Mage Hand Legerdemain is absolutely the best feature of the subclass - it has so many uses, from pickpocketing contact poison onto your enemy's weapon hilt before combat starts, to stealing the macguffin during a fight, to simply playing chess against yourself, and the bonus action usage means you're guaranteed to be able to still attack in combat.
You don't really need extra damage with rogue, getting more utility is much more important. But that said, you get extra damage from spells, Booming Blade alone is quite a lot of free extra damage every round, and you can also get Shadow Blade that not only increases your damage significantly, but also turns it to psyhcic damage which is very rarely resisted damage type. You can also pick up all kinds of other nice utility spells like disguise self, mirror image, invisibility, misty step, etc.
Great combo indeed. Just remember you can’t make your second attack as two weapon fighting bonus action since you’re using Cast a Spell instead of the Attack action :) thanks for watching!
It can even be fun with booming blade, if you use cunning action to dash and let a melee ennemy you hit during your turn alone he will be tempt to chase after you especialy with a low intelligence, and it will trigger the second effect of booming blade
@@URGE yes you can, shadow blade creates a weapon, you attack with the weapon, using dexterity, it has the light property for the sole purpose of you being able to dual wield it with other light weapons, you don't attack with the spell, the spell gives you a weapon, as long as the spell lasts, you have this weapon, the fact it is a weapon is the sole reason you can booming/green flame blade it, the thing is, you use your bonus action to cast the spell, you can't dual wield attack with it the turn it is summoned, but you shouldn't be using your bonus action to attack as a rogue either way, you have more important options than doing 1d6/1d8+dex extra damage.
@@dragonhearthx8369 You get three 1st level spells at 3rd level, and one can be of any class. Find Familiar can be had at 3rd level, but since ATs don't get ritual casting, they have to blow a spell slot every time their familiar "dies" and needs to be brought back.
I agree that utility is far more important for a class like this. Blur, mirror image, shit like that which will boost your already impressive base class are also going to add a lot of flavour to your character.
I played an AT through Lost Mines of Phandelver and had a BLAST. Playing as a spy who snooped on magic users and took out the ones going evil, I mostly looked for utility spells. Took Message and Minor Illusion for cantrips (Message for communicating with the party when I was sneaking ahead, Minor Illusion for all kinds of trickery), and utility spells. I loved her so much I made an AT/dex-based-paladin rogue based on her an NPC in my current campaign.
Being able to make the Mage Hand spell invisible again like in 3E/3.5E is my favorite feature of the class considering how stupid the giant spectral hand is IMHO.
One thing I add to this subclass is that the skill checks made with the mage hand are always done with expertise. This frees up the arcane tricksters a bit for picking up different expertises like arcana or investigation.
I’m currently playing a dual wielding variant human arcane trickster with the mobile feat. Booming blade is huge, run up hit something that’ll be moving on their turn then attack something already next to another player with the off hand for the sneak attack then get back out of range. That’s a cantrip for combat so everything else is RP or utility spells.
I am running a halfling Trickster/pact of the chain warlock, disguise self at will and an invisible imp as a familiar, infiltration and scouting dream come true. (then retreat into the ring and the imp flies you out.)
Read Swords and Deviltry by Firtz Leiber, and learn about the cool arcane trickster rogue the Gray Mouser. He travels with a Bard-barian named Fafferd. The right spells make the arcane trickster more powerful than the others by using spells to gain advantage through imposed conditions.
So, I changed how the arcane trickster, and eldritch knights cast spells switching to a spell point system. They get a number of spells points equal to half their level rounded down, but are limited on the level of the spell. This means they can cast way more lower level spells, but can’t cast anything higher than 4th level.
Access to Minor Illusion for on demand hiding spots. Fog Cloud at 1 is Great for party concealment. Invis, for a Rogue? I like a 1 lv dip in Wiz to give me the extra cantrips, Rituals, and a Swiss army knife of spells not restricted primarily to Illusion and Enchantment. With the right feats, you'll rarely not be hidden in combat, and will always attack from advantage, on top of some great CC (especially at 9) and Oh Snap spells. Your party will Love Rope Trick and Tiny Hut.
Grant Parker every DM is different, but I would go by what Mike Mearls said which is if the caster is already hidden, they would perform an additional stealth check vs the targets passive perception score. Here’s the original tweet thread twitter.com/mikemearls/status/767866016822992896 thanks for watching!
It saddens me that the classes i prefer to play are always under valued...the silver lining however is that i dont have to argue with someone else who wants to use the class. xD
I really don't get why people have a problem with Arcane Trickster, especially after the Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide. Booming / Greenfire Blade is enough of a damage boost on its own to be great and there is no denying the utility of the ATs casting. Rogues already have solid martial abilities from the base class.
You guys never had an arc. Trickster in your pt ! Is the best rogue class! Familiar make advantage in all attacks! The spells you are to help, not battle and make the trickster a great support and can survive to almost anything. Rogue ia already a great class, with some spells, just make perfect
Familiar is great, but can die very easily in combat. Some spells can be great depending on circumstances for sure. Something like Swashbuckler rogue gets sneak attack basically 100% of the time due to the subclass features and you don’t have to rely on a familiar or spells. It is definitely an interesting and unique choice with lots of potential shenanigans! Thanks for watching!
@@URGE just make it an owl and have it fly outside of your enemies attack range, ranged attacks maybe but would they really focus on a familiar when there’s a far greater threat right in front of them?
Jussef haha we just wanted to roll out some dice for style points instead of an empty table. Don’t worry, I organize each by type when I’m DMing, but I can’t say the same for Alex ;) thanks for watching!
I don't think you can Spell Thief a Counterspell. Counterspell doesn't target the caster, it targets the spell being cast. The other caster doesn't get a save or ability check, it's all on the caster of the Counterspell. You can absolutely use it to counter a Finger of Death, you just can't cast Finger of Death yourself, in the same vein, you can counter a cantrip, but don't get to learn it, but that caster can no longer use that cantrip for 8 hrs. The example of stopping an enemy from flying away is way out. The spell has to target the AT, or include it in the area of effect. I don't think either of these guys really thought through this ability before making this video. I seems almost more like a reaction video than a well thought out review.
The wording for counterspell says “You attempt to interrupt a creature in the process of casting a spell.” You are targeting a creature to interrupt. Up to DM discretion, but seems fair game as written (at least in our opinion). Note this was one of our early videos and we are a lot more practiced now (and better quality equipment), so keep that in mind as well. Thanks for watching!
Generally yes, but some of those don't have that restriction At 3rd level, 1 of your known spells can be of any school and every time you level up you can change that one for any wizard spell. At certain levels you get more of those
You need to re-imagine better ways to use that ledger domain, with proper use I don't even see you needing to take find familiar; at that why burn your one non Ench/Illus slot at level 3 on a ritual conjur that you already have as an invisible cantrip.
I don't really have intelligence on my Arcane Trickster. The cantrips, and spells I have don't require me to roll or have intelligence checks of any kind. They supplement my rogue skills.
Arcane Trickster casting spell thief: "No, you cannot do that"
Spellcaster: "Do what?"
Arcane Trickster: "Exactly"
"No power of Voodoo for you!"
I don't think you need that many spell slots. I mean, the rogue is pretty great in general and the magic just complements its features
Mage Hand Legerdemain is absolutely the best feature of the subclass - it has so many uses, from pickpocketing contact poison onto your enemy's weapon hilt before combat starts, to stealing the macguffin during a fight, to simply playing chess against yourself, and the bonus action usage means you're guaranteed to be able to still attack in combat.
I've used it very well in combat to spread ball bearings and cover a party's retreat from a goblin castle.
Cantrip Minor Illusion. Cast minor illusion of some boxes or rock, attack then Hide.
Also, Find Familiar. amazing resource.
You don't really need extra damage with rogue, getting more utility is much more important. But that said, you get extra damage from spells, Booming Blade alone is quite a lot of free extra damage every round, and you can also get Shadow Blade that not only increases your damage significantly, but also turns it to psyhcic damage which is very rarely resisted damage type. You can also pick up all kinds of other nice utility spells like disguise self, mirror image, invisibility, misty step, etc.
You can also throw the psychic blade, and have it reappear in your hand giving you an extra ranged option.
Don’t forget about summoning a familiar for sneak attacking. Personally, I have my familiar dropping blinding powder on enemies in combat.
They are really strong with shadow blade + booming blade/green flame blade + sneak attack. That's the biggest damage you can get with a blade
Great combo indeed. Just remember you can’t make your second attack as two weapon fighting bonus action since you’re using Cast a Spell instead of the Attack action :) thanks for watching!
You already use your bonus action to cast shadow blade on first turn, and rogue has over way to use it the turn after
It can even be fun with booming blade, if you use cunning action to dash and let a melee ennemy you hit during your turn alone he will be tempt to chase after you especialy with a low intelligence, and it will trigger the second effect of booming blade
I suggest you take the mobile feat so you don't need to spend your bonus action disengaging
@@URGE yes you can, shadow blade creates a weapon, you attack with the weapon, using dexterity, it has the light property for the sole purpose of you being able to dual wield it with other light weapons, you don't attack with the spell, the spell gives you a weapon, as long as the spell lasts, you have this weapon, the fact it is a weapon is the sole reason you can booming/green flame blade it, the thing is, you use your bonus action to cast the spell, you can't dual wield attack with it the turn it is summoned, but you shouldn't be using your bonus action to attack as a rogue either way, you have more important options than doing 1d6/1d8+dex extra damage.
Spell thief can CANCEL high level spells (like finger of death). You can't steal them, but you can negate them.
Best use of 1st lv spell slot find familiar
i did this!
To bad you don't get that until level 8. It's a conjuration spell.
@@dragonhearthx8369 you can get on lvl 3 man. Is the best lvl1 spell
@@dragonhearthx8369 You get three 1st level spells at 3rd level, and one can be of any class. Find Familiar can be had at 3rd level, but since ATs don't get ritual casting, they have to blow a spell slot every time their familiar "dies" and needs to be brought back.
This is a really interesting subclass. Spell thief sounds like it could be very useful
I agree that utility is far more important for a class like this. Blur, mirror image, shit like that which will boost your already impressive base class are also going to add a lot of flavour to your character.
I played an AT through Lost Mines of Phandelver and had a BLAST. Playing as a spy who snooped on magic users and took out the ones going evil, I mostly looked for utility spells. Took Message and Minor Illusion for cantrips (Message for communicating with the party when I was sneaking ahead, Minor Illusion for all kinds of trickery), and utility spells. I loved her so much I made an AT/dex-based-paladin rogue based on her an NPC in my current campaign.
My favorite character was a forest gnome arcane trickster. 20 int, 20 dex, and I played him as basically a spy
Being able to make the Mage Hand spell invisible again like in 3E/3.5E is my favorite feature of the class considering how stupid the giant spectral hand is IMHO.
One thing I add to this subclass is that the skill checks made with the mage hand are always done with expertise. This frees up the arcane tricksters a bit for picking up different expertises like arcana or investigation.
I’m currently playing a dual wielding variant human arcane trickster with the mobile feat. Booming blade is huge, run up hit something that’ll be moving on their turn then attack something already next to another player with the off hand for the sneak attack then get back out of range. That’s a cantrip for combat so everything else is RP or utility spells.
cant wait til you reach Grave Domain Cleric :D nice video
I am running a halfling Trickster/pact of the chain warlock, disguise self at will and an invisible imp as a familiar, infiltration and scouting dream come true. (then retreat into the ring and the imp flies you out.)
Read Swords and Deviltry by Firtz Leiber, and learn about the cool arcane trickster rogue the Gray Mouser. He travels with a Bard-barian named Fafferd. The right spells make the arcane trickster more powerful than the others by using spells to gain advantage through imposed conditions.
So, I changed how the arcane trickster, and eldritch knights cast spells switching to a spell point system. They get a number of spells points equal to half their level rounded down, but are limited on the level of the spell. This means they can cast way more lower level spells, but can’t cast anything higher than 4th level.
Well rogues are primarily melee fighters, and it is called arcane trickster. So I think the spell slots were intended to be utility
Access to Minor Illusion for on demand hiding spots. Fog Cloud at 1 is Great for party concealment. Invis, for a Rogue? I like a 1 lv dip in Wiz to give me the extra cantrips, Rituals, and a Swiss army knife of spells not restricted primarily to Illusion and Enchantment. With the right feats, you'll rarely not be hidden in combat, and will always attack from advantage, on top of some great CC (especially at 9) and Oh Snap spells. Your party will Love Rope Trick and Tiny Hut.
Question: How would you rule casting fireball while sneaking considering the verbal component of the spell?
Grant Parker every DM is different, but I would go by what Mike Mearls said which is if the caster is already hidden, they would perform an additional stealth check vs the targets passive perception score. Here’s the original tweet thread twitter.com/mikemearls/status/767866016822992896 thanks for watching!
Question if you steal a spell which is concentration who concentrates on the spell or does anybody?
You didn’t quite mention that INT stat is not that important. Many useful spells do not depend on INT.
That moment your arcane trickster gets hold person off on your bbeg 😂 sneak attack crits for days 😂
Really? Isn't checking for traps investigation? Who do you have finding the traps if the rogue doesn't have int.? Is it officially perception?
It saddens me that the classes i prefer to play are always under valued...the silver lining however is that i dont have to argue with someone else who wants to use the class. xD
I really don't get why people have a problem with Arcane Trickster, especially after the Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide. Booming / Greenfire Blade is enough of a damage boost on its own to be great and there is no denying the utility of the ATs casting. Rogues already have solid martial abilities from the base class.
Hmmm the one on the right is rather handsome, I wonder how old he is?
You guys never had an arc. Trickster in your pt ! Is the best rogue class! Familiar make advantage in all attacks! The spells you are to help, not battle and make the trickster a great support and can survive to almost anything. Rogue ia already a great class, with some spells, just make perfect
Familiar is great, but can die very easily in combat. Some spells can be great depending on circumstances for sure. Something like Swashbuckler rogue gets sneak attack basically 100% of the time due to the subclass features and you don’t have to rely on a familiar or spells. It is definitely an interesting and unique choice with lots of potential shenanigans! Thanks for watching!
@@URGE just make it an owl and have it fly outside of your enemies attack range, ranged attacks maybe but would they really focus on a familiar when there’s a far greater threat right in front of them?
That table is a mess! please group the dice by size or color or something.... Oh and put the higher number up!
Jussef haha we just wanted to roll out some dice for style points instead of an empty table. Don’t worry, I organize each by type when I’m DMing, but I can’t say the same for Alex ;) thanks for watching!
I don't think you can Spell Thief a Counterspell. Counterspell doesn't target the caster, it targets the spell being cast. The other caster doesn't get a save or ability check, it's all on the caster of the Counterspell.
You can absolutely use it to counter a Finger of Death, you just can't cast Finger of Death yourself, in the same vein, you can counter a cantrip, but don't get to learn it, but that caster can no longer use that cantrip for 8 hrs.
The example of stopping an enemy from flying away is way out. The spell has to target the AT, or include it in the area of effect.
I don't think either of these guys really thought through this ability before making this video. I seems almost more like a reaction video than a well thought out review.
The wording for counterspell says “You attempt to interrupt a creature in the process of casting a spell.” You are targeting a creature to interrupt. Up to DM discretion, but seems fair game as written (at least in our opinion). Note this was one of our early videos and we are a lot more practiced now (and better quality equipment), so keep that in mind as well. Thanks for watching!
@@URGE maybe it’s time for an update?
I thought arcane trickster could only take from two spell schools? So some of those examples may not work
They can chose from every school at certain level. That give you 3 spells that can be what you want
Generally yes, but some of those don't have that restriction
At 3rd level, 1 of your known spells can be of any school and every time you level up you can change that one for any wizard spell. At certain levels you get more of those
Wrong. Read PHB. -
You need to re-imagine better ways to use that ledger domain, with proper use I don't even see you needing to take find familiar; at that why burn your one non Ench/Illus slot at level 3 on a ritual conjur that you already have as an invisible cantrip.
Honestly I feel like eldritch knights, and arcane tricksters should be half casters rather than 1/3 casters as it would make them a lot more powerful.
They are alredy martial classes, making them half casters would make them completely broken
@@artifextalas1499 The paladin would like to know your location.
I don't really have intelligence on my Arcane Trickster. The cantrips, and spells I have don't require me to roll or have intelligence checks of any kind. They supplement my rogue skills.