Fun Guns reviews Presents Mouse Guns.Mouse guns are known for their less than effective power, but here are some techniques that make these little pistols reliable self defense tools.
At a local mountain beer joint some 40 years ago there was a bully that harassed everyone. Most of them he would wait outside and beat them up when they came out. He was kinda large, maybe 6' tall and around 300#. He decided he would whip a guy one night and the guy pulled out a 25 auto on him and told the bully to leave him alone. The bully told him he wasn't afraid of his "cap gun" and that it would take at least a 357 magnum to stop him. The smaller guy tried to walk away but the bully tackled him. The guy put the barrel against the bully's fat belly and it did in fact sound no louder then a cap gun when it went off. Suddenly the bully begins screaming for someone to call him an ambulance. It is my opinion that a small caliber gun is just fine for self defence.
When I was in law enforcement years ago I carried a .22 revolver like the one in the forefront as a back -up. I also knew some other other lawmen who did the same including local, county, and FBI agents.
Clearly mouse guns or pocket pistols have their place in self defense, but more so in close contact. Google Seecamp or go to their website and you learn how a small pocket pistol saved the life of Seecamp while in the Military. Mr Seecamp went on to designing one of the best pocket pistols in the industry. My everyday carry most times is a 9mm, sometimes 40/45. In my pocket lives my Seecamp 32. Should someone grab me from behind or take me to the ground as opposed to a threat within the 21' range I believe I can deploy my Seecamp to defend myself in an upfront close and personal manner. As always your videos are clear, concise and you articulate better than anyone on RUclips, thanks!!!
+Slate Creek Dulcimers You're basing your opinion on a single case? Good thing the bully was a sissy. The 25 didn't stop him, he chose to stop. Even though caliber selection is secondary to shot placement you still are well advised to be carrying something with enough snot, and place your shot well enough, that it removes all decision making power from the attacker.
+Slate Creek Dulcimers I don't understand how some people have the notion that mouse guns aren't effective self defense guns. Seriously, who wants to get shot by anything. Plus, the cases where aggressors do continue fighting have been shot with very large caliber pistols, and the only thing that stopped most of them were incapacitating shots, or bleeding out/passing out. Ask any cop, or even military service member. Most of these guys were also high on drugs, and/or adrenaline. I am confident that, whether a man be armed with a .45 or a .32 acp, a bullet is a bullet, and it will TEAR through your vital organs, veins, lung(s), bones, skin, and central nervous system.
+Slate Creek Dulcimers I read about a pawn shop owner who was attacked by a maniac with a ninja sword after his handgun purchase was delayed by NICS. The owner was stabbed through the abdomen, but a couple rounds of .25ACP about the eyes stopped the attack in an instant. Perp was DOA, obviously, victim made a full recovery.
For all of those that claim that a .22 LR is not an effective defense weapon..... Just try standing in front of one and take a round or two in the chest. You may change your mind.
.22 LR has a very high failure-to-stop rate when compared to larger calibers: Around 31%. Of course, it all comes down to what you're trying to do. Most private citizens don't want to kill whoever is accosting them; they just want them to go away and stop accosting them. .22LR is plenty effective for that because in a majority of self-defense cases, simply presenting the handgun is enough to deter the attacker. This is why .25 ACP was such a popular cartridge well into the 80s; the firearms were small and easy to carry concealed, but the presentation was still usually enough to deter an attacker. This is why it should become popular again; because a sucking chest wound is a sucking chest wound, regardless of its size, and if the firearm that can deliver it is so small that you can't even begin to guess who might be carrying one just by looking at them, the perceived risk in doing street crime is very, very high and it becomes unappealing. Everyone should have a .25 ACP handgun (to go with the Firearm Fundamentals course that everyone ought to be taking in high school).
Yeah well I got hit when I was a kid with a 22 lr from a negligent discharge from my neighbor I was 12 and let's just say I had 35 stitches in my leg so I know its not something you play with
I'm glad someone is finally demonstrating the proper use of a mouse gun, spies and special operations people have been carrying them for many many years when they're in deep cover and people often wonder why but this is how they use them and use them effectively !!!
A quick question to all those who disparage mouse guns: If mouse guns are such crappy self defense tools, why can't I find any used ones cheap? Seems to me that if they were so ineffective they would be a dime a dozen on the used market.
Well, thanks to the king of the mousers and his videos I am now a member of his club; it can be both expensive and frustrating! I have a colt .25 that is driving me crazy; it is no longer a hobby but is a mission...new triple k mag, wouldn't work so am rebuilding old mag with Wolff spring,,..trip to the range tomorrow-lol.
Sooch, I really enjoyed watching this video. Thanks for the shooting tips. I agree of being in the shots to the face mindset. I also want to share that I ran a call on a gun shot wound (Paramedic here) and a man was shot by a 25 acp below his underarm somehow, on his side, he was in shock and he later died in the ambulance. (no exit wound) I agree with shot placement, that was definitely a luck shot. Thanks for the Great videos and God Bless America!!
25% stopping capability does not translate into needing 4 shots to stop. An example of this type of math. > 25% of people who lose 1 pint of blood pass out from blood loss would mean that it takes 4 pints of blood loss to pass out.
ir this is the only channel that showed how to use the mouse gun for last chance self defense. Absolutely superb video on the proper stance and right ammo. thanks so much sir
As my rule of thumb always goes... When in doubt empty the mag... I sometimes carry a J-22 pistol just because of the small size. It makes it easier to carry than my .40 cal S&w. You are correct though it is all about shot placement.
2:54 hahaha, something about those two scenes/takes are hilarious. Almost like the second time you decided "oh nevermind, this little gun isn't worth trying to use"
I carry a Davis P-32 when i leave the house. I have only had to pull the weapon once and the sight of the small gun was enough to make two very large punks back away very quickly! Small weapons do have a place in our honest society .
CCI minimags out of mouse gun length barrels have managed some pretty good results even for torso shots. Up to 13 inches into calibrated ballistics gel, and as a bonus the bullet tumbled making a larger wound.
Good analysis. Congrats. Good, reliable mouse guns are excellent self-defense weapons. I don't know anyone (and I grew up in the roughest streets of L.A. during the deadliest era (the homicide numbers, violent crimes were perhaps the highest in our nation's history) who will willingly go up against these little guns. It would have to be a huge, double-tough criminal deranged on PCP to do that and even then. For good or bad, these little guns took out so many lives during that era. In real urban gunfights, attacks and encounters, people armed with these little guns sometimes would come on top of attackers with bigger guns. Your class on how to effectively use these guns is very good. If people don't have anything else, this is a very good weapon to have for protection. God Bless.
The Israeli Mossadd, KGB and on various occasions MI 6 all have dispatched their enemies with a well placed .22 round and a silencer. I would not like to stand in front of one heading to my head!
Cody Hoel Well if you are going to assassinate a terrorist you don't walk up to him and ask his permission. Mouse guns have their place, especially in extremely warm climates where large handguns are difficult to conceal and carry with light clothing and cut offs. Besides no one like to bleed, admittedly .22's they are also referred as a kill you later round, but they do their job if it hits a vital and no one likes to bleed, so for protection they will do.
0Good lesson Sootch! I'm forwarding this to my wife. She carries the 8 shot 22 LR Lady Smith with Crimson Trace and I have always told her to concentrate on the head. I'm trying to graduate her up to a Model 642 CT 38. Love your videos. Short, sweet and to the point for those of us with itty bitty attention spans. ;-) And high production quality. Please keep up the good work.
Good vid scootch. You bring up alot of reality here (for the tacti-cool rambos who don't leave the house without a full-sized edc+ backup guns AND plenty of mags). I carry a kahr 9mm but believe a face full of .380, .32 or even .22lr would probably (i.e.more than likely) put an end to any situation I may realistically encounter. .Would I go kick in doors in the "projects" with a mouse gun? No....but for "Joe citizen" a mouse gun makes a great "get off me" gun. Of course at that distance a knife works too.
Never thought about this. Thanks ! I am also thinking that if you are wrestling arround with someone and can't get away one of these little guns pressed into the body then fired would do lots of damage. There is an awful lot of pressure even in a .25 barrel
Used to Contenders hunting calibers & the proper scopes to them from 2x to 12x & with a 21A Beretta that has no usuable sights ,always ignored them & shot just like your doing,with favorable results. Another good video, Sir.
Back in the late 80s " I shot an attacker in the torso one time with a 25 cap and he fell over & ran for his life .to this day all I carry is a NAA 22MAG. And I am sure it's all I'll ever need. Great vids buddy!!!
no know your video is a long time ago. but I just got a seekamp today. I took it to the range immediately and it was stuffing bullets down the brass. I had the shop check it out and they are sending it back today. they offered me a new one which is darn nice. I'm just taking it back.
Menu years ago I was discussing the merits of the smaller rounds with a frendu he gave me a quote he had herd years ago from an American policeman of his aquantance. " I would rather be missed by a 45 than hit by a 22". That made a lot of sense to me.
very informative & well made vid i also like the mouse guns got an ol j-22 thanks for the heads up on the cci mini-mags. personally i was cleaning it after every 2 mags and it shot jacketed rounds fairly well with out failures
I'd like to get a b.u.g. I was thinking about a little pocket 22 because they say most fatal shootings are done with a 22 (well a rifle) but I like the techniques you showed I was looking around and seen this older video glad you're still doing the channel keep up the good work
I just wanted to thank you for an excellent video. My wife and I have several 9mm's, 38's, and a 357 however they are all too big to carry. We are looking for a very small gun ( like the Beretta) that can be slipped in the pocket or purse and not be cumbersome or noticeable You video was very informative- especially regarding how to actually shoot them if placed in a life threatening situation. Thanks Again..
hey sootch, just had to say...i think you have an awesome radio voice, seriously. its great, and you do a great job with your vids...ok brother, thanks!
The gun is merely a tool. I AM THE WEAPON! Anyone who believes that any caliber is insufficient for self defense is actually stating that HE is less qualified and seeking to compensate with "bigger tools".
Good video. I just want to bring up a much needed point about the .32 silvertip. It's called rimlock and it is real and is caused by short hollow point rounds. It's happened to me and when it does your magazine is completely useless until you clear the rimlock by taking the mag. apart. You can load 1 hp in the chamber and 1 on the top of your mag and the rest fmj.
String four to five shots up from torso to head up the "lethal corridor". This is a proper self defense firing method for any caliber. This puts rounds on center mass first then up through the neck to the head. Criminals can be wearing body armor (getting class 3a armor is easy these days), so even a .44 Magnum won't stop that if you shoot just center mass.
Interesting you posted this as I am looking around for a smaller handgun to carry w/ me in camping, my CZ 82 is smaller but still too heavy for a back pack situation. PS: I was up in Linville gorge this weekend, had a great hike but got soaked for about 40 minutes :)
I've got the Bobcat in .22LR and when I bought it I got a cheapo bulk box of .22LR, I think it was Remington. I was very disappointed at first, the gun wouldn't cycle this ammo. It would shoot a couple then jam. I found out later the ammo was bad. I switched to CCI stingers and haven't looked back, the gun works great with CCI stinger or mini mags. CCI makes great .22 ammo. As finicky as these little .22 autos are you need to have good ammo for them to work reliably
Another thought... at such close range the possibility of being in a grappling situation is high. It is worth considering that you may have to be fending off with your weak hand and practice single handed point shooting with the weapon tucked in close to the body and the strong side turned slightly behind.
I love my Jetfire. Being SA, it is super easy to put multiple rounds on target. I have no allusions re: the 25acp. I don't plan on a "one shot stop". My other CCW's are a compact 191145acp and a Ruger SP101 357.
In a way to think about shooting someone makes me sick, so when i think about what a pistol or other guns can be used for, it makes me in bad mood. Another thing is there is some pistols that are made so nicely, so just looking at them gives me a good feeling. I have the same feelings about very nicely made knives. The worst thing is that a very nice looking tool, can make so unbelievable much harm to anybody, including yourself.
I'm sorry, but just the mere act of pulling a gun on someone of any size would be enough to stop most attacks. Also, I have seen what a .22 can do. Sure, it might not be the most lethal, but I guarantee that if you got hit ONCE you'd be begging not to get hit TWICE!lol. Also, the capacity of their ammo almost always seems to be larger. If I got hit once, my mind would be FIRMLY fixed on the fact these guns often have 7, 8, and 9 capacities.lol
johnlewisbrooks you have watched to many movies. Pulling a gun on some people DOES NOT stop attack. A man a pcp has no sense of fear or common sense.You must have been protected all your life .. believe me there is reality in this world..
Any gun is better than no gun, but once you've had a serious encounter with a violent criminal as I have had, you are going to want to do everything you can to stack the deck in your favor. That means carrying a bigger gun, that means making the sacrifices necessary to carry a bigger gun. My everyday carry is a Smith SD40VE with 15 rounds of Federal HST .40 S&W jacketed hollow-points in the gun (it's very Glock-like except for the trigger). At home I keep a low-end but reliable Bushmaster XM-15 with a red dot and a green laser (the laser switch is on the grip). A Mossberg 500 12-gauge with 00-buckshot is my emergency back-up...all three guns are at the ready beside me this very second. I've an alarm and security cameras, plus good doors with special bars to prevent them from being easily kicked in. The point here is to do everything you can to stack the deck in your favor--more is almost always better.
Excellent video Here in Texas a no head shoot may be consider murder even if your intent is only to stop The problem is that a head shoot is not consider stopping is consider killing Please check you local laws just to make sure Note I'm not a lawyer nor pretend to be one
Before posting I consulted with one of the experts in the industry and author of several well-known books and DVDs to get his opinion. He said the truth is that these calibers (.22 and .25) are notorious for skidding off human skulls or stopping in the frontal skull wall.
Actually with multiple bullet wounds the chance of fatality grows exponentially. Being shot twice means you are 4 times as likely to die. 4 shots are 16 times more likely to kill. Thats why buck shot is so effective. Its like getting hit with 16 .32 caliber bullets. Which is 256 times as likely to kill someone as being hit once with a .32.
even a smaller gun will give you a chance to get away....the shock of the hit may give you those precious seconds even if you can not hit a vital area.....i agree sootch ...........practice , practice , practice. your vids are awesome ...thank you
I suspect ammo developments in the 13 years since this video was made have changed some things. There are some pretty premium .32 ACP rounds out there now and I don’t just mean hollow point.
I've only watched this video and a few of your "Why I Carry A Gun" videos so this might not be necessary, but I feel like an important edge was forsaken: practice, practice, PRACTICE! Granted, if you have a CCW you're probably familiar with firearms. But, the fact remains that not everyone who owns a gun has put in the range time to effectively wield their piece, especially with a smaller caliber. **If you've gotten this 500 times then by all means ignore this. Keep up the good work though!
I use to have a Jennings J22. I shot CCI Stingers out of it sometimes. In about 100 rounds my extractor would bend and then break off. I replaced the extractor and it did the same thing. Mine was the blued version. Have you ever had this problem with the J22 and the CCI Stingers?
.... You make some really good points and I agree with you on most things but its stopping ability... Dude I have taken Roo's and pigs with a 22lr so I think their stopping power ability on people would be quite effective. Also take into account their fire capacity, some 22lr handguns can hold 15-20 rounds, heck I dont know some my even hold more. Rather than shooting them in the head 5 times with the 22 like you in your video id just go 5 times to the chest. Im quite sure it would work.
Great info, learned alot especially about that crumpled weaver stance. My qeuestion is about a particular chambering. I have a smith and wesson revolver chambered in 32 s&w long. What would you say is the best load for it? All I can ever find is either winchester LRN or Remington SN Im not really sure which one would be the best. Unfortanutley my wife has a hard time racking the slide of a semi, or I would get her a .380 and she is extremely recoil sensative. Thanks, -woohog1
touche. However I still hold firm to the idea that simply the visual effect of a firearm is enough to halt most in their steps. You don't need to kill them, you just need to buy some time, and change their mind about what they are about to try.
in my oppinion an average person with basic or no gun training could more easily shoot an attacker four times in the chest with a 25 auto than with say a 9mm. less blast and recoil, just point and squeeze, squeeze, squeeze, squeeze.
Don, which of the two would you carry more out of a semi auto pistol; a .22 or .25? I may want to up it to a .32 (I really need a small compact gun I can keep on target while in tight work clothes) but am afraid of rim lock. Is this a real issue when carrying?
Much has changed since 2009 so there may be better .25 ACP ammo out there now. Best to check. A half box of Stingers blew off the extractor on my stainless Sterling Arms Model 302 22 LR. I replaced it with a blued extractor which was all I could find back in 1988. The Sterling was never designed for hyper velocity 22s, predating them. They may work fine in some mouse guns but beware they may also break parts such as the firing pin/ejector and extractor as well, leaving you with a paperweight in the middle of a gunfight.. No one has ever confirmed to me which 22 LR ammo is safe to use in a Sterling 22. A spreadsheet I put together using velocities and recoil energy using a 2 inch barrel shows even some high velocity loads could be dangerous. I used data from ammo brand websites as well as some using a chronograph and calculated where I had to. I compared about 25 or more common brands. There are a number of loads out there with more energy than the Stinger. The stinger has an energy of about 67 foot pounds out of a 2 inch barrel. Bullet grain weight makes a big difference. You can make your own spreadsheet. It is not difficult. The testing is what is difficult unless you own a barrel mounted chronograph. 22s sometime don't register on conventional models. I discovered ammo showing an estimated 80+ foot pounds of recoil energy. That can break parts and springs. The people posting on RUclips are not ballisticians but well meaning. I would like to see someone with expertise post a test of the common rounds one pistol at a time and shoot at least one box of each ammo. Keep the gun clean and well lubed and inspect parts after each ammo. I have an Iver Johnson eight shot Supershot Sealed Eight revolver made in 1934 and I am cautious about what 22 ammo I put thru it as well. The strongly manufactured Ruger LCR revolver and LCP pistols would be a good place to start to gather data and then work from there. Not all 22 ammo is the same.
Any tricks to holding the NAA mini revolver? My first time shooting it the other day I hit the 6" target from 20 ft routinely but also the back edge of the cylinder cut my thumb when it jumped in hand. A day later it still hurts like a *&^% (I kept shooting for another 50 rounds until there was too much blood to hold it... I'd driven all the way to the range so wanted my money's worth lol)! Any tips on holding appreciated I love the workmanship of this tiny thing and its compact size but not the pain of shooting. (I normally shoot a .50 black powder pistol so I am ok with recoil but it's the tiny grip that gets me).
With these small calibre rounds, would it be wise in winter NOT to use hollow points? I am concerned a leather jacket might cause hollow points to open prematurely.
Hi sootch00 and thanks very much for the info and vision of being safe and making someone out of business. I am in a wheelchair so this requires a special and smart defense - sort of an attacking defense. I have the opportunity of buying my friends Beretta 950 but it's in .22 short. What do you think of this. Great shape - 3 mags. How much do you think it's worth and what about the .22 short round?? Thank You. Sincerely, JAMES.
At a local mountain beer joint some 40 years ago there was a bully that harassed everyone. Most of them he would wait outside and beat them up when they came out. He was kinda large, maybe 6' tall and around 300#. He decided he would whip a guy one night and the guy pulled out a 25 auto on him and told the bully to leave him alone. The bully told him he wasn't afraid of his "cap gun" and that it would take at least a 357 magnum to stop him. The smaller guy tried to walk away but the bully tackled him. The guy put the barrel against the bully's fat belly and it did in fact sound no louder then a cap gun when it went off. Suddenly the bully begins screaming for someone to call him an ambulance. It is my opinion that a small caliber gun is just fine for self defence.
When I was in law enforcement years ago I carried a .22 revolver like the one in the forefront as a back -up. I also knew some other other lawmen who did the same including local, county, and FBI agents.
Clearly mouse guns or pocket pistols have their place in self defense, but more so in close contact. Google Seecamp or go to their website and you learn how a small pocket pistol saved the life of Seecamp while in the Military. Mr Seecamp went on to designing one of the best pocket pistols in the industry. My everyday carry most times is a 9mm, sometimes 40/45. In my pocket lives my Seecamp 32. Should someone grab me from behind or take me to the ground as opposed to a threat within the 21' range I believe I can deploy my Seecamp to defend myself in an upfront close and personal manner. As always your videos are clear, concise and you articulate better than anyone on RUclips, thanks!!!
+Slate Creek Dulcimers You're basing your opinion on a single case? Good thing the bully was a sissy. The 25 didn't stop him, he chose to stop. Even though caliber selection is secondary to shot placement you still are well advised to be carrying something with enough snot, and place your shot well enough, that it removes all decision making power from the attacker.
+Slate Creek Dulcimers I don't understand how some people have the notion that mouse guns aren't effective self defense guns. Seriously, who wants to get shot by anything. Plus, the cases where aggressors do continue fighting have been shot with very large caliber pistols, and the only thing that stopped most of them were incapacitating shots, or bleeding out/passing out. Ask any cop, or even military service member. Most of these guys were also high on drugs, and/or adrenaline. I am confident that, whether a man be armed with a .45 or a .32 acp, a bullet is a bullet, and it will TEAR through your vital organs, veins, lung(s), bones, skin, and central nervous system.
+Slate Creek Dulcimers I read about a pawn shop owner who was attacked by a maniac with a ninja sword after his handgun purchase was delayed by NICS. The owner was stabbed through the abdomen, but a couple rounds of .25ACP about the eyes stopped the attack in an instant. Perp was DOA, obviously, victim made a full recovery.
Almost 10 years later, Jan 2019 - the video quality and editing has come a long way, but the quality of content was there then, and remains.
For all of those that claim that a .22 LR is not an effective defense
weapon..... Just try standing in front of one and take a round or two in the chest. You may change your mind.
Ken Johnson, at least someone has some common sense
a 22 to the stomach is probably the most dangerous hit to take fro any small caliber
.22 LR has a very high failure-to-stop rate when compared to larger calibers: Around 31%.
Of course, it all comes down to what you're trying to do. Most private citizens don't want to kill whoever is accosting them; they just want them to go away and stop accosting them. .22LR is plenty effective for that because in a majority of self-defense cases, simply presenting the handgun is enough to deter the attacker. This is why .25 ACP was such a popular cartridge well into the 80s; the firearms were small and easy to carry concealed, but the presentation was still usually enough to deter an attacker. This is why it should become popular again; because a sucking chest wound is a sucking chest wound, regardless of its size, and if the firearm that can deliver it is so small that you can't even begin to guess who might be carrying one just by looking at them, the perceived risk in doing street crime is very, very high and it becomes unappealing.
Everyone should have a .25 ACP handgun (to go with the Firearm Fundamentals course that everyone ought to be taking in high school).
All the guys who say that mouse guns are the same ones that are afraid of bees and wasps
Yeah well I got hit when I was a kid with a 22 lr from a negligent discharge from my neighbor I was 12 and let's just say I had 35 stitches in my leg so I know its not something you play with
I'm glad someone is finally demonstrating the proper use of a mouse gun, spies and special operations people have been carrying them for many many years when they're in deep cover and people often wonder why but this is how they use them and use them effectively !!!
It has been said many times before: the .32 in your pocket is better than the .45 (9mm, 40, .357, etc.) you left at home.
That's a fact.
A quick question to all those who disparage mouse guns: If mouse guns are such crappy self defense tools, why can't I find any used ones cheap? Seems to me that if they were so ineffective they would be a dime a dozen on the used market.
Tru
benthere422 I have two 22 la and 25 i love them they are old school one is worth 750 other 150
benthere422 u can find them I found some. I love them.lol
Well, thanks to the king of the mousers and his videos I am now a member of his club; it can be both expensive and frustrating!
I have a colt .25 that is driving me crazy; it is no longer a hobby but is a mission...new triple k mag, wouldn't work so am rebuilding old mag with Wolff spring,,..trip to the range tomorrow-lol.
Bill Pohlman curious as to how it went?
Personally I carry RPG for self defense, It's very compact and is a great concealed weapon
I keep a loaded M2 in my watch pocket myself
"Carry the largest caliber you feel comfortable to shoot." Time to carry a concealed .308
Himlow Odinmire I only carry musket balls after watching this video
I think ill carry a 120mm.
Oh wait, you mean I need to carry the gun too?
Sooch, I really enjoyed watching this video. Thanks for the shooting tips. I agree of being in the shots to the face mindset. I also want to share that I ran a call on a gun shot wound (Paramedic here) and a man was shot by a 25 acp below his underarm somehow, on his side, he was in shock and he later died in the ambulance. (no exit wound) I agree with shot placement, that was definitely a luck shot. Thanks for the Great videos and God Bless America!!
If I had to use a .25 auto for self defense, I'd wiggle the trigger until it stops making noise.
.32 is a very affective round though..
25% stopping capability does not translate into needing 4 shots to stop. An example of this type of math. > 25% of people who lose 1 pint of blood pass out from blood loss would mean that it takes 4 pints of blood loss to pass out.
Albert Buchheit thank you I came here to post this lol
ir this is the only channel that showed how to use the mouse gun for last chance self defense. Absolutely superb video on the proper stance and right ammo. thanks so much sir
As my rule of thumb always goes... When in doubt empty the mag... I sometimes carry a J-22 pistol just because of the small size. It makes it easier to carry than my .40 cal S&w. You are correct though it is all about shot placement.
2:54 hahaha, something about those two scenes/takes are hilarious. Almost like the second time you decided "oh nevermind, this little gun isn't worth trying to use"
I carry a Davis P-32 when i leave the house. I have only had to pull the weapon once and the sight of the small gun was enough to make two very large punks back away very quickly! Small weapons do have a place in our honest society .
CCI minimags out of mouse gun length barrels have managed some pretty good results even for torso shots. Up to 13 inches into calibrated ballistics gel, and as a bonus the bullet tumbled making a larger wound.
Good analysis. Congrats. Good, reliable mouse guns are excellent self-defense weapons. I don't know anyone (and I grew up in the roughest streets of L.A. during the deadliest era (the homicide numbers, violent crimes were perhaps the highest in our nation's history) who will willingly go up against these little guns. It would have to be a huge, double-tough criminal deranged on PCP to do that and even then. For good or bad, these little guns took out so many lives during that era. In real urban gunfights, attacks and encounters, people armed with these little guns sometimes would come on top of attackers with bigger guns. Your class on how to effectively use these guns is very good. If people don't have anything else, this is a very good weapon to have for protection. God Bless.
It's all about shot placement, a well placed round, even a .22, can bring any man down.
The Israeli Mossadd, KGB and on various occasions MI 6 all have dispatched their enemies with a well placed .22 round and a silencer. I would not like to stand in front of one heading to my head!
MR. Gentleman Sir Yes but they had the privpedge of walking up to somebody and shooting them in the back of the head
Cody Hoel Well if you are going to assassinate a terrorist you don't walk up to him and ask his permission. Mouse guns have their place, especially in extremely warm climates where large handguns are difficult to conceal and carry with light clothing and cut offs. Besides no one like to bleed, admittedly .22's they are also referred as a kill you later round, but they do their job if it hits a vital and no one likes to bleed, so for protection they will do.
.22 is not a good self defense round, and I can conceal a full size Beretta with just a tshirt
Chris J. Rabitts and cayotes also!
Great vid I just recently purchased a 380 NAA Guardian for pocket carry and as an ankle holster gun. I am very pleased with it so far.
0Good lesson Sootch! I'm forwarding this to my wife.
She carries the 8 shot 22 LR Lady Smith with Crimson Trace and I have always told her to concentrate on the head. I'm trying to graduate her up to a Model 642 CT 38.
Love your videos. Short, sweet and to the point for those of us with itty bitty attention spans. ;-) And high production quality. Please keep up the good work.
Good vid scootch. You bring up alot of reality here (for the tacti-cool rambos who don't leave the house without a full-sized edc+ backup guns AND plenty of mags). I carry a kahr 9mm but believe a face full of .380, .32 or even .22lr would probably (i.e.more than likely) put an end to any situation I may realistically encounter. .Would I go kick in doors in the "projects" with a mouse gun? No....but for "Joe citizen" a mouse gun makes a great "get off me" gun. Of course at that distance a knife works too.
I truly enjoy your videos. Very informative and easy to follow.
Never thought about this. Thanks ! I am also thinking that if you are wrestling arround with someone and can't get away one of these little guns pressed into the body then fired would do lots of damage. There is an awful lot of pressure even in a .25 barrel
Once again another great, informative video. 5 stars.
Thanks, that was one of the best and most accurate reviews I have seen. I agree with your assessment wholeheartedly.
Agreed,I usually pack my Jimenez ja22 small and dependable now that I worked it over.
I have a JA22. Good little gun. I carry it.
Used to Contenders hunting calibers & the proper scopes to them from 2x to 12x & with a 21A Beretta that has no usuable sights ,always ignored them & shot just like your doing,with favorable results. Another good video, Sir.
Back in the late 80s " I shot an attacker in the torso one time with a 25 cap and he fell over & ran for his life .to this day all I carry is a NAA 22MAG. And I am sure it's all I'll ever need. Great vids buddy!!!
no know your video is a long time ago. but I just got a seekamp today. I took it to the range immediately and it was stuffing bullets down the brass. I had the shop check it out and they are sending it back today. they offered me a new one which is darn nice. I'm just taking it back.
What you have with you at the time of an attack is the best weapon.
Menu years ago I was discussing the merits of the smaller rounds with a frendu he gave me a quote he had herd years ago from an American policeman of his aquantance. " I would rather be missed by a 45 than hit by a 22". That made a lot of sense to me.
very informative & well made vid i also like the mouse guns got an ol j-22 thanks for the heads up on the cci mini-mags. personally i was cleaning it after every 2 mags and it shot jacketed rounds fairly well with out failures
I'd like to get a b.u.g. I was thinking about a little pocket 22 because they say most fatal shootings are done with a 22 (well a rifle) but I like the techniques you showed I was looking around and seen this older video glad you're still doing the channel keep up the good work
You can now get Speer Gold Dots in 25 and 32, I would recommend those over the older hollow points.
Talk with people that work in the ER. The 22 Lr tends to enter the scull then bounces around in there.
But can a mouse use them?
Yes, in fact, some have been known to bring down cats.
Funny
I once had a shootout with a Mouse. Short answer... No!
Excellent video! While it's hard to talk about shots to the head of an assailant, when one is given no choice, it's nice to have a mouse gun.
Excellent review... :)
I just wanted to thank you for an excellent video.
My wife and I have several 9mm's, 38's, and a 357 however they are all too big to carry. We are looking for a very small gun ( like the Beretta) that can be slipped in the pocket or purse and not be cumbersome or noticeable
You video was very informative- especially regarding how to actually shoot them if placed in a life threatening situation.
Thanks Again..
Real good video & advice in using these weapons. Most just ignore mouse guns.
hey sootch, just had to say...i think you have an awesome radio voice, seriously. its great, and you do a great job with your vids...ok brother, thanks!
The gun is merely a tool.
I AM THE WEAPON!
Anyone who believes that any caliber is insufficient for self defense is actually stating that HE is less qualified and seeking to compensate with "bigger tools".
The purpose of self-defense is to make the guy stop what he's doing, not to drop him in his tracks. With that in mind, mouse guns work perfectly fine.
Up close and nasty...just like it would be. Nice demonstration. I enjoy all your information. Thank you sir.
Good video. I just want to bring up a much needed point about the .32 silvertip. It's called rimlock and it is real and is caused by short hollow point rounds. It's happened to me and when it does your magazine is completely useless until you clear the rimlock by taking the mag. apart. You can load 1 hp in the chamber and 1 on the top of your mag and the rest fmj.
Great techniques and advise... thanks
String four to five shots up from torso to head up the "lethal corridor". This is a proper self defense firing method for any caliber. This puts rounds on center mass first then up through the neck to the head. Criminals can be wearing body armor (getting class 3a armor is easy these days), so even a .44 Magnum won't stop that if you shoot just center mass.
Shot placement is the name of the game!
+John E. Perry Its the only thing that makes a difference 100% of the time.
enjoy your videos, just got a 950bs and this is perfect for training, thanx
The proposed target point is vital. Those .22 consider big bullet, blind to the eye and it stop breathing to the neck.
Great video ..but usually the bad guys mostly come 2 -4 ..need more and bigger rounds !!
thank you once again very informative my first firearm is a DAVIS 380 I still have it since 93 i no longer carry it but i would if i had too
Interesting you posted this as I am looking around for a smaller handgun to carry w/ me in camping, my CZ 82 is smaller but still too heavy for a back pack situation.
PS: I was up in Linville gorge this weekend, had a great hike but got soaked for about 40 minutes :)
I just recently purchased a Kel-tec p32. Hope it turns out great, havent shot it yet... nice mouse guns good sir. cool stuff.
I've got the Bobcat in .22LR and when I bought it I got a cheapo bulk box of .22LR, I think it was Remington. I was very disappointed at first, the gun wouldn't cycle this ammo. It would shoot a couple then jam. I found out later the ammo was bad. I switched to CCI stingers and haven't looked back, the gun works great with CCI stinger or mini mags. CCI makes great .22 ammo. As finicky as these little .22 autos are you need to have good ammo for them to work reliably
Another thought... at such close range the possibility of being in a grappling situation is high. It is worth considering that you may have to be fending off with your weak hand and practice single handed point shooting with the weapon tucked in close to the body and the strong side turned slightly behind.
I love my Jetfire. Being SA, it is super easy to put multiple rounds on target. I have no allusions re: the 25acp. I don't plan on a "one shot stop". My other CCW's are a compact 191145acp and a Ruger SP101 357.
In a way to think about shooting someone makes me sick, so when i think about what a pistol or other guns can be used for, it makes me in bad mood. Another thing is there is some pistols that are made so nicely, so just looking at them gives me a good feeling. I have the same feelings about very nicely made knives. The worst thing is that a very nice looking tool, can make so unbelievable much harm to anybody, including yourself.
I used to have a M1911, sold it to a family member who needed a nightstand gun. I bought a .38 snubby for replacement carry.
I'm sorry, but just the mere act of pulling a gun on someone of any size would be enough to stop most attacks. Also, I have seen what a .22 can do. Sure, it might not be the most lethal, but I guarantee that if you got hit ONCE you'd be begging not to get hit TWICE!lol. Also, the capacity of their ammo almost always seems to be larger. If I got hit once, my mind would be FIRMLY fixed on the fact these guns often have 7, 8, and 9 capacities.lol
johnlewisbrooks you have watched to many movies. Pulling a gun on some people DOES NOT stop attack. A man a pcp has no sense of fear or common sense.You must have been protected all your life .. believe me there is reality in this world..
Any gun is better than no gun, but once you've had a serious encounter with a violent criminal as I have had, you are going to want to do everything you can to stack the deck in your favor. That means carrying a bigger gun, that means making the sacrifices necessary to carry a bigger gun. My everyday carry is a Smith SD40VE with 15 rounds of Federal HST .40 S&W jacketed hollow-points in the gun (it's very Glock-like except for the trigger). At home I keep a low-end but reliable Bushmaster XM-15 with a red dot and a green laser (the laser switch is on the grip). A Mossberg 500 12-gauge with 00-buckshot is my emergency back-up...all three guns are at the ready beside me this very second. I've an alarm and security cameras, plus good doors with special bars to prevent them from being easily kicked in. The point here is to do everything you can to stack the deck in your favor--more is almost always better.
Excellent video
Here in Texas a no head shoot may be consider murder even if your intent is only to stop
The problem is that a head shoot is not consider stopping is consider killing
Please check you local laws just to make sure
Note I'm not a lawyer nor pretend to be one
Before posting I consulted with one of the experts in the industry and author of several well-known books and DVDs to get his opinion. He said the truth is that these calibers (.22 and .25) are notorious for skidding off human skulls or stopping in the frontal skull wall.
Excellent thank you Sooch!
As a fur trapper , I can guarantee a "ear shot" is a instant kill shot on just about everything.
Nice collection 5 Stars. I agree CCI makes the best 22L ammo. CCI 22L is hotter than Remington and Federal. It works better in semi auto guns.
Wow I love it the gun safe and self defence
CCI is the best brand of rimfire rounds on the market. IMO it goes like this
1. CCI
2. Federal
3. Remington
Thanks so much! I have a baby bauer and needed your info. Thanks
Good video! Thanks!
I got the Phoenix arms HP22A and love it
I own that gun and I love it. I might buy hp25 or look for a 32 acp pistol.
Actually with multiple bullet wounds the chance of fatality grows exponentially. Being shot twice means you are 4 times as likely to die. 4 shots are 16 times more likely to kill. Thats why buck shot is so effective. Its like getting hit with 16 .32 caliber bullets. Which is 256 times as likely to kill someone as being hit once with a .32.
even a smaller gun will give you a chance to get away....the shock of the hit may give you those precious seconds even if you can not hit a vital area.....i agree sootch ...........practice , practice , practice. your vids are awesome ...thank you
I'd carry a .25acp maybe if it had a 40 round magazine and was full-auto 1,200 rpm. Seriously though, informative video.
I suspect ammo developments in the 13 years since this video was made have changed some things. There are some pretty premium .32 ACP rounds out there now and I don’t just mean hollow point.
the first *pop* or gunshot an attacker hears, theyre going to run. no one is going to want to stick around for that.
I've only watched this video and a few of your "Why I Carry A Gun" videos so this might not be necessary, but I feel like an important edge was forsaken: practice, practice, PRACTICE! Granted, if you have a CCW you're probably familiar with firearms. But, the fact remains that not everyone who owns a gun has put in the range time to effectively wield their piece, especially with a smaller caliber. **If you've gotten this 500 times then by all means ignore this. Keep up the good work though!
I use to have a Jennings J22. I shot CCI Stingers out of it sometimes. In about 100 rounds my extractor would bend and then break off. I replaced the extractor and it did the same thing. Mine was the blued version. Have you ever had this problem with the J22 and the CCI Stingers?
This WILL stop an attacker because you will have it with you.
.... You make some really good points and I agree with you on most things but its stopping ability... Dude I have taken Roo's and pigs with a 22lr so I think their stopping power ability on people would be quite effective. Also take into account their fire capacity, some 22lr handguns can hold 15-20 rounds, heck I dont know some my even hold more. Rather than shooting them in the head 5 times with the 22 like you in your video id just go 5 times to the chest. Im quite sure it would work.
Great info, learned alot especially about that crumpled weaver stance. My qeuestion is about a particular chambering. I have a smith and wesson revolver chambered in 32 s&w long. What would you say is the best load for it? All I can ever find is either winchester LRN or Remington SN Im not really sure which one would be the best. Unfortanutley my wife has a hard time racking the slide of a semi, or I would get her a .380 and she is extremely recoil sensative. Thanks,
-woohog1
@ZombieMasterEd25 Exactly. I do want one of those NAA .22 mags though, better than nothing and a good backup to a backup.
Good stuff Sootch!
To this day I still don't know of a single person that is willing to take a 22LR to the chest to prove that it is NOT effective.
Man, you are great! You rank up there with nutnfancy and hickok45.
touche. However I still hold firm to the idea that simply the visual effect of a firearm is enough to halt most in their steps. You don't need to kill them, you just need to buy some time, and change their mind about what they are about to try.
Nice review....5 stars.
Nobody is gonna convince me any caliber isn’t going to stop an attacker.
in my oppinion an average person with basic or no gun training could more easily shoot an attacker four times in the chest with a 25 auto than with say a 9mm. less blast and recoil, just point and squeeze, squeeze, squeeze, squeeze.
Good stuff. Thanks!
Don, which of the two would you carry more out of a semi auto pistol; a .22 or .25? I may want to up it to a .32 (I really need a small compact gun I can keep on target while in tight work clothes) but am afraid of rim lock. Is this a real issue when carrying?
Much has changed since 2009 so there may be better .25 ACP ammo out there now. Best to check. A half box of Stingers blew off the extractor on my stainless Sterling Arms Model 302 22 LR. I replaced it with a blued extractor which was all I could find back in 1988. The Sterling was never designed for hyper velocity 22s, predating them. They may work fine in some mouse guns but beware they may also break parts such as the firing pin/ejector and extractor as well, leaving you with a paperweight in the middle of a gunfight.. No one has ever confirmed to me which 22 LR ammo is safe to use in a Sterling 22. A spreadsheet I put together using velocities and recoil energy using a 2 inch barrel shows even some high velocity loads could be dangerous. I used data from ammo brand websites as well as some using a chronograph and calculated where I had to. I compared about 25 or more common brands. There are a number of loads out there with more energy than the Stinger. The stinger has an energy of about 67 foot pounds out of a 2 inch barrel. Bullet grain weight makes a big difference. You can make your own spreadsheet. It is not difficult. The testing is what is difficult unless you own a barrel mounted chronograph. 22s sometime don't register on conventional models. I discovered ammo showing an estimated 80+ foot pounds of recoil energy. That can break parts and springs. The people posting on RUclips are not ballisticians but well meaning. I would like to see someone with expertise post a test of the common rounds one pistol at a time and shoot at least one box of each ammo. Keep the gun clean and well lubed and inspect parts after each ammo. I have an Iver Johnson eight shot Supershot Sealed Eight revolver made in 1934 and I am cautious about what 22 ammo I put thru it as well.
The strongly manufactured Ruger LCR revolver and LCP pistols would be a good place to start to gather data and then work from there. Not all 22 ammo is the same.
Good gouge, thanks! I'm still trying to decide which .380 to get....
i just came up with a fun name for the crumpled weaver stance; the T-rex stance.
These so call "mouse guns" are perfect(my opinion only)if you live in small units in apartment buildings in urban cities.
Any tricks to holding the NAA mini revolver? My first time shooting it the other day I hit the 6" target from 20 ft routinely but also the back edge of the cylinder cut my thumb when it jumped in hand. A day later it still hurts like a *&^% (I kept shooting for another 50 rounds until there was too much blood to hold it... I'd driven all the way to the range so wanted my money's worth lol)! Any tips on holding appreciated I love the workmanship of this tiny thing and its compact size but not the pain of shooting. (I normally shoot a .50 black powder pistol so I am ok with recoil but it's the tiny grip that gets me).
With these small calibre rounds, would it be wise in winter NOT to use hollow points? I am concerned a leather jacket might cause hollow points to open prematurely.
@sootch00 agreed. If deadly force is justified then where you shoot to stop him isn't the deciding factor. Stopping him is the only factor.
Hi sootch00 and thanks very much for the info and vision of being safe and making someone out of business. I am in a wheelchair so this requires a special and smart defense - sort of an attacking defense. I have the opportunity of buying my friends Beretta 950 but it's in .22 short. What do you think of this. Great shape - 3 mags. How much do you think it's worth and what about the .22 short round?? Thank You. Sincerely, JAMES.