AoE2 AI Battle! Definitive Edition vs HD vs AoC
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- Опубликовано: 7 сен 2024
- Free for all battle between the three AIs available in AoE2: Definitive Edition. Besides just seeing which one wins, I also wanted to see all the new tricks and strategies the Definitive AI knows. All three AI were playing as the Cumans - one of the new civilizations!
Patreon: / spiritofthelaw
Background music from Epidemic Sound: www.epidemicsou...
Game: Age of Empires 2 - Definitive Edition. Released Nov 14, 2019 on Steam and Microsoft Store.
HD Bot: Time to boom.
DE Bot: Time to rush the HD Bot because that's how Spirit Of The Law says I can beat it.
AoE Bot: Time to play farming simulator.
AoCbot is my spirit animal.
DE: absolutely smacking HD
HD: builds mills frantically
AoC: still "growing strong"
hahaha love the Game of Thrones scenario reference
@Mark Patino "aoe2 game of thrones" - spirit of the law's video on yt
thing is, AOC AI was good for the time, as the meta of gameplay back then WAS to put all on berries, then 3 on wood. That is old pro level AOL online build order.
It has since changed from then and why I am not as good as I used to be way back in 1999-2005 because I haven't re-learnt the new game styles.
DE knew it was against HD so it attacked pre 16 minutes while completely unworried about AoC
@@moistjohn you can't be serious, right?
Fat Dragon: *forward towers
Rubenstock: *forward TCs
DE AI: *forward Lumber Camp and Mining Camp
The strats
It'd be fun to customize ai to fight against. Kinda want a Fatslob AI.
@@kylethomas9130 absolutely 11
Still waiting for *Forward Market*
Probably not gonna happen though, too OP.
i was playing on an arena map yesterday, and a bot built a lumber camp right next to my base.. with 1 villager chipping away at my wood
@ MbL levels of disrepecc
It’s nice how the DE ai is basically debugging itself by printing out what it’s thinking. Gives us a peek inside the script.
Should we be worried it is talking to itself?
I would assume they had this all along, since it is super useful for debugging, but they removed this from the finished product (since it's often a debug feature)
With all these robots taking over I think we've got to be worried!
That's rude! Don't call Spirit a robot. You both can do casting now, you don't have to fight.
Soon commentors will be replaced, as player will.
Soon robots will be commenting games played by other robots, mark my words.
Inb4 the next Killer Robot is the T90 instead of the T9000 ;)
As long as you say gg every time everything should be fine.
I would really like to see Barbarian AI put against these.
*"Forward lumber camp"*
That is certainly what I didn't expect from new AI
*AI proceed to build forward mining camp*
Wow great AI xD
The new AI does seem to be having a few issues.
I imagine they'll sort a lot of it out before release. That's what beta's are for.
It's trying to mimick human behaviors, next update will have the AI hide a villager in the corner of the map and never resign while taunting you in chat.
@@Reflexion555 i want that fucking feature XDD
That's called economic war :D
It's an absolute Chad move.
"The old AI does love berries so it's probably perfectly happy right now."
A relief to hear that :D
It's so nice imagining the old AI, sitting on top of a berry pile, happy as could be...
Till the new one arrives with Rams
TheMygoran lawl
Back in 99 my friends and I always started on berries too.
Future of gaming. Games are played by the AI, we watch them play.
why future? A german Stronghold Crusader RUclipsr already has 2 Series (in sum 186 videos) of different AIs on different Patches (we have somewhat like a userpatch for stronghold crusader) fighting it out.
Currently he is on hold with that to play some user created maps.
drew durnil xD
2 words.
Drew. Durnil. (Aka. Switzerland)
just adding in. there are tournaments for AI in Starcraft and Warcraft also
AI Age always exciting to watch.
The Number 1 Aoe2 Player Timeline
2001-2005 Halen/Grunt
2005-2012 Chris/Daut
2012-2019 Viper
2020 --> DE AI
I'm surprised Forgotten Empires didn't collaborate with Max. At a glance, Barbarian looks quite a bit better than what they've come up with here.
thing is, AOC AI was good for the time, as the meta of gameplay back then WAS to put all on berries, then 3 on wood. That is old pro level AOL online build order.
It has since changed from then and why I am not as good as I used to be way back in 1999-2005 because I haven't re-learnt the new game styles.
Viper won vs 4 extreme ai in a team by archer civ, so Viper is still much better
That forward lumber camp was a real flex
Edit: mining camp tho
When the Conq AI does better than I do and Spirit just laughs at it
"magical wood that can stay on fire forever"
don't forget about the supports of the building are made out of flint so when struck by the totally-age-appropriate steel tipped arrows they light on fire.
AI luring deer O_O oh my god, give those programmers a reward!
That is actually not hard to code since every unit is on a x and y cordinate and you have to position the scout always on a route 1 diagonal field away from the deer towards your town center. That is really easy to program. Just needs like 1 extra function to path around obstacles.
@@Jartran72 I wonder if they programmed the DE AI in the same static manner as the other ones, or if they added a new way of defining AIs
@@Jartran72 i wonder if luring enemy's boar is hard to code?
@@brehbreh01 Barbarian AI steals boars consitently
@@brehbreh01 a scout that has enough HP to survive two hits of a boar just needs to hit it twice and run back to your own tc. You can add somethint like keep x units away from enemy scouts but just the luring to your own tc is even easier than the deer stuff
HD AI: "who are you?'
DE AI: "I'm you, but stronger"
"I'm future you"
HD AI "who are you
DE AI " Your doom"
I think 4 DE vs 4 HD AI would be an interesting experiment - to see how they perform when they have the chance to boom properly
Or treaty.
i love this idea
The HD AI did quite a decent job surviving the New AI. Inexperienced players can easily quit and lose from early pressure like that.
Yeah... AI not succombing to stress and pressure isn't exactly a surprise... ^^'
@@lhumanoideerrantdesinterne8598 HD AI, _frantically building mills_ "oh shit oh shit oh shit oh shit"
5:40 AI deer pushing lol
That impressed me, really wasn't expecting that from AI
wow
yeh I mean some players can barely even do it lol
That’s been in UP for years haha
"Another town center, strategically placed so that when... that's gonna be a really easy boar lure..." I'm dying
Haha yeah this was hilarious. He definitely earned a subscribe with that comment
Hey Spirit, just wanted to thank you for existing
Ok cool, thanks bye
HD vs DE: Viciously fighting
AoC: Eating paste
The extreme AI was made to fight against TheViper specially.
You forgot the mill that was Burning for 15 minutes and you missed when it collapsed
The first apparent fail with that test is using a new civ with old AIs. Depending on how AI is coded, it might end up at a disadvantage of not having civ-specific algorithms to play with new civ at full efficiency.
that's what I thought but the HD AI responded more to the unique civ traits than the new one!
Defininitive: Superiority level 9001
HD: 222, 222, 222 (edit: _Help! I'm_ _getting the crap beaten out of me_ !!!)
AoC: _has left the chat_
This new AI will be blasting through the forest with onagers and will make surprise attack from back on the Black forest map.
I would love to see that!
Wait for real,would it actually do that?
@@megaslayercho 1, with new command 'Use an Onager to cut down trees at the flared location'
How about: Forest Nothing?
@@raidarthegunwizard4520 The default AI tends to just give up on forest nothing and even on settings where you give them a little space to walk they don't actually start making progress for a huge amount of time because they won't build their buildings too close to eachother while a human or smarter ai would.
To be fair forest nothing is such a niche example to program for. Space being that constricted just doesn't happen in normal gameplay.
I actually discovered ways of manipulating the AI as a kid playing aoe2 (maybe not even the conquerors expansion) on the old family laptop. I would fill a small map with trees in the level editor and make a river down the middle of the map, i'd draw a small line for the ai to reach the river any time it wanted because I noticed it would always resign if it couldn't send SOMEONE to look around.
I also needed that river because a full small map of trees lagged that laptop noticeably.
I wouldn't call what I played forest nothing exactly but it was pretty close. It's been really interesting seeing the forest nothing phenomenon pop up given that's how I played as a kid.
Spirit casting and T90 doing civ overviews!? wtf is going on
Glad it wasn't just me.
Theres no way they didn’t coordinate this and do it on purpose
A bold new dawn for the AoE community
Made me laugh hard, nice.
Definitely reminded me of T90 casting
The way those buildings crumble is so visually satisfying, it's beautiful.
That was some entertaining commentary. Just sat down and thought I'd watch a bit but ended up watching it all!
Seems I'll have to play on a lower difficulty in DE than in HD, haha.
Just got comfortable with medium AI, guess I'll be going back to easy. :D
@@Hanfgurkenhasser Yea, I currently beat Hardest HD AI about 3/4 of the time, but DE will probably take me apart.
5:34 did the DE ai just use their scout to lure a deer?
Jesus christ
It's a learning machine
1
Yeah the Barbarian ai has been doing that for along time other tricks to such as building a palisade to stop a boar from killing you
Mining camp drop can’t hurt you, it’s not real
Mining camp drop:
Cumans : Additional TC in the feudal age
Persians : "SO YOU DARE TO CHALLENGE ME?"
New AI be like : What's mine is mine , and what's yours is mine.
This was interesting.
Can't wait for the DEFINITIVE edition of AOE2 civ overviews
I would love to see this again with 2 AI players on each team. Especially if the game goes late, it would give an interesting insight to how the teams interact internally and how much collaboration and teamwork there actually is. Thanks Spirit
blue: "team-superiority-level:0"
thats harsh dude haha
Basically "this guy is a noob" in AI talk.
12:23 lmao defending that tree
Saving the boar for imperial age
Extra castle for boar protection
1. AI started scouting with sheep.
2...
3...
4...
5. Machines destroys humans.
Papa SoTL blessing us with the daily uploads 🙏🙏
*When you realized you get in the game at AoC and have imitated all its AI's play style.*
0:59 "We can see a big difference, it's scouting with sheep."
I have NEVER played this game before and I LOST IT when i heard this line 😂😂😂
Video suggestion: 1 new AI vs 7 OG AI on extreme (if you know what I mean...)
But damn, this week is gonna take forever, isn't it?
@That Scribe I tested the same in a 1 v 6 for HD (8th being me the spectator), despite holding up for 3 hours, it finally died. So, yeah, you are right.
I love how the tone of the video is the DE AI and the HD AI duking it out, while the Conquerer AI is just the five year old in the corner."oop, and the conquerer AI has got all his villagers on berries. It loves those berries though so I bet he's perfectly happy right now" and "Let's go see the conquerer AI...oh look, he built a tower...that's nice...".
No one:
Not a single soul
DE2 AI to itself:
*I AM ADVANCING TO THE F E U D A L A G E*
Sometimes you gotta be your own hype lol
The extreme AI looks like its just the Hardest Barbarian AI from the Userpatch from Voobly. That AI tends to go full feudal fight with archers, and do perfect laming, luring boar, sheep exploring, pushing deer, etc
"Maybe that monks coming down to convert the mill" - Your dry delivery kills me man, I love vids of you analyzing AI fights with, I am guess you dont read comments on 4 yo vids but I love it lol
I love the absolute dry delivery on your sarcasm. If I didn't watch all of your videos to know better, I couldn't even tell lol.
What we see: Mine camp drop
What the enemy AI sees: Mein Kampf drop
Purple AI be like:
"Im not resigning until I realize that all my citizens are gay" lmao 30:31
I'd love to see what Deepmind is able to do in this game... In SC2 it already plays like a pro.
18:00
Is the AI version of aggressively T-posing at you.
Except the AI is aggressively chopping *your* woodlines while they attack your base.
The old AI is like you got a towel man? is kinda hot out here man.
The new AI is like, why don't you purify yourself in the waters of Lake Minnetonka?
Was just watching your matches with the Hardest AoE AI on HD edition lol what a coincidence
Your dry humour is great. Especially the placement of the AoC Town Center.
I was about to do chores but then Spirit uploaded something
I just finished mine! 😄
Yes more Spirit of the Law! I've been wanting to watch more AoE DE content, but i can't stand the other streamers.
Anyone noticed at 10:42 the DE ai notices that the HD ai has moved from second position to the third position on the scoreboard and it just leaves it the moment the transition happens and focuses on the AOC ai
I wonder how it will turn out if new AI attack AoC AI first
Maybe HD AI can fight more better if they're given more time to boom, as usual
it world help the HD AI a lot. The battle will be longer. And it's looks like in the late game the HD and the new AI doesn't different so much
12:24 that tree was purple's game
0:47 In my head, a subcontious humming of the intro music starts...
I think one of the biggest improvements is how the new AI is taking his fights. The old ones send in every unit one by one as soon as its created but the new AI collects them in groups and starts the attack in a group. Also in its base the Army was allways in a smaller formation and not every unit running around by themself.
In regards to the eco; i think the old AI was pretty good at booming allready if you didnt interrupted them early on.
What sparks my interest the most though is how the new AI will react to a Trush (yes i know shame on me but even i as a noob could beat the hardest AI with a trush on HD)
I think having the ais play with an age of kings civ would be better. The old civs arent primed as well to play the new civs with their unorthodox abilities and that may not gauge their abilities accordingly.
well HD was able to capitalize on that extra TC (though I think it just checks if he can build one, so he doesnt get stuck if his tc got destroyed pre castle age)
On the other hand, I understand why he chose Cumans. He was testing their ability to work with their unorthodox economic advantages.
@@HolyKhaaaaan personally Cumans are not the best Civ for AI testing, they have terrible University Tech and can't build walls. Lithuanians fall more under conventional Civ, i feel this Civ would've been the best to make AI testing.
@@unnamedshadow1866 there is definitely a good argument for seeing whether the AIs will all build stone walls, or if just the original AOC AI does that.
But ultimately, they all have Town centers. They all have military buildings. They all have Siege weapons and military units. Seeing what they do with those is the meat and bones of the game. And they are typically engineered for land maps, of which this was one. Any variations beyond that are minor and not usually worth looking at.
when they said the new AI could beat the HD AI, I thought they were just PR-ing the game.....guess they weren't kidding after all
Maybe in the next episode of AI WARS, try team AOC and HD vs DE with the other new civs on an interesting new map and even get some naval action on display too. See if the old robots can take down the new whilst demonstrating some other new features!
26:44 - Using Steppe lancers to attack a tower is pretty stupid... it's just letting the tower attack back due to the extra cavalry range...
The CD AI is just cute with how ineffcient it is
keep in mind on what pc's the ai was made for in 2001
5:35 OMG that deer pushing was epic o.O
Nice video. So it sounds like the new DE AI plays like the HD AI, except it does everything a little better. It also isn't as vulnerable to early attacks as the HD AI. Doing an archer or tower rush in HD against computer did feel a bit like cheating. And of course there is the Conquerors AI who builds a mill next to a boar and doesn't lure it...
I played against DE AI this week. These little things about them surprised me:
1. They harassed my villagers in Feudal; move away when I microed the vil but as soon as the vil returned to her task the AI scout pursued her again. This went on over and over, I can't even build the blacksmith in time for castle
2. Their scouts kept a safe distance from my TC, esp when they know my vils are there
3. The DE AIs built markets at the farthest corners of the map (HD AIs don't do this). A lot of markets for each player (HD AIs only do 1 or 2 markets, built the markets in their territory)
4. DE AIs don't resign, even after their home base was razed to the ground; they'd rebuild elsewhere to boom. Allies AI sent them a lot of res asap
Ha! The original 1999 Age of Kings AI would defeat them all by microing every single unit against every single incoming missile.
Would love to see more AI battles.
On a bigger scale? :3
It’ll be so entertaining to watch an 8 player DE Ai fight it out while I have my popcorn 🍿
It's only a matter of days now. So excited for this!
Yesssssskeep the commentaries coming you’re getting me back into this game
Really cool insight into the AI changes; although it would be interesting to see how the aoc AI would compare with a 75 pop limit 🤔 - it doesn't seem to boom beyond that regardless of the real population cap (I assume becuase it was built primarily for the campaigns)
This is very relaxing to watch while I work
The DE AI did lure a deer at 5:36, that's really impressive!
What the AoC ai did after the berries is exactly what I used to do.
heard the new ai will be so advanced it'll make you fall in love with it and do the whole ex machina thing
I love your avatar :)
Man you picked a good topic! Im two years late. I realized the ai was different but you already did it! And 100s of ks views on an RTS game damn. At first I was pissed, the new ai is tougher not like the original experience, but then im like it is playing more like a player so
I'm certainly looking forward to playing this next week, this new AI looks like a fun challenge to overcome
It’d be cool to revisit this topic. It’s been four years. Would be interesting to see how much the DE AI has improved
Looks like the devs watched all your videos to program the DE IA
I'm impressed they were able to keep all AI types in the game. I would have expected in order to fix pathfinding game wide, the old AI would just plain not work.
I really wish they would add machine learning to the games AI in booth Definitive Editions of the game. An AI that can be synchronised with the cloud to gather data of every match it has played. It would get more advanced and better until it is on par with a human player. With that knowledge, it would create several difficulty modes in order that human players actually have a chance.
It would adapt to the different playstyles of each player and would trie to conter the humans behaviour.
If you want something like that, why not play online against other humans?
@@jomnix Because humans and AIs are not even remotely the same.
Humans are not nearly as good as an ai can be and humans are never perfect. Chances that you fight agains someone who uses intelligent tactics is about 0.1%. Humans don't really get better, they stagnate. Humans only learn one or two tactics and only adapt to the most common one.
An AI that paralell fights agains hundreds of players and other AIs at the same time will improve exponentially faster and adapt to all tactics simultaneously. It will create completely new tactics a human could not even think about. It gives good players an enemy to play against since they don't really have anybody to play against, in most cases. Such an AI would change game dynamics and make a game more interesting. It would smartly adapt to attacks and events. And it would be way more useful to teach new players the game and to help exiting players get better.
Isn't it self explanatory from my comment already?
I'd like to see a match with 1 DE vs 2 HD vs 4 AoC AIs.
The hd wins.
AI should do this when raiding (early game)
1) remember all lumberjacks, mines etc.
2) check each spot and if there are villagers, attack them
3) repeat until raid army is dead or send raid army back if enemy is defending well (count enemy troops, towers, etc)
4) decide whether to produce more raid units or to boom etc
The AI backs up because its advancing to next age. This is often the theoretically correct move, because its at its most vurnerable while doing it, and will get a huge boost to units alive after its upgraded
"lets check it out.." *no intro is played* :'''(
22:40 that was satisfying, the villager actually went into the castle by the door
5:37
The way they hunt the deer is actually really clever
Can't wait next week to get the game and watch AI Vs AI by myself
I MAY be picky, but seeing arrows acting like gunpowder projectiles (namely not remaining stuck on ground but disappearing in a cloud of dust) is a tad disappointing, I even expected them to actually taking longer to disappear instead
Lovely stuff! So glad the AI has been changed / improved
22:00 scout survives vil fight only to die of heart failure shortly after.
As someone who played a lot of AoC AI as a kid I can tell you it won't resign if it still has a villager or the ability to make them. Notice it resigns immediately after losing it's last villager. Also it will delete it's castles when it resigns and maybe it's towers? I can't remember what else it deletes. Also for some reason in DM games when the AI is Goths it performs way better than with any other civilization and it's not even close. I think it's because it can't make walls so it can't waste time doing it.
The good thing about AI tunnel vision - outposts seem to be an instant trigger of it. It *WILL NOT* proceed past an outpost without destroying it first.
Hi SOTL, I'd like to help you add some closed captions but I heard youtube has added some changes that it requires the creator to manually check for it. Do you mind doing it? It'll be helpful for non English speakers.
The AoC bot didn't lose because of inefficient dark age gameplay; it lost b/c "all of [his] starting citizenry were male," obviously.
that forward lumber camp has got to be the most demoralizing strat mind games. Instant lost will to go on
I've never played this series before and I found this quite entertaining.