NEW Independent Trucks
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- Опубликовано: 4 мар 2023
- Comparing my new Independent Stage 4 Trucks to ACE AF1 Hollows. Join channel members:
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Thanks @BigAlSkateTutorials for testing them!
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The 6 holes are not made so you can switch up your wheel base. It's made that way for the new school or old school truck mounting pattern.
Glad someone gets that.
You are correct. Bear makes a “street” truck with 8 holes. I wish every brand would do that. It’s nice being able to change wheelbase without drilling.
that seems obvious
@@dempc47 this dummy zack doesnt know anything about skating, hes a hack
You can use them as a jig to create a 2nd wheelbase option. The more you know.
I believe another reason for the stage 4 is because they work with all original time period reissue setups. All the 80's boards can now run trucks from that same time frame.
Shaped boards seem to be real popular atm.
@@lukecollins7965 they are, imo they are very hard to get used to after using a popsicle for so long
If the kingpin nut started falling off, it's because they usually don't tighten down the nut far enough for the plastic lock washer to fully engage on the bolt. I always tighten mine up a little until the nut is flush with the end of the bolt.
its nylon
@Patirck O'Zz nylon is plastic. I don't like the advice "don't touch the nut, factory settings" or whatever, as if it's some delicate process..no they slap the things together. If you ride tight trucks tighten them, if the nut is lose and that's not how you want it, it should at least make it to the nylock.
@@aerofoxoosvn I agree. I don't think the nut is installed in a precision way with a robot. I have probably 30 sets of trucks. Mostly Independent. Usually, the nut is slightly over the end of the kingpin. Definitely, don't start tightening it down a lot right away though. Tighten it at least to be flush with the end of the kingpin, but, ride on it loose for about an hour. The bushings will harden up on their own. If you torque them down right away, you will damage the bushings. I learned this the hard way.
@@idmhead0160 i totally agree. Gotta get them set to a happy medium and cruise the streets. Me personally I don’t like cranking down on the kingpin nuts. If you gotta crank them down just step up to a stiffer set of bushings
@idmhead0160 happened to the very first trucks I got. Tighten then down and they squished. I think riding loose for a day breaks them in asap. Great advice
I got Ace AF1 lows not long ago. I love them. I don't weigh much, so wheel bite hasn't been an issue. Also, using a hard Ace low bushing with a stock low bushing. I wax the wheel bite marks for peace of mind. Good vid.
All the people complaining about the iron cross clearly never payed attention to the trucks because Independent never put the cross on the truck itself till stage 8
this channel is so genuine keep up the amazing work bro
I wish I could skate that mini ramp! Looks so fun. I can't find one anywhere near me.
6 hole baseplates are not for switching wheelbase.
@@reza_dc2 Wrong. You would need 8 holes for that to work. It's just for the old bolt pattern that was larger than what is standard now
@@screwyouguysimgoinhome1043 I'm not wrong.
I said:
6 hole baseplates are not for switching wheelbase.
which is true.
For me below 7 Celsius the Indy Bushings do stiff up to much, i swapped to ace af1 bushings in the Stage 4 and that feels perfect for me, way smoother turn!!!
More material on the wings as like a venture or indy style hanger will result in a more stable feel, as compared to a truck like aces where the axle barrels are thin that is part of what gives them the turn/response they have
I'm not sure what that dull finish is called, but I laughed when you pointed that out. Back in the day all I used to do is stare at CCS catalogs wishing I had a skateboard and when was finally getting one for my birthday I had Krux picked out purely because at the time they were the only ones that had that finish. In my mind it made them look lighter than the others.
6:42. Real sells 1/8 risers that are made of wood to prevent that plastic feeling. I bought em for skating 56mm-60mm wheels
Also shock pads are a thing, instead of plastic or wood it's rubber. Helps take away the vibrations when riding hard wheels on a crusty road or when landing tricks.
IIRC Venture and Thunder are currently made in the U.S. The forged baseplates come from China, but the rest of the truck (hanger, cast plates) are made in the U.S.
There is a rumor that DLX is moving Thunder production to Mexico soon.
I don't know too many people that ride Trackers, but those are supposed to be made in the U.S.
If I wanted to be sure I would just contact the companies as things can change. That goes for any product.
Just got done with my 2nd sesh with these and at first, I skated them out the box without any mods and they were great! The turning was awesome, pop felt just like I'm used to.. But I personally always use the Bones bushings and I didn't have any for these so I removed the bottom washer from then and now they feel like "my" trucks.
I also agree with you about breaking in the bushings but I'm just not a fan of barrel bottom bushings. Hence why I wish I could use some Bones bushings on these.
Removing the low washer, give more room to the bushings so overall them go softer, but at the same time this move reduce the wheelbase of sensible bit... had to do that test too.
Great detailed review I've been riding Indy titaniums for years and have been trying to decide between these 2 for the last week or so. That backyard mini with the pool coping looks amazing, did you build it yourself?
I'm shopping for these and a pair of Grind King inverted king pins. So stoked.
Best combo in the market. I'm "breaking in" mines before I adapt them to the GK IKP.
Add a small washer under the bottom bushing and swap out for Ace medium bushings. The standard bushings feel dull/dead after a session or two
I rock the 136’s. Just replaced my 139 titanium… these stage 4 are the best for my curb rage
I just copped a pair of these, IMO they’re in between a stage 11 and an ace truck . Which is perfect for me bc I think aces are a little too squirly
The drilling pattern has nothing to do with the wheelbase... it's just the old pattern + the new one.
but it does.. because when you use the lower holes, the wheel base comes closer together. it's not rocket science.
@@reza_dc2 there are 6 holes in the baseplate. Not 8. Let's assume you put screws through the outer holes of the baseplate (the ones towards the nose/ tail) and screw the truck to your board this way ... How do you get screws through on the other side (towards the wheelbase) now that the holes on your board don't align with the ones on your truck anymore? If you can make it work you might want to apply at NASA 😄
Yea boii have a nice day everyone! Stoked to try these out
I think these trucks are the exact truck I been looking for, surfy super tight turn radius minimal wheel bite, lite and also have good pop still even being super loose
The break in was fast. They grind better than aces , they have the perfect turning radius . Only issue was the infamous indy bushings. After a month I swapped them with the krux bushings and they are the best trucks I ever had now
awesome!
Thanks for the detailed review. I was about to get some Stage 4 trucks but probably the ACE AF1 is a better fit for me, just ordered. Never tried them so I'll give it a go. Currently have Indy Stage 11. Really looking forward to more turning radius. I have one cheap board, with some cheap trucks, don't even know the manufacturer, and it turned soooooo easily... (yes I changed to softer bushings and everything on my Indys but still a huge difference). So I hope to get better turning for bowl riding out of them.
Hey Denise- I'm sure you will - I'm also a transition/bowl rider and have 2 of the same deck set up, one with Stage 11 169s the other Ace 66 Classics - the difference is amazing. Not that I'll say one is better than the other - but definitely different. The Ace turn is a smoother carve feeling. I'm sure the AF1s will give a similar turn. Not sure about the New Stage 4 - I actually have an original set of Stage 4s (169 I think) in my garage somewhere on an old board. I'll have to dig it out for a test run. Yeah I'm old 😆.
The Aces have a smoother/tighter turn because they are shorter from axle to axle then the Indy’s thus shortening your wheel base
Honestly i got back on 55mm high trucks with 56mm wheels and i love it
I like the stage 4s I just changed the top bushing cuz the hanger kinda stabs the bushing
Great video Zack. Over the responsiveness you mentioned...so from less to more...Stage 11s, then Stage 4s, Lurpiv, and AF1s for the most responsive... Where would you place Thunder 147s and below (49.8 mm) and Thunder 148 and above (52.3 mm)?
Thunder High (Team baseplate) are more responsive than Stage XI. I ride both (he doesn’t).
Indy Mids are actually like an Ace/Thunder hybrid… and turn way better than a Standard XI! Considering the small deck size you’re riding, look at Team Editions, or Indy’s Mid. 🤙🏽
I skated these trucks yesterday and they were great!Very stable. broke em in in no time at all. I got the 151s on a 8.5. Rockin cortina bearings and bones stf v5 53 mm. Evo has em for 50$ free shipping. (My local shop didn’t have the 151s.)
Does anyone know if they are compatible with bones bushings
I have no prob w the new indy stage 4s. My fav combo right now is them but w switched out bones bushings rather than the stock indy ones. For me theyre a huge diff but thats just me. Thx for vid
Man, I totally agree with just leaving trucks as they come and getting used to it, I used to have the madness and carry the damn tool around with me all the time, but the more I can go without adjusting these days the better!
do u have advice on getting out of this because this is how i am rn 😵💫
Tighten your bolts from time to time to prevent sog
@@toddt. whats sog? like sogginess?
@@lonelypatios exactly
How do I get a session in on that mini ramp!!😂😅😢
Best Trucks On the Market Right Now!
I wouldn't get anything under 151s as I skate a 8.5 & above. I have 151s on my AA 🥚 8.7" deck and they fit perfectly👍
Hey zack the six hole pattern is for those reissue skateboards.
I have to comment on the Bertoia knock off chair... not a fan. Love the content though. Keep it up, and maybe look into some 2nd hand Bertoia chairs someday.
What song is playing at the beginning?
I have ridden mostly Indys since 1989, and in that time I only ever had one set of Indys with the cross on them. Stage V, Stage VI, and Stage VII which were out when I went through sets quickly only had the bar logo, just as they do now. Original Stage IVs would also not have had the cross anywhere on the truck. I enjoyed the video.
I have had a ton of them with the cross in the baseplate and they looked way better to my eye. The cross was always synonymous with sharing to me, always was my favorite skateboard logo, they had the best merch. Them cancelling themselves for no reason is weak. Nothing about the Indy logo was in any fashion racist, it was based in surfing. I almost exclusively ride ace now
It would be nice to see a price drop, since there made overseas now.
What size should i got for 8.25?
good video!
I think one of the things about that new stage 4 truck is that they upgraded the bushings to a premium grade bushing in fact I think they use venom bushings.
Love the trucks but the bushings felt exactly the same , swapped after a month because they were blowing out and it’s not because my weight i only weigh 110lbs . Might be because of the excessive heat where I am.
Apriciate the vid bro !
is it a permanent thing or just a one time thing
can't switch your wheelbase, its so you can use OG bolt pattern decks.
but it does.. because when you use the lower holes, the wheel base comes closer together. it's not rocket science.
You always leave us a lot to think about Zack. I brought AF1s just before these came out so it's good to know Aces are still the way to go.
The iron cross was a link to the early America hot rod/surf culture which was cool, but times have now changed I guess.
Nah Indy all the way
@@koltaire5938
Personal preference;)
slappy trucks sound like the best of an ace and indy stage 4. slappy trucks are a stage 4 for but hollowed out to be lighter!
I was interested but they’re heavier, higher and longer wheel based than the AF1s. Mainly skating flat I don’t think they’re for me.
The aces don't have resistance as the turn gets deeper because of the tall height of the top bushing. If u stack a bones washer and a regular washer and use lower top bushings, u will get that little bit of wheel bite/turn resistance. I wish they came out with a lower kingpin baseplate for the option to use lower top bushings. Inverted kingpins could accomplish this too.
Use a grinder to make the kingpin flush.
@@siouxicide9002 that's what I would do but I don't have one
@@jackhoban8971 harbor freight is ur friend
hey Zack , you look like your becoming a better skater . I think i am seeing more confident commitment to moves on the coping , more efficient execution and just a generally more fluid flow in your skating . Congratulations brah, looks like you hit the next level of pro skater . : * )
Good review. Not sure how much you could test the turn on a mini-half though with not that much space
Skated them other spots/streets unfortunately didn’t get worthy footage.
were you able to compare the wheelbases of Ace and Independents?
@Bed of Fire or Decompose holy shit, I didn't expect that! thanks dude
Aces grind smoother probably a little bit cuz of the shiny on it but it’s softer metal so it grinds smoother but isn’t quite as durable but not significantly
This is origin model for thunder and ace trucks. But I would prefer sticking to my stage 11 hollows🎉.
Ace trucks are the only one I didn't have to break in. Indys broke in after 1 day of skating then loose. Then I tighten them and PERFECT
trying to get the market back... i know several seasoned skaters, who have been lifetime indie riders, and they have swapped out to a different brand..... i think they are loosing the market and are trying to get people back with nostalgia (or it could be a thicker truck means the poor quality alloys won't break as easily) when in reality it seems like they just need to look at the base materials and quality control... just my humble.
I rember back in the day the fucking axles would float, youd have to whack the axle nut on a curb to even them back out all the time
I’m confused. How does having a six hole pattern allow you to change your WB if the inner holes always stay in the same place? I guess you can drill new holes?
It's for some reissue boards
@@i4got477 I figured that, but my point was that you can’t change the WB with a 6 hole baseplate, unless there are extra holes drilled in the board.
@@driftlessskater5475 oh I gotcha now, yeah they are useless on a modern skateboard lol
Thunder venture and ace are all made in USA. Venture and thunder are even made in the same factory
mini montage👌
Thunder 148 team editions bayyyyybeeee
do a Slappy Trucks review my dude
I personally never really liked the iron cross logo tbh. Kinda annoyed for the reasons they got rid of it though, I have some old pro model stage 9s with the logo. I ride mainly retro boards that wouldn’t of had the logo on their trucks back then, so more historically accurate when putting say new stage 1 or 4 trucks on a reissue board.
Indy’s have always been the best and ace trucks are molded from them but won’t ever be the best!! Slappy trucks are a combo of both but time will tell if they stick around
Ride the best 🔥🔥🔥
I really like the ACE classics better with Bones bushings but their sizing sucks.
Just bought Silver Stage 11 139s for my kid’s 8.0. Anyone has them ? You like them ?
What about Slappy trucks
Fun Fact Alert ⚠️ 📢
U can use the 4 hole inverted kingpin baseplates with the stage 4 hangers and it's a match made in skateboard heaven
bushings were meant to be broken in. that being said, you don't want to keep breaking in new bushings with each new truck.
I prefer looser trucks but I break the trucks in first like you said. I run stock bushings and I purposely work them in and then skate them u til they are broken in before I loosen them a touch.
"cutting hard and breathing hard" Al Brunelle
What trucks are you riding?
Still riding my ace classics. Honestly wasnt a fan of the af1s so i bought a few pairs of the classics anticipating that they would be discounted
Ace classic 44 on a 8.5 board. Seeing you ride bigger trucks so thinking about doing the upgrade
AF1 Hollows. I just wish they were a little lighter and a little lower. But I’m going to try the AF1 Lows next and put the Hollow hanger on them and see what that feels like.
Indy stage 11 169s on my street deck which is a 9.75 welcome dark lord. My park deck I have 5.8 venture Hi on my 8.5
AF1 hollows 66s on the curb board, 44s on street deck! Coming from close to 20 years of Thunders I appreciate the freedom. Luckily didn't have the axle nut issue on either pair. Thanks for showing these, they look like life size tech deck trucks I can't unsee that!
Not gonna lie. I hated how my Stage 4s turn. I had to take off the top washer in order to get them to feel squirrelly
Your meant 2007 right about ace trucks when they came out ? Because you said 2017 ?
Yes!
Keep the content coming my. Dude much love from da Bay Area I watch u all the time you and Al rip so hard 💯🔥🛹
The white bushings from independent are the softest, not the red
You’re talking about stage 11 aftermarket bushings, but for stage 4 red is the softest.
Resisment?
what deck is that? the design is sick lol
Polar
It's a weird stage to re-issue. Stage V are stronger and Stage VII fixes some of the problems you mention, while keeping a similar geometry. It only makes sense that they are made for re-issued '80s decks and not to compete with Ace.
They were banking on the nostalgia market. It was an odd move imo
I have read a lot of og rider still ride stage 7s..
Not true. I was an Ace guy - these blow them out of the water!
Stage 4 reissue is not a new thing. You could even get them back in the 90s. Also stage 5s were 80s as well
trucks over 53mm tall are made wrong. 52 is the sweet spot imo
Aces came out in 2007 btw
Ace all day
Albrunelle is the homie!!
Save the cross. Made in USA 🇺🇸
Wrong! Thunder are Not the only trucks made in the US. You have also TRACKERS TRUCKS (one of the historic brand of trucks)
What about a Slappy truck review bud?
Thunder and Venture are both the only trucks still made in USA
Shoutout DLX!
Not anymore, they moved production to Mexico. I just got a recent Venture V-Hollow(Philly w/gold baseplate) with “Made in Mexico” in the sticker.
@@reup4023 atleast not in China and maybe its the baseplates only or idk
dude, I think you can not give a comprehensive opinion or comparison to other truck if you just do not know. Maybe just one of the things, Thunder and Venture trucks come from the same distribution and are both made in USA.
Venture trucks made in usa
I have the OG's made in America better build quality. I go back and forth between theses and OG Tracker Aggros.
Always surprised by all of the skaters who are whining about the cross that's now two years gone. Let it go. Hasn't impacted my ability to skate and I've ridden Indy's before and after the cross. Even funnier that these folks "won't ride Indy anymore", but take the time to troll the posts and reviews. Big babies.
2 points of criticism from yours truly would be:
1) Your theory on not touching the kingpin nut on new trucks to preserve the ability to maximize breaking in your stock bushings.-
That sounds absurd to me😂 i mean you cannot trust every single Chinese kid from the factory to place the nut in the same spot with every truck they assemble. Not only that but weight is weight. Pressure is pressure. I like em loose but as long as you're getting that and full range of motion I don't understand how there could ever be a difference.
2) I highly doubt that just because it's Shiney it makes it grind longer. I think thats in your head also😂 certain alloy blends would make a difference however in this case I don't think the fact one is polished and the other isn't is the difference. The duller finish could be a softer more grind able alloy than the polished. I'm saying a truck could grind longer than another but I don't think it's shineyness attributes to that nessisarily.
Hey man it's all constructive, no hate here. I've done the same bias things so it's whatever, but I figured I'd put in my .02 at least for your algo🤙 that's where I stand hahah.
I love my stage 11s. I got em in 8-8.25-8.5. My 8.5 setup is my favorite with the combo of 31.6 length and 14" wheelbase she turns so nicely and quite stable, but they're forged hollow on 56mm wheels. Major wheelbite the way I run em. So I got a 1/16" shock pad (not installed yet) to bring it up to 55mm height from 53.5 (1/16" is basically 1.5mm) I talked to an indy rep about a bunch of truck geek stuff was pretty interesting. Only way to truly know is to try so I think I'm gonna give them 4's a shot along with some standard height 11s. I feel like I'd appreciate the extra nose height on pop ALSO, I got some 58mm wheels I'd like to setup a bowl/vert board. Same length and wheelbase, but just wider and higher.
Geese, this is along comment😂😂 anyways, shred on bro🔥🤙🤙
So, if you go by the deck size you are giving potentially wrong configurations - nowadays wheel widths are very similar - but an old school type wheel with twice the width would require a smaller hanger truck for the same size deck .. which is why we shouldn’t match truck sizes to decks like that. But it would be nice to standardize truck sizes but that’s just wishful thinking this is a competitive market and nobody is going to change they way they size things just because they want to be compared to other products…
Anyway enough ranting lol
F that! Indy’s attempt to go backwards is about as lame as them moving production to China! I have so many pairs of each Indy model and I’m done. 77 Ace’s for the wide decks, and Thunders on everything from 775-8.5.
They look like a smaller version of a 215 truck
they are
Been shopping for trucks. ACE’s look nice but they seem gimicky. Those end nuts should be nylcoks like every other truck nut in history. Then they wouldn’t fall off. Boards are subject to huge amounts of vibration so this is a basic engineering principle. Also why have nuts which rethread and then a red die that’s included to do the same thing? Pointless. I never had issues rethreading ruined axle ends with the standard nylock nut. Rode ventures and gullwings for years and had zero issues. Also these super soft loose bushings in ACE’s seem like a fail to anyone who doesn’t want their board to ride like a surf skate. I’ll stick with Indy or ventures I think.
Venture is also made in the USA.
I don't think so anymore. I could be wrong
I never tried Independent trucks. I miss Phantoms like crazy though. I just got into BMX, but seeing your videos really makes me miss skating. I gave it up after 2 decades of not learning a single trick, but riding in itself was always fun.
wheel bite is never a good thing. stability is important in skating...
I am going to start a start a truck company called 'Red China'. The trucks will turn on a dime, but they will break a month after warranty. Enjoy American freedom skater!!!