Fate/Zero Season 2 Episodes 3 & 4 Reactions | 'Don't Smile'
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 23 июл 2024
- Aussie Ravenclaw deals with successive shocks and Kirei's smile in Episodes 3 and 4 of Fate/Zero.
0:00 - physical clashes to reflect philosophical ones; 3:25 - normie fodder, Saber's flaws; 7:37 - Archer/Tokiomi toxic relationship, how d'you do fellow kids; 14:46 - Berserker brings Gil down wooo; 17:08 - Tokiomi vs Kariya, one mage child policy; 30:24 - out of the fry pan, into the crazy Kirei; 33:50 - Ryuunosuke's peace, fast food murder; 35:55 - Kiritsugu's sly setup, Waver steps up; 41:42 - Excalibur's beauty for everyone (except for Gil); 47:26 - cheated by Caster, too real world; 51:53 - Rider/Archer get snarky.
57:32 - Episode 3 Reaction
1:19:35 - Episode 3 mini rant
1:22:23 - Episode 4 Reaction
1:45:56 - Thoughts, ie. honour in war?, the vessel??, Kirei's daddy issues
Comment shoutouts: @thomas815 (15:05/47:38), @oberon127 (18:58), @kennethelder3659 (23:20), @nrvnqsr4001 (43:24), @Plexippuspetersi92 (45:52)
*NOTE*
This is a time-synched reaction, so watch along with your own copy of the show! English captions (for the stuff I say) coming soon.
*WHO ARE I*
I'm double-cursed with an excessively laid back accent and tendency for brain overload. Oh, and I recently discovered a little thing called 'anime'. Cue amazement, and a bad case of playing catch up.
*'WATCHED ANIME' COUNT AS OF UPLOAD*
14
*CURRENTLY CATCHING UP ON*
Aria the Natural
Hibike! Euphonium
Fate/Zero
Haibane Renmei
Find me over on Twitter @ravenclawreacts for random in-between video thoughts.
Join our Discord (we're a pretty sweet bunch): / discord
List of 'to watch' anime: anilist.co/user/ravenclawreac... 
Кино
![Fate/Zero Season 2 Episodes 5 & 6 Reactions | 'Hey Kid' [RE-UPLOAD]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4cfxCCvTLno/mqdefault.jpg)
![Fate/Zero Season 2 Episodes 5 & 6 Reactions | 'Hey Kid' [RE-UPLOAD]](/img/tr.png)
One of my favorite details in this episode is that Gilgamesh for the first (and only) time gives the smallest bit of respect to Tokiomi only upon learning he was planning to betray and kill him, it just says so much about Gil's fundamental values. He is the ultimate hedonist, I don't think he's like Kirei in the sense that he's distinctly drawn to suffering, he's repulsed by the boring and the ordinary and gripped by the all things rare and intriguing. "Isn't rare stupidity more valuable than commonplace wisdom?" he said of Saber some episodes ago. In short, he likes shiny things and believes himself to be the rightful owner of all of them. And right now Saber seems to be the shiny "thing" he is most interested in acquiring.
Also, quick note, you do not need to kill all 7 servants to get a wish granted, if you get the Grail, you get a wish. Killing all servants is a ritual to reach the Root (which is what the big Mage families actually care about and the "true" purpose of the Grail War). This is not super relevant in Fate/Zero since the Einzbern and Matou families aren't really being represented by "traditional" mages and Tokiomi is dead, none of the Masters that are still alive care about it.
Ahh I see, thanks for clarifying what killing all 7 servants does!
And yes to see Archer give a nod of respect to Tokiomi because he'd planned to force Archer to commit suicide this whole time.. really speaks to the lengths to which Archer will go to be entertained. It matters not the form, as long as it's shiny.
Things have drastically picked up speed, there was a lot of time spent on the preparation and setup, but the "second act" seems to be in full force and people are dropping like flies. Speaking of, we've heard about and seen glimpses of Kiritsugu's methods before, like blowing up that building and his first confrontation with Kayneth, but wow, the brutality of his utilitarian philosophy is on full display here. I really appreciate how balanced Fate/Zero is in its showing of Deontology vs Consequentialism. It really isn't super clear if Saber is more right than Kiritsugu or vice-versa. What are the logical consequences of these two ideologies? Saber seems to be indirectly willing to sacrifice the whole world for her sense of honor, I mean, what else could you call voluntarily fighting one-handed when saving her entire country from destruction is supposedly at stake? It borders on insanity. Kiritsugu, inversely, seems willing to sacrifice the entire world in order to save it, as obviously contradictory as that is. There is nothing he isn't willing to do, no evil he isn't willing to bear if it means saving lives. Both endpoints, if taken to their extreme logical endpoints become self-defeating. So, who's right? It's very hard to say, and imo, as the show keeps poking and prodding at both of their philosophies, it only becomes less and less clear.
On a related note, it's interesting that you noted the difference in tone between Kayneth and Lancer's deaths compared to Caster and Ryuunosuke's. Granted, Lancer's death was particularly tragic, but was there really such a difference between Kayneth and Ryuunosuke? Their deaths are almost mirror images, they both get sniped from far away and live for a couple of seconds before getting finished off. I'd argue there is a difference: perspective. It's curious that Kayneth dies horrifically just moments after we see him at his most human. He sacrifices his own aspirations and dreams out of love for someone who doesn't even love him back, it's almost touching, just to get his insides turned into minced meat as a reward. Ryuunosuke on the other hand, sees beauty in death. In his twisted theology, God made everyone for his own amusement, cruelty, sin, and virtue are all equally important parts of a good entertaining story, so he gets a beautiful grand finale, his final "COOL". It's easy to think Fate/Zero enjoys cruelly punishing and toying with the good and gives the evil absolution, but I'd argue the causality is backwards. It's not that the universe is uniquely hostile to those with honor and ideals, it's simply uncaring and indifferent, it's just that those who expect anything more than that are uniquely set to suffer in the face of the indifference. From this perspective, both Kiritsugu's cold utilitarianism and Saber's noble sense of honor are no longer that far apart, they're both, at their core, attempts to carry a burden too great for anyone, to change the fundamental nature of the world.
'... as the show keeps poking and prodding at both of their philosophies, it only becomes less and less clear.' YEPP. Whenever I try to think through Kiri's and Saber's positions, I find myself see-sawing, seeing flaws and reason in both. It doesn't help that their actions sometimes belie their stated positions - as you pointed out, Saber refused to use her left hand and risked defeat even when the Grail (and by extension her wish for the salvation of Britain) was at stake, showing she too is susceptible to extreme means, while Kiri acknowledges the usefulness of 'just/noble conduct' in war when he emptied the building of innocent people first before blowing it up. And now after reading your comment I'm looking at my notes and seeing things from another possible angle. gahhh (but it's great haha)
Also excellent points about how it's perspective of death that matters, not so much the 'manner' of death. Yeah Ryuunosuke was always going to embrace blood and guts death - I suppose for him, a fate that would be on par with the horribleness of Kayneth's end (in the sense that he loses everything he ever wanted) would be... life. A boring life where he is prevented from experiencing any of the 'entertainment' of life or death. Just mediocrity, for eternity (or maybe something like solitary confinement until the end of his days). Hmm.
Lancer's death is even more tragic when you think about it. In his past life he falls in love with the woman betrothed to his Master and ends up getting them both killed. Everything he does as a Servant is to restore his honour by serving his new master. He doesn't speak up as Kayneth hurls abuse at him, he does everything he's ordered even if it goes against his preferences, he follows every part of the knightly code of honour. Only for, in a cruel twist of Fate, everything to repeat itself, his mole causes Sola-Ui to fall in love with him and betray Kayneth, setting up the sequence of events that eventually leads to him getting betrayed and killed at the hands of his own master in the most humiliating way possible
exactly, he's been dismissive towards Sola Ui the whole time hoping not to repeat his past mistake only for it to fail miserably
You're right - I actually think Lancer pips everyone else to take out the 'Most Tragic' character award in FZ, especially if we're going by how comparatively little to no choice he has in his fate.
I've been waiting so long for this! I'm so happy to see you are back with more Fate/Zero.
To clarify, there is no magic in the summoning itself that prevents a servant from killing their master aside from their need for mana to exist.
The archer class and a few exceptions have a trait called independent action that allows them to exist without a mana source longer.
Interesting when you mention Ghilles not getting unpunished, he appears again in the mobile game who is more like a visual novel and does get to meat Jeanne again.
I think rider's main problem with Saber isn't even her selflessness it's mainly the regret that she has bc he views it as disrespectful to the soldiers that fought for them, especially her wish.
Oh, how I was waiting for you to see those episodes. That's *the* stuff.
First a word on the recap, particularly the Gilles/Ryuunosuke scene: while you're on point with the general vibe of "peaceful" or rather satisfying (from their POV) resolution, I feel there's also an element of their final moments making them realise all their lives they were looking in the wrong places.
It's clearer in the book, where Ryuunosuke's reaction to seeing his own blood and guts spill out is more direct -- he exclaims that's the sight of "truest red, one he could've never hoped to find in others", more "beautiful" and "vibrant" than anything he experienced through his crimes. It leaves a massive space for interpretation -- is that a twisted yet childish marvel at the beauty of life, or maybe a grim realisation that harming himself, not others, was supposed to be the actual source of his cruel satisfaction and he completely misread his own twisted desires? (Which makes for an interesting connection with Kirei.)
It's simpler with Gilles -- the vision of Jeanne in her infinite faith, forgiveness and acceptance of whatever life threw at her probably makes him realise he was terribly wrong to stray off the righteous path. Her faith never wavered (no pun intended) despite everything, so how could he lose it and commit those atrocities? Hence why that "What have I done?". (Side-note: from elsewhere we know Caster has a very different ideal image of Jeanne in his mind -- disillusioned, vengeful, broken. A reminder of her never truly giving into such corruption must have been like hitting a dusty yet much needed reset button in his head.)
Now onto the meaty part, the new episodes. Have to say I appreciate your lively reaction to Kerry doing Kerry things -- just as it should've been :D
Diarmuid might quietly be one of the most tragic characters, honestly -- misunderstood, mistreated, trampled upon from every side. Kayneth's end was quite awful and miserable, but I can't help a feeling of satisfaction when I remember how horrible he was towards "new-ager" Waver. Here we circle back to the mage aristocracy discussion -- old bloodline, incredible talent and a legendary Mystic Code meant nothing in the hands of condescending douchebag. He's dead, while the mediocre kid with inferiority complex lives. Sure, luck and not being recognized as a major target by Kerry helped, but treating his Servant with actual respect played its part too.
The discussion. As you've said, both sides make good, relatable points here. I'm leaning towards Kiritsugu, ever so slightly -- I see Saber's point about "taking a life, as a human act, needing to follow laws", but I also can't help but feel the absurdity of the phrase "taking life -- a human act". There's nothing humane about killing. I'm all for Geneva Conventions and such, but at the same time I always felt there's something deeply unsettling and absurd about humans sitting down and collectively deciding "okay, so this is how we'll lawfully massacre each other from now on". That feeling grows ever stronger each time you look around the world and realise the powerful aggressors rarely if ever care about such rules anyway and it's only the attacked ones who have to follow them so they don't lose the moral upperhand.
Anyway, ultimately I feel a massive part of the friction between Saber and Kerry comes from the fact they're not really talking, but lashing out at images and preconceptions of one another they've built in their heads. Maybe Kiritsugu would've seen things differently if he knew Saber carried her way-too-heavy burden all alone the same way he's willing to. And I'm sure Saber would've approached him differently had she ever got to see him break down and open up like he did in front of Iri.
There's also room for speculation with how much Saber really knows about modern world and warfare -- my personal feeling is if she got to see the scale of bloodshed, scenes like exploitation of child soldiers, or even if she realised nowdays there's no honorable kings and knights, just wealthy guys in suits sending the country's youth into certain death from the safety of their offices, there's a good chance she'd arrive at a conclusion much closer to Kiritsugu.
That scene is also crucial in terms of certain keywords and foreshadowing. "Champion of justice" and "all that is evil in this world" are two phrases you're certainly going to hear again.
Onto our beloved priest -- you're probably giving Kirei too much credit with attributing him all those grudges against Risei and Tokiomi. I mean, yeah, these would be perfectly justified, but that's not it. He's just that empty and that sociopathic -- "wish I was the one to kill them" is simply the only emotion towards others he can find in himself. Not to get some kind of revenge, just to enjoy their suffering first-hand. It appears it's the first thing he's ever actually *felt*. That's why Kiritsugu is so puzzling to him. The professional killer, a husk of a man who was supposed to be just like him, has those deep personal connections with Iri and Maaya, goals, determination. To Kirei these are alien concepts. That man has never liked, nevermind loved or hated anything in his life. Until Gilgamesh introduced him to the simple joy of watching people suffer and die, of course.
Grail lore time: basically, the Holy Grail divides into two components. Simplifying, the Greater Grail is the big thing all those mages aim to summon and sustain. But to fully work, it requires a "core" -- the Lesser Grail, which collects the souls of defeated Heroic Spirits (ie. massive sources of magical energy), in order to fuel the big one. Irisviel is the Lesser Grail -- hence why the more Servants fall, the weaker she gets, as her primary role takes the lead and maintaining human traits gets more difficult / less important from the plan's perspective.
As for Servants' souls, Kirei tells the truth, but not the entirety of it. Whether he manipulates Gil or that's the knowledge he's got, that's open to interpretation. All 7 Servants' souls are required to enable the very specific function of opening a path to the Root. If the Master doesn't chase the Root and just wants a simpler wish granted, 6 souls is enough -- the Grail is basically a truckload of magical energy, making normally impossible spells possible. And yeah, in the second scenario it's technically possible for both Master and Servant to get their wishes. If the Master does want to reach the Root, however -- well, tough luck, the Servant is absolutely getting bamboozled.
14:13 I think that considering Archer to be interested in all art, from the pristine to the perverse, then his fascination with Kirei makes more sense. Tokiomi already has his own style, traditional and set in his ways. On the other hand, Kirei is still trying to discover his style. He is a blank canvas, which Gilgamesh finds more interesting to watch develop.
Also, what I like about these episodes is that no one's perspective is wrong per se. Kiritsugu is cynical almost to the core but retains the hopefulness that some miracle can save humanity. Saber tries to lead by example, hoping that extolling chivalry and etiquette will provide a good path for others to follow.
Ahh thinking about Archer's fascination with Kirei from an artist's perspective is interesting, thank you! And yes, what I've found most difficult and most entertaining has been to consider the issues from all sides, and not come out with a straightforward 'right' perspective.
Fate reaction enjoyers eating good recently
Great to see you back again!
can't wait for the succeeding episodes! ♥
I love these episodes, and the next set so much! They get at what I personally find to be the core of the show Fate/Stay Night idealism/realism and all the various forms that outlook can take.
I find Saber in all her Knightly chivalry and honor is actually the more realist approach. Wars of liberation, wars of tyranny, wars of greed, wars of ideology, such things will happen in her world view and she is fighting an eternal conflict to make these events noble, good, and civil. Once again an impossible burden she places upon herself. Its mitigation is a still a just cause and has outright historically proven to be a net positive. Saber is team: ‘War Crimes are bad’, you can’t really root against that.
Kiritsuge takes it the opposite angle though, that a war still happened. People still died, people still killed, and even with you trying to mitigate it. Doing so just makes you a role model for others to follow. The tools and methods of war still remain. My read is that Kiritsugu very much knows his actions could perpetuate the cycle, which is why he is so coldly efficient about cleaning up loose ties. This isn't always killing. I think it's important to look at Kiritsugu's *other* time we see him operate. When he blew up a whole hotel to kill Kayneth towards the beginning of the show. Kiritsugu went out of his way to trip the alarm and evacuate the building to minimize casualties, and he knew Kayneth would stay as a proper mage. In another situation he might have blown up the whole thing killing everyone if that was his only choice, but he clearly thought of an alternative and did that. So Kiritsug very much believes there is no good in war and killing and is coldly efficient about it, but not wanton or being excessive about the killing. He is about minimizing killing and violence on all fronts, one great evil is less then many or a prolonged evil. Everything he does though kind of falls apart and becomes kinda hypocritical if an end to it doesn’t exist. Which is why he takes this “I am a monster and a savior” stance simultaneously. He wants to end the cycle and now is pursuing the grail in order to get that impossible miracle.
Irisviel is putting in some serious communication work to make her throuple not fall apart, we all need to wish her the best!
'Saber is team: ‘War Crimes are bad’, you can’t really root against that.' lol yep!
It's actually fascinating that Saber's view could be seen as the more realistic one, you're right. Humans are gonna human, so unless Kiritsugu plans to get rid of every single one of them (hmm Lancer's curse on the Grail wish looks increasingly worrying - assuming Kiritsugu wins and wishes for an end to all war, the Grail might grant it in a way he didn't intend it to..), his dream of ending conflict forever appears equally out of reach.
Great point about Kiri knowing the need for restraint where possible, despite his extreme beliefs and his propensity to take what Saber sees as 'dishonourable' actions. I can't help but feel he and Saber have more common ground than they acknowledge.
i kinda hope there is a part 2 to your K-ON! music reaction cuz the character songs even
Ui, Jun, and Nadoka have some
and the 5 main girls have a lot to choose from
( Ohayou, Mata Ashita ) and Houkago Tea Time as 2 songs where all 5 sing
and then
Yui Hirasawa - Gīta ni Kubittake
Mio Akiyama - Heart Goes Boom!!
Ritsu Tainaka - Girly Storm Shissou Stick
Tsumugi Kotobuki - Dear My Keys ~Kenban no Mahou~
Azusa Nakano - Over the Starlight
And Ui, Jun and Nadoka have songs too
Fr, I've been waiting for months to the point that i rewatch the video 5 times already
@@jeanpierrepolnareff1714 same
one day ill get her to watch Syphogear another music anime with Mio's VA having a role in it starting in season 2
the lead is voiced by Aoi Yuki the person who does Tanya the Evil
@@phantomvaporeon5596 i actually haven't watch that either, I'll watch that someday
Yay this is back :D
LETS GO. My wish has been granted. More Fate
Oh! A great post-Thanksgiving, Black Friday Sale, anime reaction! :)
Episode 3:
Wow. For as much as I thought the battles vs Caster crawled forward at too slow a pace in the last episodes, this episode was stuffed full of important happenings. Kayneth really should have given up when he had the chance. He of all people should have known what a Holy Grail War entailed. Namely, the killing of servants and masters. He was one of the few outside the three main magic families to know of the war and its history, yet he continued on.
As to the argument between Saber and Kiritsugu, we need to peel back a layer here. Kiritsugu can only justify his actions as being in the right because he believes he is a final martyr who has one chance to end all mankind's suffering thanks to the Holy Grail. Without that magical, wish granting trump card, and the promise of it all having been worth it, there's no way Kiritsugu would engage in this kind of total bloody warfare.
Of course, Saber is also right, just in a more practical manner. As someone who did not have this luxury of a magical get out of jail free card, she used rules and order to at least bend the horrors of war towards the greater good. Saber talks about a champion of justice, in the English voice track it comes across as hero of justice but same thing, that term is important. Hero of Justice is more than just being a good person. It's a theme that will be expanded on and is a central point of the other Fate shows, as well.
Who is right? Kiritsugu or Arutoria? Both and neither, of course. Each has valid points. It's tempting to choose Saber because she only kills for the greater good, but Kiritsugu is really the same. He isn't killing for the sake of evil. The greater good is kinda eliminated as a factor. So, while I do choose Saber because I like her ideals better, my choice really comes down to not having a Holy Grail that can permanently save the world. If such a thing really existed then maybe Kiritsugu is the better choice.
Not as much to say about Episode 4. It was a long time coming.
Final note: The next two episodes are perhaps my favorite in the series and really should be watched back to back. I think you'll really enjoy them.
Ahh finally getting back to this!
I relate to the basic analysis of, 'Kiritsugu is somewhat justified, but Saber is also right, but both are also wrong but gahhhhh'
appreciate the comments as always!
Strongly in Kiritsugu's side. War must be prevented almost at all cost, but one started it must be wage with little restraint.
I envy your ease of decision when it comes to the Kiritsugu vs Saber debate!
Kiritsugu Emiya is a hypocrite of the highest order. He belittles Saber, yet rationalizes the mountain of corpses he stands atop as necessary. He believes himself grounded, a holder of truths forged by his experiences. And yet he is beguiled by the Grail, when all his experience should be warning him.
And not all wars are for selfish reasons. The oppressed shedding blood for their freedoms, for instance.
Hey careful there.....some people does not like being told the truth about their favorite character's this direct in the face😅
Yes the more I thought about it, the more Kiri's criticism of Saber is hypocritical - he looks down on her for 'romanticising' war when he himself holds onto probably one of the most romanticised dreams of all, ending all human conflict.