I feel like Charlie-83 is what I believe in, and this goes for half of the community at this point. The Silver Eyes suggested her death happened around Halloween- But I want to talk about the “1982” thing, I think this was the one retcon that Scott did back around FNAF 4 and SL. The Silver Eyes was published around that time period, and I want to acknowledge one of the FNAF 4 teasers had that year. So if it’s possible that Scott had to retcon it to introduce the Afton family, then he had to change the narrative of BV and Michael’s character arcs to build up William Afton for the Games’ lore. So if TFC had to retell the lore without Mike and BV, then I’m sure that Scott always wanted Charlie to die in 1983. So, I believe Charlie died in Halloween 1983.
5:07 its said that afton made the mci to recreate what happened with elizabeth, not charlie “The most terrible accidents sometimes bear the most beautiful fruits,” he said, as if to himself. “Re-creating the accident-that is the duty and the honor of science. To replicate the experiment, and obtain the same result. I give my life to this experiment, piece by piece.” afton treats elizabeth like garbage on TFC, so the accident is here and the beautiful fruits are the mci so charlie > cc > elizabeth > mci
I’m sure she died in 1983 probably a few months after The Crying Child’s death, considering the fact that we see that the midnight motorist (William Afton) is clearly not in a good state, probably drunk, angry and depressed and so it’s highly likely that he killed Charlie in an act of rage against Henry.
Yeah but there's the fact that in Midnight Motorist there was a second boy in the house (Or at least there was supposed to be a second boy), and Elizabeth hadn't been born yet but when the bite happend she had already been born (according to a SD teaser, the bed in her room is actually a cradle). And there's also the fact that William didn't really care for his childs, and at the time of the bite there were A LOT of rumors about the animatronics. CC's fear has an origin, and it's probably Charlie's death.
@@ALoliComunista The first one has a different hexcode than Michael, it’s grey still but they’re obscured largely so it’s more likely that Mrs. Afton was who was on the couch in the episode. It also would make zero sense if the Crying Child ran off because he was terrified of the Animatronics, he would have no reason to go there. It makes more sense if Mrs. Afton parallels Vanessa’s mother and self unalived(phrasing so I don’t get nuked) after losing BV/crying child and learning of the horrible things William has done; all of it would fit nicely into the timeline.
I love the fact that the new games instead of answering old questions and giving new ones to figure out, it gives new questions, and messes up the things we thought we figured out... Thanks scott.
The two reasons I believe that Charlie died in 1983 is because of it being 1983 in the novels and cause in fnaf 4 we hear the pigtails girl talk about how the animatronics come to life at night, kill, and hide the bodies, which could be just a red herring but perhaps it means that at least one animatronic is possessed, and since charlie is the one that usually gives animatronics lives it would make since if then charlie died before cc. Oh also we know that william has set up cameras and uses the fredbear plush, and some people theorize that cc is a victim of William experiments just like mike, and there is not much reason for William to do experiments until he discovers possession and charlie would be a perfect way for him to find out as well as her being his first victim in the novels due to jealousy to henry I don’t believe that it is definitely true, but it does make sense for me so I tend to prefer charlie dying before cc.
i think what the pigtail girl was talking about the animatronics come to life at night could refer to the Springlock incident in fredbears.(honestly idk if it occured on fredbears lol) but i respect your theory!
The pig tails girl isn’t exactly a valid source, it’s pretty clear in canon that this isn’t a lore hint: it’s her trying to scare the Crying Child with a story because everyone likes to bully the kid.
I believe the Withered Chica line from UCN was saying she was the first of the kids involved in the MCI, not the first death caused by William in general, which, in a way, disproves that Charlie could be the first one to pass away and posses an animatronic
I definitely agree that it happens in 83 shortly after the bite, but this sadly crushes the one I had been hoping for(I was hoping that it would be a neat little descent with first BV being not William’s fault, then him designing a robot with the intentions of harming others, and then directly doing it after his daughter got too close to the Animatronics he created. I know that not every character needs a sympathetic motivation, but I did feel that narratively it was a good slow progression that fits together well.
1983. The pizzeria simulator opening mini game with shadow Freddy mimics take cake from fnaf 2. Given the mini games of the past having a heavy emphasis on memories it's logical they happen before the events of the games they appear in. Especially with the possibility happiest day is a failed party. 'The party WAS FOR YOU.' in the survival logbook. Seems accusatory given pizzeria simulator and UCN. Meaning if Cassidy was put to rest at the party, a certain someone chose NOT to make an appearance at THEIR party. Who else SHOULD have been sat at Cassidy's side of the table and has angry personality?
Why do yall assume 1985 MCI is true despite there being plently of evidence for 83 in the games, not reliant on contradicting books. I'm CharlieBeforeMCI, assuming the MCI happening in 85 makes Charlie dying after less likely is not true, if evidence points to charlie dying in 83, but after the MCI, then the MCI is in 83.
@@zetorocks811 I guess the movie shows the MCI is in 1987. Try again. That's a AU story, with a completely different timeline and event. FNaF 4 already gave the date, therefore ITP is irrelevant in that regard.
Preach brotha, I 100% agree with Charlie-83 and I think it has the most evidence out of the two dates, and I also agree with CharlieBeforeCC since I think it makes more sense evidence wise and narrative wise.
About the 6th child in the ITP MCI, I don't think it's Andrew, because there were only 5 children reported missing. Where did he could have come from? In my opinion that's Charlie. But I'm not saying she's a victim of the MCI, but she died at Freddy's, and her agony/memories got mixed with the agony/memories of the 5 victims. Considering the fact that Oswald isn't seeing a 1:1 recreation of the past bc the memories are all kind of fuzzy (I don't know if that's the most appropiate word)
I have a similar thought, but with it being Andrew. The MCI had 5 kids, and Andrew is killed elsewhere and attaches himself to William. The reason why Andrew is the 6th body in the pit world? The pit world is a reflection of the real world, and William is trapped in the safe room for decades, with Andrew with him. With Andrew in the safe room for decades, this is reflected in the pit world as a 6th body.
@@ahusky4498 I don't think that's the case bc the safe room William got locked in is in the 90s location, and Jeff's Pizza is the 80s location. Altough you can say they're the same, the 80s location is built in a straight line with rooms on the left, whereas the 90s location is built in a "exponencial" way, the rooms are all around the dining room.
@@zetorocks811 yes, but in the meaning that it's in the wrong order. Everything that happend before Oswald's intervention actually happend, but not in that order. Wich means 6 kids died at Freddy's, but it doesn't mean they all died together. So my point remains.
at this point i gave up on TFC gravestone since it contradicts the entire trilogy so my guess is halloween 1982, with cc dying on spring 1983 why you might question? if TFC gravestone is accurate, so she has 15 years on TSE, and 16 on TFC which doesn't make sense since she's 17 on TSE taking place on 1995 she would be 4 years old when she was kidnapped on 1982 and 18 on the fourth closet events, since she borns on may and TFC takes place on february 1997
@@zetorocks811 she is literally stated to be 17 on TSE this would make her be 16 on tfc, which she is supposed to be a a adult at this point the gravestone isn't reliable since her birthday is on may 13th, and TFC happens around january-february
Scott probably didn’t think about, he still had to retcon her death to be 1983 it’s not an accident, if it was he would’ve changed it in future releases but he never did
Not gonna lie, Charlie dying in 1985 but still before the mci would be so much better in a narrative perspective, you wouldn’t have that 2 years gap and also it would mean William is really thirsty for blood and death that he already kills his first 7 victims in the same year, also between 1983 and 1985 in this version of the story William would be reflecting and thinking about life and death due to the bite
I feel like Charlie-83 is what I believe in, and this goes for half of the community at this point.
The Silver Eyes suggested her death happened around Halloween-
But I want to talk about the “1982” thing, I think this was the one retcon that Scott did back around FNAF 4 and SL. The Silver Eyes was published around that time period, and I want to acknowledge one of the FNAF 4 teasers had that year.
So if it’s possible that Scott had to retcon it to introduce the Afton family, then he had to change the narrative of BV and Michael’s character arcs to build up William Afton for the Games’ lore.
So if TFC had to retell the lore without Mike and BV, then I’m sure that Scott always wanted Charlie to die in 1983.
So, I believe Charlie died in Halloween 1983.
5:07
its said that afton made the mci to recreate what happened with elizabeth, not charlie
“The most terrible accidents sometimes bear the most beautiful fruits,” he said, as if to himself. “Re-creating the accident-that is the duty and the honor of science. To replicate the experiment, and obtain the same result. I give my life to this experiment, piece by piece.”
afton treats elizabeth like garbage on TFC, so the accident is here and the beautiful fruits are the mci
so charlie > cc > elizabeth > mci
I’m sure she died in 1983 probably a few months after The Crying Child’s death, considering the fact that we see that the midnight motorist (William Afton) is clearly not in a good state, probably drunk, angry and depressed and so it’s highly likely that he killed Charlie in an act of rage against Henry.
Yeah but there's the fact that in Midnight Motorist there was a second boy in the house (Or at least there was supposed to be a second boy), and Elizabeth hadn't been born yet but when the bite happend she had already been born (according to a SD teaser, the bed in her room is actually a cradle). And there's also the fact that William didn't really care for his childs, and at the time of the bite there were A LOT of rumors about the animatronics. CC's fear has an origin, and it's probably Charlie's death.
@@ALoliComunista The first one has a different hexcode than Michael, it’s grey still but they’re obscured largely so it’s more likely that Mrs. Afton was who was on the couch in the episode.
It also would make zero sense if the Crying Child ran off because he was terrified of the Animatronics, he would have no reason to go there. It makes more sense if Mrs. Afton parallels Vanessa’s mother and self unalived(phrasing so I don’t get nuked) after losing BV/crying child and learning of the horrible things William has done; all of it would fit nicely into the timeline.
@@ALoliComunista that wasn’t even true though, also I don’t think the runaway was ever pronouned so it could be any of the 3
“*he* ran off to that place again”
@@zetorocks811 well people still think couch person could be female so idk 🤷🏻♀️
I love the fact that the new games instead of answering old questions and giving new ones to figure out, it gives new questions, and messes up the things we thought we figured out... Thanks scott.
Charlie died in 83 for me. I believe the evidence are much better then 85.
The two reasons I believe that Charlie died in 1983 is because of it being 1983 in the novels and cause in fnaf 4 we hear the pigtails girl talk about how the animatronics come to life at night, kill, and hide the bodies, which could be just a red herring but perhaps it means that at least one animatronic is possessed, and since charlie is the one that usually gives animatronics lives it would make since if then charlie died before cc.
Oh also we know that william has set up cameras and uses the fredbear plush, and some people theorize that cc is a victim of William experiments just like mike, and there is not much reason for William to do experiments until he discovers possession and charlie would be a perfect way for him to find out as well as her being his first victim in the novels due to jealousy to henry
I don’t believe that it is definitely true, but it does make sense for me so I tend to prefer charlie dying before cc.
Agreed!
I too agree that Charlie died first.
i think what the pigtail girl was talking about the animatronics come to life at night could refer to the Springlock incident in fredbears.(honestly idk if it occured on fredbears lol)
but i respect your theory!
@@Kevin_YT1133 could be but we don’t know about any victims of springlocks
The pig tails girl isn’t exactly a valid source, it’s pretty clear in canon that this isn’t a lore hint: it’s her trying to scare the Crying Child with a story because everyone likes to bully the kid.
Give gifts give life pretty much confirms that Charlie was the first murder victim.
I believe the Withered Chica line from UCN was saying she was the first of the kids involved in the MCI, not the first death caused by William in general, which, in a way, disproves that Charlie could be the first one to pass away and posses an animatronic
I definitely agree that it happens in 83 shortly after the bite, but this sadly crushes the one I had been hoping for(I was hoping that it would be a neat little descent with first BV being not William’s fault, then him designing a robot with the intentions of harming others, and then directly doing it after his daughter got too close to the Animatronics he created.
I know that not every character needs a sympathetic motivation, but I did feel that narratively it was a good slow progression that fits together well.
1983. The pizzeria simulator opening mini game with shadow Freddy mimics take cake from fnaf 2. Given the mini games of the past having a heavy emphasis on memories it's logical they happen before the events of the games they appear in. Especially with the possibility happiest day is a failed party. 'The party WAS FOR YOU.' in the survival logbook. Seems accusatory given pizzeria simulator and UCN. Meaning if Cassidy was put to rest at the party, a certain someone chose NOT to make an appearance at THEIR party. Who else SHOULD have been sat at Cassidy's side of the table and has angry personality?
I was with you even up to you saying Charlie died in ‘85, but completely lost me when you said the 6th victim was andrew
She died in 83 considering she is the first to die after Evan's death William was drunk and crazed at the time
Why do yall assume 1985 MCI is true despite there being plently of evidence for 83 in the games, not reliant on contradicting books. I'm CharlieBeforeMCI, assuming the MCI happening in 85 makes Charlie dying after less likely is not true, if evidence points to charlie dying in 83, but after the MCI, then the MCI is in 83.
Into the Pit
@@zetorocks811 I guess the movie shows the MCI is in 1987. Try again.
That's a AU story, with a completely different timeline and event. FNaF 4 already gave the date, therefore ITP is irrelevant in that regard.
Why did I not get recommended this??
Preach brotha, I 100% agree with Charlie-83 and I think it has the most evidence out of the two dates, and I also agree with CharlieBeforeCC since I think it makes more sense evidence wise and narrative wise.
1982.
Vr 2 confirmed 1983💀💀💀
How
@@mrepico2750 to get the puppet memory you have to type in 1983 in the sister location keypad
@@Starfallsupersonic YOU SAID 85 YOU ARE NOT FOOLING ME
The question I have is if Charlie died before or after The Bite of ‘83?
About the 6th child in the ITP MCI, I don't think it's Andrew, because there were only 5 children reported missing. Where did he could have come from? In my opinion that's Charlie. But I'm not saying she's a victim of the MCI, but she died at Freddy's, and her agony/memories got mixed with the agony/memories of the 5 victims. Considering the fact that Oswald isn't seeing a 1:1 recreation of the past bc the memories are all kind of fuzzy (I don't know if that's the most appropiate word)
I have a similar thought, but with it being Andrew. The MCI had 5 kids, and Andrew is killed elsewhere and attaches himself to William.
The reason why Andrew is the 6th body in the pit world? The pit world is a reflection of the real world, and William is trapped in the safe room for decades, with Andrew with him. With Andrew in the safe room for decades, this is reflected in the pit world as a 6th body.
@@ahusky4498 I don't think that's the case bc the safe room William got locked in is in the 90s location, and Jeff's Pizza is the 80s location. Altough you can say they're the same, the 80s location is built in a straight line with rooms on the left, whereas the 90s location is built in a "exponencial" way, the rooms are all around the dining room.
Like you said Oswald isn’t seeing a 1:1 recreation of events
@@zetorocks811 yes, but in the meaning that it's in the wrong order. Everything that happend before Oswald's intervention actually happend, but not in that order. Wich means 6 kids died at Freddy's, but it doesn't mean they all died together. So my point remains.
at this point i gave up on TFC gravestone since it contradicts the entire trilogy
so my guess is halloween 1982, with cc dying on spring 1983
why you might question? if TFC gravestone is accurate, so she has 15 years on TSE, and 16 on TFC
which doesn't make sense since she's 17 on TSE taking place on 1995
she would be 4 years old when she was kidnapped on 1982
and 18 on the fourth closet events, since she borns on may and TFC takes place on february 1997
You can’t just give up on it, it was changed for a reason
@@zetorocks811 this reason don't make any sense on logic
Why not
@@zetorocks811 she is literally stated to be 17 on TSE
this would make her be 16 on tfc, which she is supposed to be a a adult at this point
the gravestone isn't reliable
since her birthday is on may 13th, and TFC happens around january-february
Scott probably didn’t think about, he still had to retcon her death to be 1983 it’s not an accident, if it was he would’ve changed it in future releases but he never did
I think Charlotte (Web) died in 2999
🔥🔥🔥
Not gonna lie, Charlie dying in 1985 but still before the mci would be so much better in a narrative perspective, you wouldn’t have that 2 years gap and also it would mean William is really thirsty for blood and death that he already kills his first 7 victims in the same year, also between 1983 and 1985 in this version of the story William would be reflecting and thinking about life and death due to the bite
The only thing is the dittophobia experiments and Mike being the patient #0 of them through…