George , you are a very good educator, I know you have a PHD mine is from Texas (Post Hole Digger) when I used to farm and ranch, LOL back to realities Thankyou for such a great channel , you hold the audience with pure facts . We appreciate it much.
I went down this rabbit hole when trying to load bismuth. It also seemed to keep cheaper bismuth from fracturing as much. It was pretty noticeable on paper when I didn’t use buffer.
From my experience, the under shot material is usually used to protect the bottom of the shot cup portion of the wad from being torn by the shot charge under acceleration. It can also be used to adjust the stack height of the shell for crimping. This allows ammo manufacturers to use the same wad for several different load weights.
It's interesting, I'm seeing under shot material used with wads that have no buffer at the bottom, so it seems like they are trading one for the other. Not sure if anyone uses both.
It is great to see someone doing there homework learning and teaching others things about the shooting art's. Old times are dieding out that know these things .it is great to see someone young steping up learning others these things..keep up the good work mr George. Ironman in Alabama 73s Terry Clark thanks
Hi George - the longbeard load uses a commercially available polyurethane resin with the tradename "Smash-Plastic". You can check Winchester's patent literature where they actually name the brand.
I have hand-loaded my 28 gauge shells for years with bismuth for my 50-year-old double barrel. With BPI buffering material, my hand loads pattern much tighter and more even.
I do think buffering helps, however, sometimes I have gotten comparable results out of a non buffered load (that was a different brand/or velocity/or powder type etc.) because my particular shotgun "liked" it better. It's good to pattern your shotgun to make sure you're getting what you want out of any particular premium load. Real life example, my shotgun likes Federal Hi-brass lead bird shot(cheap), but patterns horribly with the equivalent federal premium plated lead shot. Cutting the two shells open, the only difference appeared to be the powder. Just goes to show that shotguns can be picky.
I think the buffering material could have a positive effect on short range shots if you’re using a sub gauge like a 28 gauge since it has fewer pellets. If you only have 7/8 ounce of say number 5 bismuth, that’s roughly 168-172 pellets. The fewer pellets in the shell, the more buffering will come into play with short range shots, because you would want a more dense pattern if you are using a load with less shot in the shell. That’s my theory at least
Yes! It works-no argument. Iv'e just looked up some test I did with a full choked 10bore I had in the 80's; as I remembered getting fantastic results. With 2oz of AAA's (No 4 buck eq:-) and 40grns of granulated plastic (now a No No because of pollution) I got 98% in a 24"circle!! Just a might tight? As bismuth is a brittle metal so they add tin, buffering works well. Don't bother with steel shot as it comes out as round as it went in. Just adjust the wad colmn with cork wads -a thin one over the shot works well- until they crimp right.
Thanks for the video! Good stuff. I recently commented on another post in regards to barrel porting for shotguns. There’s a continual debate in the sporting clays world about it and I think your approach would do it justice. The claims of a few companies, Rhino being the biggest, are that their porting “reduces muzzle jump by 87%”. These are mostly done on O/U shotguns. They do not have any data other than anecdotal evidence to support their claims. If it works as advertised, more people would want to know and vice versa.
I tested barrel porting in my Mossberg 930 vs 940 video. It does make a noticeable and measurable difference in felt recoil. 87% decrease in muzzle jump sounds optimistic but maybe with a particular ammo. Either way, its not 87% less recoil. But it works. I don't know if there is a velocity or patterning trade off though. Thats harder to measure accurately between guns. It does make the gun louder though. All said, I'm in favor of barrel porting when practical. O/U need some help with recoil compared to autoloaders, they need everything they can get in that department. But autoloaders shoot even softer with it as well. I'm just not sure if it has a trade off in velocity for waterfowl or turkey ammo.
Thanks George, i’ve seen tons of buffered loads and seen dramatic improvement with buffer and various wads but you never really know if it’s the buffer , the wads, or the combination of them that give excellent long range performance. Some say buffer in steel actually does nothing because likelihood of pellet deformation is nil. Your opinion?
I've seen unbuffered steel get close to 87% pattern efficiency at 40 yards. If buffering would get it tighter, it wouldn't really help anyone. And since steel isn't very potent much beyond 40, it's really not worth trying to get the pattern tighter. So since steel is a short to mid range tool, buffering is probably more of a hinderance than a help, IF it did add value. So its kind of a catch 22.
Tss shot has changed the game in ammo. Check the accuracy of the number that is written on the choke tube with a dial indicator caliper not with a digital caliper. You may find a mistake in the numbers .just saying Check to make sure the numbers are correct. Terry Clark thanks
Boss legacy doesn't use a full length wad. That is a huge difference vs the warchief as well. Just the full length wad produces a better pattern. The buffering just takes it a tad further.
Buffered material to retain roundness formation of pellets for better flight and penetration. Then I bought waterfowl loads that were cubed shaped shot packed in a shot cup.??? I think it was called Blindside??
Oh yea, that's a thing. I did a video on it. The hexagon shaped pellets are real. And their performance was not impressive. Better than expected, but I wouldn't use them.
Off topic, but are there any real benefits to over under shotguns outside different chokes? Mostly just have my eye on a really cool OU. I guess two different ammos.
They're in essence an autoloader that will run dirty but at the cost of one shell less capacity. I run an o/u for waterfowl and also a side by side for upland. For long days carrying a gun and walking I'll take a side by side every day of the week. It just carries more comfortably. It swings nicer has double triggers for instant barrel/choke swaps, and it stpoints and swings faster, for me at least. An over under I really like for doing work in the marsh. Simple mechanism, and typically if you need 3shots, all its doing is letting everybody in earshot know you missed the first two shots so all that giving up a third round does is typically get you just as many birds but reduces ammo consumption by 30%.
@@eduffy4937 I would say no, over unders don't generally make for good field guns in my opinion, a side by side would be my preference for a double gun.
@@mrsmith9079 to each thier own I've never had anything let me down as much as semi autos have. Too picky of a weapon for my liking. In a filthy place I want a gun that can run filthy. Let the haters commence commenting on this one.lol
![Chino Pacas - Modo Capone (with Drake & Fuerza Regida) [Video Oficial]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/zjv8TQ0gBkg/mqdefault.jpg)
It’s amazing how well that camo pattern you’re wearing works. You look like a head just floating in the woods! lol 😂
I need to do a review on this jacket. Apparently the camo works better than I thought lol
George , you are a very good educator, I know you have a PHD mine is from Texas (Post Hole Digger) when I used to farm and ranch, LOL back to realities Thankyou for such a great channel , you hold the audience with pure facts . We appreciate it much.
Thank you so much!
That cardboard/fiber disk is usually referred to as a cushion wad rather than a buffer. At least in the hand loading manuals.
Thanks!
I went down this rabbit hole when trying to load bismuth. It also seemed to keep cheaper bismuth from fracturing as much. It was pretty noticeable on paper when I didn’t use buffer.
Yea I have found buffered bismuth to have drastically less fragmentation.
From my experience, the under shot material is usually used to protect the bottom of the shot cup portion of the wad from being torn by the shot charge under acceleration. It can also be used to adjust the stack height of the shell for crimping. This allows ammo manufacturers to use the same wad for several different load weights.
It's interesting, I'm seeing under shot material used with wads that have no buffer at the bottom, so it seems like they are trading one for the other. Not sure if anyone uses both.
This was a good one George thank you. God bless you and go get them in the marsh.
Thanks so much Jeff!
It is great to see someone doing there homework learning and teaching others things about the shooting art's. Old times are dieding out that know these things .it is great to see someone young steping up learning others these things..keep up the good work mr George. Ironman in Alabama 73s Terry Clark thanks
Thank you so much Terry!
Hi George - the longbeard load uses a commercially available polyurethane resin with the tradename "Smash-Plastic". You can check Winchester's patent literature where they actually name the brand.
Very cool.
I have hand-loaded my 28 gauge shells for years with bismuth for my 50-year-old double barrel. With BPI buffering material, my hand loads pattern much tighter and more even.
Very nice!
I love learning a little more something new each day! Great info!
Thanks so much!
Thanks for sharing your knowledge and keep your videos coming please.
Thanks for watching!
I do think buffering helps, however, sometimes I have gotten comparable results out of a non buffered load (that was a different brand/or velocity/or powder type etc.) because my particular shotgun "liked" it better. It's good to pattern your shotgun to make sure you're getting what you want out of any particular premium load.
Real life example, my shotgun likes Federal Hi-brass lead bird shot(cheap), but patterns horribly with the equivalent federal premium plated lead shot. Cutting the two shells open, the only difference appeared to be the powder. Just goes to show that shotguns can be picky.
That's a fair point.
I think the buffering material could have a positive effect on short range shots if you’re using a sub gauge like a 28 gauge since it has fewer pellets. If you only have 7/8 ounce of say number 5 bismuth, that’s roughly 168-172 pellets. The fewer pellets in the shell, the more buffering will come into play with short range shots, because you would want a more dense pattern if you are using a load with less shot in the shell. That’s my theory at least
That's a very good point.
Thanks for the video!
Thanks for watching Ben!
Yes! It works-no argument. Iv'e just looked up some test I did with a full choked 10bore I had in the 80's; as I remembered getting fantastic results. With 2oz of AAA's (No 4 buck eq:-) and 40grns of granulated plastic (now a No No because of pollution) I got 98% in a 24"circle!! Just a might tight? As bismuth is a brittle metal so they add tin, buffering works well. Don't bother with steel shot as it comes out as round as it went in. Just adjust the wad colmn with cork wads -a thin one over the shot works well- until they crimp right.
Thanks!
Thanks for the video! Good stuff. I recently commented on another post in regards to barrel porting for shotguns. There’s a continual debate in the sporting clays world about it and I think your approach would do it justice. The claims of a few companies, Rhino being the biggest, are that their porting “reduces muzzle jump by 87%”. These are mostly done on O/U shotguns. They do not have any data other than anecdotal evidence to support their claims. If it works as advertised, more people would want to know and vice versa.
I tested barrel porting in my Mossberg 930 vs 940 video. It does make a noticeable and measurable difference in felt recoil. 87% decrease in muzzle jump sounds optimistic but maybe with a particular ammo. Either way, its not 87% less recoil. But it works. I don't know if there is a velocity or patterning trade off though. Thats harder to measure accurately between guns. It does make the gun louder though. All said, I'm in favor of barrel porting when practical. O/U need some help with recoil compared to autoloaders, they need everything they can get in that department. But autoloaders shoot even softer with it as well. I'm just not sure if it has a trade off in velocity for waterfowl or turkey ammo.
Thanks George, i’ve seen tons of buffered loads and seen dramatic improvement with buffer and various wads but you never really know if it’s the buffer , the wads, or the combination of them that give excellent long range performance. Some say buffer in steel actually does nothing because likelihood of pellet deformation is nil. Your opinion?
I've seen unbuffered steel get close to 87% pattern efficiency at 40 yards. If buffering would get it tighter, it wouldn't really help anyone. And since steel isn't very potent much beyond 40, it's really not worth trying to get the pattern tighter. So since steel is a short to mid range tool, buffering is probably more of a hinderance than a help, IF it did add value. So its kind of a catch 22.
Tss shot has changed the game in ammo. Check the accuracy of the number that is written on the choke tube with a dial indicator caliper not with a digital caliper. You may find a mistake in the numbers .just saying Check to make sure the numbers are correct. Terry Clark thanks
Boss legacy doesn't use a full length wad. That is a huge difference vs the warchief as well. Just the full length wad produces a better pattern. The buffering just takes it a tad further.
Buffered material to retain roundness formation of pellets for better flight and penetration. Then I bought waterfowl loads that were cubed shaped shot packed in a shot cup.???
I think it was called Blindside??
Oh yea, that's a thing. I did a video on it. The hexagon shaped pellets are real. And their performance was not impressive. Better than expected, but I wouldn't use them.
Science.😊
What camo pattern is that, I really like it!
That's the First Lite source jacket. Just did a review actually: ruclips.net/video/dDYIoRk0-90/видео.html
Off topic, but are there any real benefits to over under shotguns outside different chokes? Mostly just have my eye on a really cool OU. I guess two different ammos.
Video about that is in the future. Short answer is kinda sometimes but dollar per dollar, not really. It's more preference than anything else.
They're in essence an autoloader that will run dirty but at the cost of one shell less capacity. I run an o/u for waterfowl and also a side by side for upland. For long days carrying a gun and walking I'll take a side by side every day of the week. It just carries more comfortably. It swings nicer has double triggers for instant barrel/choke swaps, and it stpoints and swings faster, for me at least. An over under I really like for doing work in the marsh. Simple mechanism, and typically if you need 3shots, all its doing is letting everybody in earshot know you missed the first two shots so all that giving up a third round does is typically get you just as many birds but reduces ammo consumption by 30%.
@@eduffy4937 I would say no, over unders don't generally make for good field guns in my opinion, a side by side would be my preference for a double gun.
@@mrsmith9079 to each thier own
I've never had anything let me down as much as semi autos have. Too picky of a weapon for my liking. In a filthy place I want a gun that can run filthy. Let the haters commence commenting on this one.lol
@@eduffy4937 Ever tried a side by side? I can't go back to over and unders now haha
Curious what the boss 2.0 tss loads would do through the bismuth bone buster xr choke with the slightly looser construction
The brand new wolfram tss? I haven't tested them yet but they are recommending light chokes. Mod or looser. But well see soon.
I have observed less fragmentation of bismuth shot when it is buffered.
Agreed
👍 ❤