There are more reasons for me to consider switching back to AMD outside of what was stated in the video. My viewers want a follow up to the AM5 video series. The LGA 1700 socket is now dead. AM5 still has life left in it. But what do you think? GET DISCORD ACCESS FOR ONLY $1: www.patreon.com/ErockOnTech Follow me on Twitter: twitter.com/ErockOnTech
i think that windows is the problem with both amd and intel. i am on the 1600 af and won't be upgrading until next year sometime (for windows 10's end of life). i believe that most of the problems are more software than hardware when it comes to pc problems today. for the longest time i'd have to roll back amd drivers in the games i played because they were only worried about intel and nvidia, that finally went away when amd started to catch and pass intel, but i still think that programs and os are the problems now.
@@ErockOnTech i don't even think it's bloat. 2 different chiplet designs and ways to do the same thing are hard to keep from conflicting in an os that's as bad as windows is becoming. then add in the fact that they wanted to charge you for using windows and are going to after october of next year. i don't think they have the manpower to keep writing the patches that don't screw with the other cpu.
With both systems (until I got the Z790 Apex Encore) XMP didn't just work without manually increasing the voltage OR lowering the frequency. Very strange but possibly why you had some RAM instability there.SA voltage also can came these things a bit wonky when off or set to auto (I run 1.25V on Intel and like 1.27-1.3V on AMD)
Capitalism is two parties making a mutually agreed upon bargain where both parties are pleased. They don't have to be your friend. Do you have to be their friend? Things like customer support and reliability are mutually beneficial if they win your long term endorsement and word of mouth. Yes they want to make money and yes you want the best product at the lowest price. Nothing wrong with that.
this is so true i was a fan of one specific brand in my country once but after my component broke and I sent it to them they won't fix it for me cuz it had rust on Backplate and it wasn't in an Agreement either
@@cppctek yeah, and doing some tuning on XTU is quite easy, I limited my 12600k to 125W, which with UV gets me the same results as 180W stock. But my favourite setting is 95W (always with UV, somewhat close to the highest point in the perf/W curve), performing virtually the same in gaming (P cores can still hit 4.7GHz) and loosing about 6% perf. in multi thread compared to 180W stock.
who cares? better yet why do you care? if you have a sufficient power supply and sufficient cooling..why does it matter? 🤷🏿♂️ I genuinely want to know why people hype power draw(real world use not full load benchmark power draw)
Personally I would game on the 7800x3d. I can definitely say AM5 really is in a good position now because just a lil over a month ago, I built my 2nd pc after stepping out of the pc space for over 2 years and was able to configure all my bios settings, drivers, EXPO without any problems. I went in blind and bought the 7700x and 4070 Ti Super, built it, and here I am chillin. The boot times were horrible before a BIOS update though lmao.
Thank you for the high quality content, it's because of you that I was able to watch the video start to finish on the pc that your videos helped create.
@@BreadAndGatorade Might need a BIOS update, or your startup apps might be making your PC boot time long. Before a Bios update my PC took like 1m 30s to boot, but after BIOS update and turning off some apps on startup, my PC boots in like 10-15 seconds now.
Stop chasing the ultimate. It really is a pointless, never ending, and unsatisfying effort. Instead, learn to be happy with gear that meets your needs.
Hey great video man and I appreciate the shout out!. These kinds of videos are awesome because they really give a good insight on what its actually like to use the product on a day-to-day basis. While the results and data from mainstream reviewers or large reviews sites are helpful, (fps figures, render times) they don't tell the full story. I hear Intel has actually launched an investigation on a lot of these issues as well as the crashing issues many users have reported. There are just so many variables involved these days and with these processors having so many built-in OC and power saving features, it's going to be hard to narrow it down to a single cause. It's just so intriguing to see how much the experiences can vary with these new platforms. I'm personally thinking one of the major culprits is DDR5 regardless of whether you're on AM5 or LGA1700. Ever since DDR5 became mainstream I've seen so many people having issues with system stability and a lot of it going back to their ram not being stable even at XMP/EXPO. Furthermore the motherboard manufacturers don't appear to be on the same page, and I think the onus is on Intel/AMD to roll out stricter guidelines for their partners. I'm not saying they should completely restrict them or take away tweaking options, but for those that don't want to mess around and want their system to work out of the box, they should have that assurance. I feel like we're regressing back to the early days of PC building where hardly anything worked out of the box, and overclocking/tweaking was a necessity if you wanted to get your system to work right. It's 2024, the end user shouldn't have to go through with that and I say this as someone who will sit there for hours messing around with ram timings. At the end of the day finding what works best for you and what makes you the happiest is all that matters. If you want a suggestion on which system you should use as your daily and which one you want to use a test bench, my advice would be to use the system that give you the LEAST amount of problems as your personal rig. So that way you can ensure you've got maximum up-time and can roll through your projects rather than waste time on trouble shooting.
Thank you! Hey man no problem at all. I appreciate you taking time to try and help me. I also appreciate the conversations we’ve had. You make good content. I have no problem helping other people find you. For my system, that’s a perfect suggestion! Thank you. I’m going to try AM5 again as my main. I’ll report my experience in a later video. You’re definitely right about the full story on product reviews. Sometimes the long term user experience is missing. That is so beneficial when someone is looking to buy a product 5-6 months after launch for example. You may be correct about the DDR5. That makes a lot of sense and honestly the thought has crossed my mind. Do we know of any reports with intel latency on a DDR4 system? That could be worth looking into actually.
When it comes to Fanboys I feel the AMD fanboyss are louder and more aggresive. Intel fanboys are generally more helpfull. On your latency have you tried another motherboard. You said you got yours at a crazy price and that could be for a reason. When it comes to space heater comments this is a thing AMD fanboys go quiet about their own choice of system. With Intel its easy to undervolt and overclock. My 13700k runs all cores at 5.2 and e cores at 4.3 and my temp doesent go above mid 70 degrees in cinebench. Under gaming it only hits 50 degree. AM5 goes upto 95 degrees and uses more power at idle. At low to mid range you cant beat Intel. 12100f for under £100, 12400f for £130 and recently 12700k for £200 in a sale. Motherboards are also only £100 for non z boards, and you cam save money by using z690 over z790.
Just a little bit of info, are you using lian li fans or the l connect software by any chance? I was getting alot of stuttering and latency problems on my 7800x3d rig and it turned out the culprit was l-connect. Like you I spent many months trying to resolve the problem until I found an old redit post mentioning the same thing for other users. Since I stop l connect running in the back ground now once my fan profiles etc have loaded on boot I have had 0 latency issues.
I was talked into leaving my AMD 7 for the new Intel 9. SMH ... Everything seems like it's hangs up. Like I click file explorer or unreal engine and it takes seconds to pop up. like hummmm....... So on July 31s I'm giving this to my kid and switching back lol. Nothing like her having an Intel I9 14900k for Roblox. Lol 😂😅
Haha that’s a wise plan. I’m sorry you had issues like me. That’s unfortunate. But I just released a new video this morning discussing the current state of AM5. Spoiler alert: it’s much better than the current state of Intel.
I remember your videos regarding your AM5 issues when I was researching building a new PC using AM5. I saw two videos (I can't remember the people who posted them) in which one said to wait (from the time the video was posted) 6 to 8 months before ordering the motherboard I had my eye on. The reason was to give the entire AM5 platform to "settle down." I ordered my components except for the motherboard and RAM. I followed that advice. The second video suggested to install everything vanilla. No CPU over clocks, no RAM over clocks.... Default only. This person even said that if your CPU has integrated graphics: don't install a dedicated GPU yet or even a second NVME. I did that.... Basic hardware hooked up, installed Windows 11 Pro, and then let the system set for a day: just run in a basic mode. After that, I installed the GPU and second NVME and started the system. After about 2 minutes of nail biting: the system booted. Again, as suggested: I used the system doing mundane stuff. Windows & driver updates, watched a few YT videos, and played a few hands of Solitaire. The third day I enable PBO and the memory OC. After a 30 second wait: Windows loaded. That was in January of this year. Now, I can shut my AM5 system off and when I turn it back on: it's less that 20 seconds before Windows login appears. Yes: that was a lot of waiting. No, I don't know for sure if those reasons are why my AM5 system has been wonderful. All I know is that sometimes, being first is not always a good thing. Running components in "vanilla mode" allowed me to become more comfortable with the AM5 boot procedures and I didn't have any issues. Granted that could have just been luck or a "golden" CPU; but, my AM5 system has been rock solid. Give AM5 another chance. You might like it. If not, you still have Intel. It would be a win win either way.
Actually with Win11 pushing so much AI. Having the AM5 platform so new back then, this was GREAT advice !! As others have said ,Asus does push boundaries on their MB’s. Quality control not so good anymore ( 10 yrs ago they were 3-5x better, I’m oldER :) I had to fully take off Asus’s Armoury Crate software on i9-12900H ROG laptop since made it way slower than a i5 12th Gen, crazy. However, I think it is Great advice now with the Win11 AI push. Hell, when I try to put I, autocorrect usually inputs ai now, just like after However in this paragraph !!
@@sbme1147 I use OpenRGB for the RGB controls. ArmoryCrate same bloat issues 12900K, so I'm better off not using it and making sure it doesn't install when possible.
Intel has a problem... More crashing and stability issues for new CPUs I am so lucky that i stopt using Intel after 30 years and running a AMD CPU . 3800X3D 😂
Great video Erock. Honestly I FEEL your frustration on this.I spent months replacing parts, testing customer machines etc. Just like you mentioned not being a hardware engineer, same here man... we shouldn't even be diving that deep into settings for a stable machine. I think a lot of it has to do with different manufacturers, for an example ASUS really pushes their motherboards out of the box (kinda in a bad way IMO) so if you get a board that really pushes it and a chip that's slightly unstable or has some issues, you'll end up with a stuttery mess. I personally found that high core count i7s and i9s seemed to be way more "stuttery" but again my sample size is small. I will mention the 3rd part I had made that you featured here (my fault for not making a proper follow up) I had some good luck with it for a while but eventually I did have issues again unfortunately. Ultimately I end up switching over to an ASRock Aqua z690 (went backwards from z790) and my stability has improved tremendously. I don't have enough data to say that it's 1 vs the other company, I will still get occasional stuttering, but it's a 10th of what it was on the Asus board. If I was to guess, I have kinda a bum chip, and my older Asus board wasn't playing nice with it, even after undervolts, disabling xmp, you know... all the things! Haha. I appreciate you having the guts to point this out. Super honest video and I hope people see that. 🫡
Thank you man for the kind words! Also, thank you for your work on this issue and sharing it with me and everyone else. I appreciate your time on trying to help me with this issue. Sometimes problems just can't be fixed I guess. Other people are reporting no issues and honestly I am happy for them. If someone builds an Intel rig, it's not cheap. They deserve a stable and snappy system. But that doesn't invalidate our experiences. Other people in the comments here suggest switching my board out. Some say it just needs to be a Z790 instead of a Z690. Others say it needs to be a non Asus board. As you can see, the suggestions are all over the place. No one really knows how to fix it. Back to AMD I go I suppose! New video incoming!
@@ErockOnTech I would be interesting to throw the I9 on some basic level board that can support it (vrms) that is not Asus, just to see if your experience changes at all.
I have/had a 790 hero with 14900k. Could game well, but as soon as I tried working with live audio it couldn't cope. Latencymon showed lots of issues. Never got to the bottom of it. Also if left on downloading or idle (not under load) it would bsod or crash and I'd find it with the CPU super hot and unable to boot. The company I used to make were great though and have accepted a return. Just trying to work out what to do now. My old system is fine though, but getting creaky.
Yeah this is pretty crazy. I used to do desktop support and in my 12 years of doing it for a large multi thousand seat company I only had 1 CPU failure (only one app crashed when performing a task, stress tests and diagnostics passed) I replaced everything and was going to rip my hair out, then I replaced the CPU and it was fixed! I guess office PC's are run WAY more conservatively. I killed one of my cpu's overvolting it a long time ago.
@@ErockOnTech yeah, this wasn't modern tech, I left in 18 right before covid. If I recall the bad CPU was a P4 in an IBM desktop. I bet the company is having a lot more CPU issues now, they seem much more delicate.
Only if you fall for the anti Intel hype -- and blind to the flop of AMD's launch. AMD is always sketchy. I am not a fan nor foe of Intel, but much like the youth of today - I learned the hard way the truth about AMD. Most people don't go to Intel and Nivida out of love or childish ideation - they do it because they are, over all, the superior offerings. Boys may play with their toys but men have to get work done. Businesses, rank and file, family feeding companies can't take the risk with low-end tools. Computers are tools not toys. With that said, AMD pretty much operates in the gaming niche. For that purpose, they might be better for the buck.
I've had my fights with AM5 as well, when my MAG X670E refused to work with my DDR5-6000 kit. Had to enter all timing values manually to get it to run stable. Never had issues outside of it. If AMD fixes the IMC issue with the next generation, then they will be in a much better position in terms of memory compatibility.
I don't find Intel or AMD has a significant strength advantage in anything, Intel has slightly better single core performance, AMD has slightly better multicore performance. I've not noticed a significant strength to either processor in heavy loads, but Intel uses a _lot_ more power on average.
The 600K parts are fantastic processors to recommend for those doing gaming & some productivity (those E-cores are handy for such tasks). On the other hand, for exclusively gaming the AMD X3D parts are very difficult NOT to consider (even those on AM4 if you're on a more strict budget).
intel for productivity and some gaming. amd for gaming and and a some productivity. intel’s the better all rounder if you plan on taking any classes in the next few years. 7800x3d is a great cpu for gaming but you should also consider the games you’re playing. 7800x3d playing world of warships and Fortnite is overkill. build a budget 13600k, 14600k build wait a few years for something better? 7800x3d is more future proof but the platform is more expensive for initial cost. At the moment it’s probably amd but intels prices are pretty hard to beat even though it’s a dead platform.
Well looks like I should stick to 5800x3D for little longer. My last Intel was 4770 and I had no issues. I am so ready to get 14900k but this video made me pause and do more research.
Thanks for the shoutout! It’s always great to hear your experiences. It’s key for everyone to be nice and to remember everyone can have a wildly different experience. So many combinations of hardware, software and settings. So many variables and intel can often get a bad wrap also for the power draw. These motherboard enabled with xmp without setting manual power limits or enforcing the intel stock limits will result in massive power draw. Dropping 7200 to 7000 def is par for the course for me too. I run xmp tweaked + manual 252w pl1 and pl2 limits and my r23 scores are the same as stock but my temps when benchmarking never touch those same numbers it use too. I totally believe you with the latency and random stutters. It’s a known issue. I’ve had some success with eliminating it on mine and my wife’s but it doesn’t always work for everyone forever. It’s a very elusive issue. It’s not a skill issue for sure because some just can’t get it fixed. I have a friend who’s got an am5 system though where he just started expecting it. I haven’t checked it out yet but yeah Thank you so much for the shoutout. If you’d like I’m still down to chat with ya this week and remote in or do a video call and let’s fafo with some tweaks I use and maybe just maybe there’s hope. Also downgrading to w10 isn’t the best either. If you can give me a shot this week we may can get this better for ya. ❤
Yeah man I’m still open to working with you later this week. Just let me know. I appreciate the time you have already given me. Thank you for the kind words. I really appreciate it!
@@ErockOnTech The 13th generation heats up rapidly, leading to potential throttling and lag without adequate cooling. I installed T30 fans on my radiator to mitigate this issue. Achieving stability with XMP took nearly four months of collaboration with MSI and experimenting with developer BIOS versions, proving to be largely unproductive. However, the mouse lag appears to be an operating system or application-related problem. To address it, I typically opt for a quick Windows reinstallation, which takes approximately 10 minutes, followed by a few additional hours to set up my applications, thus avoiding prolonged troubleshooting efforts.
It reminds me of AMD's usb issues on am4 witch still works fine sometimes and boom it acts bad again until i reboot the system or reset the bios ,and yes my x570 tomahawk wifi bios is up to date. scheduling with multicore used to be an issue when it came out so with e-cores in the mix i was waiting this kind of issue to pop up someday and here it is . disable this, change that , enable this, this auto setting is too high i didn't want to split hairs over this so i replaced my 3600 by a 5800x and shout out to amd that got it replaced quickly because my first one was bad , not doa but just very bad and it works flawlessly since i got it. i never had much luck with intel i dont want a fight to apply changes i want and unfortunately intel does not always let you do so easily because to change one setting you have to change a bunch of them sometimes and here comes in the headache . with amd things are a bit more obvious , it tells you what dependencies for the setting you need to change are and most can be let to auto while intel you still have to do some manual input and probably lots of tuning . manual point and shoot of issues or settings is always a problem because sometimes its a shot in the dark. prebuilt pc's like DELL and ACER may not be the best but for the same cpu you will notice that those system works flawlessly because they do not go out of specs so results will be a bit lower for performance but it will more reliable none the less. i only regret that most of these won't have a xmp/expo setting unless you put the price for it with a high end system . reminds me of paying for options when you buy a car , sometimes to get a feature you want you have to pay an extra for lots of stuff you do not need/want but it is how it works so no choice there. for the reinstall of windows i would do a clean install then image the system drive so i have a fully working state to simply use in case i ever need to so all my programs are there whenever i restore windows . Acronis and many others have good softwares for this but Acronis is one i never had any issues with .just make an image backup of the system without any RGB software and you are good to go in a few clicks and a few minutes instead of hours if anything happens .
I was jealous of your backdrop for a long time, I just realized that the backdrop looks different now. Now I'm more jealous than before 🤦 Love the clean look!
Think it’s the $250 dollar motherboard it’s cheaper for a reason I have a 650 dollar Asus apex encore motherboard and have not experienced the latency issue 🎉but it’s going to cost you 😂
the extremist booting time of gen7 amd cpus is the most horrible retardness i ever experience in pc's. I don't say Intel is perfect but Jeezus imagine in 2024 building a 2000$ pc and your pc cannot boot in within 30 sec - 60 sec loool wtf amd am5 is just unusable. I just bought a 12900k im waiting for 5090 to make my build, i know that you are better with 12 gen then 13 and 14 , i am mainly video playing, in 4k . my current system is a 11900k, i'm not a pro in pc or anyting but for me 100% of the time i use a Intel system, its shit to say it but its true, it's just work. But i have some reserve for 13/14 gen i see to much of instability weirdness in a lot of video about those cpus, energy usage, temperature etc etc 12 gen system is seriously just magnificiant with ddr5 is just the most quick pc u can build i build 2 12700k system pc for friends and im jaleous of their pc's. also pcie gen 5 unlock fully ethernet speed etc etc , its just quick AF. So i can't wait to have the rtx 5090 to build my 12900k system
I guess your issue wasn't with the Intel CPU, the problem could be with your motherboard. It was wired you bought it 250$! I guess the motherboard has a problem, so Newegg sold it at that price! Change the motherboard and then test your 14900K CPU
On AM5 had issues with my system the am5 series helped me find out that my ram at 6000 was the issue currently running stable at 6000 and improved performance by tuning the voltages and subtimings. Try tuning the ram on am5 might help stability
Damn dude, you've got a lot of disposable income. edit: for some reason, your intel issue was power saving. I am not going to go into it, but I fixed those by swapping motherboards. I also stay away from Asus but this is not unique to them, it's more to do with expensive motherboards and all of their extra features. For instance, there could be a "thing" you are not even using but is not a 100% and causes IRQ/DMI issues. Good policy is to just straight disable everything you are not using, even the SATA ports.
I am new to this whole pc build. I am still buying components. So far two cases, a qube 500 and an ASUS ap201 prime mesh. Just bought an i5 14600KF and an ASUS strix z790h. So far, intel seems to be more expensive on motherboard and CPU but still learning.
Your going down a Rabbit Hole with thinking it's the Chip that's causing the Latency Issues. I've had the 13900K, 14900K, and now I'm running the 14900KS paired with the Z790 Apex and 8000 speed RAM. No Latency, or studdering Issues at all. Sounds more like driver issues to me when the problems are Mouse or some other peripheral hardware. Honestly, it's definitely not the Chip. Very Important, don't rely on some Software to check for drivers for all your hardware. Make a list from the Device Manager of everything that you can go to the manufacturers website and go there and compare your drivers to what they say you should have. I found out the hard way about that and had incompatibility issues many times and had the wrong drivers installed. Also make sure you plug your mouse into the fastest USB port available on the IO. I use the Red USB Port, it's faster than the Blue. Hope you can figure it out before you go swapping Stuff around.
Doesn't sound like you had anything long enough to start seeing the instability issues. These chips don't seem to have a problem out of the box, they're degrading over time, and a LOT of people are reporting problems.
I had the 13700k and watched Danny’s videos on how to set it up and it was perfect, after some time a bios was released and I just kept getting constant bsod no matter the time, I tried so many things I just gave up and stopped playing. The 7950x3d went on sale and I decided to go with that over the 7800x3d because I do more than game and aside from the boot times it’s been great.
There are a specific set of bios option that can be flipped to improve Boot times on AM5. The main one is Memory Context Restore, as it speeds up subsequent memory training after the initial one when memory settings are changed. It tends to be in two different places, and seems to be best to enable in both places. At least in the Asus BIOS I know there is a search feature where searching "Context" the only relevant options tend to show up. Another change may need to be made to the 'Fast Boot' option in the Boot menu.
@@ErockOnTech ah no worries, I'm planning on using it for a SFF build for when I travel or use it for a DIY Nas, even though that seems kind of overkill, but I have it! Cant go wrong with the AM5, nor 13th gen but you get what I mean.
The interesting thing is that Intel has became what people hate about AMD CPUs back in the 2000s-2010s (high temp + power consumption), but those hardcore Intel fanboys kept on defending the brand by using excuses that hardcore AMD fanboys has been using before, haha. I love their hypocrisy. And to some extent, NVIDIA fanboys also did this just a generation ago when Radeon's 6000 series emits less heat + takes less power than RTX 3000 card equivalents.
Good video Erock documenting your experience. I've been a very early adopter of AM5 with the 7700X and now have had a 7800X 3D for some time as well. AM5 has come a long way since it's launch with fixes. I really like the 7800X 3D. It has awesome gaming performance and sips power.
And... You're correct. Some 13/14 gen chips have whats called the "SA bug" essentially they either freeze or slow down at higher system agent voltages. Now the issue? Asus loves to pump 1.3v VCCSA (system agent) by enabling your XMP profile.
The issue you're describing is potentially related to Intel's use of hybrid architectures in some of their newer processors, specifically those using a combination of Performance (P) cores and Efficiency (E) cores, like those seen in the Intel Alder Lake and newer series. This hybrid approach contrasts with AMD's current strategy, which predominantly relies on uniform cores in their Ryzen processors. Intel's Hybrid Architecture: Intel’s hybrid design, part of their newer generation CPUs, aims to optimize both power efficiency and performance by assigning different tasks to the most suitable type of core. P cores are designed for high-performance tasks that require more processing power, while E cores handle background tasks or less demanding processes to conserve energy. Potential Issues with Software Optimization: The effectiveness of Intel's hybrid architecture can partly depend on how well software and operating systems can utilize these different core types effectively. Windows 11, for example, introduced optimizations specifically designed to better allocate tasks between P and E cores. However, if the software or the OS isn’t fully optimized to handle this type of architecture, it could potentially lead to less efficient task distribution, which might manifest as lag or reduced performance in certain scenarios. AMD's Uniform Core Approach: AMD, on the other hand, uses a more traditional approach where all cores are performance-oriented, relying on their ability to efficiently handle both high-power and low-power tasks. This can lead to more predictable performance across different types of applications, especially in environments where the software might not be fully optimized for a hybrid core setup. ~My 2 cents.
running 7800x3d with 240mm, auto overclocking with 80C at max load; with 14700k or 14900k I would need a 360mm AIO and still get heat throttled from time to time unless I run at stock
Thanks for sharing. I was on intel (i7 920) for about a decade. Had no issues. Been on amd since ryzen though (3600, 5600, and soon to be 5700x3d) and its been great.
ruclips.net/video/ysU9mMj9g_Q/видео.html I have the stuttering problem too, but Intel 13600k processor Asus Z690 Plus D4 board Video card 6800xt, but checked also on 1080Ti, same thing there Windows 10
@@ErockOnTech Guys with luck.... It can't be bad for everyone either. Let me describe my experience with a 7800x3d and 6000 memory. When I bought and started the pc with xmp it gave me memory errors and it was working fine when I increased the voltage from 1.35 to 1.4, I updated the bios and the memory was working fine at 1.35, I thought let's tighten the subtimes and to my amazement now I have them all the subtimes very tight and without errors. Volt from 1.25 socket went to 1.2 volts, memories with xmp voltage and tight sub times for more than 6 months without problems. With memory tuning I saw drastic improvements in 0.1 fps. Hugs my friend and courage to face the fan boys
In hardware, power use is pure marketing nonsense, mostly propagated by nVidia. You'll find no significant savings on comparable hardware, sku for sku. (IE 14700k vs. 7800x3D, or RTX 4060 vs 7600xt). This even applies to high cost markets, you will not find any significant savings by choosing one brand over another. User settings are *_far_* more important in power use.
DCP latency is not necessarily a intel/amd problem. It's more likely a motherboard issue. I've had Amd cpus since FX series. Out of 8 different motherboard brands 4 were asus, 2 msi and 2 gigabyte. 3 out of the 4 asus boards (3 rog strix, 1 tuf) have struggled with DCP latency. Only Asus motherboards had this issue, even testing the same cpu. Doing some digging the issue originate somewhere between their usb chips and drivers. Disabling unused usb ports usually fixed or reduced the issues for me. There were other factors as well related to pci lanes and onboard audio that at one point had to be disabled on one of the boards that also made things a lot better
Hey Erock I appreciate this video and you are right there isnt much videos like this and it gives a perspective of trying something new and seeing if its better.
That was my goal! Yes, I noticed there was a big gap on RUclips for that type of content. I was genuinely curious what would happen if I switched. Sadly, all I learned is that both platforms are good at gaming and can have different issues in other categories. However, I am excited to switch back to AMD and see how that goes for me.
I would just sell 14900K. Kind of pointless to have a test system with more horse power than main system even though 7800X3D is better gaming, Its got far less CPU power and may be slower gaming than fast RAM 14900K assuming you can get it reliable lol. But hey 7800X3D system will be more reliable as 13th and 14th Gen high end has not been reliable and inconsistent stability more than just IMC from my experience. Though I kind of jumped back on Intel train thinking my own test system which I got a great deal on a 12600KF and DDR4 mobo plus RAM it felt kind of not to make sense to have a test system with more cores (Even if they are e-cores). And also Golden Cove clock normalized IPC almost on par or maybe 2% better than Zen 4. So ok 14th Gen should be more reliable right just enforce Intel stock limits. Nope was not and reports around suggest its worse. So returned stuff and went back to AMD. So went back to AMD and will just keep e-cores disabled on test system so my main system is 8 strong cores with the 3D cache and my test system is 6 strong cores with only DDR4. Who cares if clock normalized IPC is maybe 2% better per CInebench R23. It still has 2 less strong cores overall and clocked a bit lower anyways and using weaker only 3200 DDR4.
I have not. The only intel motherboards I have are both Asus. So you think if I use another brand, the issue will go away? What voltages were changed and what were the values?
Over the many years I used to build computers, I learned that not all CPU's or mother boards are created equal. I built two identical systems on the same day and one wouldn't run. I swapped the CPU's and they both ran a treat and lived long and productive service lives. Why wouldn't one CPU run in one mother board instead of the other... no one knows. The weirdest issue I had was a mother board that wouldn't run in a certain box. I switched the box and the MB ran a treat. Likewise, sometimes I had to use different settings to make the same build work right. In fact AMD used to specify the voltage on each CPU. I had two CPUs come out of the same tray, shipped on the same day with different listed voltages... well that was a long time ago... but it still applies. The fact is that some CPU's are just better than others, even if they both passed QC. Likewise true of mother boards. There's a reason why HP used to disable overclocking on some of their motherboards. They knew in some cases it would work and in other cases, it would lead to massive service headaches. As a software engineer, your code either runs or it doesn't. In the hardware world things aren't as simple. Every physical thing has it's own set of properties, just like no two people are exactly alike. The fact that you are working with "open box" parts might give you a clue that someone else might have found certain shortcomings with that part. I do mostly repairs now, as I'm retired. I will still build occasional PC's and repair PC's, but I never touch anything that's been returned or refurbished. I wasted way too much time chasing intermittent issues in returned or refurbished hardware in my youth to do it again as I don't have that much time left to live aggravated and frustrated over a part that randomly fails or crashes every few hundred hours. That's not to say I've never installed new parts that failed, but knowing that the part or machine has been returned for reasons unknown is too big a risk to chance. And here's a secret... no one is going to test returned equipment for a few hundred hours to see if it will fail. If it get's tested at all, it's on and off the bench, usually in a few minutes. No one has time to run 1000 test cycles. In fact, one bench tech told me that many of the returns he refurbs are perfectly good, in his opinion, they were retuned because the buyer found a better deal or changed his mind... so when the hardware passes the first test, he pretty much assumes it's fine and doesn't even look for more problems. Stay away from things labeled open box, that are likely returned or refurbished, they will break your heart. (And yes, some perfectly good stuff is returned and you can save a few bucks on it... feel free to ignore my advise if you are feeling lucky.)
I have an i7 & rtx2070 super...love it. I play current games on high/ultra graphics with over 60fps. I want in the near future to upgrade. But i heard the rtx 40 series are bad. What about 30? And if i switch to amd processor + amd graphics card close to 40 series performance? Please help
It depends on what you want and how much your budget is. I would recommend these cards. You can decide for yourself how much you want to spend. New - 4070 Super - 4070 TI - 7800XT - 7900 GRE Used 3070 ti 3080 6800 XT 6700 XT 6900 XT
@ErockOnTech Thank you very much! I have 2000-2500 budget no used harware please! Would you recommend switching to amd? I heard they are faster and consume less power...i honestly don't know the difference. What would you recommend for that budget? Thank you
Man, I'm so confused on what to upgrade to from my i3 9100F. My budget is about $400, so I'm thinking i5 12400F or Ryzen 5 7500f. Another thing is pc parts are way more expensive in the Philipppines.
I also have latency issue with my mouse, even with my gen 4 intel. But only because i have mouse receiver on the front panel and, every time i plug in the usb3 flashdrive next of it on the front panel. The latency issue happens. It runs win7 by the way. So, I wonder if that is the very core/beginning of intel's latency issue. I feel like, the cause is the usb3 driver tho. Either way. Im intel and win7 user. But i would love to build the latest win7 platform (native chip driver supported). There is win7 driver for X470 AM4. Which means i can install ryzen 5800x3d in theory. But it seems, it only offers one M2 PCIe gen 3 slot. Meanwhile, even with just the 7th gen platform of intel (which, its supposed to be the equal of ryzen 3000 series, i think?). Like, the Z270, it already offers two M2 PCIe gen 3 slots. So, it is such dilemma for me. Either you ll have the fast processor (the latest AM4 proci) without many expansion options, or so many expansions options but not the fastest proci. I mean, i would love to make this pc as dual boot (win 7 and win 10). And having various work spaces and games at the same time. Therefore, i would love to have the fastest proci with pretty numbers of expansion slots.
My 13900k degraded after one year to the point where i had to downclock to 5.,1ghz just to be stable, so got a 14900k and even just starting on windows baseline profiles degraded faster and still crashed randomly on games, so I switched to amd 7800x3D and a 670E mb by just returning my 14900k for the same value and now finally stable more then ever. also read about someone who went threw 6 14900k's that all died so wasnt gonna go back to that
I jusy switched from a 7800x3d to a 14900k. So far, i haven't experienced any issues. Its been a really smooth transition. My am5 platform has been a headache since day 1 with a ton of random issues. In my experience and with the games I play, im getting better fps and better 1% lows. Leading to a more enjoyable experience. While I havent had issues with intel. I have had issues with the mobo trying to push crazy high wattage. Thats not an intel issue. Its the motherboard..just set to intel defaults and its good to go. Though i did take the time to OC/UV it myself. Its been fantastic so far
I've seen a lot of people talking trash about AMD and RUclipsrs that are saying the truth, they say that they're not fans, but they also say that "if you're a smart person... bla bla... AMD drivers and platforms are so complex, I don't understand... " and they repeat those kind of things a lot along their videos... I just leave a dislike and hit the button to not recommend that kind content. I'm glad that your AMD system is working great now. I think that I'm going to buy AMD next time.
Look at this fanboy of objectivity and neutrality, offering a balanced opinion :P For me, it's about the best bang for my buck, in pure gaming. At the time of researching, Oct 2023, AMD offered the best bang for my buck in terms of CPU price, motherboard price, and cooling options (being able to use a good quality air cooler instead of being sort of 'forced' into an AIO) in my market, I know this is different in other markets where Intel may offer the best bang for your buck. Edit: I just want to say it was your AM4 vs AM5 and PC vs console content that got me into your channel in the first place :)
Thank you for letting me know what brought you here! That’s always valuable information to have as a creator! Your opening line there was quite funny 😄
Strange. I have had the world of USB issues on AMD. Switching to Intel solved all. Waiting on your follow up video. I suggest just moving the Windows install as is into the AMD system and see if it happens.
Thank you for that suggestion. I’ll do that before wiping the OS and doing a clean install. Technically, with each new CPU install you should do a fresh windows install. Especially, if the brand is different. But before I do that for my final build, I’ll absolutely use your suggestion. Thank you.
I dont understand why half the comments or more are running ridiculous amounts of ram. I have an i7-13700K, mated to a TUF GAMING Z790-PLUS WIFI mobo, and 32GB (2×16GB) DDR5 6,000 CL30. I find this when configured with the appropriate manufacturers XMP (XMP2), is the most optimal for 90% of gaming builds. GPU is a TUF GAMING 4070 SUPER OC for reference. I run most games at 1440P, and by no means have some god level build. But 128GB of ram is just overkill.
every time I think about switching to AMD, I come across another horror story about the experience and change my mind. I recently just upgraded to a 13600. Idk man, the amount of shilling makes me nervous too. You'd think AMD was the second coming of christ, even though there's so many horror stories. I pretty much never see stories about Intel cpus having massive stability issues and whatnot.
Hey I get it entirely. Personally, I never had an issue with AMD until I went to AM5. But I was an early adopter and unfortunately, early adopters are basically bug testers. Here it is over a year later and AM5 is so much better. I switched to Intel thinking it was perfect and the best thing ever. As the people I have interacted with made Intel sound perfect. At first, it was perfect, but after about 3 months it started to fail me.
@ErockOnTech Though the temptation to respond to trolling posts ('You are gay', 'bald' blah-blah) is understandable, the worst thing one can do is to respond. It gives them oxygen. Ignore them - It hits them hardest by depriving them of that which they desperately seek. Notice. Keep well and thank you for your channel. (Subscribed)
The only reason why most people that are sponsored or have the money go with Intel is because they have a 4090. Well, I have a 4080 I went with AMD’s Ryzen 7 7800X3D. The 4090 is about 25 to 30% faster or so then the 4080. To be honest, only people with money care about the 4090, and the latest and greatest.
I really enjoy the path of the APU's of AMD i love small builds. Really looking to get a sweet my64 9000 series APU built (if possible). Time will tell.
Skill issue, never had any of these issues. I AM A COMPUTER GOD! I miss when you could have a Intel CPU with a nVidia motherboard and AMD(ATI) GPU :P. I'm so old now....
I think for the next build I'll go for intel. I've used a 3950x and the bios bugs were horrible, the unstable windows experience, stuttering and cold boots and stuff. It took a bit more than a year to get it stable. Without forgetting the pain with memories. So, I think intel would just be a better experience. The downside of intel is I don't like those stupid e cores or dumb cores. That's the thing I like from AMD though. Real cores for real simulation work.
Update: and the experience with windows 11 + 3950x was laggy. Like slower explorer. Not sure if all the AMD users do have it, whether is just AMD users besides the processor type while intel users are doing just fine
Frame Chasers isn't going to like your claim that AMDip isn't a real phenomenon. I'm interested to see that because that man kinda has brainwashed me to think of AMD as an inferior product and has added to my FOMO and feelings that my system is inadequate to it's intel counterparts on my 5800x3d.
Respectfully, I don’t care what he likes. I don’t run my channel based off what someone else might think. I run it based off data. Show me the concrete data. Does he, or anyone for that matter, have a multi game benchmark with multiple runs showing this supposed dip occurring in a repeatable state? Or is the data presented ONLY in call of duty and a single run? It’s called editing magic. You can make a video show whatever you want my friend. Where’s the repeatable data?
Intel 13 and 14th gen cpus are diying after a few months , silicon death, starts as general errors, games crashing, etc, change to new same CPU, problem goes away. I'm a intel user, but I'm afraid of new stuff. Etc
Enjoyed your video. It was detailed & very helpful Sorry that you had latency issues with the Intel CPU. Will check out some RUclipsr's channel's that had that issue. People build PC's with CPU's based on their preference. I've built PC's with both AMD & Intel but I prefer AMD. I just built a PC with the AMD Ryzen 5 8500G CPU. First time building a PC with a AM5 CPU. Wanted to build it with an AM5 CPU for experience. It's running very good. Look forward to watchng more of your content.
i have amd 7800x3d +7900xt here i felt everything is fine but watching this vid but now i see if i fast drag a window /mouse cursor it only draws a few, so theres 1cm gaps between cursor arcs on a 27inch monitor 1440p 170hz , putting mouse trails on looks like a star field ! couldnt find any setting for update rate in mouse settings and every googled guide fixates on mouse speed not fps so looks like a win 10 issue for me
@@ErockOnTech i would never race the mouse around like that in normal use and dragging open windows is ok or less noticable, just mentioned it in context with your video and going from 4770k to 7800x3d doesnt feel like an upgrade other than gaming
7:24 oh boy lol. I respect you not naming and shaming, but as soon as i heard about the AMDip, i knew you had been exposed to a certain "fame chaser" out there. 😅
Sell the Z690 and the 14700k, and grab a B760M AORUS ELITE X AX (the best cheap high frequency memory capable board) the Z790 AORUS ELITE AX ICE its the bigger version, but more expensive. With does boards you can push you 7200 kit up to 7800, or even 8000 if you got lucky on the memory controller.
@@ErockOnTech and, if you are gonna try some fun with memory on intel, grab the LGA 1700 custom bracket too, that can help with cpu contact signal improvement/Cooling.
Yeah man I'm kind of like you but an old guy. I made my daughters amd computers back in the 90's. Always stayed with AMD as I was familiar with them. I have always thought the way Intel has several different platforms for their many dif chips is confusing. That has kept me from trying Intel. Now I don't have to. Your experience is helpful to me. Thankyou
Dang, I'm running a 12700k with zero latency issues. I was planning to eventually put a 14700k in this machine to get a bit more life out of it but might not after all. Good video
I had similar Usb problem on an Msi board. The Pch chip on the mb handles Usb among other systems. In bios you can adjust the voltage on this chip and you can also see the temperature in Hwinfo64. You should stay under 65C on that chip. Some mb run too low voltage on this chip because of inadequate cooler on this chip. Its often cooked from the air coming from the graphic card too. Its always placed in the upper part of the mb and usally behind the graphic card. So try to keep this chip cool (below 65C idealy) and adjust the voltage to 0.84-.0.9V. 0.87V is a good middlepoint if you can keep the chip below 70C at all times. I have a feeling that silicon quality varies a lot on these chips. My z690 Asus ran that chip at 0.92V and Msi z790i ran the Pch at 0.82V and this made the usb drop out completely a few times.
I'd pull the boot device, replace it, install Windows 10 on it and then go from there. If you don't like it just replace the old boot device with windows 11 already install on it and you'd be good to go. You could even switch it back and forth for a comparison.
Dude I don’t care about neither company as well. But the reason that you switched from one company chip to another is REALLY STUPID, just because you couldn’t get the ram speed you wanted. Wao I can tell you are so…let me just shut up.
You seem upset by something so trivial. Yet, I’m the one that “is so..”. Lol yeah ok. Chill out man. Use what you want and why you want. I’ll do the same. I’m just sharing my experiences here. If you appreciate that, awesome. If not, there are other tech RUclipsrs you can watch. Cheers.
Also, there was a lot going on outside of just the ram speed. That is a gross over simplification. I’d suggest watching the full video series to get the full story. That is if you’re actually interested in truly understanding and not just judging for the sake of being an internet troll.
Problem sounds like sysmain service is on. Aka the old prefetch or superfetch. Would explain why the problem doesn’t happen until months after the build, since it needs time to build up
So, recent information states that Intel 13th and 14th Gen i9's are having instability issues. Have you seen these claims? EDIT: Shouldn't have to 'have' "skills" to fix a issue for a Out Of the Box experience. That's on Intel to resolve, not the end user who wants to plug and play.
@@ErockOnTech I've not seen any large YT channels report on this, and having tested it themselves. Just a few channels and some posts here and there. Could be the CPU or the memory controller, but either way, a proclaimed stability issue. Reminds me of AMD's Zen4 - AM5 voltage issues at launch. That was a AMD - Board Partner issue, users shouldn't have to worry about that.
I'm currently on a 12600k and I'm planning to switch to a 7800x3d for completely different reasons. I need space on my desk so I want to get rid of my tower and build an itx system. At first I thought I would upgrade to a 14600k but I learned very quickly that I wont be able to cool it with acceptable noise levels. So I will switch to a processor that is twice as efficient from AMD (which might be a bit slower in some benchmarks, but thats fine) (a new mainboard is required either way because my 12600k sits on ATX) The manufacturer doesnt matter, what matters is if the product fits your needs.
If you find yourself doing a lot of CPU heavy workloads, the 14900k would be a much better workhorse than the x3d, say for video rendering, and that's a use case where latency isn't a concern. Then you could sell the 14700k
I hear you and understand. Here is my advice. Go with AMD. Get a DDR5 RAM kit that is on your motherboard's QVL. For your first boot, DO NOT USE the xmp/Expo profile. Leave everything stock. Boot into Windows. Install all updates. Then go back to the bios and use the memory overclocking profile. Also, make sure before you do any of this, update your bios.
Why did you care so much about the ram speed when you had the 7800X3D? I tested few games with mine and it made little to no difference when I was running 4800Mhz vs 6000Mhz
My AMD system boots up in around 10 seconds now, but my old motherboard was troublesome in many cases. Everything you mentioned I had that problem x 10. I returned two Gigabyte Master high-end boards before switching from an X670E AORUS MASTER (rev. 1.x) to a PRIME B650M-A WIFI II. Now, everything is functioning smoothly and quickly. I downgraded the specs significantly, but I'm satisfied with the performance. Also, my motherboard might have had a compromise at the factory, and I've read that Asus had similar issues with some of theirs.
I’m making the switch this weekend. I’ve had a horrible time with my intel cpu . Blue screen of death . Heat problem now it’s to the point I can’t even open games
My 14700k build is rock solid at 7000mhz. Z790 Rog strix E. You actually have the same exact ram as me and did the same thing as me. 7200 was not stable haha
1.AMD Ram compatiblity compared to 1 year ago is night and day difference if you have your bios updated to the latest version ofc, similar to how things were with 1st Ryzens on DDR4, when they released it was a nightmare for close to 1 year after that things started to look a lot different. At the moment there are multiple people reporting they can get 7200-7600mhz xmp working out of the box without any additional tuning and I saw quite a few people even adding a little bit of dram voltage and getting 8000mhz on those same ram kits. Given how 1 year ago getting 6000mhz to work was hit or miss thats a huge difference imo. Boot times are also a lot better. 2. intel problems could be MPO needs to be disabled, or windows updates screwing drivers, it happens quite a lot even on AMD, both are Windows problems, can't really fault intel there its just the OS sh!tting itself imo. Another thing might be some peripheral or capture card or anything like that triggering windows update to auto install something crappy/wrong driver as an update. You could easily make a fresh windows 11 install and if the problem is gone make occasional system restore points and as soon as the problem starts again(if it does) you can go check all your drivers/softwares and etc and revert back to a previous point to see whats different. 3. At the moment the reasonable choice is AMD, especially if you care about value, power draw, temps, future proof, but if you get intel to work without that problem you have and you enjoy it more then there is nothing wrong with that either. If I had both of these systems I would just switch them around every 3-6months to see how they are progressing with bios/windows updates and etc. Things are always changing in time, but last 12 months its safe to say that AM5 improved quite a lot, but I can't say the same for Intel. P.S. CPUs I had last 12 months: Intel 12400F(OCed with BCLK with external clock gen to 5.1GHZ core and 4.6GhZ cache) with 6200mhz DDR5 5800x3d with 3600mhz and 4000mhz ram kits + PBO and -30mv CO 7800x3d with 7200mhz ram kit OCed to 7600mhz with tighter timings + PBO and -30mv CO In terms of latency and snappiness 12400F and 7800x3d are comparable. Boot times are comparable. Experience is comparable ofc excluding the performance difference. In terms of performance 12400F and 5800x3d were comparable, cuz of the OC ofc. I actually opted to keep intel as a main system for almost 1 year, then 5800x3d cpu mobo ram sold and 7800x3d happened. Anyway, thanks for sharing your experience including the frustrating parts and I really admire that you are not being biased/fanboying over any brand. I really appreciate that, so I wrote my experiences and thoughts, hope you find them informative and/or helpful.
Thank you for this detailed feedback. I fully agree about AMD and the RAM improvements. My new AMD system is already night and day compared to the old system. They really improved things and I am excited to give it another try. I also agree about Windows. Windows 11 especially seems to have so many issues. I think it's because they have so much out of box bloat on it and there are mico updates almost daily it seems. I do have auto updates turned off. But every time I manually check for updates, there is a new update waiting for me. At this time, I am planning to make my main PC the 7800X3D. I will use either the 14700K or the 14900K in the test bench. I will then sell the other.
@@ErockOnTech Absolutely, I would love to have a cleaner windows like XP or 7 again when things were just simple and were just working. I hate the fact that windows is moving towards touchscreens/tablets type of UI and that just makes things so much worse for normal Desktop PC users, especially the enthusiasts who just wants a clean Windows that just works and everything is easily accessible. We can all hope and pray some of the next Windows versions will be clean and most of the issues will be resolved, but I think this dream will stay for eternity and never come true :D There should be 2 separate versions of Windows - one to be more tablet/touchscreen oriented with all the bloat and bullshit and semi-broken fancy UI and the other one just barebone Windows where everything is just one-two clicks away and also allows users to install only the things they need and use Windows in their own way. Like we got to the point where simplicity in Windows is gone and is too much to ask for and thats kinda sad. I'm happy to hear you are having a blast with AMD now. For the testbench maybe whichever Intel you manage to OC the most to have the least amount of CPU bottleneck. Pushing intel's Core clock, cache clock and then ram clock really changes everything quite a bit and you can feel the results, especially the whole system snappiness and reduced latency from the cache clock, core clock in gaming performance and ram helps both a bit, but its very time consuming and the temps are quite annoying to deal with. Anyway, thanks for the nice chat, I'm looking forward to watching more of your stuff in the future and Good luck!
@@ErockOnTech 9000 series improved memory compatibility by a lot. I could never get 8000 to boot or be stable on most 7000 chips, whereas in most 9000 chips I can stabilize 8000 100% 24hr VST3 stable, and can even boot 8400MHz, but obviously its impossible to make that stable at the moment. Not tht it makes any difference on intel cpus.
There are more reasons for me to consider switching back to AMD outside of what was stated in the video. My viewers want a follow up to the AM5 video series. The LGA 1700 socket is now dead. AM5 still has life left in it. But what do you think?
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i think that windows is the problem with both amd and intel. i am on the 1600 af and won't be upgrading until next year sometime (for windows 10's end of life). i believe that most of the problems are more software than hardware when it comes to pc problems today. for the longest time i'd have to roll back amd drivers in the games i played because they were only worried about intel and nvidia, that finally went away when amd started to catch and pass intel, but i still think that programs and os are the problems now.
@@craiglortie8483 You very well may be right. Windows 11 is filled with bloat.
@@ErockOnTech i don't even think it's bloat. 2 different chiplet designs and ways to do the same thing are hard to keep from conflicting in an os that's as bad as windows is becoming. then add in the fact that they wanted to charge you for using windows and are going to after october of next year. i don't think they have the manpower to keep writing the patches that don't screw with the other cpu.
@@ErockOnTech this is why i kept my phenom II 955 for almost 9 year, til it became a tri core. LOL.
With both systems (until I got the Z790 Apex Encore) XMP didn't just work without manually increasing the voltage OR lowering the frequency. Very strange but possibly why you had some RAM instability there.SA voltage also can came these things a bit wonky when off or set to auto (I run 1.25V on Intel and like 1.27-1.3V on AMD)
People forget that any company is not your friend they want only your money.
What are you talking about? Next time you say that Red Bull doesn't give wings??
Capitalism is two parties making a mutually agreed upon bargain where both parties are pleased. They don't have to be your friend. Do you have to be their friend? Things like customer support and reliability are mutually beneficial if they win your long term endorsement and word of mouth. Yes they want to make money and yes you want the best product at the lowest price. Nothing wrong with that.
Except evga😂
this is so true i was a fan of one specific brand in my country once but after my component broke and I sent it to them they won't fix it for me cuz it had rust on Backplate and it wasn't in an Agreement either
_Some_ people take pride in their work. It's difficult for a publicly list company.
I just don't want my CPU to draw more power than my GPU.
I understand that completely.
You have to enforce the intel limits or manually change pl1 /pl2 limits or else most motherboards will yeet in as much power as it can handle.
@@cppctekVery true as well! Good point! Thank you for sharing this information.
@@cppctek yeah, and doing some tuning on XTU is quite easy, I limited my 12600k to 125W, which with UV gets me the same results as 180W stock. But my favourite setting is 95W (always with UV, somewhat close to the highest point in the perf/W curve), performing virtually the same in gaming (P cores can still hit 4.7GHz) and loosing about 6% perf. in multi thread compared to 180W stock.
who cares? better yet why do you care? if you have a sufficient power supply and sufficient cooling..why does it matter? 🤷🏿♂️ I genuinely want to know why people hype power draw(real world use not full load benchmark power draw)
Personally I would game on the 7800x3d. I can definitely say AM5 really is in a good position now because just a lil over a month ago, I built my 2nd pc after stepping out of the pc space for over 2 years and was able to configure all my bios settings, drivers, EXPO without any problems. I went in blind and bought the 7700x and 4070 Ti Super, built it, and here I am chillin. The boot times were horrible before a BIOS update though lmao.
Thank you for the feedback. You’re the first person I’ve seen answer my question at the end of the video. Thank you 🙏
Thank you for the high quality content, it's because of you that I was able to watch the video start to finish on the pc that your videos helped create.
@@AkNichThank you! That is very kind of you to say! I really appreciate you sharing that with me!
My 7800x3d with 32gb 6000 cl30 takes a solid minute plus to boot. No idea how to fix it
@@BreadAndGatorade Might need a BIOS update, or your startup apps might be making your PC boot time long. Before a Bios update my PC took like 1m 30s to boot, but after BIOS update and turning off some apps on startup, my PC boots in like 10-15 seconds now.
Stop chasing the ultimate. It really is a pointless, never ending, and unsatisfying effort. Instead, learn to be happy with gear that meets your needs.
You’re right. Very wise words.
This guy just dropped a big blue marble bro!
This aged so poorly lmao
Hey great video man and I appreciate the shout out!. These kinds of videos are awesome because they really give a good insight on what its actually like to use the product on a day-to-day basis. While the results and data from mainstream reviewers or large reviews sites are helpful, (fps figures, render times) they don't tell the full story.
I hear Intel has actually launched an investigation on a lot of these issues as well as the crashing issues many users have reported. There are just so many variables involved these days and with these processors having so many built-in OC and power saving features, it's going to be hard to narrow it down to a single cause. It's just so intriguing to see how much the experiences can vary with these new platforms. I'm personally thinking one of the major culprits is DDR5 regardless of whether you're on AM5 or LGA1700. Ever since DDR5 became mainstream I've seen so many people having issues with system stability and a lot of it going back to their ram not being stable even at XMP/EXPO.
Furthermore the motherboard manufacturers don't appear to be on the same page, and I think the onus is on Intel/AMD to roll out stricter guidelines for their partners. I'm not saying they should completely restrict them or take away tweaking options, but for those that don't want to mess around and want their system to work out of the box, they should have that assurance.
I feel like we're regressing back to the early days of PC building where hardly anything worked out of the box, and overclocking/tweaking was a necessity if you wanted to get your system to work right. It's 2024, the end user shouldn't have to go through with that and I say this as someone who will sit there for hours messing around with ram timings.
At the end of the day finding what works best for you and what makes you the happiest is all that matters. If you want a suggestion on which system you should use as your daily and which one you want to use a test bench, my advice would be to use the system that give you the LEAST amount of problems as your personal rig. So that way you can ensure you've got maximum up-time and can roll through your projects rather than waste time on trouble shooting.
Thank you! Hey man no problem at all. I appreciate you taking time to try and help me. I also appreciate the conversations we’ve had. You make good content. I have no problem helping other people find you.
For my system, that’s a perfect suggestion! Thank you. I’m going to try AM5 again as my main. I’ll report my experience in a later video.
You’re definitely right about the full story on product reviews. Sometimes the long term user experience is missing. That is so beneficial when someone is looking to buy a product 5-6 months after launch for example.
You may be correct about the DDR5. That makes a lot of sense and honestly the thought has crossed my mind. Do we know of any reports with intel latency on a DDR4 system? That could be worth looking into actually.
that aged well hahahah
When it comes to Fanboys I feel the AMD fanboyss are louder and more aggresive.
Intel fanboys are generally more helpfull.
On your latency have you tried another motherboard. You said you got yours at a crazy price and that could be for a reason.
When it comes to space heater comments this is a thing AMD fanboys go quiet about their own choice of system.
With Intel its easy to undervolt and overclock. My 13700k runs all cores at 5.2 and e cores at 4.3 and my temp doesent go above mid 70 degrees in cinebench. Under gaming it only hits 50 degree.
AM5 goes upto 95 degrees and uses more power at idle.
At low to mid range you cant beat Intel. 12100f for under £100, 12400f for £130 and recently 12700k for £200 in a sale. Motherboards are also only £100 for non z boards, and you cam save money by using z690 over z790.
Just a little bit of info, are you using lian li fans or the l connect software by any chance? I was getting alot of stuttering and latency problems on my 7800x3d rig and it turned out the culprit was l-connect. Like you I spent many months trying to resolve the problem until I found an old redit post mentioning the same thing for other users. Since I stop l connect running in the back ground now once my fan profiles etc have loaded on boot I have had 0 latency issues.
Are you fr?? This is so random, but thank you kind stranger for this possible solution to a problem I didn’t know I might have. Will try!
tf is i connect lol
@@StevoHDAx2
@@StevoHDA L-Connect. Software you need to control your lian li fans.
I was talked into leaving my AMD 7 for the new Intel 9. SMH ... Everything seems like it's hangs up. Like I click file explorer or unreal engine and it takes seconds to pop up. like hummmm....... So on July 31s I'm giving this to my kid and switching back lol. Nothing like her having an Intel I9 14900k for Roblox. Lol 😂😅
Haha that’s a wise plan. I’m sorry you had issues like me. That’s unfortunate. But I just released a new video this morning discussing the current state of AM5. Spoiler alert: it’s much better than the current state of Intel.
@@ErockOnTech nice bro. I appreciate the feedback!
I remember your videos regarding your AM5 issues when I was researching building a new PC using AM5. I saw two videos (I can't remember the people who posted them) in which one said to wait (from the time the video was posted) 6 to 8 months before ordering the motherboard I had my eye on. The reason was to give the entire AM5 platform to "settle down." I ordered my components except for the motherboard and RAM. I followed that advice.
The second video suggested to install everything vanilla. No CPU over clocks, no RAM over clocks.... Default only. This person even said that if your CPU has integrated graphics: don't install a dedicated GPU yet or even a second NVME. I did that....
Basic hardware hooked up, installed Windows 11 Pro, and then let the system set for a day: just run in a basic mode. After that, I installed the GPU and second NVME and started the system. After about 2 minutes of nail biting: the system booted. Again, as suggested: I used the system doing mundane stuff. Windows & driver updates, watched a few YT videos, and played a few hands of Solitaire. The third day I enable PBO and the memory OC. After a 30 second wait: Windows loaded. That was in January of this year. Now, I can shut my AM5 system off and when I turn it back on: it's less that 20 seconds before Windows login appears.
Yes: that was a lot of waiting. No, I don't know for sure if those reasons are why my AM5 system has been wonderful. All I know is that sometimes, being first is not always a good thing. Running components in "vanilla mode" allowed me to become more comfortable with the AM5 boot procedures and I didn't have any issues. Granted that could have just been luck or a "golden" CPU; but, my AM5 system has been rock solid.
Give AM5 another chance. You might like it. If not, you still have Intel. It would be a win win either way.
I appreciate you sharing this feedback with me. I’m going to give AM5 another try. I’ll report my experience. Thank you 🙏
Actually with Win11 pushing so much AI. Having the AM5 platform so new back then, this was GREAT advice !!
As others have said ,Asus does push boundaries on their MB’s. Quality control not so good anymore ( 10 yrs ago they were 3-5x better, I’m oldER :) I had to fully take off Asus’s Armoury Crate software on i9-12900H ROG laptop since made it way slower than a i5 12th Gen, crazy.
However, I think it is Great advice now with the Win11 AI push. Hell, when I try to put I, autocorrect usually inputs ai now, just like after However in this paragraph !!
@@sbme1147 I use OpenRGB for the RGB controls. ArmoryCrate same bloat issues 12900K, so I'm better off not using it and making sure it doesn't install when possible.
The price drop and system stability are worth the wait. It’s a flaccid flex to have the latest and greatest.
Intel has a problem... More crashing and stability issues for new CPUs
I am so lucky that i stopt using Intel after 30 years and running a AMD CPU . 3800X3D 😂
I finished my AM5 build in January 2024 and never had a single issue with. I still use win 10 tho (don't like 11 so far)
Great video Erock. Honestly I FEEL your frustration on this.I spent months replacing parts, testing customer machines etc. Just like you mentioned not being a hardware engineer, same here man... we shouldn't even be diving that deep into settings for a stable machine.
I think a lot of it has to do with different manufacturers, for an example ASUS really pushes their motherboards out of the box (kinda in a bad way IMO) so if you get a board that really pushes it and a chip that's slightly unstable or has some issues, you'll end up with a stuttery mess. I personally found that high core count i7s and i9s seemed to be way more "stuttery" but again my sample size is small.
I will mention the 3rd part I had made that you featured here (my fault for not making a proper follow up) I had some good luck with it for a while but eventually I did have issues again unfortunately. Ultimately I end up switching over to an ASRock Aqua z690 (went backwards from z790) and my stability has improved tremendously. I don't have enough data to say that it's 1 vs the other company, I will still get occasional stuttering, but it's a 10th of what it was on the Asus board. If I was to guess, I have kinda a bum chip, and my older Asus board wasn't playing nice with it, even after undervolts, disabling xmp, you know... all the things! Haha.
I appreciate you having the guts to point this out. Super honest video and I hope people see that.
🫡
Thank you man for the kind words! Also, thank you for your work on this issue and sharing it with me and everyone else. I appreciate your time on trying to help me with this issue. Sometimes problems just can't be fixed I guess. Other people are reporting no issues and honestly I am happy for them. If someone builds an Intel rig, it's not cheap. They deserve a stable and snappy system. But that doesn't invalidate our experiences. Other people in the comments here suggest switching my board out. Some say it just needs to be a Z790 instead of a Z690. Others say it needs to be a non Asus board. As you can see, the suggestions are all over the place. No one really knows how to fix it. Back to AMD I go I suppose! New video incoming!
@@ErockOnTech I would be interesting to throw the I9 on some basic level board that can support it (vrms) that is not Asus, just to see if your experience changes at all.
I have/had a 790 hero with 14900k.
Could game well, but as soon as I tried working with live audio it couldn't cope. Latencymon showed lots of issues. Never got to the bottom of it. Also if left on downloading or idle (not under load) it would bsod or crash and I'd find it with the CPU super hot and unable to boot. The company I used to make were great though and have accepted a return. Just trying to work out what to do now.
My old system is fine though, but getting creaky.
Imagine my surprise when i7 and i9 13th and 14th gen are over volted overheating degrading silicon.
you have no choice but to not use intel now
You are correct! I am now back on AMD.
Yeah this is pretty crazy.
I used to do desktop support and in my 12 years of doing it for a large multi thousand seat company I only had 1 CPU failure (only one app crashed when performing a task, stress tests and diagnostics passed) I replaced everything and was going to rip my hair out, then I replaced the CPU and it was fixed!
I guess office PC's are run WAY more conservatively. I killed one of my cpu's overvolting it a long time ago.
@@volvo09 Not sure how long ago that was for you. But I know today, voltages and GHz are pushed higher than ever. So that likely plays a role as well.
@@ErockOnTech yeah, this wasn't modern tech, I left in 18 right before covid. If I recall the bad CPU was a P4 in an IBM desktop.
I bet the company is having a lot more CPU issues now, they seem much more delicate.
Only if you fall for the anti Intel hype -- and blind to the flop of AMD's launch. AMD is always sketchy. I am not a fan nor foe of Intel, but much like the youth of today - I learned the hard way the truth about AMD. Most people don't go to Intel and Nivida out of love or childish ideation - they do it because they are, over all, the superior offerings.
Boys may play with their toys but men have to get work done. Businesses, rank and file, family feeding companies can't take the risk with low-end tools. Computers are tools not toys.
With that said, AMD pretty much operates in the gaming niche. For that purpose, they might be better for the buck.
The windows installation becoming corrupt after some initial ram instability is my guess.
Have you tried another board vendor? Gigabyte? ASRock? Also, G.Skill hasn't let me down yet when it comes to RAM. Flare X or Trident Z/Neo!
I've had my fights with AM5 as well, when my MAG X670E refused to work with my DDR5-6000 kit. Had to enter all timing values manually to get it to run stable. Never had issues outside of it. If AMD fixes the IMC issue with the next generation, then they will be in a much better position in terms of memory compatibility.
AM5 is already better than it was a year ago. But yes, next AMD CPUs should have better memory compatibility/stability etc.
If your heavy productivity, I really like the Intel 13700k/14700k
For gaming focused, I LOVE my 7800x3d.
Btw, I owned a 13600k for a year
I don't find Intel or AMD has a significant strength advantage in anything, Intel has slightly better single core performance, AMD has slightly better multicore performance. I've not noticed a significant strength to either processor in heavy loads, but Intel uses a _lot_ more power on average.
The problem is having those i9 intel 100 usage for 6 days non stop. The heat and power it draws is too huge. AMD isn't thst hungry.
The 600K parts are fantastic processors to recommend for those doing gaming & some productivity (those E-cores are handy for such tasks).
On the other hand, for exclusively gaming the AMD X3D parts are very difficult NOT to consider (even those on AM4 if you're on a more strict budget).
I'd rather have full fat cores than E-cores for productivity, thanks.
intel for productivity and some gaming. amd for gaming and and a some productivity. intel’s the better all rounder if you plan on taking any classes in the next few years. 7800x3d is a great cpu for gaming but you should also consider the games you’re playing. 7800x3d playing world of warships and Fortnite is overkill. build a budget 13600k, 14600k build wait a few years for something better? 7800x3d is more future proof but the platform is more expensive for initial cost. At the moment it’s probably amd but intels prices are pretty hard to beat even though it’s a dead platform.
Well looks like I should stick to 5800x3D for little longer. My last Intel was 4770 and I had no issues. I am so ready to get 14900k but this video made me pause and do more research.
Thanks for the shoutout! It’s always great to hear your experiences. It’s key for everyone to be nice and to remember everyone can have a wildly different experience. So many combinations of hardware, software and settings. So many variables and intel can often get a bad wrap also for the power draw. These motherboard enabled with xmp without setting manual power limits or enforcing the intel stock limits will result in massive power draw. Dropping 7200 to 7000 def is par for the course for me too. I run xmp tweaked + manual 252w pl1 and pl2 limits and my r23 scores are the same as stock but my temps when benchmarking never touch those same numbers it use too. I totally believe you with the latency and random stutters. It’s a known issue. I’ve had some success with eliminating it on mine and my wife’s but it doesn’t always work for everyone forever. It’s a very elusive issue. It’s not a skill issue for sure because some just can’t get it fixed. I have a friend who’s got an am5 system though where he just started expecting it. I haven’t checked it out yet but yeah Thank you so much for the shoutout. If you’d like I’m still down to chat with ya this week and remote in or do a video call and let’s fafo with some tweaks I use and maybe just maybe there’s hope. Also downgrading to w10 isn’t the best either. If you can give me a shot this week we may can get this better for ya. ❤
Yeah man I’m still open to working with you later this week. Just let me know. I appreciate the time you have already given me. Thank you for the kind words. I really appreciate it!
@@ErockOnTech The 13th generation heats up rapidly, leading to potential throttling and lag without adequate cooling. I installed T30 fans on my radiator to mitigate this issue. Achieving stability with XMP took nearly four months of collaboration with MSI and experimenting with developer BIOS versions, proving to be largely unproductive. However, the mouse lag appears to be an operating system or application-related problem. To address it, I typically opt for a quick Windows reinstallation, which takes approximately 10 minutes, followed by a few additional hours to set up my applications, thus avoiding prolonged troubleshooting efforts.
Btw stock Win11 is junk. I use one of FBconan's builds (WinXlite), and then clean it up and check file signatures. Processes should be
It reminds me of AMD's usb issues on am4 witch still works fine sometimes and boom it acts bad again until i reboot the system or reset the bios ,and yes my x570 tomahawk wifi bios is up to date. scheduling with multicore used to be an issue when it came out so with e-cores in the mix i was waiting this kind of issue to pop up someday and here it is . disable this, change that , enable this, this auto setting is too high i didn't want to split hairs over this so i replaced my 3600 by a 5800x and shout out to amd that got it replaced quickly because my first one was bad , not doa but just very bad and it works flawlessly since i got it. i never had much luck with intel i dont want a fight to apply changes i want and unfortunately intel does not always let you do so easily because to change one setting you have to change a bunch of them sometimes and here comes in the headache . with amd things are a bit more obvious , it tells you what dependencies for the setting you need to change are and most can be let to auto while intel you still have to do some manual input and probably lots of tuning . manual point and shoot of issues or settings is always a problem because sometimes its a shot in the dark.
prebuilt pc's like DELL and ACER may not be the best but for the same cpu you will notice that those system works flawlessly because they do not go out of specs so results will be a bit lower for performance but it will more reliable none the less. i only regret that most of these won't have a xmp/expo setting unless you put the price for it with a high end system . reminds me of paying for options when you buy a car , sometimes to get a feature you want you have to pay an extra for lots of stuff you do not need/want but it is how it works so no choice there.
for the reinstall of windows i would do a clean install then image the system drive so i have a fully working state to simply use in case i ever need to so all my programs are there whenever i restore windows . Acronis and many others have good softwares for this but Acronis is one i never had any issues with .just make an image backup of the system without any RGB software and you are good to go in a few clicks and a few minutes instead of hours if anything happens .
@@raydioz I had no problem with XMP and MSI Z790-P, very stable. And i9-14900k runs very well with liquid cooling.
If you are editing i understand Quick Sync with Intel really helps.
I was jealous of your backdrop for a long time, I just realized that the backdrop looks different now. Now I'm more jealous than before 🤦 Love the clean look!
Haha oh really? That’s interesting. That’s funny also. Thanks for sharing man.
Think it’s the $250 dollar motherboard it’s cheaper for a reason I have a 650 dollar Asus apex encore motherboard and have not experienced the latency issue 🎉but it’s going to cost you 😂
Dude the “$250 motherboard” was on a close out sale. That was not MSRP. MSRP was around $500-$600. It’s not a cheap board.
My motherboard was on a close out sale. MSRP was closer to $500 - $600. It’s not a cheap board.
This video aged like milk.
Can you explain why? Genuine question since I was wondering if I missed something
Victor sounds like he has something important to say. Everybody tune in. Let's wait and see what he responds.
the extremist booting time of gen7 amd cpus is the most horrible retardness i ever experience in pc's. I don't say Intel is perfect but Jeezus imagine in 2024 building a 2000$ pc and your pc cannot boot in within 30 sec - 60 sec loool wtf amd am5 is just unusable. I just bought a 12900k im waiting for 5090 to make my build, i know that you are better with 12 gen then 13 and 14 , i am mainly video playing, in 4k . my current system is a 11900k, i'm not a pro in pc or anyting but for me 100% of the time i use a Intel system, its shit to say it but its true, it's just work. But i have some reserve for 13/14 gen i see to much of instability weirdness in a lot of video about those cpus, energy usage, temperature etc etc 12 gen system is seriously just magnificiant with ddr5 is just the most quick pc u can build i build 2 12700k system pc for friends and im jaleous of their pc's. also pcie gen 5 unlock fully ethernet speed etc etc , its just quick AF. So i can't wait to have the rtx 5090 to build my 12900k system
Actual Hardcore overclocking the guy seems very knowledgeable you should give him a call I think he might be able to help you out.
Yeah not a bad idea.
I guess your issue wasn't with the Intel CPU, the problem could be with your motherboard. It was wired you bought it 250$!
I guess the motherboard has a problem, so Newegg sold it at that price!
Change the motherboard and then test your 14900K CPU
On AM5 had issues with my system the am5 series helped me find out that my ram at 6000 was the issue currently running stable at 6000 and improved performance by tuning the voltages and subtimings. Try tuning the ram on am5 might help stability
how did you dected the ram issue ? is there a software you would recommand ? are you running an x3d cpu ?
Damn dude, you've got a lot of disposable income. edit: for some reason, your intel issue was power saving. I am not going to go into it, but I fixed those by swapping motherboards. I also stay away from Asus but this is not unique to them, it's more to do with expensive motherboards and all of their extra features. For instance, there could be a "thing" you are not even using but is not a 100% and causes IRQ/DMI issues. Good policy is to just straight disable everything you are not using, even the SATA ports.
I am new to this whole pc build. I am still buying components. So far two cases, a qube 500 and an ASUS ap201 prime mesh. Just bought an i5 14600KF and an ASUS strix z790h. So far, intel seems to be more expensive on motherboard and CPU but still learning.
Your going down a Rabbit Hole with thinking it's the Chip that's causing the Latency Issues. I've had the 13900K, 14900K, and now I'm running the 14900KS paired with the Z790 Apex and 8000 speed RAM. No Latency, or studdering Issues at all. Sounds more like driver issues to me when the problems are Mouse or some other peripheral hardware. Honestly, it's definitely not the Chip. Very Important, don't rely on some Software to check for drivers for all your hardware. Make a list from the Device Manager of everything that you can go to the manufacturers website and go there and compare your drivers to what they say you should have. I found out the hard way about that and had incompatibility issues many times and had the wrong drivers installed. Also make sure you plug your mouse into the fastest USB port available on the IO. I use the Red USB Port, it's faster than the Blue. Hope you can figure it out before you go swapping Stuff around.
Or he has one of the unstable 13900/14900k cpus.
Doesn't sound like you had anything long enough to start seeing the instability issues. These chips don't seem to have a problem out of the box, they're degrading over time, and a LOT of people are reporting problems.
Intel has a problem... More crashing and stability issues for new CPUs
It's all over the internet, Hot topic 😁
I had the 13700k and watched Danny’s videos on how to set it up and it was perfect, after some time a bios was released and I just kept getting constant bsod no matter the time, I tried so many things I just gave up and stopped playing. The 7950x3d went on sale and I decided to go with that over the 7800x3d because I do more than game and aside from the boot times it’s been great.
I'm sorry to hear about your 13700K issues. But I'm happy you are up and running now with a reliable CPU.
There are a specific set of bios option that can be flipped to improve Boot times on AM5. The main one is Memory Context Restore, as it speeds up subsequent memory training after the initial one when memory settings are changed. It tends to be in two different places, and seems to be best to enable in both places. At least in the Asus BIOS I know there is a search feature where searching "Context" the only relevant options tend to show up. Another change may need to be made to the 'Fast Boot' option in the Boot menu.
@@ErockOnTech ah no worries, I'm planning on using it for a SFF build for when I travel or use it for a DIY Nas, even though that seems kind of overkill, but I have it!
Cant go wrong with the AM5, nor 13th gen but you get what I mean.
@@blkspade23 i did not know that! I'll have to check that out when I have the chance so thank you for that info!
The interesting thing is that Intel has became what people hate about AMD CPUs back in the 2000s-2010s (high temp + power consumption), but those hardcore Intel fanboys kept on defending the brand by using excuses that hardcore AMD fanboys has been using before, haha. I love their hypocrisy.
And to some extent, NVIDIA fanboys also did this just a generation ago when Radeon's 6000 series emits less heat + takes less power than RTX 3000 card equivalents.
Good video Erock documenting your experience. I've been a very early adopter of AM5 with the 7700X and now have had a 7800X 3D for some time as well. AM5 has come a long way since it's launch with fixes.
I really like the 7800X 3D. It has awesome gaming performance and sips power.
Thank you! I’m planning to switch back here soon. Video incoming!
all tech is going thru worse and worse quality, do not expect things to go well. luckily i never had any issue except from anything from samsung.
Also i swear to god: All of this is an ASUS issue.
And... You're correct. Some 13/14 gen chips have whats called the "SA bug" essentially they either freeze or slow down at higher system agent voltages. Now the issue? Asus loves to pump 1.3v VCCSA (system agent) by enabling your XMP profile.
The issue you're describing is potentially related to Intel's use of hybrid architectures in some of their newer processors, specifically those using a combination of Performance (P) cores and Efficiency (E) cores, like those seen in the Intel Alder Lake and newer series. This hybrid approach contrasts with AMD's current strategy, which predominantly relies on uniform cores in their Ryzen processors.
Intel's Hybrid Architecture:
Intel’s hybrid design, part of their newer generation CPUs, aims to optimize both power efficiency and performance by assigning different tasks to the most suitable type of core. P cores are designed for high-performance tasks that require more processing power, while E cores handle background tasks or less demanding processes to conserve energy.
Potential Issues with Software Optimization:
The effectiveness of Intel's hybrid architecture can partly depend on how well software and operating systems can utilize these different core types effectively. Windows 11, for example, introduced optimizations specifically designed to better allocate tasks between P and E cores. However, if the software or the OS isn’t fully optimized to handle this type of architecture, it could potentially lead to less efficient task distribution, which might manifest as lag or reduced performance in certain scenarios.
AMD's Uniform Core Approach:
AMD, on the other hand, uses a more traditional approach where all cores are performance-oriented, relying on their ability to efficiently handle both high-power and low-power tasks. This can lead to more predictable performance across different types of applications, especially in environments where the software might not be fully optimized for a hybrid core setup.
~My 2 cents.
Was your RAM in the QVL of your MB? Mine wasn't and had crashes often until I switched to one that was listed there.
Yes it is on the QVL.
QVL means nothing
running 7800x3d with 240mm, auto overclocking with 80C at max load; with 14700k or 14900k I would need a 360mm AIO and still get heat throttled from time to time unless I run at stock
I'm back on AMD with a 7800X3D. I love it!
Thanks for sharing. I was on intel (i7 920) for about a decade. Had no issues. Been on amd since ryzen though (3600, 5600, and soon to be 5700x3d) and its been great.
Yeah the AMD AM4 platform was great for me! Zero issues! I do believe AM5 is better now and likely similar. I’m about to find out and make a video 😎
@@ErockOnTechwaiting for this one
Before I’ll make my choice in going to do my first build on 7800x3d or going on 14700k on the intel!
I had to upgrade from my i7 920 when bf1 came out. 144hz would saturate the cpu and cause microstutters.
ruclips.net/video/ysU9mMj9g_Q/видео.html
I have the stuttering problem too, but Intel 13600k processor
Asus Z690 Plus D4 board
Video card 6800xt, but checked also on 1080Ti, same thing there
Windows 10
At the end of the month, the electricity bill makes a difference... Especially in countries with high k-watt prices like we have in Europe.
That’s a good point as well. I’m in the US so that isn’t as much of a factor for me but it does still matter!
@@ErockOnTech Guys with luck.... It can't be bad for everyone either. Let me describe my experience with a 7800x3d and 6000 memory. When I bought and started the pc with xmp it gave me memory errors and it was working fine when I increased the voltage from 1.35 to 1.4, I updated the bios and the memory was working fine at 1.35, I thought let's tighten the subtimes and to my amazement now I have them all the subtimes very tight and without errors. Volt from 1.25 socket went to 1.2 volts, memories with xmp voltage and tight sub times for more than 6 months without problems. With memory tuning I saw drastic improvements in 0.1 fps. Hugs my friend and courage to face the fan boys
In hardware, power use is pure marketing nonsense, mostly propagated by nVidia. You'll find no significant savings on comparable hardware, sku for sku. (IE 14700k vs. 7800x3D, or RTX 4060 vs 7600xt). This even applies to high cost markets, you will not find any significant savings by choosing one brand over another.
User settings are *_far_* more important in power use.
@x8jason8x True. Setting reasonnably can save xx percents of power.
DCP latency is not necessarily a intel/amd problem. It's more likely a motherboard issue.
I've had Amd cpus since FX series. Out of 8 different motherboard brands 4 were asus, 2 msi and 2 gigabyte.
3 out of the 4 asus boards (3 rog strix, 1 tuf) have struggled with DCP latency.
Only Asus motherboards had this issue, even testing the same cpu.
Doing some digging the issue originate somewhere between their usb chips and drivers.
Disabling unused usb ports usually fixed or reduced the issues for me. There were other factors as well related to pci lanes and onboard audio that at one point had to be disabled on one of the boards that also made things a lot better
Hey Erock I appreciate this video and you are right there isnt much videos like this and it gives a perspective of trying something new and seeing if its better.
That was my goal! Yes, I noticed there was a big gap on RUclips for that type of content. I was genuinely curious what would happen if I switched. Sadly, all I learned is that both platforms are good at gaming and can have different issues in other categories. However, I am excited to switch back to AMD and see how that goes for me.
I would just sell 14900K. Kind of pointless to have a test system with more horse power than main system even though 7800X3D is better gaming, Its got far less CPU power and may be slower gaming than fast RAM 14900K assuming you can get it reliable lol. But hey 7800X3D system will be more reliable as 13th and 14th Gen high end has not been reliable and inconsistent stability more than just IMC from my experience.
Though I kind of jumped back on Intel train thinking my own test system which I got a great deal on a 12600KF and DDR4 mobo plus RAM it felt kind of not to make sense to have a test system with more cores (Even if they are e-cores). And also Golden Cove clock normalized IPC almost on par or maybe 2% better than Zen 4. So ok 14th Gen should be more reliable right just enforce Intel stock limits. Nope was not and reports around suggest its worse. So returned stuff and went back to AMD.
So went back to AMD and will just keep e-cores disabled on test system so my main system is 8 strong cores with the 3D cache and my test system is 6 strong cores with only DDR4. Who cares if clock normalized IPC is maybe 2% better per CInebench R23. It still has 2 less strong cores overall and clocked a bit lower anyways and using weaker only 3200 DDR4.
Thank you for the advice and feedback. I really do appreciate you sharing your experience and thoughts with me! I am likely going back to AM5.
lots of changes and such but have you changed out the asus mobo? have had an issue with asus and voltages with intel chips on my 12,13 and 14th gen
I have not. The only intel motherboards I have are both Asus. So you think if I use another brand, the issue will go away? What voltages were changed and what were the values?
@@ErockOnTech changed my mobo to Gigabyte from Asus, all problem solved
@@ErockOnTech same for me don’t know why but asus motherboard caused issues for me and changing to msi solved issues.
Over the many years I used to build computers, I learned that not all CPU's or mother boards are created equal. I built two identical systems on the same day and one wouldn't run. I swapped the CPU's and they both ran a treat and lived long and productive service lives. Why wouldn't one CPU run in one mother board instead of the other... no one knows. The weirdest issue I had was a mother board that wouldn't run in a certain box. I switched the box and the MB ran a treat. Likewise, sometimes I had to use different settings to make the same build work right.
In fact AMD used to specify the voltage on each CPU. I had two CPUs come out of the same tray, shipped on the same day with different listed voltages... well that was a long time ago... but it still applies.
The fact is that some CPU's are just better than others, even if they both passed QC. Likewise true of mother boards. There's a reason why HP used to disable overclocking on some of their motherboards. They knew in some cases it would work and in other cases, it would lead to massive service headaches.
As a software engineer, your code either runs or it doesn't. In the hardware world things aren't as simple. Every physical thing has it's own set of properties, just like no two people are exactly alike. The fact that you are working with "open box" parts might give you a clue that someone else might have found certain shortcomings with that part.
I do mostly repairs now, as I'm retired. I will still build occasional PC's and repair PC's, but I never touch anything that's been returned or refurbished. I wasted way too much time chasing intermittent issues in returned or refurbished hardware in my youth to do it again as I don't have that much time left to live aggravated and frustrated over a part that randomly fails or crashes every few hundred hours. That's not to say I've never installed new parts that failed, but knowing that the part or machine has been returned for reasons unknown is too big a risk to chance. And here's a secret... no one is going to test returned equipment for a few hundred hours to see if it will fail. If it get's tested at all, it's on and off the bench, usually in a few minutes. No one has time to run 1000 test cycles. In fact, one bench tech told me that many of the returns he refurbs are perfectly good, in his opinion, they were retuned because the buyer found a better deal or changed his mind... so when the hardware passes the first test, he pretty much assumes it's fine and doesn't even look for more problems. Stay away from things labeled open box, that are likely returned or refurbished, they will break your heart.
(And yes, some perfectly good stuff is returned and you can save a few bucks on it... feel free to ignore my advise if you are feeling lucky.)
Thumbnail is dope!
Thanks bro 🔥
I have an i7 & rtx2070 super...love it. I play current games on high/ultra graphics with over 60fps. I want in the near future to upgrade. But i heard the rtx 40 series are bad. What about 30? And if i switch to amd processor + amd graphics card close to 40 series performance? Please help
It depends on what you want and how much your budget is. I would recommend these cards. You can decide for yourself how much you want to spend.
New
- 4070 Super
- 4070 TI
- 7800XT
- 7900 GRE
Used
3070 ti
3080
6800 XT
6700 XT
6900 XT
@ErockOnTech Thank you very much! I have 2000-2500 budget no used harware please! Would you recommend switching to amd? I heard they are faster and consume less power...i honestly don't know the difference. What would you recommend for that budget? Thank you
Man, I'm so confused on what to upgrade to from my i3 9100F. My budget is about $400, so I'm thinking i5 12400F or Ryzen 5 7500f. Another thing is pc parts are way more expensive in the Philipppines.
Im sorry to hear that about the pricing. I would definitely recommend AMD.
I also have latency issue with my mouse, even with my gen 4 intel.
But only because i have mouse receiver on the front panel and, every time i plug in the usb3 flashdrive next of it on the front panel.
The latency issue happens. It runs win7 by the way.
So, I wonder if that is the very core/beginning of intel's latency issue. I feel like, the cause is the usb3 driver tho.
Either way.
Im intel and win7 user. But i would love to build the latest win7 platform (native chip driver supported).
There is win7 driver for X470 AM4. Which means i can install ryzen 5800x3d in theory.
But it seems, it only offers one M2 PCIe gen 3 slot.
Meanwhile, even with just the 7th gen platform of intel (which, its supposed to be the equal of ryzen 3000 series, i think?).
Like, the Z270, it already offers two M2 PCIe gen 3 slots.
So, it is such dilemma for me. Either you ll have the fast processor (the latest AM4 proci) without many expansion options,
or so many expansions options but not the fastest proci.
I mean, i would love to make this pc as dual boot (win 7 and win 10). And having various work spaces and games at the same time.
Therefore, i would love to have the fastest proci with pretty numbers of expansion slots.
My 13900k degraded after one year to the point where i had to downclock to 5.,1ghz just to be stable, so got a 14900k and even just starting on windows baseline profiles degraded faster and still crashed randomly on games, so I switched to amd 7800x3D and a 670E mb by just returning my 14900k for the same value and now finally stable more then ever. also read about someone who went threw 6 14900k's that all died so wasnt gonna go back to that
Oh wow that is so crazy to hear! Thank you for sharing!
I jusy switched from a 7800x3d to a 14900k. So far, i haven't experienced any issues. Its been a really smooth transition. My am5 platform has been a headache since day 1 with a ton of random issues. In my experience and with the games I play, im getting better fps and better 1% lows. Leading to a more enjoyable experience.
While I havent had issues with intel. I have had issues with the mobo trying to push crazy high wattage. Thats not an intel issue. Its the motherboard..just set to intel defaults and its good to go. Though i did take the time to OC/UV it myself. Its been fantastic so far
You're getting better 1% lows with an Intel CPU over the 7800X3D?
What are you playing, Bejeweled?
I've seen a lot of people talking trash about AMD and RUclipsrs that are saying the truth, they say that they're not fans, but they also say that "if you're a smart person... bla bla... AMD drivers and platforms are so complex, I don't understand... " and they repeat those kind of things a lot along their videos... I just leave a dislike and hit the button to not recommend that kind content. I'm glad that your AMD system is working great now. I think that I'm going to buy AMD next time.
Look at this fanboy of objectivity and neutrality, offering a balanced opinion :P For me, it's about the best bang for my buck, in pure gaming. At the time of researching, Oct 2023, AMD offered the best bang for my buck in terms of CPU price, motherboard price, and cooling options (being able to use a good quality air cooler instead of being sort of 'forced' into an AIO) in my market, I know this is different in other markets where Intel may offer the best bang for your buck. Edit: I just want to say it was your AM4 vs AM5 and PC vs console content that got me into your channel in the first place :)
Thank you for letting me know what brought you here! That’s always valuable information to have as a creator! Your opening line there was quite funny 😄
Strange. I have had the world of USB issues on AMD. Switching to Intel solved all. Waiting on your follow up video. I suggest just moving the Windows install as is into the AMD system and see if it happens.
Thank you for that suggestion. I’ll do that before wiping the OS and doing a clean install. Technically, with each new CPU install you should do a fresh windows install. Especially, if the brand is different. But before I do that for my final build, I’ll absolutely use your suggestion. Thank you.
I dont understand why half the comments or more are running ridiculous amounts of ram. I have an i7-13700K, mated to a TUF GAMING Z790-PLUS WIFI mobo, and 32GB (2×16GB) DDR5 6,000 CL30. I find this when configured with the appropriate manufacturers XMP (XMP2), is the most optimal for 90% of gaming builds. GPU is a TUF GAMING 4070 SUPER OC for reference. I run most games at 1440P, and by no means have some god level build. But 128GB of ram is just overkill.
every time I think about switching to AMD, I come across another horror story about the experience and change my mind. I recently just upgraded to a 13600. Idk man, the amount of shilling makes me nervous too. You'd think AMD was the second coming of christ, even though there's so many horror stories. I pretty much never see stories about Intel cpus having massive stability issues and whatnot.
Hey I get it entirely. Personally, I never had an issue with AMD until I went to AM5. But I was an early adopter and unfortunately, early adopters are basically bug testers. Here it is over a year later and AM5 is so much better. I switched to Intel thinking it was perfect and the best thing ever. As the people I have interacted with made Intel sound perfect. At first, it was perfect, but after about 3 months it started to fail me.
@ErockOnTech Though the temptation to respond to trolling posts ('You are gay', 'bald' blah-blah) is understandable, the worst thing one can do is to respond. It gives them oxygen. Ignore them - It hits them hardest by depriving them of that which they desperately seek. Notice. Keep well and thank you for your channel. (Subscribed)
Thank you! Well said! I appreciate the kind words and the sub! Much appreciated!
The only reason why most people that are sponsored or have the money go with Intel is because they have a 4090. Well, I have a 4080 I went with AMD’s Ryzen 7 7800X3D. The 4090 is about 25 to 30% faster or so then the 4080. To be honest, only people with money care about the 4090, and the latest and greatest.
I can afford many 4090's, I just refuse to support that price point for a gaming GPU, so its not just the "can't afford" crowd.
I really enjoy the path of the APU's of AMD i love small builds. Really looking to get a sweet my64 9000 series APU built (if possible). Time will tell.
Best of luck!
Skill issue, never had any of these issues. I AM A COMPUTER GOD! I miss when you could have a Intel CPU with a nVidia motherboard and AMD(ATI) GPU :P. I'm so old now....
lol I appreciate the comment! :)
I think for the next build I'll go for intel. I've used a 3950x and the bios bugs were horrible, the unstable windows experience, stuttering and cold boots and stuff. It took a bit more than a year to get it stable. Without forgetting the pain with memories. So, I think intel would just be a better experience.
The downside of intel is I don't like those stupid e cores or dumb cores.
That's the thing I like from AMD though. Real cores for real simulation work.
Update: and the experience with windows 11 + 3950x was laggy. Like slower explorer. Not sure if all the AMD users do have it, whether is just AMD users besides the processor type while intel users are doing just fine
Frame Chasers isn't going to like your claim that AMDip isn't a real phenomenon. I'm interested to see that because that man kinda has brainwashed me to think of AMD as an inferior product and has added to my FOMO and feelings that my system is inadequate to it's intel counterparts on my 5800x3d.
Respectfully, I don’t care what he likes.
I don’t run my channel based off what someone else might think. I run it based off data. Show me the concrete data. Does he, or anyone for that matter, have a multi game benchmark with multiple runs showing this supposed dip occurring in a repeatable state? Or is the data presented ONLY in call of duty and a single run? It’s called editing magic. You can make a video show whatever you want my friend. Where’s the repeatable data?
Intel once ruled, so did dinosaurs.
Not as if i care in the slightest.
Intel 13 and 14th gen cpus are diying after a few months , silicon death, starts as general errors, games crashing, etc, change to new same CPU, problem goes away.
I'm a intel user, but I'm afraid of new stuff. Etc
You are correct! I just saw the story AFTER publishing this video!
Enjoyed your video. It was detailed & very helpful Sorry that you had latency issues with the Intel CPU. Will check out some RUclipsr's channel's that had that issue. People build PC's with CPU's based on their preference. I've built PC's with both AMD & Intel but I prefer AMD. I just built a PC with the AMD Ryzen 5 8500G CPU. First time building a PC with a AM5 CPU. Wanted to build it with an AM5 CPU for experience. It's running very good. Look forward to watchng more of your content.
Just facts, AMD and Intel aren't any further apart than AMD and nVidia in the GPU sector. Every brand has their strengths and weaknesses.
Well said!
7:26 I KNOW EXACTLY WHICH CLOWN UR REFERRING TO 💀💀💀💀
I know the z690 can't handle ram speeds as well as the z790 motherboards, and thermal throttle a little sooner on many boards.
Yes, you are correct. However, that is not the cause of my latency issues.
i have amd 7800x3d +7900xt here i felt everything is fine but watching this vid but now i see if i fast drag a window /mouse cursor it only draws a few, so theres 1cm gaps between cursor arcs on a 27inch monitor 1440p 170hz , putting mouse trails on looks like a star field ! couldnt find any setting for update rate in mouse settings and every googled guide fixates on mouse speed not fps so looks like a win 10 issue for me
I hope you can find a solution. Thank you for sharing your experience.
@@ErockOnTech i would never race the mouse around like that in normal use and dragging open windows is ok or less noticable, just mentioned it in context with your video and going from 4770k to 7800x3d doesnt feel like an upgrade other than gaming
7:24 oh boy lol. I respect you not naming and shaming, but as soon as i heard about the AMDip, i knew you had been exposed to a certain "fame chaser" out there. 😅
...shhhhhh lol :)
People used to say AMD FX on Am3 are space heaters ,,, nOw look at u intel😂
“My my how the turn tables.”
- Michael Scott
7800X3D is simply better and more importantly, more reliable
I agree. I switched back to the 7800X3D.
@@ErockOnTech I hate to take sides on PC parts but Intel has just broken my trust lately!
@@ErockOnTech which mobo are on yon w/ the 7800x3d? what does your dpc latency look like?
@@ChairmanMeow1 Same here.
@@supernice_auto Asus ROG Strix X70-E-F Gaming Wifi. No idea on the DPC. Where do I see that?
Sell the Z690 and the 14700k, and grab a B760M AORUS ELITE X AX (the best cheap high frequency memory capable board) the Z790 AORUS ELITE AX ICE its the bigger version, but more expensive. With does boards you can push you 7200 kit up to 7800, or even 8000 if you got lucky on the memory controller.
Thank you for this advice. I’ll definitely consider it.
@@ErockOnTech and, if you are gonna try some fun with memory on intel, grab the LGA 1700 custom bracket too, that can help with cpu contact signal improvement/Cooling.
Yeah man I'm kind of like you but an old guy. I made my daughters amd computers back in the 90's. Always stayed with AMD as I was familiar with them. I have always thought the way Intel has several different platforms for their many dif chips is confusing. That has kept me from trying Intel. Now I don't have to. Your experience is helpful to me. Thankyou
I'm happy I could help you. Thank you for letting me know!
I'am using a 35w cpu! gives 80% of a 65w cpu from intel :) and you can boost some of it
That's cool!
Dang, I'm running a 12700k with zero latency issues. I was planning to eventually put a 14700k in this machine to get a bit more life out of it but might not after all. Good video
I had similar Usb problem on an Msi board. The Pch chip on the mb handles Usb among other systems. In bios you can adjust the voltage on this chip and you can also see the temperature in Hwinfo64. You should stay under 65C on that chip. Some mb run too low voltage on this chip because of inadequate cooler on this chip. Its often cooked from the air coming from the graphic card too. Its always placed in the upper part of the mb and usally behind the graphic card. So try to keep this chip cool (below 65C idealy) and adjust the voltage to 0.84-.0.9V. 0.87V is a good middlepoint if you can keep the chip below 70C at all times. I have a feeling that silicon quality varies a lot on these chips. My z690 Asus ran that chip at 0.92V and Msi z790i ran the Pch at 0.82V and this made the usb drop out completely a few times.
I'd pull the boot device, replace it, install Windows 10 on it and then go from there. If you don't like it just replace the old boot device with windows 11 already install on it and you'd be good to go. You could even switch it back and forth for a comparison.
Not a bad idea. Sadly, Microsoft is killing off Windows 10 support unless you pay for it here soon.
i keep going back to Intel. AMD has always just not been stable.
Dude I don’t care about neither company as well. But the reason that you switched from one company chip to another is REALLY STUPID, just because you couldn’t get the ram speed you wanted. Wao I can tell you are so…let me just shut up.
You seem upset by something so trivial. Yet, I’m the one that “is so..”. Lol yeah ok. Chill out man. Use what you want and why you want. I’ll do the same. I’m just sharing my experiences here. If you appreciate that, awesome. If not, there are other tech RUclipsrs you can watch. Cheers.
Also, there was a lot going on outside of just the ram speed. That is a gross over simplification. I’d suggest watching the full video series to get the full story. That is if you’re actually interested in truly understanding and not just judging for the sake of being an internet troll.
Problem sounds like sysmain service is on. Aka the old prefetch or superfetch. Would explain why the problem doesn’t happen until months after the build, since it needs time to build up
So, recent information states that Intel 13th and 14th Gen i9's are having instability issues. Have you seen these claims? EDIT: Shouldn't have to 'have' "skills" to fix a issue for a Out Of the Box experience. That's on Intel to resolve, not the end user who wants to plug and play.
I saw these claims after I published this video yes.
@@ErockOnTech I've not seen any large YT channels report on this, and having tested it themselves. Just a few channels and some posts here and there.
Could be the CPU or the memory controller, but either way, a proclaimed stability issue.
Reminds me of AMD's Zen4 - AM5 voltage issues at launch. That was a AMD - Board Partner issue, users shouldn't have to worry about that.
I'm currently on a 12600k and I'm planning to switch to a 7800x3d for completely different reasons. I need space on my desk so I want to get rid of my tower and build an itx system. At first I thought I would upgrade to a 14600k but I learned very quickly that I wont be able to cool it with acceptable noise levels. So I will switch to a processor that is twice as efficient from AMD (which might be a bit slower in some benchmarks, but thats fine) (a new mainboard is required either way because my 12600k sits on ATX) The manufacturer doesnt matter, what matters is if the product fits your needs.
If you find yourself doing a lot of CPU heavy workloads, the 14900k would be a much better workhorse than the x3d, say for video rendering, and that's a use case where latency isn't a concern. Then you could sell the 14700k
Good suggestions. Thank you.
As building new pc, I'm sad I have to pick problems that will be easier to deal with. Rather than just building system that just works.
I hear you and understand. Here is my advice. Go with AMD. Get a DDR5 RAM kit that is on your motherboard's QVL. For your first boot, DO NOT USE the xmp/Expo profile. Leave everything stock. Boot into Windows. Install all updates. Then go back to the bios and use the memory overclocking profile. Also, make sure before you do any of this, update your bios.
Why did you care so much about the ram speed when you had the 7800X3D? I tested few games with mine and it made little to no difference when I was running 4800Mhz vs 6000Mhz
huh?
@@StevoHDA Huh? 😂😂😂
Too much babbling! Get to the point!
My AMD system boots up in around 10 seconds now, but my old motherboard was troublesome in many cases. Everything you mentioned I had that problem x 10. I returned two Gigabyte Master high-end boards before switching from an X670E AORUS MASTER (rev. 1.x) to a PRIME B650M-A WIFI II. Now, everything is functioning smoothly and quickly. I downgraded the specs significantly, but I'm satisfied with the performance. Also, my motherboard might have had a compromise at the factory, and I've read that Asus had similar issues with some of theirs.
I’m making the switch this weekend. I’ve had a horrible time with my intel cpu . Blue screen of death . Heat problem now it’s to the point I can’t even open games
I’m sorry to hear that. What AMD CPU are you getting?
@@ErockOnTech 7950x3D
My 14700k build is rock solid at 7000mhz. Z790 Rog strix E. You actually have the same exact ram as me and did the same thing as me. 7200 was not stable haha
Haha oh wow how wild is that?
@@ErockOnTech Only occt was showing errors. It's weird.
Dang didnt inow intel had issues
if amd never started ryzen, then we will still have a i7 with 4 cores for 500$
You are probably correct!
1.AMD Ram compatiblity compared to 1 year ago is night and day difference if you have your bios updated to the latest version ofc, similar to how things were with 1st Ryzens on DDR4, when they released it was a nightmare for close to 1 year after that things started to look a lot different. At the moment there are multiple people reporting they can get 7200-7600mhz xmp working out of the box without any additional tuning and I saw quite a few people even adding a little bit of dram voltage and getting 8000mhz on those same ram kits. Given how 1 year ago getting 6000mhz to work was hit or miss thats a huge difference imo. Boot times are also a lot better.
2. intel problems could be MPO needs to be disabled, or windows updates screwing drivers, it happens quite a lot even on AMD, both are Windows problems, can't really fault intel there its just the OS sh!tting itself imo. Another thing might be some peripheral or capture card or anything like that triggering windows update to auto install something crappy/wrong driver as an update. You could easily make a fresh windows 11 install and if the problem is gone make occasional system restore points and as soon as the problem starts again(if it does) you can go check all your drivers/softwares and etc and revert back to a previous point to see whats different.
3. At the moment the reasonable choice is AMD, especially if you care about value, power draw, temps, future proof, but if you get intel to work without that problem you have and you enjoy it more then there is nothing wrong with that either. If I had both of these systems I would just switch them around every 3-6months to see how they are progressing with bios/windows updates and etc.
Things are always changing in time, but last 12 months its safe to say that AM5 improved quite a lot, but I can't say the same for Intel.
P.S. CPUs I had last 12 months:
Intel 12400F(OCed with BCLK with external clock gen to 5.1GHZ core and 4.6GhZ cache) with 6200mhz DDR5
5800x3d with 3600mhz and 4000mhz ram kits + PBO and -30mv CO
7800x3d with 7200mhz ram kit OCed to 7600mhz with tighter timings + PBO and -30mv CO
In terms of latency and snappiness 12400F and 7800x3d are comparable. Boot times are comparable. Experience is comparable ofc excluding the performance difference. In terms of performance 12400F and 5800x3d were comparable, cuz of the OC ofc. I actually opted to keep intel as a main system for almost 1 year, then 5800x3d cpu mobo ram sold and 7800x3d happened.
Anyway, thanks for sharing your experience including the frustrating parts and I really admire that you are not being biased/fanboying over any brand. I really appreciate that, so I wrote my experiences and thoughts, hope you find them informative and/or helpful.
Thank you for this detailed feedback. I fully agree about AMD and the RAM improvements. My new AMD system is already night and day compared to the old system. They really improved things and I am excited to give it another try. I also agree about Windows. Windows 11 especially seems to have so many issues. I think it's because they have so much out of box bloat on it and there are mico updates almost daily it seems. I do have auto updates turned off. But every time I manually check for updates, there is a new update waiting for me. At this time, I am planning to make my main PC the 7800X3D. I will use either the 14700K or the 14900K in the test bench. I will then sell the other.
@@ErockOnTech Absolutely, I would love to have a cleaner windows like XP or 7 again when things were just simple and were just working. I hate the fact that windows is moving towards touchscreens/tablets type of UI and that just makes things so much worse for normal Desktop PC users, especially the enthusiasts who just wants a clean Windows that just works and everything is easily accessible. We can all hope and pray some of the next Windows versions will be clean and most of the issues will be resolved, but I think this dream will stay for eternity and never come true :D
There should be 2 separate versions of Windows - one to be more tablet/touchscreen oriented with all the bloat and bullshit and semi-broken fancy UI and the other one just barebone Windows where everything is just one-two clicks away and also allows users to install only the things they need and use Windows in their own way. Like we got to the point where simplicity in Windows is gone and is too much to ask for and thats kinda sad.
I'm happy to hear you are having a blast with AMD now.
For the testbench maybe whichever Intel you manage to OC the most to have the least amount of CPU bottleneck. Pushing intel's Core clock, cache clock and then ram clock really changes everything quite a bit and you can feel the results, especially the whole system snappiness and reduced latency from the cache clock, core clock in gaming performance and ram helps both a bit, but its very time consuming and the temps are quite annoying to deal with.
Anyway, thanks for the nice chat, I'm looking forward to watching more of your stuff in the future and Good luck!
@@ErockOnTech 9000 series improved memory compatibility by a lot. I could never get 8000 to boot or be stable on most 7000 chips, whereas in most 9000 chips I can stabilize 8000 100% 24hr VST3 stable, and can even boot 8400MHz, but obviously its impossible to make that stable at the moment. Not tht it makes any difference on intel cpus.
Not buying intel until their CPU’s don’t degrade by just existing
you will have a great experience on intel if you have a high end cooler. the TDP on intel is just way to high
I do have a 360 AIO on my intel setup. Sadly, I still have the latency issues.