I’d love if you did a series about stuff like this dude. Like what defines a „waifu” archetype, a vid about characters that break the rules and have a one of a kind playstyle (like yoshi, king), I don’t know how many more archetypes specific to tekken are there… like stance characters maybe? But I think this would be a cool series Also it would be cool to showcase how characters that are present all the way since T1 are looking in T8. Like evolution of each character, and what defined them over the years - an interesting example would be King, cause he’s always been iconic, but I feel like the stuff they gave him in this game (sprint, heat smash, pedigree) is also borderline iconic at this point, it’s super interesting that such a fan-favorite character got so much more flashed out in this latest game Overall, I been really digging your vids, if u want I can give u like 100 more ideas for structured vids, cause I’m too lazy to make them but would watch the shit out of this type of content bro fr
Since we covered Mishimas. How about the 3 tiered terrors ( use to be anyways) Feng, Dragonuv and Azu. What made them frequently picked in high level play
The mishimas are all pretty neat, Im not as much of a fan of the easier style of Jin but it makes sense from namcos perspective. Would love to see namco embrace more of a difficulty = strength type of balance style so we can actually see more mishimas in the pro scene. The state DvJ is in makes me a bit sad as he was clearly witch hunted by the community rather than being appropriately balanced. (Pysco crusher nerf was justified but the rest was just over kill, id love some poking buffs)
Reina is a combination of Heihachi's aggression and Jin's prior need for accurate option selection in a stance-focused package that makes her a very interesting addition, but doesn't quite fill the void of Heihachi. Jin has lost a lot of depth and is imho a less enjoyable/respectable character to VS in T8 but having an entry level psuedo-mishima is something thats been needed so I dont fully hate where he is now despite missing T7 Jin. Also the flips and stuff detract from his prior col and collected Karate aesthetic which I'm not a fan of. DVJ is having a bit of an identity crisis with his usual tools being scaled back and his new tools not filling the gaps - issues that only really came to light when his broken heat was toned down. I think he'll need some work to hit a good place in T8. I think DVJ should be the Jin to have flips and visual effects out every orifice to further divide the two sides of him mechanically and visually. Kazuya has never felt more characterful with his more frequent use of devil form and lasers etc but he's also in a rough spot mechanically due to his inconsistent combos - the *slightest* axis diff will make him drop a combi and be vulnerable to getup attacks - Kazuya mirror combo drop into getup twin piston is a menace. If his combos were consistent I would be a *very* happy Kaz main, as that's really his only issue due to the massive additions of ff2 and db1,2 as a neutral and punishment tool respectively. Kuma exists. Love him lore wise but the bears are awful to fight against. They're mechanical design is horrendous. Make them big bruiser types that hit hard and slow like Gigas, with a disgusting throw game to emphasis being a literal bear. Not weirdly gimmicky troll characters that have phantom hitboxes and ass-blast you into walls for like 70% dmg off of confusing attacks that are...unbearably un-bearlike.
Simple trick to keep me recycling. Been a Mishima player for 13(?) years: buy a new controller the same color as your old, take the old and put it in the box. Go get ya money back. Keeps it fresh for you and the old one gets refurbished by Sony.
@casadovah4684 My controller has already been lasting for over 300 hours with no signs of it breaking down anytime soon. Maybe don't use a gamecube controller to play Tekken on?
As a DJ main, I'm in a weird spot and state of mind where i feel like playing DJ is so draining, physically and mentally for precisely the reasons you mentioned, but if you asked me if i'd rather play any other character, i'd immediately say no. I literally bought the game because i saw how cool DJ was and it made me want to actually get good. 8 is my first serious tekken game. Played a bit of 7 but fell off insanely quick after a few hours. Currently low blue. Not good, but not bad
I actually think that he is still better than Kazuya overall. He has much more pressure once you utilize his oki game with mourning crow 4, 2 but that requires some practice. Is he weaker than he should be overall? Yes. They overdid the nerf on his Heat Smash and Heaven's gate. However, as a result, I don't ever use it anymore and just keep the opponent in a rush down state. My Devil Jin has become better than ever with the tech that MomoDog and Qudan's have shown. If they need to change anything to make him a bit more "user friendly" then they should revert the initial nerfs he received, fix his heaven's gate 1 damage nonsense, and make his poking range better. At least to Tekken 7 range.
@@SolusFather DVJ is Kaz but better. so many tools way better than kaz. but i still love my Kazuya. DVJ input felt really weird and both kaz and dvj suffer from that stupid high level execution combo with a lot of animation cancels. wanna do basic wall-carry combo? well you better master those frame-tight dash cancel move to extend it. while Jun and Reina and literally other new characters can just bread and butter combo and they carry you wall and back again without any stupid cancels. at the same time, Mishimas desperately need walls to do damage.
@@Cakalank I literally main both and play them both at a high level, you can see on my channel. Kaz is way better than Devil Jin and most high level mishimas would agree.
Another thing you could say is a downside about Kazuya is the frame data of his mids. Almost all of them are either punishable or very slow. His 13f options (db1,2 and df4,4) are both launch punishable. Db1,2 mid screen might space people out enough to be safe but some characters (like Jun or Asuka with their f2) will be able to reach him. At the wall, there is no push back at all. Df4,4 is particularly bad since if they block you die but if you land it, you’re -4 anyways. Very weird risk reward ratio on the move since it only gives you 29 damage. Sure you could only do df4 but then you’re doing even less damage. It’s only +2 on hit and -9 on block so you lose your turn. You’ll want to use these moves to frame trap but since they’re so punishing you risk your self using them. Kazuya’s lows, besides hellsweep or generic d4, are also very slow. A hellsweep getting blocked means a big punish of course. His other lows are all 20+ frames so they’re approaching being reactable. It can be hard to shut down powercrushes or heat bursts with him. What I think Kazuya players should use more of, however, is his df1, 4 string. It leaves you at +18 on hit allowing for an uninterrupted 50/50. Not even rage art can stop you. I used to think df1 was trash (the combo consistency and hitbox still is tho) but when I realized the utility of this, I changed my mind. After landing df1, 4 you can do any of his slow lows and they will frame trap. Do ff3 to launch or do df1,4 again if you think they’ll duck or mash to keep the frames up. A counter hit db4 will leave you at +17 for identical mix up opportunity.
King ,all mishima except jin(kazama half moves) df 44 are punishable. Its a legacy move thats been there and is like that. That -4 on hit is just since you could delay it by a lot and hit confirm as well so asking for more is just pushing it. About lows ,It suppose to be like that specially given the frames they give and the counter potential that way the risk/reward of hitting it is balance. Kazuya has a fast, low crushing db 3 low. It might not be as good as other low but it gets the job done
@@axelrossvillarin9505 I never liked this argument. “It’s tradition” or “it’s always been like that” is just a lazy cop out. Look at the risk reward ratio for the move. Think about what you get for landing it vs what you get for getting it blocked. You don’t get much for landing that move but you get severely punished if you’re wrong? That doesn’t make sense to me. You’ll want to use df4,4 to frame trap but both of Kaz’s 13f mids are severely punishable. What else does he have? Highs? Dick jab would cover that. “Legacy” or “tradition” is no excuse for a straight up bad move. If a move is there and it’s just bad, I’m not incentivized to use it. Several characters also have way faster lows that give them plus frames. This is a new game, we’re allowed to have new things. Some people seem to just want to keep Kazuya in the past I guess
@@floridaman7206 i agree but sadly most characters have it specially true for both devil jin and kazuya. Look at devil jin for example alots of his moves retained from past tekken and to make it worst most of it was useless. I agree that this is a new game and new change should be in order sadly devz just laze around some character leading to either bad hitboxes or overall useless moves
@@floridaman7206 complaining about df4,4 being launchable is like complaining about 112 being launchable. The point of the move is to hit confirm and never use beyond df4 unless you see it hit. It’s extremely hit confirmable.
Thank you for this video. As a Reina main and a new Tekken player, i always wondered why i rarely see Reina or Kazuya being used in tournaments. I also wondered a lot why the Tekken community doesn't consider Reina an S tier character, seeing how strong she is. I kinda understand now, especially that I had a hard time learning some of her combos.
Thank you for making this video. This really sums up my experience overall playing Mishimas in T8. I mainly play DVJ since T5 but fully picked up Kaz during T7 because training your fundamentals with him felt the most satisfying. I'm in blue ranks with both Kaz and DVJ but it's been unrewarding which is why I made the decision to truly main Jin more. Although to whoever wants to try any Mishima in T8 soon, don't hesitate to do so! You'll definitely learn a lot playing them. Respect to all Mishima players reaching the high ranks, even those who are in purple ranks still!
I’m now Raijin on DVJ. It was a hard way for me even though I mained him since tekken 7. Because of characters like Feng, Jun or King. They don’t need big effort to win unlike DVJ. And they are stronger than my devil boy :(
Interestingly enough everything you said about Reina in this game applied to Jin in T7 PLUS his absolutely ridiculous execution demands in T7. Seriously, T7 Jin might have been the toughest character in the history of Tekken to master, the T8 version is INSANELY easy comparatively.
@@darkpromeathean937as a jin main, i don’t think he is hard to play at all, but that doesn’t mean he gives you “free wins” either. free electrics can only get you so far as you can just LOL duck. you know when it comes from the df2 mixups and free electrics is not better to jumpstart combos than if you were to manually input his electric (which players DO have the option in doing) i played him in t7 so i know jin has been simplified but so have the majority of the roster.
The best part about being a DJ/Kazuya main is people calling your character broken. Makes you feel like a god because you know damn well you had to put in 3000% more effort than the King you just bodied
Reina would be difficult if she actually relied on eletrics and strong movement to get her gameplan going, she has too much power in neutral, her gameplan is harder to understand since its not a straigh 50/50 like some others, but she has to many tricks up her sleve that are too strong and cover more options than most realize
In my experience Reina is so difficult to play against because I'm always on defense and it feels she never has to stop pressing buttons. A lot of people talk about this game being heavy on 50/50s and playing guessing games ,but no character makes me feel that more than Reina
@@ragnarok7452 more like when its a newcomer instead of a legacy character specially reina players are quite capable of blowing her up couse people who dont play her dont realize how unsafe she is when she applies her pressure how many of her moves let her open for a 13f punish or straight up a launch its just not as easy to see
@@ragnarok7452 Difference is. Heihachi didnt have to play defense no where near as much as others in T7 because of high pressure, when defense was super strong, Reina does not play defense is T8 near as much as others, in a game offense is fucking insane (block damage, guard breaks, safer scary lows, recoverable health...). That character desing has more value in T8, not debatable realy
Im not finished with the video as of writing this, Im just so happy you said all mishimas ”are difficult to play - that is until recently with Jin”. I was fuming before that, that guy has protagonist training wheels.
I main Reina, and she really is a magical character, because as long as you can do the inputs, it’s actually not that hard to hit garyu. As soon as you hit garyu though, she becomes insanely hard as you have to really tighten up pressure and get good at keeping your foot in the accelerator. But it’s surprising how easy it is to get by with just df1,2, a WGF combo, ff2f~3, and a hellsweep.
Ahsan clearly wasn't familiar with the Reina matchup, and also wasn't playing at the top of his game. He basically didn't employ basic counter measures to ff2 at all, and even didn't punish the 2 or 3 times Joka whiffed it. The fact that it was so close just goes to show how difficult Reina is to play, even (and especially) at the highest level.
Umm the stance reliance thing isn't something that makes a character not a mishima since heihachi himself breaks the rule that you made but still has the flash punch combo along with reina. Jin falls into the same category as sagat wheres he's almost a shoto but not quite
Other not mishimas but pseudo mishima would be Bob and AK since they have tools in there wavedash similar to a mishima but not quite one along with the family bloodline
How his moves are exactly the same exact d2, zen u1 and easy electric, and df2 is negative. If anything they made him worse. His electric isnt a launcher, its only a tornado. They ruined jin. And his hellsweep isnt a launcher anymore.
My first Tekken and I started off playing Jin cause of the campaign and I also saw the Kazuya “I’m not gonna sugarcoat it” memes before so I now main Devil Jin who’s tougher but more rewarding to me
“I wish heihachi came back” I hadn’t even touched a tekken game an was also hyped to see him back lol, hope that you find what you’re hoping for in heihachi 😊
The original Mishima karate fighting style were Heihachi, Kazuya and tekken 3 Jin. The commonality were there rising uppercut, sweep kick, headbutt and blue electric charge. Jinpachi is a Mishima too, but his input commands were a little simpler.
I’m moving from Jin to Devil Jin as I feel the mishima style gameplay just fits me better. Devil Jin is also helping me improve fundamentally as I don’t have easy pokes and a killer ff2 anymore. The transition from Jin to Devil Jin is also a lot more natural which is why I chose him over Kazuya. Quite happy with where Devil Jin is at. Now people won’t complain anymore.
I've actually been doing something similar playing way more devil jin and kazuya instead of my normal jin. I definitely feel like it's making me a stronger player
People have no idea how hard it is to mix up an offense with Reina. She really doesn't have any low attacks that would force a character to respect them. I have to trick people into thinking she's more deadly than she really is. Most people in purple ranks or above know this and I have to work my ass off because of it
@@edgelord121 yes but someone with a good defense will find the oportunity to take the turn or sidestep your atacks, you have to use your lows to make your oponent take more risks or crouch, but that is also a risk for reina because her lows are launchebles and her best presion tool (f4) is just +2 in block.
@@edgelord121 Not sure what's so busted about Reina's neutral. Anyone who uses her knows the limitations of FF2. It's not some god-like tool that makes her unstoppable. There's clear counter play to every option she has from that move. A simple jab beats 90 percent of her options.
@@edgelord121 She does have a strong neutral to make up for the lack of strong lows but it's way easier to mix up strong highs and lows to get past a strong defense. Just block high and wait for an opportunity to punish her. If you know you know.
Up until Tekken 8, I had never picked up a Mishima as a main before. As you said, Reina is difficult to learn mainly because she has so many different options and stances. However, for me, she's so much fun to learn because of the mix-ups you can do with her. I have played Tekken since Tekken 4, but I just always played casually and didn't necessarily ever learn how to play well. Because Reina is so fun to play, I feel like I've gotten better at the game on a whole, and that feels really cool. Tekken 8 in general did a fantastic job making the characters fun to learn. :)
i think reina isn’t necessarily braindead, but i know exactly why she gets called that. she’s a character where her design is pretty much non stop offensive pressure, which makes her absolutely seem like a character for mashers, not to mention the high crush launchers (though they got nerfed as of a few hours ago when i’m writing this comment)
Man i loved this game but as jin player who played since tekken3 i hate that he became simplified cus i spend 4years learning t7 jin and then i feel betrayed by the development team cus of A huge opnion number of players were seen only playing for one month while me and some few jin players master the character for nothing i got Jin tekken god happy with the design but sad that there is almost no rewards for Jin old players (from skill perspective)
tekken 8 was the first tekken i’ve taken seriously, and kazuya was actually the first character i took up (horrible starter) and oml i’ve had such a blast with him. i played a bit of tekken 7 and the first one i wanted to try was heihachi. mishimas ftw🗣
I picked up Jin and Kaz and seriously tried to learn them for the first time in T8. Jin has his challenges which make it fun to continue playing him. Kaz is fun in a casual setting where I’m playing friends that do t play as much as I do lol. I’ve gotta get the movement down for him which is crucial like you said but it’s tough. Found myself getting my ass handed to me completely in rank when I play with him.
lol as an ex tk3 jin and kazuya player i was saying reina was a very easy character, and to be honest the reason why i played her is because she had the same tools that i love and find cool from mishimas but with her own unique style that resembles classic karate, which is basically what i love on makoto, so having stance makoto that wave dash and hell sweeps is basically all i could ask for in a tekken game, to the point i rarely wanna play feng or kaz anymore. Lidia might be my second pick for a character simply because karate, chesto, tsurugi thing is fun, and why i liked so much feng alongside kaz in tk5 and 6 (he was the one that had the gameplan that resembles the most this type of thing). Knowing reina isn't the easy character i thought she was makes me realize how easy some characters are in this game now, because damn if i find this easy, what must be tk8 jin or dragunov who seemed at the same level as her in difficulty.
Nice video you almost mentioned everything about how much dj suffers, i dont know what the game devs are smoking tbh, i wish they'd just offer a unique kit and balance the mishimas like they did in t7, everyone had something that the other mishima did not. Hei was the poke machine with bad lows, kazuya was the casino mishima, dvj was all round but had the least damage output & lacked mids. Then they decide to remove what made DVJ good in T7 and nerf what was good in the new t8 moves, leaving him to be literally overshadowed by most of the mishimas. its sad, i hope they do something asap i love this char but my god is it draining to play him.
I learned how to play Mishima first, now I can only play Mishima 😔 everything else feels like I’m using mortal combat character in a Tekken game 😩not having a perfect electric gives me brain fart, and not having a wave dash confuses me 😂 (I know some do that aren’t Mishima)
They really gotta give lars the standard god fist and even the uppercut, he does have the hellsweep tho, but is used in a completely different way from the rest of the hellsweeps
The less weighing on the wave dash seems like a big opportunity missed. New players who haven't seen the wavu wavu controls and cancels would have been fun to put some pressure on. But regardless great vid! Will look forward to more vids
tekken 8 is my first ever tekken that i actually play alot of and i picked kaz as my main got to red ranks not too long ago 180h played as of this moment. Yes im getting my cheeks clapped everyday but its alright i love the character.
I haven’t played dvj enough in tekken 8 but after seeing some of his weaknesses through gameplays, it’s a shame that he’s considered as low tier. Back in tekken 7, I considered him as a good well rounded Mishima style character because he offers everything that most characters had: strong 50/50s, good pokes, good pressure potential, and mental frames if you know what you’re doing.
This was really useful with rounding up the Mishimas, similarly, maybe I’d like a video on Lee chaolan or Lars and how they aren’t ones or some more details on them. Maybe why Lars is hated to fight or why Lee is so hard to play lol
0:43 I was just about to say cause even going beyond the Jin main stereotype of downplaying his strength tekken 8 being my first game in the series he was really easy for me to get the hang of even before I learned how to electric. Like I considered going Law Eddy or Vincent as my real mains with Jin being a side character I’d practice cause I like his story but how much I clicked with him surprised me.
I may be the minority but I hate the new Jin, I played Jin a lot ever since T4. The weird feather and jump moves throw me off. I miss the Zen cancel mechanic
Miss old zen cancel, but there is a harder one still possible. Also, I love his new demon moves. Really pushes the great story forward, as Jin has now accepted his demon half.
Tekken 8 is the first Tekken game that i play seriously in the series. I started with Kazuya because it’s my favorite character but i struggled a Lot. After a month (and thanks to Hitbox), I can execute Electric and wavedash on player 1 side almost Every time i want. Problem is when i have to switch to player 2 side where my fingers are weaker and to find the right moment in order to land my electric without getting hit or something. If i use pad it’s a disaster, i land some electric but wavedash is a nightmare. I’m really having a right time and i know i mad a bad choice for a beginner, but i just love this character, and landing my first whiff punish electric on ranked has been really a good feeling!
As a Mishima Main since Tekken 4 (Kazuya until I unlocked Jin.) Mishima is love Mishima is Life! I don’t even feel right if I don’t play Jin. Mishimas ARE TEKKEN to me
Having a lot of moves doesn't make a character hard at all, Hwoarang is usually considered an easy character and he has much more stance options than Reina plus he cannot block in 2 or those stances and he has to hit a low or make you block a high to enter stance pressure (which most of the time loses to Rage Art). Ofc Reina doesn't have as many good lows but just the fact that she has a quite fast ranged mid with safe stance transition on block that tracks to her right (your left) is a crime when hellsweep and electric is supposed to be sideWALKED (much riskier than sidestep, much less blocking) left. When you have a lot of moves and most of them are good or gimmicky it's MUCH harder for your opponent to learn how to beat you than for you to learn how to play. Again, Hwoarang being a great example.
I got to Tekken god rank without using the electric god fist and wave dashing that much, and that make most players confused on how i play, because the top rank players expect it to be used, i have my own style of using the Mishimas, although some people think im cheating or they get very salty its hilarious lol
Kimberly and Reina both feel like the challenging yet welcoming new girls on the block. Plus I just love their styles in combat (I usually play depending on style tbh)
Reina isn't difficult, she is quite OP The word you're looking for is 'complex' Difficult would be Akuma in T7 Putting a Yoshi / Hwo amount of moves that are all about as good as Kazuyas in one character makes without a doubt for a much stronger character Also her FF2 is way overtuned. Always connects, almost impossible to step, free plus frame mid followed by free billion option mixup. To win against Reina, you have to be lucky and catch her on a punishable move on block or whiff and then never ever let her regain control until she is dead
Tekken 6 was the last one I played before T8 and I was great on that game. Now playing T8 I've beaten the game and done some character stories then thought I was good enough to play online. Well, I was sadly mistaken and got beat quite alot. After playing I noticed I wasn't having fun and getting mad at myself and the game. I realized that wasn't good and I need to not worry about wins and rank and just learn the game more and have fun overall. It took me losing to see that just have fun and the knowledge will come after practice and experience. This is great info. For any new or frustrated players don't get worked up about trying to be number 1 because that won't happen on the first day, week or even month. Just enjoy the game and you'll get better everyday you play.
@toxicheat1226 not necessarily if we wanna count kuma we might as well count Lars or any of his other children. As of now the mishimas are Jin Reina Kazuya and DVJ. And id argue dvj mainly uses the mishima fighting style cause of the devil gene. And Jin does have Some Mishima Moves implemented in his kit as he can Hellsweep from Omen Stance
@@LowTierDagoth reina is a Mishima jep. Djin ist Just a half Mishima cause your say right He stole a Part of Kazuya. Lars is No Mishima Like Jin imo. And kuma ya... I would say He is was more Mishima than Jin/Lars.
Mishimas were actually the training characters for every korean pro the game has to offer in the past installments. Even players like Justice, Lowhigh, and Jeondding or literally any other korean pro you wouldn't associate with Mishimas know how to play them, which explains why their execution and reactions are so sharp.
I mean I mained Heihachi since Tekken 3, so I'm a little peeved that they took out the one Mishima that relied on pokes and mid attack pressure at the expense of 50/50s and lows. There's no substitute for his playstyle either. I really hope he comes back in one way or another.
So I started tekken a couple days ago and thought "hmm Reina looks fun, Ill give it a shot" idk what I was thinking but im sticking too it. Shes very fun though.
But they aren't the hardest characters. It's just mishima players saying that and those with no experience themselves repeating that. You practices Electric, you practice wavedashing, which is just reverse KBD. Then you practices electrics out of wavedash. You will get progressivly better every day you do it until you dont think about it. took me 6 monthes when i started to play T7 and sidemained Kazuya. If you really want you will be faster than me. 2:40 also calling jins oki too effective with few moves is even weirder to me, cause all mishimas have crazy op oki. That's their main neutral gimmick. snowballing af. Jin in T7 has like 2 grounded hitting moves. both sucked. i15 electric out of blockstun is hard but doable for a regular kazuya main. I promise Ling is infinitly harder to be good with. They are hard, but not the hardest to win with as a certain popular tekken content creator claims.
T8 is my first time playing Tekken and Reina was the first character I picked up. She definitely has a lot of tools to work with, but the execution of them varies. By a certain rank bracket, majority of the players know what you’re going to do (and even how to punish it).
I have been playing only with devil jin since tekken 7. I've tried picking up other characters many times, but they just don't stick to me. The lack of ewgf's is jarring, and doesn't feel satisfying. The amount of mind games he offers is also fun. But it is definitely exhausting, and I would imagine having a bad day with him hits much harder than any other non-mishima characters. Loving his new tools too, devil jin just didn't have the range in tekken 7, but now with his uf1, fff3 and ff4 he is really fun. And the heat smash nerf was really deserved, some say they overdid it, but he still has his mourning crow one, which can be used in setups.
Same with other two prominent 3D fighting game, this is my personal opinion: - VF: Akira is a character for advanced player, Jacky is better for beginners - DOA: Story protagonist Kasumi is maybe beginner-friendly, but the legendary name since NES days Ryu Hayabusa is not, he is a grappler
Jin purposely unlearned the Mishima stuff so that’s why he doesn’t do the 112. He wants to be more like his mama. So maybe he’s a Kazaa if I remember her last name correctly.
Mashima players are good when their 50/50s are good mix ups, I as a Reina main in blue rank have some good mix up but using her full kit takes a lot of practice
I swear the more and more i go against reina the more i think she is actually brain dead compared to the other mishima’s at least jin even though he is dumbed down he still has to play somewhat tekken unlike reina who literally doesn’t need to be played as a mishima at all.
1:52 - This is actually 1 of the primary reasons I didn't want to main Jin. It honestly felt like he was even harder to use than both his T3 self & Devil Jin. The fact it took this long for Jin to become accessible is pretty ridiculous IMO. 3:40 - I never knew this about Kazuya. As a Mishima, he always came across as a character who was deceptively easy to use but hard to master. I always figured he never had any high execution reward because of how many honest moves he had. I never realized how few options he actually has despite the new Devil install he has since T7 6:27 - It's funny bcuz I always firmly believed Devil Jin was the embodiment of "easy to play but hard to master" when it comes to both the Mishima's & Tekken itself. DJ always had that scrubby feeling to him, but it becomes super obvious how well someone plays DJ when they're not wavedashing. The moment that happens, God Almighty, it likes sharks smelling for blood. 8:35 - Oh cool, so Reina is what I always thought Mishimas should've been. Kinda annoying it took this long for this to happen, but meh. Anyway, great editorial video man. Keep it up.
Im brand new to Tekken and fighters broadly. I decided to main Jin. Its rough out here. Certain characters i really struggle with. Asuka has been given me hell during the arcade mode, piolited by max.
To beat asuka you gotta just lab and know all her best moves. She’s pretty awful so players who use her bank on you not knowing which moves of hers you can punish. So they just mash hoping you’ll run into a launcher. Take it with a grain of salt tho that’s just from my experience im not super high level I’m at Bushin, but that’s how it’s been against most asukas I’ve fought
They should add a second Paul called Paul 2 and they should give this second Paul a stance that just kills you every time you miss a just frame window in any patented Mishima move, just to make life more difficult for Kazuya mains. Call it the Death Smasher Stance, you enter it the instant you whiff Deathfist.
What do you guys think about the Mishima's In this game? And which characters do you want to see me cover next in a video?
I’d love if you did a series about stuff like this dude. Like what defines a „waifu” archetype, a vid about characters that break the rules and have a one of a kind playstyle (like yoshi, king), I don’t know how many more archetypes specific to tekken are there… like stance characters maybe? But I think this would be a cool series
Also it would be cool to showcase how characters that are present all the way since T1 are looking in T8. Like evolution of each character, and what defined them over the years - an interesting example would be King, cause he’s always been iconic, but I feel like the stuff they gave him in this game (sprint, heat smash, pedigree) is also borderline iconic at this point, it’s super interesting that such a fan-favorite character got so much more flashed out in this latest game
Overall, I been really digging your vids, if u want I can give u like 100 more ideas for structured vids, cause I’m too lazy to make them but would watch the shit out of this type of content bro fr
Since we covered Mishimas. How about the 3 tiered terrors ( use to be anyways) Feng, Dragonuv and Azu. What made them frequently picked in high level play
The mishimas are all pretty neat, Im not as much of a fan of the easier style of Jin but it makes sense from namcos perspective. Would love to see namco embrace more of a difficulty = strength type of balance style so we can actually see more mishimas in the pro scene. The state DvJ is in makes me a bit sad as he was clearly witch hunted by the community rather than being appropriately balanced. (Pysco crusher nerf was justified but the rest was just over kill, id love some poking buffs)
Reina is a combination of Heihachi's aggression and Jin's prior need for accurate option selection in a stance-focused package that makes her a very interesting addition, but doesn't quite fill the void of Heihachi.
Jin has lost a lot of depth and is imho a less enjoyable/respectable character to VS in T8 but having an entry level psuedo-mishima is something thats been needed so I dont fully hate where he is now despite missing T7 Jin. Also the flips and stuff detract from his prior col and collected Karate aesthetic which I'm not a fan of.
DVJ is having a bit of an identity crisis with his usual tools being scaled back and his new tools not filling the gaps - issues that only really came to light when his broken heat was toned down. I think he'll need some work to hit a good place in T8. I think DVJ should be the Jin to have flips and visual effects out every orifice to further divide the two sides of him mechanically and visually.
Kazuya has never felt more characterful with his more frequent use of devil form and lasers etc but he's also in a rough spot mechanically due to his inconsistent combos - the *slightest* axis diff will make him drop a combi and be vulnerable to getup attacks - Kazuya mirror combo drop into getup twin piston is a menace. If his combos were consistent I would be a *very* happy Kaz main, as that's really his only issue due to the massive additions of ff2 and db1,2 as a neutral and punishment tool respectively.
Kuma exists. Love him lore wise but the bears are awful to fight against. They're mechanical design is horrendous. Make them big bruiser types that hit hard and slow like Gigas, with a disgusting throw game to emphasis being a literal bear. Not weirdly gimmicky troll characters that have phantom hitboxes and ass-blast you into walls for like 70% dmg off of confusing attacks that are...unbearably un-bearlike.
Steve Fox for next content, maybe? one of the unique tekken fighting game designs, as well 🥊
Mishima is not a fighting style is a life style
Amen
Couldn’t have said it better
Cold
This sums up everything
Dah!
I played Mishimas on D-pad since 6. I got a army of zombie controllers
Rofl
Yeah a new controller only last like 3 days 💀
Simple trick to keep me recycling. Been a Mishima player for 13(?) years: buy a new controller the same color as your old, take the old and put it in the box. Go get ya money back. Keeps it fresh for you and the old one gets refurbished by Sony.
@casadovah4684 My controller has already been lasting for over 300 hours with no signs of it breaking down anytime soon. Maybe don't use a gamecube controller to play Tekken on?
Just replace the rubber membranes.
Mishima is so difficult
Lee: i guess i am a mistake
As thor would have said, "he's adopted"
Lars: hey don’t forget about me!!
Oh crap I totally forgot about Lee!
And then you have that smug Pikachu in the back-
Pikachu: "Pika!"
Steve players laughing at everyone in the back:
As a DJ main, I'm in a weird spot and state of mind where i feel like playing DJ is so draining, physically and mentally for precisely the reasons you mentioned, but if you asked me if i'd rather play any other character, i'd immediately say no. I literally bought the game because i saw how cool DJ was and it made me want to actually get good. 8 is my first serious tekken game. Played a bit of 7 but fell off insanely quick after a few hours. Currently low blue. Not good, but not bad
I’m literally on the same boat
No ones as cool as DJ for me :/
I actually think that he is still better than Kazuya overall. He has much more pressure once you utilize his oki game with mourning crow 4, 2 but that requires some practice. Is he weaker than he should be overall? Yes. They overdid the nerf on his Heat Smash and Heaven's gate. However, as a result, I don't ever use it anymore and just keep the opponent in a rush down state. My Devil Jin has become better than ever with the tech that MomoDog and Qudan's have shown. If they need to change anything to make him a bit more "user friendly" then they should revert the initial nerfs he received, fix his heaven's gate 1 damage nonsense, and make his poking range better. At least to Tekken 7 range.
@@adazium1909kazuya is better
@@SolusFather DVJ is Kaz but better. so many tools way better than kaz. but i still love my Kazuya. DVJ input felt really weird and both kaz and dvj suffer from that stupid high level execution combo with a lot of animation cancels. wanna do basic wall-carry combo? well you better master those frame-tight dash cancel move to extend it.
while Jun and Reina and literally other new characters can just bread and butter combo and they carry you wall and back again without any stupid cancels.
at the same time, Mishimas desperately need walls to do damage.
@@Cakalank I literally main both and play them both at a high level, you can see on my channel. Kaz is way better than Devil Jin and most high level mishimas would agree.
Next video should be on why everyone hates alisa
Not a bad idea
I love Alisa (I love watching opponents suffer)
I don’t hate Alisa though
It would just be an hour long video of the chainsaws 😂
Too easy to play like a Garyu Kazuya = Tekken King alisa in term of skill . And insane chip dmg
Also kazuya and devil Jin have consistency issues like quite a bit of them which need to be addressed soon by Bamco
Yeah but when you tell them to fix it the devs get offended and make like 6 different tweets about it.
*Kuma has left the chat*
I refuse to mention that mf
@@Boogard Kuma is the most noble Mishima. Jin still needs to be tried at the Hague for his crimes
@@Boogard but he's Heihachi's most beloved son
@@BoogardKuma is the honorary mishima
@@Boogard Ah I see bias tuber had a feeling the moment you started talking about Reina you was yapping
Thank you.
- Kazuya main
Stay strong it's tough out there
you must get jabbed out your wavedash.
The Kaz glazing brings me joy
Another thing you could say is a downside about Kazuya is the frame data of his mids. Almost all of them are either punishable or very slow. His 13f options (db1,2 and df4,4) are both launch punishable. Db1,2 mid screen might space people out enough to be safe but some characters (like Jun or Asuka with their f2) will be able to reach him. At the wall, there is no push back at all. Df4,4 is particularly bad since if they block you die but if you land it, you’re -4 anyways. Very weird risk reward ratio on the move since it only gives you 29 damage. Sure you could only do df4 but then you’re doing even less damage. It’s only +2 on hit and -9 on block so you lose your turn. You’ll want to use these moves to frame trap but since they’re so punishing you risk your self using them.
Kazuya’s lows, besides hellsweep or generic d4, are also very slow. A hellsweep getting blocked means a big punish of course. His other lows are all 20+ frames so they’re approaching being reactable. It can be hard to shut down powercrushes or heat bursts with him.
What I think Kazuya players should use more of, however, is his df1, 4 string. It leaves you at +18 on hit allowing for an uninterrupted 50/50. Not even rage art can stop you.
I used to think df1 was trash (the combo consistency and hitbox still is tho) but when I realized the utility of this, I changed my mind. After landing df1, 4 you can do any of his slow lows and they will frame trap. Do ff3 to launch or do df1,4 again if you think they’ll duck or mash to keep the frames up. A counter hit db4 will leave you at +17 for identical mix up opportunity.
imagine punishing with df4,4 cause thats the only good range punishing tool you have, and you get minus on hit 🤣
King ,all mishima except jin(kazama half moves) df 44 are punishable. Its a legacy move thats been there and is like that. That -4 on hit is just since you could delay it by a lot and hit confirm as well so asking for more is just pushing it. About lows ,It suppose to be like that specially given the frames they give and the counter potential that way the risk/reward of hitting it is balance. Kazuya has a fast, low crushing db 3 low. It might not be as good as other low but it gets the job done
@@axelrossvillarin9505 I never liked this argument. “It’s tradition” or “it’s always been like that” is just a lazy cop out. Look at the risk reward ratio for the move. Think about what you get for landing it vs what you get for getting it blocked. You don’t get much for landing that move but you get severely punished if you’re wrong? That doesn’t make sense to me. You’ll want to use df4,4 to frame trap but both of Kaz’s 13f mids are severely punishable. What else does he have? Highs? Dick jab would cover that.
“Legacy” or “tradition” is no excuse for a straight up bad move. If a move is there and it’s just bad, I’m not incentivized to use it. Several characters also have way faster lows that give them plus frames.
This is a new game, we’re allowed to have new things. Some people seem to just want to keep Kazuya in the past I guess
@@floridaman7206 i agree but sadly most characters have it specially true for both devil jin and kazuya. Look at devil jin for example alots of his moves retained from past tekken and to make it worst most of it was useless. I agree that this is a new game and new change should be in order sadly devz just laze around some character leading to either bad hitboxes or overall useless moves
@@floridaman7206 complaining about df4,4 being launchable is like complaining about 112 being launchable. The point of the move is to hit confirm and never use beyond df4 unless you see it hit. It’s extremely hit confirmable.
When I finally landed a perfect electric on counter hit with Kazuya. I legit cried lmao
dweeb
but good for you! its really difficult!
@1:53, "black sheep" with iconic T4 music. I see what you did there on all levels.
Thank you for this video. As a Reina main and a new Tekken player, i always wondered why i rarely see Reina or Kazuya being used in tournaments. I also wondered a lot why the Tekken community doesn't consider Reina an S tier character, seeing how strong she is. I kinda understand now, especially that I had a hard time learning some of her combos.
The Mishimas are the equivalent to the McMahon family in WWF/WWE 😆
Minus the Mr. McMahon allegations hopefully 😅
Welp, you got what you wanted at 11:25. Heihachi was announced this weekend!
Thank you for making this video. This really sums up my experience overall playing Mishimas in T8. I mainly play DVJ since T5 but fully picked up Kaz during T7 because training your fundamentals with him felt the most satisfying. I'm in blue ranks with both Kaz and DVJ but it's been unrewarding which is why I made the decision to truly main Jin more. Although to whoever wants to try any Mishima in T8 soon, don't hesitate to do so! You'll definitely learn a lot playing them. Respect to all Mishima players reaching the high ranks, even those who are in purple ranks still!
I’m now Raijin on DVJ. It was a hard way for me even though I mained him since tekken 7. Because of characters like Feng, Jun or King. They don’t need big effort to win unlike DVJ. And they are stronger than my devil boy :(
Interestingly enough everything you said about Reina in this game applied to Jin in T7 PLUS his absolutely ridiculous execution demands in T7. Seriously, T7 Jin might have been the toughest character in the history of Tekken to master, the T8 version is INSANELY easy comparatively.
Thank you, people still like to pretend like Jin is hard in 8. He even gets moves that lead to free electrics
@@darkpromeathean937as a jin main, i don’t think he is hard to play at all, but that doesn’t mean he gives you “free wins” either. free electrics can only get you so far as you can just LOL duck. you know when it comes from the df2 mixups and free electrics is not better to jumpstart combos than if you were to manually input his electric (which players DO have the option in doing) i played him in t7 so i know jin has been simplified but so have the majority of the roster.
@@TomiokaGiyuus97 Oh 100% just using him for an example.
Mishima are Tekken Royalty.
"Rite of passage"
"Now we are playing REAL Tekken"
Famous tekken commentators.
The best part about being a DJ/Kazuya main is people calling your character broken. Makes you feel like a god because you know damn well you had to put in 3000% more effort than the King you just bodied
As a Kazuya main I relate from the heart. “Your character does so much damage, it’s unfair”. Yeah go ahead and try him 😂
Had a king plug yesterday because I hit em with hellsweep twice then ff4 oki then hellsweep again
Reina would be difficult if she actually relied on eletrics and strong movement to get her gameplan going, she has too much power in neutral, her gameplan is harder to understand since its not a straigh 50/50 like some others, but she has to many tricks up her sleve that are too strong and cover more options than most realize
In my experience Reina is so difficult to play against because I'm always on defense and it feels she never has to stop pressing buttons.
A lot of people talk about this game being heavy on 50/50s and playing guessing games ,but no character makes me feel that more than Reina
Heihatchi was like that especially online. But it's interesting to see people claim that once a character is turned female.
@@ragnarok7452 more like when its a newcomer instead of a legacy character specially reina players are quite capable of blowing her up couse people who dont play her dont realize how unsafe she is when she applies her pressure how many of her moves let her open for a 13f punish or straight up a launch its just not as easy to see
@@agssilv5919 Maybe but I have seen people bash waifu's more than male characters even when both are equally gimmicky or cheap.
@@ragnarok7452 Difference is. Heihachi didnt have to play defense no where near as much as others in T7 because of high pressure, when defense was super strong, Reina does not play defense is T8 near as much as others, in a game offense is fucking insane (block damage, guard breaks, safer scary lows, recoverable health...). That character desing has more value in T8, not debatable realy
Im not finished with the video as of writing this, Im just so happy you said all mishimas ”are difficult to play - that is until recently with Jin”. I was fuming before that, that guy has protagonist training wheels.
Great video man. No crazy bias opinions just facts. Kazuya is my main and ranking up is pretty hard.
As someone new to Tekken trying to main Reina, the sheer amount of options definitely fries my brain
I main Reina, and she really is a magical character, because as long as you can do the inputs, it’s actually not that hard to hit garyu. As soon as you hit garyu though, she becomes insanely hard as you have to really tighten up pressure and get good at keeping your foot in the accelerator. But it’s surprising how easy it is to get by with just df1,2, a WGF combo, ff2f~3, and a hellsweep.
This makes me really appreciate JOKA for playing with Reina and Kazuya in the Grand Finals when most wouldnt even dare.
Ahsan clearly wasn't familiar with the Reina matchup, and also wasn't playing at the top of his game. He basically didn't employ basic counter measures to ff2 at all, and even didn't punish the 2 or 3 times Joka whiffed it. The fact that it was so close just goes to show how difficult Reina is to play, even (and especially) at the highest level.
I main Reina and I got a hate message from a Jun player calling me carried. Both Fujin at the time. Reina is definitely not braindead.
Reina is actually TRASH. Even though that’s the character I lose to the most. I still think she isn’t good at all.
jun is terrible matchup for me i think im like 20-50
She most definitely is, she and jin both are but Raina is just horrible to fight
@@Tekkenandgaming Please explain
Nerf Reina now
I fully agree with your point on jin I think it was really good they decided to make one of the mishimas accessible for new players
Yeah I'm actually so glad they did because I couldn't play him for shit in tekken 7
Umm the stance reliance thing isn't something that makes a character not a mishima since heihachi himself breaks the rule that you made but still has the flash punch combo along with reina. Jin falls into the same category as sagat wheres he's almost a shoto but not quite
Other not mishimas but pseudo mishima would be Bob and AK since they have tools in there wavedash similar to a mishima but not quite one along with the family bloodline
How his moves are exactly the same exact d2, zen u1 and easy electric, and df2 is negative. If anything they made him worse. His electric isnt a launcher, its only a tornado. They ruined jin. And his hellsweep isnt a launcher anymore.
yeah now jin mains dont wanna play him. its the reason i liked jin
My first Tekken and I started off playing Jin cause of the campaign and I also saw the Kazuya “I’m not gonna sugarcoat it” memes before so I now main Devil Jin who’s tougher but more rewarding to me
Just found this channel. How have I not heard of you before? Reall nice videos
Really appreciate it 🙏
I don't sleep well knowing that It took me less time to reach Purple Rank with Jun then It did with Kazuya.
jun is as cheap as it gets
“I wish heihachi came back”
I hadn’t even touched a tekken game an was also hyped to see him back lol, hope that you find what you’re hoping for in heihachi 😊
I will never forget when I played Reina a victor tried to grill me on how easy she was I had no words
Bruh my guy really tried to roast you when he plays a character that gets a combo from spamming 2😂
@@anso3886 Yea, like I get she’s not kazuya difficult but she’s not that easy
The original Mishima karate fighting style were Heihachi, Kazuya and tekken 3 Jin. The commonality were there rising uppercut, sweep kick, headbutt and blue electric charge. Jinpachi is a Mishima too, but his input commands were a little simpler.
As a Kazuya player, thank you for mentioning our blood, sweat, and tears in trying to improve this punish rewarding character.
➡️⭐⬇️↘️🥈
-DORYAH🗣️✊⚡
I’m moving from Jin to Devil Jin as I feel the mishima style gameplay just fits me better. Devil Jin is also helping me improve fundamentally as I don’t have easy pokes and a killer ff2 anymore. The transition from Jin to Devil Jin is also a lot more natural which is why I chose him over Kazuya. Quite happy with where Devil Jin is at. Now people won’t complain anymore.
I've actually been doing something similar playing way more devil jin and kazuya instead of my normal jin. I definitely feel like it's making me a stronger player
Personally, i think dvj is simply a more reliable but weaker kazuya. He's my main choice if i want a real mishima experience other than kazuya
Practice him daily and if im having a bad day, i just pick alisa, and spam my heat chainsaw like an absolute menace
Steve: " *Laughs in 9 separate stances* "
People have no idea how hard it is to mix up an offense with Reina. She really doesn't have any low attacks that would force a character to respect them. I have to trick people into thinking she's more deadly than she really is. Most people in purple ranks or above know this and I have to work my ass off because of it
She has the most busted neutral control. She doesn't need to mix with lows. Especially because this game also has chip damage as well.
@@edgelord121 yes but someone with a good defense will find the oportunity to take the turn or sidestep your atacks, you have to use your lows to make your oponent take more risks or crouch, but that is also a risk for reina because her lows are launchebles and her best presion tool (f4) is just +2 in block.
@@edgelord121 Not sure what's so busted about Reina's neutral. Anyone who uses her knows the limitations of FF2. It's not some god-like tool that makes her unstoppable. There's clear counter play to every option she has from that move. A simple jab beats 90 percent of her options.
@@tek87Or just ducking apparently, I cant even 1,1 sometimes without even getting randomly ducked and launched
@@edgelord121
She does have a strong neutral to make up for the lack of strong lows but it's way easier to mix up strong highs and lows to get past a strong defense. Just block high and wait for an opportunity to punish her. If you know you know.
Up until Tekken 8, I had never picked up a Mishima as a main before. As you said, Reina is difficult to learn mainly because she has so many different options and stances. However, for me, she's so much fun to learn because of the mix-ups you can do with her. I have played Tekken since Tekken 4, but I just always played casually and didn't necessarily ever learn how to play well. Because Reina is so fun to play, I feel like I've gotten better at the game on a whole, and that feels really cool. Tekken 8 in general did a fantastic job making the characters fun to learn. :)
i think reina isn’t necessarily braindead, but i know exactly why she gets called that. she’s a character where her design is pretty much non stop offensive pressure, which makes her absolutely seem like a character for mashers, not to mention the high crush launchers (though they got nerfed as of a few hours ago when i’m writing this comment)
Man i loved this game but as jin player who played since tekken3 i hate that he became simplified cus i spend 4years learning t7 jin and then i feel betrayed by the development team cus of A huge opnion number of players were seen only playing for one month while me and some few jin players master the character for nothing i got Jin tekken god happy with the design but sad that there is almost no rewards for Jin old players (from skill perspective)
tekken 8 was the first tekken i’ve taken seriously, and kazuya was actually the first character i took up (horrible starter) and oml i’ve had such a blast with him. i played a bit of tekken 7 and the first one i wanted to try was heihachi. mishimas ftw🗣
I picked up Jin and Kaz and seriously tried to learn them for the first time in T8. Jin has his challenges which make it fun to continue playing him. Kaz is fun in a casual setting where I’m playing friends that do t play as much as I do lol. I’ve gotta get the movement down for him which is crucial like you said but it’s tough. Found myself getting my ass handed to me completely in rank when I play with him.
trust me i suffer to every day in rank with kaz. also love the video
lol as an ex tk3 jin and kazuya player i was saying reina was a very easy character, and to be honest the reason why i played her is because she had the same tools that i love and find cool from mishimas but with her own unique style that resembles classic karate, which is basically what i love on makoto, so having stance makoto that wave dash and hell sweeps is basically all i could ask for in a tekken game, to the point i rarely wanna play feng or kaz anymore. Lidia might be my second pick for a character simply because karate, chesto, tsurugi thing is fun, and why i liked so much feng alongside kaz in tk5 and 6 (he was the one that had the gameplan that resembles the most this type of thing). Knowing reina isn't the easy character i thought she was makes me realize how easy some characters are in this game now, because damn if i find this easy, what must be tk8 jin or dragunov who seemed at the same level as her in difficulty.
Nice video you almost mentioned everything about how much dj suffers, i dont know what the game devs are smoking tbh, i wish they'd just offer a unique kit and balance the mishimas like they did in t7, everyone had something that the other mishima did not. Hei was the poke machine with bad lows, kazuya was the casino mishima, dvj was all round but had the least damage output & lacked mids. Then they decide to remove what made DVJ good in T7 and nerf what was good in the new t8 moves, leaving him to be literally overshadowed by most of the mishimas. its sad, i hope they do something asap i love this char but my god is it draining to play him.
Uh why would you do that? Devil Jin was NOT good in Season 4 or 5 of Tekken 7. What are you smoking?
Great video man, mishima players getting a lot of bad rep since 8 appreciate the analysis
Glad I could help
“I’ll be back.”
-Heihachi.
That aged well
I learned how to play Mishima first, now I can only play Mishima 😔 everything else feels like I’m using mortal combat character in a Tekken game 😩not having a perfect electric gives me brain fart, and not having a wave dash confuses me 😂 (I know some do that aren’t Mishima)
I love using Reina but her moves are very hard to get into my head.
They really gotta give lars the standard god fist and even the uppercut, he does have the hellsweep tho, but is used in a completely different way from the rest of the hellsweeps
gonna have to update this video after heihachi comes out
The less weighing on the wave dash seems like a big opportunity missed. New players who haven't seen the wavu wavu controls and cancels would have been fun to put some pressure on. But regardless great vid! Will look forward to more vids
Bob is more Mishima then Lars.
i personally could not care less if devil jin is the weakest mishima this game has reawakened my love for him ever since tekken 6
also i ran into ur dvj ggs bro!
tekken 8 is my first ever tekken that i actually play alot of and i picked kaz as my main got to red ranks not too long ago 180h played as of this moment. Yes im getting my cheeks clapped everyday but its alright i love the character.
I haven’t played dvj enough in tekken 8 but after seeing some of his weaknesses through gameplays, it’s a shame that he’s considered as low tier. Back in tekken 7, I considered him as a good well rounded Mishima style character because he offers everything that most characters had: strong 50/50s, good pokes, good pressure potential, and mental frames if you know what you’re doing.
This was really useful with rounding up the Mishimas, similarly, maybe I’d like a video on Lee chaolan or Lars and how they aren’t ones or some more details on them.
Maybe why Lars is hated to fight or why Lee is so hard to play lol
Lol I've actually been planning on making that videos on lars. Thanks for the other suggestions!
@@Boogard it will be interesting to see as a Lars main
As someone who is brand new to tekken I started with Jin and I feel like you say it very well he is easy to pick up hard to master
I’ve been playing Devil Jin and Tekken 8 is my first Tekken game. He’s not too difficult once I took time to lab him.
0:43 I was just about to say cause even going beyond the Jin main stereotype of downplaying his strength tekken 8 being my first game in the series he was really easy for me to get the hang of even before I learned how to electric.
Like I considered going Law Eddy or Vincent as my real mains with Jin being a side character I’d practice cause I like his story but how much I clicked with him surprised me.
I may be the minority but I hate the new Jin, I played Jin a lot ever since T4. The weird feather and jump moves throw me off.
I miss the Zen cancel mechanic
I definitely understand why people who have been playing him for a long time wouldn't like the new changes
I miss F4 zen :( but it actually made me a better player not depending on zen.
They messed up all the execution heavy stuff for all the characters man, it sucks!!
Miss old zen cancel, but there is a harder one still possible. Also, I love his new demon moves. Really pushes the great story forward, as Jin has now accepted his demon half.
He's 10x better now. Genuinely fun character too without needing to put in 100 hours to learn 1 character
Tekken 8 is the first Tekken game that i play seriously in the series. I started with Kazuya because it’s my favorite character but i struggled a Lot. After a month (and thanks to Hitbox), I can execute Electric and wavedash on player 1 side almost Every time i want. Problem is when i have to switch to player 2 side where my fingers are weaker and to find the right moment in order to land my electric without getting hit or something. If i use pad it’s a disaster, i land some electric but wavedash is a nightmare. I’m really having a right time and i know i mad a bad choice for a beginner, but i just love this character, and landing my first whiff punish electric on ranked has been really a good feeling!
As a Mishima Main since Tekken 4 (Kazuya until I unlocked Jin.) Mishima is love Mishima is Life! I don’t even feel right if I don’t play Jin. Mishimas ARE TEKKEN to me
Having a lot of moves doesn't make a character hard at all, Hwoarang is usually considered an easy character and he has much more stance options than Reina plus he cannot block in 2 or those stances and he has to hit a low or make you block a high to enter stance pressure (which most of the time loses to Rage Art). Ofc Reina doesn't have as many good lows but just the fact that she has a quite fast ranged mid with safe stance transition on block that tracks to her right (your left) is a crime when hellsweep and electric is supposed to be sideWALKED (much riskier than sidestep, much less blocking) left.
When you have a lot of moves and most of them are good or gimmicky it's MUCH harder for your opponent to learn how to beat you than for you to learn how to play. Again, Hwoarang being a great example.
I got to Tekken god rank without using the electric god fist and wave dashing that much, and that make most players confused on how i play, because the top rank players expect it to be used, i have my own style of using the Mishimas, although some people think im cheating or they get very salty its hilarious lol
How do you play Mishima without ewgf and wavedashes (cause I want to get good with Reina)
I want Heihachi back 😢
I'm praying everyday 🙏
He fell in a volcano fam, issa wrap for him
I would love to play Heihachi again (he was my main in older Tekken games) but I know it's curtains for him. :(
I’d love to have heihachi back
Not sure if it’s possible but that’d be great
If we can at least kazumi back that’d be great
He will don’t worry, and he will have devil powers too trust me.
Kimberly and Reina both feel like the challenging yet welcoming new girls on the block. Plus I just love their styles in combat (I usually play depending on style tbh)
Reina is a lot harder than Kimberly
Reina isn't difficult, she is quite OP
The word you're looking for is 'complex'
Difficult would be Akuma in T7
Putting a Yoshi / Hwo amount of moves that are all about as good as Kazuyas in one character makes without a doubt for a much stronger character
Also her FF2 is way overtuned. Always connects, almost impossible to step, free plus frame mid followed by free billion option mixup.
To win against Reina, you have to be lucky and catch her on a punishable move on block or whiff and then never ever let her regain control until she is dead
I only clicked to this video to see if you included Kuma in it.
I refuse to mention him
@@Boogard Kuma is the rightful heir to the Mishima Zabatsu and the best Mishima. But I understand how you feel.
Even after launch I’m still learning how to play
I actually fought some pros at Comic-Con this year and they said I alright but lack matchup knowledge
Tekken 6 was the last one I played before T8 and I was great on that game. Now playing T8 I've beaten the game and done some character stories then thought I was good enough to play online. Well, I was sadly mistaken and got beat quite alot. After playing I noticed I wasn't having fun and getting mad at myself and the game. I realized that wasn't good and I need to not worry about wins and rank and just learn the game more and have fun overall. It took me losing to see that just have fun and the knowledge will come after practice and experience. This is great info. For any new or frustrated players don't get worked up about trying to be number 1 because that won't happen on the first day, week or even month. Just enjoy the game and you'll get better everyday you play.
For Kazuya it's mostly execution part. Also overcoming tendency to pull the plug when they think they have been cheesed.
Jin isnt a Mishima. He doesnt deserve.
Kuma is more a Mishima than (d)Jin.
He is a mishima though. In tekken 3 he was trained by Heihachi but chose to stuck to the Kazuma Style cause he hates the mishima zaibatsu
@@LowTierDagoth and a real Mishima stays at His Style. Is proud of it. So Jin isnt a Mishima.
@toxicheat1226 not necessarily if we wanna count kuma we might as well count Lars or any of his other children. As of now the mishimas are Jin Reina Kazuya and DVJ. And id argue dvj mainly uses the mishima fighting style cause of the devil gene. And Jin does have Some Mishima Moves implemented in his kit as he can Hellsweep from Omen Stance
@@LowTierDagoth reina is a Mishima jep. Djin ist Just a half Mishima cause your say right He stole a Part of Kazuya. Lars is No Mishima Like Jin imo. And kuma ya... I would say He is was more Mishima than Jin/Lars.
Ik Lars isn’t exactly a Mishima but as a lars main i would like to think he is a strong Mishima.!
"I'm not gonna sugarcoat it"
Mishimas were actually the training characters for every korean pro the game has to offer in the past installments.
Even players like Justice, Lowhigh, and Jeondding or literally any other korean pro you wouldn't associate with Mishimas know how to play them, which explains why their execution and reactions are so sharp.
I mean I mained Heihachi since Tekken 3, so I'm a little peeved that they took out the one Mishima that relied on pokes and mid attack pressure at the expense of 50/50s and lows. There's no substitute for his playstyle either. I really hope he comes back in one way or another.
I like butt
Made a video about the Mishima but didnt include Kuma... My heart is broken.
where's our boy kuma. he's got the electric wind god fist
Fix Kazuya Neighbor
infernasu?
"You main a mishima? Damn who?"
"Heihachi's Son"
"Oh Kaz-"
"Kuma"
"What?"
"What?"
My only gripe with Reina is her position in t8's story. Same for Jun.
So I started tekken a couple days ago and thought "hmm Reina looks fun, Ill give it a shot" idk what I was thinking but im sticking too it. Shes very fun though.
But they aren't the hardest characters. It's just mishima players saying that and those with no experience themselves repeating that. You practices Electric, you practice wavedashing, which is just reverse KBD. Then you practices electrics out of wavedash. You will get progressivly better every day you do it until you dont think about it. took me 6 monthes when i started to play T7 and sidemained Kazuya. If you really want you will be faster than me. 2:40 also calling jins oki too effective with few moves is even weirder to me, cause all mishimas have crazy op oki. That's their main neutral gimmick. snowballing af. Jin in T7 has like 2 grounded hitting moves. both sucked. i15 electric out of blockstun is hard but doable for a regular kazuya main. I promise Ling is infinitly harder to be good with.
They are hard, but not the hardest to win with as a certain popular tekken content creator claims.
now let's talk about the Kazama play style
Everyone wants the real og back Heiachi 👑
T8 is my first time playing Tekken and Reina was the first character I picked up. She definitely has a lot of tools to work with, but the execution of them varies. By a certain rank bracket, majority of the players know what you’re going to do (and even how to punish it).
i know u want to sentai3 just keep that in the back of your mind
@@agssilv5919 read me like a book 😂
I have been playing only with devil jin since tekken 7. I've tried picking up other characters many times, but they just don't stick to me. The lack of ewgf's is jarring, and doesn't feel satisfying. The amount of mind games he offers is also fun. But it is definitely exhausting, and I would imagine having a bad day with him hits much harder than any other non-mishima characters. Loving his new tools too, devil jin just didn't have the range in tekken 7, but now with his uf1, fff3 and ff4 he is really fun. And the heat smash nerf was really deserved, some say they overdid it, but he still has his mourning crow one, which can be used in setups.
Same with other two prominent 3D fighting game, this is my personal opinion:
- VF: Akira is a character for advanced player, Jacky is better for beginners
- DOA: Story protagonist Kasumi is maybe beginner-friendly, but the legendary name since NES days Ryu Hayabusa is not, he is a grappler
Jin purposely unlearned the Mishima stuff so that’s why he doesn’t do the 112. He wants to be more like his mama. So maybe he’s a Kazaa if I remember her last name correctly.
Playing vs reina in T8 feels like playing vs Akuma in T7. Very mentally taxing
Mashima players are good when their 50/50s are good mix ups, I as a Reina main in blue rank have some good mix up but using her full kit takes a lot of practice
0:33 which kof is this.. anyone?
It's kof 13
I swear the more and more i go against reina the more i think she is actually brain dead compared to the other mishima’s at least jin even though he is dumbed down he still has to play somewhat tekken unlike reina who literally doesn’t need to be played as a mishima at all.
Funny enough, Lidia now appears in Tekken 8, and it seems like she learned a few new moves, too!
1:52 - This is actually 1 of the primary reasons I didn't want to main Jin. It honestly felt like he was even harder to use than both his T3 self & Devil Jin. The fact it took this long for Jin to become accessible is pretty ridiculous IMO.
3:40 - I never knew this about Kazuya. As a Mishima, he always came across as a character who was deceptively easy to use but hard to master. I always figured he never had any high execution reward because of how many honest moves he had. I never realized how few options he actually has despite the new Devil install he has since T7
6:27 - It's funny bcuz I always firmly believed Devil Jin was the embodiment of "easy to play but hard to master" when it comes to both the Mishima's & Tekken itself. DJ always had that scrubby feeling to him, but it becomes super obvious how well someone plays DJ when they're not wavedashing. The moment that happens, God Almighty, it likes sharks smelling for blood.
8:35 - Oh cool, so Reina is what I always thought Mishimas should've been. Kinda annoying it took this long for this to happen, but meh.
Anyway, great editorial video man. Keep it up.
Bro doesn’t even include the bear 😭🐻
As a Kazuya main, holy crap his combos are so inconsistent! Just lower the hitbox on his df+1 and fix his 1,1,2 and boom we're cooking
Im brand new to Tekken and fighters broadly. I decided to main Jin. Its rough out here. Certain characters i really struggle with. Asuka has been given me hell during the arcade mode, piolited by max.
To beat asuka you gotta just lab and know all her best moves. She’s pretty awful so players who use her bank on you not knowing which moves of hers you can punish. So they just mash hoping you’ll run into a launcher. Take it with a grain of salt tho that’s just from my experience im not super high level I’m at Bushin, but that’s how it’s been against most asukas I’ve fought
They should add a second Paul called Paul 2 and they should give this second Paul a stance that just kills you every time you miss a just frame window in any patented Mishima move, just to make life more difficult for Kazuya mains. Call it the Death Smasher Stance, you enter it the instant you whiff Deathfist.