2001 CART Firestone Firehawk 600k
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- Опубликовано: 20 июл 2011
- April 29th, 2001 finds the CART boys at the Texas Motor Speedway. After the thrilling IRL races at the speedway, rival CART decided to put on their own show. After a pole speed of 233mph around the 1.5 mile oval, drivers complained of vertigo. The race was postponed but never run.
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RIP David Brown the astronaut interviewed in this video. He died a few years after this in the STS107 break-up on re-entry ....
I noticed that too. Good catch.
Kind of the perfect metaphor for CART really.
Had the flight launched on time and not kept vetting delayed, the accident would not have happened. The age of the tank foam was a contributing factor.
DANG!! I decided to watch this video because I was at this race. WOW!! I never put that together. I remember them interviewing him when everything hit the fan after the race. Just WOW! RIP David Brown!!
@@Zoomer30 or had they used a different tank maybe they would’ve got lucky and been able to bail out.
As soon as Paul said STS-107, I was like "Goddamn that's Columbia." How ironic that is ....
It sucked that they had to do this. I feel sorry for all the fans but when Michael Andretti who was one of the most physically fit drivers at the time said he didn’t feel safe, you know they made the right call.
This is why CART went bankrupt in 2003,they never held testing sessions, which should’ve prevented the race from being cancelled in the first place, and TMS sued CART for breaking their contract
They should’ve cancelled the 2011 Vegas Oval race before it happened. They were experiencing G-Forces.
@@giotrapani7852 they should have! I'll be honest I haven't thought about this but why was Champ Car the spec series 2003-2008 was allowed to run the oval at Las Vegas Motor Speedway without any problems
@@tacklefatkids that was before Vegas was reconfigured.
I never realized the huge foreshadowing that this race has compared to Vegas 2011. Huge props to the drivers coming forward and for CART to stop this race. Big shame that this isn’t what happened in Vegas 10 years later.
yes, i wish they changed vegas or atleast lowered the entry list to 24, maybe dan would still be here q.q
Kudos to CART for this decision. Avoided major disaster
"Avoided major disaster", em, CART's bankruptcy lawyers would probably disagree...
If you mean "nobody got hurt", then that's a pretty piss poor definition of a successful race. Nobody spends money on a racing league so the fans can be *absolutely sure* nobody's going to get hurt. What are race drivers to you, collectable china dolls the league should keep in a curio cabinet so people can behold their pristine safety from a distance?
Spoken like a true asshole
yes but what about asking the drivers to push hard during the pre season testing and these issues would have been found then
@@AlonsoRules teams do what they want as far as testing is concerned. Those things would probably be found at the tire test.
Wow that's amazing that David Brown interviewed for this. RIP
+Colin McCann holy cow when they said STS 107 I instantly knew what that was
Anthony Kernich yep Columbia disaster
Paul Page's comment to him about how he works for an organization (NASA) that always prioritizes safety didn't age well, considering the circumstances of the Columbia disaster and the underlying cause of it...
the cars were to bad ass for their own good
It was the high banking that did them in. They could handle the high speeds at Fontana and Michigan due to the low banking
To me, the 1996 US 500 was the beginning of the end for CART, and this fiasco sealed the fate of CART.
Scuderia Kasey Dixon this plus Driven’s premier made it a rough week for CART.
Yup, the nail on the coffin
what are you talking about? the 97-00 were the golden ages of CART and were doing way better than IRL was
Safety Standpoint: Win
Business Standpoint: Loss
I respect the hell outta them for canceling it. That's a hard thing to do in every aspect of it- the business side, the fan side, and the reputation side. Obviously it would have been nicer to have had them be able to slow the cars down with more drag, but that would have taken too long.
Hard to believe that this was 20 years ago today. An event that should have never been allowed to happen in the first place.
@AlonsoRules The beginning of the end for CART was when Penske jumped ship after the 01 season. When Roger ****ing Penske, one of the founders of CART and one of the richest men in motor racing, jumps ship, you know **** is going to hit the fan.
I often think that the "vector" that was formed when Dale Earnhardt hit the wall at Daytona was a contributing factor in his basal skull fracture. He was on the 33° banking going up hill. He took an even worse hit at Talladega a few years before that that didn't kill him, but he was on the flat tri oval. Different vectors and do odd things when added up.
Earnhardt's seat belt being improperly used by him contributed greatly to his death.
I often wondered how CART's Texas 2001 race would have gone. Las Vegas 2011 gave me a pretty good indication. The banking's too high for 230mph+ open wheelers. Even if the G's were not the problem, there is a point when great racing becomes ludicrously dangerous and that point is four-wide, on a 24-degree oval, at 230mph+, in an open wheeler. There's a line between these drivers RISKING their lives and GAMBLING with it. Texas '01 and Vegas '11 cross that line. The danger level is just too much.
Thank god for the drivers at cart 2001 season. Unfortunately, Dan wheldon wasnt lucky.
well they would have knocked themself out after about 20 laps, so every long green run would end in a horrible crash!
When irl ran at Vegas in the 90s the track was different.. Lot less banking. Was actually a little wider than it was in 2011
2011 should’ve not happened in general if they cancelled that race Dan would still be here.
Driven came out the same weekend...what a horrible weekend for CART. That movie killed the series.
Cancelling the race was the right call given the information they had BUT, CART were just way too arrogant and stupid in their preparation. They had been in this game long enough to know that you need to be prepared.
Thats some Final Destination shit, its like the CART tragedy was averted and passed on to the Columbia mission.
Me and my dad were there for that cart race, paid good money for grand stand tickets and when the race was called we didn't even get a refund for the tickets, this was the start of the end of CART racing sadly.
According to Texas Motor Speedway at the time, they had asked CART if they needed more testing to go ahead and do all the testing they needed. CART refused to do additional testing, while promising TMS that the race would happen. CART's disorganization is what led to their collapse. Tony George wasn't exactly organized either, but it wasn't a total mess unlike this.
This should of happen at vegas last year to fast and way to many cars if that happen im pretty sure Dan Wheldon would still be alive ....
They should have ran that race at Fontana or something Dan was one of my favorites I agree
if i remember correctly, CART ran a compatibility test in late 2000 after they released the initial 2001 schedule and the cars were running mid to high 220's, a little bit faster than the IRL cars of the time, but not by much. Unfortunately with chassis and engine development during the off-season that pushed the cars even faster.
TMS also had a repave between the initial tests and the race weekend. TMS also begged to retest in the lawsuit, but CART ignored them.
@@FMecha I did not know about the repave aspect .... Thanks for that
Given the circumstances, they had no choice but to cancel the race on short notice. Where CART went wrong was they didn't properly test at the track and have some sort of speed restricting system BEFORE the cars turned up in Fort Worth. Paul Tracey did a lap of 236.678 MPH in practice, and with the dramatic changes in banking on a 1.5 mile ovals is complete madness. Had they been able to keep speeds to the high 220's the race could have happen
11:23. Look at the guy falling on the right side of the screen
Well said!
It's like what Eddie Gossage said, it's too hot in Texas. They had PLENTY of time to test and prepare for this event. CART should have known. They have no one to blame but themselves for causing this to happen.
This is a really old comment, but for anyone reading this comment now, CART actually DID test. It's just that the testing speeds were much lower and so they deemed it would be safe. But when race week rolled around and all of the cars were in race trim, plus other factors mentioned in the video, the speeds were much higher than they ran in testing.
@@MrJohansen the teams in testing were running low boost and with high fuel loads to mask their true pace
That movie driven killed the series
+Milton Butler and Tony George's ego
And it was released the same weekend as this race.
That's what I thought when they said "STS-107." R.I.P. Dr. Brown.
And why Randy Bernard couldn't make this kinda annoucement at Vegas in 2011 I will never understand
+Austin Brooks Same here.
And the fact that Brian Barnhart blatantly ignored the drivers' concerns over this. Dan would be alive if TGBB hadn't have caused a mutiny against the drivers.
that weekend of starting 34 cars on a 1.5 track was a bad idea. #RIPDan
SaidHead2 yet Dan's ego should be blamed a bit too
Nobody knew that it would be a massive pack race until the green came out. Barely any cars ran together in practice, it was pretty much all single car runs. I've never seen anything like it, those first 12 laps.
If CART had tested this better and later rescheduled it after the cars were made safer, it would have been one hell of a race...
Had that happened and say they raced a year later Kenny Brack I still think would’ve won.
That guy with the announcers David Brown sadly was killed during the STS-107 flight
17:35 RIP David M Brown he died in the Space Shuttle Columbia disaster.
@azapro911 If you looked at the qualification and practice times for the supposed race. There are variations in lap times so you'll likely see the cars not racing close together than the IRL cars would. But then again we don't know what the racing looked like that day until I myself along with other gearheads were looking forward to see these cars race there and then we learned the consequences why they ended up canceling the race.
@schumacher180racing @azapro911
The problem in 2011 at Las Vegas was threefold: 1. The aero package that creates pack racing and these underpowered N/A cars = pack racing, 2. The race track added banking than the previous Open-Wheel event (CCWS), 3. The race had 34 race cars on a 1.5 mile track (at the time they were all running together NASCAR style which was extremely dangerous). That alone claimed the life of Dan Wheldon. IMO they should have run that special event at Auto Club than the shorter Las Vegas circuit.
Anyone realize they use Eddie Guererro's old theme song from WCW?
The interview with David Brown is a bit sad. He was apart of the Columbia space flight in January-February 2003 which broke up on re-entry and all crew on board were killed.
do u have the qualifying session of this
A CART deixou de existir por causa da incompetência de seus administradores, tinha grandes equipes e esses carros com esses motores V8 turbo eram espetaculares, até hoje não acredito que esses carros não são mais fabricados.
i miss CART, a shame this lawsuit helped end it. i remember watching this race, all weekend long during practices they were discussing the possibility of canceling because of the G's, i wasn't surprised, and honestly didn't care, i preferred the road races
Wow, dunno why I never heard about this before.
Wow. The astronaut they interview perished in the Columbia disaster.
7:45 - Chase sequence music from the Plumbers Don't Wear Ties video game.
A couple of years later there was a private test with an IRL team using one of the proposed engine formulas of the time where the average speed was 231MPH and no vertigo reported. In reality only a small change was needed to reduce the G's but CART always cared more about being "pure" than being reasonable.
Is this private test before or after the repave? Because the repave lowered the steepness of the banking, so going around at those speeds should probably be more reasonable than during the Firehawk 600.
problem with running the high downforce road-course package is that you would still be doing roughly 205-210mph or so, but the cars would be packed up like an IRL race ... imo the best recourse for CART would have been to remove The Hanford Device and kill the downforce and crank the boost UP to make the drivers have to lift off the throttle in the corners ... then again im no physicist
5:40 LOLZ at Pat Carpentier!
Obviously in that moment nothing could be done but do you think today with preparation like mandatory g suits and hick training would allow them to be able to handle it?
Typical Aggie answer.
Yea... Vegas should have been canceled too.. Everyone knew it was scary on Friday practice and said someone is gonna get hurt... Sure enough.....
It was a bit different.
Do you have the making of Driven that they had?
I watched Driven many times. It was awesome.
These cars were built for high speed , low banked tracks like Indy, Fontana, and Michigan...not slower speed, higher banked NASCAR type speedways.
Michigan has a 18 degrees banking and Fontana 14. They are not "low banked" track at all. Only TMS has a banking superior to 20 degrees. The IRL / IndyCar Series runs continuously at Texas since 1996 and didn't have any problems like this. TMS isn't a NASCAR speedway. It's multiseries race track, buit both for the IRL IndyCar Series and NASCAR. Both have participated into the funding to built this track.
@@clementgrevoul2627 let me rephrase that for him. texas had a higher banking AND was shorter, which seemed to be the problem. fontana and michigan weren't low banked but they were .5 longer which is enough time for drivers to recover from the g loading plus that 6 to 2 degrees difference in banking is A LOT when you're driving on it.
Does anybody have the Indy Lights race that ran this weekend? According to what I've seen, that was one of the Top 5 greatest AOWR Feeder oval races *EVER*.
I saw it once. Its been deleted.
Notice the fact that this race was supposed to take place after the premiere of the worst racing film ever, Driven...
I know this is going to sound like a rather redundant question, but WTF was up with 16:40?
they could have raced by just putting more drag on the car and just making it slower, C.A.R.T. was a great series and it should have continued today
If they'd done that it would've just been like Las Vegas 2011, pack racing with a lot of turbulant air. So, it might have been even more dangerous than running the cars in normal spec. It's a shame they found the limits of the human body there, would've been a blast to see these cars race on this track.
I'd say maybe lower the max RPMs and also lower the downforce
Why can't Indycar make the cars like they were in C.A.R.T. ? You would attract more fan base and more viewers like wtf
Agree with Raffini about putting more drag on the car - maybe take some downforce out, and also lower the boost threshold as well. These cars were running with 37 (?) inches of boost before the pop-off valve went. If that had been lowered to maybe 32 or 33 inches, would that have worked?
Sure, Eddie-you don't want to place the drivers at unnecessary risk. Weren't you the guy who just three years before answered NASCAR driver complaints with the statement "Shut up and race"?
almostfm indycars crashing and stock cars crashing are a bit different
Imagine if this race did happen. No one went more than 40-50 laps without feeling light-headed and dizzy due to the massive G forces. Some drivers even feared someone could pass out by the way. So anyway, they race, and in typical flat out oval fashion, it's a big pack of cars inches apart. 50 or so laps in, the mental strain and physical strain is affecting everyone. Suddenly, one driver, for whatever reason, touches another going through a corner. In just a few seconds, you have a crash that makes Vegas in 2011 look like a Hollywood stunt. Doesn't matter how big of balls you have, it's a massive death trap if this were to happen.
Also Scott Roembke died too in 2012.
IndyCar should have listened like CART did for Vegas and we know what happened then.
I love Cart. But i hate the IRL. Please bring back CART! ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆
Modern Indycar is closer to CART than the IRL. I'm not sure if you watch anymore, but you should, it's good stuff.
Sorry but what happened in Las Vegas 2011 was just bad luck for our good friend Dan Wheldon. They were still in a pack but hey it was lap 10? Things already started to sort out and after so many IRL races in Texas, Charlotte, Chicagoland, Kentucky and to call the others it always went right, even when the series ran at Vegas from 1996 until 2000.
It's the other way around. IndyCar was lucky losing only one driver in Vegas. It was close to be much worse!
R.I.P Joseph Heitzler.
If only it was possible for the human body to tolerate those g-forces... it would have been a spectacular race!
Oh well, for safety's sake, it was probably for the best.
I don't mind the fact that they cancelled the race for safety concerns, but don't you think it's irresponsible to bring this stuff up AFTER they schedule a race?
I mean, considering that CART is a multi-million dollar operation, this is something you think would have been brought up and investigated before they actually scheduled the event, especially when you consider the indirect costs incurred on teams, fans (travel expenses), vendors, and local businesses.
Had the cars featured some less horsepower (like 650-700). the speeds would have had a good compromise. That being said, 900 horsepower on a 1700 pound chassis with those G forces would have been disastrous.
Why they didn't install a chicane or 2 on the backstretch the morning of the race I'll never understand. Not ideal but they still could have put on a race and avoided legal trouble. Could have set out some barricades and given some practice sessions & then race.
if only they canceled Vegas. But when BB is in charge you should expect the worst
moron
I'm so glad that asshole is gone never liked him since I was a kid and started watching in 2001 i saw him at Indy in 2012 was wearing a Dan Wheldon tribute shirt I made I swear we made eye contact gave him the one finger salute
20:55 I think Paul almost passed out again from the Gs in the broadcast booth.
No he didn’t you liar
@@taylorsmith9629 sarcasm isn't your thing, bro
It's weird the computer projections had lower speed projections than the IRL.
Sabotage?
@@taylorsmith9629 probably not
@@penskepc2374 then why did you imply it?
@@taylorsmith9629 I didn't. You're just not intelligent
I don’t blame Texas Motor Speedway, I blame Hulk Hogan.
To cancel this CART race was a huge mistake, inevitable and their own fault. TMS request around a thousand times to test there before they're going to race. They never wanted to test there before the race weekend and you see what happened. I'm glad Eddie Gossage sued them, it was a stupid mistake by their selves.
It wasn't the mistake. The mistake was coming unprepared. They could have slowed down the cars by 11 to 13mph with some air intake restrictors or restricting the turbo bost even more.
At 224mph average you can race easily on that track. At 236, you can't.
Or perhaps they could ask about some equipment to help drivers avoid gray out and race at 228mph.
@@therrydicule no, he's right. The only driver to test there was Kenny Brack for Rahal Letterman, in December, and only a handful of laps topping out at avg. 206 mph. Rahal was also the acting CEO of CART at the time. Sounds sketchy to me
They did test earlier but they were sandbagging
@@AlonsoRules idk if they were sandbagging or not, but TMS repaved after the test which likely prompted them to ask CART to retest.
Indy Racing League (Now the NTT IndyCar Series) didn’t have a problem with that
They weren’t running 230 to 250 top speeds.
The IRL was running quite a lot slower, so is Indycar Now
The IRL was 15mph slower
they should have put the large high downforce wings and let them race!! CART shot themselves in the foot
Since then, CART/Champ Car started to die... slowly :'(
The teams could've easily adjusted the gear ratios and gone around the turns at 200mph or even 180mph instead I'm just saying.
Then they would be redlining like absolute hell. These cars were just way too fast for a track like that and there was nothing they couldve done or change that would’ve qualified as “racing”
...Oi tdbem?
Vamos dar uma de jack estripador kkk
Por partes...
1. Houve corrida da CART no circuito TEXAS IRL em 2001?
2. Essa prova fazia part do calendario da CART 2001?
Cm a RECORDTV na época não mostrou pra o Brasil EU SINCERAMENT NAO VI?
3. Essa prova valia pela CART?
TODOS CART Correram?
Correu alguem IRL Com carro CART
quantos correram?
Quem ganhou?
POE A CORRIDA COMPLETA PRA GENT RELEMBRAR PORQUE COM CERTEZA EU NAO VI
SE POR NO RUclips
EU VOU TENTAR GRAVAR OK?
FICAREI MTO FELIZ
FICAREI AGUARDANDO
DESD JA
ABRC FORT
FELIZ2020 AMGS
ATEMAIS
Não houve corrida.
The death of Dale Earnhardt at Daytona just 2 months prior scared the hell out of all of the drivers in every motorsport league.
moron
well that is true, but it isnt the cause, the thing is there is barely any time to recover from the g force
Different situation but sure
This was teh day CART died. Because of this it went bankrupt.
this was such a massive misstep by CART. Sorry but I dont believe that with all the technical minds in the paddock at that time they couldn't figure out a way to slow the cars down by 15-20 mph. Such a fail
Sure you could slow the cars down. But at that time, CART was straight up *competing* with the IRL, and had staked the claim of being faster and more powerful cars with the best drivers. To slow the cars would have been a PR nightmare for CART. The competition between the two series was intense and played out week to week.
Nascar at Fontana that day was better
And Okay, I admit, I already became an IRL fan since the first race in 1996 but watched CART as well until 2001 but the cancellation of this race and the shortened Fontana race, led me to leave the sport after 2001 and fully concentrate me on IRL of course besides F1.
The race which began the fall of CART
Stupid people need to stop saying Wheldon got killed because the track was too fast. He got killed because open-wheel cars didn't have the halo yet and people were still dying on the regular from preventable impacts to the driver's head. The roll loop wasn't enough - HANS wasn't enough. Everybody knew it, because people kept dying. The list of these deaths is massive, starting all the way back with Tom Price vs. fire extinguisher at Kyalami in '77.
I wonder if Grosjean had decapitated himself people would still be shrieking about the track instead of the need for a halo...
Just add a couple chicanes and race!
The cars are meant for ovals so the cars couldnt do a chicane
Who’s that chick 23:00?
Reasonable People : You can just add more drag or put a restrictor on the motor
CART : Nah, we'll just cancel the most anticipated CART Race in years for no reason.
You couldn't just slap a restrictor plate on a indycar on a whim that weekend. They didn't have other option to create more drag either.
The only reason why Dan Wheldon is dead is because some idiot didn't want to stay in the upper groove. Don't get me wrong, that race with 33 cars is irresponsibly dangerous, but all it took was for one guy to turn down at the absolute wrong time.
Drivers are some of the dumbest smart people on the planet. They have the ability to just lift or use the brakes but all it takes I'd that 1 guy to flat foot it for a lap and then they all have to.
Should have bricked the cars up aero wise to slow them down.
They tried the Hanford device but it didnt help much, slowed them down about 20 MPH but when your talking about 250 MPH laps a 20 MPH decrease isnt that helpful
Rubbing is racing.
99 cent McChicken
5+ Gs with no rest is something a human being cant deal with, regardless of strength. Drivers would pass out and in a pack of 20+ Cars at 230 with no SAFER Barriers that would kill drivers, the track and the series
Verdigo my ass.
The human body cant deal with 4+ Gs with no recovery time. Multiple Drivers would have died because they didnt have SAFER Barriers and Drivers would pass out from the G Force. They were pulling 230 MPH laps and if someone passed out it would have gone pretty fucking bad
yeah but even if the race was not cancelled and a driver had been killed, these drivers get in the car every weekend knowing that what they do is dangerous , but the passion and love for racing outwieghs the risks, i just came from the 2013 INDYCAR race at texas and the cars still approaced 230.00 on the straights, i think this race was cancelled due to political reasons and cart told the drivers to go along with bullshit they had made up to cancel the race
Formula 1 cars generate 5+ Gs during cornering and braking
did you watch the full video?
Formula 1 doesn't have ovals, 24 degree banking, and 5+ g-forces for a sustained period of time. It's not a fair comparison. Many F1 drivers are afraid of oval racing.
They are not sustained g-forces over the course of 2+ hours. Major difference.
Yep, almost peaking at 7Gs in F1 now, for a couple of seconds at the very most though, that makes a MAJOR difference.
F1 cars only have around 5-6 G-Forces for around 1 second under heavy braking. Only a handful of corners in F1 have that load, which is a fraction of a second. To have over 5Gs almost the whole time you are racing for 2 hours. No human can handle that pressure for that time. Not only that but to manoeuvre around cars and try escape any errors or incidents is ridiculous under those loads. Its basically a suicide mission.
Cart Was A Terrible Series
Do you miss the irl loser.
@@scoobyruuuu I Would Take The Irl Over Shitty Ass Racing Teams