This is why DC deaths require footage to appeal in the discord so the mods can verify things. Like if the cause of death was absolutely caused BY the disconnect (disconnecting underwater while at good health then drowning as a result of trying to get back on) then I agree there can be an appeal. If it looked like you were dead regardless of being disconnected (hehe i ran into 5 mobs and then unplugged my modem out of fear), you're staying dead. Also on Pawful's death, it took so long to reconnect cause it's server side, not slow PC. The server is trying to figure out where the hell to put their character after falling through the world
Generally how I view it. I get people want to argue and say "anyone can rip their cord" ect ect but it is VERY obvious when you are in a position that is dangerous and not.
@@nolp2898 Not to mention, unless you have someone physically next to you to unplug the cord for you, it's very obvious if you stop playing for a few seconds to unplug your ethernet. Even if you did, it's still obvious if you're on camera when you look away from the PC right when you're about to die to let them know to unplug it. You'd have to come up with some sort of signal that doesn't look suspicious, but this is already absurd enough (who's going to be on standby to unplug a cable at a moment's notice for hours on end while the other person plays?) so I doubt most people would even bother. Just making a simple rule that dc appeals require characters to have some sort of activity (button presses, precise movement that's not just autorun, etc) right before the disconnect would make it a lot harder for would be abusers to abuse.
@@Apav1x You can probably bind a key on mouse or keyboard to cut your ethernet connection. You dont need to physically remove a wire. Good luck finding out if people did that. Honestly its just better to leave it be that DC cannot be appealable except in extreme cases like last one. People have been able to get to lvl 60. So DC isnt that problematic and by trying to define what is appealable and what not you just open gates for fraud. Warrior dude could use waterbreathing potion or just not fight in water and grind other mobs. Druid one got is extreme case that should be appealable.
If i die to a DC, you can be damn sure i'll go into the addon file and delete my death myself, and continue playing. I do try to record most of my gameplay, but sometimes i simply dont remember to, and i also dont have a terrabyte SSD. My HC run should not be over just because of a dc
Honestly. No. When Blizzard opens up the Hardcore Servers we're not going to be able to appeal things like this anymore so we should be prepared for losing characters. Much like life a freak accident can happen and you can die at any moment. That's life, That's the ball game we're all playing. We don't get do-overs - and trust me, I wouldn't wanna hear it either when/if I die at a high level due to a d/c - but you got to have the mental fortitude to keep going again. When you strike out it doesn't matter if the sun was in your eyes. Only guaranteed level you get in Hardcore is level 1 and the only level that matters is 60.
Facts brother. These guys who are appealing deaths and immediately saying "WELL WHAT ABOUT IF YOU ARE 59 AND DC!!!!" - sucks bro go again - thats hardcore. maybe its not for you
@@rossmiller9740 I mean that's what makes it a challenge. Like I said - it's not something I'll want to hear if it happens to me in the moment but it's got to be said. Specially when the hardcore servers come out. Blizzard isn't going to care that you d/c'd just take your lumps, be a man and go again.
Just to clear up the "slow" PC in both clips. They aren't slow PC's necessarily, I have a new PC, SSD and everything, takes max 2 seconds to load the game. But if you get DCed depending on the reason, it will load slower when you try to log in or outright not let you get back in and get stuck in the loading bar.
I think both of the last 2 clips should be appealable. It's very common to DC while in the water and resurfacing. That last clip was more of a glitch death than a disconnect death.
@@nolp2898 It's a very well known bug. Spacebar+water=DC in classic wow. Instead of 100 appeals there should be some place for HC players to read a list of common issues like this so they can be avoided.
@@opiliones4202 "Official HC" wont have any kind of appeals. Blizzard has been cutting CS costs for 14 years you think they would waste a single second on appeals?
no rogue death was "avoidable" if you are getting attacked in water and press SPACEBAR it has a very high chance to DC you, just swim up or pull everything to the top of the water. dumb thing to know
The rule has already been hashed out regarding DCs. If you character was in serious danger of dying when you disconnected than it stands and if it wasn't than it can be overturned. The point of HC is to test your in game abilities, not your internet connection.
@@v0mdragon The fuq are you talking about? I am talking about the rules as they are currently instated by the HC community. If the official servers treat this differently than so be it.
no cap i'd just never invite a rogue to a group in HC bc lord knows they gonna vanish and let everyone die at the first sight of danger meanwhile if its a warrior they have no choice but to try to fight which is only gonna help your chance of survival
I mean, of course he thinks that right? No other quest in the game as far as i know just pvp flags you so he thought the hunter fucked with him. He just didnt know.
Tbh the hunter was the same level so I don’t even see it as a grief - just an opportunist hunter who flagged himself too. If it was a lvl60 I’d say grief but this is just basic wow mechanics. Deffo won’t get appeal approved.
Those long loading screens are not entirely caused by the PC. Back in legion blizz changed how loading worked. Which resulted in people going from having decent loading screen to having loading screens that took a long time, and some even all the way up to 5 min. Cause of this you had 2 choices to shorten them. Either you bought a SSD and put the game on it. Or you used the ' SET worldPreloadNonCritical "0" ' command ingame, which would shorten the time on loading screen but at the cost of certain textures/models not being loaded in and in some cases even lock the camera in place (was still possible to move around using minmap until all camera stuff was loaded). I never understood why blizz even made this change. It just ended up annoying people alot and forcing people to buy SSD's (they were not cheap at the time of the change).
I remember doing that quest way back in wrath, however, it was a PvP server, so this "flagged" aspect didn't matter, and I wouldn't have known about it anyway. Back to the story, some Tauren Hunter tried ganking me, well, I don't actually remember if I died or not, I probably did. Back again to the story, I just remember hiding half underwater targeting the Hunter. Jaina Proudmore comes out there for some reason and I don't think he body pulled her, I think he attacked her on purpose and she 3 shotted him in like 2 seconds, lol.
@@hotlikesauce Not at all, I play HC full time but appeals are dumb af and completely ruin the spirit of hardcore. You are smoking crack if you think blizzards hc realms will have appeals.
@@brandoxic8354 Not at all, I play HC full time but appeals are dumb af and completely ruin the spirit of hardcore. You are smoking crack if you think blizzards hc realms will have appeals.
I played hardcore before it had a name. From 2008 to 2021 I played WoW, and I always deleted and started over upon death. I can't play any other way. I've tried to play after a death, but I just couldn't bring myself to continue. It didn't feel right, and I would lose interest in the character. In all that time, I managed to get to max level twice. DC deaths were just an occupational hazard. During WotLK, I had a 78 level character die while in Howling Fjord killing wolves for LW leveling due to a disconnect. I contacted a GM to see if they could erase the death on my stats, but he didn't get it. He was like, "What's the big deal? Just rez and keep on going." He thought I was strange. And don't get me started on the UC elevators. I once lost a 57 level on one of those. Talk about rage quitting. I didn't play for over a month after that.
In the past week or so blizz NA servers have had micro disconnect issues that you need to restart your pc to fix. There was a large amount of deaths because of it.
I can't think of a single game that has a HC mode that has death appeals, I don't mind the ability to appeal, but it's not something I would require if we ever get official servers.
@@DepressoDevo Yeah, it's going to suck, just as it has sucked the times I've done that exact same thing in PoE. It's just something you'll have to live with if you decide to go HC, it just is.
@@DepressoDevo Thats the entire point of the game mode - if you die, you're done. Appealing is not hardcore, everyone always gives a DC example but that is so rare. People just fucking suck and die and try to appeal it and fake DC's.
DC deaths should be appealable because most of the time its Blizzard server fault. However I think you have to look at it case by case, needs to be recorded and if someone has died to DC like 5 times, its probably their own internet or doing it on purpose and they should consider taking the L. Official hardcore servers will probably not have that option but hopefully there won't be so many DCs.
Idk if blizzard just uses shittier cloud servers for classic compared to Wotlk....or if it's the HC addon itself. But I find myself DC'in pretty often when playing my HC character. But never have the issue when playing wotlk
The on going issues on NA with DCs have resulted in myself quit playing the game. Nothing is more frustrating that being on the flight path to somewhere, DC, log in while you're not recording, fall to your death. happened on my 2nd enh shaman. in fact, all my deaths have come from DC on any person beyond lv 20. It is so frustrating that Blizzard has such terrible servers that the leak of HC in the next SM2, I cannot say i will play as the servers at Blizzard are easily DDOS and they do not have a system in play to do simple things like while in flight you have a slow fall buff all the time for 30 seconds, or when you lose connection, the character to 100% remove aggro from the mob and disappear temporaily into a void that prevents death, even from drowning until you load back in and it goes back to the HP you were at when you D/C when you log on. I do not understand why it is so hard to have a character disappear from your game when you lose connection to it.
Cause then, hardcore or not, alt f4 or unplugging your modem turns the game into easy mode, ill be safe no matter what. That mob just ran in fear and pulled 3 more? Alt f4, I backed up to far and pulled another pack of trash, alt f4, im about to drown unplug modem.. like how could the game differentiate a legit dc to someone abusing the system? The persistence in the world was put there for that reason.
I’ve attempted to level 2 hard core characters, first was an orc warrior. I leveled it to 28 and a L60 undead rogue kited south shore guards to me and griefed me. The addon insta appealed me but I didn’t care. I deleted the toon BECAUSE I DIED. My second hardcore character is a human warrior that’s still alive and is currently level 36. Appeals are for the weak. Your character is mortal. Official hardcore servers will not have appeals. Learn to play now regardless of internet connections and griefs.
@@LawnSprinkler one of the biggest griefs is players making low level toons and taking them to stand on flight masters while flagged in stealth, or making low level toons to un stealth at low level NPC quest spawn points to auto flag people. Those kind of griefs happen all the time and can be done with anywhere from a level 1 to a level 15. Any griefer can do that on a HC server with almost no effort. They won’t go away.
Imo if you do a HC dungeon with a rogue or hunter you are being foolish. They will abandon you to die far before all hope is lost. I want people who are all in and, going to stand their ground. Not pretend to be dead the second shit goes wrong.
I honestly can't think of a valid reason for any appeals to ever be accepted. If you get "griefed", you weren't paying attention and being careful enough. If you fall victim to a bug, you should know better. If you D/C, that's too bad. There's no way that can be a legit excuse. It's abusable.
How I see DC death is that if the DC is the actual cause and you can prove that you D/C before dying then it should be appealed. The fact that he D/C 2x before drowning would be enough for me to say "yeah, that was on the game" but if he died just because of the ping that would count because you should know that classic/game does that. If he only D/C once then maybe I would say it does count and he is dead for reals. Again it's a case by case thing and why HC WOW should never be official because blizzard can barely handle normal tickets. No way are they going to be able to look into millions of appeals.
Taking the L should always be the first response for no other reason than personal satisfaction: You want to know when you're playing Hardcore/Ironman that your character doesn't have a permanent blemish in the form of a "technical" death, and losing characters is part of the game mode. THAT BEING SAID, DC and bug related deaths should absolutely be appealable, especially on characters with a lot of time put into them. Adults with jobs value the time they invest in hardcore characters, and when the death was because of something completely out of their control, it feels like a spit in the face to be told to "just go again". No, the game should "just work" and you shouldn't have to lose hundreds of hours of progress because the game decided to have a hissy fit.
If I die from a D/C I delete my character no matter what. I can't be bothered to go through the appeal process, and personally, my character feels tainted after I die, no matter how it happens. I died on the UC elevator from a D/C on my first run, Lol.
I get why people want many things appealable, esp the grief aspect. I like the challenge more if it’s a “you die any way, you die”. Shoutout to the true hardcore characters w/ 0 deaths.
That swifty clip hits different considering i just lost a lvl 23 hunter to those same guards, while i was running down to Rachet, looked away for like 10 secs with cheetah on.
In the event of a server crash private hardcore servers usually just role back a few minutes to before the crash happened , if you DC on your end then that’s on you
What’s the point of HC if you can’t appeal a death from disconnecting? Is HC an ingame challenge? Or is it a challenge where you’re up against your ISP and God himself? Appeals for DC are the main reason why HC servers will never happen in any form similar to playing with the addon. Blizz will not be paying anyone to look at appeals.
1:36 LOL! I have played Horde since day one for many years. On my first hardcore toon I actually intentionally ran right in XR forgetting I was Alliance. But, I survived. I have the clip somewhere.
Lmao, so in the last two clips, first Guzu explains that DC/bug should not be appealed. And in the last clip - concerning his friend who died to DC/bug - then suddenly it should be appealed. Imo both should be appealed. The guy in the water got DC because of this shitty buggy water. But I don't like when someone has opposite way of thinking depending on the context. Double standards..
Dc’s should be appealable, at some point rules only go so far and we have to respect the honor system, that player will know in his heart and mind if that character is legit. That has to be on there conscious. A Dc is completely out of the players control (granted that player didn’t force the Dc) and to say that because of that you lose everything is in my opinion is out side the spirit and point of hc. Game mechanics are one thing, spawns and server issues happen but a straight disconnect… what can you do, there’s nothing you can physically do to prevent that other then having the fastest pc you can and logging on asap to get back to the action. I think I’ve made my point, in my opinion I would never look down at someone who appealed a Dc on there toon. I’ve never had to do it myself but still if I had to I would still believe that character is legit
DC and deaths by griefers should be appealed, but only really bad DC deaths, unlike the Payo clip yesterday where he gave up and did not even try, knowing he would get an appeal.
guzu you're wrong. If the only thing you died to was drowning - because of a DC - your character is still logged in to the game (whilest not in combat) Then the death should be 100% appealable. Who would D/C themselves in water on purpose? Just makes no sense. If you DC'd while your breath level was above 30 seconds it should be appealable. Plus the mods in this community show favoritism towards whoever they want and the rest of us just get screwed. So if you're a streamer like xarhyu who right clicked a played instead of left click interacting you can just say "grief! grief!" and get appealed, but drowning in water because you D/c'd isn't.
Maybe it's different on EU, but on NA we've had days where it's non-stop disconnects and the issue is on Blizzard's end. That Rogue easily lives there without the d/c, they escaped the mob and died because they were 1s too slow. For me that should definitely be appealable. If they release an official Hardcore server and it's getting as many d/c's as currently with no kind of protection it will not be a fun time. A compromise could be that d/c is changed so that it automatically refills your breath meter.
I get DCd all the time WHILE killing mobs. Haven't died yet but it should absolutely be appealable. There's so many DDOS attacks happening on top of it.
Absolutely NO death should be appealable. If you DIE then you are DEAD. That is what makes it HARDCORE. Allowing appeals just make people try to find a way out of DEATH. You can’t come back from the dead. You’re DEAD. If you appeal successfully, you will always know in the back of your mind, you died. You’re not a real hardcore player anymore.
I think DC deaths should not be appealable at least when official HC servers come out as it would be too easy to have a lag switch you flip when you know you are in a bad situation like that druid, DC and die, then come back and say oh it was the DCs fault. IF, the whole server goes down or has issues they should have a buff that goes out and protects you from death and lets you revive but only if it is a server wide issue. If it is your internet provider then tough luck that's how all HC games are.
I think DC deaths should be appealable when video evidence is present and it's obvious that if the DC hadn't happened the character would've (likely) survived. So a DC when you're in a bad spot already, should only be appealable in an edge case like that last clip, where multiple game bugs stacked to screw over the player. I don't think pawful would've survived even without a DC, but they could've, so I think it should be appealable, especially because it's obvious that the bugs were not caused on purpose. DCs without video evidence are and should always remain un-appealable.
Swifty has always been bad.. One of the greatest disappointments of my Classic "carrer" was grouping up with Swifty and realizing that... Also no, deaths shouldn't be appealed.
The DC has to be in a situation where it is likely that you would have lived. So pulling 4 elite mobs and going to 20% health --> DC would not be appealable.
Alot of underwater deaths can be avoided by doing the Threshwackonator quest. Those 5 30min underwater breathing pots are enough to get you through nearly all the areas where you spend alot of time underwater to quest.
@@TheBronf nah just doing the quest he’s referring to and getting the underwater breathing pots is way easier than sitting and waiting for a warlock to come around and hope they buff you with under water breathing every single time you have an under water quest
there will be ZERO appeals on the official hardcore servers blizzard doesnt have the staff and if they hold streamers hands and do it for them only people get get pissed and not play. all i cant is classic fresh start not hardcore.
D/C deaths should absolutely be appealed - also sometimes log in screen is slow after a D/C. My PC is blazing fast but ill hang up when trying to reload of a bad disconnect
the long loggin are windows doing this - happened to me with 8 gb videocard and 16 gb ram . or blizzard doing some anticheat check and then the antivirus reacting to the blizzard check
He fell through the world which auto DC's you, as he kept falling and thus kept moving it meant the server could not sync his position correctly resulting him in being unable to log in. (flight paths are hard coded movements so it can still lock onto those). After he then landed and died within a "non terrain" or "under the world", the server moved his corpse to the nearest anchor teleport point which was just outside the horde AB cave. He died not because of a DC, but because of an obvious bug, which to me, is just extremely unlucky, but still a bug which would be really dangerous to grant appeals on. Once you set a president that "bugs" can be appealed, the poor dudes who review the appeals are gonna get swarmed with appeal requests.
Disconnects, glitches, bugs etc. The game of vanilla was never made to be played HC. If the rules of HC as they are, wont take this into account into the rules, then HC is just a fly atm. Most ppl will probably play on different HC servers with different rules and all the chars under the current HC set will be forgotten.
Maybe then we will have real hc instead of these "dieing for views". Most of these hc pro streamers die to stuff not even a new wow player would die too.
The HC addon makes me DC twice in a row everytime I login the same as the guy in the water clip. After the 2 dcs I dont DC for as long as I play. It isn't an internet issue it is the addon this should be appealable
HC - put with 100000 conditions. Should be death = death, pvp, d/c whatever. It doesn't matter if you trade or group the higher you get the more you have to lose. Imagine getting to like ICC HC and raiding, then losing all of that? That is the true rush. Not this ironmade restriction bullshit where you die but have gear so shit who cares. Watching a bunch of 15-40s die, they lost some time and that's it.
don't play a healer if you don't know how to heal - eg. target healing... if you target a player to heal them then you don't know what you're doing and you shouldn't be healing any HC dungeons.
Well, I'm playing a DPS, but I still got invited to heal a dungeon. I targeted people to heal them. I kind of find it annoying that people even _can_ cast targeted spells without targeting. Anyways, I am sorry I didn't measure up to your standards, but luckily you don't have to invite me to your groups if you don't want to.
Appealing death is bs, what's what's point in doing a hc run if you can appeal some deaths but not others, especially the deaths to pvp griefers I meen that should just be expected, xaryu has died like 4 times now to different things on his char and everyone got approved. Imo pvp combat and pulling big mobs to kill others is all part of the game and somthing you should have to deal with. Now if I was going to say its OK to appeal certain instances then unintentionally disconnecting is most definatly the only instance I'd give any leeway if there was evidence that was the cause, but dying to a high level mob pulled to a certain area na you should count that as a legit death
This is why DC deaths require footage to appeal in the discord so the mods can verify things. Like if the cause of death was absolutely caused BY the disconnect (disconnecting underwater while at good health then drowning as a result of trying to get back on) then I agree there can be an appeal. If it looked like you were dead regardless of being disconnected (hehe i ran into 5 mobs and then unplugged my modem out of fear), you're staying dead.
Also on Pawful's death, it took so long to reconnect cause it's server side, not slow PC. The server is trying to figure out where the hell to put their character after falling through the world
Generally how I view it.
I get people want to argue and say "anyone can rip their cord" ect ect but it is VERY obvious when you are in a position that is dangerous and not.
@@nolp2898 Not to mention, unless you have someone physically next to you to unplug the cord for you, it's very obvious if you stop playing for a few seconds to unplug your ethernet. Even if you did, it's still obvious if you're on camera when you look away from the PC right when you're about to die to let them know to unplug it. You'd have to come up with some sort of signal that doesn't look suspicious, but this is already absurd enough (who's going to be on standby to unplug a cable at a moment's notice for hours on end while the other person plays?) so I doubt most people would even bother.
Just making a simple rule that dc appeals require characters to have some sort of activity (button presses, precise movement that's not just autorun, etc) right before the disconnect would make it a lot harder for would be abusers to abuse.
great, everybody with junk ISP can stay on era, offical can be death=delete, as it should be!
@@Apav1x You can probably bind a key on mouse or keyboard to cut your ethernet connection. You dont need to physically remove a wire. Good luck finding out if people did that. Honestly its just better to leave it be that DC cannot be appealable except in extreme cases like last one. People have been able to get to lvl 60. So DC isnt that problematic and by trying to define what is appealable and what not you just open gates for fraud.
Warrior dude could use waterbreathing potion or just not fight in water and grind other mobs. Druid one got is extreme case that should be appealable.
If i die to a DC, you can be damn sure i'll go into the addon file and delete my death myself, and continue playing. I do try to record most of my gameplay, but sometimes i simply dont remember to, and i also dont have a terrabyte SSD. My HC run should not be over just because of a dc
Honestly. No. When Blizzard opens up the Hardcore Servers we're not going to be able to appeal things like this anymore so we should be prepared for losing characters. Much like life a freak accident can happen and you can die at any moment. That's life, That's the ball game we're all playing. We don't get do-overs - and trust me, I wouldn't wanna hear it either when/if I die at a high level due to a d/c - but you got to have the mental fortitude to keep going again. When you strike out it doesn't matter if the sun was in your eyes.
Only guaranteed level you get in Hardcore is level 1 and the only level that matters is 60.
Facts brother. These guys who are appealing deaths and immediately saying "WELL WHAT ABOUT IF YOU ARE 59 AND DC!!!!" - sucks bro go again - thats hardcore. maybe its not for you
@@rossmiller9740 I mean that's what makes it a challenge. Like I said - it's not something I'll want to hear if it happens to me in the moment but it's got to be said. Specially when the hardcore servers come out. Blizzard isn't going to care that you d/c'd just take your lumps, be a man and go again.
@@NotTheWheel dumb take
@@rossmiller9740 dumb take
@@user-fg3fv9hl3b found the
Appealer
Just to clear up the "slow" PC in both clips. They aren't slow PC's necessarily, I have a new PC, SSD and everything, takes max 2 seconds to load the game. But if you get DCed depending on the reason, it will load slower when you try to log in or outright not let you get back in and get stuck in the loading bar.
Accurate.
I think both of the last 2 clips should be appealable. It's very common to DC while in the water and resurfacing. That last clip was more of a glitch death than a disconnect death.
The water death is rough but I mean if you just use a waterbreathing pot it never happens
@@nolp2898 It's a very well known bug. Spacebar+water=DC in classic wow. Instead of 100 appeals there should be some place for HC players to read a list of common issues like this so they can be avoided.
@@kbsskb788 i instinctually do this every time I touch water. never disconnected from it. guess we'll see how official hc servers handle it.
@@opiliones4202 "Official HC" wont have any kind of appeals.
Blizzard has been cutting CS costs for 14 years you think they would waste a single second on appeals?
no rogue death was "avoidable" if you are getting attacked in water and press SPACEBAR it has a very high chance to DC you, just swim up or pull everything to the top of the water. dumb thing to know
The rule has already been hashed out regarding DCs. If you character was in serious danger of dying when you disconnected than it stands and if it wasn't than it can be overturned. The point of HC is to test your in game abilities, not your internet connection.
@@v0mdragon The fuq are you talking about? I am talking about the rules as they are currently instated by the HC community. If the official servers treat this differently than so be it.
Hc players going soft already. Hc is unfair like life is.
@@heatrayzvideo3007 This is such a dumb take. Dying only because of a DC or a bug in the game has nothing to do with the skill of the player.
@@heatrayzvideo3007 says the man who doesnt play btw.
Your game abilities will be heavily dependent on internet connection so your argument is moot
no cap i'd just never invite a rogue to a group in HC bc lord knows they gonna vanish and let everyone die at the first sight of danger meanwhile if its a warrior they have no choice but to try to fight which is only gonna help your chance of survival
*dies from intentional pvp flagged* “I WAS GREIFED!!!!!”
I mean, of course he thinks that right? No other quest in the game as far as i know just pvp flags you so he thought the hunter fucked with him.
He just didnt know.
@@Fibah that quest is pretty notorious in hc. Everyone knows it flags you, hell the hardcore addon even warns you
@@Fibah there is an undead quest in the starting area that PvP flags you too.
Tbh the hunter was the same level so I don’t even see it as a grief - just an opportunist hunter who flagged himself too. If it was a lvl60 I’d say grief but this is just basic wow mechanics.
Deffo won’t get appeal approved.
@@cg7265not everyone has hardcore addon or knows these things
Those long loading screens are not entirely caused by the PC. Back in legion blizz changed how loading worked. Which resulted in people going from having decent loading screen to having loading screens that took a long time, and some even all the way up to 5 min.
Cause of this you had 2 choices to shorten them. Either you bought a SSD and put the game on it. Or you used the ' SET worldPreloadNonCritical "0" ' command ingame, which would shorten the time on loading screen but at the cost of certain textures/models not being loaded in and in some cases even lock the camera in place (was still possible to move around using minmap until all camera stuff was loaded).
I never understood why blizz even made this change. It just ended up annoying people alot and forcing people to buy SSD's (they were not cheap at the time of the change).
Ok and nowadays tho itd be zero excuse. If you play literally any game on HDD much less hardcore. You deserve it.
@@Odyssey636🙄
3:15 there's always a higher level troll hunter ready to gank you. Always.
I remember doing that quest way back in wrath, however, it was a PvP server, so this "flagged" aspect didn't matter, and I wouldn't have known about it anyway.
Back to the story, some Tauren Hunter tried ganking me, well, I don't actually remember if I died or not, I probably did.
Back again to the story, I just remember hiding half underwater targeting the Hunter. Jaina Proudmore comes out there for some reason and I don't think he body pulled her, I think he attacked her on purpose and she 3 shotted him in like 2 seconds, lol.
DC deaths should be appealable because death by DC isn't an intended part of the game and can't be outplayed or prevented.
Thats the risk you take with a 1 life character. Appeals should be removed all together
@@bucky7162 bro just say ur a hunter griefing lowbies by kiting high lvl shit lmao 😂
@@bucky7162 Sounds like something someone who's whole personality is griefing would say tbh.
@@hotlikesauce Not at all, I play HC full time but appeals are dumb af and completely ruin the spirit of hardcore. You are smoking crack if you think blizzards hc realms will have appeals.
@@brandoxic8354 Not at all, I play HC full time but appeals are dumb af and completely ruin the spirit of hardcore. You are smoking crack if you think blizzards hc realms will have appeals.
I played hardcore before it had a name. From 2008 to 2021 I played WoW, and I always deleted and started over upon death. I can't play any other way. I've tried to play after a death, but I just couldn't bring myself to continue. It didn't feel right, and I would lose interest in the character. In all that time, I managed to get to max level twice. DC deaths were just an occupational hazard.
During WotLK, I had a 78 level character die while in Howling Fjord killing wolves for LW leveling due to a disconnect. I contacted a GM to see if they could erase the death on my stats, but he didn't get it. He was like, "What's the big deal? Just rez and keep on going." He thought I was strange. And don't get me started on the UC elevators. I once lost a 57 level on one of those. Talk about rage quitting. I didn't play for over a month after that.
lmao ppl in 2k23, flags for pvp, gets killed "i got griefed"
Hardcore is hardcore. Death is final. No other hardcore game allows for appeal. You die, you die.
In the past week or so blizz NA servers have had micro disconnect issues that you need to restart your pc to fix. There was a large amount of deaths because of it.
Literal ddos attacks.
that tauren warrior coudve just jumped on the roof xD
The long load screens after a DC do not mean a slow pc, its just game is confuzed
I can't think of a single game that has a HC mode that has death appeals, I don't mind the ability to appeal, but it's not something I would require if we ever get official servers.
say that now till you are level 57 and disconnect as soon as you engage in a fight and die
@@DepressoDevo Yeah, it's going to suck, just as it has sucked the times I've done that exact same thing in PoE. It's just something you'll have to live with if you decide to go HC, it just is.
@@DepressoDevo Thats the entire point of the game mode - if you die, you're done. Appealing is not hardcore, everyone always gives a DC example but that is so rare. People just fucking suck and die and try to appeal it and fake DC's.
@@rossmiller9740 Im sure you wouldnt appeal a level 50 who dies to dc, just built different.
Tell me you haven't leveled beyond 10 without telling me you haven't leveled beyond 10.
DC deaths should be appealable because most of the time its Blizzard server fault. However I think you have to look at it case by case, needs to be recorded and if someone has died to DC like 5 times, its probably their own internet or doing it on purpose and they should consider taking the L.
Official hardcore servers will probably not have that option but hopefully there won't be so many DCs.
there's a space for DC deaths, era servers!
Idk if blizzard just uses shittier cloud servers for classic compared to Wotlk....or if it's the HC addon itself. But I find myself DC'in pretty often when playing my HC character. But never have the issue when playing wotlk
The on going issues on NA with DCs have resulted in myself quit playing the game. Nothing is more frustrating that being on the flight path to somewhere, DC, log in while you're not recording, fall to your death. happened on my 2nd enh shaman. in fact, all my deaths have come from DC on any person beyond lv 20. It is so frustrating that Blizzard has such terrible servers that the leak of HC in the next SM2, I cannot say i will play as the servers at Blizzard are easily DDOS and they do not have a system in play to do simple things like while in flight you have a slow fall buff all the time for 30 seconds, or when you lose connection, the character to 100% remove aggro from the mob and disappear temporaily into a void that prevents death, even from drowning until you load back in and it goes back to the HP you were at when you D/C when you log on. I do not understand why it is so hard to have a character disappear from your game when you lose connection to it.
Cause then, hardcore or not, alt f4 or unplugging your modem turns the game into easy mode, ill be safe no matter what. That mob just ran in fear and pulled 3 more? Alt f4, I backed up to far and pulled another pack of trash, alt f4, im about to drown unplug modem.. like how could the game differentiate a legit dc to someone abusing the system? The persistence in the world was put there for that reason.
If you die in diablo hc you die from a dc
Yeah u should appeal disconnects especially a double disconnect under water and this edge case of unplugging your modem when in trouble is irrelevant
I’ve attempted to level 2 hard core characters, first was an orc warrior. I leveled it to 28 and a L60 undead rogue kited south shore guards to me and griefed me. The addon insta appealed me but I didn’t care. I deleted the toon BECAUSE I DIED. My second hardcore character is a human warrior that’s still alive and is currently level 36. Appeals are for the weak. Your character is mortal. Official hardcore servers will not have appeals. Learn to play now regardless of internet connections and griefs.
Yea, but griefs would happen less when the person griefing you is also a hardcore character.
@@LawnSprinkler one of the biggest griefs is players making low level toons and taking them to stand on flight masters while flagged in stealth, or making low level toons to un stealth at low level NPC quest spawn points to auto flag people. Those kind of griefs happen all the time and can be done with anywhere from a level 1 to a level 15. Any griefer can do that on a HC server with almost no effort. They won’t go away.
Juvenile opinion
Imo if you do a HC dungeon with a rogue or hunter you are being foolish. They will abandon you to die far before all hope is lost. I want people who are all in and, going to stand their ground. Not pretend to be dead the second shit goes wrong.
Especially since alot of hunters let their pets run wild in dungeons, usually causing the initiation of a wipe.
I honestly can't think of a valid reason for any appeals to ever be accepted. If you get "griefed", you weren't paying attention and being careful enough. If you fall victim to a bug, you should know better. If you D/C, that's too bad. There's no way that can be a legit excuse. It's abusable.
How I see DC death is that if the DC is the actual cause and you can prove that you D/C before dying then it should be appealed. The fact that he D/C 2x before drowning would be enough for me to say "yeah, that was on the game" but if he died just because of the ping that would count because you should know that classic/game does that. If he only D/C once then maybe I would say it does count and he is dead for reals. Again it's a case by case thing and why HC WOW should never be official because blizzard can barely handle normal tickets. No way are they going to be able to look into millions of appeals.
Taking the L should always be the first response for no other reason than personal satisfaction: You want to know when you're playing Hardcore/Ironman that your character doesn't have a permanent blemish in the form of a "technical" death, and losing characters is part of the game mode. THAT BEING SAID, DC and bug related deaths should absolutely be appealable, especially on characters with a lot of time put into them. Adults with jobs value the time they invest in hardcore characters, and when the death was because of something completely out of their control, it feels like a spit in the face to be told to "just go again". No, the game should "just work" and you shouldn't have to lose hundreds of hours of progress because the game decided to have a hissy fit.
If I die from a D/C I delete my character no matter what. I can't be bothered to go through the appeal process, and personally, my character feels tainted after I die, no matter how it happens. I died on the UC elevator from a D/C on my first run, Lol.
@@WhoFlungDung what hc rules say? Can you appeal death if it was the result of disconnect?
Yeah, sorry but appealing after you literally die and saying you're a hardcore still is just wild. No other hardcore game mode does that.
@@rossmiller9740 Like I said, taking the L should always be the first response in 99.999% of cases.
I get why people want many things appealable, esp the grief aspect. I like the challenge more if it’s a “you die any way, you die”.
Shoutout to the true hardcore characters w/ 0 deaths.
A DC shouldn't be able to be appealed, if that is the case you can just plug pull when you know you bit off more than you can chew.
True but if mass dc happens cuz of server?
The quest that flags you pvp, and then getting killed by a passing horde player should never be appealable. that's not griefing
That swifty clip hits different considering i just lost a lvl 23 hunter to those same guards, while i was running down to Rachet, looked away for like 10 secs with cheetah on.
not allowing appeals is ridiculous. they should require video evidence, and be subject to a board of approaval. simple
Lmaooo that dude dying on the missing diplomat and trying to claim “grief”
In the event of a server crash private hardcore servers usually just role back a few minutes to before the crash happened , if you DC on your end then that’s on you
I believe it wasn't a potato PC summoning the loading screen boss, I believe it was the server trying to figure out "whe'r the hell he at...".
It’s so funny people talk about the legitimacy of the appeal. No other HC game allows you to appeal ever. If you die, you die.
You should be able to appeal, but anything slightly suspecious shouldn't be accepting. That being dc'ing in sketchy situations.
11:56 He lost 5 seconds here. He would have lived if he was on his toes.
A DC is just a reaction time minigame. You sleep you weep.
What’s the point of HC if you can’t appeal a death from disconnecting? Is HC an ingame challenge? Or is it a challenge where you’re up against your ISP and God himself?
Appeals for DC are the main reason why HC servers will never happen in any form similar to playing with the addon. Blizz will not be paying anyone to look at appeals.
1:36 LOL! I have played Horde since day one for many years. On my first hardcore toon I actually intentionally ran right in XR forgetting I was Alliance. But, I survived. I have the clip somewhere.
I think the rules they've already established around DCs seem pretty fair.
14:40 You just got my respect, for being willingly not appealing.
Dont get me wrong....id love if Blizz released HC servers..... but all these crybabys aint gonna be able to appeal shit when dying.
That man gasped like he was actually drowning. 😂😂😂😂
Lmao, so in the last two clips, first Guzu explains that DC/bug should not be appealed. And in the last clip - concerning his friend who died to DC/bug - then suddenly it should be appealed.
Imo both should be appealed. The guy in the water got DC because of this shitty buggy water. But I don't like when someone has opposite way of thinking depending on the context. Double standards..
Die Ladezeit ist bei solchen Bugs/DCs immer sehr hoch. Egal wie stark die Rechenleistung des Rechners ist...
Dc’s should be appealable, at some point rules only go so far and we have to respect the honor system, that player will know in his heart and mind if that character is legit. That has to be on there conscious. A Dc is completely out of the players control (granted that player didn’t force the Dc) and to say that because of that you lose everything is in my opinion is out side the spirit and point of hc. Game mechanics are one thing, spawns and server issues happen but a straight disconnect… what can you do, there’s nothing you can physically do to prevent that other then having the fastest pc you can and logging on asap to get back to the action. I think I’ve made my point, in my opinion I would never look down at someone who appealed a Dc on there toon. I’ve never had to do it myself but still if I had to I would still believe that character is legit
How some of these players even get to those levels on HC is mind boggling
DC and deaths by griefers should be appealed, but only really bad DC deaths, unlike the Payo clip yesterday where he gave up and did not even try, knowing he would get an appeal.
guzu you're wrong. If the only thing you died to was drowning - because of a DC - your character is still logged in to the game (whilest not in combat) Then the death should be 100% appealable. Who would D/C themselves in water on purpose? Just makes no sense. If you DC'd while your breath level was above 30 seconds it should be appealable. Plus the mods in this community show favoritism towards whoever they want and the rest of us just get screwed. So if you're a streamer like xarhyu who right clicked a played instead of left click interacting you can just say "grief! grief!" and get appealed, but drowning in water because you D/c'd isn't.
this irrelevant but the music at 2:23 is "Spooks Of Halloween Town" from Kingdom Hearts 1
Problem is, if dying to a dc in diablo happens, you are out of luck. its a risk you take in the game.
Maybe it's different on EU, but on NA we've had days where it's non-stop disconnects and the issue is on Blizzard's end. That Rogue easily lives there without the d/c, they escaped the mob and died because they were 1s too slow. For me that should definitely be appealable. If they release an official Hardcore server and it's getting as many d/c's as currently with no kind of protection it will not be a fun time.
A compromise could be that d/c is changed so that it automatically refills your breath meter.
there should be no appeals such as in Diablo. This is probably the reason why we are not having blizzard hardcore servers yet.
I get DCd all the time WHILE killing mobs. Haven't died yet but it should absolutely be appealable. There's so many DDOS attacks happening on top of it.
people with superiority complexes will tell you otherwise
Anyone who is against appealing has never gotten past level 30.
Get used to no appeals.
Once we get offcial HC servers, there will be no appeal system for anything.
What UI is the hunter in the first clip using? Looks like classic but then has common abilities and enemy health bar/effect as well
The amount of people going “Quit having fun!” Over hardcore is lmao
People appealing deaths and pretending to be hardcore isnt hardcore.
so if one guy scams the system and disconnects on purpose you should vilify everyone who doesn't have a crisp and pristine internet connection?
Absolutely NO death should be appealable.
If you DIE then you are DEAD.
That is what makes it HARDCORE.
Allowing appeals just make people try to find a way out of DEATH.
You can’t come back from the dead. You’re DEAD.
If you appeal successfully, you will always know in the back of your mind, you died. You’re not a real hardcore player anymore.
DC deaths is a part of the vanilla gameplay.
Even if you fall tru the world and die, you still died and have to start over.
this is why you aren't in charge of the HC community lol
@@chocobojoe6906 if you die, you die.
@@chocobojoe6906 ur wrong noob. If you die, it's your own fault.
I think DC deaths should not be appealable at least when official HC servers come out as it would be too easy to have a lag switch you flip when you know you are in a bad situation like that druid, DC and die, then come back and say oh it was the DCs fault. IF, the whole server goes down or has issues they should have a buff that goes out and protects you from death and lets you revive but only if it is a server wide issue. If it is your internet provider then tough luck that's how all HC games are.
if u are going to die anyway DC deaths are not appealable (atleast that is what I thought)
That hunter priest duo would of killed that so easily if the priest just MC’d one of the elites until it got killed by the others
Guzu never grew up with an unstable connection lol, "ITS AN ONLINE GAME"
I think DC deaths should be appealable when video evidence is present and it's obvious that if the DC hadn't happened the character would've (likely) survived. So a DC when you're in a bad spot already, should only be appealable in an edge case like that last clip, where multiple game bugs stacked to screw over the player. I don't think pawful would've survived even without a DC, but they could've, so I think it should be appealable, especially because it's obvious that the bugs were not caused on purpose.
DCs without video evidence are and should always remain un-appealable.
If you can't appeal deaths that you can't prepare for or anticipate at all then there's no point playing.
Way WAY too many DC's and layer spawn occurrences for it all to be just merely coincidental... 😕
you're a dent if you think the DC deaths shown SHOULDN'T be appealed, like what?
I am a no appeal extremist. No appeal under any circumstances.
Swifty has always been bad.. One of the greatest disappointments of my Classic "carrer" was grouping up with Swifty and realizing that... Also no, deaths shouldn't be appealed.
The DC has to be in a situation where it is likely that you would have lived. So pulling 4 elite mobs and going to 20% health --> DC would not be appealable.
Alot of underwater deaths can be avoided by doing the Threshwackonator quest. Those 5 30min underwater breathing pots are enough to get you through nearly all the areas where you spend alot of time underwater to quest.
or just w8 till a warlock comes around and hopefully he does a friendly buff on you if he is feeling generous without you asking.
@@TheBronf nah just doing the quest he’s referring to and getting the underwater breathing pots is way easier than sitting and waiting for a warlock to come around and hope they buff you with under water breathing every single time you have an under water quest
Turtle wow server's rules are BIS on the HC mode.
there will be ZERO appeals on the official hardcore servers blizzard doesnt have the staff and if they hold streamers hands and do it for them only people get get pissed and not play.
all i cant is classic fresh start not hardcore.
D/C deaths should absolutely be appealed - also sometimes log in screen is slow after a D/C. My PC is blazing fast but ill hang up when trying to reload of a bad disconnect
1:24 How did he make it to 58?
the long loggin are windows doing this - happened to me with 8 gb videocard and 16 gb ram . or blizzard doing some anticheat check and then the antivirus reacting to the blizzard check
Dead is dead. Good luck appealing on official servers. I dont see Hardcore ARPG players appealing dc deaths.
This is why wow doesnt have hc mode and is not vital for it .
"fear fear fear the mob" yeah the guy was probably thinking he was 100% dead if he feared the mob potentially pulling more
If the warrior is targeting the mob he gets feared in place. Would have been fine, should have feared and used the better bandages.
He fell through the world which auto DC's you, as he kept falling and thus kept moving it meant the server could not sync his position correctly resulting him in being unable to log in. (flight paths are hard coded movements so it can still lock onto those).
After he then landed and died within a "non terrain" or "under the world", the server moved his corpse to the nearest anchor teleport point which was just outside the horde AB cave.
He died not because of a DC, but because of an obvious bug, which to me, is just extremely unlucky, but still a bug which would be really dangerous to grant appeals on.
Once you set a president that "bugs" can be appealed, the poor dudes who review the appeals are gonna get swarmed with appeal requests.
Until you DC on a flight path and even remotely near a new zone.... watch yourself fall for fun
Me watching these loading times like damn that’s quick 😢
DCs should not really be appealable I dont think that is a thing in other HCs
theres no sound, playing ff music in the background lmfao
with the video I think the DC should be appealable. he did everything he could to save his char and continue and it was purely out of his control.
Think they only appeal DC if you could of easily lived the encounter.
in other games with hardcore... there is no appeals even to dc :)
Disconnects, glitches, bugs etc. The game of vanilla was never made to be played HC. If the rules of HC as they are, wont take this into account into the rules, then HC is just a fly atm. Most ppl will probably play on different HC servers with different rules and all the chars under the current HC set will be forgotten.
the druid Deter i dont know how he made to that level with clicking portray to heal tohe player without mouseover makro wtf
Pretty sure if HC servers become a thing. Just like Diablo HC no death is going to be appealable, so just start over
Maybe then we will have real hc instead of these "dieing for views". Most of these hc pro streamers die to stuff not even a new wow player would die too.
@@Shadowxjen right? It’s annoying.
The HC addon makes me DC twice in a row everytime I login the same as the guy in the water clip. After the 2 dcs I dont DC for as long as I play. It isn't an internet issue it is the addon this should be appealable
HC - put with 100000 conditions. Should be death = death, pvp, d/c whatever. It doesn't matter if you trade or group the higher you get the more you have to lose. Imagine getting to like ICC HC and raiding, then losing all of that? That is the true rush. Not this ironmade restriction bullshit where you die but have gear so shit who cares. Watching a bunch of 15-40s die, they lost some time and that's it.
It absolutely should be able to be appealed. You’re supposed to be challenged by the game, not the servers.
He should of reset it all once that mossflyer got him..
It's impossible to die as a hunter. How? just how?
Panic, ignorance, being distracted. Same as any other class. Oh also, since hunter has an easy time baseline, they tend to lower their guards.
Some of these mistakes are from fatigue. People no-lifing hardcore and making silly mistakes. Go out and touch the grass people.
I think it should be cause you can be killed within the loading screen if you dc in a bad spot
no death is death sometimes shit happens thats fair and unfair
don't play a healer if you don't know how to heal - eg. target healing... if you target a player to heal them then you don't know what you're doing and you shouldn't be healing any HC dungeons.
Well, I'm playing a DPS, but I still got invited to heal a dungeon. I targeted people to heal them. I kind of find it annoying that people even _can_ cast targeted spells without targeting. Anyways, I am sorry I didn't measure up to your standards, but luckily you don't have to invite me to your groups if you don't want to.
Appealing death is bs, what's what's point in doing a hc run if you can appeal some deaths but not others, especially the deaths to pvp griefers I meen that should just be expected, xaryu has died like 4 times now to different things on his char and everyone got approved. Imo pvp combat and pulling big mobs to kill others is all part of the game and somthing you should have to deal with. Now if I was going to say its OK to appeal certain instances then unintentionally disconnecting is most definatly the only instance I'd give any leeway if there was evidence that was the cause, but dying to a high level mob pulled to a certain area na you should count that as a legit death