So much happening when Dr. Honda glides into trying to healing K's youth trauma. It seems lovingly done, but K's role get turned from professional to client during a live streaming, K's seems to be sucked into emotions, but quickly switches to analyze and reflect on it, and directs the conversation away from him feeling his feelings. It reminds me of how complex working with very personal emotions and trauma can be. Especially as host in a live public event. Talking about personal examples can be totally different then personally reliving them.
As someone who has AvPD, one of the hardest things was when I was shamed for being avoidant. So I was being shamed for the very thing that helped keep me from feeling shame. Which further reinforced the shame. Its a sad cycle. To anyone struggling, there is hope I promise!
I started with a new therapist recently and he is doing this exact thing. I'm seeing a new therapist tomorrow. I can't work with someone who makes me feel like I have my whole life. Thanks for your comment.
@@JanetSmith900I’m sorry to hear that. Hopefully you’re new therapist is more supportive. I’m grateful that my therapist pushes me to take risks and work on my avoidance while also validating my internal desire to avoid.
@@JanetSmith900oh man, some therapists are just… not helpful. To say the least. But when you find a correct one - it’s honestly amazing. Though still hard journey of course. Good luck!
1:06:48 - 1:09:12 so wholesome seeing Dr. Honda react to Dr. K being bullied as a child 🥲 it was sweet & refreshing to see Dr. K on the receiving end of this type of conversation!
To be quite honest, this section made me quite uncomfortable. Dr. K had the right answer and the right mindset - he overcame his anger and hatred, and doesn't want to be all like 'Look at me now', I don't think he would use his title and successes to show off if he did come across them. No, instead he no longer harbours ill will to those who wronged him in the past. Vengeful thoughts to past transgressions isn't the way to overcome them.
Literally me and how my life looked like. Neglectful parents, I got bullied at school for 6 painful years of elementary school, at home I was kinda just left to do whatever I wanted and noone really bothered to ask me how I was doing, and I didn't feel comfortable telling anyone about it of my own accord. Then for years I've felt like I was somehow just not really a normal human that could be genuinely liked, cared about, I've felt like anything I was into was somehow wrong, something to be ashamed of, I've always felt around other like I was just weird, awkward, different, not really human; like others were these real human who had feelings, needs, wants and they mattered and were normal, meanwhile I was just some sort of creature that existed next to them, looked like them, but really wasn't like them at all, didn't deserve anything whatsoever from them, couldn't really be on the same level as them.
I feel you man you’re not alone. While I was never really bullied in my life, literally everything else that you wrote about had me connecting to it in a way I haven’t connected to a RUclips comment before. I often still do feel like that and it’s a struggle to deal with so just know that there’s others out there who feel your pain as well.
That was such a good description which I also totally related to. I would also add the part that everybody can tell there is something wrong with me. I've worked so hard to gain awareness of my perception, that I'm proud of myself for it, and I really appreciated Dr k calling it a perception disorder. This discussion was mind blowing and deeply satisfying for me. Thanks heaps.
@@trappart9209 it's a work in progress, I guess. When I'm on my own I feel pretty good about myself and overall just life, honestly am pretty happy. When it comes to people I still feel terrified of them and having to interact with them irl on any deeper level than just something like saying good morning to a cashier or ordering something at a restaurant. And I still feel awful and incapable of being open and vulnerable with someone when they try to approach me, like a few days ago a girl that's now living in my family home asked me if I watch movies often and my reaction to that was my mind racing for a few seconds trying to figure out how I should answer her in a way that would be safe, I ended up just saying "sometimes" lol So yeah, I'm still pretty much completely self-isolated, literally 0 friends, the only time I talk with anyone is when some family member wants something from me, but I feel happy despite that
I didnt know why i was rejected in social situations (it was autism). I was rejected & ignored in my home & forced into holiday camps, daycare, sports etc & my parents absolutely did not care. They had to work so i had to go & thats what they told me & they didnt want to hear any more about it. Gen x. Latchkey. I woke up alone from 7 years old, made my own breakfast & lunch, walked to school & back, made my afternoon tea, got yelled at for what i ate, asked how my day went, nobody listened & my parents were volatile, immature & absuive. Ive never bothered to work on my avoidance in therapy, because im autistic, so i just figure ill always be alone, so why bother with that when so much is on the list, but this has encouraged me to bring it up. I don't have a PD but im extremely avoidant. I'm a 45 year old life long spinster lol. So i appreciate the pushback early on that avoidants would have a spouse and a therapist!
@@aussiejubes Hi I'm sorry this is the way that you were treated as a kid and the hopelessness you feel. I read that in some cases people within the autism spectrum have similar ways to communicate. Of course this doesn't mean that two autistic persons will automatically be friends just because. However it may be worth trying it might be more comfortable to start with someone that's speaking your same language:D. Anyway I wish you the best!
As a clinician ( Neurologist ) this talk was amazing. It's a real shame our specialties became separated all those years ago. The mind and body are really one. And what the mind experiences so does the body and vice versa. Those experiences become memories , they carry with themselves emotion and in time form our personality.
I LOVE hearing a medical clinician talk this way. I truly believe we’d be much better off if more people understood how truly intertwined body and mind are and how much one can affect the other.
Both these guys have awesome eyebrows. And the thing about having bullies AND having parents who didn't support you causing the problem really hit home. Bullying at school, bullying/lack of empathy at home is the perfect storm.
The schizoid PD explanation explained my entire adolescent years and half of my 20s. I am 28 now and has evolved so much through Dr. K’s videos and other specialists, and in hindsight I see how far I have come. I feel relieved and assured that I will be ok.
TIMESTAMPS: [00:00] - Introduction and initial moments with relaxation and music. [03:42] - Introduction to the stream by Dr. Alok Kanojia, mentioning it is for educational purposes, not medical advice. [04:38] - Anticipation of a special guest, Dr. Kirk Honda, and mention of his expertise in personality disorders, including avoidant personality disorder. [06:13] - Connection with Dr. Kirk Honda, technical adjustments and the start of the discussion. [07:20] - Introductions and reminders about discussing personality disorders without giving medical advice. [07:45] - Dr. Kirk Honda gives a brief introduction about himself and his online presence. [09:18] - Explanation of various contents on Dr. Honda's channel, from deep dives into disorders to reaction content. [13:32] - Introduction to personality disorders with a focus on distorted perceptions related to early relational trauma. [16:23] - Detailed explanation of avoidant personality disorder, focusing on childhood trauma, neglect, and social anxiety. [23:04] - Discussion on the cycle that reinforces perceptions of inherent rejection and the impact of corrective experiences. [26:01] - Challenges in treatment, particularly regarding establishing trust with a therapist or spouse. [27:19] - Exploring individual cases and variability in experiences of people with avoidant personality disorder. 29:49 - 30:02: Discussion on fear of social situations like Tinder and how it relates to individual traumas. 30:03 - 30:16: Explanation of how social traumas might come from different social interactions. 30:17 - 30:31: Examples of specific social scenarios in childhood that might cause distress or social trauma. 30:32 - 30:44: Discussion on individual comfort zones and how they can vary from person to person. 30:45 - 31:15: Connection between chronic experiences in childhood, social interactions, and personality development. 31:16 - 31:37: Explanation of how social interactions can lead to a perceptual distortion in relation to social anxiety. 31:38 - 31:52: The impact of early social traumas on adult behavior in different types of relationships. 31:53 - 32:20: Differing effects of trauma triggers on romantic versus familial relationships. 32:21 - 33:15: Characteristics of avoidant personality and how some people are comfortable with close family members or select individuals. 33:16 - 34:10: Exploration of personal experiences of those with avoidant personality disorder. 34:11 - 34:57: Detailed descriptions of social anxiety symptoms and fears in professional settings. 34:58 - 35:48: Anecdotes illustrating excessive self-awareness and misconceptions about personal appearance and behavior. 35:49 - 36:08: How corrective experiences build new mental frameworks for those with social anxiety or avoidant personality disorder. 36:09 - 38:45: Parallels between avoidant personality disorder and conditions like schizophrenia; pattern recognition and paranoia discussion. 38:46 - 40:20: Analysis of how trauma influences belief in conspiracy theories or perceived patterns. 40:21 - 42:06: In-depth look into mind reading and self-criticism in avoidant personality disorder. 42:07 - 44:35: Therapeutic approaches and challenges when addressing deep-seated personal beliefs and disorders. 44:36 - 45:56: The process and importance of a therapist's role in managing feelings of defectiveness or rejection. 45:57 - 47:04: Comparison of therapeutic experiences and strategies with different personality disorders. 47:05 - 49:35: Examination of how SSRI and neuroplasticity concepts relate to therapeutic changes. 49:36 - 52:59: Discussion on psychedelics, meditation, and their effects on neuroplasticity and personal growth. 53:00 - 54:27: Deep dive into the shared therapeutic journey and building hope in patients with personality disorders. 54:28 - 55:55: Differentiation between social anxiety and avoidant personality disorder, focusing on severity and self-awareness. 02:13:49 - 02:14:04: Discussion about screen sharing and technical setup for the video. 02:14:04 - 02:14:15: Introduction of a subreddit post regarding avoidant personality disorder. 02:14:15 - 02:14:31: Explanation of how people with avoidant personality disorder schedule their time, mentioning the importance of preparation. 02:14:31 - 02:14:45: Discussion about the usefulness of preparation for people with avoidant traits before meetings. 02:14:45 - 02:14:59: Risks of not preparing and potential negative outcomes like job loss. 02:14:59 - 02:15:13: Host thanks Dr. Kirk Honda and the appreciation of discussing spirituality. 02:15:13 - 02:15:27: Mention of the community's interest in spirituality but balancing it with clinical science. 02:15:27 - 02:15:41: Host explains the decision to avoid deep spirituality discussion due to time constraints. 02:15:41 - 02:16:09: Host values the framework discussed, highlighting its simplicity and clinical relevance. 02:16:09 - 02:16:22: Dr. Kirk Honda promotes his work and mentions his Psychology in Seattle podcast. 02:16:22 - 02:16:49: Host praises Dr. Kirk Honda's work, mentioning his discussions on personality disorders and entertaining reactions to pop culture. 02:16:49 - 02:17:02: Host encourages the audience to check Dr. Kirk Honda's work, particularly around topics like attachment theory. 02:17:02 - 02:18:11: Host praises Dr. Kirk Honda, acknowledging his experience and contributions to mental health education. 02:18:11 - 02:19:10: Host plans on future collaborations and highlights the strong chemistry during the discussion. 02:19:10 - 02:22:10: Host reflects on the depth and quality of the conversation, comparing it to high-level clinical training. 02:22:10 - 02:23:52: Host expresses gratitude to the audience, reflecting on the high level of discussion and promising more sessions. 02:23:52 - 02:25:17: Discussion on how the session will be available, mentioning various platforms like RUclips and Twitch for storing broadcasts. 02:25:17 - End: Host suggests future collaborations with Dr. Kirk Honda to further explore relevant topics together.
Seeing Dr Honda and Dr K tell each other that it’s an honor to be in each others presence touched me in such a way as a fan, I had to watch it a few times.
Both of you have changed my life, I've watched you both for years. Your friendship forming was so great to watch. You're both incredibly insightful and compassionate men. I wasn't spiritually prepared for the crossover episode, it just blew my mind. Amazing.
These conversations always make me tear up. It took me until 27 to finally admit my parents could have done a lot better and how the neglect I faced has radically molded who I am today. Thanks for this video guys
It took my partner until 28 to even begin to admit the same. It’s really eye-opening to see others having struggled to admit the same things. All the best to you on your journey of self-discovery and healing.
This came at a perfect time, as usual. Today, I left my neighborhood for the first time in months, sometimes I don't leave my house for weeks. I pretty much need something to force me to go out because if not I just pick times of the day when nobody is around. I've had severe social anxiety since a kid, and it developed into AVPD in my adulthood, as I can't be forced to do things as much now. I have phases where I am better and can go to the gym, my community college classes, and generally go out more, but at my worst I won't even see my family. My family is a big reason as to why I am like this, and I know and accept that it's my responsibility to take control of my life, I just mention that because I rather see strangers than them. I used to let it put my life on a complete hold, but I've managed to be hyper independent and make progress in life while working around these issues. I work out at home, learn skills, take online classes, create content on other accounts, help others with similar issues etc. I do understand that I can't live like this forever, but I have this internal need to be as perfect as possible before I can be in society. If all areas of my life aren't at the very least average, then I feel ashamed of showing my face. I've changed and grown in so many ways, but it never feels like enough, I always feel worse and further behind than everyone else. Today I had to be out for a few hours and so many things went wrong. I was sweating a lot, I hadn't walked this much in a long time so I was limping, I had to go somewhere new and looked lost, etc. Almost everyone that crossed my path made me think terrible things about myself, when half the time they didn't even look at me. Thankfully, everyone I interacted with was nice, and I had the opportunity to be nice back. It felt good smiling at someone holding the door for me and vice versa. Anyway, sorry to trauma dump on y'all. I'm gonna keep trying to live a good life and keep figuring things out. It isn't easy for me to share this because it could come back to me, but I hope that someone out there feels like they're not alone.
Can I offer another perspective? If you go out into the world, while perfect or somewhat good at everything, is that even human? Everyone has something they are bad at, and they don't deserve to be shunned for their imperfections when thats how they are recognizable as individuals. It's the "aw, that's our Doe, can't read a map to save a life"thing. Can you maybe try a class where you would be deliberately clumsy? Like painting or claywork. I recently did a cooking class and the average skills were pretty low, kinda the point of it, lol. I just think that going out to be a superhuman out there would be very lonely cause you wouldn't have anyone offering help, and then how would you be able to surround yourself with good people.
@@strawberry_punch_art Logically, I understand that nobody is perfect, and I will never be perfect or maybe even close to it. But emotionally, when I fail at something in front of someone, it causes me a lot of internal distress. On the outside I play it cool, but in my head I'm kicking myself. It's what has driven me in the last couple of years and I'm afraid of losing progress if I let go of that mindset. Though In the right environment, I do loosen up a bit, so there's hope. I will reflect on your comment, you worded that in a way that resonated with me. I guess I really haven't been trying to be human? That could explain a lot. Thank you!
Within the last year or so, i think he started to get a little grey in his beard, which looks great on him and adds to the wise vibe, but it does give away his age a bit. Before that, I swear he looked in his 30s!
This is how people who genuinely attune with honesty to their core innate self, values and qualities age. People who has less negative emotions, intentions and experiences for prolonged times or even in frequency, and professionally know how to spot, take care of, and maintain their emotional and psychological wellbeing. Of course other factors play major key roles like his Japanese heritage genes, nutrition, exposure to clean air and water full of minerals and vitamins, sleep patterns, and financial safety which allows for a higher possibility of the above, but generally speaking their bio-psycho-social life and environment in which they marinate daily (especially important during the pregnancy periods of the mother, prenatal, natal, perinatal all the way some would argue up until age 17~18, the brain integrates and grows alongside the damages from traumatic experiences) is much more favourable. This is how those people age - naturally, as we're all supposed to. It's just a frightening contrast in realising how internally broken and/or unable to repair ourselves the remaining majority of us are in comparison to these 2 professionals.
The child in me really felt understood in this video for the first time, it explained a heck of a lot about my perceptions of the world back then. Alcoholic parents, one a psychopathic narcissist, the other OCD, so neglected in my early years and even more so in my teens after they divorced. However, I wanted to post because I have something to suggest towards a future video on spirituality. Coming into my 20s, I was still quite lost, unable to understand deep connections, but never used substances to cope because of my parents. A friend in uni brought in some female Buddhist monks for a talk to our class. Mind blown, didn't even know female monks were a thing (I'm a woman). I enjoyed their talk but what stood out to me most was this: "I encourage you to convince yourself that if what you believe makes your life better (and doesn't hurt anyone), does it really matter if it's true or not?" So I decided that believing that people were only tolerating me and that everyone thought I was weird was not helping my life, it was making me a loner, unable to truly connect with people and so unhappy. So why not take a leap of faith and try believing that people were generally nice and that trusting them would help me make deeper connections? It might not be true, and likely I would be hurt when it wasn't, but giving people the benefit of the doubt and believing it would drastically improve my life and perception of people and myself. So I did it. Almost overnight my life changed for the better. Certainly I have been hurt from trusting too much at times, but I consider it a small price to pay for my overall general happiness. 30 years later I still carry this with me today and you know, I discovered also, a lot of people will rise to your level of trust in them and that helps increase everyone's happiness. I am not into organized religion but I do feel very closely in tune with the Universe at times and I would partially credit this to changing my perception. Bad parenting only increases the level of unhappiness and bad coping skills every generation unless you can somehow break the cycle, and I think that society is now seeing the result of enough of the population being in this basket that the curve has gone exponential. Thank you both for your good work towards helping so many break the cycle, I've learned a lot here today and it also helps me to raise my own child better too. Much love.
I recently discovered about this as well! The image you have of yourself is so important. Our mind relies on our input about the world and will stay consistent to it. So if you say nobody likes you, your mind will make you be closed off and give weird vibes to prove to you that yes, you were correct. So it's better to think positively about things even if they're not true. Because one day they might be
Listening to Dr. Honda always restores my faith in humanity and myself. I had a tough day yesterday and i needed this. I'm not familiar with the other guy, but the way they both connected with each other was so special. Seeing men being vulnerable is so healing for me.
Dr Honda genuinely appreciates the recognition and its nice to see. It feels like as good as he is he doesn't meet enough people on the same wavelength who actively compliment him
Taking notes and not interupting is great podcaster relationship hygiene. I get distressed by podcasters with horrendous manners. This was SOO timely and may launch the next episode of my healing journey. Be Blessed❤
From about 45:00 onwards, hearing Dr. Honda talk about being there for and with a patient when facing the abyss made me tear up a little. Such a beautiful description of this incredibly kind and compassionate act. I am so grateful for the therapists around the world who manage to help their patients in this way.
this stream made me feel so relieved. it's actually possible that there's nothing terribly wrong with me on a fundamental level. thank you Dr. K and Dr. Honda!
This is why I felt I had found a treasure when I stumbled upon Dr. Honda's youtube channel. Without his channel I wouldn't be able to see why humans operate the way they do. It gave me confidence to try to become a better person. And also to try and keep my sanity in a world that I am seeing is okay with behaving abnormally.
As somebody that's a frequent listener of Dr. Honda's audio podcast, this was an incredible listen, not just because of the insights both of you provided, but as somebody that isn't a paying member of Dr. Honda's Patreon, I never got the opportunity to really get into his deep dives on AvPD and Schizoid PD, so to hear hear his insights on both conditions was an absolute enriching experience. Thank you for having him on your podcast, and look forward to seeing you two collab again in the hopefully not too distant future :)
Two mental health professional who are absolute trail blazers bringing mental health literacy to the world via the internet! So beautiful to see how their worldviews, life experiences, educational backgrounds shape their approaches into their practices when working with their clients and brings an incredible amount of value to us! So much insight is provided through these lines of thinking being explained. Thank you so much for sharing these conversations with us, so grateful to have this knowledge and ways of thinking introduced to us.
I've been a fan of Dr H for years, I'm one of his patrons because his deep dives on attachment theory made me a better parent and I'll be forever grateful to him. I knew I was on the spectrum of avoidant attachment but this made me think differently about my avoidance and how much deeper it is. Thank you so much. Watching you guys connect on a personal level was also extremely emotional to see. ❤
Absolutely in love with this conversation! The structure of information, the deep understanding of the topic, the natural flow of conversation and amazing chemistry - it's all just top notch. I hope that it would be possible for Dr. K and Dr. Honda to make another talk on other topics, spirituality for sure is one of them Thank you so much!
This was such a good conversation. I totally teared up when they were talking about Dr. k's bullying and Dr. Honda's foot incident. I hope they do more content together
As someone who is about to be 36, and have never been in a serious relationship I hate to ID with any disorder or disability. I stumbled upon the subreddit for avpd years ago but AVOIDED even that because I noticed it actually makes it worse when you associate with it too much. Lol It sucks but every symptom of avpd resonates with me too hard. I had it way worse before, I didn’t leave my room for years basically in my mid 20’s. Video games filled my time. A free, old treadmill received by a neighbor up the street saved my life. 20 minutes a day running got my brain back to more normal levels. I never have been in such a rut since then but have had months of similar activity. Exercise, sun in your eyes/on skin in the AM is big. I still am a master procrastinator, befriending my anxiety in a way that I have to do something before a I panic. Taking right action is big. I still deal with barely being able to look at my phone for texts and missed calls. Peace is something earned on the other side of courage.
This information is absolutly mind blowing and was delivered in digestible, easy to understand way. Thank you very much and respect to both of you for being so open, authentic and professional at the same time❤😊
It was great to see 2 of the RUclipsrs I already watch collaborating but this was suh a good conversation and a bit of an antidote to toxic masculinity. Make this a series please!
As someone that grew up with neglect, I can definitely say that it can develop a coping mechanism in you that you can later use to protect yourself. While most people will still make an effort to hold onto their closest relationships when they feel hurt or bothered by someone, a switch can flip where the neglected person can literally drop that relationship and never talk to them for the rest of their lives without feeling remorse for it. And I think the reasoning for this is because it becomes ingrained in you that even those that love you the most will let you down and that people will never really love you, and this ideation is confirmed to you whenever someone does anything to hurt you. But to make things more complicated and harder for the neglected person is that you are naturally way more sensitive to your feelings being hurt than a regular person, you can even look for reasons to doubt a person and doubt their intentions no matter how kind they are to you. You are always on guard for someone to betray you, which is why this can lead to paranoia and even other issues. But please be mindful that I'm not certain if this is just my personal experience because everyone is shaped differently however. But I imagine that those with avoidance have a similar reaction to easily being hurt and then being avoidant.
1:06:48 wholesome, healing, and corrective for you two and everyone watching who experienced similar being bullied and who even was the bully and regrets it deeply. So, thank you you two for going there and being two comfortably vulnerable dudes despite being near strangers to each other.
This was an absolute banger of a stream. Not too deep at all, the depth is an integral part of what made it so damn good. I know you're both busy content creators, but if possible, please please please bring him back!
My 2 favorite people that I learn about psychology from!! Love both of you ❤ I am a veterinarian and lonely people use me as a counselor often, which luckily I enjoy helping people also, and both of your videos have helped me understand people better and have increased empathy for people. I’m pretty empathetic already, but I do have my own issues which get in the way when people are hostile towards me, but both of you have helped understand my own and others reactivity better, which has helped me deal with clients so much better. So thanks so much to both of you for that! ❤
In case anyone is wondering, I had very critical Mom (she tried her best after her childhood which was even worse) and that affected my ability to deal with any criticism.
Nothing more touching than a fatherly strong gentle nurturing personality. Thank you for coming to this stream. 33:48 It is the neglect that creates the belief that there is must be something wrong with me. This is just sad that I had to learn to feel like this for the most of my life. 39:19 feeling first and then we fit reality to our feeling. it hits so hard. 45:14 There is a self there. A beautiful self. all of those negative things are the things that I have learned to survive. 47:50 this hits hard too 49:50 take a leap into the unknown still and always feels scary. Certainity gives me safety that I can handle it. Given the surprising behaviour on how my parents anger to me, the unknown feels like the world is going to end. The thing is that I am not with my parents anymore. The fear is there. 51:27 if we quiet the emotion, we create room for cognitive flexibility. It makes sense when my therapist really focus on squeezing the emotion. Most of the emotion that I felt right now are anger, sadness and fear. A combination of years and years of numbing and dissociation. However I am too afraid to feel. Feeling has been the one that stops me from getting out of the family. Now feeling is the one that stops me to live a fulfilling life. 1:26:10 I love day dreaming. the only hope that I have. Whenever I day dream, I feel like even though the dream is not real, it just feels so good. I never realized that this is just a manifestation of neglect and lack of stimulus. And yeah. I just dismiss how hard it was for a child to experience difficult emotion and no one there for him. Cries dries by itself. Crying till I got tired and sleep. Then the next morning trying to forget of what just happened. Not including the blindess to what I am experiencing. I don't know whether it is sadness, anger or fear. All that I know is that I must not feel this feeling. 1:26:40 If I don't feel my emotion, I don't need to worry to be rejected. this has been my defense mechanism. To survive the constant painful or rejection. Now I live in the different world and I still reject myself before the world reject me. The only difference is that my parents rejected me, the sub part of the world that I live in don't reject me. Yet, I still reject myself in advance. 1:29:00 this proto emotion hits home so hard. Now I am in my 30's expecting myself to navigate the world through the "common" way on how an adult in their 30's manage their emotion. However, my emotion is stunted and how can I expect myself to be able to navigate my emotion as an adult if I don't spend enough time to be a child. I feel I haven't passed the 4 years old of sadness and fear and 15 years old of anger. The sadness of not being cared. The fear of not being able to survive if I don't submit to my parents. I don't want to expect myself again in the sadness and fear. I feel sad and I feel fear. When I feel sad I just want someone who has a stable emotional regulation to hold me till I am stable myself. When I am afraid, I want someone to hold strong that I can face my fear. Unfortunately no one was there. I just want to admit that first. Now I am an adult and I can be there for my little self. 1:29:40 Yeah. I don't know what are my needs and how to fulfill them.
This is an awesome awesome one! I'm BPD on healing journey.( thanks to Dr.k) Studying psychodynamic counselling. In the future, I'd like to work with personality disorder. It is just amazing video. Thank you
When you asked about the difference between social anxiety and avoidant personality disorder, I yelled yes and jumped up in my basement as if my hockey team had just won the Stanley Cup
Awesome video. Really explained a lot to me; we (dissociative system) are being evaluated for personality disorders right now, and this opened my eyes a lot to how to help my system and myself through understanding potential roots that I cannot of some of our adaptions. Great work both of you
I'm a long time super fan of Dr Honda and a pretty new one to dr K, and I have to say I'm OBSESSED about this crossover! I learned so much. I've listened to all of dr Honda's deep dives on PDs in the past, so I've heard this info before, but hearing dr K's input and slightly different persepctive to dr Honda's words blew my mind as well and helped me understand it all even more. One thing I want to note though: my sister was pretty convinced she had AvPD for a long time and I was agreeing, she seemingly was meeting all the criteria. Turns out she got diagnosed with autism instead, no AvPD, and it makes even more sense now. I guess I just wanna say these 2 might present in a very similar way sometimes. The meme near the end, about pre and post meeting, applies 100% to high-masking autistic experience (I'm autistic too). thank you for the great talk!
incredible stream. You could feel towards the end that Kirk had really found their comfort level on a topic, and was able to flawlessly talk about it. The discussion about intrusion and schizoid was truly eye opening. Definitely interested in more!
I could literally watch another 2 & 1/2 hour video from these two on avoidant and schizoid pd and I would still be deeply fascinated. This was such an eye opening talk. Please do more videos together!
This was such an engaging and helpful conversation. My partner has some avoidance tendencies and I legitimately feel like I learned valuable information to better connect with him. Thank you both!
I think you were both great. Dr Honda had great simple explanations and Dr K helped connect some of those dots. And then Dr K provided his understanding and interpretations, and Dr Honda helped connect those with more dots.
The more i hear the more i relate I obviously cannot self diagnose but hearing all of these videos is a god send. Idk what i wouldve become if it weren't for these videos. Thank you For the first time ever i am enjoying socialising, i am understanding myself, i am in tune with myself. The warmth is smthg that i never expected. I never knew that i didnt feel pleasure from life. I never realised how scared i was of people and admitting that yes, i was lonely, because i was ashamed, and that my daydreams were to compensate for my lacks. Thank you doc. Idk where i wouldve been if it werent for your videos and thank god i found them now. Im 16 and i fixed so much of my problems because i trust what you say and when i dont wanna do something, i remember your videos and take a risk and force myself to be with people, to not shut down, to not isolate myself, to adress my shame. It's been 3 years since i found your videos, and I finally feel content. I had the impulse to write my gratitude, and ofc i was maladaptive daydreaming abt talking to a pyschologist (i dont have one) about this amazing psychology youtube channel and how it helped me BUT i chose to express that daydream through words to make it a productive habit since i canr get rid of it anyway:D
I (most likely) have schizoid pd. Not diagnosed with it but my neuropsychologist wanted to and said I showed signs of it (while doing an adhd “investigation”) And there is actually one time in my life that I can remember where I’ve really felt emotion. And it was overwhelming but not really in a bad way. That one time is when I watched a video here a long time ago and it was some emotional attachment thing. I’ve decided to try get back into treatment and actually feel, instead of being there answering basic questions with just my logical mind. Gonna be looking for the video that I found that time. Been doing a lot of meditation recently which is great I guess but I’m missing that emotional feeling that I experienced then. Thank you for this video
Yes I know what you’re saying about the connection we just saw. It reminds me of the positive connection I’ve had with a therapist. Thank you for sharing that with us ❤
I feel like I said "yes, 100%" or "yes, but..." to the entirety of the first 30 minutes. And I don't think I am just pretending because I didn't feel anything for any of the other parts (I wasn't bullied, for example), and my therapist was the first person to bring up avoidance to me. I would say that I don't feel like I have social anxiety; I imagine social anxiety as a more real, concious, rational emotion in response to actual real external social threats. With avoidance, it feels very internal. It is definitely quite magical in thinking and causality. I noticed I actually don't really care about actually upseting other people as much as I care about imagined social transgressions that will prove once and for all I'm a horrible person and make people hate me. A word of caution - I am an atheist yet I find Dr. K's presentation of Karma very emotionally compelling, because I really do feel like my ego operates using "magical causality". Of course I am the worst person in existence, that is my Karma. Ah yes, of course I am the worst person in existence due to the crimes of other people (my ancestors, my past lives, etc). I would advise Dr. K to be careful talking about Karma to avoidant people because it can be the ultimate bs justification as to why avoidance becomes our Dharma.
I needed this. This is me and Ive wasted YEARS of my life trying to figure out what is wrong with me. Im just a human and the only issue is me thinking something is wrong with me.
Dear Dr K, this has been one of the most profound discussions on the internet, and I loved it to the core. It is possible to explore the ideas shared at 1:31:47 in detail (among the types) and what happens when an adult is treated that way. i.e. invading their private space and leaving them with no privacy. How does that manifest?
This was a great stream! I have avoidant issues, specifically around women. I was forced into bad social situations without any support when I was younger, and there were girls who didn't like me and were mean / made rumors about me and bullied me (also I think some shit happened to me before I can even remember). Interestingly, in some situations like in a work environment or around only men I'm pretty chill. I really appreciate the schizoid reference in this stream. I think my mother has schizoid. She was very emotionally absent, neglectful, and would daydream A LOT. She also had narcissistic tendencies and was completely in her own world. The recent streams with other experts have been great. I hope there is more collaboration in the future
Very interesting. Watching a 2.5 hours long live stream (not live but as a video) seemed a bit daunting to me at first, but (other than that it's past 3 am now) it was absolutely worth it. I loved the interaction between you two, not only the professional parts but also the personal ones, especially the bullying experience part. I'm definitely looking forward to seeing you both doing this again!
Absolutely amazing!! One of the best interviews! 🤩🥰 Loved it! The bromanze! 😄 Thank you for doing this one, really looking forward to the next one! The conversation about spirituality is going to be 😙👌🏼
rip bc my last therapist looked into that abyss with me and was like... nah i'm out good luck tho 💀💀 but very comforting to know there are some therapists out there that can handle it; gives me hope for others (and maybe one day myself.)
Im leaving this feeling like you two just explained my whole life problems :o Im not very good in english, and I thought a LOT about what to say in here, but it's just... To much to express in words. I'm just... So grateful! Thank you Dr. Honda and Dr. K!
My two favourite psychology RUclipsrs discussing my personality disorder, I’ve died and gone to mental health nerd heaven
Was literally typing the same thing!
FACTS LIKE THE ULTIMATE CROSS OVER!
Aaahh same here! Best crossover episode of life.
❤❤❤
So much happening when Dr. Honda glides into trying to healing K's youth trauma. It seems lovingly done, but K's role get turned from professional to client during a live streaming, K's seems to be sucked into emotions, but quickly switches to analyze and reflect on it, and directs the conversation away from him feeling his feelings.
It reminds me of how complex working with very personal emotions and trauma can be. Especially as host in a live public event. Talking about personal examples can be totally different then personally reliving them.
for the first time in my life I can confidently say I'm talking for everyone here: we need this WEEKLY
@@sedmidivka YES!!!
YES I want them to talk again. Such a great dynamic
I disagree. I need it daily.
@@BackToVoid you have to ruin it for me :) this is why we can't have nice things
I love how careful Dr. Honda is with his words. He’s very mindful and intentional behind the things he says. A true professional!
Definitely do this again, guys! I've never seen Dr. Kirk sweat, nor have I seen Dr. K fanboy out so hard ever!
As someone who has AvPD, one of the hardest things was when I was shamed for being avoidant. So I was being shamed for the very thing that helped keep me from feeling shame. Which further reinforced the shame. Its a sad cycle. To anyone struggling, there is hope I promise!
I was shamed for being avoidant by a teacher who was appointed as my counselor by the school.
I started with a new therapist recently and he is doing this exact thing. I'm seeing a new therapist tomorrow. I can't work with someone who makes me feel like I have my whole life. Thanks for your comment.
@@JanetSmith900I’m sorry to hear that. Hopefully you’re new therapist is more supportive. I’m grateful that my therapist pushes me to take risks and work on my avoidance while also validating my internal desire to avoid.
@@JanetSmith900oh man, some therapists are just… not helpful. To say the least. But when you find a correct one - it’s honestly amazing. Though still hard journey of course. Good luck!
It was beautiful to watch two grown men feel seen by each other. Watching Dr.K slowly just be shocked at been cared for. Thank you
Right? Men seem so callous toward each other most of the time, we need more of this!
1:06:48 - 1:09:12 so wholesome seeing Dr. Honda react to Dr. K being bullied as a child 🥲 it was sweet & refreshing to see Dr. K on the receiving end of this type of conversation!
Good seeing Dr K on the other end of this too, really admirable and can really tell he has a lot of drive.
Truly loved seeing this happen
Yeah ❤
Got a serving of his own medicine 😂 I was curious how he'd react. He's a good sport.
To be quite honest, this section made me quite uncomfortable. Dr. K had the right answer and the right mindset - he overcame his anger and hatred, and doesn't want to be all like 'Look at me now', I don't think he would use his title and successes to show off if he did come across them. No, instead he no longer harbours ill will to those who wronged him in the past. Vengeful thoughts to past transgressions isn't the way to overcome them.
Literally me and how my life looked like. Neglectful parents, I got bullied at school for 6 painful years of elementary school, at home I was kinda just left to do whatever I wanted and noone really bothered to ask me how I was doing, and I didn't feel comfortable telling anyone about it of my own accord.
Then for years I've felt like I was somehow just not really a normal human that could be genuinely liked, cared about, I've felt like anything I was into was somehow wrong, something to be ashamed of, I've always felt around other like I was just weird, awkward, different, not really human; like others were these real human who had feelings, needs, wants and they mattered and were normal, meanwhile I was just some sort of creature that existed next to them, looked like them, but really wasn't like them at all, didn't deserve anything whatsoever from them, couldn't really be on the same level as them.
I feel you man you’re not alone. While I was never really bullied in my life, literally everything else that you wrote about had me connecting to it in a way I haven’t connected to a RUclips comment before. I often still do feel like that and it’s a struggle to deal with so just know that there’s others out there who feel your pain as well.
That was such a good description which I also totally related to. I would also add the part that everybody can tell there is something wrong with me.
I've worked so hard to gain awareness of my perception, that I'm proud of myself for it, and I really appreciated Dr k calling it a perception disorder.
This discussion was mind blowing and deeply satisfying for me. Thanks heaps.
Thank you, that is quite relateable. It's good to know I'm not alone.
yes, relatable. were you able to change that?
@@trappart9209 it's a work in progress, I guess. When I'm on my own I feel pretty good about myself and overall just life, honestly am pretty happy.
When it comes to people I still feel terrified of them and having to interact with them irl on any deeper level than just something like saying good morning to a cashier or ordering something at a restaurant.
And I still feel awful and incapable of being open and vulnerable with someone when they try to approach me, like a few days ago a girl that's now living in my family home asked me if I watch movies often and my reaction to that was my mind racing for a few seconds trying to figure out how I should answer her in a way that would be safe, I ended up just saying "sometimes" lol
So yeah, I'm still pretty much completely self-isolated, literally 0 friends, the only time I talk with anyone is when some family member wants something from me, but I feel happy despite that
I didnt know why i was rejected in social situations (it was autism). I was rejected & ignored in my home & forced into holiday camps, daycare, sports etc & my parents absolutely did not care. They had to work so i had to go & thats what they told me & they didnt want to hear any more about it. Gen x. Latchkey. I woke up alone from 7 years old, made my own breakfast & lunch, walked to school & back, made my afternoon tea, got yelled at for what i ate, asked how my day went, nobody listened & my parents were volatile, immature & absuive.
Ive never bothered to work on my avoidance in therapy, because im autistic, so i just figure ill always be alone, so why bother with that when so much is on the list, but this has encouraged me to bring it up. I don't have a PD but im extremely avoidant. I'm a 45 year old life long spinster lol. So i appreciate the pushback early on that avoidants would have a spouse and a therapist!
@@aussiejubes Hi I'm sorry this is the way that you were treated as a kid and the hopelessness you feel. I read that in some cases people within the autism spectrum have similar ways to communicate. Of course this doesn't mean that two autistic persons will automatically be friends just because. However it may be worth trying it might be more comfortable to start with someone that's speaking your same language:D. Anyway I wish you the best!
4:14 Start! 🌟
7:15 Dr Honda joins
thanks
@@AethelraedTheReady thanks
Thanks
Hero
As a clinician ( Neurologist ) this talk was amazing. It's a real shame our specialties became separated all those years ago. The mind and body are really one. And what the mind experiences so does the body and vice versa. Those experiences become memories , they carry with themselves emotion and in time form our personality.
I LOVE hearing a medical clinician talk this way.
I truly believe we’d be much better off if more people understood how truly intertwined body and mind are and how much one can affect the other.
Both these guys have awesome eyebrows. And the thing about having bullies AND having parents who didn't support you causing the problem really hit home. Bullying at school, bullying/lack of empathy at home is the perfect storm.
Ahhh! I suggested this collab in a comment on a Dr. Honda video like a year ago! Best day ever!
Worth the wait!😂
The schizoid PD explanation explained my entire adolescent years and half of my 20s. I am 28 now and has evolved so much through Dr. K’s videos and other specialists, and in hindsight I see how far I have come. I feel relieved and assured that I will be ok.
TIMESTAMPS:
[00:00] - Introduction and initial moments with relaxation and music.
[03:42] - Introduction to the stream by Dr. Alok Kanojia, mentioning it is for educational purposes, not medical advice.
[04:38] - Anticipation of a special guest, Dr. Kirk Honda, and mention of his expertise in personality disorders, including avoidant personality disorder.
[06:13] - Connection with Dr. Kirk Honda, technical adjustments and the start of the discussion.
[07:20] - Introductions and reminders about discussing personality disorders without giving medical advice.
[07:45] - Dr. Kirk Honda gives a brief introduction about himself and his online presence.
[09:18] - Explanation of various contents on Dr. Honda's channel, from deep dives into disorders to reaction content.
[13:32] - Introduction to personality disorders with a focus on distorted perceptions related to early relational trauma.
[16:23] - Detailed explanation of avoidant personality disorder, focusing on childhood trauma, neglect, and social anxiety.
[23:04] - Discussion on the cycle that reinforces perceptions of inherent rejection and the impact of corrective experiences.
[26:01] - Challenges in treatment, particularly regarding establishing trust with a therapist or spouse.
[27:19] - Exploring individual cases and variability in experiences of people with avoidant personality disorder.
29:49 - 30:02: Discussion on fear of social situations like Tinder and how it relates to individual traumas.
30:03 - 30:16: Explanation of how social traumas might come from different social interactions.
30:17 - 30:31: Examples of specific social scenarios in childhood that might cause distress or social trauma.
30:32 - 30:44: Discussion on individual comfort zones and how they can vary from person to person.
30:45 - 31:15: Connection between chronic experiences in childhood, social interactions, and personality development.
31:16 - 31:37: Explanation of how social interactions can lead to a perceptual distortion in relation to social anxiety.
31:38 - 31:52: The impact of early social traumas on adult behavior in different types of relationships.
31:53 - 32:20: Differing effects of trauma triggers on romantic versus familial relationships.
32:21 - 33:15: Characteristics of avoidant personality and how some people are comfortable with close family members or select individuals.
33:16 - 34:10: Exploration of personal experiences of those with avoidant personality disorder.
34:11 - 34:57: Detailed descriptions of social anxiety symptoms and fears in professional settings.
34:58 - 35:48: Anecdotes illustrating excessive self-awareness and misconceptions about personal appearance and behavior.
35:49 - 36:08: How corrective experiences build new mental frameworks for those with social anxiety or avoidant personality disorder.
36:09 - 38:45: Parallels between avoidant personality disorder and conditions like schizophrenia; pattern recognition and paranoia discussion.
38:46 - 40:20: Analysis of how trauma influences belief in conspiracy theories or perceived patterns.
40:21 - 42:06: In-depth look into mind reading and self-criticism in avoidant personality disorder.
42:07 - 44:35: Therapeutic approaches and challenges when addressing deep-seated personal beliefs and disorders.
44:36 - 45:56: The process and importance of a therapist's role in managing feelings of defectiveness or rejection.
45:57 - 47:04: Comparison of therapeutic experiences and strategies with different personality disorders.
47:05 - 49:35: Examination of how SSRI and neuroplasticity concepts relate to therapeutic changes.
49:36 - 52:59: Discussion on psychedelics, meditation, and their effects on neuroplasticity and personal growth.
53:00 - 54:27: Deep dive into the shared therapeutic journey and building hope in patients with personality disorders.
54:28 - 55:55: Differentiation between social anxiety and avoidant personality disorder, focusing on severity and self-awareness.
02:13:49 - 02:14:04: Discussion about screen sharing and technical setup for the video.
02:14:04 - 02:14:15: Introduction of a subreddit post regarding avoidant personality disorder.
02:14:15 - 02:14:31: Explanation of how people with avoidant personality disorder schedule their time, mentioning the importance of preparation.
02:14:31 - 02:14:45: Discussion about the usefulness of preparation for people with avoidant traits before meetings.
02:14:45 - 02:14:59: Risks of not preparing and potential negative outcomes like job loss.
02:14:59 - 02:15:13: Host thanks Dr. Kirk Honda and the appreciation of discussing spirituality.
02:15:13 - 02:15:27: Mention of the community's interest in spirituality but balancing it with clinical science.
02:15:27 - 02:15:41: Host explains the decision to avoid deep spirituality discussion due to time constraints.
02:15:41 - 02:16:09: Host values the framework discussed, highlighting its simplicity and clinical relevance.
02:16:09 - 02:16:22: Dr. Kirk Honda promotes his work and mentions his Psychology in Seattle podcast.
02:16:22 - 02:16:49: Host praises Dr. Kirk Honda's work, mentioning his discussions on personality disorders and entertaining reactions to pop culture.
02:16:49 - 02:17:02: Host encourages the audience to check Dr. Kirk Honda's work, particularly around topics like attachment theory.
02:17:02 - 02:18:11: Host praises Dr. Kirk Honda, acknowledging his experience and contributions to mental health education.
02:18:11 - 02:19:10: Host plans on future collaborations and highlights the strong chemistry during the discussion.
02:19:10 - 02:22:10: Host reflects on the depth and quality of the conversation, comparing it to high-level clinical training.
02:22:10 - 02:23:52: Host expresses gratitude to the audience, reflecting on the high level of discussion and promising more sessions.
02:23:52 - 02:25:17: Discussion on how the session will be available, mentioning various platforms like RUclips and Twitch for storing broadcasts.
02:25:17 - End: Host suggests future collaborations with Dr. Kirk Honda to further explore relevant topics together.
Thanks so much!
There’s a big chunk missing from 55:55-2:13:49. Just letting you know, in case that was accidental. No worries if not.
Can smell the low effort AI timestamps from a mile away
I am an atheist, but u showed like God here 🙏
@@johnjohnson3681can this be done by ai ? How do we do that? What ai can we use ?
@@yuiitodoro7791idk about specifics but GPT definitely does that based on a video subtitles
Seeing Dr Honda and Dr K tell each other that it’s an honor to be in each others presence touched me in such a way as a fan, I had to watch it a few times.
Both of you have changed my life, I've watched you both for years. Your friendship forming was so great to watch. You're both incredibly insightful and compassionate men. I wasn't spiritually prepared for the crossover episode, it just blew my mind. Amazing.
omg, how did I miss this? The 2 psychologists I follow for years.
Dr k is a psychiatrist
I think they know ^^ I think in that context it just means: awesome people who talk about psychology stuff!
Not only am I a fan of both but this podcast is basically about me so this is amazing for me.
@J45845-n he prob means missing the Livestream
@@3run632 I am aware, but thank you for correcting me. In the excitement of the moment I wasn't very precise about the terminology.
These conversations always make me tear up. It took me until 27 to finally admit my parents could have done a lot better and how the neglect I faced has radically molded who I am today. Thanks for this video guys
It took my partner until 28 to even begin to admit the same. It’s really eye-opening to see others having struggled to admit the same things.
All the best to you on your journey of self-discovery and healing.
This came at a perfect time, as usual. Today, I left my neighborhood for the first time in months, sometimes I don't leave my house for weeks. I pretty much need something to force me to go out because if not I just pick times of the day when nobody is around. I've had severe social anxiety since a kid, and it developed into AVPD in my adulthood, as I can't be forced to do things as much now. I have phases where I am better and can go to the gym, my community college classes, and generally go out more, but at my worst I won't even see my family. My family is a big reason as to why I am like this, and I know and accept that it's my responsibility to take control of my life, I just mention that because I rather see strangers than them. I used to let it put my life on a complete hold, but I've managed to be hyper independent and make progress in life while working around these issues. I work out at home, learn skills, take online classes, create content on other accounts, help others with similar issues etc.
I do understand that I can't live like this forever, but I have this internal need to be as perfect as possible before I can be in society. If all areas of my life aren't at the very least average, then I feel ashamed of showing my face. I've changed and grown in so many ways, but it never feels like enough, I always feel worse and further behind than everyone else. Today I had to be out for a few hours and so many things went wrong. I was sweating a lot, I hadn't walked this much in a long time so I was limping, I had to go somewhere new and looked lost, etc. Almost everyone that crossed my path made me think terrible things about myself, when half the time they didn't even look at me. Thankfully, everyone I interacted with was nice, and I had the opportunity to be nice back. It felt good smiling at someone holding the door for me and vice versa. Anyway, sorry to trauma dump on y'all. I'm gonna keep trying to live a good life and keep figuring things out. It isn't easy for me to share this because it could come back to me, but I hope that someone out there feels like they're not alone.
You sound like a really kind and decent person 😊
Can I offer another perspective? If you go out into the world, while perfect or somewhat good at everything, is that even human? Everyone has something they are bad at, and they don't deserve to be shunned for their imperfections when thats how they are recognizable as individuals. It's the "aw, that's our Doe, can't read a map to save a life"thing. Can you maybe try a class where you would be deliberately clumsy? Like painting or claywork. I recently did a cooking class and the average skills were pretty low, kinda the point of it, lol.
I just think that going out to be a superhuman out there would be very lonely cause you wouldn't have anyone offering help, and then how would you be able to surround yourself with good people.
@@ArielLVT Thank you! I at least try to be
@@strawberry_punch_art Logically, I understand that nobody is perfect, and I will never be perfect or maybe even close to it. But emotionally, when I fail at something in front of someone, it causes me a lot of internal distress. On the outside I play it cool, but in my head I'm kicking myself. It's what has driven me in the last couple of years and I'm afraid of losing progress if I let go of that mindset. Though In the right environment, I do loosen up a bit, so there's hope. I will reflect on your comment, you worded that in a way that resonated with me. I guess I really haven't been trying to be human? That could explain a lot. Thank you!
Literally described how I feel most of the time as well so yes this did help me feel less alone in this thx
Is Dr Honda a vampire or something? What do you mean he’s been a professor since the 90s? He looks like he just turned 40!
(hes half asian) 🥰 lol
He's 53. I looked it up. He looks fairly typical for a 53 year old, but also looks pretty good for his age :)
Within the last year or so, i think he started to get a little grey in his beard, which looks great on him and adds to the wise vibe, but it does give away his age a bit. Before that, I swear he looked in his 30s!
This is how people who genuinely attune with honesty to their core innate self, values and qualities age. People who has less negative emotions, intentions and experiences for prolonged times or even in frequency, and professionally know how to spot, take care of, and maintain their emotional and psychological wellbeing. Of course other factors play major key roles like his Japanese heritage genes, nutrition, exposure to clean air and water full of minerals and vitamins, sleep patterns, and financial safety which allows for a higher possibility of the above, but generally speaking their bio-psycho-social life and environment in which they marinate daily (especially important during the pregnancy periods of the mother, prenatal, natal, perinatal all the way some would argue up until age 17~18, the brain integrates and grows alongside the damages from traumatic experiences) is much more favourable. This is how those people age - naturally, as we're all supposed to. It's just a frightening contrast in realising how internally broken and/or unable to repair ourselves the remaining majority of us are in comparison to these 2 professionals.
The other half is swedish. Scandinavians dont age hard either.@@plantsntrance5513
The child in me really felt understood in this video for the first time, it explained a heck of a lot about my perceptions of the world back then. Alcoholic parents, one a psychopathic narcissist, the other OCD, so neglected in my early years and even more so in my teens after they divorced. However, I wanted to post because I have something to suggest towards a future video on spirituality. Coming into my 20s, I was still quite lost, unable to understand deep connections, but never used substances to cope because of my parents. A friend in uni brought in some female Buddhist monks for a talk to our class. Mind blown, didn't even know female monks were a thing (I'm a woman). I enjoyed their talk but what stood out to me most was this: "I encourage you to convince yourself that if what you believe makes your life better (and doesn't hurt anyone), does it really matter if it's true or not?" So I decided that believing that people were only tolerating me and that everyone thought I was weird was not helping my life, it was making me a loner, unable to truly connect with people and so unhappy. So why not take a leap of faith and try believing that people were generally nice and that trusting them would help me make deeper connections? It might not be true, and likely I would be hurt when it wasn't, but giving people the benefit of the doubt and believing it would drastically improve my life and perception of people and myself. So I did it. Almost overnight my life changed for the better. Certainly I have been hurt from trusting too much at times, but I consider it a small price to pay for my overall general happiness. 30 years later I still carry this with me today and you know, I discovered also, a lot of people will rise to your level of trust in them and that helps increase everyone's happiness. I am not into organized religion but I do feel very closely in tune with the Universe at times and I would partially credit this to changing my perception. Bad parenting only increases the level of unhappiness and bad coping skills every generation unless you can somehow break the cycle, and I think that society is now seeing the result of enough of the population being in this basket that the curve has gone exponential. Thank you both for your good work towards helping so many break the cycle, I've learned a lot here today and it also helps me to raise my own child better too. Much love.
I recently discovered about this as well! The image you have of yourself is so important. Our mind relies on our input about the world and will stay consistent to it. So if you say nobody likes you, your mind will make you be closed off and give weird vibes to prove to you that yes, you were correct. So it's better to think positively about things even if they're not true. Because one day they might be
Listening to Dr. Honda always restores my faith in humanity and myself. I had a tough day yesterday and i needed this. I'm not familiar with the other guy, but the way they both connected with each other was so special. Seeing men being vulnerable is so healing for me.
Dr Honda genuinely appreciates the recognition and its nice to see. It feels like as good as he is he doesn't meet enough people on the same wavelength who actively compliment him
Taking notes and not interupting is great podcaster relationship hygiene. I get distressed by podcasters with horrendous manners. This was SOO timely and may launch the next episode of my healing journey. Be Blessed❤
From about 45:00 onwards, hearing Dr. Honda talk about being there for and with a patient when facing the abyss made me tear up a little. Such a beautiful description of this incredibly kind and compassionate act. I am so grateful for the therapists around the world who manage to help their patients in this way.
this stream made me feel so relieved. it's actually possible that there's nothing terribly wrong with me on a fundamental level. thank you Dr. K and Dr. Honda!
This is why I felt I had found a treasure when I stumbled upon Dr. Honda's youtube channel. Without his channel I wouldn't be able to see why humans operate the way they do. It gave me confidence to try to become a better person. And also to try and keep my sanity in a world that I am seeing is okay with behaving abnormally.
As somebody that's a frequent listener of Dr. Honda's audio podcast, this was an incredible listen, not just because of the insights both of you provided, but as somebody that isn't a paying member of Dr. Honda's Patreon, I never got the opportunity to really get into his deep dives on AvPD and Schizoid PD, so to hear hear his insights on both conditions was an absolute enriching experience. Thank you for having him on your podcast, and look forward to seeing you two collab again in the hopefully not too distant future :)
Dr. Honda & Dr. K in one video? What is this, a crossover episode?
Yes, that’s exactly what this is 😜
RIGHT
MR PEANUT BUTTER
I have to rewatch bojack omg
It is a dream come true :) now watch again! ;)
This was amazing! Hope Dr. Honda comes back for more streams!
Two mental health professional who are absolute trail blazers bringing mental health literacy to the world via the internet! So beautiful to see how their worldviews, life experiences, educational backgrounds shape their approaches into their practices when working with their clients and brings an incredible amount of value to us! So much insight is provided through these lines of thinking being explained. Thank you so much for sharing these conversations with us, so grateful to have this knowledge and ways of thinking introduced to us.
I've been a fan of Dr H for years, I'm one of his patrons because his deep dives on attachment theory made me a better parent and I'll be forever grateful to him.
I knew I was on the spectrum of avoidant attachment but this made me think differently about my avoidance and how much deeper it is. Thank you so much. Watching you guys connect on a personal level was also extremely emotional to see. ❤
Absolutely in love with this conversation! The structure of information, the deep understanding of the topic, the natural flow of conversation and amazing chemistry - it's all just top notch.
I hope that it would be possible for Dr. K and Dr. Honda to make another talk on other topics, spirituality for sure is one of them
Thank you so much!
This was such a good conversation. I totally teared up when they were talking about Dr. k's bullying and Dr. Honda's foot incident. I hope they do more content together
that tangent is exactly what i needed to hear as someone who's studying to be a therapist.
As someone who is about to be 36, and have never been in a serious relationship I hate to ID with any disorder or disability.
I stumbled upon the subreddit for avpd years ago but AVOIDED even that because I noticed it actually
makes it worse when you associate with it too much. Lol
It sucks but every symptom of avpd resonates with me too hard. I had it way worse before, I didn’t leave my room for years basically in my mid 20’s. Video games filled my time.
A free, old treadmill received by a neighbor up the street saved my life. 20 minutes a day running got my brain back to more normal levels. I never have been in such a rut since then but have had months of similar activity.
Exercise, sun in your eyes/on skin in the AM is big. I still am a master procrastinator, befriending my anxiety in a way that I have to do something before a I panic. Taking right action is big.
I still deal with barely being able to look at my phone for texts and missed calls. Peace is something earned on the other side of courage.
THE GREATEST CROSS OVER IN RUclips HISTORY 😱😱😱
This information is absolutly mind blowing and was delivered in digestible, easy to understand way. Thank you very much and respect to both of you for being so open, authentic and professional at the same time❤😊
It was great to see 2 of the RUclipsrs I already watch collaborating but this was suh a good conversation and a bit of an antidote to toxic masculinity. Make this a series please!
As someone that grew up with neglect, I can definitely say that it can develop a coping mechanism in you that you can later use to protect yourself. While most people will still make an effort to hold onto their closest relationships when they feel hurt or bothered by someone, a switch can flip where the neglected person can literally drop that relationship and never talk to them for the rest of their lives without feeling remorse for it. And I think the reasoning for this is because it becomes ingrained in you that even those that love you the most will let you down and that people will never really love you, and this ideation is confirmed to you whenever someone does anything to hurt you. But to make things more complicated and harder for the neglected person is that you are naturally way more sensitive to your feelings being hurt than a regular person, you can even look for reasons to doubt a person and doubt their intentions no matter how kind they are to you. You are always on guard for someone to betray you, which is why this can lead to paranoia and even other issues.
But please be mindful that I'm not certain if this is just my personal experience because everyone is shaped differently however. But I imagine that those with avoidance have a similar reaction to easily being hurt and then being avoidant.
1:06:48 wholesome, healing, and corrective for you two and everyone watching who experienced similar being bullied and who even was the bully and regrets it deeply. So, thank you you two for going there and being two comfortably vulnerable dudes despite being near strangers to each other.
This was an absolute banger of a stream. Not too deep at all, the depth is an integral part of what made it so damn good. I know you're both busy content creators, but if possible, please please please bring him back!
My 2 favorite people that I learn about psychology from!! Love both of you ❤ I am a veterinarian and lonely people use me as a counselor often, which luckily I enjoy helping people also, and both of your videos have helped me understand people better and have increased empathy for people. I’m pretty empathetic already, but I do have my own issues which get in the way when people are hostile towards me, but both of you have helped understand my own and others reactivity better, which has helped me deal with clients so much better. So thanks so much to both of you for that! ❤
@@ShariHanneman I'm sick of this neurological planet pisses me the hell off
In case anyone is wondering, I had very critical Mom (she tried her best after her childhood which was even worse) and that affected my ability to deal with any criticism.
Nothing more touching than a fatherly strong gentle nurturing personality. Thank you for coming to this stream.
33:48 It is the neglect that creates the belief that there is must be something wrong with me. This is just sad that I had to learn to feel like this for the most of my life.
39:19 feeling first and then we fit reality to our feeling. it hits so hard.
45:14 There is a self there. A beautiful self. all of those negative things are the things that I have learned to survive.
47:50 this hits hard too
49:50 take a leap into the unknown still and always feels scary. Certainity gives me safety that I can handle it. Given the surprising behaviour on how my parents anger to me, the unknown feels like the world is going to end. The thing is that I am not with my parents anymore. The fear is there.
51:27 if we quiet the emotion, we create room for cognitive flexibility. It makes sense when my therapist really focus on squeezing the emotion. Most of the emotion that I felt right now are anger, sadness and fear. A combination of years and years of numbing and dissociation. However I am too afraid to feel. Feeling has been the one that stops me from getting out of the family. Now feeling is the one that stops me to live a fulfilling life.
1:26:10 I love day dreaming. the only hope that I have. Whenever I day dream, I feel like even though the dream is not real, it just feels so good. I never realized that this is just a manifestation of neglect and lack of stimulus. And yeah. I just dismiss how hard it was for a child to experience difficult emotion and no one there for him. Cries dries by itself. Crying till I got tired and sleep. Then the next morning trying to forget of what just happened. Not including the blindess to what I am experiencing. I don't know whether it is sadness, anger or fear. All that I know is that I must not feel this feeling.
1:26:40 If I don't feel my emotion, I don't need to worry to be rejected. this has been my defense mechanism. To survive the constant painful or rejection. Now I live in the different world and I still reject myself before the world reject me. The only difference is that my parents rejected me, the sub part of the world that I live in don't reject me. Yet, I still reject myself in advance.
1:29:00 this proto emotion hits home so hard. Now I am in my 30's expecting myself to navigate the world through the "common" way on how an adult in their 30's manage their emotion. However, my emotion is stunted and how can I expect myself to be able to navigate my emotion as an adult if I don't spend enough time to be a child. I feel I haven't passed the 4 years old of sadness and fear and 15 years old of anger. The sadness of not being cared. The fear of not being able to survive if I don't submit to my parents. I don't want to expect myself again in the sadness and fear. I feel sad and I feel fear. When I feel sad I just want someone who has a stable emotional regulation to hold me till I am stable myself. When I am afraid, I want someone to hold strong that I can face my fear. Unfortunately no one was there. I just want to admit that first. Now I am an adult and I can be there for my little self.
1:29:40 Yeah. I don't know what are my needs and how to fulfill them.
When two legends unite 🍻🤝
THE COLLAB IVE BEEN WANTING ALL ALONG BUT DIDNT THINK I DESERVEDDDD!!!!!!! Love you both!!!🫶🏽🫶🏽🫶🏽
After years of searching online for answers, this is a blessing I didn’t even know could exist. Thank you.
This is an awesome awesome one! I'm BPD on healing journey.( thanks to Dr.k) Studying psychodynamic counselling. In the future, I'd like to work with personality disorder. It is just amazing video. Thank you
When you asked about the difference between social anxiety and avoidant personality disorder, I yelled yes and jumped up in my basement as if my hockey team had just won the Stanley Cup
Timestamp?
@@Trintron46 Give me one sec, I’ll find it for ya
That’ll be 54:03 for ya boss
Awesome video. Really explained a lot to me; we (dissociative system) are being evaluated for personality disorders right now, and this opened my eyes a lot to how to help my system and myself through understanding potential roots that I cannot of some of our adaptions. Great work both of you
Two of my favorite mental health professionals doing a collab! It’s a great day to be alive. Thank you so much Dr. K and Dr. Honda (Kirk!)
I'm excited 🥳🥳🥳🥳. My dream came true. My two favs👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽. Wow, what a great convo. Best Collab.
I'm a long time super fan of Dr Honda and a pretty new one to dr K, and I have to say I'm OBSESSED about this crossover! I learned so much. I've listened to all of dr Honda's deep dives on PDs in the past, so I've heard this info before, but hearing dr K's input and slightly different persepctive to dr Honda's words blew my mind as well and helped me understand it all even more.
One thing I want to note though: my sister was pretty convinced she had AvPD for a long time and I was agreeing, she seemingly was meeting all the criteria. Turns out she got diagnosed with autism instead, no AvPD, and it makes even more sense now. I guess I just wanna say these 2 might present in a very similar way sometimes. The meme near the end, about pre and post meeting, applies 100% to high-masking autistic experience (I'm autistic too).
thank you for the great talk!
incredible stream. You could feel towards the end that Kirk had really found their comfort level on a topic, and was able to flawlessly talk about it. The discussion about intrusion and schizoid was truly eye opening. Definitely interested in more!
this conversation was amazing! thank you.
I could literally watch another 2 & 1/2 hour video from these two on avoidant and schizoid pd and I would still be deeply fascinated. This was such an eye opening talk. Please do more videos together!
this is the crossover I've been waiting for! excited to listen to this! 😊
This was such an engaging and helpful conversation. My partner has some avoidance tendencies and I legitimately feel like I learned valuable information to better connect with him. Thank you both!
Same here!
As someone diagnosed with both schizoid and avoidant PD, thank you for this conversation. Very insightful and relatable.
Never thought you guys would collaborate, this was not on my bingo card. I'm so happy right now I'm a great fan of both yalls content
So cool to see this collaboration and how your intellects interact! Please please do more!
This is gold purified. Thank you both and the team so so so much for this
Wow that was such an amazing colab. Possibly one of the best so far
I think you were both great. Dr Honda had great simple explanations and Dr K helped connect some of those dots. And then Dr K provided his understanding and interpretations, and Dr Honda helped connect those with more dots.
The more i hear the more i relate
I obviously cannot self diagnose but hearing all of these videos is a god send. Idk what i wouldve become if it weren't for these videos. Thank you
For the first time ever i am enjoying socialising, i am understanding myself, i am in tune with myself. The warmth is smthg that i never expected. I never knew that i didnt feel pleasure from life. I never realised how scared i was of people and admitting that yes, i was lonely, because i was ashamed, and that my daydreams were to compensate for my lacks. Thank you doc. Idk where i wouldve been if it werent for your videos and thank god i found them now. Im 16 and i fixed so much of my problems because i trust what you say and when i dont wanna do something, i remember your videos and take a risk and force myself to be with people, to not shut down, to not isolate myself, to adress my shame. It's been 3 years since i found your videos, and I finally feel content. I had the impulse to write my gratitude, and ofc i was maladaptive daydreaming abt talking to a pyschologist (i dont have one) about this amazing psychology youtube channel and how it helped me BUT i chose to express that daydream through words to make it a productive habit since i canr get rid of it anyway:D
Not even done yet, but this conversation has been incredibly eye opening thank both of you for doing this
I was just dreaming about this collaboration last week! Lovely intuitive conceptualization. Great job! -former student and therapist
I (most likely) have schizoid pd. Not diagnosed with it but my neuropsychologist wanted to and said I showed signs of it (while doing an adhd “investigation”)
And there is actually one time in my life that I can remember where I’ve really felt emotion. And it was overwhelming but not really in a bad way.
That one time is when I watched a video here a long time ago and it was some emotional attachment thing.
I’ve decided to try get back into treatment and actually feel, instead of being there answering basic questions with just my logical mind.
Gonna be looking for the video that I found that time. Been doing a lot of meditation recently which is great I guess but I’m missing that emotional feeling that I experienced then.
Thank you for this video
The crossover we've all been waiting for!
Dr. Honda is so cool, very excited for this!
Amazing conversation. Thank you both for your work!
Saving this to my Watch Later list.
(Because I’m at work and my lunch break is almost over)
Yes I know what you’re saying about the connection we just saw. It reminds me of the positive connection I’ve had with a therapist. Thank you for sharing that with us ❤
That was awesome 👐 thank you both 🎉🎉
I feel like I said "yes, 100%" or "yes, but..." to the entirety of the first 30 minutes. And I don't think I am just pretending because I didn't feel anything for any of the other parts (I wasn't bullied, for example), and my therapist was the first person to bring up avoidance to me. I would say that I don't feel like I have social anxiety; I imagine social anxiety as a more real, concious, rational emotion in response to actual real external social threats. With avoidance, it feels very internal. It is definitely quite magical in thinking and causality. I noticed I actually don't really care about actually upseting other people as much as I care about imagined social transgressions that will prove once and for all I'm a horrible person and make people hate me.
A word of caution - I am an atheist yet I find Dr. K's presentation of Karma very emotionally compelling, because I really do feel like my ego operates using "magical causality". Of course I am the worst person in existence, that is my Karma. Ah yes, of course I am the worst person in existence due to the crimes of other people (my ancestors, my past lives, etc). I would advise Dr. K to be careful talking about Karma to avoidant people because it can be the ultimate bs justification as to why avoidance becomes our Dharma.
Oh my good!! This is SOOO great!! I love you two collaborating 🎉🎉
I needed this. This is me and Ive wasted YEARS of my life trying to figure out what is wrong with me. Im just a human and the only issue is me thinking something is wrong with me.
Dear Dr K, this has been one of the most profound discussions on the internet, and I loved it to the core. It is possible to explore the ideas shared at 1:31:47 in detail (among the types) and what happens when an adult is treated that way. i.e. invading their private space and leaving them with no privacy. How does that manifest?
Thank you both for creating and sharing your wisdom. Much
Both of you So sweet so wise. Thank you ❤❤
Luv these two r talking!! And they r gushing over each other :)
This was a great stream! I have avoidant issues, specifically around women. I was forced into bad social situations without any support when I was younger, and there were girls who didn't like me and were mean / made rumors about me and bullied me (also I think some shit happened to me before I can even remember). Interestingly, in some situations like in a work environment or around only men I'm pretty chill.
I really appreciate the schizoid reference in this stream. I think my mother has schizoid. She was very emotionally absent, neglectful, and would daydream A LOT. She also had narcissistic tendencies and was completely in her own world.
The recent streams with other experts have been great. I hope there is more collaboration in the future
I absolutely loved this. I would be forever grateful if you guys could manage more of this collaboration
Very interesting. Watching a 2.5 hours long live stream (not live but as a video) seemed a bit daunting to me at first, but (other than that it's past 3 am now) it was absolutely worth it. I loved the interaction between you two, not only the professional parts but also the personal ones, especially the bullying experience part. I'm definitely looking forward to seeing you both doing this again!
That was really awesome. Thank you so much for doing this! We need more of Dr Honda and Dr K ❤
OMG I can't get over how much I love the way they talk to each other!!! I could watch this for daaaays
Thanks!
Thank you for this Dr. K I hope y'all make one on anxious type too
Absolutely amazing!! One of the best interviews! 🤩🥰 Loved it! The bromanze! 😄 Thank you for doing this one, really looking forward to the next one! The conversation about spirituality is going to be 😙👌🏼
I feel smarter just for having watched this. Thank you!
so good and you two work perfectly together
That was fun. Learning about your youth experiences was interesting.
You guys have to do this again!!!
rip bc my last therapist looked into that abyss with me and was like... nah i'm out good luck tho 💀💀 but very comforting to know there are some therapists out there that can handle it; gives me hope for others (and maybe one day myself.)
So Glad I was able to catch the end of this stream!
this is so unexpected omg i’m so happy about this
We need a part two and three of this!
Im leaving this feeling like you two just explained my whole life problems :o Im not very good in english, and I thought a LOT about what to say in here, but it's just... To much to express in words. I'm just... So grateful! Thank you Dr. Honda and Dr. K!
As a fan of both, a lover of knowledge and a human being, this was a great watch!