I work for the railway and I work alongside 750v dc and making sure that it is isolated correctly and locked off is so important so this is a great video showing how to safely isolate correctly nice video.
Some years back I was doing a quick job at a Tesco and turned the 20a mcb off, whilst working on the equipment it suddenly came on, checked mcb and yes one of the staff noticed it was off so put it back on, my stupid fault very very quickly learned lesson, always always lock off no matter how quick you think you are going to be.
We had a "lock out- tag out system" when I use to work for a large semiconductor company in Ireland. A great system which worked really well & provided you with that security. You always had that niggling worry that's always in the back of your mind that some unsuspecting person could accidentally turn the power back on. When I went back to domestic sparking I always tried to recreate it, as the same safety standards were just not there. Great to see this device being introduced.
Fantastic video again. Love this channel. As an automotive HV electrical engineer I really appreciate these types of videos showing educational safe working practices. It is so so important and necessary. Agree Martindale are a fantastic product. I have always used them and give great peace of mind. Being Live working certified at 400v I need to trust what my testers and proving units are telling me and I get that trust from Martindale. Keep up the great work guys. Look forward to the next video. 👍👌
Actually you won't get shocked if you touch that probe with your hand. The internal impedance of these testers is too high for that. Otherwise you would trip the RCD/RCBO when testing between line and CPC. If the tester is damaged and that internal impedance is no longer given, the tester would indicate weird voltage values. Some proofing units will give you a full test cycle with different voltages. A different thing is if you have a tester with a load connection, but this load connection is only applied when pressing two buttons simultaneously, and only for the time both buttons are pressed. And that load connection trips RCDs/RCBOs. Still good practice to do so. But on a three-phase system it becomes a bit weird, because you also have to test between the lines, so there is no least dangerous in that case. Here in Germany the safe isolation is fixed in our regs for decades in the DIN VDE 0105, called the "five safety rules for electrical work" 1. isolate circuit 2. prevent reenergizing 3. ensure the circuit is really dead with a properly tested 2-pole voltage tester 4. earth and short-circuit all conductors (only on overhead lines which are usually not insulated, and voltages above 1kV) 5. cover up all exposed live parts next to your working area (that is mainly for work areas like transformer stations or industrial environments) So for domestic usually only rules 1 to 3 are relevant. Instead of using a proofing unit you can also use a known functional live circuit instead to fulfill that regulation. But sometimes you don't have the luxury of having one in the area, so still a good idea of having a proofing unit. Also a tip: Always use your own lock, never a provided one by a colleague or the customer! You don't know who else got a copy of the key for that lock.
R Isnt cutting the plastic bag off a plug socket that may be live a bit dodgy, a narrow pointed blade could easily touch a terminal, and to protect a plug socket from paint plaster etc use cling film, easier to remove and mould to fit around the unit.
I changed an outside light fitting off ladders at my parents house and didn't put a padlock on the mcb as they were away on holiday and I had the spare key to the house which I locked up after switching off the consumer unit mcb. After I had connected the new light it came on as i was descending the ladder, My parents had come home early and reset the mcb. Lesson learned always assume someone else with the building keys could be there at any time
Excellent video! Just to let you all know we're looking at the feedback provided in the comments and if you have any questions we're glad to help. Stay Safe!
I had an incident recently in a refurbished commercial building. The building had undergone extensive refurbishment that included a rewire. The incident involved an installed motor which now had a new feed from a different DB, the electrician had connected the new feed but hadn't removed the old wiring which had just been cut-off and left. Because I needed to renew some low-voltage control wiring that ran through the same flexible conduit as the old feed I went to remove this cut-off power cable, only to find out the hard way that the electrician had left it connected at the load end so it was now back-fed from the incoming side of the motor isolator. Of course I should have turned-off the relevant MCB in the new DB first, but it never occurred to me that a qualified spark would connect the new wiring to the isolator without removing the old wiring first. The moral of this story is never assume that the other guy, however well qualified, is going to do the job properly.
them retractable tips can be more dangerous than you think - if the tip fails to extend properly you will be left with a false sense of safety because you can't see the tip making contact directly. Should have at least 1mm always exposed.
It's a retractable shroud as opposed to an extending probe so it's not so bad, but your point still stands about potentially not being able to see. Also potentially problematic if you're trying to probe a socket dangling in mid air... I do think it's better than non retractable shrouds though, fixed ones (or removable ones that haven't been removed) are more likely to give you a false connection. I very much like the Fluke TwistGuard system. Slim, no fiddly bits to lose and you choose exactly how much exposed probe you want.
trainee meter fitter great video we dont get given lockout kits but will defiantly be buying one to stop home owner trying to turn back on and giving us a flash over when we replace the main fuse
When I was around 4 or 5 I stuck my finger into a lamp which had no bulb in whilst my parents were redecorating. Needless to say the lamp was live and I got the shock of my life. That was one lesson I learnt very early on.
Such an important aspect of the job. Quite ironic really because my neighbour was telling me this evening how he got thrown over a kitchen table when he jabbed a screwdriver behind a socket that he thought was dead.
I remember years ago my mother and I were visiting her aunt in her flat. The power went while my mother was cooking our lunch. I went down to the box where the meters were for the flats and shop belonging to the person who also Owned the flats. I noticed the main isolation switch for my granaunts flat was turned off. There was no safe isolation lock on it. I was about to turn it back on when I thought I should check with the owner first. He told me that there was an electrician installing a sign outside his shop. I still get the willies when I think how I could have been responsible for ultimately killing the electrician.
Worries so much about safety he uses an uninsulated knife to cut off wrapping on a circuit he's not sure is live or not ... great advert for martindale there haha
There might have been a loose wire floating around which you wouldn’t see because wrapped in plastic. As a non electrician I would have turned power off before unwrapping the socket.
No matter what it is I am sure it will be interesting.The fact he got it as a free sample and told us is great. I am all for these reviews as long as the kit is genuinely good. If it were cheap Chinese crap I would not be happy but quality sells itself. Just because an electrician uses a Metrel does not mean they are good. If all they have is a 'fluke' coloured £20 multimeter and some chewed up stone age screwdrivers show them the door.
I still have my old martindale test lamp kicking around somewhere,not only does it indicate if the circuit is live,it also isolates the rcd for you if you test between phase and earth
All falls under the time-honoured phrase "reasonably practicable". I used to work as a DNO engineer and the proving units for LV test lamps and for HV live-line detectors were also tested periodically. Testing all the test equipment at every use _ad infinitum_ isn't reasonably practicable, so it's not expected but I get your point. Not using a proving unit immediately before and after using the voltage indicator could land you in some difficulty post-incident, however.
Always wise to test, so easy to screw up, no matter how intelligent / experienced you happen to be. I worked on my shed live once because I'd switched off the smoke alarms at the main CU. I only had two breakers not on RCD protection, both clearly marked, and somehow I switched off the 6A smoke alarms rather than the 40A shed feed. No idea how it happened, only found out when I went to turn it back on. Fortunately I was only working on earth wiring, but inside a garage CU right next to the (covered) busbar.
And this is where, not just Jordon, fail. Martaindale is super and great. Can you just point me to a previous video where he has used them?? I’ll watch future ones to see how much they appear. I mean, if you use the stuff sure, but to just stick it on a video and promote it, it’s a joke. Your not helping the industry, more so lining your pockets. Syndical me 😂😂
I don't think this is specific to martindale, but is more an issue with "2 pole testers" in general. They will only pick up when there is a voltage between two conductors, they won't pick up when *everything* is live or floating. For this reason and others I would be very careful about working on stuff that is "already dead" when you arrive. It is much better if you can confirm something is live, then isolate it and finally confirm it is dead. Even then it's not 100% foolproof, multiple feeds, borrowed neutrals and so-on are far from unheard of.
@@petermichaelgreen hi peter, i use a different brand of voltage tester which has a feature that will alert me if there is no cpc or neutral, the only problem with this is it requires a battery to do so but also has a self test function you can perform before using a proving unit which will tests all the led’s and the battery.
@@petermichaelgreen The rather simple 2-prong tester I use does actually indicate a live connection both visually and audibly when probing from the meter side, but for it to display a voltage reading does require a form of ground (basically anything loosely connected to earth) on the flying probe.
Modern ones have a single probe live test as well. The Kewtech voltage tester I use has this feature, I'm sure the flukes do. I think I've only ever seen Jordan use the same Kewtech tester that I do in previous videos.
I remember working on a lighting circuit in a shed with a tv guy, he wanted to turn on his tv, so I said it should be working, (as in the power point) next minute i hear a familiar click behind me and he had switched the lighting circuit back on. Still strange to this day
Lots of cases of lockoff kits falling off the breakers due to being poorly fitted then someone getting injured. Sadly that process of locking off isn’t fool proof . Is probably better to actually isolate it from within the board
The thing is, you got several types of MCBs with different dimensions and designs of the housings. So you require different types of locking mechanisms, and it's always trial and error. I always take my time checking if I picked the right one and test if it's holding properly and prevents that the MCB/RCBO can be switched on again.
I'm just starting out as an electrician and I love your videos but I can't help but cringe at companies giving free stock to people for free advertising 🤮 I know the economics of it but 🥶
It drives me insane as there are so many who can't afford the new equipment (myself included) yet companies give them out for free like this, I know its all about advertising to get more business but still sucks. Especially as Jordan and the team probably have tons of equipment they don't use anymore due to getting free stuff.
ADVERT: Martindale Electric have kindly sponsored this video - you can buy their safe isolation kits using the links below: amzn.to/3E7Hcr0 amzn.to/38PN3mi
Great Video, Thanks for making it. I do have a question thou, why do you try different breakers? Could you not just use a tone generator on the line and use the receiver to find which circuit it is. Saves runnung back and forth trying different breakers.
Using a tone generator would involve more disruption as the whole CU would have to be isolated to accommodate the circuit identification process. It may well be that an electrician carrying out a risk assessment would decide that was reasonable in the circumstances (unoccupied house). However, tone generator signals could be applied to the wrong circuit and the tone receiver could pick up a signal at the point of work that was interpreted by the user as a 'clear indication' that the circuit was identified, when it was not. In the scenario depicted in this video, proving a change of condition at the terminal on the socket outlet (proved live - MCB opened - proved not-live) is probably the most practical and reasonable way to identify and disconnect the circuit prior to isolation.
@@mikeselectricstuff not a good idea. Socket testers are not designed to be used as voltage indicators (with approved proving units) like the Martindale kit. You could use them a 100 times and get way with it or use it once and have an accident. Don't think I would want to defend that approach in a subsequent HSE investigation.
Pity the plasterer didn't show the same consideration as the decorator. The socket is absolutely covered in plaster. Have you tried using the temporary yellow socket spacers that Nick Bundy uses? Fit them during 1st fix and remove them during 2nd fix. Great product.
That will only work with batteries. If the batteries are empty they'll usually only show you the "dangerous voltage" symbol and that's it to comply with the EN for voltage testers. These Martindale testers work without any battery. I use a voltage tester with a load connection. The load is a vibration motor in one of the handles. On a noisy site you won't hear the beeping, but you can feel the vibration in your hand. The higher the voltage, the harder the vibration.
l , a six lock lockout ,one person goes home with a key and you are knackered ,so you fitted a lockout to a breaker .but obstruct the next breaker .all this maybe off a electrician ,its live or its not ,a sharp knives by wires ,went in without checking socket was dead ,whoever unscrewed those sockets and covered them over ,but left them live, how long do the batteries last in that proving unit ?instruction leaflet just tossed to one side, yes maybe you know what these things are for, but its always a good idea just to look at a leaflet ,could be a important note you might miss
Here’s a scenario, you mention multiple sparks working on one site from the same consumer unit and, other trades working on site. So you’ve just isolated the breaker you’re working from. What happens if another of the aforementioned sparks, or worse still another trade on site, makes a change to the wiring in the loft, which for what ever reason, becomes connected in to the ring you’re on. They go back and turn on their breaker and you then get a shock. Surely the safest option in the instance where other trades are working, where possible, should be to lock off at main breaker?
In the real world you cannot go round and just turn of mains and incoming. Especially in an Industrial setting. You have to allow for compliant people working not everything can be fool proof
Not an unusual scenario on a large commercial or industrial installation with lots of work going on at the same time. Management of safety then includes as part of any risk assessment before work starts a specific action to confirm whether other work is taking place that could affect your safety (or your work could affect theirs). Some large sites may operate a Permit-For-Work system to manage this too. Your scenario refers to a domestic house so the risk is probably higher as it's unlikely a safe system of work is written down to cover what's going on. Head on a swivel and always treat wiring as live until proven otherwise.
Exactly what I was thinking. I’ve worked on big jobs where the HVAC boys may have their own sparks, therefore not inconceivable they could make changes without any communication, especially with multiple subby gangs going.
Hi Jordan I am not a electrician just a very keen interest in electrical installation but I got a Martindale plug in tester that I bought in 1989 and still work great also I got a Klein 5 in1 screwdriver that I bought in USA on holiday In a Sears store in Florida back in 2000 the largest slotted driver bit of the two fits the brass M4 pan head conduit boxs machine screws perfect I think I paid about 10 dollars for it I just love to buy tool were ever I have been on holidays all over I just got to find a tool shop
The boards I go for domestic nowadays are Contactum just because they have the magnets to hold the cover up. Not really impressed with Hager that much and fusebox brand is just a hype which tend to go down hill in my view where I used the torque screwdriver on a main switch and it just lost the thread on it. But mind you I don't want to hype Contactum just because I can go to my wholesaler and get everything without waiting for weeks on for a 20a RCBO. Thanks Jordan nice to see you back.
Contactum is a brand I am not sure on, they have been bust a few times, so who knows how long they will be around. I recently installed one of their boards, and I wasn't impressed with it, mine didn't have magnets, plus it doesn't come with any grommet strip. Only used it because cities had it on the shelf, I normally use fuse box, it's been difficult to get, but denmans now have a good stock of it.
Nice video again! Can’t there be a case where only the live was connected, but cpc and neutral were not connected? That would lead to no voltage shown on the tester but the live still has its potential to earth. Hence I think it’s good practice to measure from all conductors to a water line or similar to proof the conductors completely dead…. what do you think?
If there was a significant hazard in the work area - so, if there was a likelihood that you could touch any part of the installation wiring and another, earthed conductor simultaneously - then, yes, I would test from each conductor (line and neutral and cpc) in turn to the pipe or whatever I might be holding onto.
I was expecting a beautiful, pristine socket for all the effort made to wrap it up. I thought maybe it will be something with a nice brushed metal finish, at least a nice MK Logic Plus or a Click Mode. But no! It's the cheapest shittiest square edge socket you can buy from Wilko that someone's dropped in a bucket of plaster!
Maybe im wrong but I thought the approved procedure was to prove the tester to show its functionality and voltage detection level is correct, conduct the tests, working lowest potential to highest potential and then reprove the tester to prove that no internal fuses were blown during the test and validate the functionality.
Hi I’m making some holes in my floor near the consumer unit in prep for an charger install, How big should the hole be to take the 7kw armoured cable? Want to make sure it’s a big enough hole? Thanks
Shouldn’t you have shown you proving the unit before sticking it in the socket. I mean in the same segment. The second time you did it at around 13:40 you showed it working after. Your supposed to do it before and after ;) you vids are great just being picky haha !
Talking about electricians losing their lives - do you have a proper emergency response kit in all your electricians cars? (medic kit, heart starter) If not, you should investigate!
We have AEDs, automatic external defibrillator. You don't start a heart with that, that thing only brings it back to the regular timing in case of ventricular fibrillation. You still have to do manual reanimation in case of cardiac arrest. First aid kits belong into every car!
The DNO I used to work for ensured that all operational staff with a live working authorisation had also to complete basic first aid training that included CPR and use of AED equipment. This was part of the safety case supplied by the DNO to the HSE to justify the issuing of live working authorisations to suitably trained and competent persons. That said, an AED won't do anything for a patient whose heart has stopped. I understand that the latest AED models, once the pads are properly applied to the patient's body, can determine whether the patient is suffering VF (in which case it will proceed with the defib sequence) or that the patient is asystole (in which case it will tell the AED operator the heart appears to have stopped so no shocking takes place).
@@tonipeters4543 a risk assessment of any work activity should consider whether the work in question should be accompanied work. Some live work (e.g. work in a control panel where some apparatus remains live while the part to be worked on is disconnected or isolated) requires accompaniment while some (e.g. switching operations) does not.
If more people died, then the governing bodies and building control may sort the problems out, until then the industry will remain a shambles, caused by a lot of people racing to the bottom.
@@nigelevans2883 he flipped off the one to right of the breaker which was already off then locked the one to the left of the pair ie the one already off!
@@judebrown4103 You want to watch the video closer and you'll see a cut in the video where he flips the left hand breaker off from behind the door and the goes to check the voltage on the socket and the locks that circuit breaker off.
@Jon Bailey You want to watch the video closer and you'll see a cut in the video where he flips the left hand breaker off from behind the door and the goes to check the voltage on the socket and the locks that circuit breaker off.
Martindale were always known as the best of the best but I fear they have lost there way,I recently brought a new Martindale tester and the quality just is not there poor mouldings and things dont line up...when I Emailed them to voice my concern I was simply ignored..
Well it doesn't belong to the customer, but if the suppliers can't be bothered to install a suitable isolator, then I will pull the fuse and think nothing of it. You have no option when doing a board change.
From what I've read on various comments to similar videos, the practice varies between DNOs (or DSOs as they are now?), which is not helpful. There should be no doubt that the service termination apparatus, including the fused cut-out is the property of the DNO, is therefore a component of the LV network and, as such, is subject to the DNOs Safety Rules applicable to that network. The DNO I used to work for has a specific switching authorisation for the withdrawal/replacement of cut-out fuses so the removal of a cut-out seal and then the fuse-holder _could_ be construed as unlawful interference. Only way to get a definitive answer is if it ends up in a court of law. Best not to go there.
@@acelectricalsecurity yep there is that too. But if you’ve turned say a circuit off then pop off to another part of the building where said circuit is supposed to be off, you’d need to test it. The house I purchased wife wanted a single socket changed to a double. Off sockets down went… went to socket down and tested. It was actually on sockets up!! Never assume, always test. No known source was available to test the tester.
In all fairness if you have got a consumer unit that is less than twenty years old, you are only going to get a sharp buzz, I've worked on loads of live electrics hence plenty of shocks, yet to hear of one person who have died on a domestic unit
Agreed. In this scenario, it was likely to have been reasonably practicable to have isolated the whole house supply in order to remove the "packaging" from the socket outlet to prepare it for testing. With the supply to the CU still on, it would have to be assumed that the wiring to the socket outlet was live and so removing the temporary protection applied by others was indeed live working that could not be justified in the context of the Electricity at Work Regulations. If the circuit was fed from a 12-way TP&N DB in a busy factory a risk assessment and method statement would probably suggest a different approach to attempt to identify the circuit and prove it not live before removing the tape. If all else fails the RAMS would probably fall back to the use of adequate PPE (gloves with rated insulation, full-face rated visor and FR coveralls and NO metal knives or tools) to protect the electrician until the terminals can be exposed to allow the approved testing procedure to be applied.
I like your video and the process of proving dead was well demonstrated but would be good to identify where the process comes from. It is a legal requirement in the electricity at work regs 1989, it states when working on equipment it must be isolated from all sources of supply. In the definitions it states that an isolation is a disconnection from all sources of supply in such a way the disconnection is secured, I.e. disconnect the source and lock it to secure it. Also the process comes from the HSG 85 which is the HSE guidance for electrical safety. You also mentioned that a light on the proving unit identifies high voltage, high voltage in the EaWRegs is voltage over 1000V ac or 1500V dc between phase conductors and above 600V ac 900V Dc between phase and neutral, voltage range between phases. national grid introduced Medium voltage bet is not recognised in law but is in their own safety rules. Good vid though for house bashers, just a shame so many so called skilled electricians don't even know the safe isolation procedure.
It’s a legal requirement to work safely, ie isolated, yet the DNOs still resist us being allowed to pull main fuses, or make us jump through hoops to enable us to do so. It’s madness.
Hi Stuart, good to see such a correct and informed reply. There are many concerns with RUclips electrical videos, even from Artisan, but at least they are trying to improve things. Working at height is a major danger and even a non fatal shock can cause a reaction fall. Noticed this problem in an Artisan recent post. Another concern is understanding the role of an electrician when making changes to an installation and installing new work without detail drawings from a professional engineer. They then assume the role of designer and need a high level of knowledge of the full installation plus professional indemnity insurance. Anyway thank you Artisan for excellent videos and welcoming debate.
@@chrisrogers2848 how does the DNO (who owns and operates the service termination apparatus) gauge the competency of someone that is intending to operate the cut-out fuse? They **_have_** to do this as they have a duty to establish and operate a safe system of work under the same health and safety legislation (s.2 HASAWA 1974) that requires you and I to work safely. Any DNO with a policy of allowing anybody to pull main fuses without first assessing their competency to do so safely would eventually be guaranteeing a visit to the dock in the local court for their Operations Manager.
@@protectiongeek surely then by the same token they should be required to provide a safe means of isolation that can be operated without need for them to assess competence, which in practice probably means an isolator switch. There was an ideal opportunity to do this with the smart meter rollout but it was missed. Failing all else, the process for getting them to isolate the supply needs to be much more accessible and convenient, otherwise people will always be tempted to just pull the fuse themselves on the quiet just to get the job done, which means no safety precautions at all.
@@chrisrogers2848 the requirement for provision of a point of isolation by the DNO is not in doubt but there is no qualification of that requirement such that operation of the PoI should not require a person to be competent and appoint as such in writing. If there was, that would create a **retrospective** burden to fit two-pole isolators to all service terminations. Clearly, DNOs concur with your conclusion that the provision of an isolator is a sensible step (although the person operating it in the context of the work carried out by an electrician must still satisfy the requirements of Reg 16 of the Electricity at Work Regs 1989). All new builds (as far as I know) incorporate an isolator. Some DNOs charge for retro-fitting one to a legacy service termination and some don't. As with so many things, the issue is one of cost - a valid consideration within the ambit of what is deemed "reasonably practicable". An electrician at work pulling the fuse "on the quiet" is taking a significant risk. We both know this happens several times each working day. However, if that action is material to the circumstances of an incident subsequently investigated and prosecuted by HSE etc, then a defence of "it was inconvenient to contact the DNO and wait for them to attend" is no defence at all. I know that the HSE take a particularly dim view of no isolation or things like sticking a bit of PVC tape over an MCB in the off position, given the availability of products like the Martindale kit demonstrated in this video.
How do you know that your proving unit doesnt effective? Do you need to prove your proving unit as well . Endless cycle :)) let me tell you do best way if i work already energized system my proving unit is the incoming supply tails. If i do new rewire or installation then i know it s not energized and already disconnected so its dead because i install them. We dont need a proving unit...
If your proving unit isn't working then your meter won't light up and you'll know that something's up. You might not always be at a location with available live tails to proove off of, what if you were working on a DB and you had isolated the supply on the other side of the building? The proving unit is a convenient way to have a high voltage source readily available when you're doing the testing.
No need to routinely prove the proving unit - if the tester doesn’t work on it, it’s an indication of a problem and that you cannot rely on the whole kit to prove isolation. You would then have to take extra steps to establish which part is faulty, rectify/replace and start again.
Not so keen on the advert type videos. If the build quality was iffy or something, would you actually say? I'm sure you would but it does put slight doubt in my mind. Nagy does with his Bosch stuff. But I've never heard you once make any type of criticism, albeit, constructive criticism, of a piece of kit that you dedicate an episode to. Although I may have missed one if you did. Cory often asks for things to be added to EV charging points and it's cool when the manufacturer adds his suggestions in, but I assume you've paid for those as part of the job you're doing.
not a good idea to be hacking at a bag and tape around a live socket with a metal knife. one slip and it will go straight through the insulation and then youd know if it was live or not.
Is it just me or did you lock off the one that was already off? I'm sure the one you turned off was the one on the right... In fact I rewound just to be sure! I've paused the vid, you may have realised by the end...
All that time proving dead and safely isolating but let's say someone put one leg of the ring in that breaker that was switched off. You didn't lock that off. The builder could switch that breaker on and your now working on a live circuit.
Didn't use the proving unit first before testing the socket was live. Should not be cutting around live cables with metal knife, sockets shouldn't be left live anyway if not screwed to back box, is this a training video? 🙄
A clamp meter doesn’t comply with the relevant bs number, your safe isolation voltage tester must be a dedicated voltage tester and work without batteries among other requirements.
@@Jamie-oo3si very true. I get the meter calibrated but I will look at investing in one and my probes don’t comply with gs38. Bit embarrassing for a qualified electrician :s. thanks
Is this a test? The already turned off breaker looks to be the one that was locked out, so the kitchen ring was not locked off at all, unless I'm very much mistaken.
Sorry, but if you're passionate about working safely then you've shot yourself in the foot before you even get started... using an open bladed knife where not necessary when opening the box, moving a metal handled blade towards potentially live conductors that also haven't been isolated and have been left unsecured outside of enclosure... Cluttered working area... As for the quality padlock... seconds to open without a key by any number of means - the point is to prevent accidental energisation as preventing deliberate override is virtually impossible.
I work for the railway and I work alongside 750v dc and making sure that it is isolated correctly and locked off is so important so this is a great video showing how to safely isolate correctly nice video.
Thanks a lot
Some years back I was doing a quick job at a Tesco and turned the 20a mcb off, whilst working on the equipment it suddenly came on, checked mcb and yes one of the staff noticed it was off so put it back on, my stupid fault very very quickly learned lesson, always always lock off no matter how quick you think you are going to be.
We had a "lock out- tag out system" when I use to work for a large semiconductor company in Ireland. A great system which worked really well & provided you with that security. You always had that niggling worry that's always in the back of your mind that some unsuspecting person could accidentally turn the power back on. When I went back to domestic sparking I always tried to recreate it, as the same safety standards were just not there. Great to see this device being introduced.
Fantastic video again. Love this channel. As an automotive HV electrical engineer I really appreciate these types of videos showing educational safe working practices. It is so so important and necessary. Agree Martindale are a fantastic product. I have always used them and give great peace of mind. Being Live working certified at 400v I need to trust what my testers and proving units are telling me and I get that trust from Martindale. Keep up the great work guys. Look forward to the next video. 👍👌
Absolutely Brilliant video, thanks for putting this together. Lives Matter.
Great. Got a test coming up, its going to be a breeze thanks to this.
Actually you won't get shocked if you touch that probe with your hand. The internal impedance of these testers is too high for that. Otherwise you would trip the RCD/RCBO when testing between line and CPC. If the tester is damaged and that internal impedance is no longer given, the tester would indicate weird voltage values. Some proofing units will give you a full test cycle with different voltages.
A different thing is if you have a tester with a load connection, but this load connection is only applied when pressing two buttons simultaneously, and only for the time both buttons are pressed. And that load connection trips RCDs/RCBOs.
Still good practice to do so. But on a three-phase system it becomes a bit weird, because you also have to test between the lines, so there is no least dangerous in that case.
Here in Germany the safe isolation is fixed in our regs for decades in the DIN VDE 0105, called the "five safety rules for electrical work"
1. isolate circuit
2. prevent reenergizing
3. ensure the circuit is really dead with a properly tested 2-pole voltage tester
4. earth and short-circuit all conductors (only on overhead lines which are usually not insulated, and voltages above 1kV)
5. cover up all exposed live parts next to your working area (that is mainly for work areas like transformer stations or industrial environments)
So for domestic usually only rules 1 to 3 are relevant.
Instead of using a proofing unit you can also use a known functional live circuit instead to fulfill that regulation. But sometimes you don't have the luxury of having one in the area, so still a good idea of having a proofing unit.
Also a tip: Always use your own lock, never a provided one by a colleague or the customer! You don't know who else got a copy of the key for that lock.
R
Isnt cutting the plastic bag off a plug socket that may be live a bit dodgy, a narrow pointed blade could easily touch a terminal, and to protect a plug socket from paint plaster etc use cling film, easier to remove and mould to fit around the unit.
I changed an outside light fitting off ladders at my parents house and didn't put a padlock on the mcb as they were away on holiday and I had the spare key to the house which I locked up after switching off the consumer unit mcb.
After I had connected the new light it came on as i was descending the ladder, My parents had come home early and reset the mcb.
Lesson learned always assume someone else with the building keys could be there at any time
They dint notice you up the 40 foot ladder as they pulled onto the drive then
@@ericthekingthekingtheking4842 around the other side and no window, can't be seen from the front drive
Excellent video! Just to let you all know we're looking at the feedback provided in the comments and if you have any questions we're glad to help. Stay Safe!
I had an incident recently in a refurbished commercial building. The building had undergone extensive refurbishment that included a rewire. The incident involved an installed motor which now had a new feed from a different DB, the electrician had connected the new feed but hadn't removed the old wiring which had just been cut-off and left. Because I needed to renew some low-voltage control wiring that ran through the same flexible conduit as the old feed I went to remove this cut-off power cable, only to find out the hard way that the electrician had left it connected at the load end so it was now back-fed from the incoming side of the motor isolator. Of course I should have turned-off the relevant MCB in the new DB first, but it never occurred to me that a qualified spark would connect the new wiring to the isolator without removing the old wiring first. The moral of this story is never assume that the other guy, however well qualified, is going to do the job properly.
Shame the plasterer never thought about protecting them before he started covering them in muck
I thought he was having a piss take when I seen the cover come off😂
I actually thought he wants ring when he took the cover off and it was covered in plaster 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
them retractable tips can be more dangerous than you think - if the tip fails to extend properly you will be left with a false sense of safety because you can't see the tip making contact directly. Should have at least 1mm always exposed.
It's a retractable shroud as opposed to an extending probe so it's not so bad, but your point still stands about potentially not being able to see.
Also potentially problematic if you're trying to probe a socket dangling in mid air...
I do think it's better than non retractable shrouds though, fixed ones (or removable ones that haven't been removed) are more likely to give you a false connection.
I very much like the Fluke TwistGuard system. Slim, no fiddly bits to lose and you choose exactly how much exposed probe you want.
@@tceng9449 and if we're being realistic, no-one is going to probe socket terminals when they can just stick a socket tester in
@@havoctrousers chosen as an example as that's exactly what he was doing in the video :)
trainee meter fitter great video
we dont get given lockout kits but will defiantly be buying one to stop home owner trying to turn back on and giving us a flash over when we replace the main fuse
When I was around 4 or 5 I stuck my finger into a lamp which had no bulb in whilst my parents were redecorating. Needless to say the lamp was live and I got the shock of my life. That was one lesson I learnt very early on.
Wow you were quite fortunate to not get badly hurt
Such an important aspect of the job. Quite ironic really because my neighbour was telling me this evening how he got thrown over a kitchen table when he jabbed a screwdriver behind a socket that he thought was dead.
Lovely bit of kit 👌🏻
I remember years ago my mother and I were visiting her aunt in her flat. The power went while my mother was cooking our lunch. I went down to the box where the meters were for the flats and shop belonging to the person who also Owned the flats. I noticed the main isolation switch for my granaunts flat was turned off. There was no safe isolation lock on it. I was about to turn it back on when I thought I should check with the owner first. He told me that there was an electrician installing a sign outside his shop. I still get the willies when I think how I could have been responsible for ultimately killing the electrician.
Worries so much about safety he uses an uninsulated knife to cut off wrapping on a circuit he's not sure is live or not ... great advert for martindale there haha
Plastic is a non conductive material.
Its not like he was touching the bare knife metal.
It’s a steel body knife
How do you know he didn't check it previously?
How could you get to the terminals to check if it's covered in wrapping to check ?
There might have been a loose wire floating around which you wouldn’t see because wrapped in plastic. As a non electrician I would have turned power off before unwrapping the socket.
I wonder if this was inspired by another electricians recent video which contained an unfortunate incident?
Who was that then?
I too would like to know.
I wonder which Free Sample you’ll be plugging on your next episode?
No matter what it is I am sure it will be interesting.The fact he got it as a free sample and told us is great. I am all for these reviews as long as the kit is genuinely good. If it were cheap Chinese crap I would not be happy but quality sells itself. Just because an electrician uses a Metrel does not mean they are good. If all they have is a 'fluke' coloured £20 multimeter and some chewed up stone age screwdrivers show them the door.
Excellent!!!👍
I still have my old martindale test lamp kicking around somewhere,not only does it indicate if the circuit is live,it also isolates the rcd for you if you test between phase and earth
Good safety video
The QVC Electrics Channel 🤣
4:42 “it’s quite shocking” lol.
I liked "it's quite shocking " how many people die from electric shock in our industry.
Interesting bit of kit. But the tester that tests the tester needs a tester to check that tester is testing correctly.
'Quis custodiet ipsos custdes?'
All falls under the time-honoured phrase "reasonably practicable". I used to work as a DNO engineer and the proving units for LV test lamps and for HV live-line detectors were also tested periodically. Testing all the test equipment at every use _ad infinitum_ isn't reasonably practicable, so it's not expected but I get your point. Not using a proving unit immediately before and after using the voltage indicator could land you in some difficulty post-incident, however.
Always wise to test, so easy to screw up, no matter how intelligent / experienced you happen to be. I worked on my shed live once because I'd switched off the smoke alarms at the main CU. I only had two breakers not on RCD protection, both clearly marked, and somehow I switched off the 6A smoke alarms rather than the 40A shed feed. No idea how it happened, only found out when I went to turn it back on. Fortunately I was only working on earth wiring, but inside a garage CU right next to the (covered) busbar.
The only problem with the martindale voltage tester is if your circuit has no cpc or neutral but has a live the tester will show the circuit as dead.
And this is where, not just Jordon, fail. Martaindale is super and great. Can you just point me to a previous video where he has used them?? I’ll watch future ones to see how much they appear. I mean, if you use the stuff sure, but to just stick it on a video and promote it, it’s a joke. Your not helping the industry, more so lining your pockets. Syndical me 😂😂
I don't think this is specific to martindale, but is more an issue with "2 pole testers" in general. They will only pick up when there is a voltage between two conductors, they won't pick up when *everything* is live or floating.
For this reason and others I would be very careful about working on stuff that is "already dead" when you arrive. It is much better if you can confirm something is live, then isolate it and finally confirm it is dead.
Even then it's not 100% foolproof, multiple feeds, borrowed neutrals and so-on are far from unheard of.
@@petermichaelgreen hi peter, i use a different brand of voltage tester which has a feature that will alert me if there is no cpc or neutral, the only problem with this is it requires a battery to do so but also has a self test function you can perform before using a proving unit which will tests all the led’s and the battery.
@@petermichaelgreen The rather simple 2-prong tester I use does actually indicate a live connection both visually and audibly when probing from the meter side, but for it to display a voltage reading does require a form of ground (basically anything loosely connected to earth) on the flying probe.
Modern ones have a single probe live test as well. The Kewtech voltage tester I use has this feature, I'm sure the flukes do. I think I've only ever seen Jordan use the same Kewtech tester that I do in previous videos.
Nice one Jordan you have just used a non insulated Stanley blade to cut the tape off of a live socket
I remember working on a lighting circuit in a shed with a tv guy, he wanted to turn on his tv, so I said it should be working, (as in the power point) next minute i hear a familiar click behind me and he had switched the lighting circuit back on. Still strange to this day
Lots of cases of lockoff kits falling off the breakers due to being poorly fitted then someone getting injured. Sadly that process of locking off isn’t fool proof . Is probably better to actually isolate it from within the board
Fantastic in a classroom not applicable especially in industry where opening a db or sub main would turn off half a site
The thing is, you got several types of MCBs with different dimensions and designs of the housings. So you require different types of locking mechanisms, and it's always trial and error. I always take my time checking if I picked the right one and test if it's holding properly and prevents that the MCB/RCBO can be switched on again.
Nice video Jordan 👍🏼
great information and video Jordan , welcome back from your holiday
i just got my live working certificate 3 weeks ago
I'm just starting out as an electrician and I love your videos but I can't help but cringe at companies giving free stock to people for free advertising 🤮 I know the economics of it but 🥶
It drives me insane as there are so many who can't afford the new equipment (myself included) yet companies give them out for free like this, I know its all about advertising to get more business but still sucks. Especially as Jordan and the team probably have tons of equipment they don't use anymore due to getting free stuff.
Welcome to RUclips, you two ;)
you should send one of the locks to Lock Picking Lawyer, see how quick he can open one :P
He has already has done the Masterlock ones, other lock pickers noted them as being excellent training locks. Video 479 and 484.
@@KevinOsborne1987 i should have picked up they were masterlock ones in the kit
ADVERT:
Martindale Electric have kindly sponsored this video - you can buy their safe isolation kits using the links below:
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Great Video, Thanks for making it.
I do have a question thou, why do you try different breakers? Could you not just use a tone generator on the line and use the receiver to find which circuit it is.
Saves runnung back and forth trying different breakers.
or just use one of those 13A socket testers that beep
@@mikeselectricstuff I did not know what they were called in UK since I live in Canada.
Using a tone generator would involve more disruption as the whole CU would have to be isolated to accommodate the circuit identification process. It may well be that an electrician carrying out a risk assessment would decide that was reasonable in the circumstances (unoccupied house). However, tone generator signals could be applied to the wrong circuit and the tone receiver could pick up a signal at the point of work that was interpreted by the user as a 'clear indication' that the circuit was identified, when it was not.
In the scenario depicted in this video, proving a change of condition at the terminal on the socket outlet (proved live - MCB opened - proved not-live) is probably the most practical and reasonable way to identify and disconnect the circuit prior to isolation.
@@mikeselectricstuff not a good idea. Socket testers are not designed to be used as voltage indicators (with approved proving units) like the Martindale kit. You could use them a 100 times and get way with it or use it once and have an accident. Don't think I would want to defend that approach in a subsequent HSE investigation.
I like the retractable tips, very good idea
Pity the plasterer didn't show the same consideration as the decorator. The socket is absolutely covered in plaster. Have you tried using the temporary yellow socket spacers that Nick Bundy uses? Fit them during 1st fix and remove them during 2nd fix. Great product.
Yeah I’ve used the sockitz before but in this case it wasn’t necessary as we were replacing all the fascias after decoration
Buena! el jefe regreso!
I ve recently done my level 3 and 4 hybrid vehicle service and repair
It's crazy how many tools cross over from your trade to mine now ,
whats crazy about it 😂
@@Parmajohn123 the way the motortrade is constantly moving and eventually will be more like electricans and plumbers in the future
Instead of checking after each circuit turn off why not have your matindale in socket wait for the sound to stop?
Would it not be safer to isolate before removing the socket from the back box
Probably are good testers but I like the audible ones buzzing like hell telling me LIVE!
That will only work with batteries. If the batteries are empty they'll usually only show you the "dangerous voltage" symbol and that's it to comply with the EN for voltage testers. These Martindale testers work without any battery.
I use a voltage tester with a load connection. The load is a vibration motor in one of the handles. On a noisy site you won't hear the beeping, but you can feel the vibration in your hand. The higher the voltage, the harder the vibration.
l , a six lock lockout ,one person goes home with a key and you are knackered ,so you fitted a lockout to a breaker .but obstruct the next breaker .all this maybe off a electrician ,its live or its not ,a sharp knives by wires ,went in without checking socket was dead ,whoever unscrewed those sockets and covered them over ,but left them live, how long do the batteries last in that proving unit ?instruction leaflet just tossed to one side, yes maybe you know what these things are for, but its always a good idea just to look at a leaflet ,could be a important note you might miss
Here’s a scenario, you mention multiple sparks working on one site from the same consumer unit and, other trades working on site.
So you’ve just isolated the breaker you’re working from. What happens if another of the aforementioned sparks, or worse still another trade on site, makes a change to the wiring in the loft, which for what ever reason, becomes connected in to the ring you’re on. They go back and turn on their breaker and you then get a shock. Surely the safest option in the instance where other trades are working, where possible, should be to lock off at main breaker?
Communication is pretty key too
In the real world you cannot go round and just turn of mains and incoming. Especially in an Industrial setting. You have to allow for compliant people working not everything can be fool proof
Not an unusual scenario on a large commercial or industrial installation with lots of work going on at the same time. Management of safety then includes as part of any risk assessment before work starts a specific action to confirm whether other work is taking place that could affect your safety (or your work could affect theirs). Some large sites may operate a Permit-For-Work system to manage this too. Your scenario refers to a domestic house so the risk is probably higher as it's unlikely a safe system of work is written down to cover what's going on. Head on a swivel and always treat wiring as live until proven otherwise.
Exactly what I was thinking. I’ve worked on big jobs where the HVAC boys may have their own sparks, therefore not inconceivable they could make changes without any communication, especially with multiple subby gangs going.
Hi Jordan I am not a electrician just a very keen interest in electrical installation but I got a Martindale plug in tester that I bought in 1989 and still work great also I got a Klein 5 in1 screwdriver that I bought in USA on holiday In a Sears store in Florida back in 2000 the largest slotted driver bit of the two fits the brass M4 pan head conduit boxs machine screws perfect I think I paid about 10 dollars for it I just love to buy tool were ever I have been on holidays all over I just got to find a tool shop
Very good video
The boards I go for domestic nowadays are Contactum just because they have the magnets to hold the cover up. Not really impressed with Hager that much and fusebox brand is just a hype which tend to go down hill in my view where I used the torque screwdriver on a main switch and it just lost the thread on it. But mind you I don't want to hype Contactum just because I can go to my wholesaler and get everything without waiting for weeks on for a 20a RCBO. Thanks Jordan nice to see you back.
Contactum is a brand I am not sure on, they have been bust a few times, so who knows how long they will be around.
I recently installed one of their boards, and I wasn't impressed with it, mine didn't have magnets, plus it doesn't come with any grommet strip. Only used it because cities had it on the shelf, I normally use fuse box, it's been difficult to get, but denmans now have a good stock of it.
Nice video again!
Can’t there be a case where only the live was connected, but cpc and neutral were not connected?
That would lead to no voltage shown on the tester but the live still has its potential to earth.
Hence I think it’s good practice to measure from all conductors to a water line or similar to proof the conductors completely dead…. what do you think?
If there was a significant hazard in the work area - so, if there was a likelihood that you could touch any part of the installation wiring and another, earthed conductor simultaneously - then, yes, I would test from each conductor (line and neutral and cpc) in turn to the pipe or whatever I might be holding onto.
Nice piece of kit, used one for years BECAUSE (becos) thy are good, the future is bright.....the future is Sales 😂😂😂
Great video 😎
I was expecting a beautiful, pristine socket for all the effort made to wrap it up. I thought maybe it will be something with a nice brushed metal finish, at least a nice MK Logic Plus or a Click Mode.
But no! It's the cheapest shittiest square edge socket you can buy from Wilko that someone's dropped in a bucket of plaster!
Maybe im wrong but I thought the approved procedure was to prove the tester to show its functionality and voltage detection level is correct, conduct the tests, working lowest potential to highest potential and then reprove the tester to prove that no internal fuses were blown during the test and validate the functionality.
Anyone notice he put the lock off on the breaker that was allready off not the one he turned off
I noticed it ...LOL
Great video
Hi I’m making some holes in my floor near the consumer unit in prep for an charger install, How big should the hole be to take the 7kw armoured cable? Want to make sure it’s a big enough hole? Thanks
imagine paying top buck for his services just for him to come in and film an unboxing during work lol
You put your lockout device on the wrong breaker Jordan, had to watch a few times to see it was the wrong one ...LOL
Don't think he did.
I think he did
No he didn't 🙄
😂
@@have-a-gorepairhero2760 Oh yes he did ..watch the video again to see..
Can you send one of those kits to Delroy of Eastway Electrical. He loves working live and the sparks that go with it 😆
So I hear 🤣
Sorry what was the point of that decorator wrapping up that socket ? It looked like a plasterers radio 🤣🤣🤣
Suspect he sprayed the walls.
4:42 no pun intended
Shouldn’t you have shown you proving the unit before sticking it in the socket. I mean in the same segment. The second time you did it at around 13:40 you showed it working after. Your supposed to do it before and after ;) you vids are great just being picky haha !
Correct you prove before and after☺
Technically you don't need to prove before if your proving after... Proving before hand doesn't improve safety
@@Marri-Tech Not in agreement there! But we work in different ways to make ourselves comfortable moving on with jobs. Habit and all that 😁
Need two magnets and short piece of string to hold that fuse box cover open.
Talking about electricians losing their lives - do you have a proper emergency response kit in all your electricians cars? (medic kit, heart starter) If not, you should investigate!
Ok, so he gets a "kit" Question If he gets a severe shock, who is going to "operate the emergency response kit"
@@tonipeters4543 The colleague or trainee helping on the job. Better to have the kit and not need it than not have it and need it!
We have AEDs, automatic external defibrillator. You don't start a heart with that, that thing only brings it back to the regular timing in case of ventricular fibrillation. You still have to do manual reanimation in case of cardiac arrest.
First aid kits belong into every car!
The DNO I used to work for ensured that all operational staff with a live working authorisation had also to complete basic first aid training that included CPR and use of AED equipment. This was part of the safety case supplied by the DNO to the HSE to justify the issuing of live working authorisations to suitably trained and competent persons.
That said, an AED won't do anything for a patient whose heart has stopped. I understand that the latest AED models, once the pads are properly applied to the patient's body, can determine whether the patient is suffering VF (in which case it will proceed with the defib sequence) or that the patient is asystole (in which case it will tell the AED operator the heart appears to have stopped so no shocking takes place).
@@tonipeters4543 a risk assessment of any work activity should consider whether the work in question should be accompanied work. Some live work (e.g. work in a control panel where some apparatus remains live while the part to be worked on is disconnected or isolated) requires accompaniment while some (e.g. switching operations) does not.
Have I tuned into QVC? 🤷♂️
"It is quite shocking to how many people die from electrocution every year" Yeah, that is shocking for sure :P
If more people died, then the governing bodies and building control may sort the problems out, until then the industry will remain a shambles, caused by a lot of people racing to the bottom.
It's great to plug in Free stuff. Cheap advertising for the manufactures. I guess most people would sing praises for Free goodies.
I’ve been wanting to do this video for ages and when Martindale reached out to me it was a no brainer
@@artisanelectrics Why not Jordon, I'd do exactly the same. Good on ya, fella 👍
When you locked off youlocked off the wrong breaker!
How is it the wrong breaker?
@@nigelevans2883 he flipped off the one to right of the breaker which was already off then locked the one to the left of the pair ie the one already off!
@Jon Bailey Good, not just me then!
@@judebrown4103 You want to watch the video closer and you'll see a cut in the video where he flips the left hand breaker off from behind the door and the goes to check the voltage on the socket and the locks that circuit breaker off.
@Jon Bailey You want to watch the video closer and you'll see a cut in the video where he flips the left hand breaker off from behind the door and the goes to check the voltage on the socket and the locks that circuit breaker off.
Martindale were always known as the best of the best but I fear they have lost there way,I recently brought a new Martindale tester and the quality just is not there poor mouldings and things dont line up...when I Emailed them to voice my concern I was simply ignored..
Quality declining prices increasing yet another company relying on past glory
@@jpelectrical7677 without a doubt
You didn’t ask permission before isolating power🤣😂🤣😂🤣 that was drummed into me for the start and I couldn’t help my self
Can I ask a question and hope you answer is it illegal to cut and take out the ESB meter fuse
Well it doesn't belong to the customer, but if the suppliers can't be bothered to install a suitable isolator, then I will pull the fuse and think nothing of it. You have no option when doing a board change.
From what I've read on various comments to similar videos, the practice varies between DNOs (or DSOs as they are now?), which is not helpful. There should be no doubt that the service termination apparatus, including the fused cut-out is the property of the DNO, is therefore a component of the LV network and, as such, is subject to the DNOs Safety Rules applicable to that network. The DNO I used to work for has a specific switching authorisation for the withdrawal/replacement of cut-out fuses so the removal of a cut-out seal and then the fuse-holder _could_ be construed as unlawful interference. Only way to get a definitive answer is if it ends up in a court of law. Best not to go there.
I don't understand why they don't build the proving units into the tester - would be a lot more convenient
Some do, there are self proving testers as well
Fluke do, I have one. T110
I don't see the point in proving units, when you can just test on a known live source
@@acelectricalsecurity yep there is that too. But if you’ve turned say a circuit off then pop off to another part of the building where said circuit is supposed to be off, you’d need to test it. The house I purchased wife wanted a single socket changed to a double. Off sockets down went… went to socket down and tested. It was actually on sockets up!! Never assume, always test. No known source was available to test the tester.
@@ericbrooks1673 how does the t110 have a built in proving unit? I’ve got a t130 and never heard of or realised they do?
In all fairness if you have got a consumer unit that is less than twenty years old, you are only going to get a sharp buzz, I've worked on loads of live electrics hence plenty of shocks, yet to hear of one person who have died on a domestic unit
As a company, you should have a procudure, when a dumb ass leaves site and has not removed their danger tag/lock. Some companies it's a DCM.
I would have isolated the CU first (checking first that no one else is affected by this) then removed the wrapping. Never work live.
Agreed. In this scenario, it was likely to have been reasonably practicable to have isolated the whole house supply in order to remove the "packaging" from the socket outlet to prepare it for testing. With the supply to the CU still on, it would have to be assumed that the wiring to the socket outlet was live and so removing the temporary protection applied by others was indeed live working that could not be justified in the context of the Electricity at Work Regulations.
If the circuit was fed from a 12-way TP&N DB in a busy factory a risk assessment and method statement would probably suggest a different approach to attempt to identify the circuit and prove it not live before removing the tape. If all else fails the RAMS would probably fall back to the use of adequate PPE (gloves with rated insulation, full-face rated visor and FR coveralls and NO metal knives or tools) to protect the electrician until the terminals can be exposed to allow the approved testing procedure to be applied.
I like your video and the process of proving dead was well demonstrated but would be good to identify where the process comes from. It is a legal requirement in the electricity at work regs 1989, it states when working on equipment it must be isolated from all sources of supply. In the definitions it states that an isolation is a disconnection from all sources of supply in such a way the disconnection is secured, I.e. disconnect the source and lock it to secure it. Also the process comes from the HSG 85 which is the HSE guidance for electrical safety. You also mentioned that a light on the proving unit identifies high voltage, high voltage in the EaWRegs is voltage over 1000V ac or 1500V dc between phase conductors and above 600V ac 900V Dc between phase and neutral, voltage range between phases. national grid introduced Medium voltage bet is not recognised in law but is in their own safety rules. Good vid though for house bashers, just a shame so many so called skilled electricians don't even know the safe isolation procedure.
It’s a legal requirement to work safely, ie isolated, yet the DNOs still resist us being allowed to pull main fuses, or make us jump through hoops to enable us to do so. It’s madness.
Hi Stuart, good to see such a correct and informed reply. There are many concerns with RUclips electrical videos, even from Artisan, but at least they are trying to improve things. Working at height is a major danger and even a non fatal shock can cause a reaction fall. Noticed this problem in an Artisan recent post. Another concern is understanding the role of an electrician when making changes to an installation and installing new work without detail drawings from a professional engineer. They then assume the role of designer and need a high level of knowledge of the full installation plus professional indemnity insurance. Anyway thank you Artisan for excellent videos and welcoming debate.
@@chrisrogers2848 how does the DNO (who owns and operates the service termination apparatus) gauge the competency of someone that is intending to operate the cut-out fuse? They **_have_** to do this as they have a duty to establish and operate a safe system of work under the same health and safety legislation (s.2 HASAWA 1974) that requires you and I to work safely. Any DNO with a policy of allowing anybody to pull main fuses without first assessing their competency to do so safely would eventually be guaranteeing a visit to the dock in the local court for their Operations Manager.
@@protectiongeek surely then by the same token they should be required to provide a safe means of isolation that can be operated without need for them to assess competence, which in practice probably means an isolator switch. There was an ideal opportunity to do this with the smart meter rollout but it was missed. Failing all else, the process for getting them to isolate the supply needs to be much more accessible and convenient, otherwise people will always be tempted to just pull the fuse themselves on the quiet just to get the job done, which means no safety precautions at all.
@@chrisrogers2848 the requirement for provision of a point of isolation by the DNO is not in doubt but there is no qualification of that requirement such that operation of the PoI should not require a person to be competent and appoint as such in writing. If there was, that would create a **retrospective** burden to fit two-pole isolators to all service terminations.
Clearly, DNOs concur with your conclusion that the provision of an isolator is a sensible step (although the person operating it in the context of the work carried out by an electrician must still satisfy the requirements of Reg 16 of the Electricity at Work Regs 1989). All new builds (as far as I know) incorporate an isolator. Some DNOs charge for retro-fitting one to a legacy service termination and some don't.
As with so many things, the issue is one of cost - a valid consideration within the ambit of what is deemed "reasonably practicable".
An electrician at work pulling the fuse "on the quiet" is taking a significant risk. We both know this happens several times each working day. However, if that action is material to the circumstances of an incident subsequently investigated and prosecuted by HSE etc, then a defence of "it was inconvenient to contact the DNO and wait for them to attend" is no defence at all.
I know that the HSE take a particularly dim view of no isolation or things like sticking a bit of PVC tape over an MCB in the off position, given the availability of products like the Martindale kit demonstrated in this video.
How do you know that your proving unit doesnt effective? Do you need to prove your proving unit as well . Endless cycle :)) let me tell you do best way if i work already energized system my proving unit is the incoming supply tails. If i do new rewire or installation then i know it s not energized and already disconnected so its dead because i install them. We dont need a proving unit...
If your proving unit isn't working then your meter won't light up and you'll know that something's up. You might not always be at a location with available live tails to proove off of, what if you were working on a DB and you had isolated the supply on the other side of the building? The proving unit is a convenient way to have a high voltage source readily available when you're doing the testing.
@@robbgosset674 but as @MR M.K said how do you know that the proving unit is not faulty, use a second instrument to check as a MFT
No need to routinely prove the proving unit - if the tester doesn’t work on it, it’s an indication of a problem and that you cannot rely on the whole kit to prove isolation. You would then have to take extra steps to establish which part is faulty, rectify/replace and start again.
Not so keen on the advert type videos. If the build quality was iffy or something, would you actually say? I'm sure you would but it does put slight doubt in my mind. Nagy does with his Bosch stuff. But I've never heard you once make any type of criticism, albeit, constructive criticism, of a piece of kit that you dedicate an episode to. Although I may have missed one if you did. Cory often asks for things to be added to EV charging points and it's cool when the manufacturer adds his suggestions in, but I assume you've paid for those as part of the job you're doing.
My electrician always wears a pair of gloves designed for electricians. Which I guess give some protection against being electrocuted.
Hey you said neutral to earth but it should be earth to neutral following least dangerous first.
Thanks you’re right
Mud slinger clearly didn’t care about protecting the sockets lol.
Some good content here, but sooooo many jump cuts makes it jarring to watch.
Thanks for the feedback
not a good idea to be hacking at a bag and tape around a live socket with a metal knife. one slip and it will go straight through the insulation and then youd know if it was live or not.
I watched this and it drummed home to me, that with all the safety procedures in the world, humans can still f*ck it up.
Is it just me or did you lock off the one that was already off? I'm sure the one you turned off was the one on the right... In fact I rewound just to be sure! I've paused the vid, you may have realised by the end...
No, the breaker that was off is 3rd in from the right, the locked off breaker is 4th in. Have another look!!
"It's quite shocking how many people die from Electrocution"
Hi Mick.that joke has a beard growing on it. Sad but true though.keep safe
How big of an issue is electrocution in the UK, excluding murder or suicide by electrocution?
All that time proving dead and safely isolating but let's say someone put one leg of the ring in that breaker that was switched off. You didn't lock that off. The builder could switch that breaker on and your now working on a live circuit.
Shameless advertising
Everyone knows the standard is megger not martingale
Didn't use the proving unit first before testing the socket was live. Should not be cutting around live cables with metal knife, sockets shouldn't be left live anyway if not screwed to back box, is this a training video? 🙄
So you leave a live socket unattended and exposed while you go to the board?
Martindale? Oh you mean it's like a Fluke? That's what we have as standard equipment here, multimeter or voltage tester here is a fluke
WRONG!
Correct sequence is always:
Prove
Test
Reprove
I don't like the way they describe safe isolation procedures as "fail proof". There are plenty of ways in which they could fail.
Anyone use a fluke clamp meter for sale isolation?
I use my fluke T5-1000. I normally dap my fluke volt alert on a circuit as it’s always on me, then check with the meter after to make sure.
A clamp meter doesn’t comply with the relevant bs number, your safe isolation voltage tester must be a dedicated voltage tester and work without batteries among other requirements.
@@Jamie-oo3si very true. I get the meter calibrated but I will look at investing in one and my probes don’t comply with gs38. Bit embarrassing for a qualified electrician :s. thanks
Is this a test? The already turned off breaker looks to be the one that was locked out, so the kitchen ring was not locked off at all, unless I'm very much mistaken.
I noticed that aswell
It was the one to the left of the initial breaker. If you look closely there's two down next to each other when he's finished.
@Simon Lee I rewound it twice, he definitely locked off the one that was already down.
Sorry, but if you're passionate about working safely then you've shot yourself in the foot before you even get started... using an open bladed knife where not necessary when opening the box, moving a metal handled blade towards potentially live conductors that also haven't been isolated and have been left unsecured outside of enclosure... Cluttered working area...
As for the quality padlock... seconds to open without a key by any number of means - the point is to prevent accidental energisation as preventing deliberate override is virtually impossible.