This is Why the MiG-29 Cannot Compete With the Smaller F-16.
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 18 май 2024
- MiG-29 is the embodiment of a Russian military aircraft. It combines unbelievable manoeuvrability with great speed. The first MiG-29 Fulcrum airframes were delivered to the Soviet Air Force in 1983.
I keep hearing how the Mig29 has beaten the F16 and the F15 but the real world tally says something totally different. It is a beautiful plane, but it’s performance numbers are near as good as the F15, hence the world records the F15 holds, IE: time to climb “only plane to exceed Mach speeds in a vertical climb “, 104 to 0 combat record, also the MiG29 has nowhere near the radar power of either the F15 or a block 40 F16, and upgrades only made the American aircraft more deadly than ever. Like I said, the real world numbers speak for themselves.
real world should also include peer to peer combat. ie usa vs russia or china. as we have witnessed in ukraine, western equipment does not meet the hype of their advertisement. all the US/ western game changing equipment has changed nothing on the way to uke defeat.
Yes, @cocodog, that's what the Black Sea fleet thinks too...what's left of it.
@@cpscps2679 no fleet and the rooskies are still winning. this is not a naval battle...try looking at a map.
@@cpscps2679 black see Fleet had to hide because of the kamikaze sea drones which still remains a new type of warfare where every nations havent developped a serious defensive counter to them yet...same as the Russian tanks got detonated against the flying drones...same goes for the US and Europe supposedly "better tanks"...so have the US and Europe sea fleet been fighting sea drones near thier port and have a defensive parade against them...simple answer is NO...So have some sense in your analogy before you try to sound smart
@@cocodog85 really? So far i have seen doesens of videos of Bradlys destroy t90ms and bmps. While the only one i have seen suffering losses r due to arty fire or lancent. No one said leopards can take hits from a 50kg round. Or be impreviuse to mines mainly becouse they got no engineering gear. Also i have seen alot of HIMARS strikes and such pentrating the russians s300/400 that they have i huge numbers but at the same time the eyris-t and patriot system preforms great thue they are in short supplie.
Btw look for what happened to sovied pilots in eygept when the idf facked them up. So...
There is also the factor of pilot training and skill development.
Pilot training will not make up for less internal Fuel, less hard points, a weaker radar, a dmsller radar, far outdated ew and ecc measures and systems.
Is that the same vaulted Soviet territorial defense system that missed a Cessna landing in Red Square???
The Mig-29 has been in combat against the F-15 several times and it lost every engagement. The F-15 Eagle has never been defeated in air to air combat. It has a 104 to 0 kill to loss ratio, half of which were Mig29.
That is not true. F-15 fought mirages, mig23, mig-21, mig-25 and only few mig29s
@@prolordjozbal_jb3431 "A few MIG29's" lol
It took a single F15 to reach that meager achievement.....by downing two (a few) MIG29's in a single combat patrol over Kosovo. Multiple F16's also have kills on the 29's in that very same campaign.
The MIG29's single and ONLY confirmed kill......shooting a friendly MIG23 AND itself down. While having the distinction of being shot down in dogfights 20+ times over its lifetime in multiple warzones by multiple military agencies. Not exactly a rich legacy of success or a great sales pitch for the "upgraded" and clearly derivative MIG35. Doubtful that it had ANY impact after seeing the markets huge interest and massive orders being placed for the MIG35 to all its traditional foreign military buyers. After years on the market it has yielded ZERO orders......so Russia pity bought the entire production run of five or six prototypes.
Only fight with iraq not with ussr that time😂 us more time more advance training compare to iraq if,that time f14 and f15 fight true pilot russia,maybe different ratio kill for f14😂😂
You do realize the MiG 29 pilots that the f15 fought were poorly trained not to mention had inferior air to air missiles.
@@jordancourse5102 I intentionally erased a section in my comment where I was discussing how no other frontline fighter aircraft has needed more excuses made for it due to its reputation in combat. I really wanted to see how many times the defacto #1 excuse would come up....."yeah but those were 3rd world MIGS" .......implying that the USSR wasn't already crushed to death from the weight of its historical failures......and that the Federation that followed, missing over half the formers population and so corrupt and poverty stricken the majority lived in 3rd world conditions......somehow would have fared any different. Guess we'll never know considering they themselves dont use 29's or 35's in any frontline capacity.
Great video, going into the meat of the issue instead of reading WIki specs
Its failure is mainly due to the fact that its performance depends on ground radar guidance, which must be very advanced and have wide coverage areas to allow the pilot to make decisions that help him successfully complete his task, which was not available or not good enough in the countries that use this plane. The plane cannot be considered a failure , the planes encountered The Western ones were the export versions of the MiG-29, which were not equipped with all the advanced technologies that the Russians possessed. Also, the Western fighters fought confrontations against the migs where lacked combat readiness for many reasons. The figures on the number of victories are somewhat misleading. They can only be relied upon if they confront Russian planes and pilots. The Russians can then have a fair assessment of the efficiency of all types of aircraft, not just Russian ones.
It is small fighter used by SSSR PVO - defensive air forces. Design is sound and very well for its age. 1988 Mig-29 fighting 1988 F-16 over SSSR teritorry will win almost every time. However time doesn't stop for anybody and 1988 Mig-29 is no match for 2018 Block 70 F-16. Primary failure of Mig-29 was that it was not upgraded. It was not upgraded because of its price - running cost were about 80% of Su-27 while being much less usefull. SSSR and Russia had plans for multiple versions, much upgraded Mig-35, and much cheaper Project 33 - a single engine version. Given collapse of SSSR and money constraints of Russia it was effectively canceled. It is a decent platform but with too high costs for what if offers.
All i know about this is that, in DCS, handling the MiG-29 in dogfight is much more demanding than doing the same with a F-16 block 50.
And for BVR and Link16 etc ... yeah let not talk about it xD
if its a mig29A or S with just r77s yea for bvr f16 would defiantly have advantage with aim120ds. But if you are comparing them for back in the day when both were released fox1 where they are close to merging mig29 with the right pilot can easily take out a f16. And if you are talking about maneuverability for just a guns only dogfight mig29 is a monster for that it has a insane thrust to weight 1.09 and thats with full fuel 4 aam's and a full center drop tank. The f16 on other hand is 1.1 and thats dry without any pylons or missiles. I cant find thrust weight on mig29 but id assume its higher then the f16 without it fully loaded.
The f-16 is a light weight rate fighter while the mig 29 is a medium weight dog fighter. Tbh either plane could win in a dogfight but it entirely depends on whether the pilot plays to the strength of the plane. Btw the f-15 is no contest. The reason is cause it can do both due to its insane thrust to weight. I think the c variant has 29,000 pounds of thrust per engine… the reason that these planes don’t perform crazy maneuvers is due to structural integrity
I remember when East Germany returned to the West a US Colonial got to fly the Mig-29. This was an old Mig against a modern Mig and the pilot said the F=16 had the advantage over that Mig in Tech but in a dog fight it would destroy the F-16. I would like to see it put up against a Mig-35 instead. Using stats remember the US went up against third world countries that used monkey models and third class pilots not Russian or Chinese. We are learning all that superior Western equipment is being destroyed in Ukraine by the Russians. Some might say it isn't being used by the Western Forces is also what I am saying about there great kill rational they got fighting third world forces.
If that case why there more Russian tanks, helicopters ,planes and missiles being destroyed than Ukraine
@@JohnnorrisDavis-oo7zg While at the start but they learned. If Russia was losing all the tanks that the Trolls are saying then Russia would have ran out of them. Since they have not it must mean someone is lying!
@@JoeyRay-fz1qe Yeah I too feel that Western countries sometimes try to over hype their own side. Many information available on internet, posted by Western media is fake. Most photos and video evidences of destroyed Russian equipment may also be old or AI generated. Ukraine is definitely not doing well against Russia all these days. Russia is simply capturing city after city in Ukraine, while Ukrainians are constantly retreating leaving all the western equipment to be captured or destroyed by Russians
@JoeyRay-fz1qe dumbass they been using old ass t-64 and t-55 .most of their t-90,t-80 is damn near gone.have you been watching this war for the last to years
@JoeyRay-fz1qe plus they got over 20,000 tanks. And most of them is old ass t-64,t-55,t-72
Frequently out-mached by F-16? Lol a Famous Dutch F-16 pilot once said that merging with Mig-29 he would rather eject than continue fighting.
Mig had socio-economic problems not performance ones. When Soviet Union collapsed Russia decided to focus improving his bigger brother Su-27 and market it for export as well. But before that entire eastern block had Migs including the 29 model. Today the 35 model is more than capable to put the most modern F-16 and F-18 versions at their place.
Another fact: The Mig 29's do not have inflight refulling probes, so eith they can either use dropable fuel tanks or fly within a 300 miles radius of their airfield.
Two words. Drop tanks. The range of the MiG-29 internal is 528 miles vs 575 miles for the F-16. So I call bullshit.
Indian mig29k navy and mig 29kub can do refuelling and buddy refilling also so its not accutate
Before the Su27, Soviet fighters were deliberately designed for limited range in order to prevent their fighters from defecting.
@@pisquared1827 oh wow, thanks for telling me that, I did not kinow it
Thats quite idiotic but I am no longer surprised by the depth of ignorance and outright stupidity of people.
The Mig-29 was a rush job.
It wasn't what the designers wanted
Soviets downgraded the military equipments for export that's well known ..the high kill-rate by Nato during the gulf war and Kosovo wasn't surprising...
Did f15 really encountered Russian pilots 😉
The thing about the 29 is it's limited combat range/radius..
Pilot load on the MiG-29 is way higher than on the F-16.
Russian military has never been good at marketing their products
The Mig29 will not likely have anything to do with the f16. The Su57 and 35 both have superior electronics and radars than any US aircraft and will most likely be tasked with countering the F16s. The F16 will merely be too little and too late to have any impact...
The MIG-28 was a vastly superior fighter.
F16 does not have a 1000km combat radius. Research your videos properly before posting falsehoods
فشلها يعود في الاساس إلى أن أدائها يعتمد على التوجية الراداري الأرضي الذي يجب أن يكون متطوراً جداً وذو مساحات تغطية واسعة يتيح للطيار اتخاذ القرارات المساعدة لإنجاز مهامة بنجاح وهو مالم يكن متوفراً في الدول المستخدمة لهذه الطائرة , لايمكن إعتبار الطائرة فاشلة نظراً لأن النسخ التي واجهتها الطائرات الغربية كانت هي النسخ التصديرية من الميغ 29 والتي لم تكن مزودة بكل مايملكة الروس من التقنيات المتقدمة , كما أن المقاتلات الغربية خاضت مواجهات ضد مقاتلات أفتقرت للجاهزية القتالية لاسباب كثيرة , الأرقام عن عدد الانتصارات مضللة نوعاً ما , يمكن إعتمادها فقط في حال مواجهتها للطائرات الروسية والطيارين الروس عندها يمكن أن يكون تقييم عادل لكفاءة جميع انواع الطائرات وليس الروسية فقط .
Ok, in relevant combat with relevant pilots the Germans rated the ig 29 as excellent and the A-11 Archer with the helmet cueing as top notch. You cant compare the current F-16 and F-15 A to A figures because of context, ie, opponent level AEW, EW, air superiority in general and backup infrastructure. As an ex simulator modeler based on real world data, there is little between an Mig 29 and F-16 as each stepping stone model progresses. I had access to all combat data for over 30 years or real world operations and it really would come down to training and pilot quality. Not sure what the F-15 comparisons are doing in here, very much a Su-27/30/35 peer. From everything I have seen and been told by real pilots, it is very marginal between the Mig 29 family and the F-16. Said this before but as per normal expecting to be blasted by the fan boys.
Real world data? You didn't mention a single relevant data point for any of the multiple "real world" engagements and losses over the MIG29's history. The F15 IS relevant in this discussion because there is real world confirmed information of multiple losses to the Eagle in actual combat. Needing to use anecdotal accounts and "what ifs" for evidence....while ignoring its real and tangible lack of any historical success in the decades of its use......presented like combat is the anomaly in all the data?? If fighters were ranked simply by the number of excuses made for them the MIG29 would have no competition for the #1 spot. Lol at your example of "relevant combat" with "relevant pilots"......relevant being applied to mock training scenarios......just not any of the real combat operations it wasn't successful in. Those relevant German MIG's are now ironically fighting the Russians......after Poland gave them away freely to Ukraine for being "too relevant" for them.
Although......you did state your credentials as a "simulation modeler" where the stakes are much higher, and data has more "relevancy" than any real world applications or actual combat use. Maybe that's where I'm failing, by not having your theoretical/proper perspective on such things.
Mig29 does have refueling probes, but not everyone got it because it depends of buyer. Mig29 was better than F-16 by any thing, start of radar, than irst that no other plane have and look and shoot capability, when USSR dismantle they leave 2 squadron of them in Germany and west could not believe what this bird can, also they upgraded F18 to be close to Mig29, F18 was better only in range Mach 1,8 - Mig29 Mach 2,3 etc. Don't even think Russia don't know how when make everything better without "west" microchips, only stupid people can believe that. 👇🏻
Such beautiful and classic designs my favorite are the Mig-21 and Mig-25
The Mig29 has won everytime going against the F-16. Ask the Pakistani air force. 😂😂 Range doesn't matter when the enemy is 300 nautical miles from u.
Right.....and the fact you could only come up with an absolutely anecdotal example that has no legitimate evidence or any confirmation......only proves to the contrary. The ONLY kill credited to the 29.....killing a friendly MIG23 and itself.....however in comparison with its awe inspiring combat loss record of 20 CONFIRMED lost in multiple wars.....does seem impressive huh??
With such incredible fighting pedigree is it really any wonder why no foreign military wanted or bought the "new" derivative MIG35? Meanwhile new orders are still being filled on F16's putting it's count close to 5,000 built.
Just for reference and single example 11:06.....4 MIG29's were shot down by 2 different F16's in Kosovo alone.
How many real fights that it won against the f-16
I was going to say, it looks like a copy of the F18s
Get your eyes checked