16:00 The reason it didn't work is because in the actual game, Flame Wingman can't be special summoned any way except fusion summoning. That's the difference between the anime and the real life game. Anime, Flame Wingman can be special summoned other ways, Actual game, it cannot.
Thanks, at first I thought it was because the materials weren't in the grave at the time of De-Fusions activation. Didn't realise it was actually something as simple as a summoning restriction. Thanks for the clarification 😁
The main reason Aster/Edo commits so many "misplays" is exactly because he's styling on Jaden/Judai. In the manga, it's explained the difference between a Pro Player and a simple duelist, any other duelist would look to achieve victory as quick as possible, but a Pro has a public to entertain. You need to keep the duel interesting and dramatic. Keeping your opponent on the edge? Not revealing your main strategy until the end? That's the way Edo duels in situations like this, same happened against Zane/Kaiser.
That does make sense It cannot be helped but a lot of duels aren't that dramatic, so making some spectacle on your own is better for viewer if you can afford it
@@Deathmare235 Jaden's friends were watching and in my opinion Aster wanted to demoralize them by misplaying on purpose and winning anyway. Based on their reactions at the end of the duel Aster succeeded.
I remember this duel being mind blowing as a kid. Not only were they using the same cards, but I never considered the same cards could fuse to a different monster. It’s simple but it made this duel feel different from any gx duel to this point.
This particular duel is mixed for me. On the one hand, it is awesome seeing 2 HERO decks go head-to-head. On the other hand, I do not think the duel was very fair because Aster said the Destiny HERO's were made by Industrial Illusions, but were never released to the public. Even if Jaden could study Aster's deck, he would have no way of stopping him. And the way Aster talks to Jaden, criticizing him for using the HERO's because they are cool, that's the sick part.
5:00 Something worth noting is that the "Fusion Deck" had no size limit back then; theoretically, so long as the show made up an appropriate card, every possible combination may have existed in his Extra Deck.
I'm not even sure if the fusion monster needed to exist as a physical card, since it seemed like players made up new fusions whenever they felt like (e.g. Red Eyes Skull Dragon or Dragon Master Knight)
@@solidzack that was largely the original anime, especially duelist kingdom. I think as time went on we saw a lot less of that. Though occasionally it still cropped up. Like with the Neos fusions, which seemed like a bit of a pull from nowhere
@@solidzack True, tho by GX, when it came to after that first summoning, and especially when it came to cards like Miracle Fusion and Fifth Hope, clearly Fusion Monsters _are_ something separate.
I know it was certainly just a "the writers didn't think to write it this way" or "they did but wanted Aster's win to be more dramatic," but I like to think the in-universe reason for all of his misplays is to show judai/jaden that "I could play poorly and STILL beat you" or some similar sentiment
Actually, Jaden likely has more than that in his extra deck. The extra deck used to have no limit, that was added when synchros were added. Though I think the video games did have a limit
Also in general the anime doesn't have any limits on extra deck size, Yuma has all the Number Monsters he has in his extra deck. In one of the duels with Dark Mist, Dark Mist is able to summon HearteartH Dragon and Heraldry Crest, which Yuma has next to no reason to keep in his extra deck unless he just has all of them. Also the Utopia versions don't share a card, since Yuma and Astral fairly regularly detach base Utopia and summon it again when the upgraded version is still on the field.
@@TheWizardMus One could be forgiven for not realising Yuma is able to play all the Numbers he's acquired when he has several occasions where he has the 3 Level 4's to play Number 16 and would greatly benefit from it but pulls out good ol' 39 instead. You'd think Astral would at least suggest it.
I assumed Aster was holding back his D-heroes from his own personal sense of drama. In a sense he was being cocky but i think he wanted to make his point about heroism.
I think both you and the animators/guionists have forgotten about "Bubbleman", at the final turn, before "Dreadmaster" attacks, "Bubbleman" should be special summoned, since 2 turns had happened since the activation of "Doom Lord"'s effect, ON THE SAME battle position he had when he was banished. So even if Judai/Jaden had summon "Shining Flare Wingman" and change "Necroid Shaman" to defense, he would have a "Bubbleman" in attack position on Aster's turn to be attacked by "Deadmaster", so he would have lost anyway.
Bubbleman could’ve also just returned to the graveyard via “Burial from a Different Dimension” as Bubbleman was presently removed from play due to DH Doom Lord. It simply made not have been made public as Jaden only made it known that Sparkman and Flame Wingman returned to the graveyard, he could’ve used his third choice as Bubbleman knowing it would’ve returned in attack position with 800 attack - thus it would’ve negated Doom Lord’s return effect.
@@SuperSayianWarrior It’s actually that way in the TCG, not just Anime. It’s text is “Target up to 3 Banished monsters; return them to the graveyard” so Jaden could’ve added Bubbleman with the other two, so yes that’s what would’ve happened.
@yymenghis64 I wish we would have gotten to see that ending lol. Jaden is my favorite protag and I'd love to see just how he could fair against Atem at his best.
I know in the dub, when Aster is first introduced on a televised duel he fuses to make Phoenix Enforcer and everyone is confused but Chazz explains that Elemental Heroes have multiple fusions as Flame Wingman and Phoenix Enforcer can be made with the same fusion material. It's the same with Shining Phoenix Enforcer. Stupidly in the show Jaden doesn't know either of those things.
It is weird how the HERO archetype is his favorite one, but he doesn't know such basic info about it as what all fusions exist. He could disregard Phoenix Enforcer as the coward's play, or just pump up Flame Wingman as the more "heroic" of the two, per his opinion, but he should still know it exists.
@@brianforsyth2225tbf, Jaden just liked flame Wingman more since that's probably the one he has. He just likes them and plays his favorites. He doesn't really care too much.
@@scarlightemperor3410 but how does that explain him not knowing phoenix enforcer exists at all. The clear implication is he didn't know about it before then.
I honestly don't think Jaden could have beaten Aster in this duel. Also, Aster's moves in this duel involving the destiny heroes are specifically designed to focus on the fact that Aster believes in destiny, that everything is predetermined. The Japanese version of this duel heavily emphasizes this, as does the English version.
I think Jaden could have beaten Astee when he attacked his shining phoenix enforcer because without the equip spell shining flare wingman would have dealt the enforcers original ATK as effect damage and end the duel right nmthere and then
@@failure4452 Dub dialogue in GX is now just a gag dub complete with 4th-wall phasing (not breaking). Also, 20 minutes? Sounds like an episode runtime minus commercials.
Aster and Zane are probably the first characters to defeat an antagonist without manipulating them or do something bad if the protagonist win. They did it all with their skills alone, and Aster is a special one because any move Jaden made was immediately countered
@@Azamingg I know I'm replying to a 3 month old comment, but you're right Kaibaman did win fair and square. He de-fused BEUD to dodge the targeting Edge Hammer trap and then attacked with all 3 BEWDs for game. The difference though is that Jaden almost won that duel, Kaibaman was just one step ahead. Aster though? He toyed with Jaden and still won.
@@brocautry5063 yes but seaosn 4 jade wood kick kaibaman ass as kabia can beat the beast cards and jaden beat them 2 times kaiba wood so lsoe to yubel and jaden beat her
@@TGSAnime gokibore (or whatever the insect was) gains a hidden effect! If this card is destroyed outside of a duel, the owner of the card loses 4000 blood cells!
I looked at that one myself. -Weevil played Infestation which weakened every monster on the field while dealing damage to both of them and bringing Atem down to 500 life points. As soon as Atem's turn ended, Poison Butterfly would deal enough damage to finish him off. -Since Breaker lost a hundred attack points that let Atem use Berserker Soul to keep attacking until Weevil died. If Weevil hadn't used Infestion then Atem wouldn't have been able to use to Berserker Soul and beat him that turn. -Atem would have only had two hundred life points left so if Weevil drew a monster with 1700 attack points or more he could have destroyed Breaker and won the duel. But if he didn't then Atem would have been able to wipe him out next turn since Atem would have drawn Queen's Knight. Even if Weevil just summoned a monster in defense mode, Poison Butterfly could have just destroyed it and let his two monsters hit Weevil directly. Weevil had the upper hand for most of the duel but Atem seemed to have him on the ropes by that last turn. He shouldn't have taunted Atem. He had the choice of losing normally, or losing from excessive force. He should just be thankful it wasn't manga Atem or he would have gotten his throat slit. Or manga Joey, he probably would have just beat up Weevil.
As someone who doesn't really delve much into the actual card game, these videos are still quite fun. Thank you for taking the time to analyze all these episodes.
Gotta love how often Aster was just toying with Jaden and most of his foes in Gx and Arc-v, only in 1 duel did he ever try from the start and that was against The D or DD because he was the one who killed his father other than that he only every tried late in any of his duels.
I researched this episode recently and it made me want to rewatch this video What really bugs me about that duel is that Jaiden kept asking what the Clock towers effect was but Aster didn't answer until after he had four counters on it
That duel was actually good it showed how good Aster really was n the anime n the skill level of duelist he was n wit him beating Jaden the best duelist n the academy after Zane left was just insane
Yet zane doesnt consider his duel with aster as good as jaden or Jesse. And I'm not dissing aster he is definitely my favorite character from this show
Without even waiting to the end, I can say confidently that anime-wise? No. But if Legacy of the Duelist is anything to go by, Aster's deck wouldn't last a fucking minute against Jaden's, oh my GOD that was a horrific match.
tbf LofD has to put all the cards into a deck that actually gets shuffled, Aster switching from E-HEROs to D-HEROs with only the early/ og support mid duel was bound to be a disaster
@@godlyblackflamegodly7754 Jaden did use mirror force but in the later parts of each series in that game it becomes clear they stopped trying when making the story mode decks
@@13Jordanator Jean threw out the win on a technicality. Both teams played with the best of their abilities. Jean wanted a proper win more than the technicality.
I just wanted to see if Jaden could win. To think if Jaden won, he might’ve not met the Neo Spacians. Also Jaden should’ve summoned Darkbright instead of Tempest. Since Aster didn’t set D Time until the next turn when he summoned Shining Phoenix Enforcer, Jaden should’ve crashed Darkbright into Enforcer meaning all Aster could is summon and attack with Sparkman and then set D Time. Yes, Jaden would take damage but next turn, Jaden would win with Shining Flare Wingman. Also, Jaden would’ve had to attack as Aster must know Darkbright’s effect so I doubt he would attacked with Shining Phoenix Enforcer during his turn. Another way for Jaden to win, would’ve been to set Light Laser during the Tempest Turn. This means he could use it to save Tempest meaning next turn, he could use it to attack directly after Shining Flare Wingman to win.
@@2mellow35 I’ve also wondered what if jaden just attacked any monster with flame wingman during his final turn instead of playing fusion gate - I know that aster can’t take battle damage but he would’ve still taken effect damage due to flame wingman’s effect
@@SpecsTube Old comment I know, but attacking with flame wingman wouldn't have changed anything. Dreadmaster prevents destruction and negates battle damage, so since flame wingman couldn't destroy any of the mosters his effect would never activate.
@@brocautry5063 I think he meant if Jaden didn't play Fusion Gate and just attacked with Wingman, he'd beat Aster with Wingman's burn effect. Sure Clock Tower negates battle damage but not effect damage. Biggest misplay was playing Fusion Gate and popping Prison and summoning Dreadmaster. And like you mentioned, Dreadmaster prevents monsters from getting destroyed that turn and all damages.
These Yugioh Duel retrospectives really do make me realize how much the game of Yugioh has change over the years. Like I can’t even remember there only being one Field Spells on the field. Everyone drawing on their first turn? What?! Also, the dub really does be shooting itself in the foot with these edits!
Honestly? I like to attribute a lot of Aster's misplays to him being that overwhelming against Jaden. His whole motif of Destiny and the duel going completely according to his plan fit this idea, plus a longer duel (aside from being better television) helps the end result of the duel (in which Jaden's confidence is utterly shattered) be that much more impactful. The idea that Aster was one step ahead at almost every turn AND wasn't even playing the best he could helps drive home the idea of how powerful he is and explain how effortlessly he beat Zane without even using the Destiny Heroes
I'd put Aster's lack of playing and D cards in his first turn as him potentially still having a sliver of hope for justice and wants to prove E-heroes can do
More duel analysis videos! These are by far the favorite for me at least. It’s fun to hear about the misplays and how different turns can be better. Really makes you think how the actual plot and stuff could be different if certain duels were won or lost.
How about Yusei vs Kalin R1? Was Kalin about to beat Yusei before his D Wheel was damaged? Did Kalin really have the upper hand? Who might have misplayed?
@@DTran-je1sn yes. Yusei was abkut to lose as he if I remember correctly didnt have Scrap Iron, or if he did it was alreadynused and reset, thus EBI Ccacc aapu wouldve game him with 3k direct damage.
@@SuperSayianWarrior I am well aware of that, but my point was to see if he misplayed anyhow during the Duel. I mean an analysis like the guy of this channel does. I know Yusei would have lost, but was Kalin really a step ahead?
15:58 I think that what happens is that, in the specific example you're putting, since the materials are moved to the GY they are considered to be new cards, and as such they're not considered to have been used as fusion materials for Shining Flare Wingman. In the anime we also have the fact that Shining Flare Wingman was banished until the 2nd standby phase, which would make it so it "forgets" that it was summoned using those two specific monsters. I'd think this is more of an anime effect vs TCG effect over an illegal play, the anime de-fusion is probably summon cards that are legal materials for the fusion monster, in this case the specific materials, or it might be that it didn't work that way in the anime since some rules are different than the TCG EDIT: As someone said, another reason to add to all these is that TCG Flare Wingman can only be fusion summoned, meaning that you cannot summon it from the GY with de-fusion, and I'd think de-fusion requires you to summon all the fusion materials, meaning you can't summon anything. TL,DR: It only works in the anime cuz they slightly changed the card(s) in the TCG (mainly Flare Wingman, we don't know about anime De-Fusion as far as I'm aware)
Would certainly make sense, as iirc the tcg de-fusion will only allow the owner of the monster and the de-fusion to resummon the materials, while the anime will always return the used material regardless of the owners. So the technicalities aren't entirely one to one.
@@a.a.6203 Not quite. Shining Flame Wingman can be special summoned from the Graveyard using Monster Reborn (or similar) but like all fusion summons, this can only be done IF Flame Wingman was first special summoned by Polymerisation correctly. De-fusion would also still work on Shining Flame Wingman were he destroyed. The 'can only be fusion summoned and not special summoned' stipulation was added to most fusion monsters in the GX era until it became a blanket rule in the TCG that you MUST fusion summon correctly beforehand. Now only exceptions to the rule (such as summoned by the effects of Mask Change etc) are added in a fusion monster's description. This was to stop you pulling any shenanigans like discarding from the extra deck using card effect's like Cyber-Stein and then special summoning from the Graveyard for free, no polymerisation required. The problem is that Shining Flare Wingman was banished. In the anime it appears that if a fusion monster is banished then so are the fusion materials (which means Jaden's play is legal within the anime). In the TCG, ONLY the fusion monster is banished (with its materials remaining in the graveyard). When this happens, Shining Flare Wingman becomes a new instance of the card and no longer recognizes the fusion monsters originally used to summon it.
@@Blackjax137 You’re forgetting that we’re talking about his example video, where Shining never even left the field, it was summoned, then immediately defusioned. It didn’t work because Flame Wingman has to be fusion summoned.
Just love this series of videos. I remember watching this duel, I was so shocked with the combo of D-Hero Captain Tenacious effect of re-summoning the destroyed D-Heros destroyed that turn + cant be destroyed by battle + u can only attack him... I thought this combo was invincible HAHAHHA good times.
People have already commented on how De-Fusion would function in the TCG and Flame Wingman's TCG Fusion restriction. There is another move in this duel that would've played out differently in the TCG though. When Aster activates Magical Stone Excavation at 15:00, he wouldn't need to discard Fusion Sage and Terraforming. This is because Spell cards revealed by Destiny Hero - Diamond Dude's effect aren't activated on the field. So you don't need to pay the costs for them.
The Wingman and Sparkman that are added back to the graveyard with Burial From the Different Dimension are not the "same" Wingman and Sparkman that were used as materials for the fusion summon. When a card changes zone it becomes a new instance of the card. It's the same logic that if a monster resurrected with Call of the Haunted is banished with Interdimensional Matter Transporter, it will no longer be tied to Call of the Haunted when it returns to play.
yup, the materials left the graveyard, so they forgot they were materials, shining wingman left the field, so he forgot, what materials he used, and flame wingman cant be special summoned, except by fusion summon. like every singe thing that could interfere with defusion actually interfered.
I have some ideas for them : _Elemental HERO Static Titan _Elemental HERO Fortress Striker _Elemental HERO Dr. Vapor _Elemental HERO Savage Swordsman _Elemental HERO MuddyBlues _Elemental HERO Clear Black _Elemental HERO Cyclone _Elemental HERO AirDiver
Maybe the reason Aster didn't set D-Signal and D-Mind in the first turn is because Aster still believes in the Elemental HEROs and doesn't want to abandon them right now.
15:55 In the real card game, while Shining FW was still Fusion Summoned, it forgot it's materials, and the materials were moved, so they're no longer the same cards.
This is what I always say exactly! I like GX and Jaden with what he went through, but I have always related more to Edo/Aster overall as a character and felt like I could understand why he did and reacted to things and such. I wish they would make an AU GX anime for him as protagonist with modernized decks for their archetypes so we would have more of the heroes and he could have two decks: a dark hero one with destiny/vision and the dark masked heroes and an elemental one he only uses earlier.
I would like to see if "Was Yusei about to beat dark signer Kessler?" They're first encounter Yusei survives because of an interruption. But I was wondering if there was a way Yusei could have won that duel.
Great video idea! Here's one for ya. Was Alexis Rhodes About To Defeat Jaden? (Episode 94) Because I mean if she had used one of her facedown cards, Flare Neos would've lost attack strength and enabled Alexis to survive the turn, and due to its adverse effect, Jaden would lose Flare Neos, leaving him wide open! You have a gift my friend!
The 'can only be fusion summoned and not special summoned' stipulation was added to most fusion monsters in the GX era until it became a blanket rule in the TCG that you MUST fusion summon correctly beforehand. Now only exceptions to the rule (such as summoned by the effects of Mask Change etc) are added in a fusion monster's description. This was to stop you pulling any shenanigans like discarding from the extra deck using card effect's like Cyber-Stein and then special summoning from the Graveyard for free, no polymerisation required. This rule would stop you using interactions like Cyber-Stein, Monster Reborn (or Metamorphosis) and attack with Blue-Eyes Ultimate then use De-Fusion for three Blue-Eyes attacking for a collective 13,500 damage. In that era with only 4000 lifepoints, that'd make for a consistent one turn kill. You'll also find that Ritual Monsters are governed by a similar rule. Until these card stipulations and later blanket rule was added, that interaction would've been perfectly legal (it's also why most of those cards are banned or limited). The problem is that Shining Flare Wingman was banished. In the anime it appears that if a fusion monster is banished then so are the fusion materials (which means Jaden's play is legal within the anime). In the TCG, ONLY the fusion monster is banished (with its materials remaining in the graveyard). When this happens, Shining Flare Wingman becomes a new instance of the card and no longer recognizes the fusion monsters originally used to summon it. It loses its 'summoned correctly' status. So if Shining Flame Wingman was destroyed in battle or by card effect, you could special summon it from the graveyard using Monster Reborn (or similar) in the TCG ONLY if it was summoned correctly. Despite its oddly worded stipulation in the card text. You'd also be able to use De-fusion providing you have any monsters in the grave that COULD be used as fusion materials (even if they weren't the ones originally used).
Maybe an interesting sequal would be Jaden not using the effect of fusion gate and switching all to defense mode and summoning sparkman to defense mode. Then on Asters turn, Aster draws d-counter and attacks flame wingman with dreadmaster and sparkman with diamond dude, then banishes necroid shaman with doom lords effect then sets d-counter and ends the turn. Now Jaden draws Winged Kuriboh and automaticly summons it in defense mode. Asters turn. Now Aster draws his second boss monster, Destiny HERO Dogma. He automaticly summons it in attack mode by tributing diamind dude, captain tenacious and doom lord, then he destroys both, clayman and kuriboh. Jadens turn, he draws monster reborn and revives winged kuriboh and takes 75 damage from dogma's ability. Asters turn and he draws destiny hero dasher. Now he attacks both, necroid shaman who came back, and winged kuriboh and ends his turn. Jaden draws mirror force, he sets it and ends the turn. Aster draws d-cube and attacks for game, then jaden defends with mirror force. Now Aster in main 2 summons d-cube in defense mode. Jaden draws bladedge and summons it cuz of necroshades effect and attacks for game but aster uses d-counter. Jaden ends his turn. Asters turn and he draws d-fortune, then he tributes his d-cube and summons Dasher and attacks for game which gives him the victory. I think Jaden needed to lose 'cuz of his new deck and I no mather what, he just got new cards to add to the deck, he didn't lose the deck actually. And why did Jaden have yellow gadget, I don't get it.
One thing about Jaden's extra deck. I don't think he had plasma vice at the time as when he fought proffesor Viper and brought Plasma Vice everyone was surprised and Hassleberry even said that it must be a newly aquired monster. I could be wrong however but I liked to point that out.
Yeah they said it was a new hero in the Japanese version too. Though looking at that duel, it seemed they just had Jaden “Shill” new cards for the sake of advertising them to be released in the TCG
Imagine the chain of events that could have happened if he had summoned darkbright and crashed Aster would have to bring out sparkman, but Jaden could bring out shining flare wingman, but now he’s actually done over 4000 lp worth of damage
The reason Flame Wingman was Special Summoned back with De-Fusion is because the effect in the anime is exactly like it is in the TCG but it ignores the Summoning conditions for any Fusion Material monsters Special Summoned from the GY.
Given how big the fusion deck was back then... Aster would have been crazy not to at least have 1 of each of the other e hero fusions in there just to have a it of a toolbox
Thanks for those videos i can work and listening to this without needing to check my phone to underdstand everything. It makes my work time even better.
I’ll admit in GX I actually liked aster. He felt like a characterization of myself in a way. Prideful, likes to be flashy, and someone close to him murdered for no reason. Knowing that I think I can answer why aster misplayed so much. He’s a pro, he’s flashy, he wants the suspense and drama not just a quick overpowering win. Least that’s how I can figure it. That’s how I’d do it if I was essentially a performer.
It wasn’t so much that aster gave up on justice it’s that he gave up on those who are supposed to deliver it. Why should he believe in those who are supposed to uphold justice when they couldn’t give him justice. His family was murdered and nobody did a damn thing. Why should he believe in anyone anymore?
Storywise Jaden was literally doomed to lose this one, because Asters Deck was infused with light of destruction by Satorius so Aster would be guaranteed to win. I also think Aster just used the orignal 5 original E-Heros and the 2 Enforcers, since he only used those to provoke (vs. Zane) and trick Jaden (in their duel). Those cards also feel like they are common cards, kinda refering to Jadens and Asters first duel, when Aster just used a few standard boosters to make a deck. Again a really good video by the way, keep it up. :)
"I use heroes because they are cool. Also heroes save people from the utmost danger, and I want to do that because i feel like someone may get hurt by being around me. For some reason"
Rewatching this after having binged most of the playlist again, it's weird how so often the technicality of a play just breaks down to an aggression tactic vs a cautious tactic when it's not just a flat misplay.
At 17:00 another big misplay from Jaden, assuming in the anime he can special summon Flame Wingman with De-Fusion, is that he really could have just attacked Diamond Dude and won the game without the need to play Fusion Gate at all since Clock Tower only negates battle damage and not the effect damage that Wingman's super power does. I suggest Diamond dude cuz the effect damage would've been enough to do lethal even if Aster had a trap card that halved the damage. Though if I'm missing something from Clock Tower's anime effect, then that makes this point null.
Man, I didn't know there was a Batman wannabe in YuGiOh! , makes me wanna go back and watch/read the series. Great analysis as always, I'm curious as to what's the meta in the universe of YuGiOh and why do characters use such variety of decks?
I love how both characters start with Elemental HEROs but go seperate ways as they grow up Aster starts with the elemental HEROs but changes over to the Destiny HEROs Jaden starts with the elemental HEROs but changes over to the Neo-Spacians They both still USE the Elemental HEROs, but they take considerable shifts in what those HEROs are used for.
I have such fond memories of hero decks. They were the first deck I took to a tournament when I was 10 (I got blasted) but I had so much fun. They will always be my fav archetype
Aster Phoenix lost his father and went on a warpath to find the one responsible. And sadly, he was misguided for a while before Jaden Yuki defeated him in their 2nd duel and opened his eyes. I honestly would love to see a Yu-Gi-Oh! GX spinoff series ft Elemental, Destiny, Evil plus other archetype HEROE monsters in the spirit world/12 Dimensions. I would pay top dollar to watch it.
Jaden would still lose if he didn't have final fusion(?) activated so they won't receive damage from combined attack of the fusion monsters on the field, only He gets damaged alone.
Another ruling misplay: Due to how Diamond Dude works, _you don't have to pay the cost for spell cards activated through his effect._ He didn't need to discard Fusion Sage and Terraforming.
Man, that clock tower made me feel this was an absolutely unwinnable duel for Jaden! I don't remember right now, but I don't think Aster used the same deck against Zane. Did he?
@@pokeguru23 Japanese version does have a line between Sartorious and Aster that Aster was going to use “That deck” against Jaden Apparently implying in universe this was the first duel he revealed his Destiny Heroes in
In summary: the most powerful ability all players have is no-one reads the cards properly OR asks their opponents what their monster effects are. It is why I loved in the past using a Caius Bomb to win. Also, I feel the duel is somewhat self-defeating in the message it delivers about the elemental heroes. By all accounts, Aster has less respect for them than Jaden technically as by this time Aster has already discarded them due to him having all the D-Heroes in his deck and clearly going for them instead. Likely his last tournament outing was the last showing of the deck and possibly had to stick with it until tournament conclusion (or plot device to make it dramatic). Ultimately Jaden makes use of the heroes far more respectful which is where I enjoy how he eventually returns to the heroes. By all accounts, this is the first duel I think we can say was Jaden's path on "losing something important" as Aster had never dueled for fun which Jaden had always done and was happy; something Aster hated because why should someone like him be happy. Also...dear god was anime diamond dude horrible, still having to pay costs...what's the point then of what is just a bad draw effect. At least Doom Lord put in work. As a last thing, I notice that Aster's deck was extremely well tuned to react to attacks and high power monsters. Even his variant fusion for Burstinatrix and Avian show this, a lot of leaning into anti-battle tech and going more for removal and immunity to battle effects, to the expense of raw power. May say something about the in-worlds meta at the time as we often see a lot of "top class" duelists often using high power bully cards with few who go for more esoteric options and even when characters become "stronger" often that is reflected in having bigger attack power monsters. Just something I noticed. Aster winning tournaments by using a rogue deck like a boss! (despite being an edgy cry-baby imo).
It's more than in the anime it's not a rule at all you can read your opponent card Surprises are entirely fair game unlike irl I can see the message being true in both ways:judai think of fun only 95% of the time at this point.He does get serious when his friends are at stakes but even against the shadow riders he mostly enjoyed fighting them without real hatred S2 really starts to increase the number of time where he has to duel with the mindset of a "fight"(He always dueled to win, but ultimately He is fun loving) But it's true aster is mostly driven by his wish for revenge so while he is not totally wrong, he is also blind
@@namoma4922 In the dub the effect text is removed. Which explains why no one reads the cards, but also raises the question of how anyone plays without a duel disk/dueling arena/magic since without them one could presumably just make up whatever effects one wants. Edit: The fact they have duel disks and such to enforce the rules might actually be why they're not allowed to read each others cards. During mundane duels (e.g. Joey vs Yugi at the start of season 1) they probably do read each others cards.
For the De-Fusion play, it doesn't work IRL because Flame Wingman (along with a bunch of E HERO Fusions) can only be Fusion Summoned. But I love this duel in the anime and it's one of the things I'm looking forward to in my Re-Write of GX (and I have to thank Konami for inventing something in the Destiny HERO line-up able to counter Sunrise).
As a comment on the last turn with Jaden and Shining Flame Wingman, you pointed out earlier that Aster drew Terraforming and we know that he has Dark City in his deck (Destiny Hero version of Skyscraper), so he could have grabbed that and then used the 1000 ATK boost to run over SFW with Dreadmaster, unless SFW has more than 3800 ATK
I think the reason Defusion doesn't work is because Flame Wingman can only be special summoned via a fusion summon, and thus can't be brought back by Defusion.
In the anime, De-Fusion has worked with Flame Wingman before. In the duel against Kagemaru, De-Fusion was used to separate Flare Wingman into its Fusion Materials.
After this episodes I’ve always felt that there were minimum 4 fusion options per a fusion. The Flame Wingman, Phoenix Enforcer, & eventually Inferno Wing (being the corrupted evil version of one) being the evidence of this. So for this fusions would be based on which material monster is the dominant trait + attribute to be dominant. Flame Wingman is dominant Avian + wind attribute, while Phoenix Enforcer would be Avian + fire attribute. This then would allow for 2 more with Burstinatrix + wind, & Burstinatrix + fire. This could further apply to most 2 named material Elemental HERO fusion monsters. While the Shinning variants are being powered by the additional light attribute of Sparkman calling on other HEROs support, and would blanket onto all those lines being extended like it does for the 2 known ones.
![Was Jesse About To Defeat Jaden? [Jewel of a Duel]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/gQUm-0k6Dko/mqdefault.jpg)
![Was Jesse About To Defeat Jaden? [Jewel of a Duel]](/img/tr.png)
![Was Joey About To Defeat Kaiba? [Battle for the Bronze]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/9byeaCLOdzg/mqdefault.jpg)
16:00 The reason it didn't work is because in the actual game, Flame Wingman can't be special summoned any way except fusion summoning. That's the difference between the anime and the real life game. Anime, Flame Wingman can be special summoned other ways, Actual game, it cannot.
Thanks, at first I thought it was because the materials weren't in the grave at the time of De-Fusions activation. Didn't realise it was actually something as simple as a summoning restriction. Thanks for the clarification 😁
@@TGSAnime No problem. I always thought it was weird they gave Flame Wingman a summoning restriction in the real life game.
Actually most if not all of Jaden's anime fusions have that restriction
Now that I think about it all of his Fusion monsters got they on restrictions if I'm not mistaken
Plus since it was banished from the grave and since it was it wasn't considered to be properly summoned
These "Was X About To Defeat Y?" videos will never get dull for me. I could listen/watch them all day. Always so enjoyable.
Same
Agree, because there is research
Fact
I love possibilities a lot, so this serie is golden to me
I listen to the Jaiden Vs. Yugi one in long car trips because to me it's just that good
The main reason Aster/Edo commits so many "misplays" is exactly because he's styling on Jaden/Judai.
In the manga, it's explained the difference between a Pro Player and a simple duelist, any other duelist would look to achieve victory as quick as possible, but a Pro has a public to entertain.
You need to keep the duel interesting and dramatic. Keeping your opponent on the edge? Not revealing your main strategy until the end? That's the way Edo duels in situations like this, same happened against Zane/Kaiser.
But no one was watching except a couple of people
It’s even more badass he says anyone can win but you must be really good to entertain a crowd
That does make sense
It cannot be helped but a lot of duels aren't that dramatic, so making some spectacle on your own is better for viewer if you can afford it
@@Deathmare235 Jaden's friends were watching and in my opinion Aster wanted to demoralize them by misplaying on purpose and winning anyway. Based on their reactions at the end of the duel Aster succeeded.
@@RenaldyCalixte ok
I remember this duel being mind blowing as a kid. Not only were they using the same cards, but I never considered the same cards could fuse to a different monster. It’s simple but it made this duel feel different from any gx duel to this point.
Not only that, but the fact that Jaden lost made the rematch super hyped later in the season when Jaden now had the neo-spacians.
This particular duel is mixed for me. On the one hand, it is awesome seeing 2 HERO decks go head-to-head. On the other hand, I do not think the duel was very fair because Aster said the Destiny HERO's were made by Industrial Illusions, but were never released to the public. Even if Jaden could study Aster's deck, he would have no way of stopping him. And the way Aster talks to Jaden, criticizing him for using the HERO's because they are cool, that's the sick part.
As a kid seeing Aster walk away while Jaden sheds a tear was shocking
Funfact: Aster Phoenix is the only duelist in the entire series who beat both zane and jaden
Fun Fact Number 2: He's also the duelist that lost to Chazz.
@@DarkGamer-co1hx chazz the strongest confirmed
@@e.t.1947 He is, but in the anime was portrayed as a joke, unlike in the manga, where he's truly a Rival
@@YasashiNoKage he also beats Jaden in the manga the only one to truly humiliate Chazz was Zane in the books
@@DarkGamer-co1hx Fun Fact Number 3: Chazz lost to Alexis
5:00 Something worth noting is that the "Fusion Deck" had no size limit back then; theoretically, so long as the show made up an appropriate card, every possible combination may have existed in his Extra Deck.
It had a limit, but it was much higher, at 30, which effectively didn't matter most of the time
I'm not even sure if the fusion monster needed to exist as a physical card, since it seemed like players made up new fusions whenever they felt like (e.g. Red Eyes Skull Dragon or Dragon Master Knight)
MY understanding in the anime that could merge any monster but the resulting monster may be random
@@solidzack that was largely the original anime, especially duelist kingdom. I think as time went on we saw a lot less of that. Though occasionally it still cropped up. Like with the Neos fusions, which seemed like a bit of a pull from nowhere
@@solidzack True, tho by GX, when it came to after that first summoning, and especially when it came to cards like Miracle Fusion and Fifth Hope, clearly Fusion Monsters _are_ something separate.
I know it was certainly just a "the writers didn't think to write it this way" or "they did but wanted Aster's win to be more dramatic," but I like to think the in-universe reason for all of his misplays is to show judai/jaden that "I could play poorly and STILL beat you" or some similar sentiment
Actually, Jaden likely has more than that in his extra deck. The extra deck used to have no limit, that was added when synchros were added. Though I think the video games did have a limit
Video games had a limit of 30 prior to the time before 5ds games were made.
@@MrThefoo42 Eternal Duelist Soul had a limit of 15.
Also in general the anime doesn't have any limits on extra deck size, Yuma has all the Number Monsters he has in his extra deck. In one of the duels with Dark Mist, Dark Mist is able to summon HearteartH Dragon and Heraldry Crest, which Yuma has next to no reason to keep in his extra deck unless he just has all of them. Also the Utopia versions don't share a card, since Yuma and Astral fairly regularly detach base Utopia and summon it again when the upgraded version is still on the field.
@@TheWizardMus One could be forgiven for not realising Yuma is able to play all the Numbers he's acquired when he has several occasions where he has the 3 Level 4's to play Number 16 and would greatly benefit from it but pulls out good ol' 39 instead. You'd think Astral would at least suggest it.
@@snowboundwhale6860 I forgot Shock Master was a Number Monster.
I assumed Aster was holding back his D-heroes from his own personal sense of drama. In a sense he was being cocky but i think he wanted to make his point about heroism.
I think both you and the animators/guionists have forgotten about "Bubbleman", at the final turn, before "Dreadmaster" attacks, "Bubbleman" should be special summoned, since 2 turns had happened since the activation of "Doom Lord"'s effect, ON THE SAME battle position he had when he was banished. So even if Judai/Jaden had summon "Shining Flare Wingman" and change "Necroid Shaman" to defense, he would have a "Bubbleman" in attack position on Aster's turn to be attacked by "Deadmaster", so he would have lost anyway.
That is a very good point, and something that I definitely forgot about.
Yeah regardless, it was a HARD GG for Jaden.
Great catch Sebastián!
Except bubble man wouldn't have been special summoned that way he would have just returned to the field
Bubbleman could’ve also just returned to the graveyard via “Burial from a Different Dimension” as Bubbleman was presently removed from play due to DH Doom Lord. It simply made not have been made public as Jaden only made it known that Sparkman and Flame Wingman returned to the graveyard, he could’ve used his third choice as Bubbleman knowing it would’ve returned in attack position with 800 attack - thus it would’ve negated Doom Lord’s return effect.
So Anime Burial returns All banished cards to the GY, so Bubble wouldve been returned to the GY and thus could not return to the field in attack.
@@SuperSayianWarrior It’s actually that way in the TCG, not just Anime. It’s text is “Target up to 3 Banished monsters; return them to the graveyard” so Jaden could’ve added Bubbleman with the other two, so yes that’s what would’ve happened.
Fun fact: this is the last duel Jaden loses in the entire series.
Wow...that's interesting.
@yymenghis64 I wish we would have gotten to see that ending lol. Jaden is my favorite protag and I'd love to see just how he could fair against Atem at his best.
@yymenghis64 Jaden never lost as Supreme King. It was a tie between him and Axel.
@@kelseywilliams8026 I think he lost in an imagination duel when axel asks him if he thinks Jayden lost here
Wait, Jaden beat the Mad King of Dark World? Thought it was otherwise.
I know in the dub, when Aster is first introduced on a televised duel he fuses to make Phoenix Enforcer and everyone is confused but Chazz explains that Elemental Heroes have multiple fusions as Flame Wingman and Phoenix Enforcer can be made with the same fusion material. It's the same with Shining Phoenix Enforcer. Stupidly in the show Jaden doesn't know either of those things.
Bastion explained the different heroes. Chazz basically was a dick
@@arbetor12 Chazz in a nutshells
It is weird how the HERO archetype is his favorite one, but he doesn't know such basic info about it as what all fusions exist. He could disregard Phoenix Enforcer as the coward's play, or just pump up Flame Wingman as the more "heroic" of the two, per his opinion, but he should still know it exists.
@@brianforsyth2225tbf, Jaden just liked flame Wingman more since that's probably the one he has. He just likes them and plays his favorites. He doesn't really care too much.
@@scarlightemperor3410 but how does that explain him not knowing phoenix enforcer exists at all. The clear implication is he didn't know about it before then.
I honestly don't think Jaden could have beaten Aster in this duel. Also, Aster's moves in this duel involving the destiny heroes are specifically designed to focus on the fact that Aster believes in destiny, that everything is predetermined. The Japanese version of this duel heavily emphasizes this, as does the English version.
I think Jaden could have beaten Astee when he attacked his shining phoenix enforcer because without the equip spell shining flare wingman would have dealt the enforcers original ATK as effect damage and end the duel right nmthere and then
@@doombringer7843
Shining Phoenix Enforcer cannot be destroyed by battle.
Flare Wingman can’t deal the burn damage.
@@mystery8820 godamn you're right didnt know about that fact until you said it and i read the card
My favourite line of Aster's is (at least in the dub) "The clock tower. You know, the one that I've been talking about for 20 minutes?"
@@failure4452
Dub dialogue in GX is now just a gag dub complete with 4th-wall phasing (not breaking).
Also, 20 minutes? Sounds like an episode runtime minus commercials.
I love these videos, the duels are so nostalgic.
Yea they are
This duel introduced my favorite archetype, The D • HEROs or Destiny HEROs.
I know this will not happen, but I really want a Destiny Hero of Shining Phoenixguy.
@@redwardranger7034 DESTINY HERO-RADIANT PHOENIX ENFORCER
@@whocaresssssss2974 I'd go with something that's the opposite of Shining, but yours are also cool. Hey, how about we draw one?
@@redwardranger7034 Destroy Phoenix Enforcer ain’t half bad tho. Can we agree
@@yurinoworry That guy isn't bad. He isn't good. He is a great card
Aster and Zane are probably the first characters to defeat an antagonist without manipulating them or do something bad if the protagonist win. They did it all with their skills alone, and Aster is a special one because any move Jaden made was immediately countered
Kaibaman won fair and square if I remember correctly
@@Azamingg ruclips.net/video/mD75dgZmsUE/видео.html
@@Azamingg I know I'm replying to a 3 month old comment, but you're right Kaibaman did win fair and square. He de-fused BEUD to dodge the targeting Edge Hammer trap and then attacked with all 3 BEWDs for game. The difference though is that Jaden almost won that duel, Kaibaman was just one step ahead. Aster though? He toyed with Jaden and still won.
@@brocautry5063 yes but seaosn 4 jade wood kick kaibaman ass as kabia can beat the beast cards and jaden beat them 2 times kaiba wood so lsoe to yubel and jaden beat her
Antagonist?
Don't you mean the protagonist?
Sadly Elemental Hero Flame wingman can only be Fusion summon in TCG. 😕
How about an episode of "was weblee about to defeat atem over the train?"
🤣 that would be a funny one. Just a hard No. As soon as Weevil ripped that card it was over.
@@TGSAnime gokibore (or whatever the insect was) gains a hidden effect! If this card is destroyed outside of a duel, the owner of the card loses 4000 blood cells!
I looked at that one myself.
-Weevil played Infestation which weakened every monster on the field while dealing damage to both of them and bringing Atem down to 500 life points. As soon as Atem's turn ended, Poison Butterfly would deal enough damage to finish him off.
-Since Breaker lost a hundred attack points that let Atem use Berserker Soul to keep attacking until Weevil died. If Weevil hadn't used Infestion then Atem wouldn't have been able to use to Berserker Soul and beat him that turn.
-Atem would have only had two hundred life points left so if Weevil drew a monster with 1700 attack points or more he could have destroyed Breaker and won the duel. But if he didn't then Atem would have been able to wipe him out next turn since Atem would have drawn Queen's Knight. Even if Weevil just summoned a monster in defense mode, Poison Butterfly could have just destroyed it and let his two monsters hit Weevil directly.
Weevil had the upper hand for most of the duel but Atem seemed to have him on the ropes by that last turn. He shouldn't have taunted Atem. He had the choice of losing normally, or losing from excessive force. He should just be thankful it wasn't manga Atem or he would have gotten his throat slit. Or manga Joey, he probably would have just beat up Weevil.
@@dragonstormx True, but what could have stopped weevil from activating infestation on atems next turn? Wouldn’t he have won?
@@AJ_Steele Actually he could have now that you bring it up.
But it fits Weevil's character to make a move like that since he's always overconfident.
As someone who doesn't really delve much into the actual card game, these videos are still quite fun. Thank you for taking the time to analyze all these episodes.
Gotta love how often Aster was just toying with Jaden and most of his foes in Gx and Arc-v, only in 1 duel did he ever try from the start and that was against The D or DD because he was the one who killed his father other than that he only every tried late in any of his duels.
These duel breakdown videos are absolutely amazing.
I researched this episode recently and it made me want to rewatch this video
What really bugs me about that duel is that Jaiden kept asking what the Clock towers effect was but Aster didn't answer until after he had four counters on it
the rules are different in the anime, public knowledge isn't a thing.
That duel was actually good it showed how good Aster really was n the anime n the skill level of duelist he was n wit him beating Jaden the best duelist n the academy after Zane left was just insane
Yet zane doesnt consider his duel with aster as good as jaden or Jesse. And I'm not dissing aster he is definitely my favorite character from this show
Without even waiting to the end, I can say confidently that anime-wise? No.
But if Legacy of the Duelist is anything to go by, Aster's deck wouldn't last a fucking minute against Jaden's, oh my GOD that was a horrific match.
tbf LofD has to put all the cards into a deck that actually gets shuffled, Aster switching from E-HEROs to D-HEROs with only the early/ og support mid duel was bound to be a disaster
Keep in mind, not all the cards in Legacy of the duelist were out at the time of this duel.
They literally gave Jaden Sakuretsu armor in that Duel despite him not having ever used that.
@@ContraryASMR I hate they do that I lose so many times because they have a trap card they never used like mirror force 🗿
@@godlyblackflamegodly7754 Jaden did use mirror force but in the later parts of each series in that game it becomes clear they stopped trying when making the story mode decks
Ok. What about the D/D/D archetype. The lore would be so cool, each one deriving its name from an ancient king or the end of the world.
Maybe do a 5ds one?
Obviously suggesting Jaden vs Yubel
Ones with screwy finishes are always more fun
Agreed! Maybe comment on whether Yusei could have defeated Kalin/Kiryu during their first duel?
I think he should’ve cover Team 5DS vs Team Unicorn because Jean had him in the ropes all he had to do was end his turn!!
@@13Jordanator
Jean threw out the win on a technicality. Both teams played with the best of their abilities.
Jean wanted a proper win more than the technicality.
I just wanted to see if Jaden could win. To think if Jaden won, he might’ve not met the Neo Spacians.
Also Jaden should’ve summoned Darkbright instead of Tempest. Since Aster didn’t set D Time until the next turn when he summoned Shining Phoenix Enforcer, Jaden should’ve crashed Darkbright into Enforcer meaning all Aster could is summon and attack with Sparkman and then set D Time. Yes, Jaden would take damage but next turn, Jaden would win with Shining Flare Wingman. Also, Jaden would’ve had to attack as Aster must know Darkbright’s effect so I doubt he would attacked with Shining Phoenix Enforcer during his turn.
Another way for Jaden to win, would’ve been to set Light Laser during the Tempest Turn. This means he could use it to save Tempest meaning next turn, he could use it to attack directly after Shining Flare Wingman to win.
Nah, it was Jadens destiny to meet them. Think its mentioned that Jaden made those cards and pegasus sent them to space or something.
@@2mellow35 I’ve also wondered what if jaden just attacked any monster with flame wingman during his final turn instead of playing fusion gate - I know that aster can’t take battle damage but he would’ve still taken effect damage due to flame wingman’s effect
@@SpecsTube Old comment I know, but attacking with flame wingman wouldn't have changed anything. Dreadmaster prevents destruction and negates battle damage, so since flame wingman couldn't destroy any of the mosters his effect would never activate.
@@brocautry5063 ah I see, I thought dreadmadter effect just meant effects but if it negates destruction then good point
@@brocautry5063
I think he meant if Jaden didn't play Fusion Gate and just attacked with Wingman, he'd beat Aster with Wingman's burn effect. Sure Clock Tower negates battle damage but not effect damage.
Biggest misplay was playing Fusion Gate and popping Prison and summoning Dreadmaster. And like you mentioned, Dreadmaster prevents monsters from getting destroyed that turn and all damages.
I JUST watched this last night and was wondering if he would do a video on it. This man's timing is perfect
Whenever I see these videos, I always think how fun it would be to play a duel where you don’t know the opponents cards effects, until they’re used
These Yugioh Duel retrospectives really do make me realize how much the game of Yugioh has change over the years. Like I can’t even remember there only being one Field Spells on the field. Everyone drawing on their first turn? What?!
Also, the dub really does be shooting itself in the foot with these edits!
Honestly? I like to attribute a lot of Aster's misplays to him being that overwhelming against Jaden. His whole motif of Destiny and the duel going completely according to his plan fit this idea, plus a longer duel (aside from being better television) helps the end result of the duel (in which Jaden's confidence is utterly shattered) be that much more impactful. The idea that Aster was one step ahead at almost every turn AND wasn't even playing the best he could helps drive home the idea of how powerful he is and explain how effortlessly he beat Zane without even using the Destiny Heroes
I'd put Aster's lack of playing and D cards in his first turn as him potentially still having a sliver of hope for justice and wants to prove E-heroes can do
I mean Aster was mostly playing with Jaden this whole dual so it makes sense that he miss play the lot
More duel analysis videos! These are by far the favorite for me at least. It’s fun to hear about the misplays and how different turns can be better. Really makes you think how the actual plot and stuff could be different if certain duels were won or lost.
I would love to see "Revolver vs Lightening." That breakdown would be one of the best
How about Yusei vs Kalin R1? Was Kalin about to beat Yusei before his D Wheel was damaged? Did Kalin really have the upper hand? Who might have misplayed?
@@DTran-je1sn yes. Yusei was abkut to lose as he if I remember correctly didnt have Scrap Iron, or if he did it was alreadynused and reset, thus EBI Ccacc aapu wouldve game him with 3k direct damage.
@@SuperSayianWarrior I am well aware of that, but my point was to see if he misplayed anyhow during the Duel. I mean an analysis like the guy of this channel does. I know Yusei would have lost, but was Kalin really a step ahead?
The Rematch between Rafael and Atem would also be a great one to cover as if he hadn't essentially given up he still had a chance to win.
15:58 I think that what happens is that, in the specific example you're putting, since the materials are moved to the GY they are considered to be new cards, and as such they're not considered to have been used as fusion materials for Shining Flare Wingman.
In the anime we also have the fact that Shining Flare Wingman was banished until the 2nd standby phase, which would make it so it "forgets" that it was summoned using those two specific monsters.
I'd think this is more of an anime effect vs TCG effect over an illegal play, the anime de-fusion is probably summon cards that are legal materials for the fusion monster, in this case the specific materials, or it might be that it didn't work that way in the anime since some rules are different than the TCG
EDIT: As someone said, another reason to add to all these is that TCG Flare Wingman can only be fusion summoned, meaning that you cannot summon it from the GY with de-fusion, and I'd think de-fusion requires you to summon all the fusion materials, meaning you can't summon anything.
TL,DR: It only works in the anime cuz they slightly changed the card(s) in the TCG (mainly Flare Wingman, we don't know about anime De-Fusion as far as I'm aware)
Would certainly make sense, as iirc the tcg de-fusion will only allow the owner of the monster and the de-fusion to resummon the materials, while the anime will always return the used material regardless of the owners. So the technicalities aren't entirely one to one.
The reason is flame wingman can't be special summoned in the tcg, only fusion summoned
@@a.a.6203 Not quite. Shining Flame Wingman can be special summoned from the Graveyard using Monster Reborn (or similar) but like all fusion summons, this can only be done IF Flame Wingman was first special summoned by Polymerisation correctly. De-fusion would also still work on Shining Flame Wingman were he destroyed.
The 'can only be fusion summoned and not special summoned' stipulation was added to most fusion monsters in the GX era until it became a blanket rule in the TCG that you MUST fusion summon correctly beforehand. Now only exceptions to the rule (such as summoned by the effects of Mask Change etc) are added in a fusion monster's description. This was to stop you pulling any shenanigans like discarding from the extra deck using card effect's like Cyber-Stein and then special summoning from the Graveyard for free, no polymerisation required.
The problem is that Shining Flare Wingman was banished. In the anime it appears that if a fusion monster is banished then so are the fusion materials (which means Jaden's play is legal within the anime). In the TCG, ONLY the fusion monster is banished (with its materials remaining in the graveyard). When this happens, Shining Flare Wingman becomes a new instance of the card and no longer recognizes the fusion monsters originally used to summon it.
@@Blackjax137 You’re forgetting that we’re talking about his example video, where Shining never even left the field, it was summoned, then immediately defusioned. It didn’t work because Flame Wingman has to be fusion summoned.
@@Blackjax137 Jaden fusioned SFM with Miracle Fusion though which banishes the materials from field and/or GY
I am always excited to see these pop up in my subscription window. Glad this one had a good amount of meat to really cut into.
Absolutely love this guy's reviews of old school duels, great stuff
And this is why when you're dueling you ask "ok what does it do?" Every new card you see
Just love this series of videos. I remember watching this duel, I was so shocked with the combo of D-Hero Captain Tenacious effect of re-summoning the destroyed D-Heros destroyed that turn + cant be destroyed by battle + u can only attack him... I thought this combo was invincible HAHAHHA good times.
I would love to see a video about Joey vs Zigfried Duel.
When I saw the poll for "Jaden vs Aster (first duel)" I kinda assumed you meant the one where Aster used random cards and still nearly won.
I am really glad you started using the Japanese scenes instead of the dub ones, and just mentioned the discrepancies for the sake of quality
People have already commented on how De-Fusion would function in the TCG and Flame Wingman's TCG Fusion restriction. There is another move in this duel that would've played out differently in the TCG though. When Aster activates Magical Stone Excavation at 15:00, he wouldn't need to discard Fusion Sage and Terraforming. This is because Spell cards revealed by Destiny Hero - Diamond Dude's effect aren't activated on the field. So you don't need to pay the costs for them.
The Wingman and Sparkman that are added back to the graveyard with Burial From the Different Dimension are not the "same" Wingman and Sparkman that were used as materials for the fusion summon. When a card changes zone it becomes a new instance of the card.
It's the same logic that if a monster resurrected with Call of the Haunted is banished with Interdimensional Matter Transporter, it will no longer be tied to Call of the Haunted when it returns to play.
This is the correct answer
yup, the materials left the graveyard, so they forgot they were materials, shining wingman left the field, so he forgot, what materials he used, and flame wingman cant be special summoned, except by fusion summon. like every singe thing that could interfere with defusion actually interfered.
I was literally thinking the same thing. Good thing someone could help me know I was correct
Wow that was very informative. Thank you.
I was gonna say that Flame Wingman cannot be special summoned except by fusion summon but that is an excellent point
There was a really missed opportunity to make “alternate” fusions of the Jaden’s like Flame Wingman and Phoenix Enforcer.
i know right
I have some ideas for them :
_Elemental HERO Static Titan
_Elemental HERO Fortress Striker
_Elemental HERO Dr. Vapor
_Elemental HERO Savage Swordsman
_Elemental HERO MuddyBlues
_Elemental HERO Clear Black
_Elemental HERO Cyclone
_Elemental HERO AirDiver
@@chrispambo1539 What would the effects of each one be?
@@bobmaloney9850 is muddy blues a JoJo reference lmao
Yup, Aster never uses the E-Heroes ever again, it’s all D-Heroes after this
Maybe the reason Aster didn't set D-Signal and D-Mind in the first turn is because Aster still believes in the Elemental HEROs and doesn't want to abandon them right now.
this was also the beginning that Jaden uses Neo-Spacians monsters and E-HERO Neos became his new Ace monster
15:55
In the real card game, while Shining FW was still Fusion Summoned, it forgot it's materials, and the materials were moved, so they're no longer the same cards.
The reason is flame wingman can't be ss in the tcg, only fusion summoned
@@a.a.6203 That too.
I honestly wouldn’t mind an alternative universe where Aster is the protagonist. His story and the history/ legacy of the Destiny Heroes are so cool.
This is what I always say exactly! I like GX and Jaden with what he went through, but I have always related more to Edo/Aster overall as a character and felt like I could understand why he did and reacted to things and such. I wish they would make an AU GX anime for him as protagonist with modernized decks for their archetypes so we would have more of the heroes and he could have two decks: a dark hero one with destiny/vision and the dark masked heroes and an elemental one he only uses earlier.
@@raina1848 not counting it but you can say Arc-V is where Edo's the main protag......kinda lol
I would like to see if "Was Yusei about to beat dark signer Kessler?" They're first encounter Yusei survives because of an interruption. But I was wondering if there was a way Yusei could have won that duel.
Thank God, someone has the same suggestion as mine! Was Kalin about to beat Yusei? Who misplayed?
They did Aster dirty in arc v
Take a closer look at 7:22. Aster added a Doom Lord and a (Normal Monster that Ishizu played against Kaiba during the Battle City Finals on the blimp.
Great video idea! Here's one for ya. Was Alexis Rhodes About To Defeat Jaden? (Episode 94) Because I mean if she had used one of her facedown cards, Flare Neos would've lost attack strength and enabled Alexis to survive the turn, and due to its adverse effect, Jaden would lose Flare Neos, leaving him wide open! You have a gift my friend!
The 'can only be fusion summoned and not special summoned' stipulation was added to most fusion monsters in the GX era until it became a blanket rule in the TCG that you MUST fusion summon correctly beforehand. Now only exceptions to the rule (such as summoned by the effects of Mask Change etc) are added in a fusion monster's description. This was to stop you pulling any shenanigans like discarding from the extra deck using card effect's like Cyber-Stein and then special summoning from the Graveyard for free, no polymerisation required.
This rule would stop you using interactions like Cyber-Stein, Monster Reborn (or Metamorphosis) and attack with Blue-Eyes Ultimate then use De-Fusion for three Blue-Eyes attacking for a collective 13,500 damage. In that era with only 4000 lifepoints, that'd make for a consistent one turn kill. You'll also find that Ritual Monsters are governed by a similar rule. Until these card stipulations and later blanket rule was added, that interaction would've been perfectly legal (it's also why most of those cards are banned or limited).
The problem is that Shining Flare Wingman was banished. In the anime it appears that if a fusion monster is banished then so are the fusion materials (which means Jaden's play is legal within the anime). In the TCG, ONLY the fusion monster is banished (with its materials remaining in the graveyard). When this happens, Shining Flare Wingman becomes a new instance of the card and no longer recognizes the fusion monsters originally used to summon it. It loses its 'summoned correctly' status.
So if Shining Flame Wingman was destroyed in battle or by card effect, you could special summon it from the graveyard using Monster Reborn (or similar) in the TCG ONLY if it was summoned correctly. Despite its oddly worded stipulation in the card text. You'd also be able to use De-fusion providing you have any monsters in the grave that COULD be used as fusion materials (even if they weren't the ones originally used).
To be honest it's hard to bypass dreadmaster... Hell I remember winning locals with that card's effect alone. You have to banish him though.
Maybe an interesting sequal would be Jaden not using the effect of fusion gate and switching all to defense mode and summoning sparkman to defense mode. Then on Asters turn, Aster draws d-counter and attacks flame wingman with dreadmaster and sparkman with diamond dude, then banishes necroid shaman with doom lords effect then sets d-counter and ends the turn. Now Jaden draws Winged Kuriboh and automaticly summons it in defense mode. Asters turn. Now Aster draws his second boss monster, Destiny HERO Dogma. He automaticly summons it in attack mode by tributing diamind dude, captain tenacious and doom lord, then he destroys both, clayman and kuriboh. Jadens turn, he draws monster reborn and revives winged kuriboh and takes 75 damage from dogma's ability. Asters turn and he draws destiny hero dasher. Now he attacks both, necroid shaman who came back, and winged kuriboh and ends his turn. Jaden draws mirror force, he sets it and ends the turn. Aster draws d-cube and attacks for game, then jaden defends with mirror force. Now Aster in main 2 summons d-cube in defense mode. Jaden draws bladedge and summons it cuz of necroshades effect and attacks for game but aster uses d-counter. Jaden ends his turn. Asters turn and he draws d-fortune, then he tributes his d-cube and summons Dasher and attacks for game which gives him the victory. I think Jaden needed to lose 'cuz of his new deck and I no mather what, he just got new cards to add to the deck, he didn't lose the deck actually. And why did Jaden have yellow gadget, I don't get it.
One thing about Jaden's extra deck. I don't think he had plasma vice at the time as when he fought proffesor Viper and brought Plasma Vice everyone was surprised and Hassleberry even said that it must be a newly aquired monster. I could be wrong however but I liked to point that out.
Yeah they said it was a new hero in the Japanese version too. Though looking at that duel, it seemed they just had Jaden “Shill” new cards for the sake of advertising them to be released in the TCG
I love how the two people claiming to be Jaiden’s best friend cared more about his cards
Imagine the chain of events that could have happened if he had summoned darkbright and crashed
Aster would have to bring out sparkman, but Jaden could bring out shining flare wingman, but now he’s actually done over 4000 lp worth of damage
The reason Flame Wingman was Special Summoned back with De-Fusion is because the effect in the anime is exactly like it is in the TCG but it ignores the Summoning conditions for any Fusion Material monsters Special Summoned from the GY.
Given how big the fusion deck was back then... Aster would have been crazy not to at least have 1 of each of the other e hero fusions in there just to have a it of a toolbox
The way clock tower prison was described in the dub made me think it had an instant win condition that actives when enough time has passed.
I always remembered that Jayden never technically ended his turn in the dub right before he lost, but I could be wrong.
Thanks for those videos i can work and listening to this without needing to check my phone to underdstand everything. It makes my work time even better.
That was amazing analysis... best Yu-Gi-Oh content ever!
5:57 I don't know when VWXYZ Dragon Catapult Cannon became a Hero but now I want it now lol
I’ll admit in GX I actually liked aster. He felt like a characterization of myself in a way. Prideful, likes to be flashy, and someone close to him murdered for no reason. Knowing that I think I can answer why aster misplayed so much. He’s a pro, he’s flashy, he wants the suspense and drama not just a quick overpowering win. Least that’s how I can figure it. That’s how I’d do it if I was essentially a performer.
It wasn’t so much that aster gave up on justice it’s that he gave up on those who are supposed to deliver it. Why should he believe in those who are supposed to uphold justice when they couldn’t give him justice. His family was murdered and nobody did a damn thing. Why should he believe in anyone anymore?
@@supervegito8340 Which family member(s) were murdered? Sorry if it's a bit sensitive.
@@MountainMemelord my best friend. He was better than family. Our families are abusive. We were like brothers
These "Was X about to Defeat Y" series is easily the best yugituber content out there. Always looking forward to the next one.
I like to think that all of asters vanilla E-HERO fusions are similar to Jaden's only they all carry the name Inforcer.
Plot twist he also had destroy phoenix enforcer
One of my favourite duel in GX and it make aster one of my favourite yugioh rivals
Having seto,Aster,Zane&kite
Storywise Jaden was literally doomed to lose this one, because Asters Deck was infused with light of destruction by Satorius so Aster would be guaranteed to win.
I also think Aster just used the orignal 5 original E-Heros and the 2 Enforcers, since he only used those to provoke (vs. Zane) and trick Jaden (in their duel). Those cards also feel like they are common cards, kinda refering to Jadens and Asters first duel, when Aster just used a few standard boosters to make a deck.
Again a really good video by the way, keep it up. :)
"I use heroes because they are cool.
Also heroes save people from the utmost danger, and I want to do that because i feel like someone may get hurt by being around me. For some reason"
18:32 "Dread SMASH!"
Rewatching this after having binged most of the playlist again, it's weird how so often the technicality of a play just breaks down to an aggression tactic vs a cautious tactic when it's not just a flat misplay.
At 17:00 another big misplay from Jaden, assuming in the anime he can special summon Flame Wingman with De-Fusion, is that he really could have just attacked Diamond Dude and won the game without the need to play Fusion Gate at all since Clock Tower only negates battle damage and not the effect damage that Wingman's super power does. I suggest Diamond dude cuz the effect damage would've been enough to do lethal even if Aster had a trap card that halved the damage. Though if I'm missing something from Clock Tower's anime effect, then that makes this point null.
Clock Tower only blocks battle damage, not burn damage. So yes, big misplay on Judai’s part.
Still praying we get the run back duel analysis one day! 😊🙏
The Japanese version of this duel is amazing
This duel, specifically the clocktower segment, lives rent free in my head.
Man, I didn't know there was a Batman wannabe in YuGiOh! , makes me wanna go back and watch/read the series.
Great analysis as always, I'm curious as to what's the meta in the universe of YuGiOh and why do characters use such variety of decks?
This is the best series in this channel. Even when I'm running low on internet I'll watch
Was Joey about to defeat Mai in the waking the dragons arc?
I love how both characters start with Elemental HEROs but go seperate ways as they grow up
Aster starts with the elemental HEROs but changes over to the Destiny HEROs
Jaden starts with the elemental HEROs but changes over to the Neo-Spacians
They both still USE the Elemental HEROs, but they take considerable shifts in what those HEROs are used for.
That reminds me of the series "what makes a duel" from noajenk, both are really nice
Sucks that noajenk doesn't do those anymore, and he is still stumped over why Submersible Carrier Aero Shark's anime effect is different from TCG.
@@mystery8820 I can't even find those vids anymore, it's so sad
@@itsjustme-_-9621
Because of copyright strikes.
I have such fond memories of hero decks. They were the first deck I took to a tournament when I was 10 (I got blasted) but I had so much fun. They will always be my fav archetype
Aster Phoenix lost his father and went on a warpath to find the one responsible. And sadly, he was misguided for a while before Jaden Yuki defeated him in their 2nd duel and opened his eyes.
I honestly would love to see a Yu-Gi-Oh! GX spinoff series ft Elemental, Destiny, Evil plus other archetype HEROE monsters in the spirit world/12 Dimensions. I would pay top dollar to watch it.
More importantly, do you think Chazz, Cyrus and Alexis rehearsed that "HE LOST? HIS CARDS!" choreography? It looked super smooth, like no delay at all
I would love to see Zane vs Jaden the graduation match to see whether it could have gone a different way
Jaden would still lose if he didn't have final fusion(?) activated so they won't receive damage from combined attack of the fusion monsters on the field, only He gets damaged alone.
I love these duel analysis videos! So fun to watch and think about. Great job with these man!
Welp, what about the second time Jaiden duelled Aster, Who would of Won then?
This is their second time they duelled 3 times
Another ruling misplay: Due to how Diamond Dude works, _you don't have to pay the cost for spell cards activated through his effect._
He didn't need to discard Fusion Sage and Terraforming.
Man, that clock tower made me feel this was an absolutely unwinnable duel for Jaden!
I don't remember right now, but I don't think Aster used the same deck against Zane. Did he?
He used Phoneix Enforcer to beat Zane. Whether he had the destiny heros in his deck at the time we don't know.
@@pokeguru23
Japanese version does have a line between Sartorious and Aster that Aster was going to use “That deck” against Jaden
Apparently implying in universe this was the first duel he revealed his Destiny Heroes in
In summary: the most powerful ability all players have is no-one reads the cards properly OR asks their opponents what their monster effects are. It is why I loved in the past using a Caius Bomb to win.
Also, I feel the duel is somewhat self-defeating in the message it delivers about the elemental heroes. By all accounts, Aster has less respect for them than Jaden technically as by this time Aster has already discarded them due to him having all the D-Heroes in his deck and clearly going for them instead. Likely his last tournament outing was the last showing of the deck and possibly had to stick with it until tournament conclusion (or plot device to make it dramatic). Ultimately Jaden makes use of the heroes far more respectful which is where I enjoy how he eventually returns to the heroes.
By all accounts, this is the first duel I think we can say was Jaden's path on "losing something important" as Aster had never dueled for fun which Jaden had always done and was happy; something Aster hated because why should someone like him be happy. Also...dear god was anime diamond dude horrible, still having to pay costs...what's the point then of what is just a bad draw effect. At least Doom Lord put in work.
As a last thing, I notice that Aster's deck was extremely well tuned to react to attacks and high power monsters. Even his variant fusion for Burstinatrix and Avian show this, a lot of leaning into anti-battle tech and going more for removal and immunity to battle effects, to the expense of raw power. May say something about the in-worlds meta at the time as we often see a lot of "top class" duelists often using high power bully cards with few who go for more esoteric options and even when characters become "stronger" often that is reflected in having bigger attack power monsters.
Just something I noticed. Aster winning tournaments by using a rogue deck like a boss! (despite being an edgy cry-baby imo).
It's more than in the anime it's not a rule at all you can read your opponent card
Surprises are entirely fair game unlike irl
I can see the message being true in both ways:judai think of fun only 95% of the time at this point.He does get serious when his friends are at stakes but even against the shadow riders he mostly enjoyed fighting them without real hatred
S2 really starts to increase the number of time where he has to duel with the mindset of a "fight"(He always dueled to win, but ultimately He is fun loving)
But it's true aster is mostly driven by his wish for revenge so while he is not totally wrong, he is also blind
@@namoma4922 In the dub the effect text is removed. Which explains why no one reads the cards, but also raises the question of how anyone plays without a duel disk/dueling arena/magic since without them one could presumably just make up whatever effects one wants.
Edit: The fact they have duel disks and such to enforce the rules might actually be why they're not allowed to read each others cards. During mundane duels (e.g. Joey vs Yugi at the start of season 1) they probably do read each others cards.
Bottom line Aster was the better duelist here
For the De-Fusion play, it doesn't work IRL because Flame Wingman (along with a bunch of E HERO Fusions) can only be Fusion Summoned.
But I love this duel in the anime and it's one of the things I'm looking forward to in my Re-Write of GX (and I have to thank Konami for inventing something in the Destiny HERO line-up able to counter Sunrise).
Aster Phoenix: "My Destiny HEROs are greater than the Elemental HEROs".
As a comment on the last turn with Jaden and Shining Flame Wingman, you pointed out earlier that Aster drew Terraforming and we know that he has Dark City in his deck (Destiny Hero version of Skyscraper), so he could have grabbed that and then used the 1000 ATK boost to run over SFW with Dreadmaster, unless SFW has more than 3800 ATK
I think the reason Defusion doesn't work is because Flame Wingman can only be special summoned via a fusion summon, and thus can't be brought back by Defusion.
In the anime, De-Fusion has worked with Flame Wingman before. In the duel against Kagemaru, De-Fusion was used to separate Flare Wingman into its Fusion Materials.
He was wonder why it didn't work when he tried it in a duelling simulator
After this episodes I’ve always felt that there were minimum 4 fusion options per a fusion. The Flame Wingman, Phoenix Enforcer, & eventually Inferno Wing (being the corrupted evil version of one) being the evidence of this. So for this fusions would be based on which material monster is the dominant trait + attribute to be dominant. Flame Wingman is dominant Avian + wind attribute, while Phoenix Enforcer would be Avian + fire attribute. This then would allow for 2 more with Burstinatrix + wind, & Burstinatrix + fire. This could further apply to most 2 named material Elemental HERO fusion monsters. While the Shinning variants are being powered by the additional light attribute of Sparkman calling on other HEROs support, and would blanket onto all those lines being extended like it does for the 2 known ones.