Dyno Testing 1.2 Ratio Roller Rockers ~ The Road To Horsepower Ep 5
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- On todays episode of The Road to Horsepower we test 1.2 billet roller rockers. These rockers will up our lift on our cam from .265 to .318. We also break down some info on cams to help you guys with your build. How much power will it make???
Parts & Products Used In This Video
Hot .265 Cam - bit.ly/2WoQA3V
Fire .265 Cam - bit.ly/3HwY9MH
.010 Head Gasket - bit.ly/3WzwTUI
Autolite 3910X Spark Plug - bit.ly/3qCKjCk
TM24 Flat Slide Carb - bit.ly/3ZtvRMB
TM24 Flat Slide Carb Kit - bit.ly/31TsUWm
VM22 Clone Carb - bit.ly/3X6cdVc
VM22 Clone Carb Kit - bit.ly/37KXRzZ
VM22 Genuine Carb - bit.ly/3J4D1kL
VM22 Genuine Carb Kit - bit.ly/3iHd1AP
Stock Carb Performance Kit - bit.ly/3kZ96wr
18Lbs Valve Springs - bit.ly/2QPD34e
36Lbs Valve Springs - bit.ly/40W5yzt
Throttle Top Plate - bit.ly/3buiBOs
Billet Flywheel - bit.ly/2vDOft1
Slipstream Flywheel - bit.ly/3C4kFM9
Stage 2 Kit - bit.ly/3HdeCGE
Air Filter & Jet - bit.ly/3kZ96wr
Header - bit.ly/3Wx2bf4
Build Your Own Header Kit - bit.ly/2NDPdM9
3 Disc Racing Clutch - bit.ly/2HXseYN
Juggernaut CVT Pulley - bit.ly/3aAl355
Mega Moto Mini Bike Kit - bit.ly/3aPEfM6
Magnetic Oil Dipstick - bit.ly/3Ylg7do
MSD Coil - bit.ly/3wn8uX2
Amsoil - bit.ly/3TWtrmM
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Prime Weld Tig 225x - amzn.to/3L4U3MG
Prime Weld MIG180- amzn.to/3KVUPvn
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It would be nice to see a spreadsheet of parts, cost and hp/torque as the build progresses
The cost is a lot lol
@@detonationpyrotechnics4156 it almost seem better to just buy the 420cc and remove the governor. But then the series 40 TQ cost will eat you up.
working on it rn
When Red Beard teaches it feels like finding the correct answer you were searching for back in the forum days.
I've only gotten to the 5 minute mark and I'm going to go out on a limb and speculate the peak torque will occur at the same RPM as the stock rockers but it will increase slightly.
Just finished the video and there was an increase in max torque but what surprised me was it came at a higher RPM, which typically only happens when the duration is increased. Very interesting build. Can't wait to see what you do with the 670cc Predator Twin!
When you increase the rocker ratio you do increase the camshafts @20 or @50 duration at the valve itself, you are also accelerating the valve at a quicker rate so you need to be mindful in some situations of valve loft and float.
Love this series man! Right when you started this series, I went and bought a Predator 212 Hemi and have been doing the same mods as you after each video!
Still loving this series. Can't wait for the V-twin "Road to power" series. Also ... you should braid your beard like a Viking 🙂
I’d like to see the v-twin done also.
Yesss viking!
Nah he needs a kilt and some bag pipes
Add a helmet too
@@mikesbarn1858 getting drunken Scotsman vibes now
Loving the series, would really love to see a part for part comparison of the hemi vs. Non hemi. Its always a Facebook debate as to which one people should buy and why and maybe just a personal preference in the end but still be awesome to see real life numbers.
This has been a very interesting series and it's been a great learning experience! Can't wait to see what big block engines will make and can't wait to see what that Supercharged 670 you have actually makes
Great info Red.Thanks.Side note:Please put a spring loaded tensioner on the dyno chain.I find myself staring at it just waiting for it to self-destruct,and it's not 'If',but 'When'.LoL..Be safe.
Bruhhh your information on the valvetrain and your editing and illustrations were SO damn informative. You are at the top of your game man, respect!! 💪💯🚀
Great series, always looking forward to the next video!
How about doing a test with different fuels 87/89/91/93 octane, small engine fuel, race fuel, methanol? 🏁🔧
I have another idea for comparisons. Removing some of the “stage 1” mods after installing mods like the rocker arms to show if gains can be made without doing the “stage 1”. If I remember right more lift helps more at higher RPM so running rocker arms with out upping the RPM should not help.
I kind of agree, a pressed steel ratio rocker set is MUCH cheaper than a Camshaft and is a better option for people with a CVT... I went from Ratio rockers to a Dyno Cams CM grind 265 lift cam and there is NO difference in performance until 45mph where the CVT maxes out and allows the engine to start revving, even with a stock cam you can feel where the CVT reaches max gearing and only then will the engine start to pull hard!
I too would like to see what each mod does alone on a stock engine, then again on an engine with other supporting mods. I feel that would better demonstrate how mods interact with and are dependent on one another.
I'm so stoked you're doing this series man. It's nice to know that these add-ons truly do improve power.
Make sure you try different seat & valve angles. 30, 45, 50, 55 & even 60 degrees are not out of the question. 45 face angle is a good choice for stock/ported stock type automotive heads. Race type cylinder heads generally run higher lifts up to 1" plus and the 55-65 seta & valve angle helps airflow @high lifts. I assume 45 degree is most likely stock angle for your engine. But should have a 60 degree throat angle into valve bowl and a 30 degree top angle smooth transition into chamber. Also can try a back-cut on the intake valve around 30 degrees to aid in low lift flow. Good luck.
Awesome series. You are doing it the right way. Would it be possible to include a spreadsheet graphic the end of each video showing the progression of each video series showing quick description of the work, horsepower, torque, peak RPM, and cost.
It would be nice to see all of this data side-by-side on a spreadsheet
C'mon Greg, don't cut yourself short, you are a professional engine builder, #Mini style! Great video!
One key piece of equipment to invest in for this series would be a good quality flow bench to test the airflow potential of the cylinder heads. If the results from the flow bench indicate the potential for airflow greater than what the engine can provide on its own, then you know it's time to tinker with forced induction which should be a lot of fun.
Yaaay more Dyno testing!!
Greetings from Texas! Love this series. Gives real world results with common sense approach. Could you include a breakdown of the improvements, cost, hp and torque in a table on the description above for the last episode. (no spoilers for this episode!) I have been watching these but forget the numbers for the previous builds and would like to compare them as we go. Keep up the great work. You are spending the time and money, so we get the benefit of your knowledge without having to invest the time ourselves. A running chart would allow me to figure out what mods I would like to include in each build that I perform and what the cost associated would be. Thanks again for running this series.
Please move the screen closer to the camera while you're doing the Dyno pull. It's hard to see on a small phone screen. Don't really need to see the engine just sitting there as much as needing to see the gauges as the pull is happening. Thanks!!
Then get a bigger screen 🤦♂️
Don't forget, RB, even with "only" .265" LOBE lift, you still had to grind the crank counterweight to clear the lobe.
I would suggest at the end of each video detail the gains of each step. That way it’s easy to see the progression of gains of each step of what you’ve done
Could not have done it without your knowledge and videos my engine turned out great I like the way it runs I'm not running the 212 am running to 224 it's a little more involved in your series right now but I built mine right along when you're doing your 224 great series all kinds of good information keep it coming good job
Can't wait till they do a road horsepower series on the 224
This has been a very informative series the dyno results and testing really help show how much and what makes the big differences when building the motor.
Would love to see a video on the EC Carbs Adjustable main jet.
Seems like a good part to boost performance of a semi stock engine.
Oh yeah 👌😁🌟🦇💕the parts are allsome looking it's cool to see the difference between all of the steps cool stuff guys from cruzermans inventions 😁👍🎉🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟
I would love to see the effects of high compression on the dyno
Yes, it would be cool if they got a head and took of one thousand a few times and tested it each time.
best small engines video content creator goes to this guy, id pay good money for him to do this series on his 479cc v-twin vanguard for a baja mini bike, with the nos kit after all the upgrades! looking to make a mini chopper thats road legal out here in alaska. all offroad vehicles are now road legal here as long as you have insurance on some kind of main vehicle.
Loving these videos, man I basically doing the same engine build you’re doing right now for my flat track bike. Can’t wait to see what the horsepower will be after you poured in Polish the head keep up the good work.
What length push rods did you use when switching to 1.2's
I truly admire the road you and your family have been on. In my opinion you are ready to learn from a professional performance engine builder. Paul's kart and EC Carburetor taught me how to build lasting engines that make lots of tourqe and still pull hard on top end. I wasted a lot off money buying bolt on horse power Go China crap. The first two companies I mentioned use serious American engineering and also make sure that I understand how to properly clearance and install there parts. Just food for thought but you will not be disappointed with either one off those companies heads. I would love to see you compare a Paul's Kart hemi head to a Go Power sport's stage whatever head. I like Go Power sport's for Go cart and mini bike part's. EC is the best in my opinion.
This is brilliant mini series. Well done.
Love the series. Hope y'all do a 459 predator series and for kicks and grins dyno that turbo diesel. Super curious the output of that critter.
Awesome information, the more I learn, the realization I don’t know a lot about these engines comes clear !
Red Beard has taught me a lot !! I don’t have to learn from mistakes,
Thank you❤ much love !
Nothing better than a before and after performance parts dyno session. I love seeing whether company claims of gained HP is the truth or just blowing smoke. Also did not know that factory clone rocker arms are 1:1 ratio.
I saw a interview with Jon Kaase on Powernation and he was saying that port geometry and size is more important than flow so you are spot on with what you are saying about porting your head.
What about an offset flywheel key? Ignition timing is no joke...
Especially if you build a long rod engine.
Love man keep up the good work, very interesting. Can you leave a link in the next video for the oil dip stick with the magnetic on it.
224 series needs to happen!!
Awesome, the air filter made a difference!
So thorough!! These are great videos
Thank you sir
Love the series. Thanks for the content
RBG, Did you dyno the bone stock motor? What was the real HP? 212 Predators are supposed to be 6.5 HP. So far you have more than doubled claimed HP. Just wondering what it really had out of the box? Great video!
that was the first video of the series, It was just over the 6.5mark, but not quire 6.6
He did on the first Road to Horsepower video. Just slightly more than 6.5 if I recall correctly.
I like the UNI type foam filters that can draw air from back as well
I think the term you missed is port velocity, too large a port kills torque, impedes fuel atomization, and doesn’t necessarily fill the cylinder as well due to port velocity loss.
Horsepower up reliability down. I have tried to get the best balance in what I build. Great show. I am Old School. Keep up the great work.
Loving the Dyno Pulls.
Damn rbg ! Your really doing it ! Keep it up !!
Id like to see the head shaved, raise the compression about 40 psi or so, high enough you can barely pull start it! Or where it requires 98 -100 octane fuel, just a guess cut the head, deck the block, or both, about.040" - .050" +/-, with better flowing head, back cut the valves, maybe cut more angles on them
Great Video and as usual awesome informative connect very much enjoying the Road as the engine progresses in power
Well that was interesting, I thought the ratio rocker would have made a bigger difference... maybe they would with a ported head, or using them with a STOCK cam. I am still more interested in torque figures at different rpms with different cams, as the engine is ALWAYS restricted to what the CVT will allow it to rev to. ie my CM grind is no quicker than a stock cam until it reaches max gearing at 45mph and nobody has the Dangly bits to reach 60mph where the power is
I have been keeping up with this series and without getting too far ahead it would be pretty cool to see what a stroker does for power, and then taking it even further by turboing it... just suggestions. "if you build we will watch it"
Picked up .2 hp just with filter change! Keep it going yeyeyyeeh
If it's going to be under 6k rpm engine, I'd look into running the shortest rod possible, with more compression sand a fine gone bore, and coated shirts, the short rid will help the not so great flow, and performance at low rpm can gain a bit,
Definitely want to see a detailed head porting video, it’s pretty intimidating and most videos on youtube aren’t the best.
Great series red beard I built my engine along these same lines
Thank you for this. It’s been a eye opening and points to the real gains
An idea for a test please. Test an engine with 87 octane then test with premium and then 87 with octane boost.
Love this series!
Chewbacca rules >> great channel 👍
Great video bud thanks for your knowledge and your time
wonder how much a 32/28 big valve head would add
I want the 999cc durumax series. With a turbu installation , am sure it will get crazy numbers.
With the bigger filter you were able to make more power even though you were running more rich, so you should see better gains with that port job.
Holy cow thats good increase from one part
I wish you would overlay the graphs pre an post rockers to see exactly were power shifted and extended
Awesome work folks
Thank you so much 😀
Great information
How is this uploading now but it says there are comments from 1 day ago
Excellent informative video.
Max lift max duration is the way to go period with small engines with a cvt.
I would like to see some wheelie on those little Minni bikes. I would like to know if you have to jerk the front of the Minni bike up or if it will come up on just power alone.
Any test on high compression heads, I'm about to put a genuine Honda GX160 head on a GX200 clone, there is a big difference in chamber size.
Maybe with ratio rockers so no need to open crank case to gain a few hp
RB, keeping P2V clearance in mind, is there a domed piston available to work with that Hemi head, bumping the compression over 12:1? With E85, and rejetted carb, it should make big power.
You should complete an Oil Shoot Out. I would love to see Brad Penn full synthetic Vs AMSoil
How much extra power did the larger air filter give ? sorry I missed it, not bad an extra horse power just changing the rockers, thanks for sharing, all the best to yous and your loved ones
The air filter setups made a big difference, did the smaller filter have the radius entry adaptor the same as the black one?
You were getting erratic booster signal with the smaller filter setup and I’m going to guess it’s more to do with the entry radius than the surface area of the filter itself.
Another great video!!
Thanks again!
It’d be cool to see the same upgrades on a non hemi vs the hemi.
Something to try on the dyno is different length rods, to see how it changes the hp and torque throughout the rpm. I know it may not add hp, or may depending on the application.
Longer rods are less prone to detonation so one could or should advance the timing to see the most benefit from a longer rod. This all assumes the piston is in the same place in relationship to the deck each time meaning longer rod, change the piston to match. In cases where you don’t have to change the piston to match, enjoy the increased compression but it won’t take as much timing before detonating.
ARC has a good video on rod ratio (what your talking about) And explain the various benefits etc
Would love to see a series like this using an actual Honda engine. And then comparing the actual Honda engine to the harbor freight engine to see how close the harbor freight version could get to the Honda version or vice versa.
Who'd uh thought dyno, now build drag strip 👍😁☮️
I wanna see y’all dyno one with the little NOS kit you can get for small engines lol
Really liking this series, where's the link for the ratio rockers, and push rods. I know G.P.S has them, but there's so many different ones.
The air fuel ratio was a lot cleaner and fatter with the larger air filter, compared to the smaller one kinda interesting.
Will you be trying different fuel types as well? E85 vs rec fuel vs premium vs racing fuel (high octane)
Build the vanguard 479cc please!!
Does the typical automotive performance valve job help on these engines? These engines are such a nice upgrade over the old flathead design. I don't know what took them so long to go to this design.
I’m putting together a pretty basic predator 212 for my almost 6 year old daughter. Just doing the air filter with included jet, governor spring capture mod, 18lb valve springs, the .010” head gasket, and the Autolite racing spark plug. I plan to leave the factory muffler to keep it relatively quiet for her. How much do you think the factory muffler will hold this back?
Hey RB.. if you had to choose between a dirt bike and your mini bike for an easy trail.. Which would you chose??
Hey rgb could you please try the mod2, mod1 and the .310 cam from dyno cams i got a rod flywheel mod2 cam ported head ss valves 26lb springs 1.3rr 196 hysun and dont know of i should upgrade to the .310 or go with a mod1... keep up the great content
Big valve head 32mm 27mm
imagine swaping one of this badboy on a snowblower.
The thing would blow snow 100 feet
Can you do me a favor we do this in Quarter Midget‘s negative cam timing. We do about 2 to 4° negative cam timing and by spinning the gear that spins the crank and it moves the RPM band up with negative cam timing. Can you test that I am very curious. It does make the exhaust hotter. I do know that.
I’d really love to see you do this on the duromax 440cc
When you want me to bring this vtwin turbo .
It currently hold the record for fastest mud boat in the country
He should invite cars and cameras for a comparison on there vtwin and his maybe they can finally get both vtwins to run at their best
good information!
Brother, I’d like to see a Mod2 cam before and after 1.3 rockers.
Since you’re looking brother, check my channel out. I’ve got a couple of billet head motors including a full on 3” going together now. Love to see one of those on a Dyno some day 😈
Needs to see what using different fuels
should test thicker to thinner weight oil. old skool builders always say thinner oil makes more power --- i am guessing cause of dipper going through it
NASCAR says thinner oil makes more power too. They were using sae 50 30 years ago, now they set their engine clearances tighter and run super thin oil. I’ve personally seen a 38 hp gain by doing just this in a near 500 hp Chevy circle track engine.