7 mistakes EVERY new camper makes with their SLEEP SYSTEM
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 3 май 2024
- Thermarest Neo Air Xtherm bit.ly/32CzCGX
Big Agnes alnk.to/3J5x4AI
Nemo bit.ly/2L0E8pL
Klymit Insulated Static V bit.ly/3G7YJ1M
Thermarest Hyperion 20F alnk.to/cb1U9Ll
Western Mountaineering Alpinlite 20F bit.ly/3rUPvRJ
Big Agnes Torchlight UL 20F alnk.to/btmSewn
Outdoor Vitals Summit -15 bit.ly/3A5LKwe
Tenacious Tape amzn.to/3o67mnr
If you have sleepless nights in the backcountry camping, backpacking, hiking, then this video will help. It's 7 tips and tricks to make sure you have the best sleep possible while out camping! How to sleep well while camping. How to sleep warm backpacking. How to sleep comfortable while camping in a tent. 
Развлечения
I'm guessing your already aware of this but the Klymit V channels are the reason for the odd Rvalue ratings. They are designed to work in conjunction with the insulation on the bottom of your sleeping bag. Like you said, most of the insulation on the bottom of your bag is compressed and worthless when you lay on it, on most pads. The V channels allow the bags insulation to loft up filling in the gaps creating a higher Rvalue.
I'm not saying it should be 4.4 Rvalue, but it's definitely going to be warmer when used with a sleeping bag versus a quilt or a sleeping bag with less insulation on the bottom.
We have several Static V insulated ultralight pads. Used them for years. Great pad for the money as long as you understand it's limitations. Lots of great info in the video....👍
Cheers!
shouldnt that be the case with every sleeping pad that leave space on the bottom? like also the sea2summit ones?
Is this really a significant effect?
The R4.4 pad dropped to 1.9 right?
I’m a hammocker, but sometimes in the winter I sleep in shelters on the floor with my Klymit Static-V insulated, with just a quilt. My latest 3 overnights it got down to 20F and I slept great. I do agree that a little bit more width would be nice though
@@toesockoutdoors3627 Yea. I've slept on the insulated V ultralight with a quilt down into the upper twenties with a slight chill creeping in around 4am. I did wear my puffy but I was fine. Of course, everyones cold tolerance is different. I consider myself just slightly on the cold sleeper side of the fence.
You will not be cold with a -15 bag and a pad that thick. It's all marketing bs. Years ago, people used to sleep on nothing but a foam mat and they were fine, yes,even in winter. Wonder what the R value of foam is? 0. Well, it worked.
You are 100% correct about the channels and how they work with a sleeping bag. This working principle does not work for those of us that use quilts. There is no material to fill the channels and you will freeze your behind off trying to use a quilt with any of the Klymit pads.
Everyone here probably knows this trick, but I love to share it because it really saved me a night of misery. I was backpacking with a friend of mine and an unexpected cold front blew in and I was not prepared. My friend was a cold weather camper and asked me if I had a Nalgene bottle with me. He had me put my jet boil just outside the tent, boil some water and dump it in my bottle, and put it in my bag. It would keep me warm for 2-3 hours and then when I got cold again I would unzip the flap reheat the water and throw it back in my bag. Kept me from freezing my berries off. Hope this helps somebody.
I would use a stainless or aluminum water bottle with a really good seal, fill with boiling water. Place inside a stocking and into the foot of the sleeping bag. Toasty all night!
I came to the comments to add this. I’ve used it in moderately cold weather to just pre heat the bag. By the time it cooled down, I had the bag good and toasty. Works best for me at my feet.
I've done that a lot. It's also good for keeping your water from freezing.
@@mortsnerd5100 Also good for drying your gloves if they got really wet during the day. Drying slightly moist clothes inside the sleeping bag is ok, but anything beyond slightly moist is miserable. Only works with overnight temps around 0 inside your tent. frozen iced tea is a bit too iced.
Excellent advice, don't forget to use common sense and don't burn yourself lol
Another tip is the sleeping bag work as a thermos. Put something (you) cold inside and it takes a hell of a lot more time too heat up. Some push ups and knee bends (getting some body heat flowing) speeds up this time. Or you can cheat, fill a bottle with warm water and throw it in the foot end.
Kind regards a soldier, that hates too freeze. In Norway.
I agree, work up some heat before you get in and the bag seals it in, jump in cold and inactive and your body won't release enough bodyheat to warm the air trapped around you. A nice hot drink just before bed is also just the ticket.
Reminds me, city person from Germany, being surprised by snow in Yosemite. We did jumping jacks until out of breath and rubbed our bodies with a cloth until hot. Bonus point: looks funny and you are exhausted (but happy and warm).
thank you for the tip :D
@@missmojo8779 u sweet
MRE heaters
I'm 79 and been camping since 1953 . Still camping. Tried many systems including my dad's 'army' blankets. We've been using REI pads for about the last 12 years, and I think they're about the best for the $$. Similar to the Thermarest but varying thickness as needed by the human body. Thicker at the shoulder-to-hip area and thinner at the knees and feet. They roll up nicely and self inflate in less time it takes to set up an e-z tent. Sorta pricy, but worth it for all the reasons (truths) in the video. Maybe wet, maybe buggy, maybe even too hot.. Never too cold. Yet... THX, Bob
p.s. If you're manually blowing up a mattress of ANY kind, do it before drinking ANY alcohol. It eats seals. Don't ask how I know. B
That sounds so interesting, you must have witnessed so many sweeping changes to how camping is done. Would you mind telling me a little more about what changed the most over your camping career?
The cameramans power stance in the beginning being reflected by the sunglasses is amazing.
Nice
🗣️Mr.Anderson
Patrick Star
I’m dead 💀
For every layer above you, you should have two layers below. All winter campers should be using a liner and a gore tex bivvy bag. Canadian army routinely camps out in the coldest arctic weather, our sleep system is a ground sheet, an air mattress, a bivvy bag, two down filled sleeping bags, and a liner and optional ranger blanket (poncho liner). It is important to sleep in nothing but your underwear so you don't sweat - sweat kills. The coldest I have been out is -60°C in the arctic and was comfy.
I disagree. I have been in Finnish army special forces and we gave arctic warfare training to US troops also, but I learned the most after the army.
Bivy is many times bad idea, that can make you swetty. And putting more clothes on you is in many situation a good idea. I usually sleep with my wet gear on, and dry them this way to next day. There is alot of tricks people don't know and nobody talks them.
When sleeping more than 100 nights in a year outdoors, I had the opportunity to test shitload of wild ideas.
@@caide notice I said Gore tex bivy bag. No survival expert recommends wet clothes in a sleeping bag. In fact they recommend against it. Also wet clothes in a sleeping bag results in a wet sleeping bag. The feathers get wet and lose loft thus insulation resulting in a loss of heat, and who wants to sleep in a wet bed?
@@dingo5208 Yes it is not usually good idea. Surviving is a different game than having trips in winter and having fun. When the game sets easier, it is not surviving anymore. It's a lifestyle.
If my sleeping set is in the limita, I will not do that drying of course. But usually me sleeping system is with more warmth, what I need. Then I can dry my clothes. And when the system breaths well, I don't have any plastics, the moist goes through the sleeping bag and to the air. Same system I dry clothes when hiking. I put wet clothes inside my jacket.
These skills are very handy when we are out week or two and make longer trips backcountry skiing.
With longer trips, the weather can change from side to side. I have some trips where I had some days +5 Celsius with rain and then quickly after that -25 celsius. So situations are very different every night and tool box for different tricks are usually handy.
@@Codzilla71 Why not. Of course with complete wet, but what you get in winter trips. I did it last weekend again and no problems. My clothing was dry in the morning.
Pro tip: Use a closed cell foam pad under your inflatable pad. This will make a thermal barrier between your sleep system and the cold ground.
You can also put one of those silver emergency blankets under it too ;-)
Been doing it for years. 3/4" closed cell pad, 2" self inflating foam pad, and a king size comforter folded in half layed on top. The comes the Cabelas Magnum 44 sleeping bag, inside of that is a -15C sleeping bag, over top of all that is a pair of thinish wool blankets.
I'm personally tested to -30C in it, comfortably sleeping in boxers and a t-shirt. Almost to the point of sweating, if I were wearing anything else.
I look forward to trying it in even colder temps, to see how it works.
Honestly, I'm working on a winter "hot tent" skidoo trip, keep warm project. It involves an Amazon Chinese Diesel Heater, 2 solar panels, a battery, and a wheeled toolbox that contains it all. Goal being, plumb the hot air into the tent, heater runs all night, solar charges the battery back up during the day when the heater is turned off and I'm out of tent sledding or cooking on the fire.
was looking for this, I always take foil foam pad even If its just one day trail
And it helps prevent air mat punctures. Yet for some reason you dont see them being used in the many camping videos. It is a no brainer.
Just use a closed cell foam pad, full stop.
Slept in the snow, no problem.
I'm a huge fan of my silk sleeping bag liner. It's tiny and very light, and adds a lot of warmth - I don't purposely camp in below freezing temps, so this is a great backup for when it does turn out colder than I was expecting.
It’s a must. Sweat in the liner. Extends life of the bag. Can open your bag a bit on cold nights
I need to try that :D
It's what the girls do, lol!!
When is on a field problem in the Marines in Korea. It was January 1973. It got down to -81 wind chill. We were a winter insulated 10 man tent heated. We had those military sleeping bag. They are very good at keeping body heat in, too good. People complain about getting sweaty. I had brought a military blanket. We were sleeping on cots. So what I did was folded the blanket in half put it on the cot and used my sleeping bag as a blanket. I didn't get sweaty and slept great.
One thing I discovered that works amazing is using both an inflatable sleeping pad and an egg shell sleeping pad with the radiant side facing you. I put the egg shell pad between the inflatable pad and my sleeping bag. Will keep you significantly warmer vs just the inflatable pad. It is a game changer. I know some people see that as too much to carry but an egg shell sleeping mat is very lightweight and you can fit it to the outside of your bag
Yes. That's my plan for my next trip. My sack doesn't have an internal frame, but instead has mesh pockets on the back panel to accomodate a folded 3/4 Z Rest to double as a 'frame'. Combined with my Thermarest Uberlite pad I should be toasty, though I've always put my Z Rest under the tent to act as a groundsheet to protect the tent, and sleep on the pad. Probably amounts to the same as your way? 'Six of one, half a dozen of the other' as they say.
@@domo3552 You want the egg shell mat between you and the air. The air in the sleeping pad is cold so if you want to maximize your warmth you don't sleep on the inflatable pad directly
@@fantasyEXX Greay idrea!
Plus you can use the egg pad as a seat
Those egg shell pads are awesome
A reflexive car windshield cover is also a lightweight option also to put under your pad also.. when that gets trashed just make a few coozy out of it.
Loved the tip about rolling. Also having a sleeping bag that’s small enough to fit me properly has made a huge difference, so much warmer! And lighter.
Don't forget that you can amplify the warmth of your bags, pads, etc, if you're in an area that has evergreens. Adding layers of spruce or juniper boughs can make a massive difference. Also, adding spare clothing in the foot of your sleeping bag while wearing wool socks will also increase your comfort.
If you have hand warmers, or water bottles, use them inside your sleeping bag too. Simply heating some snow and pouring it into the water bottles while warm will help.
Another option if you have less expensive pads is to use a thermo blanket between the ground and the pad. Very cheap and weigh nothing. The silver reflective ones work great and make a huge difference.
I do this as well when camping below freezing.
The silver roll up solar reflectors that you put in your car’s windshield to keep car cool work great under your pad and weigh nothing. I get them cheap at the dollar store.
@@kevindice1092 Same
Between GROUND and PAD or between PAD and SLEEPING BAG?
@@dh2558 between ground and the pad
Getting comfortable at night and working out what's important to YOU is a huge camping game-changer. I nearly binned backpacking altogether because I didn't like single skin tents, restrictive sleeping bags, stuff-sack pillows etc. I now have a two skin tent, a Thermarest Questar and the Hikenture pillow and my base weight is still only around 10kg.
I’m a roller, and the most frightening sleeping experience I had was 40 years ago when I rolled inside of my 1970’s Gerry mummy bag and awoke upside down, not being able to breathe and find the opening. Total panic, like I was drowning. Otherwise, it was, and still is(!) a great 3lb. Goose down bag, though heavy by today’s standards. Cowboy’d it with a tube tent as a ground sheet and a foam pad in those days. Now at age 60 and getting back into packing, I want to use it again with an inflatable pad and tarp in three seasons and see how it goes before I shell out for a new sleep system.
This happened to me too as a kid. I was traumatised - total panic, but my family thought it was hilarious & I was just messing around. I'm surprised it didn't put me off camping for life!
I’ve been getting back into camping again lately and just getting into hammocking, the amount of videos I’ve watched is unreal.. with that being said, your video was hands down the most informative, honest, no bs video on this entire platform. Never heard anyone talk about these other ratings and stuff. Thank you!
👍🔥🙏
Hope you've seen some videos by Shug! (Shugemery), taught me everything I know about hammocking!
I made the mistake of thinking the sleeping bag was the most important element in staying warm, and neglecting the R value of my pad! I don't think people realise that most of your body heat will be lost to conduction from contact with the cold ground underneath you! Thinking of it as a 'system' that requires each component to work in harmony is definitely the best approach!!
I learned that lesson camping on wet ground in the fall around Ottawa. Thankfully I had my SOL bivy which I just turned inside out and slid my pad in to, instant insulation. I was warm the rest of the night
Try purchasing some radiator reflection foil roll. On Amazon. It's very cheap. Durable and waterproof. It has its own R rating.
From a 5m X 1.2 meter roll you will get 4 full size pieces.
Put the piece under your sleeping mat. This definitely stops the transference of cold from the ground.
It's really good stuff.
@@NotASheep100 yeah it's great stuff! I use a thermarest pad now, but for really extreme temps I take out a strip of radiator foil cut to size! Also handy for sitting on at camp, or lying on in an emergency if a bivvy out is required due to injury etc.
Watching Perry Peacock use his gear from Wilderness innovation, drilled this into my brain. So dry leaves or 12 inches of pine boughs, get some loft under you. And if you can't get it under all of you, get it under your torso.
I am currently employed at a outdoors store (I just unload and stalk the selves) however there is a camping department in the store and thanks to you I can give them more information about the gear there looking for
If someone has the SOL reflective bivvy, you can put that around your sleeping pad inside out and it will increase the insulation value of the pad.
I was doing an overnight camp just outside Ottawa on October when it was wet and cold. My sleeping bag was fine, but I was still cold because of the issue mentioned at the start. So instead of putting the bivvy around myself, I put it around the pad and it turned a chilly night into a quite cozy night
After years of cold feet and short ground pads, I ended up making my own ground pad. I made a big pocket out of rubber backed canvas and a few sheets of aluminized bubble wrap. I can add in layers for any winter camping and at 6’8” long, my feet are never off the end anymore. I really like using it in my hammock. The canvas is grippy enough that I don’t slide into a ball, it’s stiff enough to keep the hammock sides away from me while sleeping, it is thick enough that I can hammock camp through 35f nights without getting cold and I don’t get bit by mosquitoes through the bottom of hammock on warm buggy nights when I’m sleeping.
You should post a video of that beast
Wow I love to see how u made it step by step, is that possible?
I'd love to hear more specifics. Would make great video or blog post. So canvas isn't too heavy and doesn't mold?
I sleep in a hammock indoors! Love it.
I bought an insulated sleeping pad, and a sleeping bag liner and they are game changers. So much more comfortable and I don’t feel any cold from the ground.
Wow. I have been doing my sleep system wrong for like 15 years. I stopped backpacking through college at least in part because I couldn't be comfortable. I did not know about all this. I had a super narrow sleeping pad that I would eventually slip off of in the night, I had mummy bags that I couldn't roll around in at all so it rolled with me and made me cold. Really takes the fun out of camping when you're so uncomfortable.
For winter or mountaineering, I always carry a foam zrest to put under any inflatable pad. This way the ground is insulated it is keeps the inflatable off the cold ground. The remark about using a bivy below is also a good idea, but not needed as much if are in a 4 season tent. Also have learned to make sure that your boots stay in the tent or in the bivy so they don't freeze.
Our winter expedition courses in northern Maine involve potentially multiple days of temps well below zero. We require our students to have -20 degree bags but many get -40 bags. We also require students to use a two-pad sleeping system, typically an insulated inflatable bag on top of a traditional thick foam pad. We travel on skis hauling sleds with all of the heavy gear and wear backpacks stuffed with the lightweight down and insulated equipment.
I've never had a sleeping bag warmer than the 3 layer gortex sleeping bag issued to me in the Army back in the early 2000's. Was a cocoon type bag with outer layer just a Gortex waterproof shell. Middle layer was like a lightweight sleeping bad with inner layer being thick. I stayed warm whether sleeping on a cott, the ground, or wherever w/o any kind of sleeping pad or useing that standard issue pad the Army gives ya. I remember being out in the field sleeping under the stars on a city nice & warm and when I woke up in the morning & unzipped & poked my head out to find my entire sleeping bag was covered in frost. I was really warm inside though. Hated to get out of it.
I swear by those things. Getting woken up for firewatch to go out in the cold and rain was always a terrible feeling.
+1 here!
And never forget your woobie!!
@@sdevans2 always.
I use this set up for fishing. Good old British army surplus
Been camping my whole life and still learned some new tips from this, great video thank you!
I like that you desribe that the sleepingbag isolation on the Bags is much thinner than on front. This fact made me order a handmade spb with the perfect filling to my needs...
Great video. While I'm not doing a lot of lightweight winter camping I am out tons in winter sledding, icefishing, backcountry skiing, etc. but always have cold fingers and toes for several hours even with good gear. Handwarmers are a must. Use for what they're made for and more- for feet, hands, body, sleeping bag... even for sled helmets without heated visors that are continuously fogging and icing up. A hand warmer tucked between the forehead and helmet visor can keep enough area clear to sled safely.
Another awesome video, Dan! Sending love and blessings from Australia.
I vouch for tip #7 a thousand percent. I bought a Sea to Summit mummy-shaped sleeping pad, and despite months of use (I tend to starfish a lot in my sleep) I could just never bag a good night’s sleep. I always had an arm or a leg sliding off, and God forbid I turn over in my sleep, cause I’d just roll straight off the pad.
Switching to an Exped Synmat (with 25 inches/~64cm of width) was one of the best decisions I ever made. Have been sleeping like a baby on all my trips ever since.
I bought the thermarest Extreme wider square shape for this reason. I bought the exped rectangular shaped ones too for spare kits. Some peeps can get away with mummy shaped...I know I cant
Super informative video! This past weekend was my first overnighter where it dropped below freezing. I was not cold whatsoever, given that I had a ton of layers too. Everything here is spot on!
A fitted sleeping bag sheet improves comfort greatly and keeps your bag fresh. I've used closed cell foam pads for decades, no fuss, no repair tape needed.
Excellent advice. If there's one thing I find as important as food/water on a hiking or camping trip, it's the quality of my sleep.
Klymit pads have those deep grooves which allow your sleeping bag to loft up underneath you and provide more warmth (at least in theory). Thus the pad it self may appear to not have enough insulation for cold temps but when paired up with a sleeping bag it will keep you warmer than a flat pad of the same R value.
7:52 - If only 30% of the insulation is on the back of the bag, Klymit’s grooves won’t cut it!
Doesn't really make sense though does it? Most insulation is made to prevent cold bridging caused by high pressure points crushing the insulation and "short circuiting" to the cold. Doesn't matter how much is lofted if you're lying on cold bits. Imagine lying on water pipes with down between them, no matter how much down depth you have, the cold pipes will freeze you.
I was wondering what the groves were for
That is false physics.
"At least in theory"? I would amend that to, "at least in Klymit's dishonest marketing."
Great information, thank you. I've been spoiled living in CA for many years. Although it is sort of depressing how many mistakes boil down to "Forgot that most companies are dishonest sacks of crap."
California has quite a bit cold weather camping. I've slept in a snow shelter near Donner Pass and it was as cold any other 'tough winter' state.
don't forget "most politicians are dishonest sacks of crap". at least companies create jobs and manufacture products.
@@Mike1614b Generally the two go together in tandem- corrupt politcal culture is an outflow of usually corrupt business culture. I'm hard pushed to think of one example in the world or in history where you has a benign business culture and corruption is isolated to just the politcal system. It hard to bribe a politician if no one is prepared to offer one. By the way corrupt businesses by in large aren't very good at creating goods and jobs- they wouldn't need to be corrupt if they made the best products and worthwhile jobs.
From Southern California yeah, if’s pretty easy to forget seasons besides summer exist, winter oh no it’s like 55 degrees outside 🥶
Yeah .
Have you ever tried using a reflective "emergency blanket" under your sleeping pad? I've found that very effective. Using it over the sleeping bag will trap moisture but using it on the floor of the tent works well.
I was going to ask this question, thanks.
@@isaiahcampbell488 The one I use is the slightly thicker blanket that is orange on one side and reflective on the other (Ozark Trail Survival Blanket). I don't know if the thin, vinyl ones will work as well.
Slept under the stars this winter-20c haf a tarp a mat and sleeping bag . I was just fine .but waking up I the morning brrrrr. That's the worst
@@terrymiller1759 Would you put the reflective side facing the floor or the mat? I've never used a reflective blanket for anything, so I'm not familiar with their use.
I also use an emergency blanket under the pad. Even the cheap thin ones work wonders for cold weather camping!
When tenting in winter always bring at least one closed cell foam sleepingpad per tent. I recomend one per person.
When your fancy 8R inflatable sleepingpad punctures, you still have something to keep you from freezing to death.
A closed cell sleeping pad of 14-15 mm will generally have an R-value of 3,5-3,9, thats not too bad for 600-750 grams of extra weight. And you can use it by a fire without worrying that flying embers will destroy it. They are puncture safe, but will ad a bit of bulk to the outside of your pack.
When carried vertically, it will act like the third leg on a stool and keep your backpack upright all on its own.
I see no disadvantages.
I used the 23 inch wide Klymit pad and kept rolling off! LOL Now I have the 30 inch wide version and I love it! It keeps me warm with my Kelty bag, it’s quiet and I don’t roll off anymore! 👍
I love that you told us from the beginning when he started us it was for people who don't know not experienced and I think that you are doing a wonderful job and you are also learning things too I appreciate you
For winter and cold night camping setups, we use two sleeping pads. One pad goes under the sleeping bag and another goes inside the sleeping bag. We use mummy style bags, so the pad that goes inside has traditionally been a 3/4 length Thermarest self-inflating foam pad. We have also used air only inflatable pads (both inside and outside the bag). With today's lightweight equipment, brining an extra pad is not a big deal. Before inflatable air only pads became popular, we used a lightweight and dense foam pad combined with a Themarest self-inflating foam pad and had no issues with the cold from the ground. Except for areas with warm nights, we generally go the two-pad route.
i've probably violated all of these tips. i've shivered in my bag for enough sleepless night to go back to the drawing board. i like these suggestions, and would like to add one. adding a foam pad to the bottom of the sleeping pad helps in many ways, increasing r value, reducing noise, less sliding around and preserving the lifespan of your pad. its like a thermal break. a hiker buddy told me that the conduction of the ground could outpace my body's ability to warm the pad, which makes sense (though i was packing a pad not rated for the conditions at the time). He offered his nemo switchback for the night and i remember sleeping like a baby.
Check out the SOL Escape Bivy. It's a great way to add 10° insulation value, it packs no bigger than a soda can, and it's pretty light
Absolutely... use a foam pad with an air pad; it makes a big difference. But there's debate over whether to put the foam under the pad or between the pad and the bag. The idea being that the foam will basically be a relatively hard stop of heat transfer between one side and the other, so why not stop/reflect heat at the bag & not waste the heat warming up the air inside a pad that's at least partially exposed to air. The flip side is that you don't heat up the foam, so why not give a little heat to the pad & let it act as a temp buffer and let the foam just block from the ground. Plus less wear/tear on the air pad if the foam is underneath. I've tried both and prefer going with a thin foam pad (like the Agnes 3rd degree) between the bag & pad. But if using a thicker one (like the Therm-a-rest Z-lite), or in a shelter with no flooring, I like it better under the pad.
But that also leads to the debate over whether to put a contour pad inside the sleeping bag or outside, which is a whole 'nother can of worms. My answer is no but there are some compelling arguments for it.
@@blackoak4978 I very much do not recommend the SOL Bivvy line for that application. It's basically a mylar blanket-turned-bag with some extra features. It traps air so well that it also traps condensation. I have one & tried it out with my bag & pad one one night when it got down to 5 degrees. By morning, the outside of the sleeping bag / inside of that bivvy was absolutely soaked in condensation. It was also really tight fitting with my bag/pad combo so I lost some loft that way. If all you had was a blanket, summer bag, or nothing but some thermal clothes, and got caught in some cold weather, go for it. (or if you're going out to test the setup) But don't plan to use it; use it for emergency. That's not to say they're bad; I now keep mine in my emergency kit and will throw into my bag on cold treks for emergencies. But they're definitely not for a properly planned/equipped situation.
Living and camping exclusively in Florida I've been more concerned with the heat but after section hiking on the AT I've been more interested in colder weather camping. This video is full of useful information and great presentation as always!
I'm a fellow Floridian as well, and I definitely share your sentiment about staying cool during the hot months, but the month or so of cold weather (at least here in North Florida) certainly should not be underestimated. I went hiking/camping in blackwater in February last year and again last montj, and seem to keep underestimating how cold it would be. Woke up and it was 24 degrees, boots were frozen, tent had sheets of ice falling off of it when I got out, etc. It was quite rough. The cold mixed with the humidity here can certainly complicate a trip if one isn't prepared. Sure, there's no snow, but it still can get damn cold and rather risky if you're down a lengthy trail with no cold weather preparations. But yes, heat is certainly the primary concern the other 11 months out of the year lol.
I use an old windshield reflector in my hammock tent. Works great!
Went camping in the mountains some time ago.was really cold at night so I got some rocks from the camp fire , wrapped them in clothes and used for a pillow and also at my feet. Helped a lot
I am glad your channel was recommended to me in my feed. I use my old US Army sleep system when I go out camping/overlanding, I dont backpack much anymore. The system is comprised of 1 lighter “Patrol” sleeping bag, 1 heavier “Cold Weather” sleeping bag, and a “Gore-Tex Bivy” shell to top it off, so you can mix and match as weather permits. When all 3 bags are used together the system is rated to provide 4 hours sleep at -40° F (-40º C). The system is designed to fit in a stuff sack that is included.
I also started bringing a blow up mattress with me for camping/overlanding, better sleep and stay warmer.
I live in AZ and have never had to be too concerned with this type if info. I'm now looking at traveling into our mountains and out of state... thank you for sharing this info!!!
I’m sleeping on a an exped megamat and I take that with me even when visiting family rather than using their guest beds/couches/air mattresses. It’s a dream to sleep on. Especially when camping. Never cold or uncomfortable!
Marvellous information that would be difficult to obtain from conventional sources. Thank you. A few decades ago I used to do quite a lot of hunting in the hills and native forests of New Zealand (very rugged terrain, and often terrible weather). I never took a "pad" with me. The conventional technique was to gather dry forest material to form a raised bed, and put down on that my sleeping bag (a "Fairy Down 20 Below" - perhaps the best NZ made bag!), and only rarely suffered from a cold night, even with snow outside. Yes, insulation below the bag is very important.
REALLY good review my friend. As a survival instructor growing up in rural MI and live/work/explore in my early years living in Alaska being out all year long in different weather conditions we definitely learned tricks to stay warm in the cold BUT the best thing you can ever do is spend some time in your gear outside at HOME before any trip. It saves so much discomfort by getting your system down first being able to bail and go inside for hot coffee/chocolate and then getting the right gear and or learn the cold weather tricks. A good night sleep is priceless in the bush. Also as others have pointed out here, site prep and layering (like you do for YOU) for your base and sides are critical in cold weather.Thank you again for really good advice and showing the ratings mean-usually not much!!
Do you have backpacking recommendations for MI in spring summer and fall?
@1001CP that’s some of the soundest advice I’ve ever heard. People absolutely “DO NOT” test their equipment out enough before going into the extremes a lot of times. Getting out in the backyard is a foolproof way to do it and figure everything out… BEFOREHAND! Awesome tip!!💯👍🏻🫵🏻
I just did a high altitude cold weather trip (sleeping highest at 4800m, temperature below freezing but the altitude changes everything). The thermarest pad (I had the mummy-formed narrow version) is wonderful. Having a sleeping bag that does a bit more than just fulfilling the minimum requirement and pairing that with a really warm pad makes the nights very comfortable and allowed me to sleep more than other travellers.
I have also found that a foam pad under my airpad is huge for warmth. I use a thermarest zpad and a big Agnes q core insulated pad. I've got a cheap fleece sleeping bag from Amazon that maybe is good at 60f by itself and a 22 degree bag that is probably good to 35 in real life. Putting the fleece bag inside the big bag and using both pads I've slept WARM AND COMFY to 5. I'm a cold person.... I never want the AC on and the heat in my house never goes below 73.
I'll add a little of my own. When you turn on your side, your back will get cold. Compresses the insulation that was under you. Now he's on the side. If I were choosing a sleeping bag today, I would choose an integrated sleeping system and a cocoon. I would put a sleeping bag inside a summer sleeping system. Two sleeping bags stacked together is a very good idea. Firstly, it is warmer than one sleeping bag. And the second is that the integrated system does not overturn.
This was very helpful. I've just upgraded from a swag to a hot tent. I'm going shopping this week for a sleeping pad and bag. You have given me the tools to make an informed decision. Thank you.
cub scout wool blanket with any camping sleep system as an add on is gold
if you've never looked into foil tape, you might check it out. its adhesive is very strong for a first-stick, not so much for any repositioning, but it's very thin so it rolls up in an emergency kit pretty well. also its reflective backing could be used for makeshift repairs should your flashlight should it be damaged-though-functional. mostly it's just very compact.
I learned a long time ago (got my first thermarest pad in 1986, ten years after starting to backpack) that if you put the sleeping mat inside the sleeping bag then you’re less likely to roll the bag with you when you thrash around, less likely to roll off the mat in the night (especially if you have to sleep on a slope) and less likely to cut or puncture your mat.
That is either a massive sleeping bag you have or a very thin mat. Sounds like it would work though. Not to get onthis guys back but the last time I watched a vid by him I think he admitted that he doesn't go on long (multiday) hikes. This was a good year or so ago so he could have changed. I don't bother listening to the advice of people who go out for the night in a tent and then the next night are back in there massive bed at home.
@@affalaffaa I use a thermarest self inflating coffin shaped. Pad. It curls up on the sides a little when you zip up but I have used this method on cots, ground, and hammock.
I’ve always stuffed my mat into the bag and sometimes a second mat outside to lie on, like those foil mats.
I just did this for the first time last week, and it made such a positive difference. I used a Nemo Forte bag and alps inflatable pad (I forget which one I have). I woke up to frost, but had the warmest sleep ever. I actually had to shed layers in the night.
just tried this at home, very good advice. I have a yoga mat and a 5C to 10C sleeping bag. I live on the countryside of brazil, so is usually warm.
The orange 'Klymit' pad is considered a 'four seasons pad' because you can listen to Verdi's "Four seasons" while lying on it.
Vivaldi*
50 years ago I discovered cheap 10mm closed cell foam pads and Fairydown's cheapest down and feather sleeping bag that moved with me as I turned worked brilliantly - winter climbing in Scotland with temps down to -20 deg C (about -4F). It takes a bit of getting used to the bag moving with you, but it saves major heat loss which depends on surface area
Made the mistake on my first backpacking trip, my air mattress was rated for fall temperatures and it was about 30 degrees in the Porcupine Mountains in Michigan, and it deflated during the night. My sleeping bag was rated for 0° F, but I was still cold. I have since gotten a higher R Value pad.
About to do a backcountry trip there in June - my first backpacking trip! Thanks for this info :)
Biggest complaint I have, especially as I get older, with sleeping gear for camping/hiking is that they do NOT make "adult sized" equipment affordable. They make it, but having to take out a second mortgage to buy a sleeping pad makes me think twice. My son is a new Boy Scout. We "car camped" in Cub Scouts mostly in warmerish months. Rules/Regulations prohibit taking Cub Scouts camping in "extreme" (approaching freezing) conditions. But Boy Scouts is a whole different ball game! They go no matter the weather! I'm 6'4" & run about 295lbs. Finding a sleeping bag I actually fit in has always been a challenge. Finding a sleeping pad long enough, wide enough, & warm enough is damn near impossible. I have a long, wide Nemo Tensor Ultralight now. I have not used it yet as we have not been camping with the Troop yet, but it that day will come soon. Fingers crossed that it works!
Western Mountaineering Badger.
@@jeskeepinitreal One thing I used to do was put a folded blanket UNDER the sleeping bag btw you and the pad. That way if the pad is a little on the summerish side of things you can boost it to a winterish pad. I'd only do this for a standing camp though, not a hike. Also, my exhusband and I had a pair of bags that could zip together making a double sized bag with the zips on the side. Line the inside of the bag with a thin but warm blanket and sleep with the blanket above you inside the bag, this will hel[ you tuck it around your neck etc to keep heat in. Again standing camp only not hiking.
I used to hike a lot in the days (80s and 90s) when our pads were pretty much not more than yoga mats and you learned a bunch of tricks to keep the cold away from the underside on a hike such as putting a small piece of canvas under your pad between it and the floor as an extra layer of insulation. You could use a space blanket (foil lined sheet), poncho etc the same way.
USMC sleep system, at least the ones used around 2009, had a bivvy bag that ran 80." The rest of the bag could easily encapsulate my head and I stand 6'0".
@@IndomnitableForceofNature, funny you mention that. I have two of them from my time stationed in an MH-53 squadron. They work, but I’m “wall-to-wall” in it.
Klymit makes an XL inflatable pad 78" x 28" x 5".
The way to roll in a bag without exposing the back of the bag to the cold is TO STRAP IT TO THE PAD. If your bag has an uneven insulation design, it almost assuredly has straps or a baffle designed to attach to the pad to prevent rolling
love how the video doesnt waffle around and gets straight into the info. great video thank you
Just to keep it simple I always add 10 degrees to what my bag rating is. For example a 0 degree bag is really good to 10 degrees and a 20 degree is good to 30 degree's and so forth. Also as far as bag size goes, yes you need one sized correctly for your body but you also have to figure you will bring a bit of gear in the bag with you to keep from freezing (Warm Nalgene, socks, electronics) so you should size for that as well.
I have the klymit V and damn near froze to death in northern minnesota with it. Right after that trip I bought a pad with an R value of 5 and that one held up fine in the cascades at lower temps. The klymit is awesome for summer temps though and I love how wide it is as my arms don't fall off.
Super helpful information. Putting together a lightweight sleep system currently with a "do-all" approach. Grabbed the Klymit insulated pad as I live in North Dakota but I was not aware of the ATSM rating. I'll have to test it out in multiple conditions. Combining it with a Snugpak Tactical 3. Basically, the two should cover 75% of the year for me with extreme winter being more problematic. But, weight and cost limits the "do-all" approach I am going for. Anyway, great work!
Ten years in the grunts and never used anything more than an iso mat. More often we just leaned against a tree and called it home.
@@planetclownfishbrain7052 camping is a recreational activity, war and training is not. i care about comfort when im camping, in a war all i care about is living
Experienced winter camper from Quebec here.
Best trick: place a 1cm thick closed foam cell sleeping pad, custom cut to fit, INSIDE your -15C rated mummy sleeping bag. Place your regular inflatable sleeping pad or another 1cm closed cell sleeping pad under your sleeping bag. If you wish to double your under-bag insulation: lay approximately 3-4cm of spruce/pine/fir fronds under your tent. Ensure your tent/sleep area is not on frozen ground (5-30 cm layer of snow is perfect).
However: I sleep in a tarp lean-to for winter conditions and lay a short tarp on top of the evergreen boughs; just use the sleeping pad inside my mummy bag - that's all (the open fire reflects the heat - very toasty).
Thank you Thank you Thank you. I am just getting back into tent camping after a lifetime of not doing it. Great information Dan. I bought the Diamond Park 0 degree bag that has the fitted attachment to a pad. I haven't used it yet but looking forward to it. Of course, most of my camping is from my motorcycle and truck
Thanks Dan, I learned something -- moving within the bag. BTW, I have the Outdoor Vitals 0F Down Bag. Like it. Couldn't decide between the 0F and -15F. But for my area I think the 0F is pretty good.
Thanks Dan for the information. If you can't get a good night's sleep while camping or on the trail, you might as well stay home because your trip will be ruined. You need to be alert out there and lack of sleep can really be dangerous.
love your point about rolling inside the bag vs. rolling with the bag. I have a Big Agnes and, not sure if all BA are like this, but the one I have has a sleeve on the bottom into which slide the pad. It makes it impossible for the bag to roll with you, keeps the pad under you all night. The drawback is I have to use a fairly narrow pad to fit the sleeve, but the construction of the bag/sleeve do a nice job of keeping you on the pad as you roll around.
Hey Dan, have you ever done a sub-$100 sleeping pad comparison? Maybe something split up with $0 to $50 pads and $50 to $100 pads? That would be awesome for us that are outfitting new Boy Scouts that are on a budget. Keep up the great videos, we'll keep watching!
Oh a video for Boy Scouts would be awesome!! My Boy Scout has a nice setup, but for those with no experience it would be great to make sure they have items to ensure they grow to love camping!!
Closed cell foam pads are better for cold weather than inflatables, and are much more budget friendly for scouts.
@@kristopherkrahl1597 I've carried a closed cell pad for years. I used it year round and for warmer weather I went with a blanket and sheet. It weighed about 3lbs, but when I was younger, the good night sleep was worth the weight of the pad. It's been on many backpacking trips and has served me well over the past 25 years. There is always a trade off on weight for comfort, chose wisely for equipment isn't cheap.
Take care and have fun.
@kristopherkrahl1597 For those of us who are *ahem* more middle aged (mid-40s) and some aches here & there - let's say lower back, for instance- how comfortable are these? I've known one person who camps very often (keeps a Thermarest roll up pad & sleeping bag in his truck "just in case"), but he's a lot younger than me, and just looking at the pad makes my joints ache imagining my bony hips and hips & shoulders touching the ground through the pad at 330 in the morning. But, maybe I'm wrong?? 🤷♀️
Hey Dan, thanks for the great video, I've never been able to get the right advice on a good sleep system. This summed in up in a great way. thanks very much.
During my time in the army we camped outside for a few times when it was freezing. We had a waterproof outside bag, then a yoga mat pad, then the sleeping bag and finally a thin, blue sleeping bag. Worked great even though we were sleeping on the naked, dirty ground.
Wow. I saw this and was like „oh, one of those videos….“ - but this was really really informative, covering many things that a beginner might not know and start believing sleeping outside is uncomfortable! Also I second the repair kit thing; my Thermarest suffered a minor spark from the camp fire on a trip, and wouldn’t hold air at all anymore. I was very lucky to have brought a repair kit with me, so I could continue the trip without the hassle to find a camping store in a foreign country. That was about 10 years ago, and I still use that same Thermarest every time I go outdoors, patched and all.
The glasses and dandy boy spotless clothing really do make him look like a glamper d-bag
Solid advice...I definitely started out with some sleeping pads and bags that we not right for me...I now have the Klymit Static V Luxe pad with the V sheet and just received my new Big Agnes Echo Park 20 bag...I've also been using a piece of Reflectix insulation cut the width and length of the pad underneath everything...I feel it makes a pretty big difference
Thanks for the brilliant reflectix tip. Had to look up what it was....and it is non-carcinogenic and non-toxic as you are aware!
@@deathfuntaxes k
Large (not regular) RidgeRest is the affordable and foolproof Winter pad. Bulky yes, but no chance your hip bone mashes down to the frozen ground as a side sleeper. Also durable and doubles as a seat when making a snow couch and other such things.
This is true. We have an inflatable mattress that we add on top of a double cot. When we don't use the inflatable mattress, it gets extremely cold!
Wow I didn't not know anything other than they made some sleeping bags/pads for freezing weather too. This gives me a lot more to think on and research, especially as a side sleeper!
Thank you Dab Becker!
I've been using a self-inflating (orange) Therm-a-rest pad since they first came out and have never had a problem even camping at the higher elevations in the Cascade Mountains in the winter. My extreme winter bag was made by Feathered Friends back in the early 90s and is rated -10. I've never been cold.
I discovered a nifty trick where I bought a cotton fitted sheet for a queen-sized mattress and I use it inside of my sleeping bag. This helped keep alot of warmth inside my sleeping bag when the fall temps started dropping around 40-50 deg F at night. The fitted ends of the sheet helps alot by keeping my feet wrapped inside so I dont have cold feet at night.
EDIT: I forgot to mention the extra weight of the sheet really didnt make much of a difference (IMO) keeping things “ultra-light” in my rucksack as I keep it stuffed inside my sleeping bag when its rolled up for storage.
I use a flannel sheet inside my bag too.
We call it a bed scarf.
i have been holding my own in lots of camping scenarios but i still learned from ur video, thank you !
Yep, super glad I got a EE quilt. Much better for tossing and turning even in cold weather.
Just bought the Western Mountaineering Alpinlite 20 and yes I have the static V Sleeping Pad. Never ending with upgrading. Told my wife this was the last item 10 items ago 😆
Just a note. I have the same Klymit sleeping pad but the insulated static V one and not the lite and has an R value of 4.4 and is a 4 season sleeping pad. It packs down incredibly small and weighs 700g. I use it all year round and never had issue with it.
I dumped my inflatable pad and went for closed cell foam pad at my first stop on my Appalachian Trail hike - Didn't want to have to worry about deflation, plus it was a pain to constantly deflate and reinflate, even for the self-inflating pads. Less things to go wrong, the better. Also, critical are waterproof stuff sacks for sleeping bag to keep them dry - it can mean the difference between life or death. Once your down bag gets wet, that could be the end of your hike or more depending on where you are and how cold it is outside.
loved this! Still working out the fine details of my sleep system before I leave for cross Canada cycle on Friday!
It took me buying two mummy shaped narrow pads before I realized be the single, only reason I couldn't sleep was just because the pad wasn't wide enough. I'm a lightweight hiker and a 25 inch wide rectangular pad is ESSENTIAL
This video was SO helpful! I just completed my 3rd backcountry, 3-season experience with my current sleep system and this last trip I REALLY felt the cold at night. I was disappointed because the comfort rating on my sleeping bag is at least 10 C colder than the nighttime temp. This video has me convinced that the rating on my Klymit V sleeping pad is the culprit.
Everyone has a different metabolism, so ratings are just a rule of thumb. Always have wool or synthetic thermal underwear for sleeping.
@@Rock_Gear_Mtn And I always have a pair of down booty's in my bag. Warm feet make all the difference in the world to a man that can handle being a little cold throughout the nite. There is really no solution for the females
I sewed together a sleeve to go over my Klymit Static V for those cold nights. I made it out of a thin wool blanket and a piece of a sil-nylon camping tarp that was getting old and worn out. The nylon goes under the pad and the wool on top, of course. I can't tell you the added R-value, but I can tell you that it is remarkably warmer than the naked pad. It does add 16 ounces to my sleeping setup, but I only have to use it in the cold winter months. It's a heck of a lot cheaper than buying the insulated Thermorest.
@@kevinhikes3132 Thanks. If you make it, make sure to leave it a little loose so that the v-channels of the Klymit pad still work properly... and it makes it easier to put on and remove, of course. Thanks for the reply..
This really gave me some good stuff to think about it. I'm a middle-aged dude, still fairly fit from mil service but way out of practice and trying to gear up for some backpacking. There's a lot I can do without but quality sleep is absolutely vital for me.
I know it is overkill and extra weight, but it's totally worth it to have a closed cell foam pad under your sleeping bag, and and some kind of inflatable one inside your sleeping bag. helps with the rolling issue as well.
I’ve never had a problem with cardboard over a divet dug into the snow/dirt. Fill the 2-3 inch deep torso+ sized hole with something airy from the environment. Even just small sticks and leaves is fine, as you place the cardboard over the top of the hole. Tarp gets folded with two layers between the inside and outside of whatever hovel you set up. usually tucked next to a Bush or someplace out of the wind with the top suspended with a corsage.This setup will make even a regular 2-season tent comfortable so long as you have a fire going.
Or you can spend 1000$ on gear you will use 3 times a year and need to replace often.
Lol. Yep. Why not just bring the whole bedroom set too while they’re at it. Pillows and all. Don’t forget the nightlight!
I've taken my Klymit Insulated Static V camping in low 30-degree F weather and was warm; but this is great info to learn!
I've used the Klymit Static V in -18 C (0 F) weather, right on top of the snow. Slept great, and was super warm.
I know it's probably frowned on, but I put my pad inside my sleeping bag with me and it's really made a big difference in how warm I stay. Its gotten rid of the shivering sleepless nights for me
I do that when I take my narrow pad because I was rolling off of it. One thing I do that I've been frowned upon for is I take my boots into my bag with me. They stay behind my knees, and are toasty warm in the morning.
What is the downside of putting the pad inside the bag?
@@NikkiLounsbury The bottom of the bag is more likely to get wet without the pad below it. I only use my narrow one in dry weather, so it just stays put better on the inside. I take a wider one otherwise.
I double it, I have a pad inside and one outside. But my bag I've had since I was young, quilted felt and fuzzy warm inside, open it up on the side and its good in the summer.
I don't find bags like this anymore. Most the smooth satiny insides tend to make me really sweaty and uncomfortable.
I do same inside gortex bivy. I have a weird system of setting up my sleep system, tying 550 around the foot end so I can hang upside down, then lighting my UCO candle lantern under the head opening to allow lanten to heat whole sleep system GP included. Seems overkill except in extreme circumstances then it works great (I'm typing this so I haven't froze to death yet).
WARNING: DO NOT LEAVE UNATTENDED! BE VERY CAREFUL OF FIRE!
Back before sleeping pads had the insulation rating, I was taught to put a wool blanket under neath my sleeping pad. It seemed to help.
I take a wool blanket and a sheepskin on tours in colder weather. It's heavy but so worth it!
Is it better to have it under the pad or between you and the pad?
A good vid for all beginners, Ive made all the misstakes and its not cheap to buy these if you good quality stuff, have 4 sleeping bags, 2 sleeping mats and 2 quilts. Now i have the setup that works best for me, a little bit bigger sleeping pad and a quilt. Still use the old ones depending on the weather thou. Wish this vid came out before I started camping :D
I had one of those Klymit pads. It was supposed to be in the upper 30's and it dropped down to 26F. I was pretty cold. Survivable, wasn't ever nervous. But don't sleep much at all. Still use it 3 season.
Used static V and found it comfortable but not very warm. Used it during a Manitoba Canada cold snap that was in the -40s. Had to put other insulation with it (parka underneath me).
Took it out a couple years later ( same temp range) but paired with a Z rest on top and was warm.
Z rest above the Static? Don't you mean underneath?
@@ryand141 No I put the closed cell pad on top of the air mattress.
My logic agreed with you and said to put the closed cell under the inflatable to provide additional puncture resistance. Another good RUclipsr, ALinsdau, suggested placing the closed cell on top. I tried it that way and was not disappointed. Was even sleeping with a surplus Canadian Army sleeping bag modified into a sleep quilt, so no down underneath me. The reasoning behind it is closed cell pads warm up faster than the nylon.
May I suggest you watch his video entitled "How not to freeze on an air mat while camping in the cold" he explains it better and far more entertainingly than I can.
Excellent video Dan, I really enjoyed you having all the gear present to show exactly what you were speaking on. I picked up a 20" pad trying to save weight and space-only to trade out for a 25" after having to sleeping like a vampire. I traditionally run marathons in my sleep, so it was a lesson learned the hard way! Take Care!
"Run marathons in my sleep" that's a great way of describing those of us who move around a lot. I love that. LOL!!!
Since the bottom of the bag is crushed and no longer insulating, put the air mat inside the bag. It stabilizes the mat with bag so they work as a team, not sliding off into the side of the shelter, secures the sleeping bag from twisting when you move, and your body heat suffuses the air space in the mattress, and is then held there by the crushed insulation underneath you.
The best thing I did for my air mattress was to buy a can of flexseal
Good mattresses usually come with a piece of patch fabric that it’s made of. That a great piece to test the flexseal.
I bought a mattress from Backcountry. It had a design flaw and went flat the first time I used it. Verrata I believe. Anyway, they told me I didn’t have to send it back. So with that I used flexseal and it fixed it and I have a replacement as well that I preventively sprayed.
It starts at 0:24... just look at the camera man's stance in Dan's glasses.... now that's stability, structure, dedication.