If only we would actually USE nuclear energy, instead of sitting around saying. "oh, we need a more efficient energy source!" Seriously, one ton of coal produces around 2500 kwh, and one ton of uranium produces MILLIONS of kwh. As long as we contain the waste, there is nothing wrong with nuclear power plants. And if we find out how to create and efficient nuclear fusion plant, there is no long-term waste
@@kalesauce9529 Yeah, that would be a good example of NOT containing the waste. However, if we continued to develop nuclear energy at the rate that we were back then, maybe accidents such as that would happen less often. We could also only create power plants in remote areas, so that if there was an accident, the repercussions would be far smaller. By the way, search up MIT's new SPARC fusion reactor. It looks pretty interesting.
@@anunayy Yeah, it does produce pollution, but I am just suggesting we switch to nuclear energy for now, until non-polluting energy sources become much more efficient and sustainable. Plus, compared to the coal industry, I think it is worth it, considering the amount of energy that comes out of it.
The design of this craft is truly alien. I can’t wait to see a new generation of heat shield spaceplanes! And I don’t think use of this design will eliminate traditional spaceplanes, I think most players will prefer wings for any application where extreme performance isn’t necessary. Eve-Jool-Laythe SSTA grand tour, anyone?
I'm working on something cool right now... Look forward to seeing it next week! I agree that most people won't use this. I'm more concerned about record holding crafts, like what Bradley Whistance does on his channel.
I discovered it through a prototype rocket that I was making for my 33 seconds to orbit video. There, I noticed that the heat shields were producing lift, despite being covered on both nodes. Then, I tried to use it as a wing and then saw its ridiculous L/D ratio. The rest is history from there! I know its been a while since then. Due to real life and other KSP projects, I haven't gotten around to making a video on it until now.
@@omnithea I'll be honest, I didn't like it very much at first. When I started building with it and saw just how ridiculous it was, I thought it was just too much. I didn't want to open this can of worms and see every high performance mission turn into a ball of heat shields. The reason I'm coming back to this is because some other people started to figure it out and so it would only be a matter of time before it became widely known. Might as well make something interesting with it! I'm warming up more to it. I think people will make the missions that will be fun to them. Most people won't use this tech because of how much of an exploit it is, much like how most people don't use a ton of clipping in their designs. I'm planning to do some missions with this. It is a pretty interesting bug and so deserves some more exploration.
@@joshw1526 pffffffff xenon. you would be totally fine with using a vector. save yourself the time and pain. he did say you only need a little "puff" (get it, puff? monoprop puff engine? XD. I guess you can use that too) to get to orbit, so f the efficiency. I just realized you probably meant a kerbin-eve shuttle and not an eve-eve station shuttle lol. so you can probably ignore that.
Is this a new exploit, or do you think it’s been there ever since heatshields were introduced? This type of exploitation reminds me favourably of stuff like the insane strategies used in Mario 64 speedruns and challenges. It’s not to that level, and the game is still being updated of course, but it’s so cool to see new ways of tearing the game apart.
I think this was in the game for a very long time. Its just until now that we figured it out. I actually first discovered this around the launch of my 33 second to orbit video (funny enough, it was playing with heatsheilds for that video that clued me into this!). Due to real life and other projects, I didn't get around to it until now.
@@Stratzenblitz75 You know it's funny, back when the game was in beta (which was honestly when I did the majority of my ksp play), I feel like there were way more people picking apart the aerodynamic model and really experimenting with the physics engine. That was back in the hayday of spaceplanes, intake stacking and whatnot. These days, people mostly expect the aero model to act perfectly realistically, but as we know, it is far from perfect. Congratulations on your discovery! You are again, boldly going where no kerbalnaut has gone before!
I nominate the term “Stratzen Drive” to define the use of this tech and differentiate it from the normal lifting surfaces in honor of one of the most innovative KSP players out there. Well done as always, sir!
I second this. Any non-traditional propellor should be called a Stratzen drive from now on (except that mechanical plane that used the power of the narrow-band ore scanner’s rotation to drive props. That is a class of its own.)
I really love how alien this is. It really wouldn't make any sense ouside of ksp. Propably we will one day meet an advanced civilization with crafts looking confusing in the same way - powered by exploiting physics to a degree we dont understand. I'm curious what kind of bugs the real universe has :P
If simulation theory turns out to be true, it's not outside the realm of possibility aliens turn up in some kraken engined or heatshield lifted craft :x
@@enderger5308 The stock ablator in KSP burns off so slowly that, when you combine it with the already high base heat tolerance of the part even at 0 ablator, you'll probably be able to do at least one full lap around kerbin before heating even becomes an issue
@@richardmillhousenixon That's the joke: That they actually burned all their ablator (which never happens because the game's default quantities are... generous).
I think that this should be in its own category. Otherwise, comparing these "heat shield planes" to traditional craft is like comparing a cellphone to a messenger.
Stratz last year: After lots of thinking and difficulty, I threw a small pizza into space using jet engines and a giant catapult Stratz today: I CAN HAS HEET SHEILD PROPLR INTO SPACE
Theres room for everything in this game. Heat shield lift surfaces / magic wings are ridiculous, and I support people doing ridiculous things. Whatever is enjoyable and interesting is worthwhile, and this video was that. With that said, I personally consider them to be outside of the primary canon of KSP advancement.
The fact that you have to drop it to get enough speed to fly reminds me of that scene in one of the new Star Trek movies(I forget which one) where they had to fall off of a cliff to get their ship(the Franklin) to fly. Amazing video, as always!
honestly dude how big is your brain? next thing we know is that by 2023 your going mach 9.6 just by useing wheels ._.' *also can you put a station in deep space?*
The fun of games like ksp is their ability to simulate real world situations in a simplified and exaggerated form. Some exploits like clipping thousands of engines together allow the player to bypass the limits of the game to create things that still fit in to the theme of the game. A hypothetical SUPER rocket fits into the theme, but the devs did not include it. The heat shield exploit however... is VERY outside the theme to the point of it ruining the feel of a space sim. I think the heat sheild poses a dangersous threat to the ksp creator world. I’m reminded of besieged where the steam marketplace was dominated by builds that used so many mods, bugs, and cheats that it destroyed most of the communities interest in the game. Now obviously ksp is a much more robust game with a more solid community so it isn’t at the same risk.. but the sentiment holds true. This is probably the ONLY heat shield plane that would ever interest me. Any more would get dull fast.
Thanks for your thoughts. I feel a similar way to this: I feel a lot of the fun of KSP is being lost in aero exploits. Its gotten to the point where I'm enjoying playing without occlusion and clipping at all. This tech makes this even worse. Basically, every space plane is going to degenerate to a fairing with heat sheild wings and a ton of clipping if you want maximum performance. I'm planning to make another video to show how far you could push this, but not too much more than that. Its a curious bug, but as I said, I'd hate to see every design use it.
@@Stratzenblitz75 I think it would be ideal to go both ways at the same time; missions with minimal clipping or exploits, and then completely bonkers alien-tech missions with vehicles that use heat shield wings and props and kraken drives for scooting around in space. The former shows off design skill in a way analogous to what can happen in real life, and the latter shows off a sort of meta-design aspect, seeing just how far the game can be pushed if you're willing to go crazy with it.
Me, a person who has only ever played vanilla KSP (+ DLC) with a couple of small info/helper mods and a bit of added prettiness (KER, KAC, scatterer, planetshine) and only uses part clipping in a way that could actually be engineered to work in the real world (e.g. building a probe core or battery bank into the void between the ends of two fuel tanks): "KSP gets LESS fun as you wander further away from reality? OH NOES!!" I guess my point is that one of the greatest things about the game is the freedom to play it entirely your own way. I'm constantly amazed at the creations showcased by guys like Scott, Shadowzone and Brad, which tend to keep part clipping and exploits to a minimum (okay, Brad likes to bend the rules a bit, but considering what he's done with pure stock non-exploited crafts he's earned that right in my book!). The things that Stratz comes up with are something else entirely, but I get just as much enjoyment from seeing what the game engine will allow at the extreme end of Kerbal engineering prowess, and his relentless pursuit of exploits and weird physics behaviours have actually pushed me to be more creative when I'm building crafts in my own much more conventional style. TL;DR - there's no way to play this game "wrong", it's all about what you consider to be allowable in your own particular Kerbal Universe, and honestly, the number of games (or other forms of entertainment) that applies to is pretty damn small. That's a big part of what makes it great, and part of the reason we'll be celebrating the 10th Anniversary next year. Just my 2c as always. 😁
@@TheToric FAR is on CKAN right? I love building crazy in-atmo stuff (bought a full HOTAS setup mostly for stunt flying and general jet-based silliness) but as you say, stock aero is far from perfect and I've been meaning to check out FAR. Unfortunately I'm currently stuck on an OLD i7 laptop so I'm hoping it's not particularly CPU-intensive, the old girl gets hot enough as it is... :)
Disagree. This is perfectly energy and momentum conserving. There's no magic thrust. It's definitely very broken, but it's no K-drive. Arguably it's less unrealistic than reaction wheels (no conservation of angular momentum) and the Breaking Ground prop blades (free energy).
They should keep all of the cool bugs and their associated physics in the game, but have them become a toggle "UFOs Enabled". It would just swap patched stuff out for unpatched stuff, minus the strictly detrimental bugs.
With your knowledge of exploits and creativity, you're pretty much my favorite KSP youtuber out there. I absolutely love the designs you make. It seems that the designs don't take in account any aesthetics but mostly functionality, and as such they actually do have an aesthetic to them. They look so alien, fantasy like and it really offers a different view and aspect on spacecrafts, and they can be really cool sources of inspiration. My favorite of your designs is the Jt0-8000, the way it looks so sleek and the way it uses rotation, it just makes this craft really unique and interesting.
I think this kind of exploit should be considered a separate category when making competition aircrafts. It was not meant to be used in this way in the game so I think using it in career is also kinda of cheating.
Reach, Bradley, Stratenblitz, and Turbopowered, SW Dennis seems to do an arms race to become ksp God But don't forget the manifestation of kraken itself, the great lord DANNY and his assistant NEXTRE Labs whom none can surpass
Update: I've tried it and it didn't work. nose cones remove the drag but not the lift just as you said but there is downforce instead of uplift, showing as body lift (aka light blue arrows in GUI) through the ground no matter where I place them. Version info: KSP 1.4.5 Stock Size Real Solar System
I have to disagree, I see these "bugs" as just part of the kerbal universe which, once discovered and mastered, should be exploited to their fullest. I often think of the quote "Any sufficiently advanced technology is Indistinguishable from magic" by Arthur C. Clarke when I see things like this. I believe the ksp community has simply reached an extremely advanced level to the point where we should be able to make things like what you see in this video without guilt or question. Who knows what crazy technology will be discovered next?
I'd definitely throw this in the "kraken drive" category. I'd love to see the new stuff it'll make possible, but it would be a shame for it to supplant existing challenges.
i am really happy with these more frequent uploads, you've managed to do something smaller but impressive while retaining what makes this channel unique. keep it up!
wierdly enough, this is not a bug, some heat shields produce lift in real life, the soyuz capsule, for example, uses this lift to steer itself through the atmosphere to ensure the safety of the crew and a more precise landing(I do believe idoes not produce as much lift as it does in the game though).
Sure, but occlusion removing the drag without removing the lift definitely is a bug. The lift to drag (un-occluded) from stock heatshields is actually pretty accurate.
I'm currently playing in 1.11 and want to test my creativity with the heat shield wings, but they just aren't producing any lift (according to f12 aerodynamic display and flight preformance). Was the effectiveness of the heat shield as lifting bodies reduced as a fix of sorts in the 1.11 update?
This is the endgame tech. Actually, you could have an array of mods that fix KSP's physics errors and turn them off as you tech up to simulate advanced new parts.
I think it's fine to count this as a stock propeller, and make it a record holder. I initially thought that this shouldn't be the case, but since prop records have been held by part clipped and offset craft in the past, I don't think this should count as "different." As unfair as it may seem to other record holders, it's using the same methods, but with different parts.
Welp, time for me to make a low speed Zompi-powered heatshield carrier or something XD This stuff is already visibly in a class of its own, its so far beyond wings that nobody who plays KSP could even see them in an apples-to-apples comparison, its absurd, its awesome, its hilarious and amazing at the same time, but its so overpowered that anyone can admit these alien designs are in a special class alongside Zompi drives and Kraken engines, or external-command-seat-landing-gear and reverse-thrust-rocket-fuel-regenerators, or the classic neutron-star-density-of-clipped-parts. I'm of course gonna use it since I love these absurd exploits, but for real challenges I'm gonna be a by-the-books, "does this work in real life?" kinda guy. But thanks Stratz, this was epic to watch :P
The year is 2050. Stratz discovers a real life physics exploit allowing interstellar travel within our lifetimes. Stratz rubs his hands in expectation: "Yes... now that I'm a kajillionaire I have more time to play KSP 5!"
Hello! I want to suggest you an interesting challenge you've probably never made or thought about. The main goal is to destruct every building and runway of the Mission Control Center in ONE launch (or fall, of course)
"In Kerbal Space Program, take charge of the space program for the alien race known as the Kerbals. You have access to an array of parts to assemble fully-functional spacecraft that flies (or doesn’t) based on realistic aerodynamic and orbital physics."
Concerning whether or not this counts as a propeller craft, I'd say we should just make a separate "glitches" category and lump this in with the Kraken drive.
Heat shields produce lift because they push the air to the side and Scott Manley talked about this Btw how did you generate that INSANE almount of electric charge?
In real life, that makes sense. But KSP has an odd aerodynamic model (as you can see in the video) so its surprising to me when certain parts have a lot of lift (like heat shields). Landing gear also have a lot of lift as well: you can get pretty high L/D ratios with just landing gears angled at 45 degrees. Its not quite as good as the heat shields, but its very interesting nonetheless.
I was playing around with a craft that had heat shields. I don't remember exactly, but I think it was a prototype for my 33 second to orbit video. There, I noticed the heat shields were still producing lift even though they were "inline" and got the idea to make wings with them. The rest is history. Even my early attempts with them were amazing. I made an Eve ssto using only Nervas and props with them: their L/D was just so good. I'm planning to play around with the tech more in the future!
Ive made a stock jet propelled craft that had to hold below level to stay in the atmosphere. It was quite silly looking as i had 8 ram air intakes per engine.
One of the most important things for my planes in ksp is for them to look really cool. A bunch of heat shields looks hideous so I’ll never use this tech
Well damn, guess it's time to abuse KSP physics like the good old days. Can't wait to see what KSP 2 is gonna have in terms of fun and interesting game-breaking bugs like this.
I use a lot of mods - key piece of information. My absolute best plane is fast - even for mods - and lasts forever using M.A.R.G.E engines from OPT and a nuclear reactor. At 45% throttle and at 11km, it cruises around 1300m/s. I have to lower the throttle or it literally burns up in the atmosphere. You've made a ***stock aircraft*** that doesn't burn up and goes almost 2x the speed whilst lasting forever... insanity.
This is absolutely amazing. If this stays in the game till the summer break (for Southern Hemisphere dwellers) I will have a lot of fun. And I really hope it does. It seems like one of those things that will never be game breaking because it is so absurd, and since the only competitive play is already checked for these sorts of things (and that this is obvious) it should ne fine. Honestly I love the lift mechanic on the heat shields and I want it to stay. Also, does this work with other lift generating parts? iirc the mk2 parts also generate lift.
Thanks for your thoughts on this! There are a few parts that have unusually high L/D ratios. Landing gear are one of them interestingly enough. Mk2 parts do not work to my knowledge.
My opinion: use it in conjunction with regular lifting surfaces to make extremely efficient and effective aircraft. Imagine how this will revolutionalize stealth aircraft in BDA, they’ll be able to fly higher and faster than ever. Or SSTOs, as shown here: imagine a colony aircraft going between Eve and Kerbin and picking up modules using only xenon and heat shield tech. You could even make highly efficient hydrofoils for attempting the sea speed record!
If it can be feasibly done IRL, it's legit for KSP with some margin for error. If not, then it's an unintended bug. Since KSP is trying to emulate real life physics, it's simply not right for something that obviously won't work IRL to be considered legit in KSP. Now, since KSP is a game you have to inevitably have some flexibility, but this heat shield wing violates several laws of aerodynamics.
Yep, definitely kraken drive level. I really wish this game did a better job of calculating part occlusion. I like trying to make really big cargo planes with custom loading ramps using the robotics parts, but the game considers any vehicle or cargo you put inside as being outside the plane (and therefore super draggy), and also tries to rip open your cargo ramp. The cargo ramps and cargo doors can also negatively impact control, and also cause a ton of drag. Super annoying. I'll go check out Bradley's video. I've been trying to use prop tech for a while now to make an Eve SSTO, without much success.
Personally, I believe that this should be in a separate category where bugs, or glitches, are the main theme of KSP tech, alike the Kraken Drive you mentioned. Bugs or glitches in the game can surely make impressive craft, but they will feel weird, or unfair compared to impressive craft that follow the rules or boundaries in a mindset that's bug/glitch free. A kraken drive has unlimited Delta V, if it was to fly against actual engineered SSTOs, it'd wipe the table with an unfair bug. Maybe a glitch/bug competition should be a thing now?
Holy shit! This can be used for so much! Maybe on a bigger scale, you can take a large cargo into orbit for basically free. Then, you might be able to do an eve or tylo unrefueled ssto!
this must've been how people felt when they discovered nuclear energy. "This is broken, is it even fair to use this?"
If only we would actually USE nuclear energy, instead of sitting around saying. "oh, we need a more efficient energy source!" Seriously, one ton of coal produces around 2500 kwh, and one ton of uranium produces MILLIONS of kwh. As long as we contain the waste, there is nothing wrong with nuclear power plants. And if we find out how to create and efficient nuclear fusion plant, there is no long-term waste
@@benlandete8397 laughs in chernobyl
@@kalesauce9529 coughs in pollution
@@kalesauce9529 Yeah, that would be a good example of NOT containing the waste. However, if we continued to develop nuclear energy at the rate that we were back then, maybe accidents such as that would happen less often. We could also only create power plants in remote areas, so that if there was an accident, the repercussions would be far smaller. By the way, search up MIT's new SPARC fusion reactor. It looks pretty interesting.
@@anunayy Yeah, it does produce pollution, but I am just suggesting we switch to nuclear energy for now, until non-polluting energy sources become much more efficient and sustainable. Plus, compared to the coal industry, I think it is worth it, considering the amount of energy that comes out of it.
The design of this craft is truly alien. I can’t wait to see a new generation of heat shield spaceplanes!
And I don’t think use of this design will eliminate traditional spaceplanes, I think most players will prefer wings for any application where extreme performance isn’t necessary. Eve-Jool-Laythe SSTA grand tour, anyone?
I'm working on something cool right now... Look forward to seeing it next week!
I agree that most people won't use this. I'm more concerned about record holding crafts, like what Bradley Whistance does on his channel.
@@Stratzenblitz75 I think they should make a separate category for heat shield spacecraft
SingleStageToAnywhere?
Why does everyone forget Duna? That's got an atmosphere too
But... with this design, where will I mount the control surfaces, and the air brakes? I also have a habit of mounting engines on wings...
Oh No. Here we go. He's done the impossible again.
@He who will Definitely be named I think I'll definitely use this exploit for ridiculous designs.
It´s not impossible, it´s necessary
@@julianmedinam8933 ruclips.net/video/XrmffnHdYwc/видео.html
I can only wonder what series of events led to this discovery.
I discovered it through a prototype rocket that I was making for my 33 seconds to orbit video. There, I noticed that the heat shields were producing lift, despite being covered on both nodes. Then, I tried to use it as a wing and then saw its ridiculous L/D ratio. The rest is history from there!
I know its been a while since then. Due to real life and other KSP projects, I haven't gotten around to making a video on it until now.
@@Stratzenblitz75 I can't believe you were able to contain this incredible knowledge for so long! The self control required must've been ridiculous.
@@omnithea I'll be honest, I didn't like it very much at first. When I started building with it and saw just how ridiculous it was, I thought it was just too much. I didn't want to open this can of worms and see every high performance mission turn into a ball of heat shields.
The reason I'm coming back to this is because some other people started to figure it out and so it would only be a matter of time before it became widely known. Might as well make something interesting with it!
I'm warming up more to it. I think people will make the missions that will be fun to them. Most people won't use this tech because of how much of an exploit it is, much like how most people don't use a ton of clipping in their designs.
I'm planning to do some missions with this. It is a pretty interesting bug and so deserves some more exploration.
@@Stratzenblitz75 It's the ORB, stratz, it's haunting you
@@wretlaw1203 😁
I guess we will have unrefueled Eve + Jool sea-level SSTO soon. Would love to see it)
Yes! I may or may not be working on that right now :P
If it it's too easy, do both in the same misson!
You could use it as a fully reusable Eve SSTO shuttle, it only needs to mine for a bit of Xenon and then it's good to go again!
@@joshw1526 pffffffff xenon. you would be totally fine with using a vector. save yourself the time and pain. he did say you only need a little "puff" (get it, puff? monoprop puff engine? XD. I guess you can use that too) to get to orbit, so f the efficiency.
I just realized you probably meant a kerbin-eve shuttle and not an eve-eve station shuttle lol. so you can probably ignore that.
@@joshw1526 You can't mine for Xenon, can you?
Is this a new exploit, or do you think it’s been there ever since heatshields were introduced?
This type of exploitation reminds me favourably of stuff like the insane strategies used in Mario 64 speedruns and challenges. It’s not to that level, and the game is still being updated of course, but it’s so cool to see new ways of tearing the game apart.
I think this was in the game for a very long time. Its just until now that we figured it out.
I actually first discovered this around the launch of my 33 second to orbit video (funny enough, it was playing with heatsheilds for that video that clued me into this!). Due to real life and other projects, I didn't get around to it until now.
@@Stratzenblitz75 You know it's funny, back when the game was in beta (which was honestly when I did the majority of my ksp play), I feel like there were way more people picking apart the aerodynamic model and really experimenting with the physics engine. That was back in the hayday of spaceplanes, intake stacking and whatnot. These days, people mostly expect the aero model to act perfectly realistically, but as we know, it is far from perfect.
Congratulations on your discovery! You are again, boldly going where no kerbalnaut has gone before!
I nominate the term “Stratzen Drive” to define the use of this tech and differentiate it from the normal lifting surfaces in honor of one of the most innovative KSP players out there. Well done as always, sir!
I second this. Any non-traditional propellor should be called a Stratzen drive from now on (except that mechanical plane that used the power of the narrow-band ore scanner’s rotation to drive props. That is a class of its own.)
How about stratzen lifting surface for a more general name
That sounds like something out of a sci-fi film/novel. I love it.
Could we compact these so-called "stratzen drives" to a rather small size and use the engine plate fairing zero drag technique to make a micro-ssto?
I really love how alien this is. It really wouldn't make any sense ouside of ksp. Propably we will one day meet an advanced civilization with crafts looking confusing in the same way - powered by exploiting physics to a degree we dont understand. I'm curious what kind of bugs the real universe has :P
If simulation theory turns out to be true, it's not outside the realm of possibility aliens turn up in some kraken engined or heatshield lifted craft :x
@@Soken50 "Brooo, you guys haven't even figured out the infinite reverse drag glitch yet????"
Then a thousand years later, we finally figure out the physics behind it, and realize that it’s not a bug, it’s a feature!
oh my god. this is amazing!
@@jadennelson7886 No, he just comments on videos he doesnt watch
@@jadennelson7886 I am joking, ofcourse
I swear me and you have the same taste in videos I’ve seen you comment everywhere I go lmao even other categories of vids like politics!
was ich sehe dich hier schon wieder?? xD
“Everywhere i go, i see his face.”
those 'designs' look more and more alien/extra-dimensional.
That wouldn't be because they're made-up, right?
This man... He used the most obscure part as a wing, and made it insanely efficient!
I mean heatshields aren't really that obscure, they're kinda needed for any capsule re-entering from all but the lowest orbits
*Cough* skipping reentry.
Yeah, heatshields without any ablator left.
@@enderger5308 The stock ablator in KSP burns off so slowly that, when you combine it with the already high base heat tolerance of the part even at 0 ablator, you'll probably be able to do at least one full lap around kerbin before heating even becomes an issue
@@richardmillhousenixon That's the joke: That they actually burned all their ablator (which never happens because the game's default quantities are... generous).
I love that this game still has bugs, known since the early days and are only now being used and exploited
I mean those aren't rly bugs. Just simplified physics in base game
Honestly every time you talked about "magic wings" I thiught it was some super complicated maneuver but that is REALLY simple. I'm impressed!
I think that this should be in its own category. Otherwise, comparing these "heat shield planes" to traditional craft is like comparing a cellphone to a messenger.
Yes, I agree completely. While this tech is fun, not every mission should look like this.
@@Stratzenblitz75 This is like Danny's exploits - fun to watch, but living on its own world.
The question is: Where do you draw the line? Bradley and Stratzenblitz routinely use part clipping and other “unrealistic” tricks.
You know it’s a Stratzenblitz video when he just causally makes the craft orbital.
That's why my brain reads it as "StratoBlitz".
When he makes orbit in exotic ways
"Causally"? How would you even go orbital in a noncausal way? Time travel until the planet is in a different place?
@@yastreb. are you saying rockets dont use time travel for a maneuver node irl?!?!!! /s
That craft looks really sci-fi. I can imagine kerbals invading Earth with something like that.
i remember discovering that heat shields had wing area, and then failing at making a heatshield plane. Glad to see that concept become reality!
Stratz last year:
After lots of thinking and difficulty, I threw a small pizza into space using jet engines and a giant catapult
Stratz today:
I CAN HAS HEET SHEILD PROPLR INTO SPACE
Theres room for everything in this game. Heat shield lift surfaces / magic wings are ridiculous, and I support people doing ridiculous things. Whatever is enjoyable and interesting is worthwhile, and this video was that. With that said, I personally consider them to be outside of the primary canon of KSP advancement.
I think we'll be seeing some new last-minute entries into Bradley Whistance's canyon run using this!
The fact that you have to drop it to get enough speed to fly reminds me of that scene in one of the new Star Trek movies(I forget which one) where they had to fall off of a cliff to get their ship(the Franklin) to fly. Amazing video, as always!
It was ST-Beyond,the 3rd Kelvin timeline movie... hope this helped :)
honestly dude how big is your brain? next thing we know is that by 2023 your going mach 9.6 just by useing wheels ._.'
*also can you put a station in deep space?*
Biblically accurate propeller
The fun of games like ksp is their ability to simulate real world situations in a simplified and exaggerated form. Some exploits like clipping thousands of engines together allow the player to bypass the limits of the game to create things that still fit in to the theme of the game. A hypothetical SUPER rocket fits into the theme, but the devs did not include it. The heat shield exploit however... is VERY outside the theme to the point of it ruining the feel of a space sim. I think the heat sheild poses a dangersous threat to the ksp creator world. I’m reminded of besieged where the steam marketplace was dominated by builds that used so many mods, bugs, and cheats that it destroyed most of the communities interest in the game.
Now obviously ksp is a much more robust game with a more solid community so it isn’t at the same risk.. but the sentiment holds true. This is probably the ONLY heat shield plane that would ever interest me. Any more would get dull fast.
Thanks for your thoughts. I feel a similar way to this: I feel a lot of the fun of KSP is being lost in aero exploits. Its gotten to the point where I'm enjoying playing without occlusion and clipping at all.
This tech makes this even worse. Basically, every space plane is going to degenerate to a fairing with heat sheild wings and a ton of clipping if you want maximum performance.
I'm planning to make another video to show how far you could push this, but not too much more than that. Its a curious bug, but as I said, I'd hate to see every design use it.
@@Stratzenblitz75 I think it would be ideal to go both ways at the same time; missions with minimal clipping or exploits, and then completely bonkers alien-tech missions with vehicles that use heat shield wings and props and kraken drives for scooting around in space. The former shows off design skill in a way analogous to what can happen in real life, and the latter shows off a sort of meta-design aspect, seeing just how far the game can be pushed if you're willing to go crazy with it.
Me, a person who has only ever played vanilla KSP (+ DLC) with a couple of small info/helper mods and a bit of added prettiness (KER, KAC, scatterer, planetshine) and only uses part clipping in a way that could actually be engineered to work in the real world (e.g. building a probe core or battery bank into the void between the ends of two fuel tanks): "KSP gets LESS fun as you wander further away from reality?
OH NOES!!"
I guess my point is that one of the greatest things about the game is the freedom to play it entirely your own way. I'm constantly amazed at the creations showcased by guys like Scott, Shadowzone and Brad, which tend to keep part clipping and exploits to a minimum (okay, Brad likes to bend the rules a bit, but considering what he's done with pure stock non-exploited crafts he's earned that right in my book!). The things that Stratz comes up with are something else entirely, but I get just as much enjoyment from seeing what the game engine will allow at the extreme end of Kerbal engineering prowess, and his relentless pursuit of exploits and weird physics behaviours have actually pushed me to be more creative when I'm building crafts in my own much more conventional style.
TL;DR - there's no way to play this game "wrong", it's all about what you consider to be allowable in your own particular Kerbal Universe, and honestly, the number of games (or other forms of entertainment) that applies to is pretty damn small. That's a big part of what makes it great, and part of the reason we'll be celebrating the 10th Anniversary next year.
Just my 2c as always. 😁
@@Stratzenblitz75 ive swiched to FAR evers ince i realized how easy it is to break the stock aero.
@@TheToric FAR is on CKAN right? I love building crazy in-atmo stuff (bought a full HOTAS setup mostly for stunt flying and general jet-based silliness) but as you say, stock aero is far from perfect and I've been meaning to check out FAR. Unfortunately I'm currently stuck on an OLD i7 laptop so I'm hoping it's not particularly CPU-intensive, the old girl gets hot enough as it is... :)
I actually like the aesthetic that this produces as well, this craft looks very alien.
Yeah, this is so busted it falls into the docking port kraken drive category
Disagree. This is perfectly energy and momentum conserving. There's no magic thrust. It's definitely very broken, but it's no K-drive. Arguably it's less unrealistic than reaction wheels (no conservation of angular momentum) and the Breaking Ground prop blades (free energy).
@@petersmythe6462 well having practically 0 drag on an object that is ment to have loads of drag is fully broken imo, but still fun.
I love the docking port KD. I try to use it sparingly as it is like serious cheating, unless one thinks of it as the next step on the tech tree.
@@petersmythe6462 or the narrow-band scanner (free energy from rotation, someone made a fully mechanical plane with it!)
Another epic chapter in the long history of Stratzenblitz flexing on the rest of the KSP community.
woah cool! can u make a stock propeller plane to laythe? that would be cool :D
Certainly! This tech has some incredible potential.
@@Stratzenblitz75 YAS
OH NO
heheheeee
To Jool...
Sea level!
They should keep all of the cool bugs and their associated physics in the game, but have them become a toggle "UFOs Enabled". It would just swap patched stuff out for unpatched stuff, minus the strictly detrimental bugs.
My man making biblically-accurate new angels for Shinji to fight lol
With your knowledge of exploits and creativity, you're pretty much my favorite KSP youtuber out there. I absolutely love the designs you make. It seems that the designs don't take in account any aesthetics but mostly functionality, and as such they actually do have an aesthetic to them. They look so alien, fantasy like and it really offers a different view and aspect on spacecrafts, and they can be really cool sources of inspiration. My favorite of your designs is the Jt0-8000, the way it looks so sleek and the way it uses rotation, it just makes this craft really unique and interesting.
Imagine how fast he would have went if he put the propeller heat shields at their optimum angle
Q: How fast did you go?
A: yes
I only saw the thumbnail and was like: "Oh ... It's one of these videos."
(Your best videos bth.)
oh god he's at it again.
someone stop him please!
I think this kind of exploit should be considered a separate category when making competition aircrafts. It was not meant to be used in this way in the game so I think using it in career is also kinda of cheating.
shame there's no craft file
Reach, Bradley, Stratenblitz, and Turbopowered, SW Dennis seems to do an arms race to become ksp God
But don't forget the manifestation of kraken itself, the great lord DANNY and his assistant NEXTRE Labs whom none can surpass
Joole SSTO is very hard and bearly possible. Heatshield based design should make it out wright easy.
Update: I've tried it and it didn't work.
nose cones remove the drag but not the lift just as you said but there is downforce instead of uplift, showing as body lift (aka light blue arrows in GUI) through the ground no matter where I place them.
Version info: KSP 1.4.5 Stock Size Real Solar System
I have to disagree, I see these "bugs" as just part of the kerbal universe which, once discovered and mastered, should be exploited to their fullest. I often think of the quote "Any sufficiently advanced technology is Indistinguishable from magic" by Arthur C. Clarke when I see things like this. I believe the ksp community has simply reached an extremely advanced level to the point where we should be able to make things like what you see in this video without guilt or question. Who knows what crazy technology will be discovered next?
I'd definitely throw this in the "kraken drive" category. I'd love to see the new stuff it'll make possible, but it would be a shame for it to supplant existing challenges.
I love the SI-Fi look of this ship. Especialy the double inversed rotors made out of heat shields wich seems separated from the rest of the ship...
Cruising to orbit through the night on a wingless electric spaceplane? It's time for synthwave.
inb4 the K-Prize thread is flooded with variants on this
I know this is an old video, but I think that this would be good for roleplaying an alien civilization's vehicle, or something.
x-15 have rocket engine eand reach 2000m/s and you reach this speed with a prop 💀💀💀💀💀
I think Kraken blessed you.
Haha
Nice!
This with a Docking port kraken drive.
i would say to count it as a bug, while it's fine to use it, it should only be used for bug abusive crafts, contests, or anything else to do with bugs
I think it's a fun thing to Play arround but no body who takes ksp serious will use this for a SSTO.
Next video: to orbit and back with just parachutes and a stick
how did you get electricity to run propellers for so long? is it just a literal ton of RTGs or something more clever?
How DARE you not use the Vsauce music when you said 'Or is it?'
If you integrated this tech into your jet engine only to orbit craft do you think that you could get to orbit purely on electric charge
Id feel like its its own class or not an ssto. I feel like if you can't do it in real life then it should count as a kraken drive.
This new tech should be considered as something to push the game to its limits but not something that can be compared to normal wings
Inb4 videos with titles like "SSTO from Eve *NO HEAT SHIELD WINGS*"
i am really happy with these more frequent uploads, you've managed to do something smaller but impressive while retaining what makes this channel unique. keep it up!
wierdly enough, this is not a bug, some heat shields produce lift in real life, the soyuz capsule, for example, uses this lift to steer itself through the atmosphere to ensure the safety of the crew and a more precise landing(I do believe idoes not produce as much lift as it does in the game though).
Sure, but occlusion removing the drag without removing the lift definitely is a bug. The lift to drag (un-occluded) from stock heatshields is actually pretty accurate.
KSP is a perfectly balanced game with no exploits whatsoever.
I'm currently playing in 1.11 and want to test my creativity with the heat shield wings, but they just aren't producing any lift (according to f12 aerodynamic display and flight preformance). Was the effectiveness of the heat shield as lifting bodies reduced as a fix of sorts in the 1.11 update?
I like the thought process "Ah yes, I have a heat shield, let's put a nose cone over it".
Always do the impossible huh?
Will there be a propeller to orbit video similar to the jet engine video some time in the future?
So... will there be a "Orbiting Kerbin using ONLY propellers" video?
Also, imagine the time you could get using this for the river run challenge.
This is the endgame tech. Actually, you could have an array of mods that fix KSP's physics errors and turn them off as you tech up to simulate advanced new parts.
I think it's fine to count this as a stock propeller, and make it a record holder. I initially thought that this shouldn't be the case, but since prop records have been held by part clipped and offset craft in the past, I don't think this should count as "different." As unfair as it may seem to other record holders, it's using the same methods, but with different parts.
Welp, time for me to make a low speed Zompi-powered heatshield carrier or something XD
This stuff is already visibly in a class of its own, its so far beyond wings that nobody who plays KSP could even see them in an apples-to-apples comparison, its absurd, its awesome, its hilarious and amazing at the same time, but its so overpowered that anyone can admit these alien designs are in a special class alongside Zompi drives and Kraken engines, or external-command-seat-landing-gear and reverse-thrust-rocket-fuel-regenerators, or the classic neutron-star-density-of-clipped-parts. I'm of course gonna use it since I love these absurd exploits, but for real challenges I'm gonna be a by-the-books, "does this work in real life?" kinda guy.
But thanks Stratz, this was epic to watch :P
Ummm.... Kerbal 'Space' Program?
I think it's Kerbal 'Hacking' Program...
The year is 2050. Stratz discovers a real life physics exploit allowing interstellar travel within our lifetimes.
Stratz rubs his hands in expectation: "Yes... now that I'm a kajillionaire I have more time to play KSP 5!"
As awesome as this is, I do agree it should be it's own category. Still, very well done finding a way to truly exploit this!
Hello! I want to suggest you an interesting challenge you've probably never made or thought about.
The main goal is to destruct every building and runway of the Mission Control Center in ONE launch (or fall, of course)
"In Kerbal Space Program, take charge of the space program for the alien race known as the Kerbals. You have access to an array of parts to assemble fully-functional spacecraft that flies (or doesn’t)
based on realistic aerodynamic and orbital physics."
This is like some kind of alien space craft that appears suddenly before your eyes, hovering in the air menacingly.
I cant even get to these speeds on conventionall engines in the atmosphere
oh yeah you hinted at this before!
B E N O T A F R A I D
Concerning whether or not this counts as a propeller craft, I'd say we should just make a separate "glitches" category and lump this in with the Kraken drive.
I know this is three years old... but is this good enough (and temperature-resistent enough) to fly in Kerbol's atmosphere?
Heat shields produce lift because they push the air to the side and Scott Manley talked about this
Btw how did you generate that INSANE almount of electric charge?
In real life, that makes sense. But KSP has an odd aerodynamic model (as you can see in the video) so its surprising to me when certain parts have a lot of lift (like heat shields). Landing gear also have a lot of lift as well: you can get pretty high L/D ratios with just landing gears angled at 45 degrees. Its not quite as good as the heat shields, but its very interesting nonetheless.
Now try to fly using other parts like Hazardish did with kerbal parachutes
As for the electric charge, I just clipped like... 60 RTGs into the fairing.
Well the reason i love this game is the little bugs and quirks throughout
Time to make an SSTO like this! ;)
When you have AtmosphericAutopilot installed but use Mechjeb.
Mechjeb did a better job of holding the roll. For some reason AtmosphereicAutopilot did not do a good job.
I wonder how did it all started? you just play around with different parts and see if it results in a "Kraken Drive"?
I was playing around with a craft that had heat shields. I don't remember exactly, but I think it was a prototype for my 33 second to orbit video. There, I noticed the heat shields were still producing lift even though they were "inline" and got the idea to make wings with them.
The rest is history. Even my early attempts with them were amazing. I made an Eve ssto using only Nervas and props with them: their L/D was just so good.
I'm planning to play around with the tech more in the future!
@@Stratzenblitz75 Hmm, maybe I can use heat shields to get to Mun? Eve? Mars?
A classic Stratzenblitz move!!! :)
Ive made a stock jet propelled craft that had to hold below level to stay in the atmosphere. It was quite silly looking as i had 8 ram air intakes per engine.
One of the most important things for my planes in ksp is for them to look really cool. A bunch of heat shields looks hideous so I’ll never use this tech
I honestly wouldn't feel comfortable using this tech, because it's op...
I mean it seems fun to play around with of course
Well damn, guess it's time to abuse KSP physics like the good old days. Can't wait to see what KSP 2 is gonna have in terms of fun and interesting game-breaking bugs like this.
Funny that you mention the good old days. This takes me back to the old days of air hogging!
I do have to say something, what if alien fly around in crafts like that because they found exploits in our own universe.
I use a lot of mods - key piece of information. My absolute best plane is fast - even for mods - and lasts forever using M.A.R.G.E engines from OPT and a nuclear reactor. At 45% throttle and at 11km, it cruises around 1300m/s. I have to lower the throttle or it literally burns up in the atmosphere.
You've made a ***stock aircraft*** that doesn't burn up and goes almost 2x the speed whilst lasting forever... insanity.
Jeb Kerman got reprimanded by the KSP for telling the public he's never taken it past 75% throttle.
This is absolutely amazing. If this stays in the game till the summer break (for Southern Hemisphere dwellers) I will have a lot of fun. And I really hope it does. It seems like one of those things that will never be game breaking because it is so absurd, and since the only competitive play is already checked for these sorts of things (and that this is obvious) it should ne fine. Honestly I love the lift mechanic on the heat shields and I want it to stay.
Also, does this work with other lift generating parts? iirc the mk2 parts also generate lift.
Thanks for your thoughts on this!
There are a few parts that have unusually high L/D ratios. Landing gear are one of them interestingly enough. Mk2 parts do not work to my knowledge.
Man really just an alien passing down tech 😂
My opinion: use it in conjunction with regular lifting surfaces to make extremely efficient and effective aircraft. Imagine how this will revolutionalize stealth aircraft in BDA, they’ll be able to fly higher and faster than ever. Or SSTOs, as shown here: imagine a colony aircraft going between Eve and Kerbin and picking up modules using only xenon and heat shield tech. You could even make highly efficient hydrofoils for attempting the sea speed record!
If it can be feasibly done IRL, it's legit for KSP with some margin for error.
If not, then it's an unintended bug.
Since KSP is trying to emulate real life physics, it's simply not right for something that obviously won't work IRL to be considered legit in KSP. Now, since KSP is a game you have to inevitably have some flexibility, but this heat shield wing violates several laws of aerodynamics.
And my prop planes don't even go 50 m/s . . .
Yep, definitely kraken drive level. I really wish this game did a better job of calculating part occlusion. I like trying to make really big cargo planes with custom loading ramps using the robotics parts, but the game considers any vehicle or cargo you put inside as being outside the plane (and therefore super draggy), and also tries to rip open your cargo ramp. The cargo ramps and cargo doors can also negatively impact control, and also cause a ton of drag. Super annoying.
I'll go check out Bradley's video. I've been trying to use prop tech for a while now to make an Eve SSTO, without much success.
Personally, I believe that this should be in a separate category where bugs, or glitches, are the main theme of KSP tech, alike the Kraken Drive you mentioned. Bugs or glitches in the game can surely make impressive craft, but they will feel weird, or unfair compared to impressive craft that follow the rules or boundaries in a mindset that's bug/glitch free. A kraken drive has unlimited Delta V, if it was to fly against actual engineered SSTOs, it'd wipe the table with an unfair bug. Maybe a glitch/bug competition should be a thing now?
Holy shit! This can be used for so much! Maybe on a bigger scale, you can take a large cargo into orbit for basically free. Then, you might be able to do an eve or tylo unrefueled ssto!
I've got some ideas for this! In fact, I'm working on one right now!
@@Stratzenblitz75 nice, can't wait to see a vid on it!