KK2.0 Multicopter PI Gain Tuning for Beginners
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- Опубликовано: 20 май 2013
- This is the last video in a 3 part series of converting the AeroSky quadcopter from a MultiWii controller to a KK 2.0. This video shows what steps I went through to dial in my PI gains for a beginner pilot. This is the HobbyKing guide that I used for reference:
www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/st...
Please feel free to share you gain settings in the comments so others can benefit. My settings are:
Roll/Pitch P Gain: 75
Roll/Pitch P Limit: 50
Roll/Pitch I Gain: 40
Roll/Pitch I Limit: 20
Yaw P Gain: 75
Yaw P Limit: 20
Yaw I Gain: 30
Yaw I Limit: 10
My first quad was a KK1 board from HobbyKing and getting the gains dialed in was a lot more difficult since they were analog potentiometers. Not to mention that it didn't have auto-level! This KK2 board is an amazing controller for the money.
Part 1 of this series shows how to upgrade KK2.0 firmware to version 1.5:
• How to Upgrade Hobby K...
Part 2 of this series shows KK2.0 ESC calibration, motor Layout, and auto-level w/ default settings:
• KK2.0 Multicopter ESC ...
Man I use to watch your videos everyday after school. Seeing this brought back so many memories lol. This was before DJI took over
Caro Dennis, con il tuo video sono finalmente riuscito a dettare il mio primo drone. Non parlo inglese ma con il video sono riuscito a capire come fare. Ancora tante grazie. Silvano dall'Italia
silvano podda Sto utilizzando Google Translate. Spero che tu possa capire questo messaggio . Grazie per la visione il mio video e sono contento che ci ha aiutato ! Tutti i migliori , Dennis
Thanks for sharing your build info. It's always great to hear what others are doing and I'll be on the lookout for your PID settings.
I have my quad kit and kk2.0 board arriving this week. Other than a hubsan x4, I have 0 experience with quads. I'm super happy that I stumbled across your tutorials, because now I feel confident about getting the controller setup right away. Thanks man, great work!
Dude, I just have to tell ya, I came from the same board set ups as you did..and you got me cleared up, and have to totally agree with being able to toggle these settings is soooooo, much better...great job, had a great time getting your info on this
Thanks for the feedback and glad to know we shared similar experiences. Good luck with your build!
I appreciate the kind words. I've been really impressed with the KK2 board and it's capabilities. Much improved since the days of the KK1. Happy flying to you too.
Posted over a year ago and still helpful. Thanks for taking the time to do this.
Mike Fuday No problem at all. Thanks for watching.
Very glad to hear that. Hope you're in the air and stable now!
Ashley, I just watched and it brought a tear to my eye to see you get in the air :) Love the acrylic frame and your attention to detail. Job well done and I'll definitely be keeping up with your channel. All the best.
Aditya, thank you for the feedback. I'm glad these videos are helping. Take care.
So happy to stubble upon this today!!! I will be finishing up my Quad tonight and getting her 1st test flight in... glad to see I can set up channel 5 for toggling safe mode on and off! Good stuff man!!
***** Great to hear it. Good luck with getting your build in the air!
You're welcome and I'm happy to hear things are working well.
I appreciate it Chris. The KK2 is an awesome little FC for the money. I will definitely be doing a build with one of these in the future.
Thank you from Sicily, my dad and I fixed our drone with your kind help. Fly safe!
HCarota You're very welcome. Thanks for watching and greetings from Austin, TX.
I am amazed that it is so stable you can fly it in your garage. This shows me where I should be in terms of stability. I'm going to try your suggestions and see where that gets me to. Thanks so much for the great video!
David Dennis Awesome to hear. Good luck and keep us posted.
Legend! So glad you liked it, and thanks so much for replying and subscribing : ) Looking forward to watching the rest of your videos! All the best dude.
No problem at all. It was a good learning experience for me. I'm really impressed with the KK2.
You da man, helped so much, I was afraid I would never learn to fly. Thank you!
Dennis what a Great Job, all you video tutorial are first rate, I know the person that win's the auction will be happy with all the work you put in this Quad. This is why I love your site Garage pilots where good people help each other out, you may not have all the answers but some one out there can make it work. Thank you for all the hard work you have done to make this happen. Thank you very much have a good Day.
Dude this was beyond helpful! Thank you so much for making this video. I recently purchased the quanum venture with a kk2.0 FC and as a beginner had a very hard time controlling the copter with default settings. Also, my self level mode wasn't setup properly so that was an extremely helpful tip. After following these guidelines I feel much more confident with the quanum.
Dionatronics So glad to hear that. Thanks for the feedback.
Thanks Larry. I appreciate you reaching out to me to help with the build. I'll get everything packaged up and shipped your way. Then I'll be anxious to hear how it flies for you.
You all probably dont give a damn but does someone know a method to get back into an instagram account..?
I somehow lost the account password. I appreciate any tricks you can give me.
Dennis, thank you thank you thank you very much for taking the time and effort to make this series. I bought the same "RTF" copter late last year and your videos helped me update the MultiWii software properly and eventually decide that the MultiWii board was not nearly as intuitive and useful as the KK boards.
I just installed a new kk 2.1 board and using a combination of excellent instructions from Hobbyking and this series of 3 videos, I'm up and running with a very stable copter and am looking forward to hours of fun flying it with my son.
Awesome Bill! Glad to hear it. There's nothing more rewarding than getting a stable build and sharing it with a child. Take care.
Got it! Had one mixed up motor connection. Your settings are spot on, and thank you again!!! Im new to this and a lot of fun with it.
sabyx5 Glad to hear that. Hope it's flying well!
Wow, nice! Thanks for sharing these. The next KK2 450 build I do I will try these out and let you know how they do. You're right though, these are definitely lower than the original ones I posted. I would have expected them to be closer, but I'll give them a try in the future.
good job Dennis once again. Keep it up and keep the videos coming. They help out so much......
Dennies,
Thanks FOR ur time answering back. In fact i followed step by step all of ur vids on the tricopter. A big help INFACT. The big problem was the motor Mount on the tail. The Carbon was not strong enough TO handle the motor on what reason i did not know why it keeps wabblin till it ended wrecking. I changed it to a metal plate and now i can start LEARNING TO FLY. A big Thanks to u and your vids it helped a LOT. Merry Christmas in advance and hope to see more of your big help vids. God Bless and more power.
bobot021070 So glad to hear you got it working! Merry Christmas to you too. Please keep us posted on your progress.
EXCELENT . Thanks for all your help in these tutorials.
thanks dennis, i got my quad in the air , you are the man
chedda214 So glad to hear that. Thanks for the good words.
top man!!! mine was yaw turning left, and pitching up on on corner... had to trim all thr way on 3axis to counter it, but with your settings its all straight and fine! thanks, great,
great video my friend very informative great work bud and what your doing it for happy flying !!!!!!
Excellent just made a quad and never flown one before so this was invaluable 👍
Thanks for the feedback. I'm about to package this quad up and ship it back to Soldier53Flyer, but in my next KK2 build I'll look into this. For this build I left the stick scaling settings at the default.
Thanks for all the videos. I was really unhappy with my H100...until I purchased the KK 2.1. After following your videos and setting it up I'm now able to mount a GoPro and take some great aerial footage (without a gimbal). It's a completely different machine!
Just Gumby So glad to hear you got it configured and in the air. Very coo. Thanks for sharing and fly safe.
You are like the best advocate on Quads. I wish you were my neighbor, keep up the good work.
fade2nada Thanks so much for the good words. It's very much appreciated :)
I had no idea, new with quad. Flew it out of the box without knowing any settings and it kept violently flipped from take off. Broke blades.
After watching this I feel stupid flying it . Waiting for new blades . But THANK YOU SO MUCH for video. I will step by step follow recommendations and will see hopefully it flies.
If just a nice hover, I'll be super happy.
THANKS!!!!!!!
sabyx5 Good to hear. I hope this helps and that you get back in the air soon.
many thanks for this tutorial, excelent as always!
Dennis,
Thanks for sharing your experience on this video, it helped me zero in on setting up my KK2. I am coming from a KK version 1.2 board.
I do have to say, that I have learned that perhaps the quality of the equipment has plenty to do with the value of the settings. I started with your settings and they were too high for my quad. I have a HobbyKing 450 board, Turnigy 12 amp ESC, Turnigy 1100 KVA motors. I will share my settings in a part two post.
Thank you for explaining the esc calibration!
aerialphotographydrone No problem at all. Hope it helped and thanks for watching.
Just what I was looking for. Good show.
Thanks Wayne. I appreciate you following along.
thank you sir! Your videos have helped me a lot, i appreciate your efforts.
dude you vid was on point, It really help me out a lot THANKS!!
+Michael Howard No problem at all. Glad it helped.
Dave, it was a request from a friend of mine. He wanted to get rid of the MWC and put the KK2 in. I agree that the quad flies great with the MultiWii and my buddy just wanted to give KK2 a try as well as be able to configure it without a computer. I haven't seen any oscillations with firmware 1.6 like you mention, but he also has the gains dialed way down. Thanks for the comment.
Great video. Appreciate the effort.
Hank Stites Thanks for watching.
Good vid...thnx pids were driving me crazy
great video, thank you so much. im building a quad and this was an incredible tutorial.
Aniketh Rao Glad to hear it and good luck with your build.
Hello, I have tried almost all settings for the beginner and this one was by far the most stable especially the rudder (turning a 360 in one spot) self level is as good as you will get.
Take my advice input the figures and start to enjoy flying your quad, THATS WHY YOU BOUGHT IT! RIGHT?
As you advance you will fine tune the settings but for a day one flyer there is nothing on RUclips that even comes close.
Thanks and well done!
Great video thanks for taking the time.
Michael L No problem. Thanks for watching.
Dennis,
part 2 my settings.
Firmware ver 1.6+++
PI Editor
Roll Pitch Yaw
P-Gain 40 40 40
P-Limit 100 100 20
I-Gain 12 12 12
I-Limit 20 20 10
Self Leveling
P-Gain 40 (matched Acro Mode settings)
P--Limit 20 default
ACC Trim Roll: not yet tuned
ACC Trim Pitch: not yet tuned
Aux Switch Setup:
Position 1: ACRO
Position 2: not active
Position 3: SL Mix Medium
Misc Settings
Min Throttle:20
Height Dampening: 0
Height D. Limit: 0
Alarm Volts:10.5V
Servo Filter: off
Motor Layout: X-Quad
Thank you for the vid Dennis.And the Page link, Very helpful. Kazz
Kazz- Mann No problem at all. Thanks for the feedback.
Sweet garage. Mini ramp and everything.
Invitingsauce Thanks man. I appreciate that.
Thanks for sharing your gains. It's always good to know what others are doing. How is your quad flying now?
Very nice!
Yes, do the P gain with I gain set to 0. But once you get the P gain in place start to bump up your I gain to where it feels comfortable. Or, as the HobbyKing guide states you can set your I gain from anywhere between 50-100% of your P gain. I know that's a wide range but I've found that 50% worked okay for me.
Ok that's fine,I'm new to RUclips so I'm still learning how it works they don't even let upload long vids so hope to get it right. Thanks again. God Bless
bobot021070 No problem. Enjoy the learning process as there's a ton of information out there. Stay tuned and thanks for watching. Merry Christmas!
You're welcome. Thanks for watching.
Dennis
Thanks for replying...
I believe this is a fine source for the PID description.
I have another question.
My quadcopter is always turning to the right site so i have continusly toe correct with the YAW.....
This makes it difficult to fly...
Any explanation???
Thanks
Dan
Yes, you should have everything you need. I'm sure it's self-explanatory, but the reason I put the battery on bottom is so the KK2 would be on top and accessible to make changes via the LCD buttons. Thanks for the comment.
I believe this exists to not allow your multirotor to over-oscillate and end up flipping. I hope that makes sense and I'm not a PID expert. Just learning from others and what I've read.
Thank you!
Hey, thanks for the great videos, it's really appreciated, especially by people like myself who have no experience with these quads. I just hope the FCC doesn't outlaw them, but there's a very good chance that they'll require some kind of a permit and licensing before long. It's already against the law to fly one in a National Park. The planet would be a much better place if people like yourself, who just want to help others were more plentiful.
just sayin.... the US would be a better place if the Fed didn't overstep it's boundaries and take land from The People in the form of National Parks!
Thank you. I will do that.
Eric Ankudavicius No problem. Good luck.
Excellent video. One point about the aux toggle too and from self level mode. The channel limits need to be set at 125% or it may not detect the aux state.
Cheers.
What do your auto level gains look like? Have you tried lowering them to see how it responds? Maybe take them way down and then slowly bump them up as you test.
Great video. Can you confirm that with these settings that I can put full sticks forward or backwards ect and it won't flip over at all?
Hi I am new to quadcopter building. I have a quadcopter with the kk2.1.5 and I tried using the p gain settings you posted. When I tried to hover the quadcopter goes forward. Can you help me out please.
Hi, thanks for the great tutorial. Definitely useful if you could show some settings on the stick scaling with this setup. Thanks again.
Dick, my recommendation is to make record of your current gains and then start to dialing them up in increments of 10 as shown in the video. Move up 10, fly and see what you think. I'm confident you can get your gains to something that fits your needs. Let me if you run into any problems.
Seriously though, Dubro Balancer Wins. And Boy oh Boy Am I glad I didn't throw the KK2.1 boards away! I'm sold, I crashed this thing in snow, it was entirely covered in snow that melted in my car on a 20 mins drive, then I just dried it with an air compressor and it flies like never before! hahahah
Come Aun That's good to know. I haven't had any issues with snow since I live in Austin, TX :)
yes!!! thank you !
I have a Hex that I had built, and it oscillates pretty bad. I have the p gain all the way down to 15 and it still does it. Hard to fly that way for sure in acro mode. Thinking the kk2.1.5 is faulty or the escs are messing up
Hi thanks for this vid. I have -1 pitch on display what does this mean?
hello i just changed over from a naza to a kk2 and found this video very informative and well explained. the best video on youtube thanks. ps i have 3 drones with the naza gps , but all 3 have developed the same problem , would you be interested in helping me overcome them? thanks
Hey Dennis, I've watched yours and many other PI tutorials and think I understand it o.k. But my question is are these adjustments affecting the stable mode only or do they affect acro mode as well? I feel like I have to be on the stick the whole time in acro mode just to keep the quad from crashing. I have the KK2 with 1.6 firmware (I think 1.6, did it a while back). I see these videos with the quad on a string (Rolf's, and a couple others) and when properly tuned they stay in the attitude they were in until corrected. If they were in stable mode it would flatten back out. So I guess I may have just answered my own question. I've played with the PI in stable mode and can see what too high or low can do, but still not comfortable with flying acro yet.
Good luck with your experiments and it will be no time before you're flying in acro mode. It really is a lot of fun and challenging at the same time. I still use stable mode when I get in trouble or am doing some filming, but other than that I'm in acro trying to fine tune my skills. Thanks for the comment.
It's hard to say, but what flight controller and transmitter are you currently using?
Hi Dennis, when to increase 'Limit' parameter for roll/pitch and Yaw ?
I set up my quad exactly as you show in this video. It is a great start. Now I want to advance a little. When I let off the stick after a maneuver the quad swings from side a couple of times slowly. Then it regains level. Also, it does not respond quickly enough to forward movement and it is hard to fly into the wind. Can you help me with a notch up in settings and explain how to get there please?
Dennis..I have watched your video a couple times. Very informative. I'm trying to absorb P,I, Gains etc. I have a tricopter. When I turn the heli to face me, it will snap back 180 degrees away from me. I was thinking possible offset on the rudder motor. Not sure though. Any help would be great.
jerry zito That's a strange one that I've never seen happen. I don't have any experience with tricopters but will see if I can find anything out. Let us know if you come to any conclusions.
I have done the settings in the controller board kk 2.1.5 now when I'm giving maximum throttle ,at some point it was suddenly stopping by itself... please let me know what the problem is?
Thank you for a great video. Can you explain, what does the Limit do?
I normally leave them alone... #8 From the link below:
Q: What are the "limit" values in "PI Editor"?A: About the "limit" values. They set the maximum of the available motor power to be used for correction. 100 is 100%. The "I limit" value is also known as "anti wind-up" in PID theory.The limits is most important on the yaw axis. The prevent a large yaw correction from saturating the motors (giving full or no throttle), causing no control of the roll/pitch axis.The default values permit 30% ("P Limit" 20 + "I limit" 10) of the motor power to be used to yaw correction, making 70% available for the roll/pitch axis, the most important ones.You can increase "Yaw P Limit" for faster Yaw response. Note that Yaw response is also limited by the craft itself.You can increase "Roll/Pitch/Yaw I Limit" for increased heading-hold "memory", that is how far it can deviate and still return to original attitude. Too large memory can cause problems if you have a "blow out" on one of the axis, tries to correct it with opposite control input and then when the blow-out conditions disappear, the craft will try to return to an unknown attitude.Unless you know what you are doing, leave the limit values as default. Default values has no impact on The PI tuning process.Also leave the self-level "I gain" and "I limit" at zero. The I part of the self-level algorithm does not work well, this will be fixed later. (Accelerometers is too slow)
www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1675613
Thanks!
TobyRay No problem!
Dennis, you do seem to be easy to fly! but build my Quadcopter with many difficulties and I am on my first flight! I do not know if they are for my PI values, could you possibly make a video to show how we do to adjust and how to fly?
awesome video. I am using the same settings in my small 220mm blackout clone.
my quad is very sloppy in yaw input, it keeps on rotating even after i let go of the sticks, wat should i change to get snappy yaw outputs???
thanks
kushagrgoyal It's so hard to say without more info, but this is a great thread that hopefully can help:
forums.openpilot.org/topic/13456-constant-slight-yaw/
Good luck and keep us posted.
This is a great tutorial. Thanks. I'm building a hexacopter with the KK 2.0 board. Can I use the same settings?
positivecamber Thanks for the feedback. I'm not sure if you can use the same settings. I'd probably start with these gains and then bump them up a bit if necessary.
thanks,
works great for my quadcopter.........!!!!!1
+ritik kadwane Glad to hear that. Thanks for sharing.
Okay i see the aerosky has battery on top,but you have yourson bottom... If i buy the aerosky kit frame,esc's,motors,wires and the kk2 board will i have everything i need to have same setup as you have,so i can have battery mounted underneath also...thax for the info
Hello, Dennis, Thanks for videos . I've watched your video since built my Hexcopter w/ardupilot w/tyg-9x and worked great. thx again. but now my ardu is Kaput and have to moved my Turnigy H.A.L hexcopter and used with KK2.0 which i had for quite a while before got Arducopter.and now after setting this H.A.L frame the same one with ardu and it will not lift off. same motors ,same esc,same RX,TX, I'm lost now ,motors config is perfect plus setup which i used to setup same KK2 with diff frame and working fine but not this one . what's wrong..an idea?? thx for your time.
Hey, (using the kk2.1.5 board) I have a bicopter and the servos are acting crazy when I throttle up. Do you know how I can edit them so I can achieve flight testing?
Thanks.
I fixed it, don't worry about it
Hi Dennis,
Great video im having trouble with my quad i built with the KK2.1.5 when i take off it doesnt take off vertically it wants to take off sidewards and if i pushed it it would crsh 2 props in the ground, any help would be great?
Glenn Cook Some quick thoughts come to mind:
1. Have you calibrated ESCs?
2. Have you done the KK calibration process?
3. Are your motors and prop rotations correct?
Hi great info...i am just learning about quads...I like the dynam 650 arf for $140...i have a jr x9303 2.4.....will this board work well with the dynam 650....thax
What do you mean by safe mode? Are you referring to auto level mode?
Could you share the hobby king PDF that you have, it is from hobby kings website
in my project i use k.k. 2.1 controller board and fw is 1.9 but with your pi setting it can not flying. problem is that motors will start to increase in speed while others are decrease. please help me
sir.
I wanted to thank you also! Great job explaining the basic set procedure. Which did you like better, Apm or Multiwii? Thanks, Doug
Doug, thanks for the feedback. I really dig the MultiWii for just casual flying out of the box. For autonomous flight and mission planning APM is the way to go.
I'm no expert, but will tell you what I do know. Please consider reading the Wikipedia page for more specifics of PID controllers. So you now about gains..well limits are the values that you input that tells the controller if the value of the gain exceeds this limit to soften it and not let it surpass the limit. Example: P gain is 50% and value comes back from the gyro as 250. The gain value is now 125. If you have a limit set at 75 then the value of 125 will be dampened to 75.
hey awesome video! do you have any experience with the kk2.1.5 board? im using it on a 250mm quad with emax motors. I have to say im not happy with the P/I gains at all. Iv experimented with it, with little success. It still has alot of oscillation. Any advice?Thanks!
Mad Yet I haven't worked with that board but the first thing that comes to mine is to make sure you have it well isolated from vibrations. On such a small frame sometimes it's hard to keep the FC from seeing vibes from the props/motors. Also, try bringing the gains down pretty far because the defaults may be too high. Do it incrementally and work your way down. Hopefully this gets you closer. Good luck.
Dennis,
thank you very much for the response! I actually got it. little to 0 oscillation after leaving the I gains alone completely. I was confused and was under the impression that the I gain would have to move once I moved the P gain. No the case. Once I understood this, the oscillation tuning became much easier and eventually I got the 250mm quad right where it needs to be. Thank you so much for the video and the help!!!
i have a question my motor 1 and 2 dont seem to spin as fast as the rest and whats happening is the quod wants to go more back than front
Great video me and my buddy are 3d printing our body. Hardware is coming soon. I have a dx6i radio will i be setting dual rates and expo on it? With my Apprentice plane i dont but do on my Blade copter. Thanks any help is appreciated.
Wally Krusee I'd probably start without dual rates initially until you get a feel for how it handles by default. Then when you want to improve the responsiveness you can start mess with your rates and expo. Just my thoughts. Good luck with your build.
I'd like to thank you for this and the other 2 videos. You've helped me a lot in building my first multirotor (a quad). One thing though, I'm seeing the same behavior as your tuned quad on this vid but at values 50% more than yours. Is this normal for a 550mm quad?
Thanks for watching my vids :) It's very normal that your gains will increase the larger your frame is. I can't say whether or not 50% is "normal" though. As long as your quad is stable with little to no oscillations then that's what you're looking for!
awesome video! i do have a question though. i have set everytthing the same as you. but when i take off the copter goes into a wobble and the wobble gets worse and worse till it smashes its self into the ground :( any suggestions?
Ryan Sweeney It's hard to tell but my first guess would be that your gains are too high. Try bringing them down incrementally (small steps) and then test. If that's not the case then maybe you have too much vibration that is getting back to the flight controller.
My kk2.15 board is not getting armed after calibrating all the four motor. I tried a couple of times and also tried factory reset but it was of no use. I can't understand whats happening. So please help me!!!!!