@@lorddukfoxyzeppeli7921 great question. Obito says that the chakra from possessing just one Rinnegan nearly drove him mad. So we know the Rinnegan enhances chakra based on that for sure. But also, Madara’s overall power significantly increases when he receives his second Rinnegan (including physical stats), so that’s pretty good evidence too. Finally, Obito straight up got his arm blown off by Minato’s rasengan, but after acquiring the Rinnegan he’s able to tank a KCM1 Naruto rasengan with just some singe marks. So, unless we think Hokage Minato’s rasengan is significantly stronger than KCM1 Naruto’s rasengan, that implies a durability amp, and the databooks state that you can use chakra to “temper the body”. So yeah all of that points in the direction of the Rinnegan amping chakra.
What about Obito's durability feat of taking a rasengan to the back from Minato? We know know the one shot manga that Minato's rasengan is REALLY strong Loved the video! Great editing, arguments and voice, liked and subscribed!
Dude thank you so much! His durability is great, but it’s in large part due to his regeneration and access to white Zetsu replacements. It’s stated in the databooks that he operates from the shadows due to the injuries he sustained fighting Minato, so even by the Pain Arc he’s not fully recovered from that, weirdly. That said, his raw durability should be above Itachi’s, but not Pain’s. Love this comment, though! Hope to see more of your opinions and comments on here in the future 🙏🏼
@@sageofthickcalvesI feel like he’d have to be 100% recovered from his injuries by the pain arc, but if not by then, he is definitely fully recovered by the war arc
@@sageofthickcalvesI compare it to when he told the 5 kage that he had no strength because of his battle with the first hokage which was just to make them underestimate him
Ok so hear me out. Normally I’d say itachi > pain. However itachi suffers the same problem that sasuke faces against Naruto. Itachi likes 1v1 where he can save chakra and end fights quickly. Pain however doesn’t do 1v1. He has dozens and dozens of bodies rushing you at all sides all with shared vision. This is a nightmare matchup for itachi who wants to fight a singular opponent. In addition, itachis usual win conditions are to use amaterasu (which gets absorbed) or tsukiyomi (paths don’t feel pain so it’s not gonna put them in a coma) itachi real only option is totsuka spam. Which gets countered by shared vision and shinra. Also itachi has Zero answer for chibaku tensei (without bee or naruto help) Edit: also, bansho tenin allows him to rag doll people pull them off the ground etc… so he should be able to bansho tenin the susano And/or itachi inside the susano
Completely agree with this entire video im surprised u didnt go over speed even tho the outcome is the same just thought that would be one of the sections but ig the video would be even longer lol
I touched on speed very briefly, just saying that Itachi and Obito should be relative, as they both scale around KCM Naruto, while Pain is slightly slower than them at around the sage mode Naruto range.
Itachi is not as Fast as Minato or Naruto let's be real here when he fought Naruto, Naruto was clearly holding back cause of the relationship between him and Sasuke
So in my opinion the Almighty push should be able to counter kamui. It uses gravity waves to block Jutsu or reflect them, kamui is a dimensional portal so almighty push should be able to collapse the Portal. Plus in the data books almighty push is said to be able to beat any type of ninjutsu, last time I checked it's a space time ninjutsu. Sharingan abilities also have been shown to be ineffective against it by the means of amaterasu. Just my opinion though.
@@sageofthickcalves actually if you think about it kamui is a weaker version of kaguya's ability. Kaguya ate the hod fruit that gave her those abilities, so her decadents like the Uchiha who posses the Sharingan that is unique to kaguya. She possesses the rennei-Sharingan, so the abilities of the Uchiha are different forms of her capabilities. So kaumi being able to open or close her portals isn't crazy.
@@joshfarrow9707 well it’s said that all dojutsu decend from Shibai Otsusuki. I do think Kamui is better than Kaguya’s dimension shift, but they’re similar for sure
@@sageofthickcalves yeah if you consider Boruto cannon and even worth the time to read or watch. I personally can't stand it and refuse to take it seriously
I'm fine with Obito being the strongest, but I do think the pact statement works as evidence for Itachi>Obito. The pact was made when Itachi implied he'd kill Obito if he attacked Konoha, and it's not like it was a short wait. Itachi joined the Akatsuki at 12 or 13, meaning Obito had to wait almost a decade due to the pact. And it's not like he simply accepted it because Itachi was helpful to him, as he said that Itachi was an eyesore (AKA a hindrance), and a few pages later when he was talking about people who helped him get as far as he did, he didn't list Itachi. I also believe the Susanoo at least is superior to Obito as Zetsu considered it invincible and in Generations (which is arguably canon due to an interview statement), Obito said no opponent was worthy of Itachi, referring to a moment when he was using the Susanoo. I'm also a bit iffy on Itachi~KCM Naruto in speed as he was drained from shooting out 13 shadow clones, but clone nerfing is a bit of a messy subject so it's cool. As for which vid I'd like to see next, Itachi vs Pain please!
Love this comment! You know your stuff. Yeah I think you can definitely interpret that statement a few different ways, but my point was that I don’t think it clearly indicates Itachi > Obito, but rather that fighting Itachi would be more trouble than it’s worth considering that he’s going to die soon anyway. I do think Itachi has win cons, but I don’t think he has a concrete way to get around the Kamui, whereas I think Obito’s Kamui is basically a solid workaround for everything Itachi has, aside from genjutsu. As far as him making the threat to kill him, I believe Obito’s response is something along the lines of, “You think you can?” And I think Itachi says something like, “It’s not about if I can kill you. I WILL kill you.” That’s pretty menacing on both counts, but I think Obito wasn’t necessarily afraid of Itachi killing him, and I think Obito definitely could’ve killed Itachi at that point. So, it leads me to believe that Obito saw Itachi as being more useful as a member of the Akatsuki, spreading fear and capturing bijuu, rather than being dead. Again, Itachi definitely has win cons, but I just can’t get past the Kamui hax. Itachi vs Pain is in the works 👀 Next video is Kakashi vs Tsunade, but Itachi vs Pain is coming 🙏🏼
@@sageofthickcalves I mean the 8-9 years he had to wait and the eyesore thing still applies but you're right in that it's not definitive, though I think it at least indicates that Itachi's a decent threat to his life. Tbh I think an overlooked wincon of Itachi's is potentially the Totsuka Blade, as the databook says that in the face of a God's power, physical and astral bodies are meaningless, which you could interpret as including Kamui.
@@AlanJia8 yeah I just get caught up on the issue of it saying it has to pierce it’s target to seal them. I’m not sure what would happen, but I lean toward Kamui working against it. We actually see it slash Orochimaru’s hydra heads and not seal them so the piercing part seems to imply it must stab it’s target to seal them. Idk man it’s weird haha
@@sageofthickcalves kamui only teleport his physical body parts when dodging thats why he's still there . However phantom dragon attacks the soul directly. Only way he could avoid it will be if he completely transport himself to another place which takes much more time and will be vulnerable to attack like konan said . So pain will be like his worse matchup cause of his wide range of jutsu's qnd ability which he will completely take advantage of
@@Crimebot02 it’s unclear whether Kamui also teleports the part of the soul that the body part being warped away is “attached” to, so that claim can’t be substantiated. I mean the databook entry for Kamui says it can transport “everything” into the Kamui dimension. I’ve seen that theory, though, and I do think it’s interesting and worth pondering, but there’s no real evidence to support it.
@@sageofthickcalves well I’m putting these Three in terms of Power-Scaling so Itachi over Pain because he beat Nagato and Sage Kabuto and Obito over both of them because Obito as Ten Tails Jinchuriki should be MASSIVELY STRONGER than both of them.
@@Emperor-ot6fl Itachi fans still spreading the slander that he soloed Nagato while it took Bee and Naruto to destroy Chibaku Tensei. Nagato solos Itachi with mid diff at best.
Remember how sasuke summoned manda in his fight with deidara and reverse summoned his way out of the explosion? And he was going to do that again with jugo and naruto in the war? What if a person is in the kamui world/ dimension and does what jiraiya and sasuke do and reverse summon their way out? Is that possible?
@@sageofthickcalves ok exactly. I forgot he summoned the hawk in another dimension. Thank you for replying. I know its out of character for someone like itachi or nagato/pain to reverse summon themselfs out of a situation. But itachis intellect may allow him to figure out he can or could reverse summon himself to escape kamui. Could minato using flying raijin to escape if he was in kamui dimension as well? If so, obitos dimension isn't truly inescapable. Just needs the right talent to pull off.
@@Vergil512 yeah FTG should work since it’s stated to “ignore space and time”. It’s entirely possible that Kamui is a sealed dimension that only allows entry and exit via Kamui, but if not then yeah it should work.
@@sageofthickcalves really need to know from kishimoto if kamui is a sealed dimension only escapable by someone with kamui alone or it just space time dimension that anyone well versed in the use of ftg can get out of it as well but then kamui was able to access kaguya's dimension which if it's also sealed only someone with the rinnesharigan should be able to access and get out of.
Konan needed years of studying Obito’s abilities and an enormous amount of prep, luxuries Obito wouldn’t have in a random encounter battle. Plus, Itachi has no counter for Kamui
this was a very goood video in termasof ranking its the best i have ever seen,itachi has spent time with obito and obito has respected all of itachis wishes ,itachi for me is the weakest but could kill all of them ,thats why they waited for him to die. I want to point out that kamui has weaknesses,kakashi,konan and flying raijin,its also very possible for him to suck in a crow clone bomb and gets destroyed but he would not die.how about obitos offense? he is sloppy as seen with fu and torune,minato,people say he grew stonger after fighting minato did he?he was literally the stongest person he just got more experienced and that is useless when it clashes intelligence, itachi knows about hashirama cells ,itachi has shisuis eye .how would kotoamatsukami and tsukuyomi do against obito ,it happens in a second ,perhaps he would survive but ,nagato i am not so sure ,he has a regul rinnegan and his sharingan and his body is not athe uchiha body meant for resisting it.its a whole lifetime in a second,what about obito vs kotoamatsukami he clearly wannet to take shisuis eye if his were better why would he want it?.he has no susano. and to attack he needs to be tangible i say there is a weakness and there are only 2 characters on tthe show that i thick can find that weakness ,minato and u guessed right uchiha itachi
Instead of asking why Itachi didn't go after Obito, you should instead be asking why he didn't go after Itachi. It's like you said - it's too dangerous. If you are basing this premise on narrative, then Itachi has Obito beat. He threatened Obito and Obito didn't disagree. "You can't beat what you can't hit". This argument works against Obito as well. He can't hit anyone while intangible. And Kamui warping was shown to be "countered" in some way in pretty much every instance it was used. So no, it's not invincible. It has a fairly high failure rate. You can argue Obito can be Shinra Tensei'd away while trying to warp a path. This video which covers a surface level falls flat if you actually look at context. I could easily just say Zetsu said Itachi is invincible even knowing Obito exists, and it would be just as valid as this video. Even more valid actually.
@@marwyn8152 Well Itachi was there, it’s just unclear how much he actually helped. Also, depending on how you feel about it’s canonicity, Itachi and Kisame seemed to have failed to catch Yagura. Either way, Itachi was sent on missions for the Akatsuki, and Obito was aware that it would take a good amount of time for all nine bijuu to be sealed. If he did want to try to take out Itachi, there’s a chance Itachi could get away and either leak information about the Akatsuki or maybe start taking out it’s members, crippling Obito’s ability to complete his plan. That said, it wouldn’t have made any strategic sense for him to try to take down Itachi when he knew he was going to die on his own soon enough. There’s just no argument to be made for Itachi over Obito bro.
How is Kamui a win conditiion against Pain? Wouldn't Pain just jump Obito from both sides if any of his Pains got sucked in? Obito has no other offensive moves that would let him win. The only argument is that Nagato can't control the Pains because they're in another dimension with the range limit. I don't really get how Kamui is a win condition in half the fights he's in tbh. Like, okay, you sucked up Minato but now what? The strongest ninja on the planet is sitting in your dimension waiting for an opportunity to kick your ass? Way to go, genius.
Obito is far faster than Pain, so he can blitz him with Kamui. I don’t think Kamui would be necessary, though. Since Konohamaru was able to take down one path with a rasengan, I don’t see why Obito’s wood style wouldn’t work. He also knows Pain’s abilities, so he’d know to take down the summoning and naraka paths first. Or he could just go straight to Nagato lol
I was more just talking about how people act like Obito sucking somebody into Kamui means he wins. The series seems to treat it that way, such as in the Minato fight, but I don't really get it because it's not like people who enter Kamui without Obito's eye instantly die or anything. Is there something I'm forgetting?@@sageofthickcalves
@@Anno_AD They’d starve to death eventually if they don’t have a way out with space-time techniques. Minato should be able to get out with FTG, but neither he nor Obito would’ve known that so it makes sense for them to treat it the way they did
That's true, at least in a 1v1 most characters would just be screwed if they got caught by Kamui, although if he's ever fighting multiple dudes it could end up in a War arc situation where he's getting attacked from both sides. Also it's funny to imagine Obito purposefully avoiding entering the dimension for like a week because he sucked a dude in and he's waiting for him to die of dehydration.@@sageofthickcalves
@@Anno_AD Yeah I think it would depend on the speed of the enemies too. Kakashi, Guy, and Naruto during the war are WAYYYYY faster than Pain is, so I’m not sure it would be an issue with them. The biggest problem would be if he doesn’t take out the summoning path then he’d just have to do everything again lol. I have thought about Obito avoiding going into Kamui in order to protect himself from his enemies so many times lmao. I do wonder why Tarune or whatever (Danzo’s Aburame clan underling) and his buddy didn’t kill Obito when he warped back into the Kamui dimension like 2 minutes later. There may be some kind of trap he’s set in there idk
Kakashi in the war arc has gotten way stronger from the pain arc so the blitzing doesn’t really apply since this isn’t the same Kakashi other than that this is a good ranking of them but comparing war arc vs pain arc isn’t a correct way to go about it but pain arc and before is the better way to scale against the characters each akatsuki member fought minus Obito since before he got the Rinnegan nothing changes from summit Obito to around pain arc Obito
Yeah I agree it might not be entirely fair to do it that way. I just wanted to give Pain a bit of a high ball in that category since he’s clearly the slowest one there.
@@sageofthickcalves one character that you didn’t mention was Kisame who was going up against Killer Bee and it was stated that Killer Bee was the next strongest adversary after pain even tho I do feel pain is stronger than the 5 kage from the 5 kage summit however falls short when it comes to the war arc unless you take Nagato as a feat but I don’t equate Nagato and Pain having the same capabilities
@@jedibattlemasterseanberry3172 Kisame arguably has the most raw power, but his abilities don’t stack up against these 3 in a battle. He doesn’t have a hard counter for any of the Rinnegan abilities, Kamui, or tsukuyomi. And he basically bent the knee when Tobi revealed himself as Obito, so he knows he’s inferior there. Love Kisame, though. You’ll like my upcoming Akatsuki Tier List video 🙏🏼 Make sure to hit that notification bell so you can know when it drops 🤙🏼
Obito's genjutsu is far better than Itachi's. You need to wake up. The genjutsu he put on the Three Tails and Yagura was so powerful he controlled him like a puppet, and it took years to be revealed that he was under a genjutsu. When they tried to break him out of it, he just died. So you're wrong about Itachi being the only one to kill with genjutsu. Obito's durability is by far the most impressive in the series. You conveniently ignore the fact that he took a Rasengan from Minato and then got stabbed with his kunai when he was just 14, without a single scratch. He just stood there like nothing happened; only his white parts melted down, which means the white zetsu parts are just weaker than his actual body. Later, a Rasengan exploded point blank twice, once in his face and the other in his arm, and he only had scratches from KCM Naruto. You only showed an amped Kakashi by Kurama's chakra when half of his body is getting punched in another space. While it's separate, of course he is going to get hurt. You clearly lack knowledge on these topics. There is no way in hell Obito and Itachi are equal in speed and power-that's just cap. Also, you're clearly wrong about the Rinnegan boosting chakra. It simply does not; it only provides the abilities. We all saw what the Rinnegan did to Nagato when he lost control, he was all emaciated and stuff. He was smiling even though he was in great pain, that's probably what Obito meant. Obito used the Rinnegan better than Nagato in most ways, he was just saying that it's smarter to use only one of it. Overall Itachi is smarter in a mid-fight, but that won't be enough to kill Obito with only that. Everything else, Obito is just better than both of them. here is the order obito nagoto and itachi at last, you all keep repeating all the glazes he gets in show that he gets, I'm sick of it, he is all glaze if u compere him to the later parts of the villain's, your clearly saying that obito is all kamui and hax, but if that were he would be dead, meanwhile what is the facts and logic? itachi is all glaze nothing else nagato is by far the best one out of the two he is not glazed like itachi or underrated as obito. thats why he is the leader of the akatsuki. with itachi under him and obito in the shadaws.
@@headcrap6152 brother look at the video release date. I actually have a short detailing why I think Obito’s genjutsu is above Itachi’s. Go watch it. Also, not super important, but Obito was actually 18 when he fought Minato. Kakashi was 14, and he and Obito are 4 years apart. We know this because they graduated together and Kakashi graduated at 5, while Obito graduated at 9.
Obito can't attack while using Kamui and Pain have 6 corpse and shared vision + perfect teamwork (because he is 1) + summons. I don't see Pain damaging Obito and viceversa he wouldn't have a window to attack
u cant beat what u cant hit? who says that there are work arounds, genjutsu ,attacking continouosly for five minutes and when he attacks he is open to getting annihilated,naruto did it,minato did it,konan did it ,other versions of obito wins but they yellow mask was iconic,sloppy but not invincible ,zetsu so hashirama,madara and he ran away he knows everything about obito but chose to say itachi is invincible
Konan was able to kill obito with his kamui. Kamui is overrated,… minato was able to bypass it. Kakashi learned how the jutsu works,… but he couldn’t understand pain’s abilities. Lore wise Itachi > OM obito,… obito had to wait 7 years to cast infinite tsukuyomi because Itachi was protecting Naruto. Pain also has an ability that can counter kamui,… it’s called his chakra rods. If pain is able to touch obito and sticks a chakra rod on him. Obito loses. Obito also has no counter to Yata mirror or can react to Itachi’s Susanoo. Here’s a feat that’s never mention,… you know EMS reacted faster to a truth seeking orb than KCm2 Minato when he’s able to FTG. Itachi then scales to that EMS Sasuke. Also Itachi showed that he can react to KCM1 Naruto speed. It’s stated by obito that if Itachi knew about his kamui ability then he would’ve died to Amaterasu. This obito thought 12 yr old Itachi was a rival to him. Then you have pain who boxed with 6 tailed Naruto and Sage Mode Naruto. In what world is kamui outhaxing pain or Itachi’s abilities? I’m pretty sure totsuka will negate kamui since it doesn’t have a physical form,… it’s a metaphysical blade that seals anyone. But let’s say obito can bypass totsuka, Itachi’s Susanoo arms, and his Susanoo beads. Itachi has Izanami,…. Which would paralyze obito. It’s an instant win for Itachi. Obito wouldn’t be able to Izanagi out of izanami because izanami prevents Izanagi. Obito would be stuck in an infinite loop like Sage mode kabuto. Obito also saw sasuke’s eye and wasn’t able to dodge Amaterasu. I think people give no respect to Itachi or pain,… and meat ride Obito. I like obito but has zero feats pre war arc. He killed Itachi’s friend, Minato, and…. the clan?? Itachi scales above KCM1 Naruto, early EMS Sasuke, Sage Mode Kabuto, and Killer Bee. Itachi then beats Edo Nagato twice. Even tho obito wasn’t trying against Kakashi,… he still got his ass beat by Kakashi in taijutsu. Itachi’s taijutsu with KCM Naruto and Sage Mode Kabuto,… how is OM obito going to touch Itachi? What’s so crazy is that fodder ninja were able to touch Obito while he was in kamui. That’s why he lost his arm. Imagine if Itachi hit Obito with Totsuka Blade or Amaterasu in the same situation,… then obito is dead. Same can be said about pain’s chakra rods.
1: Konan needed an enormous amount of prep AND the intel that there’s a timer on it. Itachi with that type of advantage wins. However, there’s no evidence to suggest he’d figure that out and replicate Konan’s result without that intel and prep. 2: Kakashi figured it out, yes, but he had the advantage of being able to use Kamui against Obito, an advantage Itachi wouldn’t have. 3: Minato was only able to counter due to FTG, an advantage Itachi would have. 4: Kakashi did figure out Pain’s abilities. What are you talking about? He explains them to Choji and Choza, and his intel is key for Naruto’s plan. 5: Obito had to wait that long because they had to seal Kurama last. 6: Chakra rods wouldn’t be able to touch Obito because Obito is faster and can warp through him. 7: Obito can Kamui into the susano’o, bypassing the Yata Mirror, or just wait for Itachi to exhaust his chakra. 8: EMS reacting faster doesn’t mean anything because the databook and manga BOTH confirm that Minato was mentally nerfed at that time, so your scaling doesn’t work. 9: That statement from Obito about almost dying only applies to if Itachi has intel and prep, which he wouldn’t in a straight up fight. Obito beats Itachi with intel and prep too. 10: Obito never said Itachi rivaled his power. That’s a fan rumor bro. 11: Boxing with 6 tails Naruto and sage mode Naruto isn’t as impressive as boxing with KCM Naruto, so Obito blatantly outscales there. 12: Totsuka Blade is stated to have to PIERCE its target, implying it must physically make contact, meaning Kamui negs. 13: Everything about Itachi’s susano’o gets countered by Kamui. 14: Izanami is a possible win con, but Kamui is a much more likely win con and Itachi has no other win cons. 15: Obito didn’t know Sasuke’s eye had Amaterasu implanted in it, so he was taken by surprise. He’d know Itachi has that ability, so he’d be ready for it. 16: Obito was not getting beat down by Kakashi in taijutsu. At worst they were even, and since we know Obito threw that fight it’s unclear what we can know scales there, aside from genjutsu. But if you want to go there, Kakashi’s combat speed scales to KCM Minato, who’s above Itachi by a wide margin. 17: None of the abilities you listed outside of izanagi are immune to being countered by Kamui. A Million: I agree Itachi has win conditions, especially with prep and intel, but he has nothing that counters Kamui without substantial prep and intel. A Million and One: Izanami is a win con, but only if he can force Obito to repeat the same thing multiple times. Obito knows about izanami and is one of the smartest characters in the verse (albeit not as smart as Itachi), so he’s more than likely not getting caught in izanami. A Million and Two: What does Itachi have to counter Kamui without prep and intel? It was nearly fast enough to beat Minato’s INSTANT teleportation, so Itachi better have a defense that’s instant or he’s toast.
@@sageofthickcalves 1. Konan’s feat is simply swarming obito with basic paper bombs,… this isn’t an intelligent feat. Itachi should swarm obito with anything,.. he could send his water shadow clone to be used as kamui fodder and explode into obito. This essentially is the same strategy that konan,…. The only difference is that obito can’t teleport away,… but prove to me that the paper bombs konan sent are faster than itachi. Or cover a greater distance than Itachi’s Amaterasu? Konan obviously didn’t paper bomb obito with 1 billion paper bombs all at once. When obito kamui konan’s bomb it hit him. The amount of 6 billion paper bombs didn’t affect obito,… it was simply he used kamui while the paper bomb exploded. Itachi can also learn what kamui is like minato and Kakashi. He doesn’t need to know that kamui is dimensional, he should understand the tangibility of kamui. Which he would be able to do if minato and Guy can react to kamui. Guy understood how kamui works,… on a stronger version of obito. He doesn’t know it’s teleportation because that irrelevant in the fight.
@@sageofthickcalves 2. Kakashi knows kamui because it’s also his ability. But Itachi doesn’t need to know that it’s teleportation,… he just needs to know how it works and how to counter it. Minato was able to decipher it with 1 or 2 exchanges. I’m not debating Minato vs Itachi in intelligence, but Itachi should have the rationality to understand how kamui works when he himself says that every jutsu has a weakness (casually counters chibaku tensei).
@@sageofthickcalves 3. No, minato reacted to kamui prior to his FTG level 2. Minato escaped kamui with FTg level 1. We can’t quantify how fast kamui can teleport,… what’s funny is that even if Itachi was trapped in kamui,… the next time obito does kamui against pain he would die as Itachi would slice him in half when his body parts teleport into the kamui dimension just like with Kakashi. Kakashi could have killed obito then there but he decided to punch him. Itachi doesn’t need FTG when can summon his Susanoo which encompass a larger area than the kamui. Remember Obito’s MS isn’t a kamui snipe like Kakashi’s,… so kamui wouldn’t transport the entire Susanoo. Maybe Kakashi can,… but obito can’t.
@@sageofthickcalves 4. Kakashi wasn’t the one who figured out pain is interconnected by Nagato,… that was Jiraiya. Also he got washed by a lesser pain. Doesn’t matter because Kakashi didn’t see all 6 paths abilities and he didn’t fight all 6 paths. He doesn’t even know about the outer path ability of the rinnegan. Itachi is the only person to have countered the animal path, absorption path, and Deva path put together with his fight with Nagato. Also edo Nagato is much stronger than the 6 paths put together.
fun fact, you're downplaying itachi so much, Konan before even she executed her plan, made Obito look like a weak character, before even she used a "prep time jutsu" if we can call it so, Itachi even without prep would have killed Obito without so much difficulty, the problem is, he wouldn't then survive long enough to prepare his fight with Sasuke due to his sickness . well now if u want to argue, give ur discord, i'll show you in few minutes how ridiculous it is to say itachi isn't the strongest akatsuki member.
![GUILTY GEAR -STRIVE- Season Pass 4 Playable Character #1 [Queen Dizzy] Trailer](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/nXDsAgYXXv4/mqdefault.jpg)
I loved Deidara the most, I painted him and put him in a glass frame and hanged up on the wall 😂 he was so cool back in my childhood.
Who would you like to see him in a battle discussion with? I’m down to drop a Deidara video
Deidara vs each kage
@@l1nk444 I’ll put it on the list!
Nicely done video!!!
Thank you so much! 🙏🏼 Hope you hit that noti bell so you can be notified when future videos drop 🤙🏼
Amazing video, amazing username, instant sub
Thank you so much! Glad to have your support 🙏🏼
Great video. I like this. I think ranking the akatsuki would be a good video and the another video is u discussing itachi vs pain.
Got an Akatsuki tier list video with @vihrtue in the works rn 👀🙏🏼
@sageofthickcalves nice that's awesome!
Nice video, you should rank the akatsuki next.
Doing an Akatsuki tier list next week 🙏🏼
Loving your videos bro big fan
Thank you! They’ll keep coming every week 🙏🏼
I love your videos and the effort put in. I’d love to know an intelligence ranking!
Thank you so much! Adding it to the list 🙏🏼
@@sageofthickcalves how does the rimmega boost the chakra?
@@lorddukfoxyzeppeli7921 great question. Obito says that the chakra from possessing just one Rinnegan nearly drove him mad. So we know the Rinnegan enhances chakra based on that for sure. But also, Madara’s overall power significantly increases when he receives his second Rinnegan (including physical stats), so that’s pretty good evidence too. Finally, Obito straight up got his arm blown off by Minato’s rasengan, but after acquiring the Rinnegan he’s able to tank a KCM1 Naruto rasengan with just some singe marks. So, unless we think Hokage Minato’s rasengan is significantly stronger than KCM1 Naruto’s rasengan, that implies a durability amp, and the databooks state that you can use chakra to “temper the body”. So yeah all of that points in the direction of the Rinnegan amping chakra.
What about Obito's durability feat of taking a rasengan to the back from Minato? We know know the one shot manga that Minato's rasengan is REALLY strong
Loved the video! Great editing, arguments and voice, liked and subscribed!
Dude thank you so much! His durability is great, but it’s in large part due to his regeneration and access to white Zetsu replacements. It’s stated in the databooks that he operates from the shadows due to the injuries he sustained fighting Minato, so even by the Pain Arc he’s not fully recovered from that, weirdly. That said, his raw durability should be above Itachi’s, but not Pain’s. Love this comment, though! Hope to see more of your opinions and comments on here in the future 🙏🏼
@@sageofthickcalvesI feel like he’d have to be 100% recovered from his injuries by the pain arc, but if not by then, he is definitely fully recovered by the war arc
@@sageofthickcalvesI compare it to when he told the 5 kage that he had no strength because of his battle with the first hokage which was just to make them underestimate him
@@Braedon-vy5om yeah someone informed me it’s a false fan translation
Bro can I just say the quality and analysis on these videos are next level. Keep it up and I’m sure you’ll blow up!
Thank you so much! I’m glad to be able to bring solid content to the community 🙏🏼
Great video brotha, keep up the good work!
Yessirrr!!! Thanks brother 🙏🏼
Killing the ranking game, man! These 3 are total beasts, but there was really only one clear winner.
Bro you already know 🔥🙏🏼
Keep up the grind
You already know 🙏🏼🔥
Ok so hear me out. Normally I’d say itachi > pain. However itachi suffers the same problem that sasuke faces against Naruto. Itachi likes 1v1 where he can save chakra and end fights quickly. Pain however doesn’t do 1v1. He has dozens and dozens of bodies rushing you at all sides all with shared vision. This is a nightmare matchup for itachi who wants to fight a singular opponent. In addition, itachis usual win conditions are to use amaterasu (which gets absorbed) or tsukiyomi (paths don’t feel pain so it’s not gonna put them in a coma) itachi real only option is totsuka spam. Which gets countered by shared vision and shinra. Also itachi has Zero answer for chibaku tensei (without bee or naruto help)
Edit: also, bansho tenin allows him to rag doll people pull them off the ground etc… so he should be able to bansho tenin the susano And/or itachi inside the susano
Completely agree with this entire video im surprised u didnt go over speed even tho the outcome is the same just thought that would be one of the sections but ig the video would be even longer lol
I touched on speed very briefly, just saying that Itachi and Obito should be relative, as they both scale around KCM Naruto, while Pain is slightly slower than them at around the sage mode Naruto range.
Itachi is not as Fast as Minato or Naruto let's be real here when he fought Naruto, Naruto was clearly holding back cause of the relationship between him and Sasuke
@@leonhart6957 Naruto states that he’s going to go all out because he’s fighting edos right before this battle
@@sageofthickcalves Just can't believe that Itachi is as fast as Minato I'm sorry that's a Bit mad
@@leonhart6957 i don’t think he is. Minato is closer to KCM2
So in my opinion the Almighty push should be able to counter kamui. It uses gravity waves to block Jutsu or reflect them, kamui is a dimensional portal so almighty push should be able to collapse the Portal. Plus in the data books almighty push is said to be able to beat any type of ninjutsu, last time I checked it's a space time ninjutsu. Sharingan abilities also have been shown to be ineffective against it by the means of amaterasu. Just my opinion though.
I think that would make a lot of sense. Kakashi’s Kamui was also able to teleport away Kaguya’s portal so none of it makes sense 🤣
@@sageofthickcalves actually if you think about it kamui is a weaker version of kaguya's ability. Kaguya ate the hod fruit that gave her those abilities, so her decadents like the Uchiha who posses the Sharingan that is unique to kaguya. She possesses the rennei-Sharingan, so the abilities of the Uchiha are different forms of her capabilities. So kaumi being able to open or close her portals isn't crazy.
@@joshfarrow9707 well it’s said that all dojutsu decend from Shibai Otsusuki. I do think Kamui is better than Kaguya’s dimension shift, but they’re similar for sure
@@sageofthickcalves yeah if you consider Boruto cannon and even worth the time to read or watch. I personally can't stand it and refuse to take it seriously
@@joshfarrow9707 i think the manga is spectacular, but the anime is 80% garbage
Volume is a little low. Could be bumped up by 5dB.
Thank you! Will keep that in mind 🙏🏼
I'm fine with Obito being the strongest, but I do think the pact statement works as evidence for Itachi>Obito. The pact was made when Itachi implied he'd kill Obito if he attacked Konoha, and it's not like it was a short wait. Itachi joined the Akatsuki at 12 or 13, meaning Obito had to wait almost a decade due to the pact. And it's not like he simply accepted it because Itachi was helpful to him, as he said that Itachi was an eyesore (AKA a hindrance), and a few pages later when he was talking about people who helped him get as far as he did, he didn't list Itachi. I also believe the Susanoo at least is superior to Obito as Zetsu considered it invincible and in Generations (which is arguably canon due to an interview statement), Obito said no opponent was worthy of Itachi, referring to a moment when he was using the Susanoo.
I'm also a bit iffy on Itachi~KCM Naruto in speed as he was drained from shooting out 13 shadow clones, but clone nerfing is a bit of a messy subject so it's cool. As for which vid I'd like to see next, Itachi vs Pain please!
Love this comment! You know your stuff. Yeah I think you can definitely interpret that statement a few different ways, but my point was that I don’t think it clearly indicates Itachi > Obito, but rather that fighting Itachi would be more trouble than it’s worth considering that he’s going to die soon anyway. I do think Itachi has win cons, but I don’t think he has a concrete way to get around the Kamui, whereas I think Obito’s Kamui is basically a solid workaround for everything Itachi has, aside from genjutsu.
As far as him making the threat to kill him, I believe Obito’s response is something along the lines of, “You think you can?” And I think Itachi says something like, “It’s not about if I can kill you. I WILL kill you.” That’s pretty menacing on both counts, but I think Obito wasn’t necessarily afraid of Itachi killing him, and I think Obito definitely could’ve killed Itachi at that point. So, it leads me to believe that Obito saw Itachi as being more useful as a member of the Akatsuki, spreading fear and capturing bijuu, rather than being dead. Again, Itachi definitely has win cons, but I just can’t get past the Kamui hax.
Itachi vs Pain is in the works 👀 Next video is Kakashi vs Tsunade, but Itachi vs Pain is coming 🙏🏼
@@sageofthickcalves I mean the 8-9 years he had to wait and the eyesore thing still applies but you're right in that it's not definitive, though I think it at least indicates that Itachi's a decent threat to his life.
Tbh I think an overlooked wincon of Itachi's is potentially the Totsuka Blade, as the databook says that in the face of a God's power, physical and astral bodies are meaningless, which you could interpret as including Kamui.
@@AlanJia8 yeah I just get caught up on the issue of it saying it has to pierce it’s target to seal them. I’m not sure what would happen, but I lean toward Kamui working against it. We actually see it slash Orochimaru’s hydra heads and not seal them so the piercing part seems to imply it must stab it’s target to seal them. Idk man it’s weird haha
@jeffsangs8427 Mans jus waited 9 years cause he couldn't be bothered?
@jeffsangs8427 100% facts
pain phantom dragon will get obito soul even with kamui
Like the idea, but I’m not sure it works
@@sageofthickcalves kamui only teleport his physical body parts when dodging thats why he's still there . However phantom dragon attacks the soul directly. Only way he could avoid it will be if he completely transport himself to another place which takes much more time and will be vulnerable to attack like konan said . So pain will be like his worse matchup cause of his wide range of jutsu's qnd ability which he will completely take advantage of
@@Crimebot02 it’s unclear whether Kamui also teleports the part of the soul that the body part being warped away is “attached” to, so that claim can’t be substantiated. I mean the databook entry for Kamui says it can transport “everything” into the Kamui dimension. I’ve seen that theory, though, and I do think it’s interesting and worth pondering, but there’s no real evidence to support it.
Keep it up!
Thank you for being so supportive! 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼
Please do Itachi versus Nagato please.
@@igormendoncacanga2569 on the list 👀
its okay just overlook itachis speed feats
I pointed out that his speed scales to KCM Naruto, which is exactly where it scales. Obito also scales there.
Personally my Top 3 Akatsuki Member List is Obito Itachi and Nagato Pain in that order.
I’d have Pain beating Itachi, but Itachi over Pain in terms of scaling
@@sageofthickcalves well I’m putting these Three in terms of Power-Scaling so Itachi over Pain because he beat Nagato and Sage Kabuto and Obito over both of them because Obito as Ten Tails Jinchuriki should be MASSIVELY STRONGER than both of them.
@@Emperor-ot6fl
Itachi fans still spreading the slander that he soloed Nagato while it took Bee and Naruto to destroy Chibaku Tensei.
Nagato solos Itachi with mid diff at best.
Remember how sasuke summoned manda in his fight with deidara and reverse summoned his way out of the explosion? And he was going to do that again with jugo and naruto in the war? What if a person is in the kamui world/ dimension and does what jiraiya and sasuke do and reverse summon their way out? Is that possible?
Should be! Summoning is a space/time ninjutsu so I don’t see why not. Sasuke was able to summon his hawk into Kaguya’s dimension
@@sageofthickcalves ok exactly. I forgot he summoned the hawk in another dimension. Thank you for replying. I know its out of character for someone like itachi or nagato/pain to reverse summon themselfs out of a situation. But itachis intellect may allow him to figure out he can or could reverse summon himself to escape kamui. Could minato using flying raijin to escape if he was in kamui dimension as well? If so, obitos dimension isn't truly inescapable. Just needs the right talent to pull off.
@@Vergil512 yeah FTG should work since it’s stated to “ignore space and time”. It’s entirely possible that Kamui is a sealed dimension that only allows entry and exit via Kamui, but if not then yeah it should work.
@@sageofthickcalves really need to know from kishimoto if kamui is a sealed dimension only escapable by someone with kamui alone or it just space time dimension that anyone well versed in the use of ftg can get out of it as well but then kamui was able to access kaguya's dimension which if it's also sealed only someone with the rinnesharigan should be able to access and get out of.
@@lexogun1311 yeah everything about space/time ninjutsu is weird
Sounds like you got background music from lost
Haha I didn’t even think of that. It’s just called Gregorian chant or something. Just from the free audio through my editing app
These 3 are the strongest in the akatsuki because of doujutsu
Doujutsu is king in Naruto. Feel free to check out my other videos if you like this type of content 🙏🏼
😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮 Bro itachi can figure it a plan just like konan, and same for nagato
, Chibaku tensei for 5 mins and its gg
Konan needed years of studying Obito’s abilities and an enormous amount of prep, luxuries Obito wouldn’t have in a random encounter battle. Plus, Itachi has no counter for Kamui
@@sageofthickcalves and how obito is supposed to beat 6 pains, or even beat itachi
@@ytestylinter8544 Kamui and wood style are more than enough
@@sageofthickcalves Ridiculous, you fanatics are something else. It's not even a question. Itachi and Obito have no chance
@@Ach1mW how does Pain counter Kamui?
this was a very goood video in termasof ranking its the best i have ever seen,itachi has spent time with obito and obito has respected all of itachis wishes ,itachi for me is the weakest but could kill all of them ,thats why they waited for him to die. I want to point out that kamui has weaknesses,kakashi,konan and flying raijin,its also very possible for him to suck in a crow clone bomb and gets destroyed but he would not die.how about obitos offense? he is sloppy as seen with fu and torune,minato,people say he grew stonger after fighting minato did he?he was literally the stongest person he just got more experienced and that is useless when it clashes intelligence, itachi knows about hashirama cells ,itachi has shisuis eye .how would kotoamatsukami and tsukuyomi do against obito ,it happens in a second ,perhaps he would survive but ,nagato i am not so sure ,he has a regul rinnegan and his sharingan and his body is not athe uchiha body meant for resisting it.its a whole lifetime in a second,what about obito vs kotoamatsukami he clearly wannet to take shisuis eye if his were better why would he want it?.he has no susano. and to attack he needs to be tangible i say there is a weakness and there are only 2 characters on tthe show that i thick can find that weakness ,minato and u guessed right uchiha itachi
Poor rinnengan being the strongest dodjutsu looses to no-clip/j
Actually he isn't intangible all the time there is bit of a cool down in kamui
There’s only a cooldown on continual use
Instead of asking why Itachi didn't go after Obito, you should instead be asking why he didn't go after Itachi. It's like you said - it's too dangerous.
If you are basing this premise on narrative, then Itachi has Obito beat. He threatened Obito and Obito didn't disagree.
"You can't beat what you can't hit". This argument works against Obito as well. He can't hit anyone while intangible. And Kamui warping was shown to be "countered" in some way in pretty much every instance it was used. So no, it's not invincible. It has a fairly high failure rate. You can argue Obito can be Shinra Tensei'd away while trying to warp a path.
This video which covers a surface level falls flat if you actually look at context. I could easily just say Zetsu said Itachi is invincible even knowing Obito exists, and it would be just as valid as this video. Even more valid actually.
I don’t think it was too dangerous for Obito to go after Itachi. I think it would’ve been an unnecessary hassle when he knew Itachi would die soon
That "soon" was almost a decade and taking too long ended up being Obito's downfall.@@sageofthickcalves
@@marwyn8152 Itachi was useful for Obito’s purposes while he was there, though, even helping snag the 4 tails
@@sageofthickcalves that was Kisame. Itachi never captured a tailed beast himself.
@@marwyn8152 Well Itachi was there, it’s just unclear how much he actually helped. Also, depending on how you feel about it’s canonicity, Itachi and Kisame seemed to have failed to catch Yagura. Either way, Itachi was sent on missions for the Akatsuki, and Obito was aware that it would take a good amount of time for all nine bijuu to be sealed. If he did want to try to take out Itachi, there’s a chance Itachi could get away and either leak information about the Akatsuki or maybe start taking out it’s members, crippling Obito’s ability to complete his plan. That said, it wouldn’t have made any strategic sense for him to try to take down Itachi when he knew he was going to die on his own soon enough. There’s just no argument to be made for Itachi over Obito bro.
itachi if far ahead of pain and obito you can debate obito and pain but itachi is in a different class
I broke down exactly why that wasn’t true in this video
Itachi vs Nagato
Do you think that should be separate from Itachi vs Pain or lumped into one vid?
How is Kamui a win conditiion against Pain? Wouldn't Pain just jump Obito from both sides if any of his Pains got sucked in? Obito has no other offensive moves that would let him win. The only argument is that Nagato can't control the Pains because they're in another dimension with the range limit. I don't really get how Kamui is a win condition in half the fights he's in tbh. Like, okay, you sucked up Minato but now what? The strongest ninja on the planet is sitting in your dimension waiting for an opportunity to kick your ass? Way to go, genius.
Obito is far faster than Pain, so he can blitz him with Kamui. I don’t think Kamui would be necessary, though. Since Konohamaru was able to take down one path with a rasengan, I don’t see why Obito’s wood style wouldn’t work. He also knows Pain’s abilities, so he’d know to take down the summoning and naraka paths first. Or he could just go straight to Nagato lol
I was more just talking about how people act like Obito sucking somebody into Kamui means he wins. The series seems to treat it that way, such as in the Minato fight, but I don't really get it because it's not like people who enter Kamui without Obito's eye instantly die or anything. Is there something I'm forgetting?@@sageofthickcalves
@@Anno_AD They’d starve to death eventually if they don’t have a way out with space-time techniques. Minato should be able to get out with FTG, but neither he nor Obito would’ve known that so it makes sense for them to treat it the way they did
That's true, at least in a 1v1 most characters would just be screwed if they got caught by Kamui, although if he's ever fighting multiple dudes it could end up in a War arc situation where he's getting attacked from both sides. Also it's funny to imagine Obito purposefully avoiding entering the dimension for like a week because he sucked a dude in and he's waiting for him to die of dehydration.@@sageofthickcalves
@@Anno_AD Yeah I think it would depend on the speed of the enemies too. Kakashi, Guy, and Naruto during the war are WAYYYYY faster than Pain is, so I’m not sure it would be an issue with them. The biggest problem would be if he doesn’t take out the summoning path then he’d just have to do everything again lol.
I have thought about Obito avoiding going into Kamui in order to protect himself from his enemies so many times lmao. I do wonder why Tarune or whatever (Danzo’s Aburame clan underling) and his buddy didn’t kill Obito when he warped back into the Kamui dimension like 2 minutes later. There may be some kind of trap he’s set in there idk
Kakashi in the war arc has gotten way stronger from the pain arc so the blitzing doesn’t really apply since this isn’t the same Kakashi other than that this is a good ranking of them but comparing war arc vs pain arc isn’t a correct way to go about it but pain arc and before is the better way to scale against the characters each akatsuki member fought minus Obito since before he got the Rinnegan nothing changes from summit Obito to around pain arc Obito
Yeah I agree it might not be entirely fair to do it that way. I just wanted to give Pain a bit of a high ball in that category since he’s clearly the slowest one there.
@@sageofthickcalves one character that you didn’t mention was Kisame who was going up against Killer Bee and it was stated that Killer Bee was the next strongest adversary after pain even tho I do feel pain is stronger than the 5 kage from the 5 kage summit however falls short when it comes to the war arc unless you take Nagato as a feat but I don’t equate Nagato and Pain having the same capabilities
@@sageofthickcalvesbut the ranking you had for them in the video was correct
@@jedibattlemasterseanberry3172 Kisame arguably has the most raw power, but his abilities don’t stack up against these 3 in a battle. He doesn’t have a hard counter for any of the Rinnegan abilities, Kamui, or tsukuyomi. And he basically bent the knee when Tobi revealed himself as Obito, so he knows he’s inferior there. Love Kisame, though. You’ll like my upcoming Akatsuki Tier List video 🙏🏼 Make sure to hit that notification bell so you can know when it drops 🤙🏼
@@sageofthickcalves I could of swore he revealed himself as Madara not obito not until his mask got broken later on into the war arc
Obito's genjutsu is far better than Itachi's. You need to wake up. The genjutsu he put on the Three Tails and Yagura was so powerful he controlled him like a puppet, and it took years to be revealed that he was under a genjutsu. When they tried to break him out of it, he just died. So you're wrong about Itachi being the only one to kill with genjutsu. Obito's durability is by far the most impressive in the series. You conveniently ignore the fact that he took a Rasengan from Minato and then got stabbed with his kunai when he was just 14, without a single scratch. He just stood there like nothing happened; only his white parts melted down, which means the white zetsu parts are just weaker than his actual body. Later, a Rasengan exploded point blank twice, once in his face and the other in his arm, and he only had scratches from KCM Naruto. You only showed an amped Kakashi by Kurama's chakra when half of his body is getting punched in another space. While it's separate, of course he is going to get hurt. You clearly lack knowledge on these topics. There is no way in hell Obito and Itachi are equal in speed and power-that's just cap. Also, you're clearly wrong about the Rinnegan boosting chakra. It simply does not; it only provides the abilities. We all saw what the Rinnegan did to Nagato when he lost control, he was all emaciated and stuff. He was smiling even though he was in great pain, that's probably what Obito meant. Obito used the Rinnegan better than Nagato in most ways, he was just saying that it's smarter to use only one of it. Overall Itachi is smarter in a mid-fight, but that won't be enough to kill Obito with only that. Everything else, Obito is just better than both of them.
here is the order obito nagoto and itachi at last, you all keep repeating all the glazes he gets in show that he gets, I'm sick of it, he is all glaze if u compere him to the later parts of the villain's, your clearly saying that obito is all kamui and hax, but if that were he would be dead, meanwhile what is the facts and logic? itachi is all glaze nothing else nagato is by far the best one out of the two he is not glazed like itachi or underrated as obito. thats why he is the leader of the akatsuki. with itachi under him and obito in the shadaws.
@@headcrap6152 brother look at the video release date. I actually have a short detailing why I think Obito’s genjutsu is above Itachi’s. Go watch it.
Also, not super important, but Obito was actually 18 when he fought Minato. Kakashi was 14, and he and Obito are 4 years apart. We know this because they graduated together and Kakashi graduated at 5, while Obito graduated at 9.
@@sageofthickcalves lol nahh bro i dont care stay stupid.
Kamui
Obito can't attack while using Kamui and Pain have 6 corpse and shared vision + perfect teamwork (because he is 1) + summons.
I don't see Pain damaging Obito and viceversa he wouldn't have a window to attack
Obito counters all of Pain’s abilities, but also has a sizable speed advantage that should allow him to drag each path of pain into Kamui one by one.
u cant beat what u cant hit? who says that there are work arounds, genjutsu ,attacking continouosly for five minutes and when he attacks he is open to getting annihilated,naruto did it,minato did it,konan did it ,other versions of obito wins but they yellow mask was iconic,sloppy but not invincible ,zetsu so hashirama,madara and he ran away he knows everything about obito but chose to say itachi is invincible
itachi kills instantly with tsukiyomi. its too fast. theres no resisting or breaking out
It’s straight up stated by Itachi that you need a mongekyou to break out of it and Obito has a mongekyou
@@sageofthickcalvesof course the itachitards would ignore reason and statements and only type the shit they want to happen in their brain lol.
Konan was able to kill obito with his kamui. Kamui is overrated,… minato was able to bypass it. Kakashi learned how the jutsu works,… but he couldn’t understand pain’s abilities. Lore wise Itachi > OM obito,… obito had to wait 7 years to cast infinite tsukuyomi because Itachi was protecting Naruto. Pain also has an ability that can counter kamui,… it’s called his chakra rods. If pain is able to touch obito and sticks a chakra rod on him. Obito loses. Obito also has no counter to Yata mirror or can react to Itachi’s Susanoo. Here’s a feat that’s never mention,… you know EMS reacted faster to a truth seeking orb than KCm2 Minato when he’s able to FTG. Itachi then scales to that EMS Sasuke. Also Itachi showed that he can react to KCM1 Naruto speed. It’s stated by obito that if Itachi knew about his kamui ability then he would’ve died to Amaterasu. This obito thought 12 yr old Itachi was a rival to him. Then you have pain who boxed with 6 tailed Naruto and Sage Mode Naruto. In what world is kamui outhaxing pain or Itachi’s abilities? I’m pretty sure totsuka will negate kamui since it doesn’t have a physical form,… it’s a metaphysical blade that seals anyone. But let’s say obito can bypass totsuka, Itachi’s Susanoo arms, and his Susanoo beads. Itachi has Izanami,…. Which would paralyze obito. It’s an instant win for Itachi. Obito wouldn’t be able to Izanagi out of izanami because izanami prevents Izanagi. Obito would be stuck in an infinite loop like Sage mode kabuto. Obito also saw sasuke’s eye and wasn’t able to dodge Amaterasu. I think people give no respect to Itachi or pain,… and meat ride Obito. I like obito but has zero feats pre war arc. He killed Itachi’s friend, Minato, and…. the clan?? Itachi scales above KCM1 Naruto, early EMS Sasuke, Sage Mode Kabuto, and Killer Bee. Itachi then beats Edo Nagato twice. Even tho obito wasn’t trying against Kakashi,… he still got his ass beat by Kakashi in taijutsu. Itachi’s taijutsu with KCM Naruto and Sage Mode Kabuto,… how is OM obito going to touch Itachi? What’s so crazy is that fodder ninja were able to touch Obito while he was in kamui. That’s why he lost his arm. Imagine if Itachi hit Obito with Totsuka Blade or Amaterasu in the same situation,… then obito is dead. Same can be said about pain’s chakra rods.
1: Konan needed an enormous amount of prep AND the intel that there’s a timer on it. Itachi with that type of advantage wins. However, there’s no evidence to suggest he’d figure that out and replicate Konan’s result without that intel and prep.
2: Kakashi figured it out, yes, but he had the advantage of being able to use Kamui against Obito, an advantage Itachi wouldn’t have.
3: Minato was only able to counter due to FTG, an advantage Itachi would have.
4: Kakashi did figure out Pain’s abilities. What are you talking about? He explains them to Choji and Choza, and his intel is key for Naruto’s plan.
5: Obito had to wait that long because they had to seal Kurama last.
6: Chakra rods wouldn’t be able to touch Obito because Obito is faster and can warp through him.
7: Obito can Kamui into the susano’o, bypassing the Yata Mirror, or just wait for Itachi to exhaust his chakra.
8: EMS reacting faster doesn’t mean anything because the databook and manga BOTH confirm that Minato was mentally nerfed at that time, so your scaling doesn’t work.
9: That statement from Obito about almost dying only applies to if Itachi has intel and prep, which he wouldn’t in a straight up fight. Obito beats Itachi with intel and prep too.
10: Obito never said Itachi rivaled his power. That’s a fan rumor bro.
11: Boxing with 6 tails Naruto and sage mode Naruto isn’t as impressive as boxing with KCM Naruto, so Obito blatantly outscales there.
12: Totsuka Blade is stated to have to PIERCE its target, implying it must physically make contact, meaning Kamui negs.
13: Everything about Itachi’s susano’o gets countered by Kamui.
14: Izanami is a possible win con, but Kamui is a much more likely win con and Itachi has no other win cons.
15: Obito didn’t know Sasuke’s eye had Amaterasu implanted in it, so he was taken by surprise. He’d know Itachi has that ability, so he’d be ready for it.
16: Obito was not getting beat down by Kakashi in taijutsu. At worst they were even, and since we know Obito threw that fight it’s unclear what we can know scales there, aside from genjutsu. But if you want to go there, Kakashi’s combat speed scales to KCM Minato, who’s above Itachi by a wide margin.
17: None of the abilities you listed outside of izanagi are immune to being countered by Kamui.
A Million: I agree Itachi has win conditions, especially with prep and intel, but he has nothing that counters Kamui without substantial prep and intel.
A Million and One: Izanami is a win con, but only if he can force Obito to repeat the same thing multiple times. Obito knows about izanami and is one of the smartest characters in the verse (albeit not as smart as Itachi), so he’s more than likely not getting caught in izanami.
A Million and Two: What does Itachi have to counter Kamui without prep and intel? It was nearly fast enough to beat Minato’s INSTANT teleportation, so Itachi better have a defense that’s instant or he’s toast.
@@sageofthickcalves 1. Konan’s feat is simply swarming obito with basic paper bombs,… this isn’t an intelligent feat. Itachi should swarm obito with anything,.. he could send his water shadow clone to be used as kamui fodder and explode into obito. This essentially is the same strategy that konan,…. The only difference is that obito can’t teleport away,… but prove to me that the paper bombs konan sent are faster than itachi. Or cover a greater distance than Itachi’s Amaterasu? Konan obviously didn’t paper bomb obito with 1 billion paper bombs all at once. When obito kamui konan’s bomb it hit him. The amount of 6 billion paper bombs didn’t affect obito,… it was simply he used kamui while the paper bomb exploded. Itachi can also learn what kamui is like minato and Kakashi. He doesn’t need to know that kamui is dimensional, he should understand the tangibility of kamui. Which he would be able to do if minato and Guy can react to kamui. Guy understood how kamui works,… on a stronger version of obito. He doesn’t know it’s teleportation because that irrelevant in the fight.
@@sageofthickcalves 2. Kakashi knows kamui because it’s also his ability. But Itachi doesn’t need to know that it’s teleportation,… he just needs to know how it works and how to counter it. Minato was able to decipher it with 1 or 2 exchanges. I’m not debating Minato vs Itachi in intelligence, but Itachi should have the rationality to understand how kamui works when he himself says that every jutsu has a weakness (casually counters chibaku tensei).
@@sageofthickcalves 3. No, minato reacted to kamui prior to his FTG level 2. Minato escaped kamui with FTg level 1. We can’t quantify how fast kamui can teleport,… what’s funny is that even if Itachi was trapped in kamui,… the next time obito does kamui against pain he would die as Itachi would slice him in half when his body parts teleport into the kamui dimension just like with Kakashi. Kakashi could have killed obito then there but he decided to punch him. Itachi doesn’t need FTG when can summon his Susanoo which encompass a larger area than the kamui. Remember Obito’s MS isn’t a kamui snipe like Kakashi’s,… so kamui wouldn’t transport the entire Susanoo. Maybe Kakashi can,… but obito can’t.
@@sageofthickcalves 4. Kakashi wasn’t the one who figured out pain is interconnected by Nagato,… that was Jiraiya. Also he got washed by a lesser pain. Doesn’t matter because Kakashi didn’t see all 6 paths abilities and he didn’t fight all 6 paths. He doesn’t even know about the outer path ability of the rinnegan. Itachi is the only person to have countered the animal path, absorption path, and Deva path put together with his fight with Nagato. Also edo Nagato is much stronger than the 6 paths put together.
cannot wait for itachi vs pain ,i think alive they will kill themselves ,and edo itachi will win by sealing.pain will pull only to receive totsuka
Itachi would smoke all of them
Itachi has no counter for Kamui, unfortunately. He’s my 3rd favorite character, but he’s just not beating Obito
fun fact, you're downplaying itachi so much, Konan before even she executed her plan, made Obito look like a weak character, before even she used a "prep time jutsu" if we can call it so, Itachi even without prep would have killed Obito without so much difficulty, the problem is, he wouldn't then survive long enough to prepare his fight with Sasuke due to his sickness . well now if u want to argue, give ur discord, i'll show you in few minutes how ridiculous it is to say itachi isn't the strongest akatsuki member.
What does he have to get around Kamui?