I genuinely like that they had dirty old vises on some of those tables. Makes it feel more real and immersive, like I'm ready to walk up to the machine and actually do something.
The coolest thing about that SX4000 horizontal is it is actually built by OKK, just rebranded by Smart. For the price, it is probably the best bang for the buck machine out there when it comes to horizontals.
I was eyeing that thing hard. I’m a huge fan or horizontals and for the price that was an insanely well made machine. I was overall super impressed with the SMART stuff. I hear people’s objections but for the money I don’t see how you beat that value.
The commodity machine market is very competitive. It would be tough to justify buying a "no name" taiwanese machine, even at a 30-40% discount over a brand like mazak or okuma. The sticker price is definitely not the most important thing when it comes to buying the right tool.
Jack, I really appreciate the input. I’m not at a point to buy a new machine myself but can you elaborate a little more on this point for others reading the comments who may be considering a purchase? Do you see a 30-40% advantage in buying Mazak or Okuma over a machine like this? Is it repeatability, longer life, less downtime? I think this VF2 type 3 axis machine is such an entry point for many like myself just getting into machining. Thanks for your wisdom.
@@ericschneiter There is little to differentiate these machines from any other generic brand so they try to compete on price, which is a very cut throat business. Going with a lesser known brand means that they probably sell fewer machines which usually means worse support, unfamiliarity with employees, and more issues in the long run. I don't even like to buy new models from the top machine builders until they work out the kinks.
@@ericschneiter the vf2 is a decent entry point if you are on a limited budget, but you should expect precision, repeatability, cycle time and lifetime that you get at the price point. A Okuma Genos M560-v will run circles round a VF2 in terms of rigidity and precision, a Brother Speedio will eat up aluminum like there is no tomorrow and continue doing it long after Haas lands on a scrapyard and this is for a not so insane of a price vs a properly optioned out VF2. Also I really recommend avoiding the Haas UMC series, they have loads and loads of problems (chip evacuation, leaks, probe in a risky position, horrible thermal growth compensation, rotary repeatability, …). The new Brother 5 axis is worth considering as an alternative at 150k. As was mentioned I would personally if I was doing serious work, not buy a machine without quick service time or one that is very unique, since even big brands like DMG (especially DMG), can have problems teaching their servicemen about unique machines which rarely get made, which can lead to extended downtime on very expensive machines. The main thing is you need to have as well is enough work and a shop hour price that can support the really expensive machines.
The biggest advantage in my eyes when you buy a big name brand machine tool such as Mazak, Okuma, Haas, etc is you know they aren't going anywhere in the distant future and they have a track record that you can relatively rely on. Mazak has machines that are 40+ years old that they still support (to an extent) and still run in shops all around the world. I own a Mazak QTN250MS lathe, and I can pick up the phone and call the tech center in my region and within about an hour have an answer to pretty much any question I may have. Not to mention, there are a lot of companies out there that have specialized in repairing Mazak components (spindles, drives, etc) to keep them going. Okuma is much the same in how they operate, and the fact they do their own drives and boards and have the ability to repair them is a big advantage if you want to talk about longevity. This isnt to knock machines that aren't built in the US or Japan, brands like Hwacheon out of South Korea have been building machines for decades and they are just as solid as any Japanese brand. The biggest issue with some of these other machine tool companies is there is no guarantee they will be around in 5-10 years. Dynamic International used to be the importer of Samsung Machine Tools (SMEC) until they had a disagreement with the manufacture that led to them venturing out and creating the Smart brand. I have read and been told by people who bought SMEC machines before the falling out with Dynamic have an extremely hard time getting information, parts, or technical help unless they try to contact someone in South Korea. Not to mention, you dont even hear about SMEC hardly anymore in the US.
@@cwhuffman01 It's worth it to pay the extra money to avoid the potential nightmare of having a 10k lb piece of scrap on your shopfloor if something goes wrong and these guys go under. I'm not trying to learn to speak korean anytime soon.
@@ericschneiter lol not just us almost everyone who have one. Just go up top and turn the shaft to home position and then there's this common occasion where the tool pocket would retract before the arm got a chance to go to home position. That's when you wipe out the crow bar. Good times..
@ericschneiter lol I actually bought one of their vx350 5 axis 😂 couple months ago. Very generic machine. But spindle is quite strong for 40 tapper. Support kinda suck. I have been requesting a part for 3 months now im sure they have forgotten about me. Technically it's not full 5 axis either it's 4+1. There are some problems not going to lie. I addressed them as I go and so far i can't say that I love it or hate it.😂
I genuinely like that they had dirty old vises on some of those tables. Makes it feel more real and immersive, like I'm ready to walk up to the machine and actually do something.
This video is gold. Thank you.
Thanks for being here! 👊
@@ericschneiter It's a good channel.
The coolest thing about that SX4000 horizontal is it is actually built by OKK, just rebranded by Smart. For the price, it is probably the best bang for the buck machine out there when it comes to horizontals.
I was eyeing that thing hard. I’m a huge fan or horizontals and for the price that was an insanely well made machine. I was overall super impressed with the SMART stuff. I hear people’s objections but for the money I don’t see how you beat that value.
Thanks for these videos !
Thanks for watching! Really enjoy making them, hope they help purchasing easier for people in the market!
The commodity machine market is very competitive. It would be tough to justify buying a "no name" taiwanese machine, even at a 30-40% discount over a brand like mazak or okuma. The sticker price is definitely not the most important thing when it comes to buying the right tool.
Jack, I really appreciate the input. I’m not at a point to buy a new machine myself but can you elaborate a little more on this point for others reading the comments who may be considering a purchase? Do you see a 30-40% advantage in buying Mazak or Okuma over a machine like this? Is it repeatability, longer life, less downtime? I think this VF2 type 3 axis machine is such an entry point for many like myself just getting into machining. Thanks for your wisdom.
@@ericschneiter There is little to differentiate these machines from any other generic brand so they try to compete on price, which is a very cut throat business. Going with a lesser known brand means that they probably sell fewer machines which usually means worse support, unfamiliarity with employees, and more issues in the long run. I don't even like to buy new models from the top machine builders until they work out the kinks.
@@ericschneiter the vf2 is a decent entry point if you are on a limited budget, but you should expect precision, repeatability, cycle time and lifetime that you get at the price point.
A Okuma Genos M560-v will run circles round a VF2 in terms of rigidity and precision, a Brother Speedio will eat up aluminum like there is no tomorrow and continue doing it long after Haas lands on a scrapyard and this is for a not so insane of a price vs a properly optioned out VF2.
Also I really recommend avoiding the Haas UMC series, they have loads and loads of problems (chip evacuation, leaks, probe in a risky position, horrible thermal growth compensation, rotary repeatability, …). The new Brother 5 axis is worth considering as an alternative at 150k.
As was mentioned I would personally if I was doing serious work, not buy a machine without quick service time or one that is very unique, since even big brands like DMG (especially DMG), can have problems teaching their servicemen about unique machines which rarely get made, which can lead to extended downtime on very expensive machines.
The main thing is you need to have as well is enough work and a shop hour price that can support the really expensive machines.
The biggest advantage in my eyes when you buy a big name brand machine tool such as Mazak, Okuma, Haas, etc is you know they aren't going anywhere in the distant future and they have a track record that you can relatively rely on. Mazak has machines that are 40+ years old that they still support (to an extent) and still run in shops all around the world. I own a Mazak QTN250MS lathe, and I can pick up the phone and call the tech center in my region and within about an hour have an answer to pretty much any question I may have. Not to mention, there are a lot of companies out there that have specialized in repairing Mazak components (spindles, drives, etc) to keep them going. Okuma is much the same in how they operate, and the fact they do their own drives and boards and have the ability to repair them is a big advantage if you want to talk about longevity. This isnt to knock machines that aren't built in the US or Japan, brands like Hwacheon out of South Korea have been building machines for decades and they are just as solid as any Japanese brand. The biggest issue with some of these other machine tool companies is there is no guarantee they will be around in 5-10 years. Dynamic International used to be the importer of Samsung Machine Tools (SMEC) until they had a disagreement with the manufacture that led to them venturing out and creating the Smart brand. I have read and been told by people who bought SMEC machines before the falling out with Dynamic have an extremely hard time getting information, parts, or technical help unless they try to contact someone in South Korea. Not to mention, you dont even hear about SMEC hardly anymore in the US.
@@cwhuffman01 It's worth it to pay the extra money to avoid the potential nightmare of having a 10k lb piece of scrap on your shopfloor if something goes wrong and these guys go under. I'm not trying to learn to speak korean anytime soon.
Some coolant is paint stripper
I’ve found that out the hard way unfortunately.
I like the ones that make your eyes bleed and your lung contracts but that just me
Ask them about their ATC being stuck once in awhile 😆
Have you had issues with the ATC on their machines?
@@ericschneiter lol not just us almost everyone who have one. Just go up top and turn the shaft to home position and then there's this common occasion where the tool pocket would retract before the arm got a chance to go to home position. That's when you wipe out the crow bar. Good times..
@@ericschneiter after awhile its just part of operating the machine. But other than that they are solid machines..no other problem.
@@a-a-ron8437 so not exactly smart right?
:P
@ericschneiter lol I actually bought one of their vx350 5 axis 😂 couple months ago. Very generic machine. But spindle is quite strong for 40 tapper. Support kinda suck. I have been requesting a part for 3 months now im sure they have forgotten about me. Technically it's not full 5 axis either it's 4+1. There are some problems not going to lie. I addressed them as I go and so far i can't say that I love it or hate it.😂