The main counter to this is human preception of volume differences follows a more linear scale. However, the logarithmic scale is still important for determining the potential for hearing damage.
My Craftsman canister shop vac is both loud and has a high pitch whine that is super annoying, and because the hose is 6 feet vs the 10-foot Festool hose you have to be closer to the source of the noise. Noise falls off at a rate of distance/cubed, so that extra 4 feet makes a big difference in addition to the Festool being 9DB more quiet right out of the box. Having just bought a Festool dust extractor I can tell you it's a very big difference.
I have the Ridgid 12 gal vacuum. I bought an anemometer to measure what my Ridgid is capable of. At the inlet, on the side of the unit, I get about 185 cfm. At the end of the hose that comes with the vacuum, I get about 140 cfm. When I add in the Dustopper, a cyclone separator, it goes down to about 75 cfm at the end of the hose. Even with the Dustopper, it works really well with my random orbital sander and my circular saw. I've used it on my table saw (Ridgid R4512) but it really only gets whatever falls straight into the dust chute. With the Dustopper though, I don't have to worry about the filter. It all goes into a bucket, not the vacuum. I recently added a router table to the extension wing of my table saw and then built a fence with dust collection and the vacuum/Dustopper combo does a very good job of clearing the shavings. I am in the process of making a "dust box" for when the fence is not in use or too far away from the cut. The vacuum, a Ridgid hose kit and the Ridgid HEPA filter/bag kit will cost you about $180. It will work just as well as the Festool with the only difference being the auto-start feature. That convenience is nice and if you have the money, go for it. The downside is, the capacity. Whatever time you saved with the auto-start, you lost with having to empty the unit more often. Pick your poison. As a hobbyist, you will be well served with the Ridgid vacuum, with the hose and HEPA kits included. There is always something better and if you've got the scratch, have at it. If you're just starting out, you should at least get something like the Ridgid set up. It is a necessary expense, regardless.
I have both types of vacs in my shop. The biggest advantage with the Hepa extractor is that it mostly eliminates the very fine dust that hangs in the air for hours or days. That stuff settles on freshly varnished furniture and is a pain. Sanding always comes right before applying finish. If we could do that backwards it would be a lot cleaner.
As got both, I know shop vac can be m filter too, is extraction system still better than shop vac with a cyclone? Been thinking to add a cyclone to my shop vac but wondering if get extractor too, so know most tools I got are portable and so in my flat table saw is worst (on not getting all cleaned up)
I've had a Craftsman vac like your Rigid for years. Recently bought the Festool Midi...just a notch up from yours. I really like the longer, more pliable, anti-static hose compared to the Craftsman. Was always wrestling with the Craftsman hose which was always too short, and the canister really didn't roll that well. I purchased the optional blue-tooth on/off switch for the end of the Festool hose primarily because I was taking a tile floor and kept the vac just outside that room to lessen the noise which let me use the vac as necessary for concrete dust/chips, etc. without constantly getting up and down off the floor. I also wanted the hose garage on the Midi so that I can stack/latch other Festool products on top. I'm buying one of their sanders next. The 15 liter dust bag is plenty for my work...I still sweep before I vac, so not that much going in the bag anyway. And, at least on the Midi, there is a HEPA filter self-cleaning mechanism, and I've always extended the life of filters by blowing them out with compressed air so don't expect to be replacing the HEPA filter anytime soon. I don't see getting rid of the Craftsman, but I don't expect to use it for anything in the near future either. Finally, the Festool is nice enough to use around the inside of the house which is great for us because we don't have a traditional vacuum like a Hoover. With all wood and tile floors we were getting by with a Roomba and a Dyson stick vacuum, but neither of those work for vertical or elevated surfaces. I invested in Festool because after a lot or research, I will start upgrading my handheld power tools with Festool as projects come up and the vacuum is central to all of that. Sander, Track Saw, and Domino Joiner are on my short list.
One thing about Festool CT collectors and tools. Everything fits together, auto start and 5 sec run after stop with tools. 5 adjustments for suction, for sanding use 1. They are quiet and HEPA. Compare this with standard shop vac. No auto on, loud and shoots out dust, no bluetooth and hose does not connect to tools. The Festool is worth the money.
Good video. You mentioned sanding with the Festool. I have the CTL MIDI (same specs as the CT15) and when sanding I always run at the lowest setting. You get near perfect dust collection, significantly lower sound and power use and much better results. Auto start and adjustable suction are very important features for a dust extractor. As far as the filter, I have been running my CTL MIDI with the same main filter for over 3 years and still looks like new. (I use bags). Never used my Festool as a wet vac.
After watching the review, I noticed that both have one flaw in common. You have your dust collector and you also have your dust extractor like these for small tools. I bought a Kirby vacuum cleaner motor head which has a impeller that is separated from the motor. The motor has a separate assembly to get cooled. The impeller sucks the dust and within few inches exhausts it to a bag via 3 inch pipe. I removed the bag and connected it to my large shop three stage dust extractor with cyclonic action. This way I have one place for all the dust from the small and large tools, none of the filter expense, takes very little space and it’s in-line install setup for under 100 bucks. Awesome review.
The separation of the two air flows, cooling and dust so to speak is a requirement in EU for vacuums that can suck water, so the festool have that separation for sure.
I'd replace that non antistatic hose that came with the 15 if you are using it for wood dust. If the $130 Festool hose is a turn off the Cen-Tec antistatic will do just fine. Antistatic isn't just for the user but also for the material in the hose. It's an older vid so maybe you have replaced it but still worth mentioning for anyone just finding the vid I suppose.
I have 3 Rigid vacs in my shop. The filters always keep plugging way before the vac fills with sawdust. I installed a cyclone pre-filter on one of the vacs and it really helps but now it is a big bulky affair that I attached to a cart to roll around. Its like an elephant. The Hepa Extractor (mine is a Bosch) is so much easier to use in every way. I also like the part where when the tool is turned on the vac does so automatically. Go get one. Your lungs will thank you.
I like how you kept the review simple. So many people get all into details that the average person either doesn't understand or doesn't care about - we just want to know the basics that matter.
Ridgid is more of a workshop, job site cleanup type of vac and the Festool is something you’d want to use if your are working in someone’s home because it’s a lot less noisy. Both will work either way but I own a Festool unit and it’s how I’d use if I had both.
This was really a comparison of what someone would use in their woodworking shop. So many start and stay with a wet/dry vac based on price and really wanted to highlight what you do or don’t get by spending the extra money. Ideally they are for 2 different uses as you stated.
use the 16 gallon ridgid as a central vac exausted outdoors and everything.... I stand by ridgid 100% With a little non manufacturing mods you can get almost 300 cfm, 185 at the end of a 40 ft oreq stinger pool vac hose with a power nozzle and 50 ft pig tail and a heap filter and bag
Nice review! Just ordered the ct15 and 5” festool orbital sander. My shop is in an unfinished basement and never sand inside, hoping between this and some box fan air filters I put together I can work inside all year round!
I have both of these vacs. I use the Rigid for large cleanup like cleaning my barbecue or sweeping the driveway. I use my CT15 dedicated to my mitersaw and as a lightweight job site vac when delivering furniture. Great video
The HEPA filter is the biggest difference IMO. To your point you don't need huge size for handtools. Having used shop vacs for dust collection in a garage for awhile I won't use anything that doesn't have HEPA anymore. Dust control has become the one thing I am most willing to spend more $$ on to get whatever is the best product. Festool is not the only brand that makes HEPA rated dust extractors either though, but the others are similarly price from Makita and Bosch etc.
Great comparison. Have looked at the CT15. Recently got the Festool sander and is extremely nice. Didn’t realize the plug is an auto start. Their other vacs use Bluetooth. Nice to have the plug option. Might be on my Christmas list.
All Festool Bluetooth vacuums are all autostart as well. Unlike most brands though, you have to change the dial to auto, otherwise the socket is not live. The Bluetooth is for there cordless tools which has bluetooth built into the tool's battery. For non festool cordless tools, there is a bluetooth button which attaches to the end of the hose. BTW, I did not even know that Festool offered vacuums without their anti static (green) hose.
Rigid makes a OSHA compatibility kit which includes 2 cyclonic dust bags and a HEPA filter for $60. With that kit, it's hard to justify the Festool, especially if you already own a shopvac.
Hi. Thanks for this video. I have been going pretty crazy trying to figure out what setup i should go with. I live in major city in an apartment and am sanding the plywood parts of my kitchen cabinets. I am doing this inside my apartment so I'm super worried about dust for our health. I just bought a Bosch palm sander (not RO just 1/4 sheet sander), a Ridgid shopvac and a separate Ridgid HEPA filtration kit that includes a HEPA filter & bag. So once i get the sander, I will hookup the sander to the shovac. Keep in mind the HEPA bag & filter will be in the Shopvac while im sanding. I am now unsure that this would provide adequate dust protection. I am thinking of returning the shopvac and filter kit - its all unopened - and just buying a dust extractor. I dont know what to do ... What are your thoughts? Hoping you see this :) Thanks a toN!
Great review. You forgot to mention that festools self cleaning bags allows the vacuum to use 95% of the bag before needing to even change it or before losing suction. Whereas most vacuums start losing suction at around half to 3/4 bag full. Lastly, because the bags work so well, the hepa filter on the festool barely gets any dust on it. Which drastically increases the longevity
@@seamancustombuilds2553 I am going to use for my Surfprep sander. Your video helped me to decide which vac I want to buy. I’m going to get Festool for sure. Thanks again.
@@thuywebb3619 I have had the Festool for 1 year and it has been running for 3-500 hours (best guess) and the filter is still clean. Thats for 75% wood and 25% paint, lacquer and other things with fine dust. I am really impressed. It should be noted that I only use the original Festool bag. And it runs like a dream.
Good review for the professional shop. However, coming back down to earth, the Festool products are professional grade no doubt and should be considered as such. The average homeowner/hobbyist can’t justify those prices. I can outfit a very good shop with Ridgid, Ryobi, Dewalt and others, without taking out a second mortgage. Festool, while making excellent products are still at premium prices and are very difficult for the average homeowner.
what about overheating on the shop vac that is run during excessive sanding vs. the dust extractors which seem to be built to handle the longer run times? Any observations there? Longevity because of this?
Doesn't the Festool and other Dust extracting vacuums have the automatic filer cleaning? (Thumping every 15 seconds to clean the filter Keep suction higher for longer.) I only have a very old OSHA 10hr. But i know new regulations are required for Silica dust I know all the other big players hit those requirements at the current time. I dont think the regular shopvacs do that?
@@seamancustombuilds2553 I just picked up the bosch VAC90AH instead of a regular shop vac i figure if it can't fit into the hose then I should just sweep it up. But After looking at my furnace filter I knew this was needed to keep the dust down.
@boogiedahomey Gotcha i didnt even look at the festool b/c i know my budget wouldn't allow it But I am very happy with the Bosch VAC090AH. I think I got if for 500 on sale. and it has done everything for me. Includes auto cleaning filter. and always use the fleece bags saves money on replacing the HEPA
My health is worth far more than $100. The $600 model is M class, which meets the regulations for hard woods and cement type dusts. Its all about the filtration. A $100 vac might have just as much or even more suction, but it won't remove anywhere near the percentage of the dust from the air as the M class extractor. the tiny particles will just pass through the filter and be blown back into the air.
If the bluetooth or bluetooth upgrade worked for this model I might consider it. Bluetooth isn't an option until you spend at least a couple hundred USD more.
That’s a good point, I don’t have any Bluetooth enabled tools and don’t have plans to add any but that should be part of the decision for others. Thanks for watching and commenting
@@seamancustombuilds2553 The upgrade kit includes a remote button that got me interested in the Bluetooth option. But all-in it would cost $700 US to get a Festool and the upgrade kit.
Most of the Festool vacuums are sold with the Green hose, which is super flexible but will not kink. Better still.. it is anti static so you don't get shocked and dust does not stick to the hose or vacuum. Additionally, the green hose has a kind of material around it which means the ridges do not get caught up on the work piece and it will not scratch things up. It is a significantly nicer hose. But.. expensive. about 150 bucks.
@@disciple777 Festool offers a nice set of accessory vac tools (crevice, brush, extensions, etc.) I just vacuumed out my large SUV with my Festool dust extractor yesterday, and here's what I like: With my old canister shop vac I had to roll the canister around to both sides. With the 10-foot Festool hose I can put the vac on one side and work both sides without relocating the vac. The hose is very flexible (I bought the Festool MIDI) and has a smaller diameter, which makes it easier to get into tight places. I bought the optional bluetooth on/off switch which is mounted on the end of the hose, so that I can turn the vac on/off from the end of the hose...don't have to go back to the vac. Suction is variable so you can dial it in just right for working around automobiles. Also the power cord is much longer than my old canister vac, which helps get around the vehicle without needing an extension power cord, and the power cord winds up on the MIDI and larger models. Vacuum "power" is as good as my canister vac, and as good as vacuums I've used at commercial car washes. All debris goes into a filter bag like a traditional vacuum cleaner, so no dumping out the canister and having dust fly everywhere. Have a look on the Festool USA web site to figure out which of their several models will be best.
I tape the seams and common blow out spots with Gorilla tape or something similar when the bag is brand new. I use mine with a cyclone and have gotten over a year out of a bag.
When you put a reducer on the hose of the rigid, doesn’t the engine race? Doesn’t causing the motor to race wear the motor prematurely? Would that be covered by warranty? What is the DB level in that set up?
@@seamancustombuilds2553 If you opt for a higher end Festool vac, there is a dial to select the diameter of the hose. I am not sure if this feature is available on the smaller midi and mini models though. If you jump up to CTM, these come with flow meters and alarms as well which let you know when the filter and bag is full. Though, that feature is more for meeting European jobsite safety standards and not for the hobbyist.
The hp rating as used for many vacuums in the US is pure bs, relevant parameters are air flow rate and air pressure, there are also something called suction power, there are formulas on how to calculate it, but different manufactures have different ways to measure this, so .... Flow and pressure are static measured, in real life they goes up and down a lot, when flow go down the pressure goes up, so they measure flow at low pressure, and the measure pressure at low flow (like zero) so these two parameters do not tell that much, add that when flow goes down 10% pressure do not go up 10%, there is a non linear and non straight relation between them. So how to find the best for your need ? You need to test every candidate on your pipework, tools, usage, etc. A thing to keep in mind is that you need a certain minimum flow to keep your pipe/hose clean from dust, and you must not exceed an other certain flow, this one is "flow/square HEPA filter" if you have a HEPA filter, if you do your HEPA filter is not guaranteed to work correctly. There are two standards for industrial vacuums, a US and an EU, they differ from each other, but roughly speaking then the highest EU rating is higher than the highest US rating, it is mostly down to HEPA filtration and separation of airflow for cooling of the motor (for wet vac) and dust, but it is standards made to place products into different category not a rating as such, the highest rating whatsoever may not be the best for you, it all depend. Just to dump a spanner into the gearbox HEPA filters are not just HEPA filters they come in different ratings too, and for those that can get it clean enough there are ULPA filters.
A shop vac is really designed for just cleaning up around the garage/house, can take on more bulky material, the dust extractor is designed to be run longer, is quieter and higher filtration
@@w49660 I was not comparing these against each other. The question was a shop vac against a dust collector. The shop vac and festool vac are both vacuums or dust EXTRACTORS. A dust COLLECTOR is another beast altogether moving many hundreds of cfm. Neither of the vacs in this video are dust collectors or sufficient from collecting from large tools.
Drywall is a special needs issue. Drywall is very abrasive and it kills most vacuums unless they are designed for that task. Festool makes a special sander just for drywall andit captures almost all the dust so it can be used for a remodel job without having to mask off or clean up and entire castomers home. Saves a lot of time. Thats $$$.
My friend has been pleased with this vacuum. I put it together and other than one of the wheels coming back out(which I had a bit of difficulty with) ruclips.net/user/postUgkxnBiz5H40H0BTcRcPDEHZkcV2smSjfUD0 it was easy to assemble. It's worked well and the large size has been handy for vacuuming up sawdust around my friend's tablesaw. The wheels and handle make it simple to move around, so the bulky size isn't overly a negative, unless you're lacking on space. It has a bag that can be used to collect the dust, though it doesn't have to be used. It works perfectly great without it and it is an added expense when replacing the bag. If vacumming water, just leave it out. It comes with various attachments, which are handy. A durable bag attaches to the handle to hold them and I love this feature. It has good power and it's a nice option for a shop vac.
Noise (decibel) is measured on a logarithmic scale. 9db is a very substantial difference.
The main counter to this is human preception of volume differences follows a more linear scale. However, the logarithmic scale is still important for determining the potential for hearing damage.
10db doubles the perceived sound to the ear so the Ridgid is a lot louder to the ear.
@@jerensteffen there’s no counter. 10 db is a lot louder. Get your head out of your ass.
@@oliverallen5324 Lol, great counter point. Very thurough and filled with facts.
My Craftsman canister shop vac is both loud and has a high pitch whine that is super annoying, and because the hose is 6 feet vs the 10-foot Festool hose you have to be closer to the source of the noise. Noise falls off at a rate of distance/cubed, so that extra 4 feet makes a big difference in addition to the Festool being 9DB more quiet right out of the box. Having just bought a Festool dust extractor I can tell you it's a very big difference.
I have the Ridgid 12 gal vacuum. I bought an anemometer to measure what my Ridgid is capable of. At the inlet, on the side of the unit, I get about 185 cfm. At the end of the hose that comes with the vacuum, I get about 140 cfm. When I add in the Dustopper, a cyclone separator, it goes down to about 75 cfm at the end of the hose.
Even with the Dustopper, it works really well with my random orbital sander and my circular saw. I've used it on my table saw (Ridgid R4512) but it really only gets whatever falls straight into the dust chute. With the Dustopper though, I don't have to worry about the filter. It all goes into a bucket, not the vacuum.
I recently added a router table to the extension wing of my table saw and then built a fence with dust collection and the vacuum/Dustopper combo does a very good job of clearing the shavings. I am in the process of making a "dust box" for when the fence is not in use or too far away from the cut.
The vacuum, a Ridgid hose kit and the Ridgid HEPA filter/bag kit will cost you about $180. It will work just as well as the Festool with the only difference being the auto-start feature. That convenience is nice and if you have the money, go for it. The downside is, the capacity. Whatever time you saved with the auto-start, you lost with having to empty the unit more often. Pick your poison.
As a hobbyist, you will be well served with the Ridgid vacuum, with the hose and HEPA kits included. There is always something better and if you've got the scratch, have at it. If you're just starting out, you should at least get something like the Ridgid set up. It is a necessary expense, regardless.
Thanks for all the info, sounds like you have done a lot of testing
i know it is kind of off topic but do anyone know of a good place to watch newly released tv shows online ?
@Briar Lyric meh I would suggest Flixportal. Just google after it:D -alex Jabari
@Alex Jabari Thank you, I signed up and it seems to work :) Appreciate it!!
@Briar Lyric happy to help :)
I have both types of vacs in my shop. The biggest advantage with the Hepa extractor is that it mostly eliminates the very fine dust that hangs in the air for hours or days. That stuff settles on freshly varnished furniture and is a pain. Sanding always comes right before applying finish. If we could do that backwards it would be a lot cleaner.
You’re right
As got both, I know shop vac can be m filter too, is extraction system still better than shop vac with a cyclone? Been thinking to add a cyclone to my shop vac but wondering if get extractor too, so know most tools I got are portable and so in my flat table saw is worst (on not getting all cleaned up)
I've had a Craftsman vac like your Rigid for years. Recently bought the Festool Midi...just a notch up from yours. I really like the longer, more pliable, anti-static hose compared to the Craftsman. Was always wrestling with the Craftsman hose which was always too short, and the canister really didn't roll that well. I purchased the optional blue-tooth on/off switch for the end of the Festool hose primarily because I was taking a tile floor and kept the vac just outside that room to lessen the noise which let me use the vac as necessary for concrete dust/chips, etc. without constantly getting up and down off the floor. I also wanted the hose garage on the Midi so that I can stack/latch other Festool products on top. I'm buying one of their sanders next. The 15 liter dust bag is plenty for my work...I still sweep before I vac, so not that much going in the bag anyway. And, at least on the Midi, there is a HEPA filter self-cleaning mechanism, and I've always extended the life of filters by blowing them out with compressed air so don't expect to be replacing the HEPA filter anytime soon. I don't see getting rid of the Craftsman, but I don't expect to use it for anything in the near future either. Finally, the Festool is nice enough to use around the inside of the house which is great for us because we don't have a traditional vacuum like a Hoover. With all wood and tile floors we were getting by with a Roomba and a Dyson stick vacuum, but neither of those work for vertical or elevated surfaces. I invested in Festool because after a lot or research, I will start upgrading my handheld power tools with Festool as projects come up and the vacuum is central to all of that. Sander, Track Saw, and Domino Joiner are on my short list.
Can’t argue with any of that, thanks for watching and commenting.
One thing about Festool CT collectors and tools. Everything fits together, auto start and 5 sec run after stop with tools. 5 adjustments for suction, for sanding use 1. They are quiet and HEPA. Compare this with standard shop vac. No auto on, loud and shoots out dust, no bluetooth and hose does not connect to tools. The Festool is worth the money.
As for sound levels -- a 6dB change is a doubling in sound pressure, so 9dB is 3x louder.
actually no. the human ear doesn't respond to increases in sound level in a linear manner, so a 10dB increase is perceived as being twice as loud.
For a portable set up
Ridgid propack + IVAC unit screwed on top. Add a dustopper set up for extended filter life. Cheapest effective portable solution
Good video. You mentioned sanding with the Festool. I have the CTL MIDI (same specs as the CT15) and when sanding I always run at the lowest setting. You get near perfect dust collection, significantly lower sound and power use and much better results. Auto start and adjustable suction are very important features for a dust extractor. As far as the filter, I have been running my CTL MIDI with the same main filter for over 3 years and still looks like new. (I use bags). Never used my Festool as a wet vac.
After watching the review, I noticed that both have one flaw in common. You have your dust collector and you also have your dust extractor like these for small tools. I bought a Kirby vacuum cleaner motor head which has a impeller that is separated from the motor. The motor has a separate assembly to get cooled. The impeller sucks the dust and within few inches exhausts it to a bag via 3 inch pipe. I removed the bag and connected it to my large shop three stage dust extractor with cyclonic action. This way I have one place for all the dust from the small and large tools, none of the filter expense, takes very little space and it’s in-line install setup for under 100 bucks. Awesome review.
Sounds like a nice setup 👍🏻
I am doing the same. Kirby works great. Just so noisy my biggest complaint.
The separation of the two air flows, cooling and dust so to speak is a requirement in EU for vacuums that can suck water, so the festool have that separation for sure.
I'd replace that non antistatic hose that came with the 15 if you are using it for wood dust. If the $130 Festool hose is a turn off the Cen-Tec antistatic will do just fine. Antistatic isn't just for the user but also for the material in the hose. It's an older vid so maybe you have replaced it but still worth mentioning for anyone just finding the vid I suppose.
You can buy the hose garage for the CT15 and then put festool boxes on it like the Midi
Yep!
I will stick with the rigid vac. They sell the Hepa filter and bags. Did some drywall sanding with it and had great success!!!
I have 3 Rigid vacs in my shop. The filters always keep plugging way before the vac fills with sawdust. I installed a cyclone pre-filter on one of the vacs and it really helps but now it is a big bulky affair that I attached to a cart to roll around. Its like an elephant. The Hepa Extractor (mine is a Bosch) is so much easier to use in every way. I also like the part where when the tool is turned on the vac does so automatically. Go get one. Your lungs will thank you.
I like how you kept the review simple. So many people get all into details that the average person either doesn't understand or doesn't care about - we just want to know the basics that matter.
Thank you for watching and glad you found it helpful
Ever met anyone with COPD? Feels like your drowning 24 hrs a day. Years in a woodshop is a huge contributor. Buy the Festool.
As a thoracic anaesthesiologist I absolutely agree with you! You really can’t put a price on your health!
Ridgid is more of a workshop, job site cleanup type of vac and the Festool is something you’d want to use if your are working in someone’s home because it’s a lot less noisy. Both will work either way but I own a Festool unit and it’s how I’d use if I had both.
This was really a comparison of what someone would use in their woodworking shop. So many start and stay with a wet/dry vac based on price and really wanted to highlight what you do or don’t get by spending the extra money. Ideally they are for 2 different uses as you stated.
use the 16 gallon ridgid as a central vac exausted outdoors and everything.... I stand by ridgid 100%
With a little non manufacturing mods you can get almost 300 cfm, 185 at the end of a 40 ft oreq stinger pool vac hose with a power nozzle and 50 ft pig tail and a heap filter and bag
how are you getting almost 300cfm from a Ridgid? They are advertised at 161 cfm.
@@ericmarlin5355 leaf blower as a turbo maybe ;)
Another question is why would you need 300 cfm from it?
Nice review! Just ordered the ct15 and 5” festool orbital sander. My shop is in an unfinished basement and never sand inside, hoping between this and some box fan air filters I put together I can work inside all year round!
Very nice! I use a Wen air cleaner and it helps a lot.
I have both of these vacs. I use the Rigid for large cleanup like cleaning my barbecue or sweeping the driveway. I use my CT15 dedicated to my mitersaw and as a lightweight job site vac when delivering furniture. Great video
Thanks Dean!
Nice honest and fair review… thanks
Thank you for watching
The HEPA filter is the biggest difference IMO. To your point you don't need huge size for handtools. Having used shop vacs for dust collection in a garage for awhile I won't use anything that doesn't have HEPA anymore. Dust control has become the one thing I am most willing to spend more $$ on to get whatever is the best product. Festool is not the only brand that makes HEPA rated dust extractors either though, but the others are similarly price from Makita and Bosch etc.
Great comparison. Have looked at the CT15. Recently got the Festool sander and is extremely nice. Didn’t realize the plug is an auto start. Their other vacs use Bluetooth. Nice to have the plug option. Might be on my Christmas list.
I’m really liking the auto start feature
All Festool Bluetooth vacuums are all autostart as well. Unlike most brands though, you have to change the dial to auto, otherwise the socket is not live.
The Bluetooth is for there cordless tools which has bluetooth built into the tool's battery. For non festool cordless tools, there is a bluetooth button which attaches to the end of the hose.
BTW, I did not even know that Festool offered vacuums without their anti static (green) hose.
Rigid makes a OSHA compatibility kit which includes 2 cyclonic dust bags and a HEPA filter for $60. With that kit, it's hard to justify the Festool, especially if you already own a shopvac.
Hi. Thanks for this video. I have been going pretty crazy trying to figure out what setup i should go with. I live in major city in an apartment and am sanding the plywood parts of my kitchen cabinets. I am doing this inside my apartment so I'm super worried about dust for our health. I just bought a Bosch palm sander (not RO just 1/4 sheet sander), a Ridgid shopvac and a separate Ridgid HEPA filtration kit that includes a HEPA filter & bag. So once i get the sander, I will hookup the sander to the shovac. Keep in mind the HEPA bag & filter will be in the Shopvac while im sanding. I am now unsure that this would provide adequate dust protection. I am thinking of returning the shopvac and filter kit - its all unopened - and just buying a dust extractor. I dont know what to do ... What are your thoughts? Hoping you see this :) Thanks a toN!
Thank you really useful comparison!
Thank you for watching
Great info on this topic, I've always steered away from Festool simply because of price. 👍
Glad it was helpful, their stuff is really well engineered and made
Great review. You forgot to mention that festools self cleaning bags allows the vacuum to use 95% of the bag before needing to even change it or before losing suction.
Whereas most vacuums start losing suction at around half to 3/4 bag full. Lastly, because the bags work so well, the hepa filter on the festool barely gets any dust on it. Which drastically increases the longevity
Good points, thanks 👍
$420 for the CT 15 E now. Do you still think it is worth it?
I’m so glad to run across your video. Do you know how often you need to change Festool filter ? Thank you
That’s going to vary by what you are cleaning up, I’m using a Dustopper with mine and haven’t had to change the Festool bag or filter yet
@@seamancustombuilds2553 I am going to use for my Surfprep sander. Your video helped me to decide which vac I want to buy. I’m going to get Festool for sure. Thanks again.
@@thuywebb3619 I have had the Festool for 1 year and it has been running for 3-500 hours (best guess) and the filter is still clean. Thats for 75% wood and 25% paint, lacquer and other things with fine dust. I am really impressed. It should be noted that I only use the original Festool bag. And it runs like a dream.
thanks, very informative review.
Good review for the professional shop. However, coming back down to earth, the Festool products are professional grade no doubt and should be considered as such. The average homeowner/hobbyist can’t justify those prices. I can outfit a very good shop with Ridgid, Ryobi, Dewalt and others, without taking out a second mortgage. Festool, while making excellent products are still at premium prices and are very difficult for the average homeowner.
I agree that many of the Festool products are pricey, I’m thankful they have this entry level dust extractor, only have one set of lungs and ears
I bought a $40 "7hp" sun joe vacuum and run it without a filter and just put a long hose on the exhaust well away from my work space 😅
what about overheating on the shop vac that is run during excessive sanding vs. the dust extractors which seem to be built to handle the longer run times? Any observations there? Longevity because of this?
Doesn't the Festool and other Dust extracting vacuums have the automatic filer cleaning? (Thumping every 15 seconds to clean the filter Keep suction higher for longer.) I only have a very old OSHA 10hr. But i know new regulations are required for Silica dust I know all the other big players hit those requirements at the current time. I dont think the regular shopvacs do that?
Yes, I believe they do
@@seamancustombuilds2553 I just picked up the bosch VAC90AH instead of a regular shop vac i figure if it can't fit into the hose then I should just sweep it up. But After looking at my furnace filter I knew this was needed to keep the dust down.
@boogiedahomey Gotcha i didnt even look at the festool b/c i know my budget wouldn't allow it But I am very happy with the Bosch VAC090AH. I think I got if for 500 on sale. and it has done everything for me. Includes auto cleaning filter. and always use the fleece bags saves money on replacing
the HEPA
My health is worth far more than $100. The $600 model is M class, which meets the regulations for hard woods and cement type dusts. Its all about the filtration. A $100 vac might have just as much or even more suction, but it won't remove anywhere near the percentage of the dust from the air as the M class extractor. the tiny particles will just pass through the filter and be blown back into the air.
This video was very helpful
Thanks for watching
If the bluetooth or bluetooth upgrade worked for this model I might consider it. Bluetooth isn't an option until you spend at least a couple hundred USD more.
That’s a good point, I don’t have any Bluetooth enabled tools and don’t have plans to add any but that should be part of the decision for others. Thanks for watching and commenting
@@seamancustombuilds2553 The upgrade kit includes a remote button that got me interested in the Bluetooth option. But all-in it would cost $700 US to get a Festool and the upgrade kit.
Awesome video, is the hose quality and flexible , how does the Festool gray hose compare with the ridgid upgraded orange hose.?
The orange Ridgid hose is much better than the standard black hose, the Festool hose is similar if not more flexible
@@seamancustombuilds2553 how do you think the Festool would work as a auto detailing vacuum?
Most of the Festool vacuums are sold with the Green hose, which is super flexible but will not kink. Better still.. it is anti static so you don't get shocked and dust does not stick to the hose or vacuum.
Additionally, the green hose has a kind of material around it which means the ridges do not get caught up on the work piece and it will not scratch things up. It is a significantly nicer hose. But.. expensive. about 150 bucks.
@@disciple777 Festool offers a nice set of accessory vac tools (crevice, brush, extensions, etc.) I just vacuumed out my large SUV with my Festool dust extractor yesterday, and here's what I like: With my old canister shop vac I had to roll the canister around to both sides. With the 10-foot Festool hose I can put the vac on one side and work both sides without relocating the vac. The hose is very flexible (I bought the Festool MIDI) and has a smaller diameter, which makes it easier to get into tight places. I bought the optional bluetooth on/off switch which is mounted on the end of the hose, so that I can turn the vac on/off from the end of the hose...don't have to go back to the vac. Suction is variable so you can dial it in just right for working around automobiles. Also the power cord is much longer than my old canister vac, which helps get around the vehicle without needing an extension power cord, and the power cord winds up on the MIDI and larger models. Vacuum "power" is as good as my canister vac, and as good as vacuums I've used at commercial car washes. All debris goes into a filter bag like a traditional vacuum cleaner, so no dumping out the canister and having dust fly everywhere. Have a look on the Festool USA web site to figure out which of their several models will be best.
Thanks
The rigid bags also have a nasty tendency to blow out. I have one blow out every other package. For $8 a bag, I feel like that shouldn’t happen.
I tape the seams and common blow out spots with Gorilla tape or something similar when the bag is brand new. I use mine with a cyclone and have gotten over a year out of a bag.
New subscriber. Appreciate the comparison!
Thank you
When you put a reducer on the hose of the rigid, doesn’t the engine race? Doesn’t causing the motor to race wear the motor prematurely? Would that be covered by warranty? What is the DB level in that set up?
A reducer on either is going to cause the motor to work harder, not sure that would affect the warranty
@@seamancustombuilds2553 If you opt for a higher end Festool vac, there is a dial to select the diameter of the hose. I am not sure if this feature is available on the smaller midi and mini models though.
If you jump up to CTM, these come with flow meters and alarms as well which let you know when the filter and bag is full. Though, that feature is more for meeting European jobsite safety standards and not for the hobbyist.
1) You can get HEPA filter for RIDGID. 2) PLug in auto start doesn't work with battery tools. Festool doesn't make the best dust collector. Nope.
Correct and they also have HEPA bags. Filter + Bag= Dang near dustless performance even for fine dust like drywall dust etc.
Very good content and review Scott. Looking into investing on a good vacuum for sanding and small stuff etc..... awesome video
Thanks Oscar, I think they are worth the money
1hp is 745w of power. That would put the rigid at 4. 47kw of power. I am pretty sure a standard us circuit breaker won't take that load.
The hp rating as used for many vacuums in the US is pure bs, relevant parameters are air flow rate and air pressure, there are also something called suction power, there are formulas on how to calculate it, but different manufactures have different ways to measure this, so ....
Flow and pressure are static measured, in real life they goes up and down a lot, when flow go down the pressure goes up, so they measure flow at low pressure, and the measure pressure at low flow (like zero) so these two parameters do not tell that much, add that when flow goes down 10% pressure do not go up 10%, there is a non linear and non straight relation between them.
So how to find the best for your need ? You need to test every candidate on your pipework, tools, usage, etc.
A thing to keep in mind is that you need a certain minimum flow to keep your pipe/hose clean from dust, and you must not exceed an other certain flow, this one is "flow/square HEPA filter" if you have a HEPA filter, if you do your HEPA filter is not guaranteed to work correctly.
There are two standards for industrial vacuums, a US and an EU, they differ from each other, but roughly speaking then the highest EU rating is higher than the highest US rating, it is mostly down to HEPA filtration and separation of airflow for cooling of the motor (for wet vac) and dust, but it is standards made to place products into different category not a rating as such, the highest rating whatsoever may not be the best for you, it all depend. Just to dump a spanner into the gearbox HEPA filters are not just HEPA filters they come in different ratings too, and for those that can get it clean enough there are ULPA filters.
@@K2teknik. Now that's what I call a extensive answer. Thanks
Thanks for this
You’re welcome
Can you tell me the difference between a "dust collector" and a shop vac? Thanks. Good video by the way
A shop vac is really designed for just cleaning up around the garage/house, can take on more bulky material, the dust extractor is designed to be run longer, is quieter and higher filtration
A shop vac moves a low volume of air at high static pressure. A dust collector moves a very large volume of air at low static pressure.
@@prodigalpilot Festool was only 130 CFM; shop vac was higher at 165 CFM. So the shop vac moves more air.
@@w49660 I was not comparing these against each other. The question was a shop vac against a dust collector. The shop vac and festool vac are both vacuums or dust EXTRACTORS. A dust COLLECTOR is another beast altogether moving many hundreds of cfm. Neither of the vacs in this video are dust collectors or sufficient from collecting from large tools.
What about large drywall jobs?
not this one. you need the sander attachment about 800.
Drywall is a special needs issue. Drywall is very abrasive and it kills most vacuums unless they are designed for that task. Festool makes a special sander just for drywall andit captures almost all the dust so it can be used for a remodel job without having to mask off or clean up and entire castomers home. Saves a lot of time. Thats $$$.
Hobby diy folk don’t really need festool quality anything lol. WEN dc3401 is only $130 and works great
A dust extractor and collector are very different, the collector cannot generate enough pressure for small tools like sanders to capture the fine dust
My friend has been pleased with this vacuum. I put it together and other than one of the wheels coming back out(which I had a bit of difficulty with) ruclips.net/user/postUgkxnBiz5H40H0BTcRcPDEHZkcV2smSjfUD0 it was easy to assemble. It's worked well and the large size has been handy for vacuuming up sawdust around my friend's tablesaw. The wheels and handle make it simple to move around, so the bulky size isn't overly a negative, unless you're lacking on space. It has a bag that can be used to collect the dust, though it doesn't have to be used. It works perfectly great without it and it is an added expense when replacing the bag. If vacumming water, just leave it out. It comes with various attachments, which are handy. A durable bag attaches to the handle to hold them and I love this feature. It has good power and it's a nice option for a shop vac.
Cool content!!!
Thanks Brad!
German engineering, boys 👍
From $16 to $70 for the filter is "a little more pricey"? Hahaha. Some of us would call that 4x more.
use a dust cyclone like a dust Deputy Love my dust cyclone!!!!!
That might be on my list 😁
$350? Where's that price?