@@kolbycheeze7607 Doesnt mean it cant be an epic matchup seeing how Minato finds out about Pains abilities. Its not always about who is stronger/weaker when it comes to good battles.
The swapped fights videos are great, Thunder. Here's a few video ideas for future: 1. Ranking the ten strongest ninja with no bloodlines or tailed beasts. 2. All the characters who at any point held the #1 spot as the strongest living ninja during the whole timeline.
Finally someone mentioned the Rain Maker jutsu and how hard it counters Minato, plus Pain would know not to use Chaotic Shinra Tensei or Chibaku Tensei which would do wonders on how long Minato will have to fight 6 dudes with the craziest justsu and in the Nine Tails Incident where he was previously mentioned in the video to be fatigued is just gonna be a complete jumping from Pain. RIP Minato, dude still dies on his kids bday
@@princeyoutuber-yq8hfhe could hardly keep up with the six tails…minato is around that kcm level of speed so he’s even faster than the six fails who pain was barely reacting to
@@J0kerz_EditzPain ran through the strongest village,and took down 3 giant toad summons,and sage naruto .Then had to dance with 6-8 tails naruto,and eventually got so fatigued base naruto out speed him. I’m pretty sure pain is dealing with Minato at full power.
The literal only time he uses them without showing his Rinnegan is when he’s explaining how he’s using Six Paths Light & Dark Style so it’s actually insanely weird how dudes don’t.
OBITO CONTENT I LOVE TO SEE IT Also tg what would you think of doing another "Assembling the perfect gokage to beat" addition for Hashirama? He lowkey stomps regardless but i think itd be fun. Or, another fun hypothetical of what if Hashirama turned against Taka, orochimaru, and the other edo hokage, like if he just decided he didnt like Sasuke's answer after he was revived in the war arc?
I’m literally saying we just don’t know how long is too long for him since he was standing in place for 2 chapters 😭 it also just doesn’t last long tho which is partially why
Nobody ever brings up that summons are massive liabilities vs. Genjutsu users and I have no idea why. People talk about fights like Jiraiya vs. Hebi Sasuke as being a wash when Gamabunta shows up as if Hebi Sasuke didn't put Manda in a Genjutsu while he was fatigued. Glad it's coming up now, but it's just weird that no one ever talks about it when even the canonical weakest version of an adult Uchiha we ever see is easily capable of it casually.
Jiraiya can just unsummon them or disrupt their Chakra . It's definitely annoying but not something that just negs the summons especially because ma and pa fuse to his Chakra network and are always putting nature Chakra in him . jiraiya can dismiss them just as fast if not faster then Sasuke can genjustu them considering his higher level of experience and that his title is the toad hermit/sage. he also casually can casually summon a huge toad that traps the opponent and itachi needed amaterarsu to get out (if he could have used a non ms Jutsu to get out he definitely would have itachi is smart and knows he can't waste energy because of his illness and the strain of the ms) tldr the genjustu is annoying but not something jiraiya couldn't deal with .
@@codbeast914 The problem is knowing they're in a Genjutsu. Genjutsu isn't automatically obvious. By the time it has done what it needs to do, that Toad is dead or has killed Jiraiya more likely than not. You can't just point to "chakra disruption" as a catch-all for Genjutsu literally turning your teammate against you. That's not how it works.
@@Necromancer4267 when there attached to your Chakra network it does . They are constantly putting sage Chakra in jiraiya so it would instantly break anything that's not a ms genjustu considering that's the most common way end a genjustu except for maybe pain. He also has precog and passive sensory in sage mode so he would sense the disturbance in his summons Chakra.
Obito slams everyone that pain ever faced and Pain slams everyone Obito faced up until KCM Naruto excluding Hokage Minato he’s not winning that one though the battle would be legendary🤝
@NarutosRasengan5 Hokage Minato wasn't nearly as strong as war arc Minato, Hokage Minato was ASS with sage jutsu and he didn't have Kurama and Pain was barley fighting together with his 6 paths against Naruto because he never took him serious. We literally never saw Pain take a fight serious. When Minato took a fight serious he still died.
I would argue, if Jiraiya starts in SM, he has a legitimate chance against Obito. Sages have been shown to have the reflexes to react to space/time jutsu. However, if we’re talking base Jiraiya, that’ll be rough. Base Jiraiya doesn’t really have the correct arsenal against space/time jutsu. He did react to Urashiki, but wasn’t fast enough to outright dodge Urashiki. I don’t think Obito is as fast as Urashiki, but Jiraiya will definitely have a hard time against Obito. However, if we have indeed confirmed that space/time jutsu can remove ones self from individual dimensions, then Jiraiya may be able to fight Obito. Because if Sasuke can summon his hawk into Kaguya’s alternate dimension and characters from Boruto can just jump from dimension to dimension with basic space/time jutsu, then reverse summoning should work in Jiraiya’s favor…in theory.
The only issue with this is Kamui is stated in D3 to be a sealed dimension unlike Kaguya’s that has no restrictions on other individuals entering it while being connected. The Kamui eye is the actual only way to pass into or for chakra to pass into the dimension.
@ThunderGodTG this is why I believe that Obito is a horrible match up for Pain. Obito might know the abilities of the Rinnegan just as much as Nagato if not more, he would know which paths to bfr first. I also think the paths will lose their connection to Nagato once in the dimension based on your explanation above. So Obito only needs to bfr the paths one by one.
Ok, so I have a video idea ( I don't know if u take them or not, but I think it'd be fun) it leans kinda heavy into the what if territory, but what if the hidden cloud invaded the leaf after pains assault. For this personally, I would rather kakazu and hidan didn't capture yugito and the 2 tails (could just make it utakata the 6 tails as a timeline replacement) which leaves her yo the hidden cloud alive. This would take place in a konoha 2 weeks after pains assault, their rebuilding, tsunade is still out, etc. But during the rebuild the hidden cloud attacks. I think it would be a pretty interesting video to watch idk
As crazy as I thin it would be, with all the changes, I think the basis of win strategy barely changes. They both had an alleged 5 seconds between their invulnerability and being hittable. The only difference is that Obito wouldn't have nearly the destructive force in THIS battle because he no longer has the 9 Tails (he could bring the 1-7 Tails but that would go directly against the Tsuki no Me plan). The brute force/power of Almighty Push more or less forced otherwise powerful ninja into duties other than fighting - that said, teaming up on Pain is borderline pointless if there's no Sage (or at least thats how it was depicted. He played around with Kakashi and Choji+dad). While you might argue this for Obito, the Leaf would be able to focus more elite ninja on Obito than they did with Pain due to the lack of mass casualties. Not to mention Shikamaru would likely be of service this time. The moment Obito slips out of the 1st shadow posession (team strats with Shikamaru tend to open up with this) he'd probably figure out. The timing will be more difficult to figure out due to the nature of the ability - Tendo Pains attacks were very straightforward regarding its limits. Obito will need to be swarmed or outsmarted, and the Leaf can do both theoretically this time. The only issue is that Obito has the Izanagi at this time, meaning that we have to outsmart him TWICE to get rid of him - and you can pretty much guarantee he'll run away. That said, in that event, Obito would likely die to Konan since she had her sea of paper bombs made in preparation, not on the spot, meaning she had already planned to kill Obito regardless of the event sin the Pain arc. Some may say he only goes to that place because Nagato dies, but Obito would have returned to the Rain village anyway since that was their base, Simply a matter of time at that point
9:00 Seems more likely the directory page was given rather than randomly stumbling upon it. I do wonder who could have possibly done so... 19:50 That might just be a random metal pipe he ripped from the surroundings. 22:22 It is noted that Gamakichi's Syrup Gun is senjutsu, suggesting all of the giant toads are using Sage Mode, which could mean they could fight blind. 26:27 The articles have some errors such as stated Obito was in the cave for multiple years before Rin died, that the Sannin were named in the Third Shinobi World War, or (this one is up for debate) that Edo Tensei Madara grew stronger than he did in life. 29:45 It is unclear if he can spin Kamui the same way whilst he is in the Kamui dimension which is needed for the Blast Wave Wild Dance.
I have known about the page for a minute but, I do appreciate the assistance lmao Saying it’s a random metal pipe is an extreme cop out to what’s established, the platform that Obito’s was standing with the pipes blew up and they were FAR larger than he was so it was def not a metal pipe imo. Obito should be able to spin Kamui as it’s quite literally the same principle just from the other side of the time space, only difference being he obviously can’t phase. I don’t disagree the articles are not objective sources nor did I claim they were perfect as I’ve disagreed with certain statements, more so aiding in some of their credibility. It’s also CRAZY you say that Madara point when I’ve seen you rep it
@@ThunderGodTG Receivers tend to be more cylindrical until snapped whilst Obito's had quite an edge, it is not coloured full black in the official coloured manga, and it even breaks in the extended fight in the anime (not that it is canon). The exact properties of Kamui in Kamui are unclear. Worth bringing up, at least. I am in the extreme minority that consider the source valid when it does not explicitly contradict (like getting years/dates wrong), such as with Madara. That there is such contention for it is my point, though, that not all would accept it when such statements exist.
Obito’s was actually cylindrical if you back and actually look at the blade, anime extended material when looking at the black rods is not as solid as the anime also has Kakashi & Hinata breaking Pain’s Rods, the anime changes it to where the rods as a whole are less durable not exclusive to Obito. I think that’s fine take when looking at the Articles.
If Obito were to teleport even 1 of Naruto's shadow clones into the Kamui dimension during a fight with him, he essentially can't phase through any of his attacks anymore because the clone would be able to attack any part of his body that he attempts to use Kamui on from that moment forward, just like what happened in the war arc.
In all honesty, I do think Minato was a bit misinformed about Pain considering he only appeared after Pain was fatigued and holding back as to not kill Naruto. I think also the shared vision is really gonna help when Minato tries to teleport behind the paths. Even if the path can’t avoid the attack, it would lead to a faster counter attack by the others
Yeah like Pain could be stronger than what was displayed, although Minato would have a good idea on his abilities as Naruto fought a more focused Deva Path. So I do agree but, I don’t think it changes an insane amount
I think Minato stomps Pain no diff. His usage of flying thunder god makes him so insanely overpowered; if he was still Hokage when Pain attacked the village very few people would have died, if any.
How tf does Minato even touch Pain? All he has is Basic Rasengan, Flying Raijin and Reaper death seal ( suicide). Pain Puts a chakra rod in Midnato's arse full 15 inches
@@playathesaints9599 Exactly. The moniker "Yellow Flash" didn't come from his usage of Flying Thunder God, that was his base speed, which makes him faster than the Fourth Raikage. With Flying Thunder God on top of that, not to mention he's a perfect toad sage, and is the greatest user of Rasengan after Naruto and maybe Boruto, Pain is history.
I think you did pervy sage dirty here. So I have question. Kamui dimension is a... Separate dimension. But we've seen summons able to be reversed summoned across dimensions (Sasuke and his bird in the kagua fight). And we know the toads can reverse summon (Naruto vs pain). So... Being stuck in the kamui dimension shouldn't be an issue for jiraya, right? And even if jiraya decides not to immediately leave said dimision, Obito would never be able to use kamui again or jiraya would attack the phased body part and kill him. Then reverse summon himself.
40 people have said this and it makes me kinda regret mentioning it but the Kamui dimension is not like Kaguya’s time space where they’re connected. In D3 it’s explicitly noted to be a sealed dimension which means the only way in or out is through the Kamui eye. Look at like this the Kamui dimension can only be entered and left through a door (the Kamui Eye) whereas Kaguya’s other dimensions don’t have this restriction & you can walk right into the house. This is also why Minato who has extensive knowledge on space time ninjutsu which is what the summoning jutsu is also thinks it’s a GG if he actually does get sucked in.
@@ThunderGodTG thanks. I didn't know about the "sealed" part. Now it makes perfect sense. Except for locking him there still means Obito can't use it again (until jiraya starves to death, lol) Great video, homie
Appreciate it what’s interesting is that even then Jiraiya would probably never see Obito since where he phases is proportionate to where he is on earth so if he teleports somewhere else Jiraiya would never find him in the dimension. An example of this is Obito can fight Fuu/Torune yet Karin never senses or see’s Obito in the Kamui dimension while he’s phasing through which means it may actually be earth sized which is kinda nuts. Appreciate the support my man 🙏🏻
The only reason why Obito could be hit in the dimension while he was phasing in the war was because of Kakashi's Mangekyo. Kakashi's eye could pinpoint Obito's transported body parts. Even using kamui with the two eyes at the same time made Obito's body part and Kakashi's target teleport to the exact same point in the dimension. This was seen with the teleported kunai and rasengan.
Aye TG you should do a video on what if Sakura tried with guy and lee focusing more on improving her overall speed and taijutsu while also being the first to master the 8th gate by using 100 healings stacked with it. Which would have made her a monster in the war arc
no he scales to kcm 1.5/ ems sasuke because kcm 1 naruto is comparable to minato but doesnt seem quite there yet and kcm 2 naruto was stated by kurama to surpass minato and kushina so minato most likely scales to kcm 1.5 to early kcm 2 but i dont see alive minato taking down 6 bijuu
Yeah not to mention that Kakashi would get tired eventually since he would be dealing with the summons and nagato over and over not to mention some his stuff can get absorbed making nagato much stronger.
You can be holding back techniques & not holding back stats, Obito very clearly was withholding moves in order to get the Seal taken off his heart - manipulating the battle so he could force a Raikiri or attack through it. He literally could not harm himself or do it himself
This was actually one of the hardest things to pull off for Obito, and he did it with prestine skill, getting Kakashi to blow it off was the plan from the very beginning. We even see it in their genjutsu battle.
I don't believe Minato using Sage Mode is an argument at all. I think it is very disingenuous to assume he would use it. He didn't use it even when the village was under attack, his wife was taken, and there was an attempted murder of his newborn child. He thought he was fighting Madara Uchiha, or at the very least someone of his caliber, who was the biggest threat to Konoha ever and still never used it. I genuinely believe he would never think about or even consider using it. He would be fighting Pain essentially in base.
I don’t disagree that was just presupposition he didn’t have to worry about a Nine Tails rampaging & has the luxury of leaving to go gather nature energy. Although I will say part of the reason he didn’t on top of it not being good was Obito could follow him anywhere he went, so he would have never had an opportunity.
@ThunderGodTG There's just a lot of variables at play in the scenario like the summons taking up a similar role to Kurama in regard to mass devastation of the village. If the goal is just destroying Konoha it would be easier and more achieveable than getting the confirmed kill on Minato because of how slippery he is via Flying Raijin. But yeah loving the content as per usual 👌
27:50 The mental blocks Nagato placed on the Ame ninja specifically contains valuable information in case the target gets captured. It's not stated or implied to actually provide any genjutsu resistance outside of protecting that specific information, and Nagato being the only known user is not proof (or really even an implication) of it even being related to the rinnegan. The rinnegan also can't see chakra through smoke, cast illusions, or precog like the sharingan can, so there's no reason to assume it improves or even maintains genjutsu resistance compared to the sharingan just because it's supposed to be an evolution from it. It's even arguable whether or not it's a proper evolutionary step above when the true pinnacle is using both together along with the byakugan. Base sharingan genjutsu victim fr. 🤷♂ Hebi Sasuke might just slam.
The Rinnegan itself has it's own distinct sensory mode visually that can see barriers, assess chakra levels, as well as being used when Pain want's to make sure he can react to faster attacks. The Sharingan is MUCH more suited to Genjutsu resistance as it is the Genjutsu focused of the 3 Great Dojutsu. The sharingan also isn't an end all be all as it works primarily off physical movement & can't see chakra movement so to say that automatically just gives it a > over the rinnegan is absurd, we quite literally saw Kakashi fight Pain & this wasn't the case. Pain himself is just nearly impossible to Genjutsu with sharingan since he overall has an insane chakra supply to try & control - to the point it can be felt by regular Anbu from 1 Path. The fact Pain's summons also don't remain in the Frog Song Genjutsu that Ma & Pa cast I think also just adds to this. The genjutsu blockers is just an interesting side point, idk why that turned into a Rinnegan vs Sharingan discussion? Especially when it's not as 1:1 with both Dojutu's either. Pain also beats the dog piss out of Hebi Sasuke, who can't even Genjutsu a V1 Raikage with a stronger Genjutsu & peak mastery of his 3T Sharingan.
@@ThunderGodTG _"The genjutsu blockers is just an interesting side point, idk why that turned into a Rinnegan vs Sharingan discussion? Especially when it's not as 1:1 with both Dojutu's either."_ At 27:50 you say that the rinnegan has natural genjutsu resistance and use Nagato's ability to use Genjutsu Protect as a primary example of that. I can't really see any other way to interpret this. The comparisons to the sharingan were just to highlight that there are things the rinnegan can't emulate despite being an "evolution" from the sharingan. It's a very common conception that the rinnegan grants inherent genjutsu resistance, but there are no statements or concrete showings to support this. The closest we get to that is Sasuke negating the infinite tsukuyomi with his rinnegan, which also happens to be a sharingan with six paths powers. Hebi Sasuke was a joke, but shit he just might do it. Early shippuden Sasuke pulled up and genjutsu'd half of the nine tails, and was keeping up in a genjutsu exchange with Itachi after absorbing Orochimaru (I might be turning into a hebi Sasuke goon tbh). Come to think of it, Kurenai managed to land a genjutsu on Itachi too. If she wasn't pregnant Pain might've been a Kurenai victim🤷♂. All jokes aside: taka Sasuke never actually tries to genjutsu A, so it seems kind of odd to use that as an anti feat. He manages to land one on V1 B while still fatigued from his fight with Itachi and basically no experience with his MS. I would argue that V1 B is at least somewhat comparable to V1 A, as those are the forms they choose to use in their double lariat so it's not like MS Sasuke just has zero chance of landing genjutsu on people with bijuu levels of chakra; with his MS at least. I actually wouldn't even know where to begin in quantifying Pain's chakra compared to A & B, but if he's not just chakra flexing out of Kabuto's control as an edo then there's no way I can believe he just negs kotoamatsukami via his normal chakra flow. It's even less believable considering that his chakra is being split in 6 different ways as Pain. Danzo's koto seems to not be quite the same as the one from the eye Itachi had, but it still required that the user be made aware of the fact they're being controlled. I never said the sharingan is above the rinnegan. I just said that it doesn't seem to be a proper evolutionary step above the sharingan, but rather just another doujutsu in the same family. If you compare it to going from 3T -> MS -> EMS it doesn't exactly follow the same trend. If it was truly an evolution, then there wouldn't be any point in going back and forth between rinnegan and MS outside of potentially saving chakra. Also, I don't recall it ever being stated that the sharingan can't see chakra movement. The rinnegan seems to be better at seeing chakra buildup and predicting what jutsu will come from it, but the sharingan can still see chakra and it's composition via color at a cellular level and should be able to predict linear attacks like fireballs just fine.
@@nwk1626relative to Ay yea definitely the guy who himself stated minato is superior to him🤡 stop listening to Naruto on your 1925 radio bud watch the show probably
Lets be real, the only actual reason Obito doesnt use all his abilities is because combined with Kamui he would have been waaaaay more op than he already is, bro never uses wood style or Rinnegan abilities like at all
I disagree with kakashi outstating red haired nagato. Nagoto was casually keeping up with bee and naruto and still bodied them, also using the the nagato that needed help walking to scale his speed is stupid
Can you do a three way vs battle between orochimaru and his edo tensei(the 4 kage), sage kabuto and his edo tensei(including one rinnegan madara), and white mask obito with his 6 jenchuriki paths.
The Databooks just describe them like that can call them chakra rods or receivers it doesn’t matter. It’s just that the blades don’t transmit chakra without the outerpath of pain so I just call them black belted blades since the Databook does.
1. 16 years had passed since Obito's fight with Minato. Thats 16 years of time for Obito to get stronger. 2. Naruto needed to learn how to control the Nine-tails chakra because Obito literally has the means to summon and control the Nine-tails. I'm really tired of youtubers using that Minato statement to make ridiculous claims about the power level of 14 year old Obito.
It’s actually not provable that Obito got stronger over the course of 16 years, the only arguments are really that he got more Hashirama cells, otherwise it’s actually insanely in character for him not to train as he’s take a much more delegator like approach. Naruto actually just needed the nine tails chakra to gain more power, this point makes no sense as the nine tails would be sealed inside of Naruto so Obito would be unable to summon it.
@@ThunderGodTG Okay first of all 16 years of manipulation and plotting would undoubtedly make anyone smarter and more strategic, and for a shinobi with an exploitable hax ability like Kamui, intelligence and strategic thinking translates directly into fighting ability. So even your "lazy delegator" headcanon version of 30 year old Obito is still a lot stronger than his immature 14 year old self. Also staying the same strength while never training doesn't make any sense. He'd be significantly weaker if he spent 16 years not training or fighting. Also Obito is an A grade instigator and it would be very easy for him to make Naruto break the seal if they ever had a serious fight before Naruto Mastered KCM. Minato already knew Naruto had the strength to beat Obito and he only needed to control his one critical weakness, the Nine-tails. This is a deep story about emotions and stuff. Not power scaling. So when Minato says "You need to control Nine-Tails chakra before fighting Obito" he means "You need to control your tantrum demon before fighting the mastermind instigator and manipulator with a Sharingan".
Yeah as I said we actually don’t have any metric to say he just improved significantly aside from “he’s probably stronger. It’s not lazy headcanon as Obito is very roundabout and less forward after his fight with Minato, opting to use pawns such as the Akatsuki for collecting the Bijuu along with Pain or Sasuke for Rinne Rebirth. By all means claim he got stronger idc tbh it’s just as a valid as he didn’t get stronger. Bro I’ve read the story obviously Naruto needs to control the nine tails as it’s a tantrum demon but, the narrative is literally he needs to master its power to beat Obito just outright stated by Naruto & Kurama himself. The idea that the nine tails can break out and harm the village is partially tied to Naruto’s interactions with Sasuke at the 5KS and him not risking a pain situation but, it also is to gain more strength. Naruto is a story about emotions but also is a SHONEN story they’re not mutually exclusive which is why Naruto is so good it excels at both.
Obito using kamui is just him dodging he's still fightin lol how is obito lazy ? Blt his gault most of these people just have no response to his kamui and some of his fights end fast because he use teleportation as a main technique. Its like sayin minato is lazy bc he mostly use raijin
Wait hold on, wouldn't Kakashi just put Nagato into the Kamui dimension and win basically by default? Or I guess, taking himself out of it if we count the fight happening inside?
@@ThunderGodTG So couldn't Kakashi just Kamui himself out of the dimension in theory? I believe that's how he got himself and Sakura out originally. (Unless am misremembering)
Obito is not stronger than nagato. He can control the 9 tails hence naruto has to master the ninetails. Obito is only stronger than nagato after taking the rinnegan and getting the jinchuriki. Keep in mind Minato also only saw a weakend fatigued version of pain...
The implication is that the Nine Tails power > Naruto’s current abilities that can contend with Pain as Minato says you’d need extraordinary power to beat Obito after watching the Pain fight. This is supplemented numerous times with differing implications some as low as KCM1 some as high as KCM2, Kurama himself also makes the exact statement TO OBITO that Minato put Kurama inside Naruto to BEAT Obito.
Imagine if Shisui randomly bounces up on Pain in the forest. Is it believable that he could just cast koto on him EZ clap new unit unlocked! We've never even seen an active rinnegan user (not kind Nagato) under any kind of genjutsu have we? Or does the show Kakashi and Obito put on count?
Didnt Minato beat orbito i mean he hit him but he got away. So pain losing would be the same. He wouldn't have his real body fight so he could probably get away also
Thunder Woof been hiding to come out with this one. I think i disagree with Pain vs. Minato, but I also have a mucher higher interpretation than Bark God does, and most people in general
@ThunderGodTG For sure. I think its a take that people just think is impossible to have or that it's entirely baseless, so it's something I wish more Naruto Powerscalers would talk about, because it does seem to be something people think is just entirely baseless and unsupported
Nah I agree I def think there is a lot to the Nagato / Pain stuff people don’t touch on which is kinda annoying when Obito / Itachi are treated way better.
@ThunderGodTG It's definitely annoying to see. I've mentioned to you before (on many occasions, actually) that I definitely have Pain>Itachi>Obito, but realistically, I think they're all fairly relative to one another despite placing them in definitive ranks. I honestly think Pain was Obito's contingency plan to Itachi, should Itachi ever turn on the Akatsuki since I doubt Kisame could put him down and Obito has never had a hands on approach in almost any of his dealings and his somewhat blatant admittance to Itachi being able to kill him. I always see the "Obito belittles Pain" argument being brought up, but rarely does anyone ever point out Obito very much respected most of the Akatsuki's members, especially Nagato and Itachi. We actually see when Obito goes to grab the Rinnegan he actually pays respect by closing Nagato's eyes and using Kamui to not further desecrate his corpse, as opposed to reaching in and plucking out the eye. We also see him openly admit to Zetsu that they (him and Zetsu) wouldn't've gotten as far as they have without the members of the Akatsuki. We even see Obito apologize to Kisame for hiding his true identity from him all along. The disrespectful personality people attribute to Obito is more likely a facade or him playing into the Madara personality he's trying to maintain for most of the series as opposed to his real feelings, which I think plays into the identity crisis he has when he becomes Juubito with all his personalities fighting for dominance (Tobi, The Masked Man, Madara, and Obito) before becoming himself again. At least, that's how I see it.
I actually agree that the Obito belittle Pain argument is really bad, especially since like you mentioned Obito’s facade changes depending on who he speaks to. The most prominent example of this is Obito’s language on Itachi which he is actually changing to further influence Sasuke which the Databooks imply. All of the Itachi is a rival to Obito & pain is an underling actually comes from how Obito speaks about both to Sasuke which again he’s skewering the information. Just my 2 cents but I also have big problems with that argument.
I hate this obito thing Minato thinks he's fighting Madera of course he tells naruto he need more power in fact, he never says otherwise just refers to him as the mask man for all we know he still believes so. hate this argument that Minato on that level because he landed 1 attack that didn't even do anything. and saying he's not trying to kill makes no sense and this Minato at 14 thing hate it to are we really saying 14 year old obito is more durable than then the nine tails biju bomb because that's what you are saying rasengon is Compared to.its either the ninetails is Extremely weakened or obito is just that durable at 14.Pain wins Minato is not kcm1 level as hokage
Why? Kakashi had crazy feats in the war. He's consistently keeping up with WM Obito & KCM2 Naruto, and even being able to kamui the 8 tails & truth seeking orbs. It's not far fetched to say that Kakashi's kamui at this point could snipe Nagato entirely. He's a beast.
@@iBeastless maybe I’m biased but I just think the plethora of abilities that come with the Rinnegan would end up being too much for Kakashi I think there’s a 66%-72% chance Nagato wins and a 33% chance Nagato kills him
@@diqtoobic I'd say it's 50-50, I think it's more challenging for Kakashi if it's the 6 paths of Pain. Edo Nagato is stronger but it's only 1 person, and whether he could dodge a kamui snipe is unknown. So yeah I think it's 50-50 if it's Edo Nagato.
@@iBeastless 50-50 is crazy💀💀I could trippin tho so imma respect yo opinion I just think there are so many more ways Edo Nagato would end up killing Kakashi let alone just winning the fight and forcing a retreat and if Kakashi goes without and precog and doesn’t kno much about the Rinnegan he doesnt stand a chance
@@diqtoobic I thought we were talking about war arc Kakashi? That logically gives him knowledge on the rinnegan abilities. With how broken his kamui got in the war, I said it's 50-50 🤷♂️
The Kanji on the scroll actually doesn't come out to either, it just mentions it as the "names of Jiraiya, The Fourth Hokage, and Naruto" if you want to say, 4th Hokage is a placeholder for Minato I think that's fine, however considering Gamabunta also references Minato in this specific scene also as the 4th Hokage it still follows that interpretation.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
Jiraya would be like HE LAGGING
😂😂😂
💀
LMAO
Minato vs. Pain would've been a Legendary matchup.
It really wouldn’t, pain would get stomped
@@kolbycheeze7607 Doesnt mean it cant be an epic matchup seeing how Minato finds out about Pains abilities. Its not always about who is stronger/weaker when it comes to good battles.
@@Phil_3491 fair point
Naah with no knowledge, Minato definitely does not stomp
@@kolbycheeze7607pain can literally use telekinesis on all Minato kunai
The swapped fights videos are great, Thunder. Here's a few video ideas for future:
1. Ranking the ten strongest ninja with no bloodlines or tailed beasts.
2. All the characters who at any point held the #1 spot as the strongest living ninja during the whole timeline.
New Horizons did the second one already. Bro just doesn’t upload anymore.
Obito watched Nagato go berserk when Yahiko died.
Not even 20 seconds into the video and ThunderDaddy already talking about “succulent and juicy”
Finally someone mentioned the Rain Maker jutsu and how hard it counters Minato, plus Pain would know not to use Chaotic Shinra Tensei or Chibaku Tensei which would do wonders on how long Minato will have to fight 6 dudes with the craziest justsu and in the Nine Tails Incident where he was previously mentioned in the video to be fatigued is just gonna be a complete jumping from Pain. RIP Minato, dude still dies on his kids bday
Pain may be able to see Minato coming, he just doesn’t have the speed to actually dodge the attack
what makes u say that?
@snv6hisaroid
@@princeyoutuber-yq8hfhe could hardly keep up with the six tails…minato is around that kcm level of speed so he’s even faster than the six fails who pain was barely reacting to
@@J0kerz_EditzPain ran through the strongest village,and took down 3 giant toad summons,and sage naruto .Then had to dance with 6-8 tails naruto,and eventually got so fatigued base naruto out speed him.
I’m pretty sure pain is dealing with Minato at full power.
It's about time someone FINALLY brings up the fact that Obito can use black rods but simply chooses not to use them. You cooked here.
The literal only time he uses them without showing his Rinnegan is when he’s explaining how he’s using Six Paths Light & Dark Style so it’s actually insanely weird how dudes don’t.
@@ThunderGodTGIn the anime it looked more like a pole instead of a black rod
Anime changed a LOT with the black belted blades
I be trynna tell em on Reddit he can literally one shot ppl with him
What do they do anyway? Like mess up chakra or bypass healing or sum?
OBITO CONTENT I LOVE TO SEE IT
Also tg what would you think of doing another "Assembling the perfect gokage to beat" addition for Hashirama? He lowkey stomps regardless but i think itd be fun. Or, another fun hypothetical of what if Hashirama turned against Taka, orochimaru, and the other edo hokage, like if he just decided he didnt like Sasuke's answer after he was revived in the war arc?
I def could do something like that we’re just so limited in terms of hokage
@@ThunderGodTGwhen you put it like that I get it. Thanks for responding to the comment!
Kamui vs Frog Kumite is actually a pretty interesting scenario
Tobi or Obito just Kamui everything GG LOL Always found these characters interesting because they both had orange and the same spikey hair like Naruto
I always forget the obito legit ate a rasengan to the face
Five seconds to charge up sage mode. Minato: "This takes entirely too long!"
I’m literally saying we just don’t know how long is too long for him since he was standing in place for 2 chapters 😭 it also just doesn’t last long tho which is partially why
Nobody ever brings up that summons are massive liabilities vs. Genjutsu users and I have no idea why. People talk about fights like Jiraiya vs. Hebi Sasuke as being a wash when Gamabunta shows up as if Hebi Sasuke didn't put Manda in a Genjutsu while he was fatigued. Glad it's coming up now, but it's just weird that no one ever talks about it when even the canonical weakest version of an adult Uchiha we ever see is easily capable of it casually.
Jiraiya can just unsummon them or disrupt their Chakra . It's definitely annoying but not something that just negs the summons especially because ma and pa fuse to his Chakra network and are always putting nature Chakra in him . jiraiya can dismiss them just as fast if not faster then Sasuke can genjustu them considering his higher level of experience and that his title is the toad hermit/sage. he also casually can casually summon a huge toad that traps the opponent and itachi needed amaterarsu to get out (if he could have used a non ms Jutsu to get out he definitely would have itachi is smart and knows he can't waste energy because of his illness and the strain of the ms) tldr the genjustu is annoying but not something jiraiya couldn't deal with .
@@codbeast914 The problem is knowing they're in a Genjutsu. Genjutsu isn't automatically obvious. By the time it has done what it needs to do, that Toad is dead or has killed Jiraiya more likely than not.
You can't just point to "chakra disruption" as a catch-all for Genjutsu literally turning your teammate against you. That's not how it works.
@@Necromancer4267 when there attached to your Chakra network it does . They are constantly putting sage Chakra in jiraiya so it would instantly break anything that's not a ms genjustu considering that's the most common way end a genjustu except for maybe pain. He also has precog and passive sensory in sage mode so he would sense the disturbance in his summons Chakra.
@@codbeast914 You're the only one talking about Fukasaku and Shima, bud. I'm not.
@@Necromancer4267 but chakra disruption is literally how you get out of it though.
You on a generational run rn
It’s been a while since I’ve seen an original Naruto battle video like this
Caramel Mama as a name is CRAZY WORK😂😂
Another banger what if video 🙏🔥
TG always coming in clutch when I’m about to eat 💯🔥
Thumbnail goes hard as hell as usual
fire video love obito getting hyped up since ppl don't like to give him credit
Awesome idea for this one dude!
Just another reminder of that insane jump in power Obito did in 1 night... Chunin to 10 tails...
Obito slams everyone that pain ever faced and Pain slams everyone Obito faced up until KCM Naruto excluding Hokage Minato he’s not winning that one though the battle would be legendary🤝
pain slams minato too lmao
@@dakota8381if thinking minato loses to pain is what helps you sleep better at night then so be it lil bro
@NarutosRasengan5 Hokage Minato wasn't nearly as strong as war arc Minato, Hokage Minato was ASS with sage jutsu and he didn't have Kurama and Pain was barley fighting together with his 6 paths against Naruto because he never took him serious. We literally never saw Pain take a fight serious. When Minato took a fight serious he still died.
@@dakota8381once again if this is what helps you sleep better at night…then so be it lil bro😂
@NarutosRasengan5 Ur the same dude that says he can beat Hashirama too huh?
I sir do be tryna hear all that. More the more tg content the better 🎉
Thumbnail is crazy good
I would argue, if Jiraiya starts in SM, he has a legitimate chance against Obito. Sages have been shown to have the reflexes to react to space/time jutsu. However, if we’re talking base Jiraiya, that’ll be rough. Base Jiraiya doesn’t really have the correct arsenal against space/time jutsu. He did react to Urashiki, but wasn’t fast enough to outright dodge Urashiki. I don’t think Obito is as fast as Urashiki, but Jiraiya will definitely have a hard time against Obito.
However, if we have indeed confirmed that space/time jutsu can remove ones self from individual dimensions, then Jiraiya may be able to fight Obito. Because if Sasuke can summon his hawk into Kaguya’s alternate dimension and characters from Boruto can just jump from dimension to dimension with basic space/time jutsu, then reverse summoning should work in Jiraiya’s favor…in theory.
The only issue with this is Kamui is stated in D3 to be a sealed dimension unlike Kaguya’s that has no restrictions on other individuals entering it while being connected. The Kamui eye is the actual only way to pass into or for chakra to pass into the dimension.
@ThunderGodTG this is why I believe that Obito is a horrible match up for Pain. Obito might know the abilities of the Rinnegan just as much as Nagato if not more, he would know which paths to bfr first. I also think the paths will lose their connection to Nagato once in the dimension based on your explanation above. So Obito only needs to bfr the paths one by one.
Each hokage runs the akatsuki gauntlet
Fantastic video!!!!
Ok, so I have a video idea ( I don't know if u take them or not, but I think it'd be fun) it leans kinda heavy into the what if territory, but what if the hidden cloud invaded the leaf after pains assault. For this personally, I would rather kakazu and hidan didn't capture yugito and the 2 tails (could just make it utakata the 6 tails as a timeline replacement) which leaves her yo the hidden cloud alive. This would take place in a konoha 2 weeks after pains assault, their rebuilding, tsunade is still out, etc. But during the rebuild the hidden cloud attacks. I think it would be a pretty interesting video to watch idk
Thundergod definitely going into the hall of fame for top scaler
Best Upcoming Naruto RUclipsr in 2024
First brotherrrrr it’s Zahhh
Jiraiya's only win con against Obito is Obito's demeanor. If he lets jiraiya just throw crap at him, he could get caught by a frog song.
You should make a playlist of videos you've been in on other's people channels
9 secs and no views. How the mighty has fallen. Jk interesting tooic. Keep up the great work.😸
What if borato fought all of naruto's opponents at the same age frame? 🤔
There’s a bunch of animated clips in this video with great quality. Where are they from?
Naruto storm video games
As crazy as I thin it would be, with all the changes, I think the basis of win strategy barely changes. They both had an alleged 5 seconds between their invulnerability and being hittable. The only difference is that Obito wouldn't have nearly the destructive force in THIS battle because he no longer has the 9 Tails (he could bring the 1-7 Tails but that would go directly against the Tsuki no Me plan). The brute force/power of Almighty Push more or less forced otherwise powerful ninja into duties other than fighting - that said, teaming up on Pain is borderline pointless if there's no Sage (or at least thats how it was depicted. He played around with Kakashi and Choji+dad). While you might argue this for Obito, the Leaf would be able to focus more elite ninja on Obito than they did with Pain due to the lack of mass casualties. Not to mention Shikamaru would likely be of service this time. The moment Obito slips out of the 1st shadow posession (team strats with Shikamaru tend to open up with this) he'd probably figure out. The timing will be more difficult to figure out due to the nature of the ability - Tendo Pains attacks were very straightforward regarding its limits. Obito will need to be swarmed or outsmarted, and the Leaf can do both theoretically this time.
The only issue is that Obito has the Izanagi at this time, meaning that we have to outsmart him TWICE to get rid of him - and you can pretty much guarantee he'll run away. That said, in that event, Obito would likely die to Konan since she had her sea of paper bombs made in preparation, not on the spot, meaning she had already planned to kill Obito regardless of the event sin the Pain arc. Some may say he only goes to that place because Nagato dies, but Obito would have returned to the Rain village anyway since that was their base, Simply a matter of time at that point
Hokage minato is closer to kcm2 naruto
Nah
Nice vid
Oh damn! Now that's a topic!
A wild Satori appears
Out the gate with "succulent" and "juicy"???? This is the Mewtwo chad downbad man himself ThunderGod without a doubt.
9:00 Seems more likely the directory page was given rather than randomly stumbling upon it. I do wonder who could have possibly done so...
19:50 That might just be a random metal pipe he ripped from the surroundings.
22:22 It is noted that Gamakichi's Syrup Gun is senjutsu, suggesting all of the giant toads are using Sage Mode, which could mean they could fight blind.
26:27 The articles have some errors such as stated Obito was in the cave for multiple years before Rin died, that the Sannin were named in the Third Shinobi World War, or (this one is up for debate) that Edo Tensei Madara grew stronger than he did in life.
29:45 It is unclear if he can spin Kamui the same way whilst he is in the Kamui dimension which is needed for the Blast Wave Wild Dance.
I have known about the page for a minute but, I do appreciate the assistance lmao
Saying it’s a random metal pipe is an extreme cop out to what’s established, the platform that Obito’s was standing with the pipes blew up and they were FAR larger than he was so it was def not a metal pipe imo.
Obito should be able to spin Kamui as it’s quite literally the same principle just from the other side of the time space, only difference being he obviously can’t phase.
I don’t disagree the articles are not objective sources nor did I claim they were perfect as I’ve disagreed with certain statements, more so aiding in some of their credibility. It’s also CRAZY you say that Madara point when I’ve seen you rep it
@@ThunderGodTG Receivers tend to be more cylindrical until snapped whilst Obito's had quite an edge, it is not coloured full black in the official coloured manga, and it even breaks in the extended fight in the anime (not that it is canon).
The exact properties of Kamui in Kamui are unclear. Worth bringing up, at least.
I am in the extreme minority that consider the source valid when it does not explicitly contradict (like getting years/dates wrong), such as with Madara. That there is such contention for it is my point, though, that not all would accept it when such statements exist.
Obito’s was actually cylindrical if you back and actually look at the blade, anime extended material when looking at the black rods is not as solid as the anime also has Kakashi & Hinata breaking Pain’s Rods, the anime changes it to where the rods as a whole are less durable not exclusive to Obito.
I think that’s fine take when looking at the Articles.
Really wanted to see obito vs itachi, Naruto and Bee.
If Obito were to teleport even 1 of Naruto's shadow clones into the Kamui dimension during a fight with him, he essentially can't phase through any of his attacks anymore because the clone would be able to attack any part of his body that he attempts to use Kamui on from that moment forward, just like what happened in the war arc.
The cutscenes present of the twentyfifth.minute with the classic Samurai hat, from which game are they from?
Im a simple man
I see Thundergod post a video, and I watch it
Another day another banger video man. Keep rolling the hits
My man ✊🏻🙏🏻🔥
In all honesty, I do think Minato was a bit misinformed about Pain considering he only appeared after Pain was fatigued and holding back as to not kill Naruto. I think also the shared vision is really gonna help when Minato tries to teleport behind the paths. Even if the path can’t avoid the attack, it would lead to a faster counter attack by the others
Yeah like Pain could be stronger than what was displayed, although Minato would have a good idea on his abilities as Naruto fought a more focused Deva Path.
So I do agree but, I don’t think it changes an insane amount
Caramel mama. The jokes write themselves. N those jokes are tasty 😂❤
I think Minato stomps Pain no diff. His usage of flying thunder god makes him so insanely overpowered; if he was still Hokage when Pain attacked the village very few people would have died, if any.
How tf does Minato even touch Pain? All he has is Basic Rasengan, Flying Raijin and Reaper death seal ( suicide). Pain Puts a chakra rod in Midnato's arse full 15 inches
He’s faster than Pain even without FTG. Pain is hardly reacting
@@playathesaints9599 Exactly. The moniker "Yellow Flash" didn't come from his usage of Flying Thunder God, that was his base speed, which makes him faster than the Fourth Raikage. With Flying Thunder God on top of that, not to mention he's a perfect toad sage, and is the greatest user of Rasengan after Naruto and maybe Boruto, Pain is history.
I think you did pervy sage dirty here. So I have question. Kamui dimension is a... Separate dimension. But we've seen summons able to be reversed summoned across dimensions (Sasuke and his bird in the kagua fight). And we know the toads can reverse summon (Naruto vs pain). So... Being stuck in the kamui dimension shouldn't be an issue for jiraya, right? And even if jiraya decides not to immediately leave said dimision, Obito would never be able to use kamui again or jiraya would attack the phased body part and kill him. Then reverse summon himself.
40 people have said this and it makes me kinda regret mentioning it but the Kamui dimension is not like Kaguya’s time space where they’re connected. In D3 it’s explicitly noted to be a sealed dimension which means the only way in or out is through the Kamui eye. Look at like this the Kamui dimension can only be entered and left through a door (the Kamui Eye) whereas Kaguya’s other dimensions don’t have this restriction & you can walk right into the house.
This is also why Minato who has extensive knowledge on space time ninjutsu which is what the summoning jutsu is also thinks it’s a GG if he actually does get sucked in.
@@ThunderGodTG thanks. I didn't know about the "sealed" part. Now it makes perfect sense. Except for locking him there still means Obito can't use it again (until jiraya starves to death, lol) Great video, homie
Appreciate it what’s interesting is that even then Jiraiya would probably never see Obito since where he phases is proportionate to where he is on earth so if he teleports somewhere else Jiraiya would never find him in the dimension.
An example of this is Obito can fight Fuu/Torune yet Karin never senses or see’s Obito in the Kamui dimension while he’s phasing through which means it may actually be earth sized which is kinda nuts. Appreciate the support my man 🙏🏻
The only reason why Obito could be hit in the dimension while he was phasing in the war was because of Kakashi's Mangekyo. Kakashi's eye could pinpoint Obito's transported body parts. Even using kamui with the two eyes at the same time made Obito's body part and Kakashi's target teleport to the exact same point in the dimension. This was seen with the teleported kunai and rasengan.
11:50 i will not stand for this kakashi slander
Bro got tired of reading make out tactics and wanted to make that shit real 😭
I predict that there will be a lot of pain for Pain.
Obito is the MC Hammer of Naruto.
huh?
@@MayoTheNnaisecan’t touch this
@@remotewinston8683also presenting as affable and good natured while being calculating and bloodthirsty behind the scenes
Aye TG you should do a video on what if Sakura tried with guy and lee focusing more on improving her overall speed and taijutsu while also being the first to master the 8th gate by using 100 healings stacked with it. Which would have made her a monster in the war arc
Good video bro and I personally think that hokage /. Alive minato scales to kcm2 naruto idk I’m not good at power scaling 😅😅
no he scales to kcm 1.5/ ems sasuke because kcm 1 naruto is comparable to minato but doesnt seem quite there yet and kcm 2 naruto was stated by kurama to surpass minato and kushina so minato most likely scales to kcm 1.5 to early kcm 2 but i dont see alive minato taking down 6 bijuu
30:43 ive always thought that was a lets fight using traditional taijutsu
30:50
If you watch "Kage the Don" review this fight, you'll be shocked at how much Obito actually folded Kakashi in this fight😂
I feel like obito would win almost all the fights
Yeah not to mention that Kakashi would get tired eventually since he would be dealing with the summons and nagato over and over not to mention some his stuff can get absorbed making nagato much stronger.
Still can’t be proven that Obito was holding back
You can be holding back techniques & not holding back stats, Obito very clearly was withholding moves in order to get the Seal taken off his heart - manipulating the battle so he could force a Raikiri or attack through it. He literally could not harm himself or do it himself
This was actually one of the hardest things to pull off for Obito, and he did it with prestine skill, getting Kakashi to blow it off was the plan from the very beginning. We even see it in their genjutsu battle.
what if swagkage uploaded?
Who is that again? Some small RUclipsr?
So Obito with a perfect win rate.
And Pain............... well he won at least 2 of them.........
Very handsome editing, partner 🤠
what's the song playing in Obito v Naruto Sage Mode section?
It is street fighter V: ibuki theme
Man i was expecting a round of White mask Obito vs Edo itachi, Bee and kcm Naruto imo Obito wins
Okay I can’t even lie I forgot about that when scripting LMAOOO but, yeah he’d clear imo
Yeah Obito probably takes this one
Yeah, Jariya vs pain is a stomp for pain especially kamui
I don't believe Minato using Sage Mode is an argument at all. I think it is very disingenuous to assume he would use it. He didn't use it even when the village was under attack, his wife was taken, and there was an attempted murder of his newborn child. He thought he was fighting Madara Uchiha, or at the very least someone of his caliber, who was the biggest threat to Konoha ever and still never used it. I genuinely believe he would never think about or even consider using it. He would be fighting Pain essentially in base.
I don’t disagree that was just presupposition he didn’t have to worry about a Nine Tails rampaging & has the luxury of leaving to go gather nature energy. Although I will say part of the reason he didn’t on top of it not being good was Obito could follow him anywhere he went, so he would have never had an opportunity.
@ThunderGodTG There's just a lot of variables at play in the scenario like the summons taking up a similar role to Kurama in regard to mass devastation of the village. If the goal is just destroying Konoha it would be easier and more achieveable than getting the confirmed kill on Minato because of how slippery he is via Flying Raijin. But yeah loving the content as per usual 👌
Nah I agree I just figured I’d address the SM since if i didn’t dudes would ask, also appreciate the support my man ✊🏻
Give me that extra two seconds of content dammit!
I want to hear you say that Nagito super dies to six pads characters!
27:50
The mental blocks Nagato placed on the Ame ninja specifically contains valuable information in case the target gets captured.
It's not stated or implied to actually provide any genjutsu resistance outside of protecting that specific information, and Nagato being the only known user is not proof (or really even an implication) of it even being related to the rinnegan.
The rinnegan also can't see chakra through smoke, cast illusions, or precog like the sharingan can, so there's no reason to assume it improves or even maintains genjutsu resistance compared to the sharingan just because it's supposed to be an evolution from it. It's even arguable whether or not it's a proper evolutionary step above when the true pinnacle is using both together along with the byakugan.
Base sharingan genjutsu victim fr. 🤷♂
Hebi Sasuke might just slam.
The Rinnegan itself has it's own distinct sensory mode visually that can see barriers, assess chakra levels, as well as being used when Pain want's to make sure he can react to faster attacks. The Sharingan is MUCH more suited to Genjutsu resistance as it is the Genjutsu focused of the 3 Great Dojutsu. The sharingan also isn't an end all be all as it works primarily off physical movement & can't see chakra movement so to say that automatically just gives it a > over the rinnegan is absurd, we quite literally saw Kakashi fight Pain & this wasn't the case.
Pain himself is just nearly impossible to Genjutsu with sharingan since he overall has an insane chakra supply to try & control - to the point it can be felt by regular Anbu from 1 Path. The fact Pain's summons also don't remain in the Frog Song Genjutsu that Ma & Pa cast I think also just adds to this.
The genjutsu blockers is just an interesting side point, idk why that turned into a Rinnegan vs Sharingan discussion? Especially when it's not as 1:1 with both Dojutu's either.
Pain also beats the dog piss out of Hebi Sasuke, who can't even Genjutsu a V1 Raikage with a stronger Genjutsu & peak mastery of his 3T Sharingan.
@@ThunderGodTG _"The genjutsu blockers is just an interesting side point, idk why that turned into a Rinnegan vs Sharingan discussion? Especially when it's not as 1:1 with both Dojutu's either."_
At 27:50 you say that the rinnegan has natural genjutsu resistance and use Nagato's ability to use Genjutsu Protect as a primary example of that. I can't really see any other way to interpret this.
The comparisons to the sharingan were just to highlight that there are things the rinnegan can't emulate despite being an "evolution" from the sharingan. It's a very common conception that the rinnegan grants inherent genjutsu resistance, but there are no statements or concrete showings to support this. The closest we get to that is Sasuke negating the infinite tsukuyomi with his rinnegan, which also happens to be a sharingan with six paths powers.
Hebi Sasuke was a joke, but shit he just might do it. Early shippuden Sasuke pulled up and genjutsu'd half of the nine tails, and was keeping up in a genjutsu exchange with Itachi after absorbing Orochimaru (I might be turning into a hebi Sasuke goon tbh). Come to think of it, Kurenai managed to land a genjutsu on Itachi too. If she wasn't pregnant Pain might've been a Kurenai victim🤷♂.
All jokes aside: taka Sasuke never actually tries to genjutsu A, so it seems kind of odd to use that as an anti feat. He manages to land one on V1 B while still fatigued from his fight with Itachi and basically no experience with his MS. I would argue that V1 B is at least somewhat comparable to V1 A, as those are the forms they choose to use in their double lariat so it's not like MS Sasuke just has zero chance of landing genjutsu on people with bijuu levels of chakra; with his MS at least.
I actually wouldn't even know where to begin in quantifying Pain's chakra compared to A & B, but if he's not just chakra flexing out of Kabuto's control as an edo then there's no way I can believe he just negs kotoamatsukami via his normal chakra flow. It's even less believable considering that his chakra is being split in 6 different ways as Pain. Danzo's koto seems to not be quite the same as the one from the eye Itachi had, but it still required that the user be made aware of the fact they're being controlled.
I never said the sharingan is above the rinnegan. I just said that it doesn't seem to be a proper evolutionary step above the sharingan, but rather just another doujutsu in the same family. If you compare it to going from 3T -> MS -> EMS it doesn't exactly follow the same trend. If it was truly an evolution, then there wouldn't be any point in going back and forth between rinnegan and MS outside of potentially saving chakra.
Also, I don't recall it ever being stated that the sharingan can't see chakra movement. The rinnegan seems to be better at seeing chakra buildup and predicting what jutsu will come from it, but the sharingan can still see chakra and it's composition via color at a cellular level and should be able to predict linear attacks like fireballs just fine.
W
Would love a hypothetical Red hair Nagato vs Minato
Pain would've been wiping bare ppl out casually. 😂
Minato died so that Naruto could be the main character.
we didn’t wanna see how he continued being relative to Ay
@@nwk1626relative to Ay yea definitely the guy who himself stated minato is superior to him🤡 stop listening to Naruto on your 1925 radio bud watch the show probably
@@J0kerz_Editz where he say that, referring to his combat speed ofc
Lets be real, the only actual reason Obito doesnt use all his abilities is because combined with Kamui he would have been waaaaay more op than he already is, bro never uses wood style or Rinnegan abilities like at all
25:25 Dude! Is that a game or some separate universe?!
Waiting for an answer as well...
Probably from the Naruto storm video games
The game is Naruto Online Mobile
Say less
I disagree with kakashi outstating red haired nagato. Nagoto was casually keeping up with bee and naruto and still bodied them, also using the the nagato that needed help walking to scale his speed is stupid
Kakashi does the same thing with a stronger Naruto & Bee, who scaled Nagato based on him needing help walking?
Can you do a three way vs battle between orochimaru and his edo tensei(the 4 kage), sage kabuto and his edo tensei(including one rinnegan madara), and white mask obito with his 6 jenchuriki paths.
Honestly, Frog Kumite could potentially hit Obito. Idk, but it's an interesting interaction.
Nice video, but what the hell is a "black belted blade" supposed to be? I thought they were just called black chakra rods/recievers.
The Databooks just describe them like that can call them chakra rods or receivers it doesn’t matter. It’s just that the blades don’t transmit chakra without the outerpath of pain so I just call them black belted blades since the Databook does.
1. 16 years had passed since Obito's fight with Minato. Thats 16 years of time for Obito to get stronger.
2. Naruto needed to learn how to control the Nine-tails chakra because Obito literally has the means to summon and control the Nine-tails.
I'm really tired of youtubers using that Minato statement to make ridiculous claims about the power level of 14 year old Obito.
It’s actually not provable that Obito got stronger over the course of 16 years, the only arguments are really that he got more Hashirama cells, otherwise it’s actually insanely in character for him not to train as he’s take a much more delegator like approach.
Naruto actually just needed the nine tails chakra to gain more power, this point makes no sense as the nine tails would be sealed inside of Naruto so Obito would be unable to summon it.
@@ThunderGodTG Okay first of all 16 years of manipulation and plotting would undoubtedly make anyone smarter and more strategic, and for a shinobi with an exploitable hax ability like Kamui, intelligence and strategic thinking translates directly into fighting ability. So even your "lazy delegator" headcanon version of 30 year old Obito is still a lot stronger than his immature 14 year old self. Also staying the same strength while never training doesn't make any sense. He'd be significantly weaker if he spent 16 years not training or fighting.
Also Obito is an A grade instigator and it would be very easy for him to make Naruto break the seal if they ever had a serious fight before Naruto Mastered KCM. Minato already knew Naruto had the strength to beat Obito and he only needed to control his one critical weakness, the Nine-tails.
This is a deep story about emotions and stuff. Not power scaling. So when Minato says "You need to control Nine-Tails chakra before fighting Obito" he means "You need to control your tantrum demon before fighting the mastermind instigator and manipulator with a Sharingan".
Yeah as I said we actually don’t have any metric to say he just improved significantly aside from “he’s probably stronger. It’s not lazy headcanon as Obito is very roundabout and less forward after his fight with Minato, opting to use pawns such as the Akatsuki for collecting the Bijuu along with Pain or Sasuke for Rinne Rebirth. By all means claim he got stronger idc tbh it’s just as a valid as he didn’t get stronger.
Bro I’ve read the story obviously Naruto needs to control the nine tails as it’s a tantrum demon but, the narrative is literally he needs to master its power to beat Obito just outright stated by Naruto & Kurama himself. The idea that the nine tails can break out and harm the village is partially tied to Naruto’s interactions with Sasuke at the 5KS and him not risking a pain situation but, it also is to gain more strength. Naruto is a story about emotions but also is a SHONEN story they’re not mutually exclusive which is why Naruto is so good it excels at both.
where is obito vs itachi, kcm1 naruto & bee?
I fully went into this video expecting for pain to get railed by kakashi guy bee and naruto but i guess it wasnt meant to be
Obito lets people phase through him as a fighting style.
He is very lazy and this can allow weaker combants to beat him when they shouldn't.
Obito using kamui is just him dodging he's still fightin lol how is obito lazy ?
Blt his gault most of these people just have no response to his kamui and some of his fights end fast because he use teleportation as a main technique.
Its like sayin minato is lazy bc he mostly use raijin
What if kakashi switch roles with jiraya
Wait hold on, wouldn't Kakashi just put Nagato into the Kamui dimension and win basically by default? Or I guess, taking himself out of it if we count the fight happening inside?
Nagato is fighting Kakashi in the Kamui dimension in the vid in Obito’s place
@@ThunderGodTG So couldn't Kakashi just Kamui himself out of the dimension in theory? I believe that's how he got himself and Sakura out originally. (Unless am misremembering)
Yeah I believe I mention that as well, it’s just like well there’s no fight now lmao
@@ThunderGodTG Reverse Kamui GG basicaly xD Good video tho man! Always fun watching ya
My man ✊🏻🔥
Pain would actually use the rinnigan! lol
Obito is not stronger than nagato. He can control the 9 tails hence naruto has to master the ninetails. Obito is only stronger than nagato after taking the rinnegan and getting the jinchuriki. Keep in mind Minato also only saw a weakend fatigued version of pain...
Minato never said that Naruto needed the nine tails power to beat Obito he was explaining the reason why he put the nine tails inside Naruto
The implication is that the Nine Tails power > Naruto’s current abilities that can contend with Pain as Minato says you’d need extraordinary power to beat Obito after watching the Pain fight. This is supplemented numerous times with differing implications some as low as KCM1 some as high as KCM2, Kurama himself also makes the exact statement TO OBITO that Minato put Kurama inside Naruto to BEAT Obito.
Imagine if Shisui randomly bounces up on Pain in the forest. Is it believable that he could just cast koto on him EZ clap new unit unlocked!
We've never even seen an active rinnegan user (not kind Nagato) under any kind of genjutsu have we? Or does the show Kakashi and Obito put on count?
Does Ino's mind transfer that one time for a second count?
@@supremelore_1533 no nope.
Nagata washes kakashi, end.
Didnt Minato beat orbito i mean he hit him but he got away. So pain losing would be the same. He wouldn't have his real body fight so he could probably get away also
Realisticly, I think you’re right.
Shut up it’s my video 😂
Thunder Woof been hiding to come out with this one. I think i disagree with Pain vs. Minato, but I also have a mucher higher interpretation than Bark God does, and most people in general
NGL I actually do think there is a lot of base for Pain > Minato especially on how you interpret a Grey Haired Nagato, I can def see the visison
@ThunderGodTG For sure. I think its a take that people just think is impossible to have or that it's entirely baseless, so it's something I wish more Naruto Powerscalers would talk about, because it does seem to be something people think is just entirely baseless and unsupported
Nah I agree I def think there is a lot to the Nagato / Pain stuff people don’t touch on which is kinda annoying when Obito / Itachi are treated way better.
@ThunderGodTG It's definitely annoying to see. I've mentioned to you before (on many occasions, actually) that I definitely have Pain>Itachi>Obito, but realistically, I think they're all fairly relative to one another despite placing them in definitive ranks. I honestly think Pain was Obito's contingency plan to Itachi, should Itachi ever turn on the Akatsuki since I doubt Kisame could put him down and Obito has never had a hands on approach in almost any of his dealings and his somewhat blatant admittance to Itachi being able to kill him.
I always see the "Obito belittles Pain" argument being brought up, but rarely does anyone ever point out Obito very much respected most of the Akatsuki's members, especially Nagato and Itachi. We actually see when Obito goes to grab the Rinnegan he actually pays respect by closing Nagato's eyes and using Kamui to not further desecrate his corpse, as opposed to reaching in and plucking out the eye. We also see him openly admit to Zetsu that they (him and Zetsu) wouldn't've gotten as far as they have without the members of the Akatsuki. We even see Obito apologize to Kisame for hiding his true identity from him all along. The disrespectful personality people attribute to Obito is more likely a facade or him playing into the Madara personality he's trying to maintain for most of the series as opposed to his real feelings, which I think plays into the identity crisis he has when he becomes Juubito with all his personalities fighting for dominance (Tobi, The Masked Man, Madara, and Obito) before becoming himself again.
At least, that's how I see it.
I actually agree that the Obito belittle Pain argument is really bad, especially since like you mentioned Obito’s facade changes depending on who he speaks to. The most prominent example of this is Obito’s language on Itachi which he is actually changing to further influence Sasuke which the Databooks imply. All of the Itachi is a rival to Obito & pain is an underling actually comes from how Obito speaks about both to Sasuke which again he’s skewering the information. Just my 2 cents but I also have big problems with that argument.
Imagine pain with Sage mode + he has access to madara's EMS 💀( Yes madara can switch sharingan 🔄 rinnegan)
He can only do that as an Edo💀
11:39💀
Pain is absolutely not in Minato’s tier at all. Explaining that fight deserved as much time as used explaining Jiraiya vs Obito 😂😂 complete stomp
I hate this obito thing Minato thinks he's fighting Madera of course he tells naruto he need more power in fact, he never says otherwise just refers to him as the mask man for all we know he still believes so.
hate this argument that Minato on that level because he landed 1 attack that didn't even do anything. and saying he's not trying to kill makes no sense and this Minato at 14 thing hate it to are we really saying 14 year old obito is more durable than then the nine tails biju bomb because that's what you are saying rasengon is Compared to.its either the ninetails is Extremely weakened or obito is just that durable at 14.Pain wins Minato is not kcm1 level as hokage
I have a hard time believing kakashi beats Nagato
Why? Kakashi had crazy feats in the war. He's consistently keeping up with WM Obito & KCM2 Naruto, and even being able to kamui the 8 tails & truth seeking orbs.
It's not far fetched to say that Kakashi's kamui at this point could snipe Nagato entirely. He's a beast.
@@iBeastless maybe I’m biased but I just think the plethora of abilities that come with the Rinnegan would end up being too much for Kakashi I think there’s a 66%-72% chance Nagato wins and a 33% chance Nagato kills him
@@diqtoobic I'd say it's 50-50, I think it's more challenging for Kakashi if it's the 6 paths of Pain. Edo Nagato is stronger but it's only 1 person, and whether he could dodge a kamui snipe is unknown. So yeah I think it's 50-50 if it's Edo Nagato.
@@iBeastless 50-50 is crazy💀💀I could trippin tho so imma respect yo opinion I just think there are so many more ways Edo Nagato would end up killing Kakashi let alone just winning the fight and forcing a retreat and if Kakashi goes without and precog and doesn’t kno much about the Rinnegan he doesnt stand a chance
@@diqtoobic I thought we were talking about war arc Kakashi? That logically gives him knowledge on the rinnegan abilities. With how broken his kamui got in the war, I said it's 50-50 🤷♂️
It says Minato's name on the scroll, not "fourth hokage".
The Kanji on the scroll actually doesn't come out to either, it just mentions it as the "names of Jiraiya, The Fourth Hokage, and Naruto" if you want to say, 4th Hokage is a placeholder for Minato I think that's fine, however considering Gamabunta also references Minato in this specific scene also as the 4th Hokage it still follows that interpretation.
@@ThunderGodTG 波風ミナト literally translates to Namikaze Minato.
I am aware of the Kanji I’m saying none of the entires on the scroll actually have that Kanji on there. It’s literally just gibberish
Yeah Danzo is cooked