One note about the Dreadnought shell, armor breaking doesn't matter for it. In fact, weakpoint bonuses don't apply to the yellow health bar at all, because it's not armor, it's just a second health bar you have to drain to damage the actual health.
i think that's his point, hipster doesn't rely on its weakpoint modifier anywhere near as much as AISE does. AISE has a good edge if you can consistently hit weakpoints, but if you're not; its going to be pretty miserable compared to a huge number of other scout primary builds. if you do 10% extra damage during the weakpoint phase compared to hipster, but 50% less damage during the armor phase, hipster will come on top. although, the "armor" phases for hiveguards and twins are very negligible. AISE is more than good enough for those two, and being a little worse off against a standard dread isn't the worst thing in the world. (you can probably just use your secondary.)
It’s funny but I think you and waste fell into the same trap when talking abt hipster. To waste, hipster is suboptimal in coordinated teams in modded, where every class in min maxing according to their strengths and weaknesses. In general, generalists are worse there because they typically cost a class a bit of their strength (if your driller can’t clear crowds as well as he could then what is he even doing that the rest of the team can’t do better) In your case, it’s the opposite. In solos and pubs, where your builds are not coordinated, everyone needs to build for everything, and so you collectively become worse at dealing with certain situations. However, in situations where the team is getting ambushed by a cloud of mactera, or a truckload of swarmers, it would be better to have someone who specializes in taking out those targets, or else everyone focuses them down, and then there’s nobody to kill the other bugs. Once the team gets tested with a really hard mission with tons of every kind of enemy (and you can have those situations in Edds or even a rlly unlucky haz 5 mission), you’ll start to appreciate how much quicker you could do things if everyone picked their targets according to their strengths. Of course, there is a limit to both. You shouldn’t spec so hard into a role that you can’t do anything else, but you also shouldn’t generalize so much that you aren’t helpful to a coordinated team. It rlly shows that while drg isn’t particularly balanced, it can get away with it because of the variety of ways you can play the game. Different builds do different for different play styles, solos or teams, coordinated or pubs, modded or vanilla etc.
can't forget solo play when talking about modded, at that point you kind of need to be a generalist because your seeing every type of bug at such high quantities that you need to be ammo efficient, need to deal a lot of damage to all the types (swarms big 'uns and hvt's)
Oh wow, that actually clears it up a lot for me. When I watched waste's video I though his take was so horrid that he was just trolling, but now it actually makes a lot of sense! Thanks
@@carpet_appetite I mean it wasn’t horrid; it was a little exaggerated but he’s right in saying hipster is overrated and one of the worst options on m1k, it’s just still good in the right circumstances. It’s just focus shot builds can also be generalist if you learn them and use blowthrough, and they also do scouts role better (more damage at range, stun, kills HVTs faster). It’s not like you absolutely have to use hipster in solos or pubs, it’s only arguably better there, and is definitely worse in a good composition.
So I finally understand what this situation reminds me of. There was a lot of discussion in the broader FPS community around the game design of Doom 2016, Doom Eternal and Ultrakill. In Doom 2016, you have a deep ammo pool for each weapon so you could stick to using a few weapons you prefer and not touch others and you'll still be able to complete the game even on the higher difficulties. In Doom Eternal, that was no longer the case. Max ammo was constrained, and you are forced to use all 8 weapons interchangeably and combo them together to even really play the game. Mobility was expanded, too, so the game expects you to master Doomguy's movement to a higher degree. Later on with expansions you also have to juggle a few throwables and a few tools. It's a different design philosophy where the game tries to force you into the infamous "fun zone" where if you stick to it and do what is expected of you, you do really start to feel like an unstoppable god of destruction. Ultrakill is not like that, you can complete it with just the starter pistol if you want because the game has unlimited ammo, however it still has deep movement mechanics and weapon interactions that allow you to do absolutely wild stuff such as punching shotgun shells to make them go faster or reflect railguns off of coins tossed into the air for massive damage. Under The Mayo did a video where he disapproved of Ultrakill because of its perceived failure to _force_ you to switch guns around like in Doom Eternal, which he was flamed for and there was a bit of drama around it because he came off as a bit elitist and inflexible, as if the Eternal way is the only right way to play FPS and from now on "good" FPS should force you to play that way. Which is not the case, games are supposed to be fun. Here, this is basically the same kind of discussion. Yes, you can play DRG on Haz 5 with only using the Hipster M1k, without ever touching your secondary even. That's absolutely fine. However, eventually it just stops being fun or challenging. If you try the same approach on modded Hazards, it just doesn't work. There are way too many bugs even for Hipster. You won't be able to kill the most dangerous bugs fast enough nor will you be able to hold your ground against hordes of smaller bugs. However, when you look at the game in the broader context, you notice that the 4 dwarves have between them 8 guns, multiple throwables, and mobility tools. Familiar is it not? It's the same choice. There will be players who prefer to stick to the generalist guns which are comfortable, but these players will face difficulties coping with challenging scenarios or constrained resources. There will be players who prefer to specialize to the max, and play in a team which, collectively, will use every one of their 8 guns all the time against different targets by playing off each other and performing sick combos. These players will feel like Haz 5 is underwhelming, and will install mods to increase the challenge to the level of their team's true ability. Vanilla DRG doesn't force anyone to play a certain way, play any way you find fun. But if you struggle with increasing the difficulty you play on, you should try to specialize and avoid generalist weapons. And maybe find a decent team of players who know what they are doing. This also avoids the plateau of DRG lategame when the weapon overclock grind is complete and there is not much game content to engage with. You have to create your own challenge and figure out if you still like the game even when it stops holding your hand. And there is external content tailored to players who feel that way.
@@Storse I meant that if you look at other FPS games beyond DRG you will find some similar themes. I used this particular example here because I remember it well. But I can also recall, say, the disdain that the Counter-Strike community holds for certain weapons like machine guns and some SMGs which are imprecise, spammy, and fail to remove key enemy players in firefights quickly enough, which is, too, very similar to how Hipster works in DRG and how it is viewed. They, too, advise that it is better for a team to have members dedicated to specific roles such as an AWP sniper and to use weapons which can reliably land headshots as opposed to weapons that are spray-and-pray.
@@p_serdiukYou cant beat Ultrakill with just the basic pistol (or its near impossible), look at any video of any late game stage with Mayo% in the title it is very, very tough.
@@cairill There is a difference between it being very tough and impossible. Doom just doesn't give you enough ammo to kill all enemies with a restricted selection of weapons.
@p_serdiuk its not litterally impossible but it requires mastering every other aspect of the game besides the guns. To beat the game with just the basic pistol will require mastery over every other system involved (enemy ai, placement, movement and parries) I would say that this is an entirely unrelated arguement to the video as of course hipster being good/bad is unrelated to promoting skill expression.
17:00 how do people think like this? Yes the classes are different, they specialize at killing different enemies, which is why they should focus on those enemies, but focussing on an enemy type never means not killing other enemy types too. Drg is a horde shooter, you get run on by pretty fast enemies, at the end of the day you are defending yourself and teammates from dying and not wasting revives/HP, so when a horde of enemies are after you, the gunner isn’t always gonna be able to kill every single grunt, they aren’t even all aggro toward them. I just urge these people to try and play like you would solo, yes you know your gun is good at certain things but at the end of the day you kill grunts in solo, not your teammates.
"Shooting again" is why I find it fine to take blowthrough when I build Hipster on certain loadouts, especially when I run Cryo Bolts and Pheromone Canisters together. Such a delicious, delicious cleave build.
Nice explanation and points! Counter argument : me no like spam clicking. If i want something fast firing(which is most of the time) i just pick one of the other two primaries.
Are Axis and waste gonna have Hipster beef now? I think it would be cool to see these two content creators do a collab like what Axis and Lazy did with gold!
@@Miho51307 As someone that's watched a good bit of waste, he's got quite the dislike for Hipster. Even in the super long video they did, the other CC he was doing the video with wasn't super adamant about how bad he though hipster is, but waste was very strongly against it. Personally I really don't see the overclock being so bad that it's worse than nothing or even a low tier overclock. There's a good chance in modded difficulties it's not an ideal overclock and doesn't make use of m1000's strengths to the fullest, which may be the reason why he doesn't like it. I will add some nuance though, waste himself said that Hipster doesn't really fall into "worse than nothing" because it's really changing the gun into an entirely different weapon.
@@mastersanada I think both waste's video and this one are memes in their own ways. Like muh man waste opens up in OC tier list video with premise on how he's ranking OCs based on how happy would a new player be with getting an OC, and then proceeds to rate them as if a new player is gonna be jumping in haz7 with premade squad of tryhards in which everyone just optimizes every single droplet of everything in the game. And muh fella Axis over here closes up with saying he only cares about vanilla, and how in vanilla generalist builds (and hipster being the best of them) are usually kings because they allow to have a good time no matter the circumstances, while throughout whole video taking jabs at people that take waste's approach to viewing the game. The cherry on top is, Axis have said before that LARPers (RolePlayers as he called them) are bullying him for choosing to do speedplay, while sending shots in this video at people that view this game through the lens of modded difficulties only, forgetting that vanilla is way different. The things both dudes be saying is hilarious to me personally , I love it
@@yaroslavcoloskov6357 Yea I think the major problem is it's so difficult to really make a comprehensive tier list without completely getting the tier list wrong in some aspects. If we're rating OCs purely off of fun, that'd be subjective (for the most part. We all know nukes are fun). If we're rating them off normal play, certain ones were certainly be up there, whereas others wouldn't be. If we were rating them purely on modded play, the tier list would also look different. All in all, I think a fair number of the tier lists in the game don't really help if you yourself don't already have a fundamental understanding of the game (which I think Axis does actually talk about). You won't understand *why* waste's tier list makes sense until you play the same difficulties he does extensively with those builds, and in the same way you won't understand why Axis' arguments make sense until you play extensively the way he does. I, however, do think that as a whole waste's tier lists are very helpful and do generally point out strong and weak overclocks. I think some of his stronger opinions could be a little more moderate (and the other CC in that 4 hour marathon tier list video I think was more moderate in his opinions and that helped).
@@mastersanada I agree with everything but 1st sentence. I feel like making a comprehensive tier list isn't that hard, just tedious. Providing compelling argument for each OC however would be so tedious that I don't think anyone would care do so. But yeah I'm with you, each viewpoint has it's merits.
I think High Value Targets should not be confused with priority targets, because the latter depends on your class. Consider this: say you're a scout in a full team in the middle of a swarm. There is a sea of grunts, two menaces and a couple of macteras. What do you shoot first? Correct, you take down the menaces, and cryo the macteras while you're at it. And now, *if you don't have anything better to do,* you might as well shoot some grunts, because otherwise you're just leaving firepower on the table. Now picture a driller built for sticky flames in this same scenario. Do you bother sniping down those menaces with your subata or TCF or something? Obviously not, you have a horde of grunts coming towards you, and you have a goddamn flamethrower. But now those are gone, and one of the menaces is still burrowing around. Naturally you shouldn't ignore it, even if someone else is focusing on it, you can always help kill it even if it's just by setting it on fire, and especially if it's by freezing it. HVTs are usually considered to be things that can do lots of harm individually or in small numbers. Priority targets are what YOU as a given class would be best suited to deal with in a given situation. HVTs are Scout's priority, but that doesn't mean they have to be the only things he shoots. You have a gun. *Use it.* Of course, this is all in the context of teamplay, where the strengths of different classes make up for the weaknesses of others and/or complement their strengths. Solo, on the other hand, is a different story, because there you can grab hipster + fire bolts like Axis did and pulverize everything in your way.
Sludge everything, let the grunts melt in puddles as you avoid them. If macteras are tri-jaws try to find a line to charge at them with a WC (after sludge) because they're better a tracking horizontal movement, then last worry about the menaces.
Exactly, noone is saying you should ignore grunts and kill HVT's only and do nothing in meantime. But since scout deals with HVT's that much better than others, he should immediately switch focus to them once they appear and threaten the team. E.g. a driller could be unaware about that trijaw charging his shot from behind since he is busy with trash mobs. But a scout can easily avoid getting swarmed and look around to prioritize spitters, mactera or menaces and once he has cleared all those, turn to help dps trash mobs. E.g. a driller, especially with TCF, has a VERY hard time dealing with menaces. Meanwhile for scout it is point and click. Playing to strengths helps a ton.
I just started playing this game and after not paying attention and taking a few supply drops to the gord I had the thought, “could this be timed to my advantage”. Very Rock n Stone indeed !!!
If you dare to ignore missed breakpoints, and just "shoot it again", taking any implications from raw total damage as nitra/ammo efficiency is a fallacy. Because if you just stack 500 healthbars of bugs altogether, you can't say you need 2 full ammo loads if full ammo load total damage just because one full load is 50% worth these 500 healthbars. You will lose on overkill. M1K-18 clipsize is the actual build that can care not about where you shoot your bullet. It both has blowthrough and time to kill a grunt pack because it has... yes you got it - it has the breakpoints. It does it cheaper and you still can just spam the full DPS of it into whatever target you like. And yep, M1K-18 is a hipspam build. It only uses focuses for long range and T5 utility. I mean, sure 6rof is better for dopamine if you get dopamine from shooting your gun as fast as possible. Otherwise if one asks for "most ammo efficient M1K build" you either take the breakpoints into account or keep your blind total ammo fallacy with you.
This entire waste vs Axis fiasco could've been resolved easily if both parties actually talked to each other and came to an agreement that the difference in their respective playstyles makes all argumentation null and void. Hipster is a generalist, in a game where completing a mission on the highest difficulty is far from hard. So, if anything, it's adequately powerful in that context. I do have a question though: why prepare for exceptions? You can ignore a korlok, you can ignore an OMEN. And, in the context of M1K, there is very little the gun is not good at (Hipster or not), so while this OC exacerbates the generalist side of M1K (in a more hipfirey way), it's not by any means the end-all be-all of M1K overclocks. It's just good. That's it.
The goal of speedplay (or anything outside of modded tbh) is to try and complete every objective - optional or not - inside a mission as fast as possible. Hipster makes you better at dealing with exceptions with little to no cost against other enemy types besides some breakpoints, which are pretty negligible in the grant scheme of things.
An important part that is overlooked is that hipster does what base M1000 does. What I mean is that with hipster, you can maximize chances of hitting an enemy with more shots. You touch on that when you talk about "shoot it again." I kinda want the Scouts AR to get an ammo buff across the board. The AR's strength is shooting again, really fast. Whenever I mod for rate of fire, I run out of ammo faster, often at inconvenient times. I'm on controller, so that ability to have controlled shots on M1000 helps ammo efficiency. This video made me wonder what other reasons I would take hipster over any AR build.
With hipster i guess you can unload full clip in a quick session or until the target dies. I don't know the exact number but hipster definitely feels faster to kill things compared to base M1k
The summarization of this 28 minute video, is play the game the way that you like to play it. Tryhards are going to play differently, because they think it's fun. In a cooperative shooter, you can legitimately BOTH BE RIGHT, but maybe you shouldn't play together, you are going to just argue constantly about min/maxing.
Generalist usage for a build is huge in pub and solo play due to the abundance of random events. Your build is bad with robots? Here's a Prospector. Bad at HVTs? Here's Trijaws, Menaces and Wardens together. Bad at burst DPS? Here's a Korlok. Bad at holding an area? Here's a Tritilyre deposit. Needs specific terrain to work? Too bad, your next mission is in glacial strata with a giant vertical tunnel. Doesn't have an accurate weapon? Here's a Rockpox Swarm Can't kill dreads? Here's a random dread. Can't break armor? Here's a Stingtail. (That's why I run a HyProp/ECR Lok-1/Mine Engineer, can do everything with a benefit of being the best Industrial Sabotage build)
mentions glacial strata when magma core is sitting right there Also, "accurate weapon" just means anything hitscan in this case. If you're running a projectile or area weapon of any kind rockpox is hell.
@@roar104it’s kinda late, but mines are better if you use repellent and chockpoints properly, and shredders are worse in that exact same situation, along with not scaling with enemy density. That said, both options are really good, but proxy mines are better if you use repellents and chockpoints to full effect
However, the end result is the same. Hitting a focus shot -> same net reward as if you were to have hit two normal shots. Missing a focus shot -> same net loss as if you had missed two normal shots.
@@ParasocialCatgirl No. Hitting two normal shots requires you to aim at the target, shoot, wait for the bloom to subside, then aim at the target a second time, and shoot. Hitting a focus shot requires you to hold down M1 for a bit, aim with pinpoint accuracy, and fire once. It's easier to execute in practice. Especially when you're dealing with multiple targets. You can use the time it takes to set up the focus shot to aim, and you won't lose any DPS. But hitting max DPS with good accuracy with hip shots takes much more skil because you don't have much time to aim between shots and you have to manage recoil.
@@sharktrap267 Spitter heads get smaller the further away they are. And they're usually covered up by their head shells, so the hitbox is maybe a couple pixels of your less than a degree in practice. I mean, unless you happen to find a spitter that's facing directly at you.
I feel like a lot of this community disagreement probably does revolve around the necessity of role progression in particular. If I’m loading into a modded difficulty with several other skilled players you’re coordinating with, and we all know what we need to be doing, then yeah one could say scout’s grunt clear is notably less relevant, and that he really needs to focus on the HVTs while other dwarves do what they are best at, so maximizing even the minutiae on picks on enemies like Tri-jaws is important and notably valuable. You touch on that when you comment shortly on modded difficulties. In such a case the driller for example is going to be good enough with sticky flames or whatever to clear the grunt lion share out, and the scout can provide a lot of value shooting those HVTs in particular (as there’s a lot of them to go around). Whereas in contrast, if I load into a random haz 5 game with players who aren’t role compressing in that same way and may not be as good, something like hipster shines in scenarios where you have to be good at multiple things to save the rest of the team or to pick up their slack, or just for shooting down myriad threats in solo. Hope this doesn’t cause some long term beef. Obviously Waste took a humorous shot across the bow in his video, and there’s some of that in response here, and it seemed to upset him. It just sounds like some back and forth shots across the bow to me, but it seems like Waste took it harder than that (maybe he saw it as harsher than I did or I just didn’t catch on to the extent others may have).
Genuine question, though: why couldn't I apply modded gameplay to vanilla? Why would it be less valuable to one-shot HVT because it's Haz 5? Why should optimization be considered an antithesis of fun?
@@That_Goddamn_Scout Certainly, if you're running a top tier, skilled team and you all hyper specialize into your roles haz 5, it would still be as strong as you could be, though the benefits of this are less relevant in haz 5 because haz 5 doesn't come close to requiring that level of strength emphasis. Generalist setups are more useful within haz 5 if you're running with less skilled players, i.e. randoms or just casual friends, or within solos, as they allow you to more easily pick up their slack/handle multiple kinds of problems, and the loss you take from not role compressing isn't very relevant. Building for the latter therefore makes more sense if you're just playing haz 5 casually with less skilled friends, in solos, or with random players. If that's not the environment you typically play within, then generalism would be less useful to you. I personally don't find hipster to be the be all end all and tend to enjoy generalist blowthrough builds for haz 5 more on M1k, though I did find Waste's take on Hipster to be unfair outside of modded. I also didn't even comment on the fun factor. Which setup is more fun for you is up to you, and deciding to run something more optimized towards Scout's niche or whoever's niche on Haz 5 is very very far from a dealbreaker, so just run whatever you want.
Like 3 min in and there’s a segment about how Hipster turns a flick gun into a tracking one …there’s a big “AI Stability Engine” shadow being cast over this topic lmao
Im playing like 100 games only with AI stability engine and zhukov gas recycling. That midigate argument of “waiting fór teammates to crush the shales” cause only few ammo of zhukov will delete armor (even dreadnaught) and then u can just burn HPs with gk2. Also i like control of situation. As i watched this gameplay, i saw that it is very effective but i dont acquire súch a skill now (i mean mobility). Anyway i tried few games with hipster, and its good, it just doesnt fit my style. I like to fly across the room and give headshots to everything. And if they get close, zhukov will piercing bullets will destroy them, in combination of last modification of higher dmg when electrocuted after throwing boomerang you just wipe the floor with everything in front of you. And thats what i like 😁 im not degrading hipster and consider myself greenbeard stíll, so maybe ill change my mind later 😃
Base M1000 - You need to be accurate. OC M1000 - You need to be more accurate. Hipster M1000 - Accuracy through volume of fire. EFS M1000 - *Braincell deletion intensifies*
Axis, everyone knows this is a jab at waste's vid but that tumbnail is just low. Deliberately including the purple L in the top right as an immature jab, pretending you're "dunking on goons". How old are you man. That's why people in the community get so annoyed at 'tryhards'. I don't really care about the debate at this point but stop trying to artificially create drama, even if you don't mention him directly
It's pathetic is what it is. The whole video is just a long string of ad-hominem attacks and mocking insults, coupled with him alluding to himself being "better than every scout he can find footage of". What an arrogant asshole he's shown himself to be
As a focus-fire only guy, i can respect hipster for its accessability. Focusfiring takes alot of brainpower for me, so im glad there are competitive dps options for those who can't or don't want to clutch out a higher high with appropriate minmaxxing
@@michaelkolano8686 Exactly, it has more burst dps than GK2 and more armor shred at the cost of you needing to spam click. Feels kinda cheap, not to mention the overall dps/ammo economy.
@@celestialowl8865 Pretty sure that's gunner since he's only useful if your team isn't very good. Being a jack-of-all-trades is very beneficial for solo and pub play which is a majority of what most players experience.
Engie is a really strong jack of all trade i mean platform gun can get you anywherw plus make a good place to kite/defend his sentry and guns do a decent job at whatever you are doing from killing swammer to dps dread but what engie really struggle is that he can use all his ammo too easily so to newer player who just shoot and not care about the small stuff like will i be wasting my shotgun ammo if i shoot at this gunt with 1 hp?
@@ghoulbuster1not really. It can just spend ammo really quick. But in terms of total damage pool it’s basically second only to some driller builds depending on how much value they get off of aoe dot stuff.
... Yeah. That's the top of the game balance. Anything higher isn't in the base balance of the weapons the devs put together. As proven by 60 or 40 nitra drops.
@@olaf.forkbeard "i outplay pretty much every scout that i could find gameplay of, not just in combat but in the metagame progression. There very few people that can push objectives, fight and have an overall view of the gamespace and deal with ennemy as well as i can with Hipster in hands" this guy is so pretentious, while to be fair he is just above average at this game
@@zgxmax Yea he should honestly just post some modded gameplay in that case, I only started playing modded recently because haz 5 has felt like a joke for a while and quickly realized I'm not actually very good mechanically.
@@boydquinoaThis. Haz 6 slapped me across the face, hard. Vanilla DRG promotes questionable gameplay habits that only become more obvious as you experiment with higher (and arguably better crafted) difficulties
There's no reason to laugh at that. This will just continue the toxicity of the discussion going on. Modded imo challenges players more but in different ways. But laughing at Haz 5 speedplay still is not a great look.
The community at large is not quite receptive to adverse opinions, and quick to shut you down if you try and go against the "Haha funny dwarf game" mindset. Any criticism is viewed as a personal attack and you're immediately labeled a "leaf lover". Perfect example of toxic positivity
@@That_Goddamn_Scout in my experience any community that quickly adopts a cheeky nickname for trolls (or naysayers) will go from "wholesome" to "shit" just as quickly
The thing that catches me on hipster is that, if I wanted a gun that I can use to spam fire at the bugs until everything dies, I’d just use the other two primaries that do that job WITHOUT needing to give myself finger spasms
Fantastic points! Personally, I feel like hipster is fine, not overpowered, because a big part of how I look at builds is 'versatility'. Notably, not combat versatility, which is what you discussed for most of the video. Instead, what I look for (and enjoy) the most in overclocks is *build* versatility, where I consider how many builds said weapon/overclock/upgrade can fit in, and especially *meaningfully synergize with*. There definitely was a point where I played hipster (and thought I always would) and enjoyed its general power, but at the stage of the game I am, hipster is unfortunately boring because, as you've stated, your primary solution to nearly any situation is simply "open fire until it stops moving". As for how I address combat versatility? Simple. I look at the *build*, not the weapon, to see how effective it is across a wide spread of situations. Carpet bomber doesn't have the HVT capabilities I need? Good thing BRT packs enough ammo to spare for situations I'm not expecting, or if need be, power picks can help make up the difference, 4 ammo at a time. Finding solutions for builds like these to *make* them work in every possible situation is one of the few things I still enjoy about the game, and it also keeps me on my toes, learning new builds, playstyles, and seeing how they perform in a wide variety of situations. 15:58 (I was gonna delete this tangent about nuances I've noticed in combat versatility but since you asked, you get the full essay this time ;D) Part of the reason why Hipster is so good is because the only versatility it lacks, one of player position (and even then, only slightly), is completely covered by the class it's on. Hipster loses a lot of effectiveness when it lacks any weakspots to hit, or in very close quarters where you can't afford to fully unload without dying. Fortunately, a large portion of scout's kit is geared around circumventing this, with cryo creating damage multipliers when there aren't any reachable ones left on the target, and the flare gun and grapple ensuring you're never caught unawares and you always have a way out of any corners you might find yourself caught in. Gunner's minigun has the raw sustained output (usually) to not have to reposition to hit weakpoints consistently or need damage multipliers to outgun a horde, but against HVTs whose only counter is movement? Gunner is stuck relying on Dash, a well-placed zipline, or the catch-all shield to buy enough time to get things back under control. Part of why I've played a lot of engineer lately is due to his weapons playing heavily with these limitations, where his weapons are all extremely versatile in one or two aspects (PGL for enemy distance and amount, BC for enemy weight class, Stubby and Loki for range where warthog ignores damage typing), while still having significant weaknesses (usually what you choose between, as well as ammo in general, due to none of the weapons having enough sustain for a whole swarm barring one or two exceptions). This lets me craft a build where I have weapons intricately weaved together, to counter either enemy weight class, amount, or even positioning, with my favorite build (yes, ECR+VIR+shredders and twin turrets) resulting in a full arsenal of weapons that all cover each other's weaknesses without leaving me dry. Also, regarding class roles in combat: while I definitely agree that the mindset of limiting yourself to only one role is detrimental, when it comes to prioritizing what you do first, it's definitely worth remembering that scout *can* fight bugs effectively, it's definitely more time-efficient to have scout spend five seconds mining than a whole minute fighting, and vice versa for gunner (driller and engi get more leniency due to having more versatility overall). In a situation where both bugs and minerals exist, it's more efficient for classes to focus on their specialties when they can, but that obviously doesn't mean that scout should be ignoring the spitballer or leech or prespawned grunts reaching for them if engineer or gunner (or long-range driller, I won't judge) don't pop them immediately.
your scout you can either 1 leave (not your problem with a grappling hook) 2 use your secondary (cryo/flame bolts, taser bolts, chem explosive bolts, bodkin bolts, cryo minelets and boomstick in general) 3 throw a nade (all work expect stun but why would you take stun) 4 just shoot them you oneshot grunts in the face with 231XX ASS
Hey Axis. For a lot of this video the gameplay shows you using a boltshark build that utilises fire bolts and taser bolts. What's the rationale behind this? Personally taser bolts are the last one I would take with fire bolts, so I find this choice quite confusing.
The logic behind it is sound, fire bolts are for crowds of bugs/temp shocking with cryo nades, whatever else. And the taser bolts are for slowing down big single targets like dreadnoughts, praetorians bulks or oppressors. They also work for area denial when doing something like a salvage op too. Combined with hipster it is one of the best generalist loadouts you can have as Scout.
Coz it freezes the vents and more damage can be done. The thing doesn't show the status effect but it works. Kinda wish they'd fix that so it does show, tbh...
I came after watching waste's hipster video. I agree with your points, but I have my own reasons for not using hipster. First things first. It kills my wrist. I go through periods of needing to let me arm take a rest, but I don't want to make that worse. Second is my playstyle. I have tried numerous times to use hipster, but I cant adjust fully to the hipster strategy. I find myself using it just like a base mk1 build and I'm worse for it. Also I would like to say that I like to focus on HPTs, but when it is reasonable. I make sure my builds are fully capable of killing any enemy at a moments notice as when you team goes down, you're gonna need it. Love your video🙂
try running hipster with focus shot, damage, armor break, and stun on focus shots. It does nearly as good at killing HVTs with the added benefits of being able to do most of what hipster spam fire builds do
@@roar104 I already run damage and armor break on hipster. I take the faster reload after kill instead of stun on all of my builds as I find it much more useful. I used to run stun all of the time, but I found that stunning praetorians and menaces can make it difficult to finish killing them if you arent fast enough and I would much prefer a faster reload. As for focus shot, I think it is terrible on hipster. You blow through your magazine so fast with hipster and reducing that greatly hampers my ability to put out sustained dps. Also a little bit extra focus shot damage doesn’t matter much when you can shoot immediately after shooting a charged shot.
I know what you mean about the faster reload in T5, but learning to cancel reload animations on M1K helps a lot and makes the reload time almost the same. So taking T5 stun comes as a bonus flexibility. @@tysoncook5152
@@roar104 if you're doing focus shots at all on Hipster, you might as well use any other OC. That's why its overrated as fuck. It comes from a time when Cryo Minelets were meta.
I think the best example you give in this video is "super-cooling chamber is going to kill a praetorian slightly faster, but when I turn around and find three slashers, which weapon is going to be better?" Having a secondary that makes up for your primary's weaknesses doesn't mean that it doesn't have them
But aren't said weakness made irrelevant, or at least less impactful, by your choice in secondary? Dealing with these slashers is as easy as clicking once or twice with, say, your boomstick. This comment also made me realize both parties are judging Hipster alone and not in the context of a build. Food for thought
I can agree with the "kill HPM" thought. Every time i tried some very specific weapon build to counter X i, at some point, got into a situation where there's not X. Or when there's very little X coz classes that like to shoot more kill them faster than u. And then u want to take a resupply coz u're out of nades/secondary/flares and u notice that ur primary is 80% full or something.
In my opinion focus shot m1k is still quite good at everything else so I wouldnt be that stumped. Also if you focus HVTs with m1k you can consistently kill them before other people do and before they are a threat and spend a lot of ammo that way.
@@Marian_DRG you just can't be everywhere at once. HVT never just come from one spot in one convenient pack. It's always some random rap on the celling, macteras, slashers and so on. There's no way engi+gunner wont outgun u against at least some of those
Idk why people talk so much about hipster while ignoring the real problem OC for the m1000, electrifying focus shots. I mean, what synergy! You can use the Zhukovs OR the Boltshark! Even the coveted Inhibitor Field Generator pales in comparison to it
Pretty much agree with everything in this video (esp 16:40 onwards), as someone who has 50+ promos with scout and isn't even that invested in "picking a side" regarding m1000 OCs. (Bouncy drak + emb dets main lol) The main issue with the recent discourse seems to be that seasoned players (who maybe have graduated to mostly playing modded difficulties) are forgetting how different the game is played by the vast majority of players who are consuming their content (to be especially clear, I'm not referring to Axis here). Speaking as someone who occasionally plays haz 6x2 - team comp, team synergies, and role specialization are all much more important for success, but the overwhelming majority of people watching DRG content are still just playing haz 3-5 with friends or in pubs, where a generalist, good-in-any-scenario OC like hipster shines. Advice that is born from playing modded difficulties - with a full team of graybeards who are all on the same page - won't always hold up when brought down to the casual context that most players play the game. For example, how much you value ammo efficiency in a build is highly biased by whether your resupplies cost 40 nitra (in 6x2s) or 80. Also, Prospectors are just straight up taken out of the game in most modded difficulties lol.
Hey, genuine question. do you not find drak (and other non-hitscan weapons) weird when you are not the host? It's just... idk, but it always feels just a LITTLE bit worse every time I'm a client, not a host.
Until you're facing Oppressors. Or dreadnaughts. Or Shellbacks. Or Korlok. Spitballers. Nexuses. Breeders. Omen. corruptor. Huuli Hoarder. Swarmageddon. Or literally any swarm big enough that just stunning/slowing down only 8-9 of them does practically nothing. So, yeah. definitely not the "all problems" solver.
You just need to play at a higher difficulty where you have to rely on your teammates and focus on specialization. I don't think your problem is with hipster, it is with the difficulty you're experiencing at the experience you are at.
I agree to many points in the video. Mostly that Hipster is very safe generalist OC that will be fit for every mission/situation because there is nothing more bullets can't fix. However, something overlooked about focus shots is that they are always 100% accurate. Sprinting especially fucks up M1000 accuracy, more than Hipster can make up. So a lot of the shots at bigger distances can either miss entirely or at least miss a weakpoint that considerably increases dmg/dps. E.g. it will be much easier to land 2 charge shots to kill a Spitballer or a Menace with SC before it even has time to react. Than spam entire magazine of Hipster to only maybe kill it. Another overlooked fact is ammo efficiency vs breakpoints. Hipster is considered "op" with how much more ammo it gives, but paper≠reality. Since it takes 1 more shot to kill a grunt (most common enemy), you are actively spending more ammo per every grunt you kill. And also waste larger part of clip size leading to more reloading. So the real benefit is smaller than it may seem. Especially considering you can take ammo+blowthrough on stock M1000 and still maintian onetap in head. Lastly, this may be VERY specific, but some enemies have breakable weakpoints. Meaning they benefit more from weapons that overpenetrate and gain full damage boost. Than weapons that break the weakpoint immediately with lots of small damage instances. E.g. extreme example, there exists a build for M1000 SC that lets you oneclip haz5 4 player bulk (6000hp) in one clip using IFG. Each shot deals 1201 damage and barely doesnt break blisters in one shot. It is effectively the fastest and most ammo efficient way to kill a bulk (apart from leadburster lmao, that one is broken). But as you said, every specific scenario will always have that one build which is better in that specific scenario. Hipster excels in being versatile and not caring about what you encounter and still being good enough.
Exactly, Hipster is something that is good enough but doesn't do anything well. MK1 specifically loses its niche against GK2, which has been buffed heavily. Why wouldn't you just use GK2, which can put out more DPS with BOM/AISE and is far more consistent at range.
why run WP when you're going cryo bolt in this vid? would BT not help immensely in this scenario? I understand WP if you don't want freeze in the build though
Even if you run some cryo, not every targets will be frozen. You can not take it on the basis that it does nothing to frozen targets, but you will suffer against every non frozen grunts and guards (and some other targets, but stingtail, warden and co are likely to warrant their bolt)
Hoverclock 13211 or 13221 does the same shit hipster can do at a similar DPS but you also get hoverclock. Use minimal clips if you don’t need Hoverclock. It’s missing nothing and it works on every mission, exactly what you asked for
I kinda fell victim to that "kill HPTs" narrative so I haven't been using hipster all too much lately, but considering my aiming skills, it's probably for the best if I start using it again :ь Upd: I guess one thing that makes me use less efficient builds for my skill level that punish me ammo wise for missing is that when I do land my shots, it feels pretty damn satisfying
literaly the same thing with scout in MVM from TF2. If your job is colecting cash it doesen't mean that you don't have one of the best primaries in the game and unbinding the attack button isn't the best idea.
IMO where hipster truly shines is when you are a casual player cruising around random lobbies. Whether your driller is rocking with goo bomber special and fully automatic subata or engie with turret arc and plastcrete catalyst. It doesn’t matter if they are goofing around having fun or they are truly green beards. A scout with a hipster is always the anchor for the team. You can manage anything, stomp every mission type and be the so called “carry” on the team. I’m not a haz 6x2 player or what. I know nothing about the shortcomings of hipster in higher difficulties, but in the content where I truly enjoys, hipster is just the most handy and comfortable option for me. I can see the point of hipster is not as “op” as people hyped it up to but I don’t think it is nothing or perhaps worse than that.
Most weapon mods I use and don’t get the most out of immediately but hipster first time I used it felt it was strong but saw how people felt about it online and figured I must be missing something. Ty for saying it’s ok to use hipster lol
hipster is just fun, most people play drg to have fun, i couldn’t care less about meta and viability in a pve game. Hipster can be as bad or as good as it wants, im still gonna be doing a red dead redemption cosplay shooting 12 enemies in rapid succession like a rabid cowboy.
I tried hipster not so long ago and now is my god damn favourite overclock and a really strong one. People caring about a single number a oneshot can do with a lots of multipliers to oneshot a enemy. This game has alot more than that to offer Even this game isnt really being honest THAT hard that you actually need EVERY BULLET to win, is a casual game to vibe and try, good movement and fights, hordes, classes and shit. And gives u ALMOST a INFINITE WORLD OF WAYS that YOU CAN PLAY IT. Find your flow then rock it and stone it ❤
People sleep on generalists in games in general. Competitive players always will take the extreme options, but at the average gamers level generalist options are a godsend especially in teams since you are extremely adaptable to what your team needs you to do.
I use hipster but solely because it feels more consistent than stock. The hitreg of the m1000 feels HORRIBLE doing chargeshots for me. So sticking to hip firing just feels better and more consistent
Scuze me? Gk2 is bad against dreadnought armor? Do you actually take the measly 20% weakpoint damage, especially when you have ai stability engine, over 600% armor break?
My outlook has always been play how you want to play. I run Drak with SBB and Boomstick with double trigger. It let's me turn the game into a half assed DOOM, blasting 5 grunts and watching the corpses fly is great.
“Modded doesn’t matter” then why are you arguing with someone who does primarily modded content I don’t understand, not only that but also you completely ignore that focus shots have perfect accuracy, meanwhile you can’t snipe things from long distances with hipster, unless it’s just a web spitter or something plus your argument about focus shots being “just 2 bullets at once” is completely ignoring the +25% damage mod for FS and the stun mod being pretty good for difficult situations also, what are you going to do when that tri-jaw is already about to shoot when you first see it, if you don’t FS, someone is going to get hit also you literally destroy your argument about spawning enemies in sandbox and proceed to do the same thing you said was a bad argument toward something being good
i actually like mini shells for a similar reason. the ammo economy and versatility is well worth the small direct damage loss. being able to hose down swarms and pick off isolated medium size bugs with only an additional shot or two (if that) while never sweating the ammo is good, imo. good for me, anyway
You seem to be optimizing for different things. Being a generalist is better than instantly deleting HVTs in casual lobbies/solo. Performing your job as efficiently as possible (and trusting your teammates will, too) is critical in modded difficulties. I think the argument is that if you have to pick up that much slack in a haz 6x2 game, you have already lost.
Hipster is effectively a broken jack of all trades option in the base game. Anything higher than that isn't near his wheelhouse of argument. The enemy numbers and health on 6x2 is literally not taken into account when the devs create something... because those are not base game. This counter argument, though correct with the assumption 6x2 is related to what he's talking about, it's the same as saying: "Your car should probably be a Jeep to get through that mountain." even though he doesn't need to get through a mountain.
Hazard 6 numbers aren't that far from Haz 5 though, at least in terms of Enemy Health. Grunts, Mactera and other similarly sized enemies still have the same amount, and only tanks and bigger have more health (Praet Oppressors, Warden, etc). They are, however, faster, the Wave timer is shorter, the enemy pool is more varied (disruptive units and HVT are more likely to appear) and the enemy cap is increased from 60 to 90 meaning you're more often than not in a combat situation, so efficiency is the name of the game when tackling these kind of difficulties. A generalist weapon will struggle a lot more than a specialized loadout, due to the higher variance in enemy distribution. Single target damage is usually preferred, to deal with HVT quickly and having more freedom when handling grunt waves.
Another huge factor is comfort level. You simply perform better with setups you know because you have developed muscle memory and know time to kill, reload patterns, ammo usage, etc. Generalist builds/setups can be brought on many more missions so the depth of your personal knowledge with that setup can increase way faster than a more specialized one. Plus specialist builds tend to have major oversights which far outweigh any benefit if they are put into an unfavorable scenario.
hoverclock is also pretty goated and not JUST a 'for fun' overclock the m1k alone is already a decent gun. And now, you can become immune to fall damage, melee enemies, and be able to fly indefinately as long as you are near a wall or ceiling (pretty commmon in caves) ontop of that, you rarely get hit by ranged enemies with hoverclock just because the grapple hook makes you move like a mactera. of course you can kite infinitely with scout anyways, but it's way easier with hoverclock. And with hoverclock, you can now also infinately kite upwards too. As long as you have 1 bullet in the clip, you can fly around infinitely with hoverclock all of scout's primaries are just very good all-rounder weapons. are they as good at being an all-rounder weapon as gunner's lead storm? No. But being excessively good at killing is gunner's specialty, with scout's speciality being agility. I would actually argue that driller is the least all-rounder class, due to range and single target, with engineer being the most all rounder.
I think stepping away from numbers is the right take. Deep rock is an easy game, and min maxxing each engagement with a bug misses the forest for the trees. its about how it feels in a mission or in a swarm not a testing room.
10:21 came back after a long break, switched from Hipster to the Drak and every single mission I widh Praetoriand fell in 5 seconds instead of 30, that I could gun down 7 grunts coming at me without overheating, kill macteras without pulling the crossbow out. Honestly, I wish the rifles were half as M100,.even without Hipster
@@kibbykibbykibbyHe actually reads his comment sections. Look at his video were he's complaining about un-unlockable cosmetic items, he's all over the newest comment section. (Video is called "The 1% Problem).
@@bast4rdlyreaper I meant he's not gonna see this as a point to argue on, it's a foregone conclusion, the video already explains and debunks the idea of people against hipster, so he's not gonna see this and think "should I really relay everything I said in this video to this person that just said nuh uh to all my points"
@@kibbykibbykibby it didn't explain anything, he's playing on Haz 5 and nothing Hipster does is any better than another MK1 build can't do. Fire Bolts can deal with swarms on their own and IFGs make them insanely deadly. If you want a generalist setup, Electrifying Reload with Pheromones/Fire Bolts is insanely safe, great swarm clear for a Scout build, and way easier recoil control. If you want DPS, BOM is amazing and shreds everything. I don't really understand the point he's making, Hipster is fine but its niche is outclassed now they have given huge buffs to the GK2 and it trades the innate value that MK1 has over GK2 for just using blowthrough rounds, which Fire Bolts are already good enough at as is.
so i was messing around with the Shard Diffractor's Plascrete Catalyst overclock and found out.. Uhhh, it's a bit... bugged. It can damage hacksy and Doretta (thankfully Doretta cannot be damaged as long as she remains on her drop platform she starts on.)
@@ParasocialCatgirl Did you even see the thumbnail? The entire video is made specifically to "dunk" on Waste. It's passive agressive and fucking immature if you even think about it for a second. I get that people enjoy drama but we should really expect better from those who are such a vocal part in the community
holy shit did you just compliment electrifying reloads? even if it was really backhanded? i am going to clip this out of context for my upcoming “every possible build in the game is not only viable but objectively good” video
You have outlined exactly why I stopped trying to argue with the people on the DRG subreddit: they do not want to admit that this game is random, and instead theorycraft a perfect scenario for each weapon to judge them. They aren't as bad as other subreddits I could name, but there is this weird fetishization of "optimal play" that amounts to cutting off your nose to spite your face: weapons that are "easy" and don't require much thought are considered "noob weapons" or "baby's first good weapon." It's an uphill battle on the DRG sub and others (like, say, the Deadcells sub) to explain how a dead-simple weapon that always does 100 damage is WAY BETTER than a complex weapon that *also* does 100 damage, but requires you to do some series of actions and punishes you by only doing 70 damage if you fuck up. I love hipster because there is so much less to keep track of: just point at bug and click.
A focus shot build is also point and click... Well, hold and release would be more accurate. I personally prefer this damage delivery method as it allows you to adjust your aim while charging. Not to mention you don't need additional shots to kill your target.
@@That_Goddamn_Scout Granted, yes, the M1k is not the worst offender--I'm an engie main, so the "discourse" I engaged in was with the Lok1 where sweaty nerds argue that you need to build it a very specific way, take certain secondaries to wombo-combo it, and adapt your play-style to force your team kill all the common bugs so that you can look up at the ceiling and only shoot X, Y, or Z... Versus the shotgun which is just pointing at bugs and splattering them with buckshot.
@MetalDustGaming To be fair, LOK1 has only two builds: Executioner and Explosive Chemical Rounds. Both being used in their own specific niches, and being relatively straightforward in execution. I don't know what you've been told but it's not rocket science to make LOK1 work.
As a 1600 level player, hipster is the best OC for scout. With similar m1000 tier build except I use faster reloads because the 'shoot faster' strategy works better when you can reload faster to keep shooting faster. It also pairs best with the zhukov and gas recycling. DRG puffed it and it insanely broken. I think it was meant to be used with the GK2, but the hipster M1000 build does more damage due to weakpoint damage and you don't have to only shoot weapoints. You ifg a chokepoint and use your Zhukov to kill all enemies without having to care about the lack of weapoint because of the Zhukov tier 5 conductive bullets that gives you +33% damage bonus plus the +25% damage bonus that the ifg gives you. And if you pick the tier 4 blowthrough round, you kill every bug. It's the best scout build because you can focus on important bugs and large crowds, which no other scout build does better.
That does sound like a strong combo. The , strongest? I'm not sure. Are there other builds that can do the same but maybe better? Probably. Strongest in your opinion? Seems like it.
Why? What else do you want? I can tell you that in my opinion something like EFS and Firebolts does it better but I don't have the time to prove anything atm.
New OC Idea: (I think) #1 -can only fire charged shots -huge increase in damage -lower ammo #2 -cannot fire charged shots -large increase in ammo capacity (Sorta like a deepcore gk2/m1000 mixed???)
I have about 100 hrs in this game and i have done all my missions on haz 4 and haz 5 and completed multiple elite deep dives and i’d like for someone more experienced to tell me why people argue so much about builds in this game when i honestly feel like the margin of error is really not that small.
You're right. The game isn't hard enough to warrant discussions/arguments about a hypothetical meta. Yet some people, myself included, know that despite DRG balance being questionable, there are options that are clearly better when you want to optimize your gameplay. And this, when confronted to more casual players opinions, tends to spark heated arguments, depending on how each party's opinion is presented. In that case, Axis comes off as passive agressive towards people he calls "spreadsheet warriors".
Its kinda like the discussion I have with a friend now and again about wether Big Bertha or Neurotoxin is better. DGR has managed to create discussions where both sides are correct and "debate" more for the lolz than anything else. Neurotoxin Gunner Sludgepump Stinky Boi Plasma Zhukov Scout "The stick" Engineer
Neurotoxin is more ammo efficient at killing grunts type enemies, but you will struggle when a tanky enemy comes or you get special bosses, and big bertha is good at everything.
If people say hipster cant one hit body grunts you know they're not taking damage and focus shot mods. It reaches that breakpoint then. With the damage in T1 it one hits web spitters to the body. A focus shot and 2 more into it's body kills a trijaw as well, which will be sitting still for 3s with the focus shot stun. Even building hipster to fill a similar role as support and not to be able to solo clear stuff *as* well, it does basically as good as the normal M1k while also getting much higher solo play potential and versatility in any situation.
I love your videos so no hate, but at the end of the video you said you weren't talking about modding but mentioned waste's video about hipster being worse then nothing. Even though waste plays a lot of modded content which without a doubt affected his opinion on hipster. I think hipster is a good overclock, I don't think it is the end all be all just because you can also kill swarms with your primary. (even though boltshark with fire or ice is all the crowd clear you need). but I digress. I haven't played as much as you so maybe I'm wrong. have a good one. :)
You’re right, Axis has been pushing the idea Hipster is broken for years when in reality it makes the M1000 worse at its best base qualities/jobs Now that the GK2 is actually good at least with AI Stability, I’d never tell a friend to take Hipster seriously
@@roar104And yet he didn't, because his video doesn't apply specifically to modded hazards, despite his opinions being obviously influenced by his experience with said difficulties.
@@roar104you could also say that the video is redundant outside of modded difficulties because the game is very well balanced. anything can be used anywhere anytime, whether it be solo or multiplayer. so a tierlist isn’t needed in the first place. but in modded difficulties, you’re going to want what works.
I have now 500h in Deep Rock and I didn't like the scout class at all in the beginning slowly I startet liking him more through playing plasma carabine on him but damadge was still kinda mid, but I like the Idea a lot of looking at something at it dying without me having to think a lot about it. I used to actually hate the M1000 because I tried overclocks like super cooling chamber or other and it just didn't feel right so me, but when I picked up Hipster I actually started to enjoy playing scout a lot. I don't care about the stats too much I go more after Weapon feeling wich to me is just perfect with Hipster.
“It’s a game so it doesn’t matter” goes onto rant for another 25 minutes about how it does matter
😂😂😂 people’s opinion when they dont care :
One note about the Dreadnought shell, armor breaking doesn't matter for it. In fact, weakpoint bonuses don't apply to the yellow health bar at all, because it's not armor, it's just a second health bar you have to drain to damage the actual health.
twins matter
i think that's his point, hipster doesn't rely on its weakpoint modifier anywhere near as much as AISE does. AISE has a good edge if you can consistently hit weakpoints, but if you're not; its going to be pretty miserable compared to a huge number of other scout primary builds.
if you do 10% extra damage during the weakpoint phase compared to hipster, but 50% less damage during the armor phase, hipster will come on top.
although, the "armor" phases for hiveguards and twins are very negligible. AISE is more than good enough for those two, and being a little worse off against a standard dread isn't the worst thing in the world. (you can probably just use your secondary.)
Hiveguards don't have any armor though.@@turmspitzewerk
@@nemergix1707 yeah he didn't deny that
Yeah, it's good ol' "grey health".
It’s funny but I think you and waste fell into the same trap when talking abt hipster.
To waste, hipster is suboptimal in coordinated teams in modded, where every class in min maxing according to their strengths and weaknesses. In general, generalists are worse there because they typically cost a class a bit of their strength (if your driller can’t clear crowds as well as he could then what is he even doing that the rest of the team can’t do better)
In your case, it’s the opposite. In solos and pubs, where your builds are not coordinated, everyone needs to build for everything, and so you collectively become worse at dealing with certain situations. However, in situations where the team is getting ambushed by a cloud of mactera, or a truckload of swarmers, it would be better to have someone who specializes in taking out those targets, or else everyone focuses them down, and then there’s nobody to kill the other bugs. Once the team gets tested with a really hard mission with tons of every kind of enemy (and you can have those situations in Edds or even a rlly unlucky haz 5 mission), you’ll start to appreciate how much quicker you could do things if everyone picked their targets according to their strengths.
Of course, there is a limit to both. You shouldn’t spec so hard into a role that you can’t do anything else, but you also shouldn’t generalize so much that you aren’t helpful to a coordinated team.
It rlly shows that while drg isn’t particularly balanced, it can get away with it because of the variety of ways you can play the game. Different builds do different for different play styles, solos or teams, coordinated or pubs, modded or vanilla etc.
can't forget solo play when talking about modded, at that point you kind of need to be a generalist because your seeing every type of bug at such high quantities that you need to be ammo efficient, need to deal a lot of damage to all the types (swarms big 'uns and hvt's)
Oh wow, that actually clears it up a lot for me. When I watched waste's video I though his take was so horrid that he was just trolling, but now it actually makes a lot of sense! Thanks
@@carpet_appetite I mean it wasn’t horrid; it was a little exaggerated but he’s right in saying hipster is overrated and one of the worst options on m1k, it’s just still good in the right circumstances. It’s just focus shot builds can also be generalist if you learn them and use blowthrough, and they also do scouts role better (more damage at range, stun, kills HVTs faster).
It’s not like you absolutely have to use hipster in solos or pubs, it’s only arguably better there, and is definitely worse in a good composition.
This is really good insight
@@kismet4918 The only time use I use Hipster is when doing Elimination Missions, feels so bad when you're forced to shoot a Grunt and miss the head.
So I finally understand what this situation reminds me of. There was a lot of discussion in the broader FPS community around the game design of Doom 2016, Doom Eternal and Ultrakill. In Doom 2016, you have a deep ammo pool for each weapon so you could stick to using a few weapons you prefer and not touch others and you'll still be able to complete the game even on the higher difficulties. In Doom Eternal, that was no longer the case. Max ammo was constrained, and you are forced to use all 8 weapons interchangeably and combo them together to even really play the game. Mobility was expanded, too, so the game expects you to master Doomguy's movement to a higher degree. Later on with expansions you also have to juggle a few throwables and a few tools. It's a different design philosophy where the game tries to force you into the infamous "fun zone" where if you stick to it and do what is expected of you, you do really start to feel like an unstoppable god of destruction. Ultrakill is not like that, you can complete it with just the starter pistol if you want because the game has unlimited ammo, however it still has deep movement mechanics and weapon interactions that allow you to do absolutely wild stuff such as punching shotgun shells to make them go faster or reflect railguns off of coins tossed into the air for massive damage. Under The Mayo did a video where he disapproved of Ultrakill because of its perceived failure to _force_ you to switch guns around like in Doom Eternal, which he was flamed for and there was a bit of drama around it because he came off as a bit elitist and inflexible, as if the Eternal way is the only right way to play FPS and from now on "good" FPS should force you to play that way. Which is not the case, games are supposed to be fun.
Here, this is basically the same kind of discussion. Yes, you can play DRG on Haz 5 with only using the Hipster M1k, without ever touching your secondary even. That's absolutely fine. However, eventually it just stops being fun or challenging. If you try the same approach on modded Hazards, it just doesn't work. There are way too many bugs even for Hipster. You won't be able to kill the most dangerous bugs fast enough nor will you be able to hold your ground against hordes of smaller bugs. However, when you look at the game in the broader context, you notice that the 4 dwarves have between them 8 guns, multiple throwables, and mobility tools. Familiar is it not? It's the same choice. There will be players who prefer to stick to the generalist guns which are comfortable, but these players will face difficulties coping with challenging scenarios or constrained resources. There will be players who prefer to specialize to the max, and play in a team which, collectively, will use every one of their 8 guns all the time against different targets by playing off each other and performing sick combos. These players will feel like Haz 5 is underwhelming, and will install mods to increase the challenge to the level of their team's true ability. Vanilla DRG doesn't force anyone to play a certain way, play any way you find fun. But if you struggle with increasing the difficulty you play on, you should try to specialize and avoid generalist weapons. And maybe find a decent team of players who know what they are doing. This also avoids the plateau of DRG lategame when the weapon overclock grind is complete and there is not much game content to engage with. You have to create your own challenge and figure out if you still like the game even when it stops holding your hand. And there is external content tailored to players who feel that way.
you say broader fps community but it was basically just the ultrakill community dogging on 1 guy and his really bad videos on ultrakill.
@@Storse I meant that if you look at other FPS games beyond DRG you will find some similar themes. I used this particular example here because I remember it well. But I can also recall, say, the disdain that the Counter-Strike community holds for certain weapons like machine guns and some SMGs which are imprecise, spammy, and fail to remove key enemy players in firefights quickly enough, which is, too, very similar to how Hipster works in DRG and how it is viewed. They, too, advise that it is better for a team to have members dedicated to specific roles such as an AWP sniper and to use weapons which can reliably land headshots as opposed to weapons that are spray-and-pray.
@@p_serdiukYou cant beat Ultrakill with just the basic pistol (or its near impossible), look at any video of any late game stage with Mayo% in the title it is very, very tough.
@@cairill There is a difference between it being very tough and impossible. Doom just doesn't give you enough ammo to kill all enemies with a restricted selection of weapons.
@p_serdiuk its not litterally impossible but it requires mastering every other aspect of the game besides the guns. To beat the game with just the basic pistol will require mastery over every other system involved (enemy ai, placement, movement and parries)
I would say that this is an entirely unrelated arguement to the video as of course hipster being good/bad is unrelated to promoting skill expression.
17:00 how do people think like this? Yes the classes are different, they specialize at killing different enemies, which is why they should focus on those enemies, but focussing on an enemy type never means not killing other enemy types too. Drg is a horde shooter, you get run on by pretty fast enemies, at the end of the day you are defending yourself and teammates from dying and not wasting revives/HP, so when a horde of enemies are after you, the gunner isn’t always gonna be able to kill every single grunt, they aren’t even all aggro toward them. I just urge these people to try and play like you would solo, yes you know your gun is good at certain things but at the end of the day you kill grunts in solo, not your teammates.
"Shooting again" is why I find it fine to take blowthrough when I build Hipster on certain loadouts, especially when I run Cryo Bolts and Pheromone Canisters together. Such a delicious, delicious cleave build.
Nice explanation and points!
Counter argument : me no like spam clicking.
If i want something fast firing(which is most of the time) i just pick one of the other two primaries.
inb4 new Hipster 2.0 overclock that replaces focus fire with burst fire or something
Same..
bind firing to scrollwheel down
Are Axis and waste gonna have Hipster beef now? I think it would be cool to see these two content creators do a collab like what Axis and Lazy did with gold!
This vid must have been motivated by wastes vid lmao
@@Miho51307 As someone that's watched a good bit of waste, he's got quite the dislike for Hipster. Even in the super long video they did, the other CC he was doing the video with wasn't super adamant about how bad he though hipster is, but waste was very strongly against it.
Personally I really don't see the overclock being so bad that it's worse than nothing or even a low tier overclock. There's a good chance in modded difficulties it's not an ideal overclock and doesn't make use of m1000's strengths to the fullest, which may be the reason why he doesn't like it.
I will add some nuance though, waste himself said that Hipster doesn't really fall into "worse than nothing" because it's really changing the gun into an entirely different weapon.
@@mastersanada I think both waste's video and this one are memes in their own ways. Like muh man waste opens up in OC tier list video with premise on how he's ranking OCs based on how happy would a new player be with getting an OC, and then proceeds to rate them as if a new player is gonna be jumping in haz7 with premade squad of tryhards in which everyone just optimizes every single droplet of everything in the game. And muh fella Axis over here closes up with saying he only cares about vanilla, and how in vanilla generalist builds (and hipster being the best of them) are usually kings because they allow to have a good time no matter the circumstances, while throughout whole video taking jabs at people that take waste's approach to viewing the game. The cherry on top is, Axis have said before that LARPers (RolePlayers as he called them) are bullying him for choosing to do speedplay, while sending shots in this video at people that view this game through the lens of modded difficulties only, forgetting that vanilla is way different. The things both dudes be saying is hilarious to me personally , I love it
@@yaroslavcoloskov6357 Yea I think the major problem is it's so difficult to really make a comprehensive tier list without completely getting the tier list wrong in some aspects. If we're rating OCs purely off of fun, that'd be subjective (for the most part. We all know nukes are fun).
If we're rating them off normal play, certain ones were certainly be up there, whereas others wouldn't be. If we were rating them purely on modded play, the tier list would also look different.
All in all, I think a fair number of the tier lists in the game don't really help if you yourself don't already have a fundamental understanding of the game (which I think Axis does actually talk about). You won't understand *why* waste's tier list makes sense until you play the same difficulties he does extensively with those builds, and in the same way you won't understand why Axis' arguments make sense until you play extensively the way he does.
I, however, do think that as a whole waste's tier lists are very helpful and do generally point out strong and weak overclocks. I think some of his stronger opinions could be a little more moderate (and the other CC in that 4 hour marathon tier list video I think was more moderate in his opinions and that helped).
@@mastersanada I agree with everything but 1st sentence. I feel like making a comprehensive tier list isn't that hard, just tedious. Providing compelling argument for each OC however would be so tedious that I don't think anyone would care do so. But yeah I'm with you, each viewpoint has it's merits.
I think High Value Targets should not be confused with priority targets, because the latter depends on your class. Consider this: say you're a scout in a full team in the middle of a swarm. There is a sea of grunts, two menaces and a couple of macteras. What do you shoot first? Correct, you take down the menaces, and cryo the macteras while you're at it. And now, *if you don't have anything better to do,* you might as well shoot some grunts, because otherwise you're just leaving firepower on the table.
Now picture a driller built for sticky flames in this same scenario. Do you bother sniping down those menaces with your subata or TCF or something? Obviously not, you have a horde of grunts coming towards you, and you have a goddamn flamethrower. But now those are gone, and one of the menaces is still burrowing around. Naturally you shouldn't ignore it, even if someone else is focusing on it, you can always help kill it even if it's just by setting it on fire, and especially if it's by freezing it.
HVTs are usually considered to be things that can do lots of harm individually or in small numbers. Priority targets are what YOU as a given class would be best suited to deal with in a given situation. HVTs are Scout's priority, but that doesn't mean they have to be the only things he shoots. You have a gun. *Use it.*
Of course, this is all in the context of teamplay, where the strengths of different classes make up for the weaknesses of others and/or complement their strengths. Solo, on the other hand, is a different story, because there you can grab hipster + fire bolts like Axis did and pulverize everything in your way.
Sludge everything, let the grunts melt in puddles as you avoid them. If macteras are tri-jaws try to find a line to charge at them with a WC (after sludge) because they're better a tracking horizontal movement, then last worry about the menaces.
Exactly, noone is saying you should ignore grunts and kill HVT's only and do nothing in meantime. But since scout deals with HVT's that much better than others, he should immediately switch focus to them once they appear and threaten the team.
E.g. a driller could be unaware about that trijaw charging his shot from behind since he is busy with trash mobs. But a scout can easily avoid getting swarmed and look around to prioritize spitters, mactera or menaces and once he has cleared all those, turn to help dps trash mobs.
E.g. a driller, especially with TCF, has a VERY hard time dealing with menaces. Meanwhile for scout it is point and click.
Playing to strengths helps a ton.
Wow... that resupply drop onto the hiveguard....
That might be the most rock and stone thing I've ever seen.
I just started playing this game and after not paying attention and taking a few supply drops to the gord I had the thought, “could this be timed to my advantage”. Very Rock n Stone indeed !!!
how? thats a normal strat in high level lobbies
Timestamp?
Nvm 18:00
the gold saga is over, let the hypster saga commence
This is more entertaining than anything Season 4 related so not complaining
If you dare to ignore missed breakpoints, and just "shoot it again", taking any implications from raw total damage as nitra/ammo efficiency is a fallacy. Because if you just stack 500 healthbars of bugs altogether, you can't say you need 2 full ammo loads if full ammo load total damage just because one full load is 50% worth these 500 healthbars. You will lose on overkill.
M1K-18 clipsize is the actual build that can care not about where you shoot your bullet. It both has blowthrough and time to kill a grunt pack because it has... yes you got it - it has the breakpoints. It does it cheaper and you still can just spam the full DPS of it into whatever target you like. And yep, M1K-18 is a hipspam build. It only uses focuses for long range and T5 utility.
I mean, sure 6rof is better for dopamine if you get dopamine from shooting your gun as fast as possible. Otherwise if one asks for "most ammo efficient M1K build" you either take the breakpoints into account or keep your blind total ammo fallacy with you.
This entire waste vs Axis fiasco could've been resolved easily if both parties actually talked to each other and came to an agreement that the difference in their respective playstyles makes all argumentation null and void.
Hipster is a generalist, in a game where completing a mission on the highest difficulty is far from hard. So, if anything, it's adequately powerful in that context.
I do have a question though: why prepare for exceptions?
You can ignore a korlok, you can ignore an OMEN. And, in the context of M1K, there is very little the gun is not good at (Hipster or not), so while this OC exacerbates the generalist side of M1K (in a more hipfirey way), it's not by any means the end-all be-all of M1K overclocks.
It's just good. That's it.
The goal of speedplay (or anything outside of modded tbh) is to try and complete every objective - optional or not - inside a mission as fast as possible. Hipster makes you better at dealing with exceptions with little to no cost against other enemy types besides some breakpoints, which are pretty negligible in the grant scheme of things.
My man literally made a 28 min vid talking about the monke mode OC in response to a ''Sorry, Axis. Not sorry''.
An important part that is overlooked is that hipster does what base M1000 does. What I mean is that with hipster, you can maximize chances of hitting an enemy with more shots. You touch on that when you talk about "shoot it again."
I kinda want the Scouts AR to get an ammo buff across the board. The AR's strength is shooting again, really fast. Whenever I mod for rate of fire, I run out of ammo faster, often at inconvenient times. I'm on controller, so that ability to have controlled shots on M1000 helps ammo efficiency. This video made me wonder what other reasons I would take hipster over any AR build.
With hipster i guess you can unload full clip in a quick session or until the target dies. I don't know the exact number but hipster definitely feels faster to kill things compared to base M1k
The summarization of this 28 minute video, is play the game the way that you like to play it. Tryhards are going to play differently, because they think it's fun. In a cooperative shooter, you can legitimately BOTH BE RIGHT, but maybe you shouldn't play together, you are going to just argue constantly about min/maxing.
AK really out here going "I'm better"
Generalist usage for a build is huge in pub and solo play due to the abundance of random events.
Your build is bad with robots? Here's a Prospector.
Bad at HVTs? Here's Trijaws, Menaces and Wardens together.
Bad at burst DPS? Here's a Korlok.
Bad at holding an area? Here's a Tritilyre deposit.
Needs specific terrain to work? Too bad, your next mission is in glacial strata with a giant vertical tunnel.
Doesn't have an accurate weapon? Here's a Rockpox Swarm
Can't kill dreads? Here's a random dread.
Can't break armor? Here's a Stingtail.
(That's why I run a HyProp/ECR Lok-1/Mine Engineer, can do everything with a benefit of being the best Industrial Sabotage build)
while mines are good, shredder swarm is better and more versatile
@@roar104 idk I feel stupid while using shredder Swarm. Also I feel like ECR kind of competes in function with Swarm.
mentions glacial strata when magma core is sitting right there
Also, "accurate weapon" just means anything hitscan in this case. If you're running a projectile or area weapon of any kind rockpox is hell.
@@roar104it’s kinda late, but mines are better if you use repellent and chockpoints properly, and shredders are worse in that exact same situation, along with not scaling with enemy density. That said, both options are really good, but proxy mines are better if you use repellents and chockpoints to full effect
Why so angry?
Trolls used to be goblins. Now they acting like the good guys
4:13 no, focus shots also have perfect accuracy and allow you a bit more time to aim between shots.
come the fuck on. basic facts.
@@sharktrap267 Did you take repeated shots and recoil into account?
However, the end result is the same.
Hitting a focus shot -> same net reward as if you were to have hit two normal shots.
Missing a focus shot -> same net loss as if you had missed two normal shots.
@@ParasocialCatgirl No. Hitting two normal shots requires you to aim at the target, shoot, wait for the bloom to subside, then aim at the target a second time, and shoot. Hitting a focus shot requires you to hold down M1 for a bit, aim with pinpoint accuracy, and fire once. It's easier to execute in practice. Especially when you're dealing with multiple targets. You can use the time it takes to set up the focus shot to aim, and you won't lose any DPS. But hitting max DPS with good accuracy with hip shots takes much more skil because you don't have much time to aim between shots and you have to manage recoil.
@@sharktrap267 Spitter heads get smaller the further away they are. And they're usually covered up by their head shells, so the hitbox is maybe a couple pixels of your less than a degree in practice.
I mean, unless you happen to find a spitter that's facing directly at you.
I feel like a lot of this community disagreement probably does revolve around the necessity of role progression in particular. If I’m loading into a modded difficulty with several other skilled players you’re coordinating with, and we all know what we need to be doing, then yeah one could say scout’s grunt clear is notably less relevant, and that he really needs to focus on the HVTs while other dwarves do what they are best at, so maximizing even the minutiae on picks on enemies like Tri-jaws is important and notably valuable. You touch on that when you comment shortly on modded difficulties. In such a case the driller for example is going to be good enough with sticky flames or whatever to clear the grunt lion share out, and the scout can provide a lot of value shooting those HVTs in particular (as there’s a lot of them to go around). Whereas in contrast, if I load into a random haz 5 game with players who aren’t role compressing in that same way and may not be as good, something like hipster shines in scenarios where you have to be good at multiple things to save the rest of the team or to pick up their slack, or just for shooting down myriad threats in solo.
Hope this doesn’t cause some long term beef. Obviously Waste took a humorous shot across the bow in his video, and there’s some of that in response here, and it seemed to upset him. It just sounds like some back and forth shots across the bow to me, but it seems like Waste took it harder than that (maybe he saw it as harsher than I did or I just didn’t catch on to the extent others may have).
Genuine question, though: why couldn't I apply modded gameplay to vanilla?
Why would it be less valuable to one-shot HVT because it's Haz 5?
Why should optimization be considered an antithesis of fun?
@@That_Goddamn_Scout Certainly, if you're running a top tier, skilled team and you all hyper specialize into your roles haz 5, it would still be as strong as you could be, though the benefits of this are less relevant in haz 5 because haz 5 doesn't come close to requiring that level of strength emphasis. Generalist setups are more useful within haz 5 if you're running with less skilled players, i.e. randoms or just casual friends, or within solos, as they allow you to more easily pick up their slack/handle multiple kinds of problems, and the loss you take from not role compressing isn't very relevant. Building for the latter therefore makes more sense if you're just playing haz 5 casually with less skilled friends, in solos, or with random players. If that's not the environment you typically play within, then generalism would be less useful to you. I personally don't find hipster to be the be all end all and tend to enjoy generalist blowthrough builds for haz 5 more on M1k, though I did find Waste's take on Hipster to be unfair outside of modded.
I also didn't even comment on the fun factor. Which setup is more fun for you is up to you, and deciding to run something more optimized towards Scout's niche or whoever's niche on Haz 5 is very very far from a dealbreaker, so just run whatever you want.
Knew this video was coming. Could smell the salt the moment I read Waste's thumbnail.
100% willing to hear this dude out and I regretted every moment of it.
Like 3 min in and there’s a segment about how Hipster turns a flick gun into a tracking one
…there’s a big “AI Stability Engine” shadow being cast over this topic lmao
*Every single GK2 build has entered the chat*
Honestly there’s hypocritical arguments everywhere in this video if you look through it
Im playing like 100 games only with AI stability engine and zhukov gas recycling. That midigate argument of “waiting fór teammates to crush the shales” cause only few ammo of zhukov will delete armor (even dreadnaught) and then u can just burn HPs with gk2. Also i like control of situation. As i watched this gameplay, i saw that it is very effective but i dont acquire súch a skill now (i mean mobility). Anyway i tried few games with hipster, and its good, it just doesnt fit my style. I like to fly across the room and give headshots to everything. And if they get close, zhukov will piercing bullets will destroy them, in combination of last modification of higher dmg when electrocuted after throwing boomerang you just wipe the floor with everything in front of you. And thats what i like 😁 im not degrading hipster and consider myself greenbeard stíll, so maybe ill change my mind later 😃
axis joker arc begins
Base M1000 - You need to be accurate.
OC M1000 - You need to be more accurate.
Hipster M1000 - Accuracy through volume of fire.
EFS M1000 - *Braincell deletion intensifies*
Axis, everyone knows this is a jab at waste's vid but that tumbnail is just low. Deliberately including the purple L in the top right as an immature jab, pretending you're "dunking on goons". How old are you man. That's why people in the community get so annoyed at 'tryhards'. I don't really care about the debate at this point but stop trying to artificially create drama, even if you don't mention him directly
It's pathetic is what it is. The whole video is just a long string of ad-hominem attacks and mocking insults, coupled with him alluding to himself being "better than every scout he can find footage of". What an arrogant asshole he's shown himself to be
@@castillejan Not to mention the absence of compelling arguments.
aka, “In Praise Of Generalism”
As a focus-fire only guy, i can respect hipster for its accessability. Focusfiring takes alot of brainpower for me, so im glad there are competitive dps options for those who can't or don't want to clutch out a higher high with appropriate minmaxxing
You can freeze the vents on the caretaker!?
Yes. It doesn't show the status effect but the caretaker slows down and takes more damage when frozen.
I didn't know that either. That's crazy!
bro just directly say its a response to the other video 💀💀💀💀
axiskronos try not to be passive aggressive challenge (impossible)
He literally included the thumbnail in his video that was pretty direct IMO
@@straps-of-skin mf this was 8 months ago
@@ProtoFreeze And im reading it now
@@ProtoFreeze comments actually stay up
@@straps-of-skin you think I don't know that? I'm just saying this is old news bruh, idgaf
i think part of the issue is that conceptually, it turns a sniper rifle into an assault rifle
So true. I dont know If i would call it an issued but in my opinion there already is an assault rifle. Hipster is not my cup of tea.
I'd say it's more like turning the M1 Garand into the M1 Carbine.
@@pierro_le_fou4993 it changes the mindset needed for it. And yeah, part of my gripe is that it butts into the GK2's territory a bit
@@michaelkolano8686 Exactly, it has more burst dps than GK2 and more armor shred at the cost of you needing to spam click. Feels kinda cheap, not to mention the overall dps/ammo economy.
Engie is technically good at everything.
Engie does need a lot of ammo though.
@@ghoulbuster1 The joke is that engie is commonly considered the worst of the 4, because being an jack-of-all-trades isn't actually super beneficial
@@celestialowl8865 Pretty sure that's gunner since he's only useful if your team isn't very good. Being a jack-of-all-trades is very beneficial for solo and pub play which is a majority of what most players experience.
Engie is a really strong jack of all trade i mean platform gun can get you anywherw plus make a good place to kite/defend his sentry and guns do a decent job at whatever you are doing from killing swammer to dps dread but what engie really struggle is that he can use all his ammo too easily so to newer player who just shoot and not care about the small stuff like will i be wasting my shotgun ammo if i shoot at this gunt with 1 hp?
@@ghoulbuster1not really. It can just spend ammo really quick. But in terms of total damage pool it’s basically second only to some driller builds depending on how much value they get off of aoe dot stuff.
25:40 had a good laugh hearing this 🤣, your playing haz5 bruh
... Yeah. That's the top of the game balance. Anything higher isn't in the base balance of the weapons the devs put together. As proven by 60 or 40 nitra drops.
@@olaf.forkbeard "i outplay pretty much every scout that i could find gameplay of, not just in combat but in the metagame progression. There very few people that can push objectives, fight and have an overall view of the gamespace and deal with ennemy as well as i can with Hipster in hands" this guy is so pretentious, while to be fair he is just above average at this game
@@zgxmax Yea he should honestly just post some modded gameplay in that case, I only started playing modded recently because haz 5 has felt like a joke for a while and quickly realized I'm not actually very good mechanically.
@@boydquinoaThis. Haz 6 slapped me across the face, hard.
Vanilla DRG promotes questionable gameplay habits that only become more obvious as you experiment with higher (and arguably better crafted) difficulties
There's no reason to laugh at that. This will just continue the toxicity of the discussion going on. Modded imo challenges players more but in different ways. But laughing at Haz 5 speedplay still is not a great look.
This game gets a ton of recognition for for not being toxic.
It feels bad to have the major content creators bickering.
The community at large is not quite receptive to adverse opinions, and quick to shut you down if you try and go against the "Haha funny dwarf game" mindset.
Any criticism is viewed as a personal attack and you're immediately labeled a "leaf lover". Perfect example of toxic positivity
@@That_Goddamn_Scout in my experience any community that quickly adopts a cheeky nickname for trolls (or naysayers) will go from "wholesome" to "shit" just as quickly
There's nothing toxic or wrong about having opinions or disagreements. You can do that without jabs and passive aggressive comments.
@@bretts6127Tell that to Axis
You take the internet too seriously
The thing that catches me on hipster is that, if I wanted a gun that I can use to spam fire at the bugs until everything dies, I’d just use the other two primaries that do that job WITHOUT needing to give myself finger spasms
Fantastic points! Personally, I feel like hipster is fine, not overpowered, because a big part of how I look at builds is 'versatility'. Notably, not combat versatility, which is what you discussed for most of the video. Instead, what I look for (and enjoy) the most in overclocks is *build* versatility, where I consider how many builds said weapon/overclock/upgrade can fit in, and especially *meaningfully synergize with*. There definitely was a point where I played hipster (and thought I always would) and enjoyed its general power, but at the stage of the game I am, hipster is unfortunately boring because, as you've stated, your primary solution to nearly any situation is simply "open fire until it stops moving".
As for how I address combat versatility? Simple. I look at the *build*, not the weapon, to see how effective it is across a wide spread of situations. Carpet bomber doesn't have the HVT capabilities I need? Good thing BRT packs enough ammo to spare for situations I'm not expecting, or if need be, power picks can help make up the difference, 4 ammo at a time. Finding solutions for builds like these to *make* them work in every possible situation is one of the few things I still enjoy about the game, and it also keeps me on my toes, learning new builds, playstyles, and seeing how they perform in a wide variety of situations.
15:58
(I was gonna delete this tangent about nuances I've noticed in combat versatility but since you asked, you get the full essay this time ;D)
Part of the reason why Hipster is so good is because the only versatility it lacks, one of player position (and even then, only slightly), is completely covered by the class it's on. Hipster loses a lot of effectiveness when it lacks any weakspots to hit, or in very close quarters where you can't afford to fully unload without dying. Fortunately, a large portion of scout's kit is geared around circumventing this, with cryo creating damage multipliers when there aren't any reachable ones left on the target, and the flare gun and grapple ensuring you're never caught unawares and you always have a way out of any corners you might find yourself caught in. Gunner's minigun has the raw sustained output (usually) to not have to reposition to hit weakpoints consistently or need damage multipliers to outgun a horde, but against HVTs whose only counter is movement? Gunner is stuck relying on Dash, a well-placed zipline, or the catch-all shield to buy enough time to get things back under control.
Part of why I've played a lot of engineer lately is due to his weapons playing heavily with these limitations, where his weapons are all extremely versatile in one or two aspects (PGL for enemy distance and amount, BC for enemy weight class, Stubby and Loki for range where warthog ignores damage typing), while still having significant weaknesses (usually what you choose between, as well as ammo in general, due to none of the weapons having enough sustain for a whole swarm barring one or two exceptions). This lets me craft a build where I have weapons intricately weaved together, to counter either enemy weight class,
amount, or even positioning, with my favorite build (yes, ECR+VIR+shredders and twin turrets) resulting in a full arsenal of weapons that all cover each other's weaknesses without leaving me dry.
Also, regarding class roles in combat: while I definitely agree that the mindset of limiting yourself to only one role is detrimental, when it comes to prioritizing what you do first, it's definitely worth remembering that scout *can* fight bugs effectively, it's definitely more time-efficient to have scout spend five seconds mining than a whole minute fighting, and vice versa for gunner (driller and engi get more leniency due to having more versatility overall). In a situation where both bugs and minerals exist, it's more efficient for classes to focus on their specialties when they can, but that obviously doesn't mean that scout should be ignoring the spitballer or leech or prespawned grunts reaching for them if engineer or gunner (or long-range driller, I won't judge) don't pop them immediately.
my simple argument
9:02
patrol bot would have been dead if you had let say ASS and could actually HIT the weakpoint and kill it
Then you would have to deal with the dozens of bugs around it.
your scout you can either
1 leave (not your problem with a grappling hook)
2 use your secondary (cryo/flame bolts, taser bolts, chem explosive bolts, bodkin bolts, cryo minelets and boomstick in general)
3 throw a nade (all work expect stun but why would you take stun)
4 just shoot them you oneshot grunts in the face with 231XX ASS
Hey Axis. For a lot of this video the gameplay shows you using a boltshark build that utilises fire bolts and taser bolts. What's the rationale behind this? Personally taser bolts are the last one I would take with fire bolts, so I find this choice quite confusing.
The logic behind it is sound, fire bolts are for crowds of bugs/temp shocking with cryo nades, whatever else. And the taser bolts are for slowing down big single targets like dreadnoughts, praetorians bulks or oppressors. They also work for area denial when doing something like a salvage op too. Combined with hipster it is one of the best generalist loadouts you can have as Scout.
I'm curious, in the gameplay around @14:00, why are you throwing cryo nades at the top of the caretaker?
Coz it freezes the vents and more damage can be done. The thing doesn't show the status effect but it works. Kinda wish they'd fix that so it does show, tbh...
@@HazopGaze Ah gotcha, yeah I was confused cause the status effect wasn't there
The same thing goes to BET-c. Freeze the parasites on her and you will be able to deal with her much quicker.@@sirbillygoat1660
"Spreadsheet warrior", you still mad at lazy for being technically right about gold ? lmao
I came after watching waste's hipster video. I agree with your points, but I have my own reasons for not using hipster. First things first. It kills my wrist. I go through periods of needing to let me arm take a rest, but I don't want to make that worse. Second is my playstyle. I have tried numerous times to use hipster, but I cant adjust fully to the hipster strategy. I find myself using it just like a base mk1 build and I'm worse for it. Also I would like to say that I like to focus on HPTs, but when it is reasonable. I make sure my builds are fully capable of killing any enemy at a moments notice as when you team goes down, you're gonna need it. Love your video🙂
try running hipster with focus shot, damage, armor break, and stun on focus shots. It does nearly as good at killing HVTs with the added benefits of being able to do most of what hipster spam fire builds do
@@roar104 I already run damage and armor break on hipster. I take the faster reload after kill instead of stun on all of my builds as I find it much more useful. I used to run stun all of the time, but I found that stunning praetorians and menaces can make it difficult to finish killing them if you arent fast enough and I would much prefer a faster reload. As for focus shot, I think it is terrible on hipster. You blow through your magazine so fast with hipster and reducing that greatly hampers my ability to put out sustained dps. Also a little bit extra focus shot damage doesn’t matter much when you can shoot immediately after shooting a charged shot.
I know what you mean about the faster reload in T5, but learning to cancel reload animations on M1K helps a lot and makes the reload time almost the same. So taking T5 stun comes as a bonus flexibility. @@tysoncook5152
@@roar104 if you're doing focus shots at all on Hipster, you might as well use any other OC. That's why its overrated as fuck. It comes from a time when Cryo Minelets were meta.
Ok *drinks randomweisser*
Made me giggle. Have a good one.
I think the best example you give in this video is "super-cooling chamber is going to kill a praetorian slightly faster, but when I turn around and find three slashers, which weapon is going to be better?"
Having a secondary that makes up for your primary's weaknesses doesn't mean that it doesn't have them
But aren't said weakness made irrelevant, or at least less impactful, by your choice in secondary?
Dealing with these slashers is as easy as clicking once or twice with, say, your boomstick.
This comment also made me realize both parties are judging Hipster alone and not in the context of a build. Food for thought
Or, you can take active stability system, or unequip supercooling chamber
Option 1: minmax weapons and overclocks, synergize with teammates.
Option 2: Hipster go brrrrrrrrrrr
After i got all the overclocks for scout hipster's gameplay paired with freeze/pheromone bolts quickly got me hooked.
I can agree with the "kill HPM" thought. Every time i tried some very specific weapon build to counter X i, at some point, got into a situation where there's not X. Or when there's very little X coz classes that like to shoot more kill them faster than u. And then u want to take a resupply coz u're out of nades/secondary/flares and u notice that ur primary is 80% full or something.
In my opinion focus shot m1k is still quite good at everything else so I wouldnt be that stumped. Also if you focus HVTs with m1k you can consistently kill them before other people do and before they are a threat and spend a lot of ammo that way.
@@Marian_DRG you just can't be everywhere at once. HVT never just come from one spot in one convenient pack. It's always some random rap on the celling, macteras, slashers and so on. There's no way engi+gunner wont outgun u against at least some of those
14:20 thats when you bring out the zkukovs with gas recycling. No weakpoint damage needed and insane armor shredding and damage.
Idk why people talk so much about hipster while ignoring the real problem OC for the m1000, electrifying focus shots. I mean, what synergy! You can use the Zhukovs OR the Boltshark! Even the coveted Inhibitor Field Generator pales in comparison to it
Pretty much agree with everything in this video (esp 16:40 onwards), as someone who has 50+ promos with scout and isn't even that invested in "picking a side" regarding m1000 OCs. (Bouncy drak + emb dets main lol)
The main issue with the recent discourse seems to be that seasoned players (who maybe have graduated to mostly playing modded difficulties) are forgetting how different the game is played by the vast majority of players who are consuming their content (to be especially clear, I'm not referring to Axis here). Speaking as someone who occasionally plays haz 6x2 - team comp, team synergies, and role specialization are all much more important for success, but the overwhelming majority of people watching DRG content are still just playing haz 3-5 with friends or in pubs, where a generalist, good-in-any-scenario OC like hipster shines.
Advice that is born from playing modded difficulties - with a full team of graybeards who are all on the same page - won't always hold up when brought down to the casual context that most players play the game. For example, how much you value ammo efficiency in a build is highly biased by whether your resupplies cost 40 nitra (in 6x2s) or 80. Also, Prospectors are just straight up taken out of the game in most modded difficulties lol.
Bouncy drak and embedded det all day baby
very true
Hey, genuine question. do you not find drak (and other non-hitscan weapons) weird when you are not the host? It's just... idk, but it always feels just a LITTLE bit worse every time I'm a client, not a host.
@@squeezyjibbs6643 could be the damage scaling
What damage scaling? There is none when you play almost exclusively Haz5/4P.@@ProtoFreeze
The thumbnail is outrageous ngl
What I’ve found in my time of playing scout as long as I have the boomerangs it solves all problems.
Until you're facing Oppressors. Or dreadnaughts. Or Shellbacks. Or Korlok. Spitballers. Nexuses. Breeders. Omen. corruptor. Huuli Hoarder. Swarmageddon. Or literally any swarm big enough that just stunning/slowing down only 8-9 of them does practically nothing.
So, yeah. definitely not the "all problems" solver.
You just need to play at a higher difficulty where you have to rely on your teammates and focus on specialization. I don't think your problem is with hipster, it is with the difficulty you're experiencing at the experience you are at.
He plays on haz 5 and he made it very clear that he is not talking about modded.
Yep, that's my point. It's not challenging for him anymore. @@idontknowmusictheory532
I agree to many points in the video. Mostly that Hipster is very safe generalist OC that will be fit for every mission/situation because there is nothing more bullets can't fix.
However, something overlooked about focus shots is that they are always 100% accurate. Sprinting especially fucks up M1000 accuracy, more than Hipster can make up. So a lot of the shots at bigger distances can either miss entirely or at least miss a weakpoint that considerably increases dmg/dps.
E.g. it will be much easier to land 2 charge shots to kill a Spitballer or a Menace with SC before it even has time to react. Than spam entire magazine of Hipster to only maybe kill it.
Another overlooked fact is ammo efficiency vs breakpoints. Hipster is considered "op" with how much more ammo it gives, but paper≠reality. Since it takes 1 more shot to kill a grunt (most common enemy), you are actively spending more ammo per every grunt you kill. And also waste larger part of clip size leading to more reloading.
So the real benefit is smaller than it may seem. Especially considering you can take ammo+blowthrough on stock M1000 and still maintian onetap in head.
Lastly, this may be VERY specific, but some enemies have breakable weakpoints. Meaning they benefit more from weapons that overpenetrate and gain full damage boost. Than weapons that break the weakpoint immediately with lots of small damage instances.
E.g. extreme example, there exists a build for M1000 SC that lets you oneclip haz5 4 player bulk (6000hp) in one clip using IFG. Each shot deals 1201 damage and barely doesnt break blisters in one shot. It is effectively the fastest and most ammo efficient way to kill a bulk (apart from leadburster lmao, that one is broken).
But as you said, every specific scenario will always have that one build which is better in that specific scenario. Hipster excels in being versatile and not caring about what you encounter and still being good enough.
Exactly, Hipster is something that is good enough but doesn't do anything well. MK1 specifically loses its niche against GK2, which has been buffed heavily. Why wouldn't you just use GK2, which can put out more DPS with BOM/AISE and is far more consistent at range.
why run WP when you're going cryo bolt in this vid? would BT not help immensely in this scenario?
I understand WP if you don't want freeze in the build though
Even if you run some cryo, not every targets will be frozen. You can not take it on the basis that it does nothing to frozen targets, but you will suffer against every non frozen grunts and guards (and some other targets, but stingtail, warden and co are likely to warrant their bolt)
Hoverclock 13211 or 13221 does the same shit hipster can do at a similar DPS but you also get hoverclock. Use minimal clips if you don’t need Hoverclock. It’s missing nothing and it works on every mission, exactly what you asked for
I kinda fell victim to that "kill HPTs" narrative so I haven't been using hipster all too much lately, but considering my aiming skills, it's probably for the best if I start using it again :ь
Upd: I guess one thing that makes me use less efficient builds for my skill level that punish me ammo wise for missing is that when I do land my shots, it feels pretty damn satisfying
literaly the same thing with scout in MVM from TF2. If your job is colecting cash it doesen't mean that you don't have one of the best primaries in the game and unbinding the attack button isn't the best idea.
Everyone has his own playstyle and while you have fun you do everything right.
Simplicity's Strength. Pretty damn powerful, in my opinion. Both the wording and the greater concept at play.
IMO where hipster truly shines is when you are a casual player cruising around random lobbies. Whether your driller is rocking with goo bomber special and fully automatic subata or engie with turret arc and plastcrete catalyst. It doesn’t matter if they are goofing around having fun or they are truly green beards. A scout with a hipster is always the anchor for the team. You can manage anything, stomp every mission type and be the so called “carry” on the team. I’m not a haz 6x2 player or what. I know nothing about the shortcomings of hipster in higher difficulties, but in the content where I truly enjoys, hipster is just the most handy and comfortable option for me. I can see the point of hipster is not as “op” as people hyped it up to but I don’t think it is nothing or perhaps worse than that.
7:52 try to butterfly click, its helping a lot with that
Most weapon mods I use and don’t get the most out of immediately but hipster first time I used it felt it was strong but saw how people felt about it online and figured I must be missing something. Ty for saying it’s ok to use hipster lol
hipster is just fun, most people play drg to have fun, i couldn’t care less about meta and viability in a pve game. Hipster can be as bad or as good as it wants, im still gonna be doing a red dead redemption cosplay shooting 12 enemies in rapid succession like a rabid cowboy.
I tried hipster not so long ago and now is my god damn favourite overclock and a really strong one. People caring about a single number a oneshot can do with a lots of multipliers to oneshot a enemy.
This game has alot more than that to offer
Even this game isnt really being honest THAT hard that you actually need EVERY BULLET to win, is a casual game to vibe and try, good movement and fights, hordes, classes and shit.
And gives u ALMOST a INFINITE WORLD OF WAYS that YOU CAN PLAY IT.
Find your flow then rock it and stone it ❤
9:57 The M1000 doesn't use magazines, it actually legitimately uses clips, specifically stripper clips.
I think that this goofy debate in the community is so funny, including AxisKronos versus all the other RUclipsrs about if Hipster is good or not.
"if the target is alive then you havent put enough lead into it"- my brother who doesn't even PLAY drg
People sleep on generalists in games in general. Competitive players always will take the extreme options, but at the average gamers level generalist options are a godsend especially in teams since you are extremely adaptable to what your team needs you to do.
I use hipster but solely because it feels more consistent than stock. The hitreg of the m1000 feels HORRIBLE doing chargeshots for me. So sticking to hip firing just feels better and more consistent
Scuze me? Gk2 is bad against dreadnought armor? Do you actually take the measly 20% weakpoint damage, especially when you have ai stability engine, over 600% armor break?
you dont know how armor break works
Great video. Its always good to call back to your past statements and highlight where youve learned and changed your thinking.
My outlook has always been play how you want to play. I run Drak with SBB and Boomstick with double trigger. It let's me turn the game into a half assed DOOM, blasting 5 grunts and watching the corpses fly is great.
That's my favorite scout build too!
It's so good, the damage is insane.
“Modded doesn’t matter” then why are you arguing with someone who does primarily modded content I don’t understand, not only that but also you completely ignore that focus shots have perfect accuracy, meanwhile you can’t snipe things from long distances with hipster, unless it’s just a web spitter or something plus your argument about focus shots being “just 2 bullets at once” is completely ignoring the +25% damage mod for FS and the stun mod being pretty good for difficult situations also, what are you going to do when that tri-jaw is already about to shoot when you first see it, if you don’t FS, someone is going to get hit also you literally destroy your argument about spawning enemies in sandbox and proceed to do the same thing you said was a bad argument toward something being good
The only mod I play with, is the one that changes Doretta's voice to an Egirl's Vtuber only fans voice.
i actually like mini shells for a similar reason. the ammo economy and versatility is well worth the small direct damage loss. being able to hose down swarms and pick off isolated medium size bugs with only an additional shot or two (if that) while never sweating the ammo is good, imo. good for me, anyway
the reason mini shells is good is that the warthog is dogshit and its only value is turret whip
You seem to be optimizing for different things. Being a generalist is better than instantly deleting HVTs in casual lobbies/solo. Performing your job as efficiently as possible (and trusting your teammates will, too) is critical in modded difficulties.
I think the argument is that if you have to pick up that much slack in a haz 6x2 game, you have already lost.
Hipster is effectively a broken jack of all trades option in the base game. Anything higher than that isn't near his wheelhouse of argument. The enemy numbers and health on 6x2 is literally not taken into account when the devs create something... because those are not base game. This counter argument, though correct with the assumption 6x2 is related to what he's talking about, it's the same as saying: "Your car should probably be a Jeep to get through that mountain." even though he doesn't need to get through a mountain.
Hazard 6 numbers aren't that far from Haz 5 though, at least in terms of Enemy Health.
Grunts, Mactera and other similarly sized enemies still have the same amount, and only tanks and bigger have more health (Praet Oppressors, Warden, etc).
They are, however, faster, the Wave timer is shorter, the enemy pool is more varied (disruptive units and HVT are more likely to appear) and the enemy cap is increased from 60 to 90 meaning you're more often than not in a combat situation, so efficiency is the name of the game when tackling these kind of difficulties.
A generalist weapon will struggle a lot more than a specialized loadout, due to the higher variance in enemy distribution.
Single target damage is usually preferred, to deal with HVT quickly and having more freedom when handling grunt waves.
Another huge factor is comfort level. You simply perform better with setups you know because you have developed muscle memory and know time to kill, reload patterns, ammo usage, etc. Generalist builds/setups can be brought on many more missions so the depth of your personal knowledge with that setup can increase way faster than a more specialized one.
Plus specialist builds tend to have major oversights which far outweigh any benefit if they are put into an unfavorable scenario.
didn’t know ya could freeze the caretaker’s vents
hoverclock is also pretty goated and not JUST a 'for fun' overclock
the m1k alone is already a decent gun. And now, you can become immune to fall damage, melee enemies, and be able to fly indefinately as long as you are near a wall or ceiling (pretty commmon in caves)
ontop of that, you rarely get hit by ranged enemies with hoverclock just because the grapple hook makes you move like a mactera.
of course you can kite infinitely with scout anyways, but it's way easier with hoverclock. And with hoverclock, you can now also infinately kite upwards too. As long as you have 1 bullet in the clip, you can fly around infinitely with hoverclock
all of scout's primaries are just very good all-rounder weapons. are they as good at being an all-rounder weapon as gunner's lead storm? No. But being excessively good at killing is gunner's specialty, with scout's speciality being agility.
I would actually argue that driller is the least all-rounder class, due to range and single target, with engineer being the most all rounder.
I think stepping away from numbers is the right take. Deep rock is an easy game, and min maxxing each engagement with a bug misses the forest for the trees. its about how it feels in a mission or in a swarm not a testing room.
If you struggle with swarms tzks cyro nades makes every biter a one tap extremly satisfying
10:21 came back after a long break, switched from Hipster to the Drak and every single mission I widh Praetoriand fell in 5 seconds instead of 30, that I could gun down 7 grunts coming at me without overheating, kill macteras without pulling the crossbow out.
Honestly, I wish the rifles were half as M100,.even without Hipster
You know DRG's new seasonal content didn't click since community is still nitpicking at best all-around overclock.
28 minutes and not a single compelling argument. Amazing.
he's not gon see this lil bro
@@kibbykibbykibbyHe actually reads his comment sections. Look at his video were he's complaining about un-unlockable cosmetic items, he's all over the newest comment section. (Video is called "The 1% Problem).
@@bast4rdlyreaper I meant he's not gonna see this as a point to argue on, it's a foregone conclusion, the video already explains and debunks the idea of people against hipster, so he's not gonna see this and think "should I really relay everything I said in this video to this person that just said nuh uh to all my points"
@@kibbykibbykibby it didn't explain anything, he's playing on Haz 5 and nothing Hipster does is any better than another MK1 build can't do. Fire Bolts can deal with swarms on their own and IFGs make them insanely deadly.
If you want a generalist setup, Electrifying Reload with Pheromones/Fire Bolts is insanely safe, great swarm clear for a Scout build, and way easier recoil control.
If you want DPS, BOM is amazing and shreds everything.
I don't really understand the point he's making, Hipster is fine but its niche is outclassed now they have given huge buffs to the GK2 and it trades the innate value that MK1 has over GK2 for just using blowthrough rounds, which Fire Bolts are already good enough at as is.
so i was messing around with the Shard Diffractor's Plascrete Catalyst overclock and found out.. Uhhh, it's a bit... bugged. It can damage hacksy and Doretta (thankfully Doretta cannot be damaged as long as she remains on her drop platform she starts on.)
I like these insight vids
no amout of beeing good at game will validate you to express your opignion like a jerk
qq more pls
@@ParasocialCatgirl Did you even see the thumbnail? The entire video is made specifically to "dunk" on Waste. It's passive agressive and fucking immature if you even think about it for a second.
I get that people enjoy drama but we should really expect better from those who are such a vocal part in the community
@@ParasocialCatgirlThe "spreadsheet warriors" he accused of having mental issues would disagree.
Ironic that the OC called Hipster is the most versatile of them all
holy shit did you just compliment electrifying reloads? even if it was really backhanded? i am going to clip this out of context for my upcoming “every possible build in the game is not only viable but objectively good” video
You have outlined exactly why I stopped trying to argue with the people on the DRG subreddit: they do not want to admit that this game is random, and instead theorycraft a perfect scenario for each weapon to judge them. They aren't as bad as other subreddits I could name, but there is this weird fetishization of "optimal play" that amounts to cutting off your nose to spite your face: weapons that are "easy" and don't require much thought are considered "noob weapons" or "baby's first good weapon." It's an uphill battle on the DRG sub and others (like, say, the Deadcells sub) to explain how a dead-simple weapon that always does 100 damage is WAY BETTER than a complex weapon that *also* does 100 damage, but requires you to do some series of actions and punishes you by only doing 70 damage if you fuck up. I love hipster because there is so much less to keep track of: just point at bug and click.
A focus shot build is also point and click... Well, hold and release would be more accurate.
I personally prefer this damage delivery method as it allows you to adjust your aim while charging. Not to mention you don't need additional shots to kill your target.
@@That_Goddamn_Scout Granted, yes, the M1k is not the worst offender--I'm an engie main, so the "discourse" I engaged in was with the Lok1 where sweaty nerds argue that you need to build it a very specific way, take certain secondaries to wombo-combo it, and adapt your play-style to force your team kill all the common bugs so that you can look up at the ceiling and only shoot X, Y, or Z... Versus the shotgun which is just pointing at bugs and splattering them with buckshot.
@MetalDustGaming To be fair, LOK1 has only two builds: Executioner and Explosive Chemical Rounds. Both being used in their own specific niches, and being relatively straightforward in execution. I don't know what you've been told but it's not rocket science to make LOK1 work.
@@That_Goddamn_Scout You're correct, it isn't, but Redditors are on another level when it comes to over-complicating things.
just watching him play cryo bolt makes me relaxed im doing it bad and how i can do better but i like hipster so im using it
As a 1600 level player, hipster is the best OC for scout. With similar m1000 tier build except I use faster reloads because the 'shoot faster' strategy works better when you can reload faster to keep shooting faster. It also pairs best with the zhukov and gas recycling. DRG puffed it and it insanely broken. I think it was meant to be used with the GK2, but the hipster M1000 build does more damage due to weakpoint damage and you don't have to only shoot weapoints. You ifg a chokepoint and use your Zhukov to kill all enemies without having to care about the lack of weapoint because of the Zhukov tier 5 conductive bullets that gives you +33% damage bonus plus the +25% damage bonus that the ifg gives you. And if you pick the tier 4 blowthrough round, you kill every bug. It's the best scout build because you can focus on important bugs and large crowds, which no other scout build does better.
That does sound like a strong combo. The , strongest? I'm not sure. Are there other builds that can do the same but maybe better? Probably. Strongest in your opinion? Seems like it.
@@Marian_DRG "Probably" is not a good response.
Why? What else do you want? I can tell you that in my opinion something like EFS and Firebolts does it better but I don't have the time to prove anything atm.
@@Marian_DRG Saying EFS and Firebolts is at least a better response.
New OC Idea:
(I think)
#1
-can only fire charged shots
-huge increase in damage
-lower ammo
#2
-cannot fire charged shots
-large increase in ammo capacity
(Sorta like a deepcore gk2/m1000 mixed???)
First one is pretty much supercooling chamber, but more limited
I have about 100 hrs in this game and i have done all my missions on haz 4 and haz 5 and completed multiple elite deep dives and i’d like for someone more experienced to tell me why people argue so much about builds in this game when i honestly feel like the margin of error is really not that small.
axiskronos has a sarcastic tone of voice that angers people apparently
You're right. The game isn't hard enough to warrant discussions/arguments about a hypothetical meta.
Yet some people, myself included, know that despite DRG balance being questionable, there are options that are clearly better when you want to optimize your gameplay.
And this, when confronted to more casual players opinions, tends to spark heated arguments, depending on how each party's opinion is presented.
In that case, Axis comes off as passive agressive towards people he calls "spreadsheet warriors".
Its kinda like the discussion I have with a friend now and again about wether Big Bertha or Neurotoxin is better.
DGR has managed to create discussions where both sides are correct and "debate" more for the lolz than anything else.
Neurotoxin Gunner
Sludgepump Stinky Boi
Plasma Zhukov Scout
"The stick" Engineer
Neurotoxin is more ammo efficient at killing grunts type enemies, but you will struggle when a tanky enemy comes or you get special bosses, and big bertha is good at everything.
If people say hipster cant one hit body grunts you know they're not taking damage and focus shot mods. It reaches that breakpoint then. With the damage in T1 it one hits web spitters to the body. A focus shot and 2 more into it's body kills a trijaw as well, which will be sitting still for 3s with the focus shot stun.
Even building hipster to fill a similar role as support and not to be able to solo clear stuff *as* well, it does basically as good as the normal M1k while also getting much higher solo play potential and versatility in any situation.
Hipster is a jack of all trades, master of all
Minimal clip > hipster
Change my mind
I did not know u can freeze the caretaker
I love your videos so no hate, but at the end of the video you said you weren't talking about modding but mentioned waste's video about hipster being worse then nothing. Even though waste plays a lot of modded content which without a doubt affected his opinion on hipster. I think hipster is a good overclock, I don't think it is the end all be all just because you can also kill swarms with your primary. (even though boltshark with fire or ice is all the crowd clear you need). but I digress. I haven't played as much as you so maybe I'm wrong. have a good one. :)
if waste was talking about modded difficulties for overclocks, maybe he should have said so at any given point in his video? Just a thought
You’re right, Axis has been pushing the idea Hipster is broken for years when in reality it makes the M1000 worse at its best base qualities/jobs
Now that the GK2 is actually good at least with AI Stability, I’d never tell a friend to take Hipster seriously
@@roar104And yet he didn't, because his video doesn't apply specifically to modded hazards, despite his opinions being obviously influenced by his experience with said difficulties.
@@roar104you could also say that the video is redundant outside of modded difficulties because the game is very well balanced. anything can be used anywhere anytime, whether it be solo or multiplayer. so a tierlist isn’t needed in the first place. but in modded difficulties, you’re going to want what works.
I have now 500h in Deep Rock and I didn't like the scout class at all in the beginning slowly I startet liking him more through playing plasma carabine on him but damadge was still kinda mid, but I like the Idea a lot of looking at something at it dying without me having to think a lot about it. I used to actually hate the M1000 because I tried overclocks like super cooling chamber or other and it just didn't feel right so me, but when I picked up Hipster I actually started to enjoy playing scout a lot. I don't care about the stats too much I go more after Weapon feeling wich to me is just perfect with Hipster.
I feel the same exact way about everything that you've said.
I think people should let people play how they want in general. Hipster definitely has potential.