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This is Tuomas showing us his soul. The last part "Mother and Father" brings a tear to my eye every time I listen to it. To know that he used his Mother's own words in the song touches my heart
lol..he is a yarn spinner and reverses his public opinions all the time...first, claiming that he regrets stabbing Tarja in the back, then doubles down on not regretting it and advising anyone confused on the issue to (exact words..shut the F* up and go away..classy)...he fabricates ersatz feelings on a whim, trying to garner sympathy for reckless acts
Tuomas is in a much better place now and has been married to Johanna Kurkela, a Finnish singer, since 2015. I am so glad he chose life. What a loss that would have been!
@@Hoopsick keep in mind that this song was performed with the second singer, Annette Olson so its been performed for quite awhile before THIS performance, the sting of it is still there but not like it was when it was written, They do not play this Poet and the Pendulum (The Pain) much anymore, or Master, Passion, Greed (The ANGER of the situation ) or bye bye Beautiful. Most of the Nightwish army will implore a reactor to wait, listen and learn to love all there eras of Nightwish especially the first with Tarja because this song is in the end about loss, grief, pain and suicide, it is also about love, friendship and rebirth
@@Hoopsick It sure doesn't look like he's having a hard time. And as this concert was about ten years after the incident it sure isn't quite as tough as had been earlier. And to be honest I'm not sure about that part where you mentioned about Emppu, he's well known to be fooling and joking around. At the end is the part where Emppu and Marko gather around Tuomas and that's their gesture of unity (they are the only members playing anymore that were there to sign THE letter, it was in no way Tuomas' decision alone).
@@1982jeepcj8 year and also its Emppu asking i dont really know, but i imagine Emppu who is often called a Joker or a Prankster not asking: " How are you Tuomas?, everything allright, i know its though for you" , more like " you good Tuomas? Pizza after the Show?" dealing with it in boyish nature but incredible warmhearted also maybe just my imagination...
Throughout this song Marco and Emppu are checking up on Tuomas, this is song is very tough for him. I believe he actually filters most of the song out of the in-ear mix he gets to avoid getting too involved in it. You can see the two of them together at the end supporting him. The "three minutes and counting" takes you exactly to the point where he draws his hand across his throat. Oh yeah...Tuomas was in a dark place alright. The story goes from the "death" of the band/his will to continue through the darkness to the virtual suicide and then finally the "coming out the other side". The last section is just so beautiful and rips into you. How can a line as simple as "all you need is to feel my love" hit so hard? Hope this one survives the DCMA purge
One detail showing the ingenuity of Tuoams: Exactly three minutes after the words "Now I have only three minutes and counting" he is "killed" by the pendulum. And afterwards it gets dark and becomes silence with just a fading heartbeat. As it was so emotional for Tuomas the other were having an extra eye on him, like Emppu talking with him. Tuomas had the spoken lyrics turned off from his in ear monitor.
At last this song!!!! Every time in the end ....tears! Next song that together with Ghost Love Score makes the golden triangle: "The Greatest Show on Earth" - Live from Tampere
@Kanashimi Wembley was great, especially having the "guest" (let's not spoil that here) live on stage. But I haven't found a recording yet (as in, video) that beats the tampere show in quality.
Notes on some points you raised... The score begins at The End because it is "The End of an Era," the painful parting of ways with band co-founder and the fans' beloved angel, Tarja Turunen. He has said in other lyrics years previous to this that he "needs to die in order to feel alive again," and thus his metaphorical suicide here. After his "death" is a new beginning... a new era to his life. And hence the score ends with The Beginning. …….. I noticed you, like many other reactors, were slightly taken aback at the line about being raped again and again and again. Though he writes the lyrics for a female voice to sing (or in this case recite) we must remember it is about the keyboardist, the poet. It is he who is being raped by Poe's slowly descending pendulum blade as it slices through him on each swing, again and again and again. ……. I have written a very in-depth interpretation of this particular score from my own research that I have shared with others. If you are interested to see another perspective, let me know, and I will gladly email you two pdf's of the mini-essay. I could also post it here, but I think other people get sick of seeing it "again and again and again" (pun intended) and then they write me snarky comments to tell me what a horribly boring person I am. (LOL) So I offer email as an option to spare them the agony.
The song being written backwards is what I thought at first, but I think the actual idea is not that. It's more of a transition : "The end" is the end of an era, and "the beginning" is a new beginning. Not just for the band but for Tuomas and his soul ; this song is basically him looking for this new beginning. It makes all the more sense when you consider the position of this track : it's the first one on the album "Dark Passion Play" and so the very first Nightwish song after Tarja's departure, as if it was something necessary before moving on (and saying goodbye to Tarja in the second track of that album). This is a masterpiece and my favourite song of all time.
he wasn't saying goodbye ...he was screeching on about how she betrayed them by choosing to go solo and marrying Marcelo, whom they despised for giving her a backbone, finally
They don't performe this song very often because it's to difficult for Tuomas. My favorite song because of everything thing that surounds it. Music built from pain it's allways awesome, specialy if it's made by a genius in pain. It starts with"the end" because he felt like it was the end of his life. It ends with "the begining" because he overcomes and it's the begining of a new life. Cheers from Portugal.
Its Tuomas' lyrical suicide so he wouldn't have to commit actual suicide; the firing of his friend Tarja and the flack from media/fans as a result made him very depressed as he feared he killed his baby, Nightwish.
i have seen nightwish live 5 times, they havent played this song once, tuomas put his all in this song and its a very rare sight to see them playing this, Tuomas didnt have his earplugs in on this recording and im pretty sure he never has had them in when they play it live, you can see the emotion he puts in when he plays it and thats enough to know how hard it is to him.
@@ProtoLolZz Well, when you play on Wembley Stadium you really need put up the best show you can. Selling out the same legendary venue Michael Jackson and Queen did is a bit of a big deal. So you have to rise up to it. For stadium venues Wembley is what Wacken is for open air ones. 😉
@@bornready6924 As harsh as it was (and it was very harsh), it revealed her actions and her words and her behaviour at the time towards the band. And it was their letter, not his letter.
I think The End represents that moment when you feel like your life is over and you want it to *end* , while The Beginning is like a new beginning, a revival after these horrible times represented by the whole song (which is why it's at the end of it). Honestly, although being a big Nightwish fan, I've never *truly* understood this song until I felt suicidal myself (the last 4 years or so). What he says there just makes perfect sense to a depressed mind. I'm just so incredibly happy that he wrote this song and got better. :(
"showing everyone but Marko"... wait for it!!!!!........ Please react to Nightwish tribute to Pink Floyd - "High Hopes" with Marko singing and Tuomas "really getting into it" (Before the aliens abduct him!)
On the end of mother and father, Emppuu and Marco stand with Tuomas to support him.. In a interview after the concert he said that he cried after the last tone of the song..
Oh man brings me always to tears. I'm so glad that you could bring this one back. Love this song and your reaction. Keep on rockin 💪🏼 Greetings from Germany
The end and the beginning in my mind are not the literal end and beginning of the song, but the End of an Era (the last DVD with Tarja was even called that) and the beginning of his spiritual recovery with the love of his parents after he metaphorically kills himself in the song The different parts of the songs are different phases of depression with the heavier fast paced parts being very manic phases He is being torn with self-pity, regret, guilt and mixed feelings of separation from the past and Tarja (around whom a lot of his life revolved around) and whom he ultimately had to fire. As an OG fan from 1997, here is my *personal* analysis of the song lyrics (which differ quite a bit from some people's analysis), it is hard to put in to words, since it is all more a general feeling, but I'll try my best *"Poet without a rhyme A widowed writer, * * torn apart by chains of Hell"* He is the widowed writer, separated from his muse, of whom almost all the songs and lyrics were at least partly about and the outlet of his music, like Christine to the Phantom of the Opera"* *"One last perfect verse* *Yet still the same old song* *Oh Christ, how I hate what I have become"* This is most likely about his feelings of self-loathing on End of the Era tour, of his looming betrayal of Tarja *"Get away, run away, fly away* *Lead me astray, to dreamer's hideaway"* He is running away from media, friends and everyone running into hiding, deeper and deeper inside his mind and into depression *"I cannot cry ?cause the shoulder cries more"* He cannot cry since the bedrock of his life, the shoulder he used to cry on (Tarja) is hurting even more *"I cannot die, I, the whore for the cold world"* Dying is too good for him, the betrayer who betrayed his beliefs and friend due to the demands of the greater good and due to insistence of Marko. He has most likely thought of finding release from death many times before (since he says later, that he has always longed for), but has never been (luckily) able to take it past random thoughts *"Forgive me, I have but two faces* *One for the world,* *One for God save me"* Asking Tarja to forgive him for being two-faced. how he fired her in a truly cold fashion, while still being torn inside by his deep feelings for her and his feeling of having betrayed her *"My home was there and then* *These meadows of heaven* *Adventure-filled days* *One with every smiling face"* This was his home, the happy early Nightwish days when every day was like an amazing adventure and the band was like a happy family *"Please, no more words* *Thoughts from a severed head* *No more praise* *Tell me once my heart goes right* *Take me home"* Please don't try to rationalize or praise me (talking to others and himself), he is too deep in depression, save it until he is over this ... ... *"On the shore we sat and hoped* *Under the same pale moon* *Whose guiding light chose you* *Chose you all"* It is about the great days of Nightwish, when everything was still fine and how it had felt destiny had chosen all the right members to be together with same dreams and hopes *"I'm afraid, so afraid, of being raped* *Again and again and again"* This is about the self-inflected mental abuse he was being subject to at the last years of Tarja years, with Tarja's new husband in the picture, with them on tours and parties. Starting to change how things work, expectations being trashed, promises broken etc *"I know I will die alone, but loved"* He knows he can never be with her, but there is platonic love between them *"You live long enough to hear the sound of guns* *Long enough to find yourself screaming every night* *And if you want* *Live long enough to see your friends betray you""* This is more about the frustration he had felt piling up over the years. "And if you want" pointing to the option of opting out having been crossing his mind. The betrayal accusation is most likely towards Tarja and mainly to himself *"Years have I been strapped unto this altar"* More about how this has been going on for so long *"Now I only have three minutes and counting* *I just wish the tide would catch me first* *And give me a death* *I always longed for"* He is remember the moment just before he had to walk in an tell to Tarja she is fired, and how he dreaded that moment, and wished something would come and stop him before that, and give him a release from that anguish, the release of death, he was not able/willing to seek himself *"Second robber to the right of Christ* *Cut in half - infacticide"* Here is a play on words, the Penitent thief from the bible, who was also crucified same as Christ, who initially mocked him, but later said "And indeed, we have been condemned justly, for the sentence we received corresponds to our crimes, but this man has done nothing criminal.". I believe this is about how he thinks Tarja herself has done nothing truly wrong, and Tuomas himself is even more guilty, but they are both paying the same price of media and fan crucifixion, due to Tuomas's actions *"The world will rejoice today* *As the crows feast on the rotting poet"* The media and fan are in ecstasy for the metaphorical corpse of Tuomas they are feasting over due to the insane media scandal and backlash against Tuomas in particular it caused in Finland *"Everyone must bury their own* *No pack to bury the heart of stone* *Now he's home in Hell, serves him well* *Slain by the bell, tolling for his farewell"* This is about self-loathing and how he thinks he deserves his fate and place in hell for what he has done *"The morning dawned upon this altar* *Remains of the dark passion play* *Performed by his friends without shame* *Spitting on his grave as they came"* He concentrated and channeled all his self-loathing, anger, hate, depression and suicidal thoughts into making this album, Dark Passion Play. As he said himself, this album saved his literal life, by working as a therapeutic process where on this particular song, he metaphorically killed himself (and his guilt, depression, suicidal thoughts and moved on). The band members could then proudly perform this masterpiece from his deepest shame without shame, spitting on the grave of his former self-loathing self *"Today, in the year of our Lord, 2005* *Tuomas was called from the cares of the world* *He stopped crying at the end of each beautiful day* *The music he wrote had too long been without silence* *He was found naked and dead* *With a smile in his face, a pen and 1000 pages of erased text"* This is the year they fired Tarja, and he finally metaphorically released himself with death from the depression and self-pity and had finally given up on his unrequited love for Tarja, erasing all the songs he had written for her and of her from his mind. He killed his old naive self, longing for something he can't have, and was now finally mentally naked (fresh start) and happy, to start again anew *"Be still, my son* *You're home* *Oh when did you become so cold?* *The blade will keep on descending* *All you need is to feel my love* *Search for beauty, find your shore* *Try to save them all, bleed no more* *You have such ocean's within* *In the end* *I will always love you"* This was the letter his parents wrote her, that helped him put away his self-destructive feelings, and get back up to find himself again, by the power of his parents love *"The beginning"* His new life free from unrequited love and longing for Tarja begins
Thank you, Santtu. I thoroughly enjoyed reading your interpretation of the events related in this amazing song. I'm going to show this to my friends and family. Cheers, mate - from downunder. \m/
Incredible!! I think, you nailed it !! Thank you for this....! You're very perceptive and do TRULY understand, the meaning of this song, and the state of Tuomas's mind, soul and heart... Seems like, you're a poet yourself... :-)
At one point in an Interview somewhere, Tuomas said that during the time after he had to kick Tarja out of the band, he was in the deepest pit of depression. To the point where he said "Either I took my own life and ended it all, or I wrote a song about me doing it." This song is that song. Where he, "The Poet," commits suicide in the song itself, whilst choosing life for himself instead.
It's probably the meaning behind the "pages of erased text" mentioned, as in in that alternate reality of the song he didn't write anything, so he killed himself instead.
she did him a favor by remaining after she decided to go solo..he took advantage of that and gave her no respect than (despite not being able to tolerate this situation any longer) waited til the last concert of the tour(to maximize profits) ....made her perform while she was ill and cowardly fired her by a posted letter so full of holes that a child could see thru it...
Thank you for this reaction. This song always brings me to tears. I've been struck by these feelings so many years, and I had an ex that committed suicide due to these overwhelming waves of hopelessness, three months ago. Since that suicide I've been watching this live a lot, 'cause Tuomas just... He just knows how to portray his emotions in melodies in a way that no one can. Thank you, again.
To me, this song is basically written forwards emotionally. The choir boy says what Tuomas imagines people may say at his passing - or an autobiography he might write on himself if he only had the time - a shadow of what he thinks the future holds. Events proceed before a merciless crowd, his own fans. He feels betrayed by his closest friends, the band. Strapped to the altar of fame, he is suddenly disgusted, and feels like a whore for the whole world. The inevitability sways above him like a pendulum of execution, and he sees no escape. The band is cut in half, and he's finished. No more songs will be written, and his heart can no longer go on beating. But then, his parents remind him that he still has the same oceans within, and he'll find other shores in life, and whether the world loves him or not, their love is constant. It may look like the end, but really, he is just beginning!
Great review and I'm glad you got to do this masterpiece, it is a complex song in many ways and you discover more everytime you listen to it. I am also glad you did some research before listening to it as it gives the song so much more meaning. I think you got most of the story right with the end being the beginning, during Marcos section there is a lot about how media and fans treated him after the break up, blaming him and hanging his rotten corpse out to dry basically, at the end when Marco and Empuu stands beside him is symbolic of how the decision to fire Tarja was a mutual one and all band members agreed, not just Tuomas. The part with his Mother and Father giving him strength through their love for him to move forward and "save them all" gets me every time. We'll done, next The Greatest Show on Earth, live frm Tampere. Bring snacks, cause it's even longer. But wow it's an epic song aswell. Keep it up, great reactions!
You can see some bandmembers going to Tuomas towards the end of the song, to make sure he's okay/not alone "out there" (his stage-position is rather separated).
Like others have said this was written about a terrible time in his life. The band mutually fired Tarja (badly) and she was leaving anyway, Tuomas being the band leader got all of the fallout for the firing. Fans, media, friends and even the Finish Government turned on him. It doesn't take a genius to understand the emotional damage that could cause someone who's sensitive like Tuomas (most people who are that able to tap into emotion like Tuomas does to write how he writes are very sensitive and vulnerable to negative emotions as well, let alone hate and death threats!) That's why the Marko and Empuu stand around him at the end to say they are always there for him as friends and the end with the words from his mother that got him to get back up and keep on writing also kept the band going past that dark period and may have saved his mental health if not his life. His writing has changed so much since then, he's happy, the band are happy and life is good now. And long may it continue.
too bad , he is only sensitive to his own precious feelings of being attacked by the world for a treacherous, vindictive act against someone he professed to respect and honor....by the way, it is well know in the industry that Tuomas tolerates no dissent and Marco was hopping mad at Tarja for refusing to go on extensive tours, playing every gin joint in the US at the expense of her health for the benefit of his greed
Nicely done with this song :) The big thing to know about this song is that its about Tuomas' emotional state, feeling suicidal, in the aftermath of the band sacking their orignal singer Tarja. Believe me when I say that it was messy! Its hard to put into words for newcomers just how messy it was at the time! Tuomas got the brunt of the blame for the decision to sack her (despite it being a decision the others took too), and the abuse he got was off the scale, including death threats, and the whole thing took its tole on the whole band, so poet and the pendulum is about that, and Tuomas writing his suicide in a song so that he wouldnt in real life - and thankfully hes still here.
From Tuomas, he was never actually suicidal in real life, but he was very depressed/traumatized. Writing about an imagined suicide was cathartic for him.
My version of the song is this: We start with the end, the time where everything is falling apart, Tarja getting fired, and Tuomas is having a sewered head, drinking wine, and ending up being close to killing himself, or at least not see the exit clearly.. Tuomas knew this and went to live with hes parrents a while, and he needed that, to feel a mothers love, and being in a calm place, he then feel loved again, and gets the strenght to go on, with positive thoughts, and continue the band.. The beginning.. A song with hard lyrics, and yes the motherfucker gets me everytime, so it got to be a masterpiece.. IT IS A MASTERPIECE!! lol
Did you notice there is EXACTLY 3 minutes between when the narrator says "now I only have 3 minutes and counting" and when the blade falls. Now that is some awesome attenion to detail.
A masterpiece indeed! This one had the biggest impact on me of all the beautiful music Tuomas has ever made, before or since. My world just shifted the moment I first listen to it. The Nightwish Army will give you all the details behind the song and what it means BUT... I would say though sad as this beautiful piece of art seems, it is actually on its core optimistic! It's about rebirth in my opinion. Some part of us dies ( "the end") in order to make way for a new one (and then "the beginning ") to be born. Often a better one. So Tuomas managed to kill the old self, the poet defined by a certain muse, a friend now lost, a certain order in his world, to give life to the new self, more creative than ever, inspired not by a muse only but by everything around him. He "found beauty" in this new world of his and by killing the old self in this song he saved his actual life and made a new start. And us with him! ❤
Nice to see the drummers get a nod from a reactor Hoopsick. Jukka was a beast and they were fortunate to get Kai, another one. Cheers from your new subscriber!
Yes the end of an era😉 then going through all the feelings and backlash of the break up. And finally getting through it all and with a new beginning (personally and as a band with a new singer). That's why it was also the first song of the album🤘
As it was told to me Tuomas was in a really dark place in his life when they fired Tarja, even the Nightwish Army turned on him, blamed him for getting her fired. they even asked the Government to step in to get her back. This was written as a way of healing himself. Interesting side note: when the child states that "he has 3 Minutes and counting" the amount of time until Tuomas cuts his head off is 3 minutes.
The end of what you love, the burden of carrying on becoming too much to bear from all the hate and heartache, then a path out of the darkness to a new beginning.
As someone who has lived with severe depression for decades, I would suggest that what the song is expressing is the sense if hopelessness and inevitability that Tuomas must have been feeling. Not only was he powerless to stop the cataclysm that nearly ripped the band apart, but he was hounded in the media like he was the antiChrist. In that state you tend to take on absolutely everything and your fault and your fault alone. The pendulum is the ceaseless assaults of his own mind tearing him to sheds, wondering which swing of the pendulum would be the one that finally severed his will and led him to suicide. Remember, depression (real depression, not just sadness) is when the pain of living exceeds the ability to cope; relief can be rare and fleeting. As a creator, writing this song would have been his way of crystallising those feelings in the hope that he could cast them away. So often the feelings that keep us down are the ones that cannot, or will not be expressed. When they are, they can finally start to fade. That's why Marko and Emppu and hovering around Tuomas. The wounds may be in the past, but like an addiction, they never really leave you. You learn to find other ways of being happy, or at least content, despite the memories. Getting back to writing and having Annette sing for them would have been extremely cathartic, but Floor seems to have healed the whole band in a way that it's hard to imagine anyone could have. She is such a magnificent presence that she brings everything to life in a way that seems almost impossible - she is the ingredient that made Nightwish a gestalt (more than the sum of it's parts). Tuomas is undoubtedly the living genius behind it all, but having it expressed by a Valkyrie made flesh is as close to divinity as expression can be. You only have to look at how happy everyone is to be there. It's not just having fun: it's total, utter, and blissful fulfillment, and you can see it on Floor's face, more than anyone else's, in *every* song. She has an omega tattooed on her wrist. She is the last singer of Nighwish, the rebirth that made them all whole again. They're all talented up the wazoo, but I think her personality and passion kind of dwarfs them all [insert short Emppu joke here].
When you see the guitarist (Emppu) talking to Tuomas (the guy on the keyboards) they are not chatting. Emppu is checking if Tuomas is okay. It is a very emotional song for him. Tuomas said in interview that he sometimes asks the sound engineers to shut his ear pieces off during the song so that he cannot hear Floor singing, because it's too hard for him.
Personally I feel like the song works better, if you don't focus on the death part too much. The way I see it, it's meant to be a purifying, cathartic moment in the song, where he gives up those self destructive thoughts. So much of what the man writes is about turning dark into light and finding hope in hopelessness. Looking at this song that way, I'd say it's a song about falling into depression, feeling crushed, hated and wanting to run away and hide, even thinking about the ultimate escape, but then overcoming those thoughts with the help of the ones closest to you. That's why it starts with an "end" but ends with a new beginning.
This is what I'm waiting for! Yes it is a masterpiece. The poet and the pendulum is my #1 favourite song of Nightwish. #2 is Ghost love score. #3 is The greatest show on earth - you really must react to this one. Another masterpiece they have. 👍👍👍
I love your reactions.........you need to do DEVIL AND THE DEEP DARK OCEAN......BUENOS AIRES LIVE..... Kai (drummer) kills it with the double bass........plus it is a very heavy song.....right in your wheelhouse!!! thanks, hope you can do that one soon!!!!! Keep it up!!!!
When the kid says only have 3 minutes left. You then hear the blade sharpen. Exactly 3 minutes from the point you hear the blade drop and see him slit his neck.
This song is very personal and powerful. Thomas's heart lays open to us all....he is after all... a poet at heart and soul.. Btw....you were talking about the drummers beat....it's a drum-machine, programmed and used by Jukka first, and then transfered to Kai....but Kia has said, he had to practice ALOT, to get the same sound for the audience, as Jukka has created. Awesome reaction video..you've got a good ear, and knows how to express yourself clearly....KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK! :-)
The end at the beginning of the song and the beginning at the ending means Death of the old Tuomas and Rebirth of a new Tuomas. The Part 1: The White Lands of Empathica is a Reference to Stephen King's Dark Tower Books, this part is like an abstract of the song. The Part 2: Home is Tuomas telling his feelings about the nightwish fans going full rent on him for what happened (Tuomas publish an open letter right after the "End of an era world tour" kicking Tarja off the band). The part of the song "I have but two faces One for the world One for God Save me" in my opinion means that the world sees him like a bad guy but God sees his true feelings, how he suffered doing what he did. The part 3: The Pacific tells his acceptance of death, the peace he will feel afterlife, Tuomas imagining the moment of his death. The part 4: Dark Passion Play is Tuomas imagining what would happen after his death, The world will rejoice, No pack to bury the heart of stone (No one caring about is death) and Remains of the dark passion play Performed by his friends without shame Spitting on his grave as they came, in my opinion means the members of the band continuing to play his songs without shame with anger because of him taking his life. The Part 5: Mother and Father is about his family (real family and the band) conforting him in this time of need and sayng that the backlash will continue, but he needs to find himself again and save the band, that in the end his family will always love him. the beginning means his rebirth.
I don't know if you're familiar with Coheed and Cambria but most of their songs are based on a fictional sci fi universe the singer and songwriter Claudio Sanchez came up with but he puts in a lot of elements and emotions relating to himself and his real life in there too. Your description of Tuomas creating a fictional story based on his real experiences and feelings made the comparison come to mind
I believe "The End" at the beginning was referring to the first era of Nightwish (with Tarja), and "The Beginning" at the end refers to the future of the band.
@Marco T.. that "ponce" was her manager who stood up for her interests and to whom Tuomas referred as that "Argentinian interloper"....yah, he really showed his love by neglecting, ignoring and then defaming her before the world...please get the facts..she had numerous very lucrative offers from other bands but stayed out of loyalty, hoping for Tuomas to change
thanx hoopsick react this and many more nightwish song. enjoy always honest react and then analyze music. this song in right moment in life or just mood like down is going to wet eyes for me and many people i think. ok have nice day there., and thanx again.
Sometimes the editor can see that you are just not up to the visual requirements for the recording, and inserts other footage instead. Marco was about to have a vocal solo, so he might have been focused on other things, like warming up his vocals. And also grimacing to stretch out his face muscles. I have no idea, but I assume the editor chose the footage based on the best possible visual outcome from what they had to work with.
Great reaction ...and good comments...you got the point well and found plenty of details. Tuomas leaves still much for the listener to explore and make up mind without giving clear exact answers so it makes these even more interesting to think about. He personally felt so quilty cause they let Tarja go and all the fans and media blamed him for it.
This piece could be a great segway into listening to some songs with Tarja and get some perspective on just why the media was in such a frenzy when Tuomas decided to fire her from the band. To say that she has an unique voice is quite the understatement. I would suggest: *She is my Sin - live, From Wishes to Eternity* *The Kinslayer - live, End of an Era* *Nemo - live, End of an Era* *Stargazers - Oceanborn* (there aren't any high quality live performances of this one with Tarja on YT. It's basically the most difficult Nightwish song ever written.)
Great reaction Hoopsick. If you want another great song (emotional with superb drumming) try Dead Boys Poem Live with Floor. It gets me like Poet and the P.
It's not written backwards. White Lands Of Empathica: is about the End of and Era (Tarja leaving the band) and how he feels it's the end of his dream. Home: Is about the backlash to the Open letter to Tarja and how he needed to get away from the band and deal with the choice he made. The Pacific: Is about depression and the longing he was left with. Dark Passion Play: Is literally the writing of the Album the song is from, and how writing it was his release. Mother and Father: Is him returning home to those who love him and to the band and new beginnings.
I think that the “open letter,” even though a childish move, saved Tarja’s career. Had Tarja just left Nightwish after whatever album came after “Once,” most of the flack would’ve gone to her for leaving “selfishly”; the band would’ve gotten the sympathies amidst the drama. The drama created after the “open letter” was huge, and the sympathies for Tarja boosted her solo career. Imagine if Tarja left on her own after the album next to “Once,” I don’t think she’d be as successful as she is now or, at least, she’d have to work harder to reach what she has now, without the PR boost caused by being on the “victimized” side of the drama.
she was victimozed by that nasty letter and could have smeared Tuomas before the world but chose not to... he, however was full of rage at her and Marcelo for interfering in what he considered his domain.... most of Tarja's fans could not care less about Tuomas and his bunch...they would have followed her regardless...
born ready, I really don’t care if Tarjaholics would’ve followed her regardless of whether she resigned or was fired. My point is simple: If she resigned from the band, she’d only have minority fans like you left to support her solo career, which is why she threatened the band that she’d leave if she didn’t get her way. She had all the reason to leave but she didn’t because her solo career wasn’t secure; she needed the band’s fame, however, she’s also against playing at “smaller venues.” Seriously, she could’ve just left at that point, but a few minority fans like you wouldn’t afford Tarja the “larger venues” she desired, so she stayed a while, even though her change in priorities spawned friction within the group. The silly Open Letter was her breakthrough. It made her the “victim” of the drama and divided the fanbase. Had it not been for this controversy, Tarja’s solo career wouldn’t have kickstarted as great as it did. She’d only have diehards like you, it would be back to “smaller venues” for her. I have a feeling that you’ll entirely miss my point, so give it you best shot, man. Miss the point like there’s no tomorrow.
@@OrdinaryCritic judging by the fact that she was deemed, always to be the chief attraction for the fans, its logical to believe that the NW fan base would dwindle down to a very few and that most would follow her...
born ready, judging that she’s in a European band and not in an American band, you would be wrong. European bands are not usually vocalist-oriented, even though fans seem to enjoy a good vocalist. There’s been precedence to this. Bands changing their vocalist retain most of their fanbase or, at least, the fanbase doesn’t all follow the vocalist’s solo career. The majority of the fans usually remain with the band despite the change of a frontman/woman, even if the replacement vocalist isn’t as good. Tarja is no exception; even until now, she didn’t get as big as Nightwish. And, one of the reason she didn’t drown into oblivion like most vocalists who left their bands is because she had a very controversial breakup with the band wherein she came out as the “victim” and the band as the “bad guys.” This divided the fanbase to a that Tarja gained more “devoted” followers other than typical Tarjaholics such as yourself. As usual, you’re still gonna miss my point because you think I’m antagonizing your queen. Wake up, I’m not. I respect her as an artist; however, I cannot deny the fact that talent alone can fill large venues. Realistically, it requires more PR than it does talent, judging by the mainstream artists.
@@OrdinaryCritic half a fan base ( proud Tarjaholics like myself) was lost immediately after the split (thats a fact)...Tarja put out 10 successful albums that are still selling at a great clip despite getting very little youtube exposure(thats a fact).,..NW released only 4 albums in that time, and no one would even know it without youtube gaving it so much exposure in the last few years (thats a fact) your presumption that Tarja milked the ugly firing to gain more fans from the non-tarjaholic pool or that without that manipulation, she would fade into history is pure speculation on your part ... Tuomas purposely attempted to defame her in a fit of anger and jealousy and continued to do so at every opportunity for many years to come (thats a fact) i only deal in facts ...
This is a hard song if one, as you did, actually listens to the story. I've listened to it many many times and yet tears still form when Floor hits those notes at the end. If you have the inclination, I highly recommend listening to the DVD itself (no compression) in a quiet room away from the cams, net, and people where you don't need two faces, and can let the emotions of the song hit you honestly as Tuomas presents them.
I would highly suggest Master Passion Greed! It's one of their heaviest and fastest song, with Marco's vocals only and he's killing it!! Unfortunately they don't have a music video or live play, but you should still check it out ;)
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This is Tuomas showing us his soul. The last part "Mother and Father" brings a tear to my eye every time I listen to it. To know that he used his Mother's own words in the song touches my heart
I used to sing it to my son when he was a little baby.
Me also...
So true! I cry every thing me no matter what mood I'm in.
lol..he is a yarn spinner and reverses his public opinions all the time...first, claiming that he regrets stabbing Tarja in the back, then doubles down on not regretting it and advising anyone confused on the issue to (exact words..shut the F* up and go away..classy)...he fabricates ersatz feelings on a whim, trying to garner sympathy for reckless acts
It is so touching, such an amazing band.
Tuomas is in a much better place now and has been married to Johanna Kurkela, a Finnish singer, since 2015. I am so glad he chose life. What a loss that would have been!
think floor did alot for him to being such a good singer having the spot on voice harmony
he was never going to off himself..this is his way of shedding Tarja...an impossible task indeed
He's not taking a break..he's supporting Tuomas because its a very emotional song for him still!
I only saw happy grins in that exchange so there's was no way for me to tell that was the case. Thank you
@@Hoopsick Both Marko and Emppu go and stand with Tuomas at the end to ensure he's not just about to loose it altogether and give support.
@@Hoopsick keep in mind that this song was performed with the second singer, Annette Olson so its been performed for quite awhile before THIS performance, the sting of it is still there but not like it was when it was written, They do not play this Poet and the Pendulum (The Pain) much anymore, or Master, Passion, Greed (The ANGER of the situation ) or bye bye Beautiful. Most of the Nightwish army will implore a reactor to wait, listen and learn to love all there eras of Nightwish especially the first with Tarja because this song is in the end about loss, grief, pain and suicide, it is also about love, friendship and rebirth
@@Hoopsick It sure doesn't look like he's having a hard time. And as this concert was about ten years after the incident it sure isn't quite as tough as had been earlier.
And to be honest I'm not sure about that part where you mentioned about Emppu, he's well known to be fooling and joking around.
At the end is the part where Emppu and Marko gather around Tuomas and that's their gesture of unity (they are the only members playing anymore that were there to sign THE letter, it was in no way Tuomas' decision alone).
@@1982jeepcj8 year and also its Emppu asking i dont really know, but i imagine Emppu who is often called a Joker or a Prankster not asking:
" How are you Tuomas?, everything allright, i know its though for you" , more like " you good Tuomas? Pizza after the Show?" dealing with it in boyish nature but incredible warmhearted also
maybe just my imagination...
Throughout this song Marco and Emppu are checking up on Tuomas, this is song is very tough for him. I believe he actually filters most of the song out of the in-ear mix he gets to avoid getting too involved in it. You can see the two of them together at the end supporting him. The "three minutes and counting" takes you exactly to the point where he draws his hand across his throat. Oh yeah...Tuomas was in a dark place alright. The story goes from the "death" of the band/his will to continue through the darkness to the virtual suicide and then finally the "coming out the other side". The last section is just so beautiful and rips into you. How can a line as simple as "all you need is to feel my love" hit so hard?
Hope this one survives the DCMA purge
He used to filter out most of the singer while playing this song. I believe I have read somewhere that he can listen to it now but it's still painfull
One detail showing the ingenuity of Tuoams: Exactly three minutes after the words "Now I have only three minutes and counting" he is "killed" by the pendulum. And afterwards it gets dark and becomes silence with just a fading heartbeat.
As it was so emotional for Tuomas the other were having an extra eye on him, like Emppu talking with him. Tuomas had the spoken lyrics turned off from his in ear monitor.
A heartbeat that stops on the 4th beat.
@@deeteenw Gives me chills over and over again
Tuomas says this: ruclips.net/video/v65-ErfUyVM/видео.html (time stamped)
Thanks for sharing!!
At last this song!!!! Every time in the end ....tears!
Next song that together with Ghost Love Score makes the golden triangle: "The Greatest Show on Earth" - Live from Tampere
You definitely need to check out The Greatest Show On Earth (Tampere show). That song is epic af.
@Kanashimi 😂😂😂😂😂😂
I agree....a reaction to GREATEST SHOW ON EARTH , would be awesome! :-)
@Kanashimi Wembley was great, especially having the "guest" (let's not spoil that here) live on stage.
But I haven't found a recording yet (as in, video) that beats the tampere show in quality.
Oh Marco Hietala , beautifull men , the viking and Floor Jansen supreme soprano , supreme singer metal. Master piece.
Finally another one that does the research first
Notes on some points you raised... The score begins at The End because it is "The End of an Era," the painful parting of ways with band co-founder and the fans' beloved angel, Tarja Turunen. He has said in other lyrics years previous to this that he "needs to die in order to feel alive again," and thus his metaphorical suicide here. After his "death" is a new beginning... a new era to his life. And hence the score ends with The Beginning. …….. I noticed you, like many other reactors, were slightly taken aback at the line about being raped again and again and again. Though he writes the lyrics for a female voice to sing (or in this case recite) we must remember it is about the keyboardist, the poet. It is he who is being raped by Poe's slowly descending pendulum blade as it slices through him on each swing, again and again and again. ……. I have written a very in-depth interpretation of this particular score from my own research that I have shared with others. If you are interested to see another perspective, let me know, and I will gladly email you two pdf's of the mini-essay. I could also post it here, but I think other people get sick of seeing it "again and again and again" (pun intended) and then they write me snarky comments to tell me what a horribly boring person I am. (LOL) So I offer email as an option to spare them the agony.
The song being written backwards is what I thought at first, but I think the actual idea is not that. It's more of a transition : "The end" is the end of an era, and "the beginning" is a new beginning. Not just for the band but for Tuomas and his soul ; this song is basically him looking for this new beginning. It makes all the more sense when you consider the position of this track : it's the first one on the album "Dark Passion Play" and so the very first Nightwish song after Tarja's departure, as if it was something necessary before moving on (and saying goodbye to Tarja in the second track of that album).
This is a masterpiece and my favourite song of all time.
he wasn't saying goodbye ...he was screeching on about how she betrayed them by choosing to go solo and marrying Marcelo, whom they despised for giving her a backbone, finally
They don't performe this song very often because it's to difficult for Tuomas.
My favorite song because of everything thing that surounds it.
Music built from pain it's allways awesome, specialy if it's made by a genius in pain.
It starts with"the end" because he felt like it was the end of his life.
It ends with "the begining" because he overcomes and it's the begining of a new life.
Cheers from Portugal.
Finally someone acknowledging Marcos Bass playing! :D 👍up from me.
Its Tuomas' lyrical suicide so he wouldn't have to commit actual suicide; the firing of his friend Tarja and the flack from media/fans as a result made him very depressed as he feared he killed his baby, Nightwish.
hence the "infanticide" reference in Marko's lines!
i have seen nightwish live 5 times, they havent played this song once, tuomas put his all in this song and its a very rare sight to see them playing this, Tuomas didnt have his earplugs in on this recording and im pretty sure he never has had them in when they play it live, you can see the emotion he puts in when he plays it and thats enough to know how hard it is to him.
@@ProtoLolZz Well, when you play on Wembley Stadium you really need put up the best show you can. Selling out the same legendary venue Michael Jackson and Queen did is a bit of a big deal. So you have to rise up to it. For stadium venues Wembley is what Wacken is for open air ones. 😉
the flak was for his nasty letter defaming Tarja
@@bornready6924 As harsh as it was (and it was very harsh), it revealed her actions and her words and her behaviour at the time towards the band. And it was their letter, not his letter.
I think The End represents that moment when you feel like your life is over and you want it to *end* , while The Beginning is like a new beginning, a revival after these horrible times represented by the whole song (which is why it's at the end of it). Honestly, although being a big Nightwish fan, I've never *truly* understood this song until I felt suicidal myself (the last 4 years or so). What he says there just makes perfect sense to a depressed mind. I'm just so incredibly happy that he wrote this song and got better. :(
The same goes to you my friend..... LIFE IS GOOD
"showing everyone but Marko"... wait for it!!!!!........ Please react to Nightwish tribute to Pink Floyd - "High Hopes" with Marko singing and Tuomas "really getting into it" (Before the aliens abduct him!)
On the end of mother and father, Emppuu and Marco stand with Tuomas to support him..
In a interview after the concert he said that he cried after the last tone of the song..
Oh man brings me always to tears. I'm so glad that you could bring this one back. Love this song and your reaction. Keep on rockin 💪🏼 Greetings from Germany
Nightwish. Masterpiece. Enough said.
Every time I listen to it it moves me. Especially the part when Floor sings the first part of The Pacific. Thanks for your reaction! 💕🤘
The end and the beginning in my mind are not the literal end and beginning of the song, but the End of an Era (the last DVD with Tarja was even called that) and the beginning of his spiritual recovery with the love of his parents after he metaphorically kills himself in the song
The different parts of the songs are different phases of depression with the heavier fast paced parts being very manic phases
He is being torn with self-pity, regret, guilt and mixed feelings of separation from the past and Tarja (around whom a lot of his life revolved around) and whom he ultimately had to fire.
As an OG fan from 1997, here is my *personal* analysis of the song lyrics (which differ quite a bit from some people's analysis), it is hard to put in to words, since it is all more a general feeling, but I'll try my best
*"Poet without a rhyme A widowed writer, *
* torn apart by chains of Hell"*
He is the widowed writer, separated from his muse, of whom almost all the songs and lyrics were at least partly about and the outlet of his music, like Christine to the Phantom of the Opera"*
*"One last perfect verse*
*Yet still the same old song*
*Oh Christ, how I hate what I have become"*
This is most likely about his feelings of self-loathing on End of the Era tour, of his looming betrayal of Tarja
*"Get away, run away, fly away*
*Lead me astray, to dreamer's hideaway"*
He is running away from media, friends and everyone running into hiding, deeper and deeper inside his mind and into depression
*"I cannot cry ?cause the shoulder cries more"*
He cannot cry since the bedrock of his life, the shoulder he used to cry on (Tarja) is hurting even more
*"I cannot die, I, the whore for the cold world"*
Dying is too good for him, the betrayer who betrayed his beliefs and friend due to the demands of the greater good and due to insistence of Marko. He has most likely thought of finding release from death many times before (since he says later, that he has always longed for), but has never been (luckily) able to take it past random thoughts
*"Forgive me, I have but two faces*
*One for the world,*
*One for God save me"*
Asking Tarja to forgive him for being two-faced. how he fired her in a truly cold fashion, while still being torn inside by his deep feelings for her and his feeling of having betrayed her
*"My home was there and then*
*These meadows of heaven*
*Adventure-filled days*
*One with every smiling face"*
This was his home, the happy early Nightwish days when every day was like an amazing adventure and the band was like a happy family
*"Please, no more words*
*Thoughts from a severed head*
*No more praise*
*Tell me once my heart goes right*
*Take me home"*
Please don't try to rationalize or praise me (talking to others and himself), he is too deep in depression, save it until he is over this
...
...
*"On the shore we sat and hoped*
*Under the same pale moon*
*Whose guiding light chose you*
*Chose you all"*
It is about the great days of Nightwish, when everything was still fine and how it had felt destiny had chosen all the right members to be together with same dreams and hopes
*"I'm afraid, so afraid, of being raped*
*Again and again and again"*
This is about the self-inflected mental abuse he was being subject to at the last years of Tarja years, with Tarja's new husband in the picture, with them on tours and parties. Starting to change how things work, expectations being trashed, promises broken etc
*"I know I will die alone, but loved"*
He knows he can never be with her, but there is platonic love between them
*"You live long enough to hear the sound of guns*
*Long enough to find yourself screaming every night*
*And if you want*
*Live long enough to see your friends betray you""*
This is more about the frustration he had felt piling up over the years. "And if you want" pointing to the option of opting out having been crossing his mind. The betrayal accusation is most likely towards Tarja and mainly to himself
*"Years have I been strapped unto this altar"*
More about how this has been going on for so long
*"Now I only have three minutes and counting*
*I just wish the tide would catch me first*
*And give me a death*
*I always longed for"*
He is remember the moment just before he had to walk in an tell to Tarja she is fired, and how he dreaded that moment, and wished something would come and stop him before that, and give him a release from that anguish, the release of death, he was not able/willing to seek himself
*"Second robber to the right of Christ*
*Cut in half - infacticide"*
Here is a play on words, the Penitent thief from the bible, who was also crucified same as Christ, who initially mocked him, but later said "And indeed, we have been condemned justly, for the sentence we received corresponds to our crimes, but this man has done nothing criminal.". I believe this is about how he thinks Tarja herself has done nothing truly wrong, and Tuomas himself is even more guilty, but they are both paying the same price of media and fan crucifixion, due to Tuomas's actions
*"The world will rejoice today*
*As the crows feast on the rotting poet"*
The media and fan are in ecstasy for the metaphorical corpse of Tuomas they are feasting over due to the insane media scandal and backlash against Tuomas in particular it caused in Finland
*"Everyone must bury their own*
*No pack to bury the heart of stone*
*Now he's home in Hell, serves him well*
*Slain by the bell, tolling for his farewell"*
This is about self-loathing and how he thinks he deserves his fate and place in hell for what he has done
*"The morning dawned upon this altar*
*Remains of the dark passion play*
*Performed by his friends without shame*
*Spitting on his grave as they came"*
He concentrated and channeled all his self-loathing, anger, hate, depression and suicidal thoughts into making this album, Dark Passion Play. As he said himself, this album saved his literal life, by working as a therapeutic process where on this particular song, he metaphorically killed himself (and his guilt, depression, suicidal thoughts and moved on). The band members could then proudly perform this masterpiece from his deepest shame without shame, spitting on the grave of his former self-loathing self
*"Today, in the year of our Lord, 2005*
*Tuomas was called from the cares of the world*
*He stopped crying at the end of each beautiful day*
*The music he wrote had too long been without silence*
*He was found naked and dead*
*With a smile in his face, a pen and 1000 pages of erased text"*
This is the year they fired Tarja, and he finally metaphorically released himself with death from the depression and self-pity and had finally given up on his unrequited love for Tarja, erasing all the songs he had written for her and of her from his mind. He killed his old naive self, longing for something he can't have, and was now finally mentally naked (fresh start) and happy, to start again anew
*"Be still, my son*
*You're home*
*Oh when did you become so cold?*
*The blade will keep on descending*
*All you need is to feel my love*
*Search for beauty, find your shore*
*Try to save them all, bleed no more*
*You have such ocean's within*
*In the end*
*I will always love you"*
This was the letter his parents wrote her, that helped him put away his self-destructive feelings, and get back up to find himself again, by the power of his parents love
*"The beginning"*
His new life free from unrequited love and longing for Tarja begins
Thank you, Santtu. I thoroughly enjoyed reading your interpretation of the events related in this amazing song. I'm going to show this to my friends and family. Cheers, mate - from downunder. \m/
Incredible!! I think, you nailed it !! Thank you for this....! You're very perceptive and do TRULY understand, the meaning of this song, and the state of Tuomas's mind, soul and heart... Seems like, you're a poet yourself... :-)
Thanks from The Netherlands. Chapeau!!!!
At one point in an Interview somewhere, Tuomas said that during the time after he had to kick Tarja out of the band, he was in the deepest pit of depression. To the point where he said "Either I took my own life and ended it all, or I wrote a song about me doing it."
This song is that song. Where he, "The Poet," commits suicide in the song itself, whilst choosing life for himself instead.
It's probably the meaning behind the "pages of erased text" mentioned, as in in that alternate reality of the song he didn't write anything, so he killed himself instead.
she did him a favor by remaining after she decided to go solo..he took advantage of that and gave her no respect than (despite not being able to tolerate this situation any longer) waited til the last concert of the tour(to maximize profits) ....made her perform while she was ill and cowardly fired her by a posted letter so full of holes that a child could see thru it...
Thank you for this reaction. This song always brings me to tears. I've been struck by these feelings so many years, and I had an ex that committed suicide due to these overwhelming waves of hopelessness, three months ago. Since that suicide I've been watching this live a lot, 'cause Tuomas just... He just knows how to portray his emotions in melodies in a way that no one can.
Thank you, again.
do you feel the emotion rise from the heart?
chills on the arms?, eyes shiny?
Nightwish hit you too!
nice reaction! Long life to all!
To me, this song is basically written forwards emotionally.
The choir boy says what Tuomas imagines people may say at his passing - or an autobiography he might write on himself if he only had the time - a shadow of what he thinks the future holds.
Events proceed before a merciless crowd, his own fans. He feels betrayed by his closest friends, the band. Strapped to the altar of fame, he is suddenly disgusted, and feels like a whore for the whole world. The inevitability sways above him like a pendulum of execution, and he sees no escape. The band is cut in half, and he's finished. No more songs will be written, and his heart can no longer go on beating.
But then, his parents remind him that he still has the same oceans within, and he'll find other shores in life, and whether the world loves him or not, their love is constant. It may look like the end, but really, he is just beginning!
This puts into words perfectly what I get from the lyrics. An emotional journey.
Great review and I'm glad you got to do this masterpiece, it is a complex song in many ways and you discover more everytime you listen to it. I am also glad you did some research before listening to it as it gives the song so much more meaning. I think you got most of the story right with the end being the beginning, during Marcos section there is a lot about how media and fans treated him after the break up, blaming him and hanging his rotten corpse out to dry basically, at the end when Marco and Empuu stands beside him is symbolic of how the decision to fire Tarja was a mutual one and all band members agreed, not just Tuomas. The part with his Mother and Father giving him strength through their love for him to move forward and "save them all" gets me every time. We'll done, next The Greatest Show on Earth, live frm Tampere. Bring snacks, cause it's even longer. But wow it's an epic song aswell. Keep it up, great reactions!
You can see some bandmembers going to Tuomas towards the end of the song, to make sure he's okay/not alone "out there" (his stage-position is rather separated).
Marco's bass sounds sick on this whole show, and on Tampere.
Like others have said this was written about a terrible time in his life.
The band mutually fired Tarja (badly) and she was leaving anyway, Tuomas being the band leader got all of the fallout for the firing.
Fans, media, friends and even the Finish Government turned on him.
It doesn't take a genius to understand the emotional damage that could cause someone who's sensitive like Tuomas (most people who are that able to tap into emotion like Tuomas does to write how he writes are very sensitive and vulnerable to negative emotions as well, let alone hate and death threats!)
That's why the Marko and Empuu stand around him at the end to say they are always there for him as friends and the end with the words from his mother that got him to get back up and keep on writing also kept the band going past that dark period and may have saved his mental health if not his life.
His writing has changed so much since then, he's happy, the band are happy and life is good now.
And long may it continue.
too bad , he is only sensitive to his own precious feelings of being attacked by the world for a treacherous, vindictive act against someone he professed to respect and honor....by the way, it is well know in the industry that Tuomas tolerates no dissent and Marco was hopping mad at Tarja for refusing to go on extensive tours, playing every gin joint in the US at the expense of her health for the benefit of his greed
@@xeleelex146 TBH, touring was kind of her job.
Nicely done with this song :) The big thing to know about this song is that its about Tuomas' emotional state, feeling suicidal, in the aftermath of the band sacking their orignal singer Tarja. Believe me when I say that it was messy! Its hard to put into words for newcomers just how messy it was at the time! Tuomas got the brunt of the blame for the decision to sack her (despite it being a decision the others took too), and the abuse he got was off the scale, including death threats, and the whole thing took its tole on the whole band, so poet and the pendulum is about that, and Tuomas writing his suicide in a song so that he wouldnt in real life - and thankfully hes still here.
From Tuomas, he was never actually suicidal in real life, but he was very depressed/traumatized. Writing about an imagined suicide was cathartic for him.
the flack came more as result of the nasty defamatory letter they insidiously published
Nice detail: when the boy says '3 minutes and counting it is exactly 3 minutes until you see the pendulum fall down. That's how precise they are!
My version of the song is this:
We start with the end, the time where everything is falling apart, Tarja getting fired, and Tuomas is having a sewered head, drinking wine, and ending up being close to killing himself, or at least not see the exit clearly.. Tuomas knew this and went to live with hes parrents a while, and he needed that, to feel a mothers love, and being in a calm place, he then feel loved again, and gets the strenght to go on, with positive thoughts, and continue the band.. The beginning..
A song with hard lyrics, and yes the motherfucker gets me everytime, so it got to be a masterpiece.. IT IS A MASTERPIECE!! lol
I love that Marco and Empuu went to check on Tuomas because he still gets emotional when they play it.
Thank you for the reaction to this masterpiece
I guess it is time for The Greatest Show on Earth.
On Earth*
Amen!!
Another MASTERPIECE coming off of The Epic Poet & Pendulum.
@@Dubbel12 right
Did you notice there is EXACTLY 3 minutes between when the narrator says "now I only have 3 minutes and counting" and when the blade falls. Now that is some awesome attenion to detail.
A masterpiece indeed! This one had the biggest impact on me of all the beautiful music Tuomas has ever made, before or since. My world just shifted the moment I first listen to it. The Nightwish Army will give you all the details behind the song and what it means BUT... I would say though sad as this beautiful piece of art seems, it is actually on its core optimistic! It's about rebirth in my opinion. Some part of us dies ( "the end") in order to make way for a new one (and then "the beginning ") to be born. Often a better one. So Tuomas managed to kill the old self, the poet defined by a certain muse, a friend now lost, a certain order in his world, to give life to the new self, more creative than ever, inspired not by a muse only but by everything around him. He "found beauty" in this new world of his and by killing the old self in this song he saved his actual life and made a new start. And us with him! ❤
Nice to see the drummers get a nod from a reactor Hoopsick. Jukka was a beast and they were fortunate to get Kai, another one. Cheers from your new subscriber!
In the end always some tears show up on me as it´s such an emotional song. Nothing more to say.
The "The end" and "The begining" verses represents the end of nightwish with tarja and without tarja, i think
Yes the end of an era😉 then going through all the feelings and backlash of the break up. And finally getting through it all and with a new beginning (personally and as a band with a new singer). That's why it was also the first song of the album🤘
if he wan't so certain that without Tarja, there would be no Nightwish , than maybe , he would be more logical
Though I'm more into prog rock and prog metal, Nightwish is one of my fave bands. The reason is pretty obvious :) They are awesome!
One of the best songs of all time. And it is now time for The Greatest Show On Earth!
Now with " the greatest show on earth " the level will go up again !!!!
As it was told to me Tuomas was in a really dark place in his life when they fired Tarja, even the Nightwish Army turned on him, blamed him for getting her fired. they even asked the Government to step in to get her back. This was written as a way of healing himself.
Interesting side note: when the child states that "he has 3 Minutes and counting" the amount of time until Tuomas cuts his head off is 3 minutes.
"That's... A serious state to be in"
Yea, You kinda hit the nail squarely on the head there, ma'dude 🤣👍
You got there nice :-) this song is superb and probably every Nightwish fans fave
Great reaction, loved how you saw it :) It's kind of a Butterfly Effect
👍🇫🇮🤘
Greatest Show on Earth is another masterpiece, well they all are. But I highly recommend this one; And Floor's the original vocalist for that one
Floor has to windmill. She's from the Netherlands and they stop her getting homesick.
😂
Excellent point!
Hooooolly shhhh..... ! By far the best take of Floor''s windmills !
You nailed it . . . . ! Now you have to mesage the band so they know it too :D
The end of what you love, the burden of carrying on becoming too much to bear from all the hate and heartache, then a path out of the darkness to a new beginning.
As someone who has lived with severe depression for decades, I would suggest that what the song is expressing is the sense if hopelessness and inevitability that Tuomas must have been feeling. Not only was he powerless to stop the cataclysm that nearly ripped the band apart, but he was hounded in the media like he was the antiChrist. In that state you tend to take on absolutely everything and your fault and your fault alone.
The pendulum is the ceaseless assaults of his own mind tearing him to sheds, wondering which swing of the pendulum would be the one that finally severed his will and led him to suicide. Remember, depression (real depression, not just sadness) is when the pain of living exceeds the ability to cope; relief can be rare and fleeting. As a creator, writing this song would have been his way of crystallising those feelings in the hope that he could cast them away. So often the feelings that keep us down are the ones that cannot, or will not be expressed. When they are, they can finally start to fade. That's why Marko and Emppu and hovering around Tuomas. The wounds may be in the past, but like an addiction, they never really leave you. You learn to find other ways of being happy, or at least content, despite the memories.
Getting back to writing and having Annette sing for them would have been extremely cathartic, but Floor seems to have healed the whole band in a way that it's hard to imagine anyone could have. She is such a magnificent presence that she brings everything to life in a way that seems almost impossible - she is the ingredient that made Nightwish a gestalt (more than the sum of it's parts). Tuomas is undoubtedly the living genius behind it all, but having it expressed by a Valkyrie made flesh is as close to divinity as expression can be. You only have to look at how happy everyone is to be there. It's not just having fun: it's total, utter, and blissful fulfillment, and you can see it on Floor's face, more than anyone else's, in *every* song.
She has an omega tattooed on her wrist. She is the last singer of Nighwish, the rebirth that made them all whole again. They're all talented up the wazoo, but I think her personality and passion kind of dwarfs them all [insert short Emppu joke here].
This is up there with Bohemian Rhapsody and Stairway to heaven....
Hey you finally got it past copyright! And you didn't have to mess it up at all with audio splices. Congrats!
When are you going to react to "Nightwish - The Greatest Show on Earth (Live)"? Tampere or Wembley idc whichever. Its just awesome ;)
I'm not crying you are crying!
Damn you stopped the video before Floor's sweet "thank you"...
When you see the guitarist (Emppu) talking to Tuomas (the guy on the keyboards) they are not chatting. Emppu is checking if Tuomas is okay. It is a very emotional song for him. Tuomas said in interview that he sometimes asks the sound engineers to shut his ear pieces off during the song so that he cannot hear Floor singing, because it's too hard for him.
yah, he likes to spin that yarn
The end, is the breakup. Then the rollercoaster. And the beginning of an new era...
The song is deep and you can find al kind of layers....
Personally I feel like the song works better, if you don't focus on the death part too much.
The way I see it, it's meant to be a purifying, cathartic moment in the song, where he gives up those self destructive thoughts.
So much of what the man writes is about turning dark into light and finding hope in hopelessness.
Looking at this song that way, I'd say it's a song about falling into depression, feeling crushed, hated and wanting to run away and hide, even thinking about the ultimate escape,
but then overcoming those thoughts with the help of the ones closest to you. That's why it starts with an "end" but ends with a new beginning.
This is what I'm waiting for!
Yes it is a masterpiece.
The poet and the pendulum is my #1 favourite song of Nightwish.
#2 is Ghost love score.
#3 is The greatest show on earth - you really must react to this one. Another masterpiece they have.
👍👍👍
I love your reactions.........you need to do DEVIL AND THE DEEP DARK OCEAN......BUENOS AIRES LIVE.....
Kai (drummer) kills it with the double bass........plus it is a very heavy song.....right in your wheelhouse!!!
thanks, hope you can do that one soon!!!!! Keep it up!!!!
When the kid says only have 3 minutes left. You then hear the blade sharpen. Exactly 3 minutes from the point you hear the blade drop and see him slit his neck.
This song is very personal and powerful. Thomas's heart lays open to us all....he is after all... a poet at heart and soul..
Btw....you were talking about the drummers beat....it's a drum-machine, programmed and used by Jukka first, and then transfered to Kai....but Kia has said, he had to practice ALOT, to get the same sound for the audience, as Jukka has created. Awesome reaction video..you've got a good ear, and knows how to express yourself clearly....KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK! :-)
in song, he is outspoken but in life he always chooses to escape into childhood
Very cool reaction man! Right on the money! Thank you!
It's funny that you mention the base, as I haven't paid attention to it before, because to me the synth is coming through the most.
Thanks you, you do it so right,that you knoe the Background..🤗.Floor is so emotional . she has a Burn Out at her time with her former Band Revamp.
🤘🤘❤️🤘🤘 Oh wow are you in for a ride!!!! This one always gets me!!! It's such a moving piece!!! 😊🤘🤘
It´s not "...hard for the cold war" She says "Whore for the cold world". There is also version with lyrics attached to the video;)
I remember watching that version but lately I haven't been able to find it anywhere
Pretty sure that one got pulled. I know there is a reaction vid that used that particular one
@@KateNadal Found it again :) ruclips.net/video/iEzZRMthhXU/видео.html
@@cdag-fq6uy There, i found it again :) ruclips.net/video/iEzZRMthhXU/видео.html
Always the last part. Always the last part. It haunts.
Epic Masterpiece of talent on a live stage. Time for The Greatest Show On Earth. Fucking Love This Band 🔥💥🍸 🚬😁
The end at the beginning of the song and the beginning at the ending means Death of the old Tuomas and Rebirth of a new Tuomas.
The Part 1: The White Lands of Empathica is a Reference to Stephen King's Dark Tower Books, this part is like an abstract of the song.
The Part 2: Home is Tuomas telling his feelings about the nightwish fans going full rent on him for what happened (Tuomas publish an open letter right after the "End of an era world tour" kicking Tarja off the band). The part of the song "I have but two faces One for the world One for God Save me" in my opinion means that the world sees him like a bad guy but God sees his true feelings, how he suffered doing what he did.
The part 3: The Pacific tells his acceptance of death, the peace he will feel afterlife, Tuomas imagining the moment of his death.
The part 4: Dark Passion Play is Tuomas imagining what would happen after his death, The world will rejoice, No pack to bury the heart of stone (No one caring about is death) and Remains of the dark passion play Performed by his friends without shame Spitting on his grave as they came, in my opinion means the members of the band continuing to play his songs without shame with anger because of him taking his life.
The Part 5: Mother and Father is about his family (real family and the band) conforting him in this time of need and sayng that the backlash will continue, but he needs to find himself again and save the band, that in the end his family will always love him. the beginning means his rebirth.
you mean a nasty letter full of defamatory halftruth
born ready yeah something like that
I don't know if you're familiar with Coheed and Cambria but most of their songs are based on a fictional sci fi universe the singer and songwriter Claudio Sanchez came up with but he puts in a lot of elements and emotions relating to himself and his real life in there too. Your description of Tuomas creating a fictional story based on his real experiences and feelings made the comparison come to mind
I believe "The End" at the beginning was referring to the first era of Nightwish (with Tarja), and "The Beginning" at the end refers to the future of the band.
@Marco T.. that "ponce" was her manager who stood up for her interests and to whom Tuomas referred as that "Argentinian interloper"....yah, he really showed his love by neglecting, ignoring and then defaming her before the world...please get the facts..she had numerous very lucrative offers from other bands but stayed out of loyalty, hoping for Tuomas to change
Thank you from Finland.
Great reaction 😍 Thank you😍
thanx hoopsick react this and many more nightwish song. enjoy always honest react and then analyze music. this song in right moment in life or just mood like down is going to wet eyes for me and many people i think. ok have nice day there., and thanx again.
Sometimes the editor can see that you are just not up to the visual requirements for the recording, and inserts other footage instead. Marco was about to have a vocal solo, so he might have been focused on other things, like warming up his vocals. And also grimacing to stretch out his face muscles. I have no idea, but I assume the editor chose the footage based on the best possible visual outcome from what they had to work with.
Great Reaction. This song is a masterpiece. You need to do Greatest Show on Earth Live in Tampere.
Tuomas is the most beautiful treasure for music.
Great reaction ...and good comments...you got the point well and found plenty of details. Tuomas leaves still much for the listener to explore and make up mind without giving clear exact answers so it makes these even more interesting to think about. He personally felt so quilty cause they let Tarja go and all the fans and media blamed him for it.
YES!!!! Floor, our sorceress supreme :)
Next... Dark Chest of wonders....headbang.....
This piece could be a great segway into listening to some songs with Tarja and get some perspective on just why the media was in such a frenzy when Tuomas decided to fire her from the band.
To say that she has an unique voice is quite the understatement.
I would suggest:
*She is my Sin - live, From Wishes to Eternity*
*The Kinslayer - live, End of an Era*
*Nemo - live, End of an Era*
*Stargazers - Oceanborn* (there aren't any high quality live performances of this one with Tarja on YT. It's basically the most difficult Nightwish song ever written.)
and also such masterpieces as Kuolema tekee taiteilijan, swanheart, dead boy's poem and pharaoh sails to orion, end of all hope, deep silent complete
@@bornready6924 Something from Century Child maybe? Ever Dream, Slaying the Dreamer, ...
@@naphackDT those are certainly great too...Tarja's voice is so devilishly angelic.
Greatest Show On Earth, live at Tampere.
Back to more regular songs now, you like bit heavier so Slaying the Dreamer - Buenos Aires
The End = the end of the Tarja era. The Beginning = the start of a new chapter in Nightwish's existence. So the chronology is correct.
Time for the Greatest Show on Earth.
Marco has allways such a gritty bass tone.
I saw your watery eyes on my TV around the 8 min mark ^_^.
Great reaction Hoopsick. If you want another great song (emotional with superb drumming) try Dead Boys Poem Live with Floor. It gets me like Poet and the P.
Shudder before the Beautiful.. Live at Wembley Arena
Great reaction and ❤Nightwish
Tuomas bares his soul for us in this song
It's not written backwards.
White Lands Of Empathica: is about the End of and Era (Tarja leaving the band) and how he feels it's the end of his dream.
Home: Is about the backlash to the Open letter to Tarja and how he needed to get away from the band and deal with the choice he made.
The Pacific: Is about depression and the longing he was left with.
Dark Passion Play: Is literally the writing of the Album the song is from, and how writing it was his release.
Mother and Father: Is him returning home to those who love him and to the band and new beginnings.
I think that the “open letter,” even though a childish move, saved Tarja’s career. Had Tarja just left Nightwish after whatever album came after “Once,” most of the flack would’ve gone to her for leaving “selfishly”; the band would’ve gotten the sympathies amidst the drama.
The drama created after the “open letter” was huge, and the sympathies for Tarja boosted her solo career. Imagine if Tarja left on her own after the album next to “Once,” I don’t think she’d be as successful as she is now or, at least, she’d have to work harder to reach what she has now, without the PR boost caused by being on the “victimized” side of the drama.
she was victimozed by that nasty letter and could have smeared Tuomas before the world but chose not to...
he, however was full of rage at her and Marcelo for interfering in what he considered his domain.... most of Tarja's fans could not care less about Tuomas and his bunch...they would have followed her regardless...
born ready, I really don’t care if Tarjaholics would’ve followed her regardless of whether she resigned or was fired. My point is simple: If she resigned from the band, she’d only have minority fans like you left to support her solo career, which is why she threatened the band that she’d leave if she didn’t get her way. She had all the reason to leave but she didn’t because her solo career wasn’t secure; she needed the band’s fame, however, she’s also against playing at “smaller venues.” Seriously, she could’ve just left at that point, but a few minority fans like you wouldn’t afford Tarja the “larger venues” she desired, so she stayed a while, even though her change in priorities spawned friction within the group.
The silly Open Letter was her breakthrough. It made her the “victim” of the drama and divided the fanbase. Had it not been for this controversy, Tarja’s solo career wouldn’t have kickstarted as great as it did. She’d only have diehards like you, it would be back to “smaller venues” for her.
I have a feeling that you’ll entirely miss my point, so give it you best shot, man. Miss the point like there’s no tomorrow.
@@OrdinaryCritic judging by the fact that she was deemed, always to be the chief attraction for the fans, its logical to believe that the NW fan base would dwindle down to a very few and that most would follow her...
born ready, judging that she’s in a European band and not in an American band, you would be wrong. European bands are not usually vocalist-oriented, even though fans seem to enjoy a good vocalist. There’s been precedence to this. Bands changing their vocalist retain most of their fanbase or, at least, the fanbase doesn’t all follow the vocalist’s solo career. The majority of the fans usually remain with the band despite the change of a frontman/woman, even if the replacement vocalist isn’t as good. Tarja is no exception; even until now, she didn’t get as big as Nightwish. And, one of the reason she didn’t drown into oblivion like most vocalists who left their bands is because she had a very controversial breakup with the band wherein she came out as the “victim” and the band as the “bad guys.” This divided the fanbase to a that Tarja gained more “devoted” followers other than typical Tarjaholics such as yourself.
As usual, you’re still gonna miss my point because you think I’m antagonizing your queen. Wake up, I’m not. I respect her as an artist; however, I cannot deny the fact that talent alone can fill large venues. Realistically, it requires more PR than it does talent, judging by the mainstream artists.
@@OrdinaryCritic half a fan base ( proud Tarjaholics like myself) was lost immediately after the split (thats a fact)...Tarja put out 10 successful albums that are still selling at a great clip despite getting very little youtube exposure(thats a fact).,..NW released only 4 albums in that time, and no one would even know it without youtube gaving it so much exposure in the last few years (thats a fact)
your presumption that Tarja milked the ugly firing to gain more fans from the non-tarjaholic pool or that without that manipulation, she would fade into history is pure speculation on your part ... Tuomas purposely attempted to defame her in a fit of anger and jealousy and continued to do so at every opportunity for many years to come (thats a fact) i only deal in facts ...
This is a hard song if one, as you did, actually listens to the story. I've listened to it many many times and yet tears still form when Floor hits those notes at the end. If you have the inclination, I highly recommend listening to the DVD itself (no compression) in a quiet room away from the cams, net, and people where you don't need two faces, and can let the emotions of the song hit you honestly as Tuomas presents them.
Woooohoooo can't wait for this one! :)
I would highly suggest Master Passion Greed! It's one of their heaviest and fastest song, with Marco's vocals only and he's killing it!! Unfortunately they don't have a music video or live play, but you should still check it out ;)
You should react to Tarja also previous singer. Check her solo things like Tarja - Supremacy ( Muse Cover ) Woodstock 2016
amen, Tarja and Floor are both so great