I love that as a coach you actually focus on explaining the physics of what's happening. So many coaches don't understand it, they just repeat catch phrases or try to show by example. They've learned through trial and error which takes way longer than of you understand what it is you are trying to get your body to do from the get go.
Thanks, Ryan for a great clip on kick serve! Of course other coaches have showed almost the same instructions on this serve that my son and I’ve tried to followed but the detail from tou that I didn’t see from other videos is the arm tucking to keep your body sideways. What a trick! My son has a habit of rotating his body into the court and I didn’t know how to help him stop it. I’ll try this on him.
Thank you Ryan! Great explained. I'm finding your channel most valuable for me. We have great praud about Daniel Medvedev achieving. Long time after Safin no body had compete with big 3.
Thanks a few interesting additions about the kick serve / topspin that i didn't really know. Such as the higher toss, and incidence rather than topspin being responsible for the high bounce.
Great video. I just think that the difference for the time to contact is not so much because of a higher toss, but rather a lower point of contact. It might be a combination of both.
I have often wondered why topspin bounces higher! Intuitively, it seemed like the spin would push it more forward than up. Thanks for the explanation. Angle of incidence makes perfect sense.
@@2MinuteTennis I was beginning to think my engineering degree was based on lies! I never considered that the angle of contact would be so different, but it seems obvious now. All is now right in the world...
Great explanation but I think the reason he contacts the ball later in the kick serve it's not that he tosses the ball higher but that he doesn't hit the ball at its highest point but a little bit later when the ball is already falling down.
yeah maybe, earlier I was seeing lot of videos on how to pronate and was kind of worried I was not doing it right during shadow serving, but when I saw my own video in slow motion I was pleasantly surprised that I was already pronating :) anyways love your videos man, keep it up!
Great video as always! 💯 We can’t see how high he’s tossing the ball, but I wonder if the time between toss and striking the ball could also be a function of the toss path (straight up versus towards 11) and also the fact that the serve is being struck when it’s falling instead of on the way up or at the apex. 🤔
Perfect kick serve video point by point. Here I would like to ask one point that is, kick serve toss how much inside court compare to flat serve? Thank you.
many video like this are very helpful . I 'ld like to see the side view of how deep is the tosh or how, where these monsters put their body under the ball at both first & second serve differences . Thank you
An alternative explanation, which I favor, is that it takes longer to contact because the ball is allowed to drop more before hitting it; a more parabolic toss might also contribute. Would be interesting to have you actually compare the peak toss positions.
The difference in the contact height does not explain .21 seconds longer ball flight. Also, the toss height between the two is very different when comparing them side by side. Send me an email ryan@2minutetennis.net and I’ll make a video for you showing the difference in the toss height. Thanks!!
Wonderful video Ryan! Most serving tips videos are from the ad side, given how much more natural serving is from that side for a RH. What to do about the toss, feet alignment when serving from the deuce side to ensure directional control?
Toss is higher not to create more falling speed but to compensate for longer travel to the left. If the toss wasn’t higher the ball would have to be tossed in a weird way.
This is a great video, but I still don't understand where the forward momentum of the ball (to get it over the net) is coming from. Is it all from pronation? It seems that the body doesn't really do much given that the core doesn't rotate.
A couple of things. The difference between .88 and 1.01 seconds is .13 seconds, which is a 13 percent difference not 25 percent. Second, you say you should "keep your body facing the side" when doing a kick serve, not toward the target. But Medvedev (and Federer too) is rotating his body, so NOT keeping his body facing the side on a kick serve. Maybe not rotating quite as much as when he's doing a flat serve, but still rotating. He has to be. Otherwise the ball would spin like crazy but it would never get over the net.
When filming I thought I remembered it being .8 and not .88. If that was the case then it would’ve been a 25% increase in the toss timing. Second, my job as a teacher isn’t to be right…but rather say what needs to be heard in order for students to improve. Bad teachers try to be “right”. Excellent teachers try to be “helpful”. It’s art vs science. Teaching is an art. Thanks!!!
Topspin serve your body faces a bit more toward your target (side somewhat sideways though). Kick serve you body is very sideways to to your target. Being so sideways like that helps put a slit Sidespin on your topspin that makes the ball kick to the right for a right hander.
I find that the one handed backhander uses platform stance while serving like Federer, Thiem, Shapovalov and two handed backhander uses pin point stance like Daniil, Zverev, Rublev, Berrettini. Is there any player who is a two handed backhander but uses platform stance or one handed backhander with pinpoint stance?If there are no such players then why it is like this?
Hey Ryan, it's me again, the Ragin' Can-nay-jin. What do ya think of his toss - it's very abrupt, n'est-ce pas? It's like: WHOOP, there it is! I don't understand how he keeps it so consistent. And please don't tell me it's "the same way you get to Carnegie Hall" (practice, practice, practice). But seriously, do you see any advantage to launching a Pearl Harbor-esque sneak attack of a toss like that? I realize that we ask you a lot of questions, Ryan, and worse, we petulantly insist you to answer them A. immediately, B. free of charge, and C. not just make things up, so I tell you what, I'm gonna answer one for YOU for a change. I know, how magnanimonius of me. Okay, ready? The answer you seek (@ 8:27) is: HIS TRAINING BRA Hey, I'm not judging, I'd take man boobs if it made me play like he does. What am I saying, I already HAVE man boobs and he could literally beat me without a racket. Or vice versa. I'm just gonna go away now and look at myself in the mirror as punishment. Ciao - no wait, I meant CHOW! 🤢
Wow, thank you very much for this demo, specially the part when you explain the pronation and contact with the ball. Hit vs. brush: what would be te percentages to get a fast enough kick serve? Thanks again.
Thanks Ryan. His trajectory is very flat as obvious from the video. Although, he has does maintain a pretty conventional service motion, he doesn't finish properly. That is he keeps his elbow straight during the finish. He can probably get away with this because of his height. But most players not over 6'5" cannot do this and maintain a serving high percentage. But eventually in tight situations, you will fault long. That's why he commits so many double faults under pressure (which also plagues Zverev who is also tall). Why don't you compare Med to Zverev's second serve?
It's so funny, my tennis coach (in retrospect he was a terrible coach), and even all the kids on my high school tennis team - NO ONE could properly explain how to do a kick serve - even the guys who were doing it! No one properly explained the up and out motion, and hitting the ball at a lower point...
I thought that is was .8 when I was filming. I had forgotten the actual number while filming it live. If it was .8 it would’ve been a 25% increase compared to .8. Thanks!!
ENJOYED your VIDEOS (per usual)... but a guy as SKILLED and ENJOYABLE as YOU simply MUST LEARN TO TALK TO LEFT-HANDED PEOPLE !!!!!!! HOW to do this? SIMPLE for THIS video: REPLACE all occurrences of "to the right of" with "in FRONT of", because that's what Medvedev is ACTUALLY doing... REPLACE all occurrences of "to the left of" with "in BACK of", because that's what Medvedev is ACTUALLY doing... REPLACE all occurrences of "tossing arm" with "BALL hand"; NOTE Medvedev actually stands with his upper body FACING the SIDELINE, so he really IS performing a toss IN FRONT OF his head and IN BACK OF his head ! PRETTY SIMPLE... and UNAMBIGUOUS for lefties like me/us. Keep up the great - no AMBIDEXTROUS - video analyses ! -Mark Vogt | VOGTLAND OUTDOORS
@@2MinuteTennis True, you are right. I was counting wrong direction. But that also means that the 1st serve toss in only 13% lower (0.13 sec decrease is 13%).
Wasnt effective vs Nadal even after 2 set and a break lead (ok crowd was a factor). Why use him as example? Perhaps show Nadal's more prudent? Also, maybe show things to learn from Nadal's fhand, movement, prep? Etc. Just sayin'. Good content tho' always enjoy and derive lessons from ea. Thanks!!!!
@@2MinuteTennis well if u do that then pretty sure all covered. They are the GOATS after all. Why learn from the 'mediocres' when one can learn from Trio-GOATs? Common sense. Again.
I love that as a coach you actually focus on explaining the physics of what's happening. So many coaches don't understand it, they just repeat catch phrases or try to show by example. They've learned through trial and error which takes way longer than of you understand what it is you are trying to get your body to do from the get go.
After 15 years of doing this job , I just realized the true concept of kick serve ,Thanks Ryan. This lesson is really a game changer !
Hey I’m so glad to help you Coach! Thanks
No one could've explained it better. Thank you.
I just learned the kick serve today. This is the best instruction I have seen so far. Makes it so easy to understand. Thank you!
I have been searching many RUclipss to improve my serve, but your explanation is the best.
While I was watching the whole match on the channel, Ryan managed to edit the video.🤔👍🎾🇷🇺
Haha you know me!! Always at it!! Let’s go!
Thank you for the best serve lesson i have ever seen. Liked, subscribed and saved.
Wow thank you James! Really appreciate the support.
Excellent Ryan it's so useful tips for kick serve ❤thank you
Great stuff, particularly to me the pointing out the difference in the time to contact between the 1st and 2nd serve of Medvedev
Thanks so much Jonathan!
You are a genius explaining tennis techniques that you keep doing it
Thanks, Ryan for a great clip on kick serve! Of course other coaches have showed almost the same instructions on this serve that my son and I’ve tried to followed but the detail from tou that I didn’t see from other videos is the arm tucking to keep your body sideways. What a trick! My son has a habit of rotating his body into the court and I didn’t know how to help him stop it. I’ll try this on him.
Happy to help tran! Keep me posted. Be sure he when his tossing arm comes down he directs points to the opponent and THEN tucks it in. Thanks!
@@2MinuteTennis Got it. Thanks!
Thank you Ryan! Great explained. I'm finding your channel most valuable for me. We have great praud about Daniel Medvedev achieving. Long time after Safin no body had compete with big 3.
Oh I’m so glad to hear that. Thanks Alex!!
Dude the slide on that first serve of the video down the t wide was INSANE . Crazy action
Excellent video, thank you
Thanks so much again Jaime!
Thanks a few interesting additions about the kick serve / topspin that i didn't really know. Such as the higher toss, and incidence rather than topspin being responsible for the high bounce.
Incredible video. One of the best on kick serve. Nice job
Best explanation ever! Thanks!
Hey tempest so glad you liked it!!
Great video. I just think that the difference for the time to contact is not so much because of a higher toss, but rather a lower point of contact. It might be a combination of both.
I checked that. The height of the tosses was completely different. First serve toss was so much lower. Thanks!!
I have often wondered why topspin bounces higher! Intuitively, it seemed like the spin would push it more forward than up. Thanks for the explanation. Angle of incidence makes perfect sense.
You are correct. Topspin actually makes a ball bounce LOWER than backspin when two balls hit the ground at the same angle. Thanks Aaron!
@@2MinuteTennis I was beginning to think my engineering degree was based on lies! I never considered that the angle of contact would be so different, but it seems obvious now. All is now right in the world...
@@aaronrussell5047 hahahaha
I'm the guy who shaves the ball. I thought my other motions were all good and I kept wondering why I had no power. Now I know. Thanks!
Awesome. Keep me posted Calvin
great video.
Thanks…..great video 😄
Thanks Ryan I can’t wait to try it!
Great video!! Thank you for sharing.
Thanks so much Roger!!!
Fantastic video, thanks for the tips. Looking forward to trying it ...
Can't wait for tomorrow to try this out!
Great examples, 2min!
Hey thanks so much!!!
Great explanation but I think the reason he contacts the ball later in the kick serve it's not that he tosses the ball higher but that he doesn't hit the ball at its highest point but a little bit later when the ball is already falling down.
Thank you!, and I think you don't have to worry about pronation, it happens intuitively
In my coaching experience pronation on the serve does not happen naturally for most players. If you’re doing it correctly then that’s awesome. Thanks!
yeah maybe, earlier I was seeing lot of videos on how to pronate and was kind of worried I was not doing it right during shadow serving, but when I saw my own video in slow motion I was pleasantly surprised that I was already pronating :) anyways love your videos man, keep it up!
perfect explanation !
Thanks so much David!
Great video as always! 💯 We can’t see how high he’s tossing the ball, but I wonder if the time between toss and striking the ball could also be a function of the toss path (straight up versus towards 11) and also the fact that the serve is being struck when it’s falling instead of on the way up or at the apex. 🤔
Someone else mentioned that. I checked it out and his first serve toss height was much much lower. Thanks!
I would have said the same ... I'm wondering if it's medevev specific... Or if all pro do that?
Perfect kick serve video point by point. Here I would like to ask one point that is, kick serve toss how much inside court compare to flat serve? Thank you.
Obits not inside as much. You can adjust as needed for more or Lesson power on your kick serve though. Thanks for the kind words!
many video like this are very helpful . I 'ld like to see the side view of how deep is the tosh or how, where these monsters put their body under the ball at both first & second serve differences . Thank you
I’ll have to show that in an upcoming video. Thanks!!!
An alternative explanation, which I favor, is that it takes longer to contact because the ball is allowed to drop more before hitting it; a more parabolic toss might also contribute. Would be interesting to have you actually compare the peak toss positions.
The difference in the contact height does not explain .21 seconds longer ball flight. Also, the toss height between the two is very different when comparing them side by side. Send me an email ryan@2minutetennis.net and I’ll make a video for you showing the difference in the toss height. Thanks!!
@@2MinuteTennis Hey, no worries. Didn't know you had directly compared the contact heights. Thx for the reply.
@@2MinuteTennis A
Would you say Meddy uses an eastern forehand?
He’s halfway between eastern and semi western. Same grip as Agassi. Thanks again Liam!
Wonderful video Ryan! Most serving tips videos are from the ad side, given how much more natural serving is from that side for a RH. What to do about the toss, feet alignment when serving from the deuce side to ensure directional control?
Dear Ryan, I admire a lot of things of you: knowledge, technic, your clear spech, but there is one that make you different: your love for teaching.
very very helpful
Toss is higher not to create more falling speed but to compensate for longer travel to the left. If the toss wasn’t higher the ball would have to be tossed in a weird way.
Thanks so much!!
This is a great video, but I still don't understand where the forward momentum of the ball (to get it over the net) is coming from. Is it all from pronation? It seems that the body doesn't really do much given that the core doesn't rotate.
Great Video!
Where did you but that device with the green ball attached to it? I'm looking for something like that to improve my lessons.
Here you go! Just take off the arm and you can use it for serves. TopspinPro link: topspinpro.com/ref/2minutetennis/
wow thank you
A couple of things. The difference between .88 and 1.01 seconds is .13 seconds, which is a 13 percent difference not 25 percent. Second, you say you should "keep your body facing the side" when doing a kick serve, not toward the target. But Medvedev (and Federer too) is rotating his body, so NOT keeping his body facing the side on a kick serve. Maybe not rotating quite as much as when he's doing a flat serve, but still rotating. He has to be. Otherwise the ball would spin like crazy but it would never get over the net.
When filming I thought I remembered it being .8 and not .88. If that was the case then it would’ve been a 25% increase in the toss timing. Second, my job as a teacher isn’t to be right…but rather say what needs to be heard in order for students to improve. Bad teachers try to be “right”. Excellent teachers try to be “helpful”. It’s art vs science. Teaching is an art. Thanks!!!
Wow so useful
Hey thanks August. Good to hear from you!
Should I tuck my tossing arm in on the other serves too?
yes tuck and crossed your arms on all serves
Awesome Video ;) Helps a lot. But there is one thing which i am struggeling with. Is there any difference between a kick serve an a topspin serve?
Topspin serve your body faces a bit more toward your target (side somewhat sideways though). Kick serve you body is very sideways to to your target. Being so sideways like that helps put a slit Sidespin on your topspin that makes the ball kick to the right for a right hander.
Should I use my wrist during the swing??
Thanks Ryan for the excellent video. Where should be the contact point with the ball, is it 6 o’clock?
My tennis elbow is screaming in pain looking at this video
oh wow. new intro
I find that the one handed backhander uses platform stance while serving like Federer, Thiem, Shapovalov and two handed backhander uses pin point stance like Daniil, Zverev, Rublev, Berrettini. Is there any player who is a two handed backhander but uses platform stance or one handed backhander with pinpoint stance?If there are no such players then why it is like this?
No correlation. Djokovic two handed with platform. Serve footwork and backhand preference have no relationship.
Is it ok to toss at eleven:forty five but in front of you for the kick serve?
Yes. That’ll hit a bit flatter and faster. Thanks!!
17:45 for this small amount of analysis. Video in desperate need of an edit
Thanks for watching and commenting!
Hey Ryan, it's me again, the Ragin' Can-nay-jin. What do ya think of his toss - it's very abrupt, n'est-ce pas? It's like: WHOOP, there it is! I don't understand how he keeps it so consistent. And please don't tell me it's "the same way you get to Carnegie Hall" (practice, practice, practice). But seriously, do you see any advantage to launching a Pearl Harbor-esque sneak attack of a toss like that?
I realize that we ask you a lot of questions, Ryan, and worse, we petulantly insist you to answer them A. immediately, B. free of charge, and C. not just make things up, so I tell you what, I'm gonna answer one for YOU for a change. I know, how magnanimonius of me. Okay, ready? The answer you seek (@ 8:27) is: HIS TRAINING BRA
Hey, I'm not judging, I'd take man boobs if it made me play like he does. What am I saying, I already HAVE man boobs and he could literally beat me without a racket. Or vice versa. I'm just gonna go away now and look at myself in the mirror as punishment. Ciao - no wait, I meant CHOW! 🤢
Wow, thank you very much for this demo, specially the part when you explain the pronation and contact with the ball. Hit vs. brush: what would be te percentages to get a fast enough kick serve? Thanks again.
genial!
Do nick Kyrgios serves comparison
His grip is between bevel 1&2 that’s not a true continental grip common coach how can you not see this?
Thanks for commenting!
I really need side view i have problems to control the right hit, i have a really nice top spin but no strong hit 😂
He is so tall and lean. Doubt a normal proportioned person can copy what he does
He certainly gets tremendous leverage
Medvedev have great kick serve! But Often time, he goes with first serve again like he have no second serve.
Thanks Ryan. His trajectory is very flat as obvious from the video. Although, he has does maintain a pretty conventional service motion, he doesn't finish properly. That is he keeps his elbow straight during the finish. He can probably get away with this because of his height. But most players not over 6'5" cannot do this and maintain a serving high percentage. But eventually in tight situations, you will fault long. That's why he commits so many double faults under pressure (which also plagues Zverev who is also tall). Why don't you compare Med to Zverev's second serve?
👍
It's so funny, my tennis coach (in retrospect he was a terrible coach), and even all the kids on my high school tennis team - NO ONE could properly explain how to do a kick serve - even the guys who were doing it! No one properly explained the up and out motion, and hitting the ball at a lower point...
13%, not 25%
I thought that is was .8 when I was filming. I had forgotten the actual number while filming it live. If it was .8 it would’ve been a 25% increase compared to .8. Thanks!!
this was way longer than 2 minutes
Haha you’re right. Good observation!
ENJOYED your VIDEOS (per usual)... but a guy as SKILLED and ENJOYABLE as YOU simply MUST LEARN TO TALK TO LEFT-HANDED PEOPLE !!!!!!!
HOW to do this?
SIMPLE for THIS video:
REPLACE all occurrences of "to the right of" with "in FRONT of", because that's what Medvedev is ACTUALLY doing...
REPLACE all occurrences of "to the left of" with "in BACK of", because that's what Medvedev is ACTUALLY doing...
REPLACE all occurrences of "tossing arm" with "BALL hand";
NOTE Medvedev actually stands with his upper body FACING the SIDELINE, so he really IS performing a toss IN FRONT OF his head and IN BACK OF his head !
PRETTY SIMPLE... and UNAMBIGUOUS for lefties like me/us.
Keep up the great - no AMBIDEXTROUS - video analyses !
-Mark Vogt | VOGTLAND OUTDOORS
You’re 100% correct. I need to do a much better job including all players. Thanks!!
How is 0.13 sec difference 25% ? From 0.88 to 1.01 …….. Hmmmmmm
While recording I thought I had measured .8…not .88. So, if it was .8 then .21 increase would be a 25% increase.
.2 is 25% of .8
@@2MinuteTennis Not 21% increase?
@@deepseadiver8191 if you invested $80 in the stock market and now it’s $101, what % increase did you get on your money?
@@2MinuteTennis True, you are right. I was counting wrong direction. But that also means that the 1st serve toss in only 13% lower (0.13 sec decrease is 13%).
Wasnt effective vs Nadal even after 2 set and a break lead (ok crowd was a factor). Why use him as example?
Perhaps show Nadal's more prudent? Also, maybe show things to learn from Nadal's fhand, movement, prep? Etc.
Just sayin'.
Good content tho' always enjoy and derive lessons from ea. Thanks!!!!
So bc he lost in a grand slam final against arguably the greatest player ever in 5 sets his serve isn’t good enough for club players to learn from?
@@2MinuteTennis no. But it means there are others can better be used as example and in this case, GOAT Nadal. Common sense.
@@andrehalim469 so who should I make my videos about? Only Rafa, Djokovic, and Nadal?
@@2MinuteTennis well if u do that then pretty sure all covered. They are the GOATS after all. Why learn from the 'mediocres' when one can learn from Trio-GOATs? Common sense. Again.
@@andrehalim469 got it. Thanks.
Wtf the funk is incidents???
на🥰👍💃🌴🎾🎾🤷🤷🎾