I hope that this engine that is being developed will serve as a base to create improved versions of Virtua Fighter and Virtua Racing that look more like the arcade versions that came out for the Sega Model 1 board.
You really believe that game programming is simple? Lmao you sound so clueless thinking that these fan devs are anywhere near the programming skills of Sega's elite Japanese in house dev teams.
Daytona USA was rushed under pressure from Sega of America's 90s management... Sega of America's 90s management created the 32X and prioritized that and shifted most Sega game development to the 32X which failed because we the gamers were not stupid kids back then... we wanted true next gen power and would have gotten the Sega Saturn but Sega of America did many things to insult us so most went to Sony PlayStation. Some racing games on Sega Saturn showed long range draw distance... especially some racing games made by 1997 that stayed in Japan... also Daytona USA CCE was rushed by SoA pressure as in they kept requesting certain games be ready for certain holiday season... same with Sega Rally in late 1995, same with Sega Touring Car Championship, further it was SoA management who handed Virtua Racing for Saturn to be done by Time Warner Interactive which became a crap port.
Most Saturn games, as well as this demo, don't horizontally scroll the vdp2 layer at the correct rate. It's too slow. The backdround and foreground element become disjointed. The 3d illusion breaks down. It's especially evident in panzer dragoon 2. Is there a reason this is so common?
Looks really cool. Whatever you do with the engine is going to be awesome. My crazy retarded dream would be a Devil May Cry type of game with only the Bloody palace mode with combat and challenges to keep things simple and arcadey. But whatever comes and is new is already outstanding. I'm not a programmer anyways.
I was wondering lately? Is using the same technique than into Tobal serie for rendering (gouraud shading replacing texture for ton of surface) would allow to port VF3 to Saturn ?
You're obviously very well aware of XL2's work. When it is feasible, I'd be very interested in you adding his technique for environment mapping to your toolkit. As a reminder: 1. ruclips.net/video/IRDho_yvT9E/видео.html 2. ruclips.net/video/TjSNdY20Sh8/видео.html 3. ruclips.net/video/Zs3l5SDlIJ8/видео.html If that technique uses too many resources that you're trying to use for other effects, I understand, but I've been very happy with your efforts so far and if you start putting fighting game models and race car models in front of me, the question immediately arises of whether we can see them rendered glossy. In any case, nice (back)ground planes in this demo. 🟦☁️
@@Frogbull55I'm sure we're thinking the same thing... "FIGHTING POLYGON TEAM!!!" (Just kidding... sort of... 😅) Seriously, though, I cannot say the number of times that I saw people beg him to create a demo with the Dural model. I always enjoyed the silver and gold codes on Soul Calibur too. I understand that the Dreamcast models are a bit high-poly for the Saturn (although wasn't the arcade original running on [slightly modified] PS1 hardware? 🤔).
Namco System 12 (a little more powerful than the PlayStation) for the Arcade versions of Soul Calibur and Tekken Tag Tournament but Namco remade all the models for the Dreamcast and PS2 ports (with way more polygons)
@Frogbull55 Soul Calibur dreamcast character model are pretty low for the Hardware (between 3000 and 4000). but watching your demo, I was thinking, it could be possible to port VF3 or Soulcalibur using the same art direction than Tobal 2 (most of the character model have no texture and it's lighting and gouraud Shading who make everything). using mostly untextured model could allow to increase polycount on screen. A gameplay arcade perfect of Daytona USA with high poly car and good FPS using Virtua Racing engine would be great too
@@Frogbull55 Sys12 is rated 50% more polygon than Sys11 (Psx based arcade board), hence 3d Tekken background in arcade, while 2d background are present in home psx conversion (characters T3 too have lower polygon in home conversion compared to arcade Sys12 counterpart).
I was thinking the music at the start when you show the fighting game fits perfectly with a mid to late 90s 3d fighter but then you showed the car from daytona USA with the theme song in the background so i'm guessing the 1st piece of music and gold coloured characters are from an officially released video game too and not assets you made yourself ?
The Music and the 3D Fighters are from a famous 90's Fighting Game but the Daytona Hornet Model is a frankenstein model I made (I don't know how to rip the real 3D model from Model 2 or Saturn)
Generally not enough VDP1 fillrate (probably 1/3 compared to PSX)...there is one game (Zero Devide) which have (partial) 3d background AND 3d fighters AND 60 fps (in HI-res mode too), clever programming done by capable developers. Also, VDP2 can be very useful when properly used (see Last Bronx conversion for example). I think Tekken 1 and 2 (T3 is a different beast) could be properly converted to SS using VDP2 for scrolling background, as correctly displayed in this Frogbull video.
@germantorre1422 I don't think it's a Saturn exclusive problem, the PSX also had difficult with this. The thing is, they weren't powerful enough to render enough polygons for both fighters + background scenarios... They had to choose, so in order to have two decent enough 3D characters on screen, they had to rely on 2D backgrounds.
@@Wartogh mmh, it's a strange case: while T1&2 are flat 2d background, T3 Psx background is a 2d image rendered on a cubic enviroment. The "problem" with T3 is the high poly count of the characters ( I read somewhere 1500 total per frame) all animated at 60 fps (thats 90000 texture mapped poly/s, something SS hasn't nearly achived in any commercial game, also probably due to limited VDP1 fillrate compared to Psx "gpu")
![Crash Bandicoot on Sega Saturn [REAL HARDWARE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/KHSZq-NTpwk/mqdefault.jpg)
I hope that this engine that is being developed will serve as a base to create improved versions of Virtua Fighter and Virtua Racing that look more like the arcade versions that came out for the Sega Model 1 board.
Please import any Virtua Fighter 3 models only to allow us to see a glimpsy of the legendary "cancelled" game of all time
You really believe that game programming is simple? Lmao you sound so clueless thinking that these fan devs are anywhere near the programming skills of Sega's elite Japanese in house dev teams.
That's really awesome to see! Best of luck to you!
You want to know more? Visit my Patreon!
www.patreon.com/Frogbull 👍
These are fantastic!!
Now people can finally shut up about SAT Daytona pop up.
Daytona USA was rushed under pressure from Sega of America's 90s management... Sega of America's 90s management created the 32X and prioritized that and shifted most Sega game development to the 32X which failed because we the gamers were not stupid kids back then... we wanted true next gen power and would have gotten the Sega Saturn but Sega of America did many things to insult us so most went to Sony PlayStation.
Some racing games on Sega Saturn showed long range draw distance... especially some racing games made by 1997 that stayed in Japan... also Daytona USA CCE was rushed by SoA pressure as in they kept requesting certain games be ready for certain holiday season... same with Sega Rally in late 1995, same with Sega Touring Car Championship, further it was SoA management who handed Virtua Racing for Saturn to be done by Time Warner Interactive which became a crap port.
Silky smooth!
Most Saturn games, as well as this demo, don't horizontally scroll the vdp2 layer at the correct rate.
It's too slow. The backdround and foreground element become disjointed. The 3d illusion breaks down. It's especially evident in panzer dragoon 2.
Is there a reason this is so common?
Looks really cool. Whatever you do with the engine is going to be awesome. My crazy retarded dream would be a Devil May Cry type of game with only the Bloody palace mode with combat and challenges to keep things simple and arcadey. But whatever comes and is new is already outstanding. I'm not a programmer anyways.
Devil may cry with 2d background on Saturn could be possible. Vampire hunter D on PSX is something like that
You can finally port Tekken Tag from arcades.😍
I was wondering lately? Is using the same technique than into Tobal serie for rendering (gouraud shading replacing texture for ton of surface) would allow to port VF3 to Saturn ?
You're obviously very well aware of XL2's work.
When it is feasible, I'd be very interested in you adding his technique for environment mapping to your toolkit.
As a reminder:
1. ruclips.net/video/IRDho_yvT9E/видео.html
2. ruclips.net/video/TjSNdY20Sh8/видео.html
3. ruclips.net/video/Zs3l5SDlIJ8/видео.html
If that technique uses too many resources that you're trying to use for other effects, I understand, but I've been very happy with your efforts so far and if you start putting fighting game models and race car models in front of me, the question immediately arises of whether we can see them rendered glossy.
In any case, nice (back)ground planes in this demo. 🟦☁️
XL2's glossy FX on a 3D fighter? I think it's possible ;)
@@Frogbull55I'm sure we're thinking the same thing...
"FIGHTING POLYGON TEAM!!!" (Just kidding... sort of... 😅)
Seriously, though, I cannot say the number of times that I saw people beg him to create a demo with the Dural model.
I always enjoyed the silver and gold codes on Soul Calibur too. I understand that the Dreamcast models are a bit high-poly for the Saturn (although wasn't the arcade original running on [slightly modified] PS1 hardware? 🤔).
Namco System 12 (a little more powerful than the PlayStation) for the Arcade versions of Soul Calibur and Tekken Tag Tournament but Namco remade all the models for the Dreamcast and PS2 ports (with way more polygons)
@Frogbull55 Soul Calibur dreamcast character model are pretty low for the Hardware (between 3000 and 4000). but watching your demo, I was thinking, it could be possible to port VF3 or Soulcalibur using the same art direction than Tobal 2 (most of the character model have no texture and it's lighting and gouraud Shading who make everything). using mostly untextured model could allow to increase polycount on screen. A gameplay arcade perfect of Daytona USA with high poly car and good FPS using Virtua Racing engine would be great too
@@Frogbull55 Sys12 is rated 50% more polygon than Sys11 (Psx based arcade board), hence 3d Tekken background in arcade, while 2d background are present in home psx conversion (characters T3 too have lower polygon in home conversion compared to arcade Sys12 counterpart).
😳
I was thinking the music at the start when you show the fighting game fits perfectly with a mid to late 90s 3d fighter but then you showed the car from daytona USA with the theme song in the background so i'm guessing the 1st piece of music and gold coloured characters are from an officially released video game too and not assets you made yourself ?
The Music and the 3D Fighters are from a famous 90's Fighting Game but the Daytona Hornet Model is a frankenstein model I made (I don't know how to rip the real 3D model from Model 2 or Saturn)
@@Frogbull55 I was about to say that the music in the fighting example is from Ranma 1/2 . Kind of has that style haha
Cheers
@@thesteammachine1282It's Wangs arranged them on Tekken 2
What fighting game would I like on Sega Saturn like Tekken or Soul Edge Xt Frogbull: Xd
Podasta Your New Logo Is Me Piola
Tobal 2 would be the best for me
@chevalierkraken
Tobal No.2 Your Favorite Game The one I want is Star Gladiator Greetings Xd
What is the problem with Saturn and 3d backgrounds in fighting games???
Generally not enough VDP1 fillrate (probably 1/3 compared to PSX)...there is one game (Zero Devide) which have (partial) 3d background AND 3d fighters AND 60 fps (in HI-res mode too), clever programming done by capable developers. Also, VDP2 can be very useful when properly used (see Last Bronx conversion for example). I think Tekken 1 and 2 (T3 is a different beast) could be properly converted to SS using VDP2 for scrolling background, as correctly displayed in this Frogbull video.
@@slashrose3287 But the PSX port of Tekken 3 also has 2D background.
@germantorre1422 I don't think it's a Saturn exclusive problem, the PSX also had difficult with this. The thing is, they weren't powerful enough to render enough polygons for both fighters + background scenarios... They had to choose, so in order to have two decent enough 3D characters on screen, they had to rely on 2D backgrounds.
@@Wartogh mmh, it's a strange case: while T1&2 are flat 2d background, T3 Psx background is a 2d image rendered on a cubic enviroment. The "problem" with T3 is the high poly count of the characters ( I read somewhere 1500 total per frame) all animated at 60 fps (thats 90000 texture mapped poly/s, something SS hasn't nearly achived in any commercial game, also probably due to limited VDP1 fillrate compared to Psx "gpu")