A Defense of the Apollo Justice Trilogy’s Name
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- Опубликовано: 3 авг 2024
- With the release of the Apollo Justice Trilogy coming Janurary 2024, Ace Attorney fans have debated if its title is even fitting of the games it contains. In this video, I seek out to prove why this naming may be more fitting than most people initially believe.
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THANK YOU! I've been calling this trilogy the "Apollo Trilogy" for years and I'm glad to see a good defense for the name. You deserve more subs than you have for sure.
I've always called it the Apollo Justice Trilogy, so I'm really happy they named it that.
To think that I would have chosen "Ace Attorney Trilogy 2: The Dark Age of Law" in those times before AJT was even announced lol
Great video! I agree that "Apollo Justice" trilogy makes the most sense because it's his story more than anybody else's. It's just not always executed well, and I think that's where most people have a problem with the title. (My kingdom for a version of these games where Kristoph being Apollo's former mentor is something that has an actual impact on him, like Mia's death did for Phoenix.)
I'd love to see more videos from you on the AJ Trilogy! I find it to be good, but flawed, which ironically makes it more fun to take apart and look at from different angles.
Excellent way of putting it! I agree the execution was shaky, which is why I think a lot of people criticize the title, as you said. Good but flawed is a great way to put the trilogy, in my opinion, and I’m glad you enjoyed!
incredibly underrated channel with great content; hope that you make it big eventually dude, you deserve it
Thank you so much! That means a lot!
Subscribing! You make a very good case for this. I hadn't really thought of how Phoenix's relationship with Apollo develops over the course of the trilogy, but the arc is definitely Apollo's. Also, I've always seen the title of the last game -- Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney: Spirit of Justice -- as a reference to Apollo. His name is literally in the title, and over the course of the game we really do see his spirit shine as he continues growing as an attorney, reunites with the man who raised him, and brings the one who so cruelly murdered his biological father to justice.
Anyway, fantastic video, and I look forward to seeing more from you.
I think the difference between the Apollo trilogy or the Phoenix trilogy is that all games in the Apollo trilogy work as standalone stories, and don’t really leave many plot threads hanging. The Phoenix trilogy, meanwhile, is so inexplicably tied together, that it feels wrong, to me at least, to look at them as separate games. It’s two different approaches in storytelling- which makes sense considering the team who makes the games was switched halfway through lol
This is exactly why 6-5 is one of my favorites. It puts a nice and tidy bow on apollo's and phoenix's relationship. It even contrasts 4-1 once Phoenix becomes Apollo's co-counsel.
Very good points!
Back then, I know this series for a long time but never got to play it. I had this lingering question when AA5 was first announced. It goes like, wait, there was Apollo Justice Ace Attorney. Where's Apollo Justice Ace Attorney 2? Which one is after Apollo Justice? Yes, this trilogy cleansed my confusion, and he totally deserves a trilogy of his own. :)
The mobile port of Dual Destinies did fix a bug the 3DS version had in NA.
What's up with the voice?
This was a great video! I honestly joked a bit too about it being his trilogy but thats mostly cause dd feels more like phoenix and athenas game, but you're right that there is growth and a focus on apollo thoughout the whole trilogy, unlike the other characters. I've always felt SoJ was his game and wish it had his name in it but oh well. At least he has his own official trilogy now that essentially confirms its his game!
You’re forgetting that tomorrow is clearly split into two trials, one for seven years ago and one for the present. So is rite, the trial for the high priest and the trial for his disciple. Also, Athena leads far less than half of countdown, doing nothing but pointing out the murder weapon in that time so whole case goes to Phoenix. Phoenix also leads 75% of cosmic compared to Apollo’s 25%. You also play as him in revolution for a short time with him being treated as a co-lead with the DC act and heavily helping Apollo. Also, Apollo getting Phoenix’s respect is more like Phoenix learning that Apollo is trustworthy and to trust him for any situation so that is more development for Phoenix than Apollo. This whole trilogy is about Phoenix losing his unwavering trust in people due to his disbarment and learning to regain it again, while also proving to the legal world that he is trustworthy and not corrupt after his forgery supposedly exposes him as being so/ also proving to the crown princess Rayfa herself that lawyers are trustworthy in SOJ
Revolution is also split in two trials, however, Phoenix is Apollo’s opponent in one of them and he would get the same punishment as Apollo, the lead if Apollo lost the other one, I wouldn’t usually say that assistants are co-leads but because Phoenix would get the same punishment, despite Apollo being the lead, I feel compelled to say even in the kurain trial, both Apollo and Phoenix are leads of the defence, also him being Apollo’s opponent in the US trial technically makes him lead of the case as well, like a prosecutor would be
Also trump and the misham case in succession have Phoenix as the real lead of the defence, leading Apollo and everyone else on with his careful planning, so those two cases also fall into the category of Phoenix being a co-lead, like revolution does. This is all just my opinion BTW (apart from the number of trials since the game makes that clear when there are 2 trials in 1 episode)
I absolutely adore these games and personally I like them more than the phoenix trilogy so excited for the collection
I just bought the trilogy two days ago. I appreciate this video a lot! I can’t wait to play through the games as I’ve never played them before
consider me convinced. I love 4 5 and 6 (got Problems with 6, but it's an ace attorney game so I love it) but the title of the trilogy bothered me. But you've won me over.
My issue was never with the name, but rather how the trilogy straight up adds a Z-Axis 1/3 in. The thing with the original trilogy is they all released for the GBA, and have the same original and HD graphics, meanwhile Apollo Justice goes from a more refined version of those styles, then to the janky 3D sprites
What do you expect when the trilogy jumps from the DS to the 3DS?
I beg to disagree with you on that.. I don't think Apollo was that bland in his own game, he does a lot more than what people credit for, at the end of the game, his arc was all about understanding the corrupt law and vowing to changing it, because he coulding catch guys like
Daryan Crescend and off course Kristoph Gavin using normal means, after all the law was corrupt, Duel Destines however ignored all that and had him cry for his best friend and accusing Athena, let's keep in mind that he accused his former mentor Kristoph at case 4-1, and he only got 15 minutes about him, when most of the game was focused on Athena's backstories, while Apollo's arc was crying for the death of a character we never met, and died, I think that his arc was rushed and was never thought out correctly..
So the SOJ Phoenix Acknowledging Apollo as a lawyer feels rushed and out of left field because in DD, Apollo was getting the short end of the stick every time, and he got only 1 and a half case in that game and his arc was losing his friend and everyone says "Oh look Apollo has been developed as a character" and him accusing Athena was nothing new if you're thinking about it in case 4-1.. Apollo hasn't been developed at all, and what we all got a bunch of backstories that are all disconnected with each other... in the first game, he learns about the corrupt law and vows to change it, in the second game is all about his dead friend, and in the third game he learns that a law that kills lawyers is BAD! something that a baby can learn.
So Apollo's "trilogy" makes no sense because instead of having Apollo develop as a character, we see him in a bunch of messy backstories that adds little to his character..
Hey! Thanks for taking to the time to engage with the points, I really like some of what you brought up, and I’d like to elaborate a little on some of it.
When I say Apollo has no real arc or agency in AJ, I mean that in terms of a couple things. First, if Apollo’s arc was learning to change a corrupt law system, I don’t really think he learned that at all, since in the very first case we see him willing to condemn Kristoph with no real hesitation or struggle. If he started out far more unwilling to do so, perhaps it could be considered development, but since he doesn’t really change his attitude from case 1 to 4 I don’t really see it as an arc. Second, Apollo doesn’t really have any agency in the situation. He doesn’t choose to try and fix a corrupt system, Phoenix is always the one pushing him into those situations, (accusing Kristoph, the final trial) it never feels like Apollo’s own choice.
I think calling Apollo’s arc in dual destinies just “crying about his best friend dying” is really unfair. Because that isn’t what he did. He did not sit around and mope, he proactively made the decision to do something about it and try and figure out who the killer was, and he had very good reasons to suspect Athena (evidence and the fact he knew she was hiding something from him). I contrasted this to AJ because all of Apollo’s choices were made entirely on his own, and I can see why he made them. As for the number of cases, Athena also got one and a half in that game, and Phoenix had 2. That’s not really “getting the short end of the stick” in my opinion. It’s actually pretty balanced, and even cases like academy where he wasn’t playable, he was still a big part of them as the assistant.
By the end of DD, Phoenix better understands Apollo’s views and philosophy as a lawyer, (wants to trust people but is not as willing to do so blindly, like Phoenix) which is why i believe he was more respectful of him in SOJ. As for his arc being just about the execution law being bad, that wasn’t my take on it at all. It was about Apollo coming to terms with WHY he became a lawyer in the first place after his inspiration (Dhurke) died, and making his own path in the legal world.
This isn’t me trying to change your mind by any means, people can absolutely draw different conclusions from games, just wanted to defend my points a bit!
@@Barbieronpa Yeah I see.. Thanks for understanding my view points..
I think SoJ handled needing to reform a corrupt law better than AJ did, even if it was over the top.
50 bucks, i dont got that money 😭
Wait, what bad was with mobile ports? 4 and AAI was kinda meh in the terms of optimization, but AA5 and AA6 were smooth as hell, never witnessed any bug or problem
I realized after I made this I had mixed up the ports. The old trilogy on mobile was badly reviewed, not DD and SOJ, I don’t stand by that line anymore!
yeah the mobile ports for AA5 and 6 were pretty good, they even fixed some bugs and typos from the original games
Wait what is wrong with the mobile ports? I thought they were the exact same?
Personally, I would prefer games 5 & 6 to simply be called “Ace Attornies” since you play as multiple characters. I would remove Phoenix’s name in the title since he’s no longer the only protagonist.
I just wish we could get a re-release of Investigations... But that is something too much to ask, since it's not a trilogy, although i would love to see a 3rd game in 3d... I miss Edgeworth's party, Kay and ESPECIALLY Franziska, Dick Gumshoe does appear in Apollo's game, but it's really a nothing burger. There's plenty of time frame to cover before Miles becomes chief, hell maybe even make the 3rd installment about the huge case that got Edgeworth promoted. And release the whole thing under the banner of: Path of Miles Edgeworth, but that is just wishful thinking.
Wish granted coming September 6th!
Personally, I would prefer games 5 & 6 to simply be called “Ace Attorn*ies*” since you play as multiple characters. I would remove Phoenix’s name in the title since he’s no longer the only protagonist.
Saying Phoenix is only half of countdown and cosmic is insanely misleading.
Countdown is a Nick case, there's no debate about it. You play as Athena in the prologue but you don't actually engage with any real gameplay and lose control of her like 5% into the case. And Cosmic is more Nick's case than Apollo's. You play as Apollo during a fairly short initial trial and then the vast majority of the case is handed to Phoenix - including an investigation and a decently sized trial section. Not including the DLC cases in the graphic on top of that makes the entire point feel disingenuous and really sours the video. You shouldn't have to stretch the facts that much to makes your argument.
While I disagree with the rest of the video as well, I much prefer hearing a genuine argument for why you think Apollo's character is a coherent throughline in the games and why that justifies the title of the trilogy. But the initial point being so misleading and stretched really made it hard to appreciate the overall video.
It makes sense that they name this Trilogy something else to differentiate it from the Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney Trilogy.
As for them deciding to go with Apollo Justice: Ace Attorney Trilogy, I'm fine with it since the 4th game is literally his game, and the 6th game focuses heavily on Apollo's origin, his family and his graduation from Phoenix's underling to a fully independent and successful attorney with his own firm and everything.
Where the name gets weird for the Trilogy is the 5th game. Sure, the 5th game featured Apollo alot.... but he was very much sidelined. That game was Athena's game and Athena's story. She was the centrepiece that everything revolved around. Apollo just happened to be around for it.
So yeah, the fact that the new trilogy went for a more game-by-game approach where each game was its own self-contained story made it so that Dual Destinies just doesn't fit in as a full cohesive part of an "Apollo Story". However, again, I am fine with the name because the 4th game starts the trilogy all about Apollo and the 6th game ends the trilogy heavily about Apollo.