I was surprised to see tailroom was an sub archetype! I used that for a single game in a small doubles draft tournament a few years back, basically by accident. Originally I just drafted to have 2 mostly separate teams, one for trickroom and one for tailwind. I figured it gave me an almost coinflip advantage of my opponent having to guess which one I'd bring that match. But with one particular player who was notably good and was towards the end of the tourny, I didn't feel I could beat them without something new, since by now I've shown both teams pretty heavily. I brought both trick and tail and successfully used both in that match to win it. Definitely my proudest game of those tourneys, though not something I could ever be consistent with. Too many moving parts, gotta make sure the right units are in at the right time or else you're sabotaging yourself and wasting TR/Tail turns.
It definitely requires a good balance and skill to use both on the same team. Glad to see another draft player around, after my VGC videos I do plan to have some info on drafts!
@@TheAweDude1 Fair, it is similar in the way it affects the whole field but it only has one effect whereas weathers have multiple interactions. It also doesn't overwrite weathers is why It is not considered with them. An automatic TR setting ability would be interesting but probably way too powerful.
Decided to watch this. I love your content and it's a shame you have so little subscribers. I'm new but if you haven't already, maybe make a video about going into speed control and trick room more deeply. I feel like there is a lot of history and interesting things about it. Anyway, just thought I would comment and say that I subbed.
@@notprogamer6 Thanks! I did touch on it in the stats video but I agree a full video on it would be useful, I'll put it on the list for upcoming videos, great suggestion!
@@NotGord Huh, never heard of pokemon autochess somehow but yea looks like the sprites are from the same place. I linked them in the description if you want to see them all.
My problem with trick room in VGC is that if it's a hard TR team that needs it up, you cannot stop it. It will come up at least one time. Due to hard TR teams using mental herb to prevent taunt or something similar, you know it's coming but can't stop it. Your only solution is to punish the set up turn as hard as possible and hope you can live through the next 4 turns of butt whooping you're about to receive. You can't even outplay it with priority most of the time because they run quick guard, farigaraf, or just psychic terrain. It's infuriating and every VGC player knows their team needs multiple checks to TR and even then, most top teams run TR anyway as a slow option or as a way to reverse an opponents setup of TR. Been playing VGC since gen 5 and I'm so sick of it
@@nicholasperry2302 I can see how it's frustrating for sure. Once it's up it is hard to stop but there is still counterplay. For example imprison and Trick Room is a tool I have found success with since they usually can't stop you from clicking that. Once it's up you are on the back foot for sure but that's just the playstyle, they should have an advantage once they get it up just how tailwind gives an advantage once up. I'm planning on doing videos how to play against different teams in the future stay tuned if you're interested in that!
hard TR teams can be incredibly hard to deal with, but they have very concrete gameplans. they always have basically two possible leads and every game functions very similarly. setup trickroom at all costs, try to explode the enemy team before it expires. these strats always have a place in the metagame but they are exploitable. you need to really think about the matchup for any serious team and prepare specific counter leads
I love hard trick room lol it’s so good. I definitely understand the frustration though, I felt the same way about expanding force before I knew about wide guard. But the fact that it necessitates a specific counter that only some Pokemon are capable of, is kinda annoying. Like needing to taunt or needing to stop priority is similar to being forced to run a flutter mane, urshifu, or archalodon counter. What if I want give that team slot to a Mon that isn’t scizor, gastrodon, or galade? The heart of the issue is power creep imo. And it’s unfortunate that so many cool Pokémon struggle to keep up. The higher the power level, the stiffer the counter-play. (Big fan of gen 9 regulation H because of the lack of higher stats enables more of the dex to actually be playable/viable)
Pokepastes are in the description for each archetype in Reg H! If you want to try one out or get an idea for a team that fits each archetype.
Looks like the youtube algorithm is finally starting to do you some justice. Huge fan of your Zero to Hero series!
@@jasindu9139 Glad you enjoy! Yea this vid is getting pretty good traction.
I was surprised to see tailroom was an sub archetype!
I used that for a single game in a small doubles draft tournament a few years back, basically by accident.
Originally I just drafted to have 2 mostly separate teams, one for trickroom and one for tailwind. I figured it gave me an almost coinflip advantage of my opponent having to guess which one I'd bring that match.
But with one particular player who was notably good and was towards the end of the tourny, I didn't feel I could beat them without something new, since by now I've shown both teams pretty heavily.
I brought both trick and tail and successfully used both in that match to win it. Definitely my proudest game of those tourneys, though not something I could ever be consistent with.
Too many moving parts, gotta make sure the right units are in at the right time or else you're sabotaging yourself and wasting TR/Tail turns.
It definitely requires a good balance and skill to use both on the same team. Glad to see another draft player around, after my VGC videos I do plan to have some info on drafts!
the little bubbles at 12:42 make the videos so much more intresting
I really like kommo-o as my main set-up sweep pokemon in double battles
@@rashawn3718 Omniboosts are always fun when you can get them off!
Great video! Clear information delivered in a clean presentation. I hope you continue to make these, subscribing!
I always considered Trick Room just another type of weather, just one without an automatic setter.
@@TheAweDude1 Fair, it is similar in the way it affects the whole field but it only has one effect whereas weathers have multiple interactions. It also doesn't overwrite weathers is why It is not considered with them. An automatic TR setting ability would be interesting but probably way too powerful.
very informative video, thank you!
Eeerm you didn't mention where the name archetype comes from aka from karl jung's propositions in psychology 🤓☝️
@@lolmenx4 0.o
thought you meant archetypes as in regional mammals, birds, bugs, pseudos, etc lol oop
Decided to watch this. I love your content and it's a shame you have so little subscribers. I'm new but if you haven't already, maybe make a video about going into speed control and trick room more deeply. I feel like there is a lot of history and interesting things about it. Anyway, just thought I would comment and say that I subbed.
@@notprogamer6 Thanks! I did touch on it in the stats video but I agree a full video on it would be useful, I'll put it on the list for upcoming videos, great suggestion!
Is that the pokemon auto chess iron bundle profile thing?
@@NotGord Huh, never heard of pokemon autochess somehow but yea looks like the sprites are from the same place. I linked them in the description if you want to see them all.
Interesting video!
@@x_bell1142 Thanks, big fan of your stuff!
❤
Biggest weaknesses of stall are body odor and virginity
My problem with trick room in VGC is that if it's a hard TR team that needs it up, you cannot stop it. It will come up at least one time. Due to hard TR teams using mental herb to prevent taunt or something similar, you know it's coming but can't stop it. Your only solution is to punish the set up turn as hard as possible and hope you can live through the next 4 turns of butt whooping you're about to receive. You can't even outplay it with priority most of the time because they run quick guard, farigaraf, or just psychic terrain. It's infuriating and every VGC player knows their team needs multiple checks to TR and even then, most top teams run TR anyway as a slow option or as a way to reverse an opponents setup of TR. Been playing VGC since gen 5 and I'm so sick of it
@@nicholasperry2302 I can see how it's frustrating for sure. Once it's up it is hard to stop but there is still counterplay. For example imprison and Trick Room is a tool I have found success with since they usually can't stop you from clicking that. Once it's up you are on the back foot for sure but that's just the playstyle, they should have an advantage once they get it up just how tailwind gives an advantage once up.
I'm planning on doing videos how to play against different teams in the future stay tuned if you're interested in that!
Honestly feel the same way about Pelipper and rain teams, it’s hell. Balance is usually the most fun, Gen 7 was peak.
hard TR teams can be incredibly hard to deal with, but they have very concrete gameplans. they always have basically two possible leads and every game functions very similarly. setup trickroom at all costs, try to explode the enemy team before it expires. these strats always have a place in the metagame but they are exploitable. you need to really think about the matchup for any serious team and prepare specific counter leads
Mimiku made tr so easy!!!!!!!
I love hard trick room lol it’s so good. I definitely understand the frustration though, I felt the same way about expanding force before I knew about wide guard.
But the fact that it necessitates a specific counter that only some Pokemon are capable of, is kinda annoying. Like needing to taunt or needing to stop priority is similar to being forced to run a flutter mane, urshifu, or archalodon counter. What if I want give that team slot to a Mon that isn’t scizor, gastrodon, or galade?
The heart of the issue is power creep imo. And it’s unfortunate that so many cool Pokémon struggle to keep up. The higher the power level, the stiffer the counter-play.
(Big fan of gen 9 regulation H because of the lack of higher stats enables more of the dex to actually be playable/viable)
Very good video!
My favorite Archetypes are Trickroom and Stall! :D
Slow playstyle I see!
I wish we had some abilities that worked with Trick Room and Gravity like we've recently gotten with Tailwind.
@@Bigdaddy93413 That would be super cool, maybe next gen. Built in room service or something
Making you my least favourite competitive player Archetype
(For legal purposes this is a joke)
I skew too stall and balance. I play mostly singlea tho.
@@Awesum Stall for sure is better in singles, balance is solid in both formats I find.