NordVPN is offering an exclusive deal, risk-free with a 30-day money-back guarantee! nordvpn.com/mockrock | Thanks for watching everyone! A couple corrections: Fox's up smash is actually frame 8, not 7, my mistake. Also, I actually miscategorized Mewtwo on my Excel sheet for the ending segment of the video. This means that the count should be one more for Mewtwo's category. My B! *Patreon:* www.patreon.com/mockrock *Second channel:* ruclips.net/user/mockrocktalk *Twitter:* twitter.com/MrMockRock *Twitch:* www.twitch.tv/mockrocktwitch *Teespring:* teespring.com/stores/mockrock *TimeBolt affiliate link* (excellent software I use to speed up editing on my videos, use code "MOCKROCK" for a discount): mockrock--timebolt.thrivecart.com/order-page/
Min-Min actually has an input move that’s absolutely amazing and easily her best move. not a lot of people know about it, but it’s able to completely end the game right then and there. It goes: plus, up, A, right, A. I highly recommend that any and all Min-Min players use this move. Especially if you’re playing against me.
As a Min-Min player, I have to disagree. Her best input is "Home, X, A, Power" It's so powerful because it's the only move in the game that leads into a TG (Touch Grass)
This comment actually works as a true combo which connects into the one with the exact timestamps for every character where you can see Kazuya's segment is 19 seconds long.
Don’t forget that Steve’s block also allows him to reverse airials literally whenever he wants to, i.e. he can be facing forwards, and still do a bair forwards as well
The kazuya segment describes the entire reason why I think this character is hilarious and is why I pocket him alongside Ike electrics and the announcer is a god send
I love how he went for the same kind of extremely thorough approach as usual, but wasn’t afraid in this video to try out some more creative takes on certain characters. Going from the Pyra/Mythra breakdown where he discusses stage positioning and advantage state to “KAZUYA MISHIMA” over and over while showing clips of EWGF was hilarious, and this kind of thing is awesome to see
Hey Mock, I don’t know if you see these, but I genuinely want you to know that you’re the best RUclipsr on this entire platform at matching up background footage to what you’re saying. It’s honestly amazing how perfectly you pick out footage.
The film essayist MauLer also does a great job with this, combining using background footage to complement what's he's saying on screen, or finding footage that matches the mood of what he is saying.
I'm fine with content creators in Smash community making videos on similar topics, since they each have a unique sense of style, criteria and presentation. The more perspectives we have on Smash the better in my opinion. Yet another amazing and well thought out video from MockRock. I alway appreciate your analytical approach to these subjects, both for Smash and non Smash related videos.
If I may, as a Hero player... Side B is also a strong candidate. It gives him one of the best side b’s in the game that can be used in advantage, disadvantage, and neutral. It has giant hitboxes, does tons of damage, kills consistently, and is extremely difficult to punish directly. While Menu rightfully takes the spot, Side B should have some sort of shout out.
Yeah Zapple is almost without question his second best move, but I think the reason he didn't shout it out is because it's really not in serious contention for his best. Since, you know, Menu exists.
As a fellow hero player I would like to secondthis notion and add on that his best non magic attack is up air. It sets up wayore than it should, has generous knock back for a kick, and is a move that no one expects you to throw out even though landing up air is obscenely safe on shield.
11:30 i kinda love how you synced up the word 'busted' with the up smash landing. i assume its intentional cos ive noticed similar things in past videos. i always enjoy things like that to make the commentary and footage just a little bit more connected
As a Kazuya main I love the in depth look you took at the character and how there aren’t any moves that stun and go into every single kazuya combo. Thanks for taking the time with our character.
I'm really glad this took the character itself into account. I think it leads to a much better picture of what actually is good in Ultimate, as opposed to in some theoretical game.
Just gotta say, I've been loving these videos and have been using them as podcasts for the most part especially with your deep dives into multiple topics. I'm prefacing it with that because the AVGN cut-in (1:13:36) caught me so off guard I had to comment on it.
It's been a rough month for someone who mains Banjo with pocket Zelda and Simon, so hearing them positively talked about in literally _any_ capacity has filled me with enough joy to get through this week...
I absolutely love your comedic timing and and all the other skills that come together to allow a joke to be effective! The Kirby Discord joke at 2:40, the Pikachu Thunderjolt joke at 13:46, and much more were all hilarious! Thank you for the incredible video MockRock, keep up the great work!
Agreed that flying slam is Bowser’s best move. How do you make a notoriously low tier heavyweight good? You make them fast, and you give them a “the big turtle has decided you die now” move. Masterclass in character design
I agree that Bowser's design is one of the best if not the best super heavyweight design we've ever seen, but it routinely makes myself want to jump off of a cliff.
I know youtubers try not to step on each others toes with video ideas, but i personally love it. When i watch one video on an interesting topic like best moves, i would click on another one to see someone elses opinion easily. Plus, everyone's style is naturally different so it never feels like the same video.
Honestly, I was expecting the N-air minirant with the Pits even if it wasn't their best move. Just wouldn't feel the same without that. I also love the callback to the utter confusion you had to Kirby's D-Air being his worst move according to the Discord. Like, Down Air could be so much better but when was the last time you've ever seen a Kirby player go for Hammer Flip at any level.
For Bayo's best move, I'd probably give the edge to Up B over Side B, because she always gets two of those as opposed to having to hit someone to get a second one, like with side B. She also has the jump cancel tech that really extends how far up she can travel with each Witch Twist, along with keeping the double jump for a later use. Also, with Peach/Daisy's float being eligible, Bats Within deserves a mention, tho both specials are still much better than it.
Damn it, man. Arcfire isn't a zoning tool, it's a trapping move that works best when you already have the advantage. It's actually really flawed at walling people out, any decent Robin could tell you that, and the character doesn't need it to when Thunder and Elthunder exist. Coincidentally, Robin's neutral special as a whole is their actual best move. No hard feelings, just want to try and clear up some of the misinformation still going around about the character.
Fun fact: the hitbox on Byleth nair is actually a bit shorter than the entire bow length, as the tip of the bow doesn't have a hitbox. But like Pit nair, doesn't excuse the move's immense versatility.
Welcome back, Mock! I’m always happy to see your videos and I can see why this video took a while to come out. You continue to impress with your simple but detailed explanations and slick editing. I can imagine it takes forever to find good tournament footage and record clips yourself. It’s very much appreciated.
as a yoshi main, the egg kill on ryu while he uses focus in the top blastzone 8:58 is no longer possible after the focus change. now it doesnt hit twice so ryu/ken just would drop through it now. i miss the days of the janky egg multihit armor break kills...
1:43:30 Don’t know what I expected but I’m happy it was this lol. Obviously electric is miles away the choice for #1 but if there was a #2 what would that choice have been Mock? …Kazuya Mishima
Probably the actual crotch dash that lets you initiate EWGF, the movement, low profiling and mixups on it are just insane. If you can nominate peach’s float I think it’s a fair call.
@@l.t.c3847 I think this is the case also. The ability to cancel the crouch dash into basically whatever you want, another dash, defensive options, attacks etc. will be a beast to watch be further optimized too.
I love going more in depth into the mechanics of smash and it’s moves. Maybe a future video could be compiling an alternate moveset for a fighter using moves from characters already in the game. For example, giving mii brawler Mario up air and fox down tilt, using similar moves to buff characters
Pac man's "silly combos that a zoner should have no business pulling off" can often feel like the kind of death sentences that RoA's zoner's can put together
Ok so as one of the probably 20 people who ever labbed Mii Swordfighter i'm glad you picked up air over chakram and mentioned SSD as a runner-up. Dtilt and up air are about interchangeables imo, the former being a big part of mii Sword's neutral (It's a disjoint, f5 and -6 on shield + FAF 20 and combos although DI away in particular or simply spacing the move makes it stop comboing pretty early as you mentioned, due to an unusual 65° angle and Mii sword's poor initial dash) and the later being both a great disjoint, kill move and combo starter at a quite wide % range while keeping good frame data although the hitbox placement makes it hard to use it raw.
You know, if I had a nickel for every down air that MockRock has had a rough relationship with, I’d have two nickels, which isn’t a lot, but it’s weird that it happened twice, right?
The editing in the beginning and the seemingly effortless (with a lot of effort put into it lol) examples for what you're talking about at ALL TIMES is absolutely beautiful to watch and makes it impossible not to understand. Amazing video from start to finish, the only thing i could criticize is that you either forgot or didn't mention some amazing/character defining moves such as Pika/Pichu Quick Attack, Ness Back Throw, Falcon Up Smash, Sheik F-Tilt, Dr. Mario Up-Special, Marth/Lucina Up-Special, Roy N-air, Rob D-Tilt et cetera. However these aren't all clear options for the best move(s) so i can't blame you for not mentioning them (and also the video would probably be too long).
I believe that the reason that Kirby mains are so anti-dair is because every single kirby player has had to learn the hard way all of its limitations and remove the habit of using the move in a lot of situations. While dair in the right spot is killer, if you use dair in the wrong spot you are inviting a free punish. Even though dair can put in work in some combos and during edgeguards, when you have the rest of kirby's other tilts, aerials, and smashes... dair is almost never your best option.
What Dair does do is still really good, especially edgeguarding. Also, this cannot explain why some Kirby mains (apparently?) genuinely believe _Hammer Flip_ to be better than Dair.
One thing to point out that differentiates this list from the best of every move list, this is not in a vacuum, but rather just in the kit of the character.
Love these videos, and I especially enjoy your longer form content a lot. Your voice is very pleasant to listen to, and getting to hear the expanded context behind the analysis of whatever topic youre covering adds a lot
Bro why is your editing so damn good! All your videos look so flashy and awesome. Your clips are always perfect in context and everything seems so cool. Nice job man! Always glad to see you upload!!!!!
Okay, first of all, I absolutely loved the edit and style choice for Kazuya's best move and the fact that you literally didn't even need to say what it was, secondly, I'm sorry, I'm not going to lie, it did take me 2 months to be able to find the time to watch this nearly 2 hour video from start to finish in one block of time but it was so worth the watch, and massive massive kudos to you for taking your time to create such a well thought out video, I am hoping that it's not too greedy to say I'd love an honourable mentions video either here or on mockrock talk because I felt like so many characters had such close second picks that it's hard and that many characters deserved another move to at minimum be mentioned as well, anyway, love the content, your channel and videos are fantastic, keep up the amazing work!
I think Mii Swordfighter's power thrust down B (I forgot exactly what it's called) is his best move. Almost no matter what other moves you pick, this down B is going to be added. It's a great kill option and a great burst option with very little downsides
As a Swordfighter main I agree, but the reason why it gets picked pretty much boils down to the fact that the other 2 down b’s are a counter, and a reflector, very niche moves in any characters kit
I saw “Every Smash Character” instead of “Every Smash Ultimate Character” and thought you were literally gonna talk about every version of the characters from 64 to Ultimate
36:32 Tell me about it, I main pt and ivysaur drag down nair leads into literally nothing, and your opponent can always act way before you meaning that doing a drag down nair with ivysaur is a near guaranteed punish
My favorite thing about inhaling Gordo is that it sends the Gordo out really fast and at a much lower angle than throwing it out normally, and you can use it to catch people on the ledge or under the ledge in a pinch if you can't make it in time, which isn't unheard of given dedede's speed. Inhale is also safer than most people think, and the wind box is quite strong so it's decently safe on shields as well, no one can really act out of shield reliably if they are sitting in Inhale Also the most interesting thing about it being a reflector is that despite it being slower, it cannot break like other reflectors.
I’d say crouchdash is Kazuya’s best move since crouchdash is what lets him use EWGF, plus crouchdash allows him to have the strongest ground movement in the game
At 47:32 you chose Lucas' zair as his best move. Let me give some info on it. normal Zair if fresh is -2 with a perfect landing. Taken from lucascord. Moai - "Sweet DJCZ Max Shield Staling on Shield is [-5]. Sweet DJCZ Max Hurtbox Staling on Shield is [-6]. Sour DJCZ has the same Max Staling value for both Hurtbox and Shield Staling on Shield which is [-6]." I always thought max stale DJCZ was -5 always because of labbing it on shield, but I didn't know staleness had an annoying nuance to it with differing multipliers fir staleness on hurtboxes & shields. If I had to personally choose his best move, it would be ftilt or fair because of their simple & effective application at all levels of play, being these safe pressure & kill moves (fair combos at low %s as well).
ok i'm not trying to harp but the clip work you've done with the slow mo and the captions is SO good. i am barely a spectator-level smash consumer and that ike/pika clip just clicked perfectly, while being really funny.
I like that Mock didn't even need to say a word about Kazuya but I hate that EWGF is his best move because I can't freakin use it. Every time I try I either end up doing a standard WGF or the Dragon Uppercut. I know that's a "me" problem, with enough practice of course I could do it, but I just don't have the patience for that kind of thing. It's why I play Smash and not TFGs.
I feel Greninja Down tilt or neutral air are more efficient/safer over dash attack, but I can still see why it was chosen. Catching landings is a very useful skill in ultimate. Awesome video by the way! 🎉
Link's bomb is potentially the thing that pushes him up the tier list, but you take it away he is still an OK character. Take away his nair and replace it with something average and you've fundamentally gutted Link's viability. Or put it this way, no matter how good your bomb play is, your Link sucks if you don't use nair well.
NordVPN is offering an exclusive deal, risk-free with a 30-day money-back guarantee! nordvpn.com/mockrock | Thanks for watching everyone! A couple corrections: Fox's up smash is actually frame 8, not 7, my mistake. Also, I actually miscategorized Mewtwo on my Excel sheet for the ending segment of the video. This means that the count should be one more for Mewtwo's category. My B!
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fesgrsehre
Isn't min mins best move side b?
Min-Min actually has an input move that’s absolutely amazing and easily her best move. not a lot of people know about it, but it’s able to completely end the game right then and there. It goes: plus, up, A, right, A. I highly recommend that any and all Min-Min players use this move. Especially if you’re playing against me.
As a Min-Min player, I have to disagree. Her best input is "Home, X, A, Power"
It's so powerful because it's the only move in the game that leads into a TG (Touch Grass)
@@stormRed I see you have learned the secret variation of the LTG combo, bc he never goes outside lol
Tried it online and it didnt work :(
I heard this is also really good for Olimar. People should really get on this tech.
What an advanced technique! Why didn’t I think of this before?!
Mario 4:20
Donkey Kong 5:05
Link: 5:44
Dark/Samus: 7:27
Yoshi 8:28
Kirby 9:59
Fox 12:09
Pikachu 13:29
Luigi 14:19
Ness 15:09
Captain Falcon 16:16
Jigglypuff 16:55
Peach and Daisy 18:10
Bowser 19:50
Ice Climbers 21:18
Sheik 22:20
Zelda 23:02
Dr. Mario 24:16
Pichu 24:58
Falco 26:08
Marth and Lucina 27:14
Young Link 28:21
Ganondorf 29:28
Mewtwo 30:23
Roy and Chrom 31:32
Mr. Game and Watch 34:07
Meta Knight 35:22
(Dark) Pit 36:18
Zero Suit Samus 38:05
Wario 39:19
Snake 40:44
Ike 42:24
Pokémon Trainer 43:44
Squirtle 43:52
Ivysaur 44:35
Charizard 45:14
Diddy Kong 46:14
Lucas 47:32 47:32
Sonic 48:44
King Dedede 50:01
Olimar 51:21
Lucario 52:19
R.O.B. 53:13
Toon Link 54:47
Wolf 55:42
Villager 56:42
Mega Man 58:02
Wii Fit Trainer 58:42
Rosalina and Luma 1:00:13
Little Mac 1:01:37
Greninja 1:03:31
Mii Brawler 1:04:45
Mii Swordfighter 1:05:39
Mii Gunner 1:08:42
Palutena 1:09:21
PAC-MAN 1:10:59
Robin 1:12:09
Shulk 1:13:13
Bowser Jr. 1:15:00
Duck Hunt 1:16:10
Ryu and Ken 1:16:57
Cloud 1:18:46
Corrin 1:19:18
Bayonetta 1:20:32
Inkling 1:21:21
Ridley: 1:22:02
Simon and Richter 1:23:32
King K. Rool 1:24:46
Isabelle 1:25:36
Incineroar 1:26:49
Piranha Plant 1:28:24
Joker 1:29:36
Hero 1:30:37
Banjo and Kazooie 1:32:17
Terry 1:33:46
Byleth 1:35:32
Min Min 1:37:16
Steve 1:38:00
Sephiroth 1:39:31
Aegis/Pyra and Mythra 1:42:00
Kazuya 1:43:30
Sora 1:43:49
Hope this helps!
Legend
Beyond legendary comment bro
A true hero right here
Hero
Wow. This hero
Man, the way you went in depth with Kazuya's best move was so well-structured with every ounce of detail and data clearly and perfectly explained.
This comment actually works as a true combo which connects into the one with the exact timestamps for every character where you can see Kazuya's segment is 19 seconds long.
You made me click on the Kazuya section in anticipation of some super well put together analytical thought processes. I was not disappointed.
“So for starters it’s obviously not ewgf”
Don’t forget that Steve’s block also allows him to reverse airials literally whenever he wants to, i.e. he can be facing forwards, and still do a bair forwards as well
And phantom block cancels which can straight up cancel hitstun and punish people for hitting you.
The kazuya segment describes the entire reason why I think this character is hilarious and is why I pocket him alongside Ike
electrics and the announcer is a god send
Moment he came up I was expecting just Electrics, repeated over and over. But this was way better.
It's funny that he is also a menace in Tekken 7.
Kazuya players are that one guy who makes a funny joke but keeps telling it over and over. It's not funny anymore.
@@hunbi1875says you
@@hunbi1875They're not gonna sugarcoat it
I love how he went for the same kind of extremely thorough approach as usual, but wasn’t afraid in this video to try out some more creative takes on certain characters. Going from the Pyra/Mythra breakdown where he discusses stage positioning and advantage state to “KAZUYA MISHIMA” over and over while showing clips of EWGF was hilarious, and this kind of thing is awesome to see
As a Ptooie main, I'm surprised you didn't say Piranha Plant was its best move.
Lol
crying what
True
Get it because piranha plant is basically just ptooie
@@Emberererwho is this “what” person and why are they crying?
I thought this was a dark pit reference and got extremely confused
I appreciate the inclusion and the shoutout in your video! Was a really good video overall as well. Keep up the good work
Thank you for being the literal only person I could find actually pulling off a long nair loop chain in a real set LMAO
NOOPS
Hey Mock, I don’t know if you see these, but I genuinely want you to know that you’re the best RUclipsr on this entire platform at matching up background footage to what you’re saying. It’s honestly amazing how perfectly you pick out footage.
I do and I appreciate it! I'm not willing to sign off on "the best" but it is something that I spend an (unpleasant) amount of time on, thanks
The film essayist MauLer also does a great job with this, combining using background footage to complement what's he's saying on screen, or finding footage that matches the mood of what he is saying.
Agreed
I posted this on the wrong comment sorry, but I do agree
1:32 bro just casually made one of the nicest transitions
I'm fine with content creators in Smash community making videos on similar topics, since they each have a unique sense of style, criteria and presentation. The more perspectives we have on Smash the better in my opinion. Yet another amazing and well thought out video from MockRock. I alway appreciate your analytical approach to these subjects, both for Smash and non Smash related videos.
Yeah I love those deeply pondered perspectives. Not just done and gone style of videos.
I love it too, problem is they could steal some of eachothers views. A lot of people won't watch 2 videos on the sane topic.
We need a 10 hour loop of *Kazuya Mishima*
Babe wake up new MockRock video just dropped
lets gooo
You've nicked Poppt1's profile pick.
I thought you were poppt1 for a second lol
Yes honey… ;-;
on the comment preview on mobile, it only shows the pfp of the top comment (that’s not made by the original creator)
Clicked this video thinking it was 14 minutes only to realize it is a 1 hour 45 minute video and I am even more excited to watch now
If I may, as a Hero player...
Side B is also a strong candidate. It gives him one of the best side b’s in the game that can be used in advantage, disadvantage, and neutral. It has giant hitboxes, does tons of damage, kills consistently, and is extremely difficult to punish directly.
While Menu rightfully takes the spot, Side B should have some sort of shout out.
Neutral b is also a heavily underrated move.
@@waffleman8053 true, but I feel that side b is a much more consistent move, even if neutral b can nuke stocks easily.
excuse me how do you use side b in disatvantage
Yeah Zapple is almost without question his second best move, but I think the reason he didn't shout it out is because it's really not in serious contention for his best. Since, you know, Menu exists.
As a fellow hero player I would like to secondthis notion and add on that his best non magic attack is up air. It sets up wayore than it should, has generous knock back for a kick, and is a move that no one expects you to throw out even though landing up air is obscenely safe on shield.
58:58 loving that transition haha. I know it’s just a split second in this almost two-hour video, but I see your efforts and appreciate you, editor :)
11:30 i kinda love how you synced up the word 'busted' with the up smash landing. i assume its intentional cos ive noticed similar things in past videos. i always enjoy things like that to make the commentary and footage just a little bit more connected
As a Kazuya main I love the in depth look you took at the character and how there aren’t any moves that stun and go into every single kazuya combo. Thanks for taking the time with our character.
I'm really glad this took the character itself into account. I think it leads to a much better picture of what actually is good in Ultimate, as opposed to in some theoretical game.
Just gotta say, I've been loving these videos and have been using them as podcasts for the most part especially with your deep dives into multiple topics.
I'm prefacing it with that because the AVGN cut-in (1:13:36) caught me so off guard I had to comment on it.
It's been a rough month for someone who mains Banjo with pocket Zelda and Simon, so hearing them positively talked about in literally _any_ capacity has filled me with enough joy to get through this week...
Especially with Simon. I consider the Belmonts to be one of my better characters.
I absolutely love your comedic timing and and all the other skills that come together to allow a joke to be effective! The Kirby Discord joke at 2:40, the Pikachu Thunderjolt joke at 13:46, and much more were all hilarious! Thank you for the incredible video MockRock, keep up the great work!
Kazuya Mishima Kazuya Mishima Kazuya Mishima Kazuya Mishima Kazuya Mishima Kazuya Mishima Kazuya Mishima Kazuya Mishima
KAZUYA MISHIMA! KAZUYA MISHIMA! KAZUYA MISHIMA! KAZUYA MISHIMA! KAZUYA MISHIMA! KAZUYA MISHIMA! KAZUYA MISHIMA!
Kazuya Mishima Kazuya Mishima Kazuya Mishima Kazuya Mishima Kazuya Mishima Kazuya Mishima Kazuya Mishima
Also that "were going to cheat" joke is also a great joke
@@MrBendy420 yeah that’s cool and all, but saying Kazuya Mishima 50 times in a row is pretty funny too lmaoo (but I agree, that joke is funny as well)
Is this video 105 minutes long?
Yes.
Am I going to watch all of it?
*Yes*
Agreed that flying slam is Bowser’s best move. How do you make a notoriously low tier heavyweight good? You make them fast, and you give them a “the big turtle has decided you die now” move. Masterclass in character design
I agree that Bowser's design is one of the best if not the best super heavyweight design we've ever seen, but it routinely makes myself want to jump off of a cliff.
@@kaiwong-fv5ib I can help with that, just sit in shield for one more second…
Honestly though Bowser isn't that good anymore
Way too simple of a character and as the game has gone on the character has just fell down
@@Mattroid99 he's the fifth most used character of 2022 competitively...
@@kaiwong-fv5ib According to what data? Also being popular =/= being good
I know youtubers try not to step on each others toes with video ideas, but i personally love it. When i watch one video on an interesting topic like best moves, i would click on another one to see someone elses opinion easily. Plus, everyone's style is naturally different so it never feels like the same video.
i was wondering how you would handle Kazuya.
i would say you handled it correctly, good stuff
The EWGF is always broken, regardless of game, era, crossover, whatever. Do not let kazuya mishima uppercut you.
I always love the way you analyze these things, I bet you could make any ranking super interesting.
He could make a ranking of each frame of Sora f-smash and it would be interesting
1:28:46 “Pleases the plant even more”
This is one of the greatest RUclipsr quotes ever. I don’t know why but it’s amazing.
K A Z U YA M I S H I M A
Honestly, I was expecting the N-air minirant with the Pits even if it wasn't their best move. Just wouldn't feel the same without that. I also love the callback to the utter confusion you had to Kirby's D-Air being his worst move according to the Discord. Like, Down Air could be so much better but when was the last time you've ever seen a Kirby player go for Hammer Flip at any level.
For Bayo's best move, I'd probably give the edge to Up B over Side B, because she always gets two of those as opposed to having to hit someone to get a second one, like with side B. She also has the jump cancel tech that really extends how far up she can travel with each Witch Twist, along with keeping the double jump for a later use.
Also, with Peach/Daisy's float being eligible, Bats Within deserves a mention, tho both specials are still much better than it.
I love how you don’t even need to say Kazuya’s best move.
The shulk section containing "That's right we're gonna cheat" is just about the most accurate thing I've seen on this channel
Timestamp is 1:13:37
Damn it, man. Arcfire isn't a zoning tool, it's a trapping move that works best when you already have the advantage. It's actually really flawed at walling people out, any decent Robin could tell you that, and the character doesn't need it to when Thunder and Elthunder exist.
Coincidentally, Robin's neutral special as a whole is their actual best move.
No hard feelings, just want to try and clear up some of the misinformation still going around about the character.
11:16 and Kirby can turn around in the air, so he can use Fair Willy-nilly
1:02 "I don't feel so good, Mr. Louis..."
1:26:49 "Can go on some strong tournament runs" indeed
That transition from jigglypuff rest to Pjiggles' icon was so slick
Fun fact: the hitbox on Byleth nair is actually a bit shorter than the entire bow length, as the tip of the bow doesn't have a hitbox. But like Pit nair, doesn't excuse the move's immense versatility.
Welcome back, Mock! I’m always happy to see your videos and I can see why this video took a while to come out. You continue to impress with your simple but detailed explanations and slick editing. I can imagine it takes forever to find good tournament footage and record clips yourself. It’s very much appreciated.
as a yoshi main, the egg kill on ryu while he uses focus in the top blastzone
8:58
is no longer possible after the focus change. now it doesnt hit twice so ryu/ken just would drop through it now.
i miss the days of the janky egg multihit armor break kills...
Kazuya does indeed have a very good taunt attack
1:43:30
Don’t know what I expected but I’m happy it was this lol.
Obviously electric is miles away the choice for #1 but if there was a #2 what would that choice have been Mock?
…Kazuya Mishima
Probably the actual crotch dash that lets you initiate EWGF, the movement, low profiling and mixups on it are just insane. If you can nominate peach’s float I think it’s a fair call.
@@l.t.c3847 I think this is the case also. The ability to cancel the crouch dash into basically whatever you want, another dash, defensive options, attacks etc. will be a beast to watch be further optimized too.
Anyone wanna talk about how clean this was? 58:57
1:35 omg that transition 😩
I love going more in depth into the mechanics of smash and it’s moves. Maybe a future video could be compiling an alternate moveset for a fighter using moves from characters already in the game. For example, giving mii brawler Mario up air and fox down tilt, using similar moves to buff characters
46:05 "relatively tame sour spot"
Look, all I'm saying is that if Ganon had EWGF he'd be fixed as a character
1:43:33 That Kazuya Mishima montage was way funnier than it had any right to be.
Pac man's "silly combos that a zoner should have no business pulling off" can often feel like the kind of death sentences that RoA's zoner's can put together
Phenomenal video. The slow motion clips being interpolated make my eyes turn to mush though
Fully expected something like that for kazuya and still laughing like crazy lmao. Great work
Ok so as one of the probably 20 people who ever labbed Mii Swordfighter i'm glad you picked up air over chakram and mentioned SSD as a runner-up. Dtilt and up air are about interchangeables imo, the former being a big part of mii Sword's neutral (It's a disjoint, f5 and -6 on shield + FAF 20 and combos although DI away in particular or simply spacing the move makes it stop comboing pretty early as you mentioned, due to an unusual 65° angle and Mii sword's poor initial dash) and the later being both a great disjoint, kill move and combo starter at a quite wide % range while keeping good frame data although the hitbox placement makes it hard to use it raw.
Yo fellow Swordfighter main :)
You know, if I had a nickel for every down air that MockRock has had a rough relationship with, I’d have two nickels, which isn’t a lot, but it’s weird that it happened twice, right?
The editing in the beginning and the seemingly effortless (with a lot of effort put into it lol) examples for what you're talking about at ALL TIMES is absolutely beautiful to watch and makes it impossible not to understand. Amazing video from start to finish, the only thing i could criticize is that you either forgot or didn't mention some amazing/character defining moves such as Pika/Pichu Quick Attack, Ness Back Throw, Falcon Up Smash, Sheik F-Tilt, Dr. Mario Up-Special, Marth/Lucina Up-Special, Roy N-air, Rob D-Tilt et cetera. However these aren't all clear options for the best move(s) so i can't blame you for not mentioning them (and also the video would probably be too long).
I believe that the reason that Kirby mains are so anti-dair is because every single kirby player has had to learn the hard way all of its limitations and remove the habit of using the move in a lot of situations. While dair in the right spot is killer, if you use dair in the wrong spot you are inviting a free punish. Even though dair can put in work in some combos and during edgeguards, when you have the rest of kirby's other tilts, aerials, and smashes... dair is almost never your best option.
What Dair does do is still really good, especially edgeguarding. Also, this cannot explain why some Kirby mains (apparently?) genuinely believe _Hammer Flip_ to be better than Dair.
@@Alg3br4 Hammer Flip isn't real. It's all a conspiracy.
One thing to point out that differentiates this list from the best of every move list, this is not in a vacuum, but rather just in the kit of the character.
Love these videos, and I especially enjoy your longer form content a lot. Your voice is very pleasant to listen to, and getting to hear the expanded context behind the analysis of whatever topic youre covering adds a lot
Acr: Missed opportunity to say "I'm not gonna Sugar Coat It-" for Kazuya.
Oooookay now the question is do I continue my series after seeing this or do I just move on with my life LOL. I can't match something like this 😂
I wanna see it!
Both of you probably have highly differing opinions it's worth a shot
I found you specifically because of your video. I definitely want you to continue.
Sponsored segments are much scarier than cybersecurity threats MockRock
_That Kazuya segment is the funniest thing I've seen all month, oh my God~_
41:59 also snake’s grenades have high priority for no justifiable reason so they can just bodyblock certain characters projectiles.
Bro why is your editing so damn good! All your videos look so flashy and awesome. Your clips are always perfect in context and everything seems so cool. Nice job man! Always glad to see you upload!!!!!
Okay, first of all, I absolutely loved the edit and style choice for Kazuya's best move and the fact that you literally didn't even need to say what it was, secondly, I'm sorry, I'm not going to lie, it did take me 2 months to be able to find the time to watch this nearly 2 hour video from start to finish in one block of time but it was so worth the watch, and massive massive kudos to you for taking your time to create such a well thought out video, I am hoping that it's not too greedy to say I'd love an honourable mentions video either here or on mockrock talk because I felt like so many characters had such close second picks that it's hard and that many characters deserved another move to at minimum be mentioned as well, anyway, love the content, your channel and videos are fantastic, keep up the amazing work!
I love this type of content because I enjoy trying to guess what each move will be!
“Both of them are pretty much equally annoying, and at the end of the day, that’s their ultimate purpose. While we’re on annoying things, Megaman-“
I think Mii Swordfighter's power thrust down B (I forgot exactly what it's called) is his best move. Almost no matter what other moves you pick, this down B is going to be added. It's a great kill option and a great burst option with very little downsides
As a Swordfighter main I agree, but the reason why it gets picked pretty much boils down to the fact that the other 2 down b’s are a counter, and a reflector, very niche moves in any characters kit
1:28 love this transition
The more I think about it, the more I realize that ultimate's Magnet and melee's Shine are strangely similar.
"KAZUYA MISHIMA KAZUYA MISHIMA KAZUYA MISHIMA" I'm dying
Bruh I was just rewatching your reaction to PJiggles' video on the opposite subject lmao
You can ask Poppt1 about how good PSI Magnet is. He killed an amiibo and a half in a tag battle just using PSI Magnet to drag them across the stage.
It's sad that Steve won't be allowed competitively, but he's still in our heart.
26:47 - That’s me!!!
It’s so cool that my tournament footage had made its way into a video like this
Im now realizing that professional gaming requires a PHD in math and psychology
15:13 YOU DID NOT PUT HINAWA AS THE GHOST-
I saw “Every Smash Character” instead of “Every Smash Ultimate Character” and thought you were literally gonna talk about every version of the characters from 64 to Ultimate
37:56 FYI this happened because an aerial footstool grants invincibility in Ultimate. Otherwise I think it would’ve hit.
56:31, you can practically hear him sigh here
36:32 Tell me about it, I main pt and ivysaur drag down nair leads into literally nothing, and your opponent can always act way before you meaning that doing a drag down nair with ivysaur is a near guaranteed punish
I find it funny how Steve’s block is arguably at its best when not placing one, just because it straight up breaks the character.
1:22:31 Oddly enough, Ridley's forward tilt is wonderful, but Fsmash, as short range as it is, will two frame as well.
My favorite thing about inhaling Gordo is that it sends the Gordo out really fast and at a much lower angle than throwing it out normally, and you can use it to catch people on the ledge or under the ledge in a pinch if you can't make it in time, which isn't unheard of given dedede's speed. Inhale is also safer than most people think, and the wind box is quite strong so it's decently safe on shields as well, no one can really act out of shield reliably if they are sitting in Inhale Also the most interesting thing about it being a reflector is that despite it being slower, it cannot break like other reflectors.
I don’t think the Kirby discord will ever let that moment down
Finally, CYBERSECURITY THREATS carries on the spirit of KIRBY, METEOR OF DEATH
"what happened to him"
"He said rob nair was better than bair..."
It is. It’s not close
I’d say crouchdash is Kazuya’s best move since crouchdash is what lets him use EWGF, plus crouchdash allows him to have the strongest ground movement in the game
1:43:30
KAZUYA MISHIMA
That Jigglypuff Down Air transition has to be one of my favorite edits I've ever seen.
At 47:32 you chose Lucas' zair as his best move. Let me give some info on it. normal Zair if fresh is -2 with a perfect landing. Taken from lucascord. Moai - "Sweet DJCZ Max Shield Staling on Shield is [-5]. Sweet DJCZ Max Hurtbox Staling on Shield is [-6]. Sour DJCZ has the same Max Staling value for both Hurtbox and Shield Staling on Shield which is [-6]."
I always thought max stale DJCZ was -5 always because of labbing it on shield, but I didn't know staleness had an annoying nuance to it with differing multipliers fir staleness on hurtboxes & shields.
If I had to personally choose his best move, it would be ftilt or fair because of their simple & effective application at all levels of play, being these safe pressure & kill moves (fair combos at low %s as well).
Go off :)
Fair and ftilt are my picks
Such a small detail but I love how the side in which Kazuya is preforming the EWGF is tied to the music lol
ok i'm not trying to harp but the clip work you've done with the slow mo and the captions is SO good. i am barely a spectator-level smash consumer and that ike/pika clip just clicked perfectly, while being really funny.
I predict that kirby's down air being considered worse than hammer flip by discord is gonna be the new pit nair
The fact that jigglepuff didn't even get an honourable mention of Rest for best move is a warcrime
I like that Mock didn't even need to say a word about Kazuya but I hate that EWGF is his best move because I can't freakin use it. Every time I try I either end up doing a standard WGF or the Dragon Uppercut. I know that's a "me" problem, with enough practice of course I could do it, but I just don't have the patience for that kind of thing. It's why I play Smash and not TFGs.
How did I know that Peanut would be the one who you got most of the Little Mac footage for
I feel Greninja Down tilt or neutral air are more efficient/safer over dash attack, but I can still see why it was chosen. Catching landings is a very useful skill in ultimate.
Awesome video by the way! 🎉
Link's bomb is potentially the thing that pushes him up the tier list, but you take it away he is still an OK character. Take away his nair and replace it with something average and you've fundamentally gutted Link's viability.
Or put it this way, no matter how good your bomb play is, your Link sucks if you don't use nair well.