Who hired the Catspaw Assassin?
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- Опубликовано: 28 май 2024
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Just on a side note. Hat off to the actor who played the assassin in the show. It was only a small role but he made it a very memorable one.👏
Very similar to the actor Oberyn stabbed in the brothel. Or the female wildling at the battle of Hardhome. The Bard whom Joffrey asked to choose his hands or Tongue. I can name probably 20 more. They only have 1 min of screentime and they always nailed it. 💯
Interesting that the Starks didn’t hire someone to find it out for them? I appreciate the Agatha Christie type elements to Game of Thrones. Perhaps they should have brought in Braavosi detective Hercule of House Poirot.
Littlefinger is of Bravosi origin and Catelyn goes tonhim for help investigating, sure, theres no money involved, but Littlefinger is kinda in debt to catelyn because she begged Brandon for his life when they were younger.
The should’ve called in Frank of house Columbo lmao
Or Tony Shaloub as Adrian the Maddening Monk.
This is the best cross over I could ever imagine
Or Benoit of House Blanc.
Robert saying “hidey-hole” is just too adorable.
And "nomenclature"
I don't think I've heard a non-rhotic speaker say it and I nearly giggled.
(note: I love his narration as well as the content of his videos, such a superb channel)
@@yondie491I'm with you! He's got such a smooth, soothing, voice, plus the quality and content he offers. Robert is the best.😊
Hes so adorable right ^^
Sometimes I wonder what would happen differently, and the ripple effects, of Joffrey had at least the sense of Cersei. No cat paw incident. Lady lives. And Ned sent to the Wall. Possibly nowhere near as strong an opportunity for Littlefinger to create as strong a storm, no Tyrion taken hostage, no Ned-Jaime confrontation, probably no immediate Lannister-Stark war. Ned could still bumble around to confronting Cersei over the affair, stick with Stannis, object to assassinating Daenerys. Maybe no fatal hunting trip for King Robert. Littlefinger still trying to find opportunities, and likely Varys if at a slower pace. Would be a great video: if Joffrey had at least as much common sense as Cersei.
I always think that exact "what if"
Its crazy that the library wasnt under constant guard and limited access
Before the printing press, every book in the library would be worth somrthing close to the valyrian steel dagger. Literally the biggest most inportant treasure in winterfell
No they wouldn't, not even close to the same value, books while exspesive cab be duplicated by anyone so long as they take there time and have the resources, even the illiterate, they would just struggle in making a high quality copy, valerian steel is completely impossible to recreate and is basically a super steel, leagues beyond what everyone else has around them, it's so rare, that tywin had been trying to get a valyern steel sword for his entier life
Your voice is so eloquent and clear. It's a pleasure to listen to you.
It's right in the name. It was Balerion the cat and meant to be attacking Catelyn to be supreme the cat of Westeros. 😂
Or so Ser Pounce would have us believe!
It is known
Balerion the black cat needed to eliminate Bran the broke to clear the way for his own son: The Prince that was promised Ser Pounce
clearly it was Hodor or Hodor's mom, trying to change the timeline
He doesn't want to hold the door anymore
It said the assassin know well winterfell. It was the last son of hodor's mom/old nan (she was lying all his sons died in the war)
@@YogaPratama-gt7bdyeah but if it’s a timeline thing it could’ve been old nans old nan.
One option is Mance Rayder. In the books, he visits Winterfell at the time of this, with a bag of silver. And wildlings believe in killing “for mercy.” And it sent the Northern armies south, so the wildings could have a chance to attack the wall.
Mance wants to lead the wildings sputh to safety. I wouldnt be murdering the son of the ,aan who owns the land thaat im eventually going to have to negotiate to stay within. Also killing Bran has no strategic value, it doesnt weaken the Starks (2nd in line to winterfell, with a younger brother and even a spare bastard), Brans killing waas a lot more personal and rushed, which is why it failed.
I don't see Mance as the type to kill an innocent child, and the full extent of Bran's injuries was not yet known
How did he get the dagger?
@@Rumkitty2000 Mance's sister in law, Val certainly believed in giving Mercy (Death) to sick children (Shireen). Not sure why a crippled child would be any diffrent for Mance.
@@chrisrubin6445 But what I'm saying is that they don't know that he won't recover . Obviously they know his legs are broken or his spine was damaged, but they won't know until he wakes up. And if Mance believes so strongly, why couldn't/didn't he do it himself?
Preston Jacobs generates a lot of tinfoil, but his critiques of this explanation are correct. It's really incoherent, with Joffrey only talking to Sandor about killing a literal direwolf because that's what was annoying him while he didn't care about Bran. The simplest explanation is that GRRM originally planned for it to be Jaime/Cersei (there are also drafts in which it's clear they poisoned Jon Arryn), but made Jaime less villainous as the books went on and decided to reassign blame to Joffrey.
As for your one additional point about the library, no need to assume the assassin's client's opinion of books matters. The assassin did that himself as a distraction, so only his own opinion of books would matter.
RE: the library- exactly. The assassin could simply have been told to "cause a distraction, start a fire," and made the choice of library himself
@@sblinder1978 The assassin was told to kill the boy and maybe to wait for a few days after the king's party left. That's all.
How dare you impugn the tin foil of Lord Jacobs! It's all I've had for years! Really though, I probably wouldn't have read the Thousand Worlds Saga or Armageddon Rag without his introduction to the material.
TOP 5 ASOIAF THEORISTS: GO!
I believe the original plan was to have Cersei send the assassin with Robert's dagger, the same way she was meant to have had Jon Arryn murdered.
Jaime's statement that "Cersei had no secrets for him" in ACOK would have been wrong.
GRRM scrapped that when he decided to make Cersei smarter than using an easily identifiable weapon and loaded that stupidity onto Joffrey.
@clownpendotfart I like a lot of Preston's material, and this video felt a lot like a response to his idea that it wasn't Joff. However, I feel Preston's argument on this one is pretty weak, as it mostly relies on pointing out the irrationalities the plan. I find it a weak argument simply because Joffrey is never portrayed as a particularly rational character. Robert (In Deep Geek, not Bobby B.) does a good job here of pointing out how these actions ARE in line with Joffrey's character.
People are not innately rational, only capable of being so. If you want evidence, then read the comment above your own. It's arguing for Mance Rayder being the culprit. The Valyrian steel dagger isn't mentioned at all and I can't imagine the mental gymnastics you would have to do in order to provide an adequate explanation for that not so minor detail.
I always assumed "catspaw" was just another way of saying a "padfoot" or "cutthroat." An unsavoury type hired specifically for their willingness to do anything for coin, no matter how foul. Interesting how the term was seemingly a source of confusion for some
I thought it was a refetence to the House Lannister lion sigil
@@oleyullah whoa..I never thought of that. It just makes even more sense now. I really like this as a mystery but if grrm heavily implies that Joff did it, perhaps with indirect prompting from LF, i can accept that.
Think “patsy” … like Oswald
@@GeneralBlorp yeah I can't help but feel a little bad for the guy. Another example of "smallfolk just want to be left alone...they never are." It sucks how regular people are treated like disposable meat to be thrown in the grinder as needed. But it's cruicial to building the grounded feeling of most of the series. Games like this cannot be played without substantial human cost.
Our catspaw was seemingly just a random guy. Maybe he was an evil man, maybe he was a sot looking to buy another flagon and a bowl o brown. Perhaps he was desperate to support a family? We will never know because he's just a pawn to be used
In the books, characters they refer to someone doing someone else's dirty work as a "catspaw", it's a relatively common phrase and I'm surprised it causes confusion among people who've actually read them.
What still doesn’t make sense is why, if Valerian steel is so rare that not even the Lannisters have any, would Littlefinger casually wage such a weapon or Joffrey entrust it to a random disreputable stranger?
Yeah Joffrey is careless and carefree in terms of money, but he loves weapons, and knows that neither of his families have a Valerian steel sword. Doesn't seem like a gift he would've thrown away, nor would it have necessarily gone unnoticed by Robert that it was missing, despite his general lack of attention to his kids.
Yes, because Joffrey is - excuse the bluntness - a serious dumbass in character. He has literally no clue whats going on in the world, nor in his direct proximity. He is king by blood, so he thinks and that is what matters... that is what creates matter in his mind. A dagger of valyrian steel is a special thing for sure in his eyes, but as prince or soon-to-be-king he could order all sorts of folks to go and fetch him another weapon of that value.
The Lannisters did have a Valyrian steel sword in their house at one point. I forget the name of the specific Lannister, but one of them journeys to Valyria (post-doom) but dies there, leaving the family without a sword of their own until the main story.
It's a dagger not a longsword that could have been use as a symbol. Euron gave a bunch of valyrian steel daggers during the Kingsmoot.
We don't know that he wagered it casually. It depends how much Robert was wagering in return
Plus, it's a hell of a way to make a good impression on Robert, if he was trying to get into the King's confidence. A man who would wager such a valuable prize looks like he must be very rich, but also not greedy. And he's ballsy. That would impress Robert either way. Winning would have made Littlefinger a big profit, and losing would have made Robert very happy and well-disposed to Littlefinger
All added together, it might have been a shrewd move, and worth the risk of losing
It was Cat's Paw.. so, it was obviously Cat. The last one anyone would expect.
Roflol
I really don't get the argument that the assassin was inept. You have a stranger successfully infiltrate a heavily guarded area, successfully set fire to it, leave the area of the fire to successfully gain access to the room of an unwell noble. Either he is the luckiest idiot or he isn't unskilled.
I would say he’s a combination of clever, lucky, and inexperienced
I mean he would have succeeded if not for Summer
You can do almost anything if you don't look out of place, or just out of place enough. For example, you can sit in a college class you don't attend if you have a bag and a laptop, or you can enter almost any building if you have a hard hat and a reflective vest or a toolbelt and are carrying a ladder. 😂
Agree. He may not necessarily been a problem, but he was fairly smart the way he went about it. I just think Cat's presence there caught him by surprise and he needed a few seconds to "regroup."
Or he didn't act alone
Reminds me of the "who will rid me of this troublesome priest" bit
One of the few mysteries that is actually solved by the characters... even if it isn't the characters it mattered to the most.
I'm fully convinced that the Joffrey answer was a retcon by George. Either he had intended it to be someone else, or didn't have the answer at the beginning and had to come up with some explanation later.
The conclusion that Joffrey did it only makes sense if you don't think about it too hard. The logic used by Tyrion to reach his conclusion is pretty flawed.
For example, if you go back and read the scene where Joffrey allegedly said "send a dog to kill a wolf", you'll see that that's not what he actually said. That whole scene is quite different from how Tyrion remembers it later.
that's the problem with memory. Sometimes, it gets fuzzy.
I agree with Joffrey as the culprit being a retcon. If I had to guess, I'd say George originally intended Jamie to be the one who hired the catspaw as part of his villain arc. However, when GRRM decided to give him a redemptive arc he needed to find a different culprit instead. Joffrey does fit the profile in terms of cruelty, but he wanted the dire wolves put down because they were howling a lot, he didn't really care about Bran, killing Bran as an act of mercy according to Robert Baratheon does sound like a son trying to impress his father, but the last time Joffrey tried to impress Robert by killing something (in that case a cat) Robert beat him, not exactly an incentive to carry it out for fatherly approval, especially the son of his father's best friend which could mean war. Some have argued it was Mance Rayder who hired the assassin, Mance was in the group supposedly to size up Robert and go to the crypts possibly searching for the horn of winter, Mance would of also seen killing Bran as a mercy and the result does work in Mance's favor with the armies of the north heading south to fight and not be able to reinforce the nights watch with no evidence tying Mance to the attempted murder. Then again how would he know about the dagger's origin? Worse still if the assassin was caught and told that Mance hired him, that makes his attempt to get the wildlings south almost impossible with the Warden of the North reinforcing the Nights Watch against the wildings. I guess GRRM saw making Joffrey as the culprit the best of the bad options available to retcon this knowing their would be some plot holes to it.
Yeah this is one of the few instances when I think George retconned something. It does feel like a weak explanation and at the beginning of book one we’re almost sure that it was either Cersei, Jaime or someone in that household with the means and gall to do it. Joff was way too young to get away with hiring an assassin and like the other person said, that’s no way to impress your royal father lol.
It makes little sense for Joffrey to hire the assassin. They're leaving and he has nothing to gain from it. He wouldn't even know Bran was killed unless the Starks decide to broadcast the news through the world. Only Jaime and Cersei have a need to silence Bran in that moment and none of them would need to give away Robert's dagger. They would pay in gold.
As to all other "suspects", none of them have access to Robert's dagger except Robert himself.
I don’t think it’s that there’s a ton of evidence that it’s Joffrey. However, there’s a lot of evidence it couldn’t have been anyone else. Reasonable doubt so we can’t convict but…. we all know OJ
Hodor or Ser Pounce. Definitely one of them.
Always Ser Pounce. The true spider.
Joffrey really is the only one that fits. The dagger itself limits the pool of suspects being something owned by the King of Westeros. Not many people would have access to it.
Jamie is too seasoned and tactically sound to hire such a bad assassin to do the job, and has no reason to arm the assassin with the Kings dagger. Cercei is too smart to arm the assassin with such a recognizable weapon or let them go in with no information.
Only Joffrey has access to the dagger and is stupid enough to arm the assassin with a knife from his own house and not give the assassin any information to assist in the kill. My guess his motivation was not to gain his fathers approval, but to place a wedge between his father and the Starks. If thats true, little-finger actually thwarted that silly plan by shifting the blame to Tyrion for his own gains
Excellent video!! One of the best and most interesting I’ve watched in days. Thank uou
Bran did, from the future. 😂
Preston?
At least he didn't send a Terminator.
@@TheCman183 Did Preston do it? That would be a twist.
Why do you think I came all this way,.........he probably saw the useless character he turned into by season 8, and infact sent someone for his younger version of himself
I feel that the Blood-Raven/Bran fan-fiction time travel plot, hinted at in the show is the most compelling.
Hello Robert, love your work!
this makes complete sense, and the part that convinces me is that the person who hired the assassin must be someone who doesn't quite understand the value of the dagger, which fits him extremely well.
Well postulated and explained.
Top tier content as always mate
Yeay there it is. I saw it last week for about 10 minutes and then *puff* it disapeared.
I had the same experience. It was so confusing when I couldn't find it
think i noticed an audio glitch at the very end of the video when he first uploaded it last week , probably took it down to sort it out and then re-upload it once fixed.
@@AlexBB77Robert did say that he'd be doing that with some of his podcasts now that he had some new software/video or audio editing apps or something like that.
@@Rumkitty2000 yes he mentioned he is taking down a lot of older videos and re-doing them , with new info and general improvements. This might be one of those as well that he first made years ago. But when he first uploaded this again a couple Fridays ago there was an audio glitch at the very end of the video and seems he took it down to sort that out. IDG only left the vid up for about 15 minutes or so that day before taking it down , so i am assuming to fix that audio issue.
Bran from the future, as ridiculous as it sounds, is the only answer that makes sense.
Makes more sense than Joffrey certainly, the only problem is that there's no evidence supporting it, at least none that I'm aware of.
It turn out that Bran, just like Jon, don't wannit. He nevah has.
Make a part 2 and add Mance, Littlefinger, Future Bran and Bloodraven as possible candidates.
But LittleFinger wasn't even there! Would he even know that the dagger was among the weapons brought to Winterfell. Granted LF has his spies, but some things are hard to arrange Long distance
@@Rumkitty2000 I agree, but it's worth mentioning.
Of the opinion it was Little Finger, and very intrigued to hear IDG's opinion. Love a good mystery.
It was ser pounce. Thats why it's called "catspaw" assassin.
You should watch the series Preston Jacobs did on this matter. He argues with evidence against Joffrey being the culprit. Tyrion misremembers the "send a dog to kill a wolf" quote for instance.
I always thought it was Sercy who did it. She couldn’t have the child wake up and reveal what he saw.
*Cersei* or even the Greek *Circe* would have been acceptable. Don't use words that you don't know how to spell. Go back to school or read the books.
how does this guy not run away with this dagger
Run where or sell it to who?
He would be very dead after either.
I just discovered your channel, I love your presentation style, and your voice. Very good altogether.
I think it was given to Lysa by Littlefinger and after the tragedy that befell Bran, put all the pieces into play. The Starks already didn't trust the Lannisters (because of her letter), and after Catelyn found out who owned the dagger, Tyrion, she wanted retribution for Bran. By the direction of Littlefinger, Lysa poisoned her husband. So why not obey him by sending someone to kill your nephew? I don't think Joffrey cared about Bran enough for a mercy killing. Cruelty, yes, but mercy, no. It seemed to me, in my humble opinion, Littlefinger started the chaos, but Varys knew more than what he let on. He knew "of" the dagger, but not the origin. But why kill Bran to keep Jamie and Cersi's incest a secret? Knowledge is Power, Power is Power, but who really served the realm, and whom served themself?
I got the impression that the assassin wasn't meant to be successful, and that the dagger was involved to frame someone.
i hope you can start a new series where you do a step by step making your own fantasy universe, you dont need/"have to" start at the "big bang" (when the universe came into being) but it would be cool if you start 70.000 years into it and then work your way in broad strokes forward and backwards, going into this deep detail and after you have layed out a time line then you delve deep into a certain era, since this gives you choices aswell as a lot of creative freedom. and i cant even imagine what type of amazing world you could build having all this knowledge about all these universes at such a deep level. absolutely looove the content
Awesome and informative video sir
it was Mance Rayder, not Joffrey. Wildlings also believe "it's a mercy" to take out sick children. he climbed the Wall "with a bag of silver", wanted to "take the measure of this king", and saw an opportunity to sew trouble between the house that guards the North and the Lannisters.
Tyrion remembers the line as "send a dog to kill a wolf" but if you go back and actually read the line in aGoT it was "send a dog to kill a dog", explicitly talking about killing the dire wolf not Bran. Wish someone could ask grrm if it's a mistake in writing or not
I love the scene where Jaime and Tyrion puzzle it out as best they could, but it feels like theyre both looking at the camera at us while doing so.
That's the vibe i got when i read it, at least. Like it was GRRMs way of hastily wrapping up that loose end and telling the audience to stop trying to figure it out.
Great vid as always Robert. Joffrey def makes the most sense as to who actually hired the catspaw assassin. Joffrey certainly fits the rich / highly enough placed, cruel, careless and inexperienced enough character to hire an assassin not up to the task and with a dagger that could be traced back to the family no less. And Joffrey surely had access and familiarity with that dagger being his father / Bobby B won it off Littlefinger. And def fits Joffrey’s warped thinking & twisted mind that doing some cruel heinous act based on overhearing what Robert said would be a way to impress his father the king. Though Joffrey also being a cruel monster , such an act is an outlet for him to fulfill his blood lust and cruelty as well. The language of the assassin about mercy also lines up with what Joffrey heard King Robert saying about Bran's situation. The imagery this vid highlighted with Joffrey outside that same library talking about killing a “wolf” no less and later destroying a seemingly very nice book with such ease and disregard ; certainly would have no issue destroying books as part of the assassination plot.
Littlefinger who once had the dagger , was an early candidate , create chaos and divisions that he thrives in would be his way for sure. But LF was able to do that anyway with his usual tactics ; so even as seemingly not the hirer of at the assassin he was able to capitalize and benefit in his way just the same.
I blame old Nan, she was infuriated that Bran wasn't the Bran that she was waiting for.
InDeepGeek, you would have been a great lawyer. Many of the skills you use in literary analysis are translatable to law.
What happened to the Roberts Rebellion playlist?
What about Mance Rayder, he was there, he specifically said he had “a bag of silver”, he wouldn’t be allowed to visit Bran so might not know Cat never left his side. Mance wanted conflict between the Starks and Lannisters to weaken the realm for his army. He didn’t care about books, so would use a fire as a feint. Also, unlike Joffrey, he’s still alive to make for a dramatic reveal later.
Also, like someone else mentioned, the catspaw could have just not killed Bran and kept the money. If Joffrey were the client, the catspaw could do this safely as Joffrey had already left. If Mance was the client, however, he'd be able to make sure the Catspaw followed through.
But how could he have got his hands on the dagger? *gotten?
@@ranica47Robert had a reputation of drunkenly giving out lavish gifts. Mance was pretending to be a bard and probably played a bawdy song or two that Robert would have loved. It’s obviously a stretch, but it’s entirely possible it was Mance. Wildlings also would view it as a mercy
The three eyed crow set it in motion, Mance and the assassin were unknowing pawns.
@@ranica47 well if he was trying to cause conflict, which this theory claims, he could have stolen it from the King, causing conflict between Stag and Wolf. It would be a daring heist, but not as daring as Bael’s heist
Interesting video. I learned a lot. I always assumed it was Cersei. She had the strongest motive imo. Thanks for the awesome content Robert!
I think the thing that makes it confusing is that cat is in the room, then the cat's paw comes in but he has nothing to do with cat, and then he pulls out a cat's paw's dagger but it's not actually his and that becomes relevant later. There's a lot of cats and a couple paws and them not being related can kind of trip people up
Littlefinger would not have minded if bran was out of the way because if he had gotten cat back, then he wouldn't have a crippled boy to be looking after
For everyone saying that the assassin had to be skilled, or essentially it was “impossible” for him to infiltrate the inner sanctums of Winterfell.
This thing happens again, although it is to save a life rather than end one. When Theon and the wildling women are going to save “Arya” they really don’t do much in the terms of subterfuge. They simply dress as washer woman and have on their side a sense of vague familiarity since they had been attached to Abel/are seen around WF for a time.
The cats paw had most likely arrived with Roberts entourage. So he had been present in/around WF for at least a month. Enough for people to have gotten used to him, or have a sense of vague familiarity. Him putting the library to fire is actually pretty clever considering he knew it would draw the guards away, but it would not necessarily take a genius.
Seems pretty obvious that this was littlefinger. He orchadtrates the whole plot to put the starks and lannisters at each others throats and gives himself a way to worm into neds good books. Between the cats paw and lysas letter, it seems pretty clear that littlefinger had longlaid plans to get revenge on catlyn and the starks and there is no reason he cant get close to winterfell without notice, the north is a big empty place and the court is with the king so he wont be missed. Littlefinger explicity set this whole series of events in motion starting with fathering sweet robyn and convincing the mother to kill her husband. Of course robert will turn to ned and its not hard to believe littlefinger helped to push roberts focus north. I really dont see why just because littlefinger is good at omprov he is not able to plan ahead. That seems to be a common theme in these videos, which strikes me as very mistaken.
It was Mance Rayder. And there is no good argument to contrary. He is the only one with the Means Method and Motivation to do it.
He was there. He actually has reason to want the Starks and the Baratheons to conflict. He told Jon he went to Winterfell with only "a bag of silver" unlike the Lannisters who are famous for their GOLD.
I think the catspaw was sent dreams by someone/something who doesn't want Bran to reach Blood Raven. It's not as if BR would be the only being in Westeros (or elsewhere) who could potentially sense a powerful Greenseer. We can reasonably assume the arrival of Meera and Jojen was in some part due to BR's influence, why wouldn't the presence of other strangers in Winterfell be a consequence of dreams and/or visions being transmitted by some "other" outside influence?
One aspect about the assasin that wasn't mentioned is why did he do it? He had already received the silver and the dagger, why didn't he just sell the dagger, got even more silver or gold for it and lived happily as a relatively rich man? The man who hired him was far away and couldn't take revenge. He may not have been very skilled, but he was in some way reliable.
lmao the KING's SON gives u money and a priceless dagger to kill someone and u want to fck him over, the assassin probably thought it was an order from the king too so if he was to lets say run away, in his mind he would be a wanted man for the rest of his life always being on the run and won't live long enough to enjoy his wealth no matter where he went, especially with varys reputation. it reminds me of this book I read when a dude killed some people and wanted to run away before authorities caught him since reasoned that the king would be too busy to care about him. so in return the king ordered a group of men with the soul duty to find and kill this man along with spreading bounties throughout all the kingdoms. in the end the knights didn't even kill him, he was killed buy a group of children who saw his posters and were very desperate for food they didn't know what he did or why just that him dead = food. or a in world example is when cersie put out bounties for tyrion and the one time he went into the public he got kidnapped,
@@AniSwiftTVRecaps Fair point, although if the King's son hires an assasin instead of sending the King's Guard it implies he doesn't want the deed to be traced back to him so it is highly unlikely he will publicly put a price on his head saying: "I hired this guy to secretely kill Brandon Stark, but he didn't do it." Besides Tyrion was famous and highly recognizable. How do you put a prize on the head of a man you know little about and who hardly anyone knows? You would need to spread masterfully drawn pictures of the assasin through all the seven kingdoms. No sane man (okay this does not exactly rule Joffrey out) would go through this kind of trouble to find a man who stole a dagger and a bag of silver. Unless the assasin had a family and Joffrey knew where they lived the risk would be negligible. But perhaps the assasin was not intelligent enough to ralize this.
@@patrickdematosribeiro1845 no people wont know what he did they will just say he's a dangerous criminal, and yes drawings is how they would spread it with a description throughout all the kingdoms and seeing that he was last seen in the north and doesn't look northern at all he would likely be captured pretty fast, like remember when the people came for gendry all they needed was a description and they tracked him down fast asf, so if u say a thief stole the king heir valaryan steel dagger with a description, anyone who sees that dagger will know that he's a wanted criminal. though thinking about this the man did have a lot of silver which is something we are told joffery doesn't use since in the sansa chapter he said that he doesn't need it since people just do whatever he wants so that's weird then I remembered mance rayder saying that he went down to winterfell to see the king for himself with his musical instrument and a bag full of silver, and he said he met the king when he joined his retinue as a harp I think it was player. so since we know the dagger belonged to Robert, what if mance stole the dagger from joffery then gave it to the assassin with the rest of the silver to off bran which would cause a war between the north and south. then this would allow the wildlings to invade the north to hide from the white walker. this fits to me, only thing that's strange is joffery acting suspicious at tyrions question but this may be because he lost his father valaryan steel dagger
@@AniSwiftTVRecaps IfJoffrey did it okay drawings might be a way to track him down, but you cannot do it without the Starks noticing. If a highly dangerous criminal is searched in the North they would probably want to know them what he was wanted for. And given that he had been hired to kill a Stark it would be wiser to just let him go than to point the Starks attention to him, because if they caught him alive Joffrey would be in trouble as well.
Besides when would they start looking for him? His job was to stay behind after the king left and do the killing. While the royal party was on the move it was difficult to contact them since ravens only find castles, not travellers. Joffrey only would expect to hear whether the assasin had succeded, failed or betrayed him after the return to the capital. By that time the assasin could have easily left the north as well. In Gendry 's case I assumed they found his master and heard he had joined the Night's watch and therefore were able to assume he was with the recruiter. I highly doubt they would have been able to find him so fast just based on his describtion.
If Mance hired him it makes even less sense, because the assasin had no reason to expect him to have the ressources to hunt him. Unless he was simpathetic to his cause or wanted a conflict between the King and the Starks for personal reasons.
@@patrickdematosribeiro1845 unless mance was still in winterfell because we know mance bought horses after the king left so maybe mance was the one to light the fire at the library while the assassin goes upstairs. so he gave him the dagger and half the silver as payment. it makes more sense going back and looking at it cause its stated that joffery doesn't use money to pay for anything and where would he even get a catpaw from seeing that cersie ordered that joffery must always be with either a kings guard or a lannister man the only time he has ever been without one is when he sent sandor away because he was frightening sansa. it just fits the more u look into it
I always thought it was called "katspaw dagger" because "kat" used her "paw" to grab it and it cut her hand up lol
What mic do you use, damn your voice comes through so cleannnn, ROB!
Well... It could have just as well been Mance Rayder - there is that part about him coming to Winterfell with a bag of silver... And beyond the wall, there is no place for cripples... As well there is the part that Mance would love nothing more than to kill Starks.
But idk...
Bag of silver was revealed in the Storm of Swords, and Tyrion is misremembering what Joffrey said.
I'm not sure who is the credit for this theory, but it was Mance. We find out that he was at the feast with King Robert : Opportunity. went down with a bag of silver : Means. He would have been around long enough to see conflict with the Lanisters and Starks, and his claimed goal is to see the king doesn't make a ton of sense when he is building an army. In reality, he wants to destabilize the north to allow for the wildlings to move south, and the Starks are the ones who have ended the last X number of wildling rebellions : Motive. He could have stolen the dagger in the traveling party and hired the catspaw. I would think even Joff would be smart enough to know not to give away a near priceless dagger. And Joff's motive, while plausible is weak at best. And on top of that waiting seems to be a little outside the realm of scheming for impatient Joff. I don't think Joff would have hired the catspaw himself, and I don't think he could convince anyone to do it for him who wouldn't run to cerci. Mance using a recognizable priceless dagger would provide more of an orgy of evidence to explode the conflict between the lions and wolves. Plus there is talk that wildlings do put down broken children for added "symbolism"(?).
The entire point of the attempt was for the Stark's to discover the dagger. The person who hired the assassin knew he wouldn't be successful, or at least wouldn't get away with it. The Lannister's wouldn't have been so reckless to hire a random person and give them the blade. Joffrey simply wouldn't give up a Valyrian Steel dagger (he would show it off to people at every chance, and threaten them with it). George confirms it wasn't Littlefinger from a distance. I think we all know the answer.... Bloodraven.
In a strange way Joff might have actually believed he was doing the right thing
He got the idea from overhearing Robert talk about how it would have been better if he had died on impact instead of being crippled for the rest of his life.
Hey what happened to the Robert's Rebellion videos and other older ASOIAF videos?
I was literally looking for them yesterday and couldn't find them. Glad I'm not losing my mind.😅
Let's gooo 🔥
I agree with the accusation. However, I'm not particularly sure about Joffrey's claimed familiarity with Valyrian steel; I think that's just an improvised bluff trying to keep face before Tyrion and the rest of the court.
On the other hand, I'm a bit surprised that Joffrey, succeeding at catching Tyrion's subtle accusation and being the cruel, arrogant king he is, wouldn't proudly admit right then and there his partaking in the assassination attempt.
Didn’t they say in the books that Joffrey was responsible for the assassin?
I’m not sure, but I do believe that Tyrion confronted someone about this theory, after he escaped from those two lunatics and their kangaroo court trial, and had even received confirmation on that.
Lost it to Tyrion on a bet?? Pretty steep bet, that would be like betting a castle. I can’t imagine someone putting that in the pot
I find the quote referenced from George to be quite interesting in this case, as it reminds me of how there’s heavy implications that Littlefinger was the one to encourage Joffery to kill Ned when everyone else’s plan at the Sept was to have him plead guilty and take the black (for those who don’t know, all of Littlefinger’s men acted instantly when Joffery went off script and decided to do the execution, and later in Clash Varys talks with Tyrion and heavily implies he thinks Littlefinger was involved in that outcome). The difference between Tyrion and Jaime’s conclusion is in the why of the matter, and I’ll admit I find neither very convincing: Joffery isn’t exactly a long term planner, and he gets neither a sadistic satisfaction or the approval from his father for committing this murder.
So I think the answer is thus; Joffery did hire the catspaw, but only after being encouraged to do so by Littlefinger. Yes, Littlefinger wasn’t at Winterfell, but he was at the very important and very offscreen Joffery’s twelfth nameday tourney. And at this tourney Littlefinger is doing a lot of start shit in the Seven Kingdoms; this is where Robert gets the valyrian steel dagger, Jon Arryn starts investigating the Lannister incest allegations, and Lysa begins her plan to kill Jon and run off with her son. Littlefinger at this tourney knows before anyone else that Jon Arryn is about to die, and Robert will probably go to Ned Stark to be his next hand; the rider in the night at Winterfell certainly points to him being ahead of the curve on that. So why not go to the boy prince and say the right words to him that’d encourage him to stir shit up in Winterfell? Obviously he can’t know that Bran will fall out of a window and be comatose, but all he needs to do is give the kid a knife and tell him to stick it wherever he feels like, at the end of the day the result is the same; more tension between the Lannisters and Starks. If he doesn’t? Oh well! No skin off Littlefinger’s back, other opportunities will arise. Lucky for him Joffery’s favorite hobby is starting shit with the Starks.
This doesn’t fully satisfy my personal issue with the mystery, which is why Joffery would do this specific murder. Maybe its the Robert thing? But as I said before I don’t really like that answer. Like I’d expect Joffery to hire the catspaw to kill Summer, not Bran. The funniest answer possible there would be that Joffery hired a catspaw to kill the wolf, but due to a miscommunication the catspaw thought he meant Bran. After all Summer didn’t have a name yet, so if Joffery handed the catspaw an obscene amount of money, pointed in the direction of the building Bran was held in and said ‘kill the wolf there’ whose to say the message doesn’t get confused?
I think we need to clarify what a cat's paw really is. Because it's not just someone working for someone else; most hired assassins are working for someone else. What truly makes someone a cat's paw is that they are *unaware* of the fact that they're being working for someone else or that the actions they're taking are for the benefit of someone else. This may be to have a convenient scapegoat or just to avoid any suspicion being directed at the person pulling the strings.
Yeah, you’re right. Essentially it’s a patsy who actually does something.
The cat uses its paw to put forth its claw, the claw is sharp.
Thank you for clarifying what "cat's paw" means 😃
I honestly thought that was the name of the dagger, like how other weapons have names 😅
Maybe George decided to continue the seeding of hints throughout the other tomes and no one asked him if.
No matter the true killer. I find each of your evaluations and explanations quite interesting to consider. Thank you!
2:56 I mean…if it were Skyrim, there’d be two bodies and my guy would be gone.
Bloodraven
But didn't Joffrey go to the room after Tyrion slapped him?
Joffrey has no motive to kill Bran. Cersei claims Joffrey heard Robert say something about it being better to put him down but we can't verify that claim.
Tyrion's memory is incorrect. Joffrey said "send a dog to kill a dog". Tyrion changed the fact.
Mance had a bag of silver. And with the wheelhouse parked outside the castle, he could have climbed in and stolen the dagger.
I don't know anything about this series but when I saw "Catspaw"...I had to look. Back in the early 80s I had a D&D character named "Fielonious Catspaw". A c/n Rouge Monk/Assassin...🤔😄
Two videos in 3 days? Nice
The Dagger by Ramin Djawadi has Baelish theme on it.
“you’re not supposed to be here” - he means Bran, because Jon hired him to kill Catelyn. It is known. [edit: is this a re-upload or re-re-upload?]
Both?
😂
This seems to surprise a lot of people. Many channels reupload stuff after making small changes or editing to clean up something they weren't happy with originally. Reminds me of this history channel I watch, where the videos view real history through the lens of film. He is always watching movies and will edit in a new clip if he happens to find a scene that perfectly illustrates a point he's trying to elucidate. Not uncommon at all
@@ThommyofThenn Hi, very curious about what channel you are talking about, this angle may really interest me !
yeah and will thrice uploaded times ten before any new material, winds, comes out
They should make this in to a show
I always thought it was in some way the 3 eyed raven if it wasn't Little finger. to ensure to set off the events that will lead to the outcome he wants.
The fire was actively meant to lure Caitlyn away cause littlefinger truly did not want her to get hurt. that's also why the Catspaw assassin's hesitated when it came to violence towards her.
He would be able to hire a better one
@@iandegiovani4703 perhaps he knew that a bad assassin would mess it up and that would lead to more division between lannister and stark
@@gbf111 Yes but then he also had the risk of the assassin getting captured and revieling who hired him.
Blood Raven. It was an intentionally failed attempt.
And that gets everything moving and the dagger in the correct hands to get it back to bran when he needs it
Joffrey is stupid enough to hire an assassin using a Valyrian steel dagger. Though I like the idea that Blood Raven/Bran did it to ensure that Bran had to travel north.
I read agot recently again, Joffrey never said send a dog to kill a wolf. It was send a dog to kill a dog after the Hound offered to silence the creature. He was referring to Summer, then still unnamed who was howling. He said to Tyrion he can't stand the wailing of women, but having left Winterfell, he has no reason to kill Bran. Joffrey was convinced Bran would die anyway. Slow or quick didn't matter to him.
In that conversation, the Hound wished Bran would die quicker and he mercy kills. Still it wasn't the Hound but the catspaw. So a cat not a dog. And why didn't he make off with the dagger? Valyrian steel is very valuable why not pawn it off and run to the free cities? Why commit to the point of a confrontation? He died for it. No I don't think he killed for money. I'd consider an ideological motivation of some kind for the assassin not just the one who hired him.
If it's Joffrey then Jaime 's idea would be the best. But then again, when Joffrey tried to impress his father the last time, he was beaten. So would he not think twice about it? Would he risk that several times over?
I interpreted the Catspaw's line of "you're not supposed to be here. No one's supposed to be here." as "you're all going to die." Whelp, guess I was wrong. lol
What happened to the travelers guide videos? Those were the best. I can't find them.
I'm a little disappointed you didn't get a chance to gather the suspects in the stateroom before giving your summation of the case. But still, a fine exercise of your "little grey cells" mon ami.
I thought it was made pretty clear in a Tryion chapter that Joefry did because Bran humiliated him in the sparring. He stole one the daggers from Robert's collection of looted valerian steal.
In the show its Petyr.
In the books its Joffrey
I've always felt that the clues lead to Goffery, although I can't be sure why he'd target Bran. It's also the sort of ham fisted BS Cerci would pull. Probably her.
Oh! Its back! I watched a few minutes of this a few days ago but it was cruelly snatched away. Whats up with that
My understanding made it seem like it was Joffrey. Everyone else denies it. Other people might’ve known about it but I think he was the one giving the command here.
If Cersei wasn’t behind the assassination attempt, what was her plan if/when Bran regained consciousness?
The whole thing about this that doesn't make sense is the value of the dagger, but I feel the value and rarity of Valerian steel was increased as GRRM continued writing. None of it really makes sense.
up until this video I thought it was established that Joffrey hired the catspaw
The dagger cuts Cat's hands; Cat's paws. And when he says, 'Noone is supposed to be here'? He means the character who is named Noone. Little Finger can't go North-it is him who wants the dagger. It is LF who loves his Silver and it is to Little Finger to whom Cat brings THAT dagger straight to. That dagger was ALREADY North when the books open...it was NOT brought by the Baratheon/Lannister party. Mance Raydar was there to raid the Winterfell manse and get that dagger. So was someone else. They were also sent to burn the Library as it had knowledge that someone wants to keep hidden. Tyrion borrowed some books and scrolls before the library burned. And that dagger, dragon-bone handle...so deathy right? And look at how books get destroyed around certain characters..is it Joff destroying the book OR did Tyrion give an important book that he wanted destroyed to someone he knew would destroy it? Tyrion can't do it-he gets others to do it for him in text.
The Valyrian steel dagger is a holdover from an earlier draft when Valyrian steel was not so rare. If King Robert didn't have a Valyrian steel sword then there's no way he'd allow the dagger to go missing. And both the assassin and Joffrey have to be spectacularly stupid to transact business with it. There's no place in Westeros the assassin could exchange it for gold. It would just be seized and returned to the king via the local lord. At a minimum you'd have to have a cover story where you thought it was a different Valyrian steel dagger, but all those blades are known and eyewitnesses can attest to their locations at the time Bran was attacked.
Valyrian steel swords are rare, the stuff itself isn't as rare as many people believe.
There are arakhs, butter knives, axes and daggers. Probably many more items. This one came from Robert's stash of stuff he had with him and it was taken randomly, that's how I understand it. The taker didn't know its value or significance.
Didn’t Joffrey get beat up by Bran in jousting/sword practice earlier that week too? That could also give a motive
Only that Tyrion is misremembering. It is send a dog to kill a dog. Meaning the direwolf because Summer made so much noise. We never hear Robert say it is a mercy but the wildlings think so. Mance or one of his agents could have hired the assassin to start a conflict that weakness the realm.