cincinnati saw Yadi as a hero instead of a villain!?
Yadi is definitely a hall of famer, but Ivan Rodriguez is the greatest defensive catcher of all time
I respectfully disagree.
One of the few catchers I was excited to watch.
Dodgers fan here… and I’m always going to praise Yadier Molina. This guy was a beast behind the plate. One of my favorite nine Dodger players. Reasons why I love catching.
As a Cards fan I’m probably very biased anyway but any time I bring up Jorge Posada’s HOF argument with his .470 slugging and +42.7 offensive WAR, many Yankee fans I’ve spoken with claim Jorge is a borderliner because of weak defense and the -49 DRS. So then I put that next to Yadi, with a SLG just barely under .400 but also has a +42 WAR on top of being one of the few 2000-hit catchers, the 1000 RBIs *and* the 9 GGs, 4 Platinum Gloves, postseason success, the +170 DRS and the battery record with Waino, that’s a pretty damned stacked HOF resume if I say so myself
Yankees fans judge Posada fairly when they admit he is not Hall of Fame material
Posada beats Molina by the way in WAR/JAWS metrics
Obviously Molina is getting an invisible 15-20 WAR credit for his game calling and scouting which doesn't show up in his advanced stats
Even given that I think it's fair to suggest that Thurman Munson was better than either of them
Wainwright didn't do a darn thing for the 04-05 cards
I've been a lifelong Cardinals fan. I absolutely fell in love with Yadi and Waino during that 2006 Championship run. Yadi didn't amass mega counting numbers, but as far as clutch hitting goes but more often then not he'd come through. I really enjoyed your video. This and Foolish's video help inform people better as to his defensive prowess.
he was fundamental for his defense, but had pivotal offensive moments in both world series campaigns of 2006 and 2011.
his hr at the 2006 nlcs game 7 was shown, but he had a bases loaded walk in the game 6 of the 2011 world series that kept the Cardinals in the game too. His plate control was much improved in his career as well.
Yadi needs a statue done in front of the stadium.
Those thinking Yadi is overrated, look at the team fall-off in 2023 after he retired in 2022.
He was the Ozzie Smith of catchers.
I will always remember the fact that in Molina's last year he and Pujols were a 0 speed in MLB the show. If they were rated any lower they'd be moving backwards
Fair rating lol he’s a hall of famer for sure
He's the GOAT. Batting was above average for a catcher but what he did behind the they don't have words for.
He was a God in St Louis. I miss him already, and we have a great catcher now
Its not even that he was BAD offensively he was average and at times a bit above, but everything else about his game was ELITE! Meanwhile Jeter is in the hall of fame because of his elite bat IN SPITE OF being a defensive liability. I do not understand by any metric why Yadi should not be a first ballet hall of famer
Molina's WAR is 42.2 which is below Posada
Yes he's light years better than Posada on defense
But Posada is 25 WAR better at hitting which is not a small amount
I'm not saying Posada is better but he wasn't THAT much worse overall
Yadi’s NLCS and WS offensive stats (given it was a pretty decent sample size) should completely negate his “bad” regular season offense. Plus he won a silver slugger. Yeah you’d be indifferent if he’s up to hit in a 5-0 game in July, but even in his last season you better believe everyone was on the edge of their seats when he came up to hit in the playoffs
He definitely was the greatest. And that's hard for me to say as a cubs fan
One of my fave moments was when yadi threw out profar at 1st 😂 im going to the giants vs padres game today, outfield bleachers and im for sure going to remind profar about that 😂
Hall of famer. Hell yes
He’s my favorite
Yadi was the best catcher of his generation. Maybe one of best of all time. Everyone talks about Posey. He was a great player too. He spent half his time playing firstbase though. Molina played catcher his entire career and averaged about 120 games per season for a long time. Played through alot of injuries and was reason St Louis were one of best teams in baseball for many years
That would be Johnny Bench
1st Ballot. Best Catcher Ever. Changed the game by dominating it defensively in the second most important defensive position behind pitcher.
Awesome breakdown.
One of the most skilled catchers yes, maybe top 5 defensive. But never say never.
Hands down best catcher of his generation and top 5 in the games history. If he’s not a hall of fame player than who is?
@10:19 the curse of sports illustrated cover got him. Look it up almost every baseball player on the cover of sports illustrated has been injured immediately after and almost out for the season Or the full season
Arguably the best defensive catcher of all time. Easy HOF. If Piazza is in the HOF then Molina can already pick his Plaque.
When he threw out guys trying to steal a base, he didn’t just get the ball to the baseman, he placed it in the glove with near precision. Like a lot of you commenting, I could watch it all day long.
I'm gonna miss his presence and glue guy aura behind the plate in St. Louis
At least he’s working in the office now
-10x All-Star.
-9x Gold Glove winner.
-2x World Series champ.
-Beloved by both teammates and opponents (except when they were trying to steal a base).
-Was a part of 16 playoff teams in his 19 seasons.
-Defensively elite catcher
-Shit, the fact that he played catcher at the big league level for 19 years (half of those seasons before the home plate collision was banned).
I don’t see how you keep him out of Cooperstown.
A lot of people downplay his bat, but he was quite a hitter in his prime and for most of his career, up until his last game, he was never an easy out and seemed to save his hits for when it mattered most
There are a lot of defensive stats that show Molina being one of the best defensive players of all time but the amount of players who didn't go 1st to 3rd and 1st to home plate because of his defense is eye opening. In recent years there's been an effort to quantify that aspect of the catcher position and Molina is probably the best catcher all time at that aspect of the game or at least on a very short list.
greatest defensive player ever.
The Molina brothers are the only set of 3 brothers each with a World Series title under their belt.
Greatest of All Time.
I was lucky enough to watch Yadi’s entire career, and while his defensive skills were as good as any catcher I’ve ever seen (including Thurman Munson, Manny Sanguillén, Johnny Bench, Pudge Rodriguez and several others), what made Yadi the best ever was his incredible ability to handle pitchers and call games. Best ever!
Hard pressed to find a slower base runner? Try his brother Benji lol. My family loved that freight train when he played for the giants.
I’m sure there’s a stat for this out there, but watching him bat, he always seemed to do better when someone was on base in front of him. While not carrying the greatest hitting numbers, he came in clutch so often, I’d often be grateful he was the one at the plate if we had runners on base.
Its called risp avg(runners in scoring position average) it wouldnt count when he got a hit with someone on only first tho
Pudge Rodriguez was damn solid too
Great video and awesome content. Very friendly suggestion would be to watch the uptalking. Every sentence sounds like a question.
Yady and Wainy one of the greatest duo of all time
He's a Hall of Famer!
The massive gap in stolen base attempts really shows how dominant he was at throwing people out. Nearly 30% less than the next closest team (around 40-50% less than MLB average). That’s not a fluke over a 16 year period. That’s people being “scared” to even try to steal. His percentage was so good, it hurt the quantity in his stats.
I can’t think of another defensive aspect in sports of an individual being so good that other teams drastically reduce attempting it. It’s really something that’s unquantifiable so it doesn’t show up in stats.
Yadi is the goat and I wont hear otherwise
Wainwright wasn’t in the big leagues until 2006
Hall of Famer hands down
Cumitalive stats? Man caught for almost 20 years in the bigs and got over 2,000 hits. He is a hall of famer, there is no debate
Yes, Yadi is an absolute Hall of Famer. Maybe not first ballot, but absolutely deserving.
Are you restarted. How could you say he’s not 1st ballot
If you were lucky enough to get a stolen base when Yadi was behind the plate, it was off the pitcher or runners on 1st and 3rd situations. He singlehandedly brought back the 1st and 3rd base runner pick off. 1st ballot HOF
Yadi is obviously a HOF Catcher, period.
The ONLY thing to say about Molina is "Yadi IS the man!" First ballot no doubt.
"What if I told you Yadier Molina had that DOG in him?"
Wainwright didn't do a damn thing for the 04-05 cards
🐐
If you mean future Hall of famer you must mean tomorrow I'm from St Louis and I watch the greatness myself
There will never, I repeat, never be another Yadi. I am biased as a long time Cardinals fan, but his importance to the organization cannot be understated.
Hall of famer without a doubt. Look at the cardinals without him
Possible hall of fame?!?!?!
He’s 1st ballot! Easy!
Oops, looks like you put Yadi in a video about the "best defensive catcher". I think you meant to put Buster Posey there.
I'd like to see a bit of a revision in Cooperstown. Separate votes for offensive contributions and defensive contributions to increase the chances of getting deserving players in there. Of course the holy grail woild to have both offensive and defensive contributions next to your plaque, but it would still be a great honor to see more players be officially deserving with those different designations.
Make way for Bob Boone, Andruw Jones, Andrelton Simmons, and Mark Belanger
Correction at 8:40. Cardinals did not fall to the Red Sox in 2013. The Cardinals fell to *David Ortiz,* who at the time was possessed by the baseball gods themselves. The Red Sox were just kinda there.
Wait. You have that backwards. If those three catchers played fewer games, their OWAR was less at risk. Yadi was so dominant behind the plate and as a field manager that he tacked on extra years with lower offensive output. You can't laud 2000+ of the beat defensive games caught, then punish the player for lower batting stats in his twilight years. Those catchers were gone because they hit the wall.
There will never be another albert pujols
YaDI!!
He's not Johnny Bench, but hes definitely HOF.
Ozzie got in because of his glove, why not Yadi? Molina should have been MYP in 2013...
Why not Andruw Jones
Why not Andrelton Simmons
Why not Mark Belanger
These are truly legendary fielders
@@DanielSong39 not sure what you're arguing. Andruw Jones should be in the HOF and Andrelton Simmons isn't even eligible. Mark Belanger should be debated and contextualized in his own era and maybe a borderline case for the HOF.
Them being great player's is inconsequential to the issue here. You're projecting insecurity for some silly reason and making silly arguments that nobody sane agrees with.