Hacksaw/rabbit hat etc> personally I feel if you find something in a region you should be able to use it, otherwise I feel it starts to become “difficult for the sake of difficulty” misery-fest, rather than creating something that both you and the viewer are enjoying, but YMMV.
A wise man once said "You play the game the way you want to play the game. There is no right or wrong way to play." So, if I'm playing this challenge, I would keep it quite simple. Any and all connector mines, caves, bunkers, etc. are fair game and in play. I don't care what the game displays as you enter, as long as you have not entered a new region, you are good. If I spawned in Pleasant Valley, I would not be able to enter Winding River, Timberwolf Mountain, Coastal Highway, or Keeper's Pass. As for items found, if I found them, they are in play. If I have the DLC, then those additional items are in play.
I also liked the way Athenon did it where he had to survive 50 days in every zone and couldn't go back(unless he had to run through it to the next zone but he wasn't allowed to touch anything). And when he goes to the next zone he can only take his full pack full of gear and not be in the red and everything else was abandoned. Should also use anything you find because random chance and luck are part of the game.
Knowing what does and doesn't spawn in regions kind of removes the thrill and unpredictability that the long dark perfected as a survival game. Many things are based on RNG even if you restrict loot. Every element in the game is supposed to be used to its fullest potential, so allow yourself everything you find!
Key question on which gear to use and which not: As a not so frequent player, how shall I know which matches are guaranteed and which not, which hacksaw is always there and which not? To make conditions equal for all players, how experienced they ever are, the only answer to your question is that ALL findings are allowed to use.
Im trying to figure out how zak can walk around with all of the stink bars and yet not a single predators cares yet I take one piece of cooked meat out side and every predator within 3 regions tells me how they feel about it lol. This is good please keep this challenge going because I want to do this after I get the 500 days achievement, im currently on day 402 on my 2nd interloper run.
The hacksaw is almost always (75%) somewhere in TWM so it would be weird to disallow it. I think that rule makes more sense for things like the Maglens and hammer(at least in the regions where those are rare finds.) Also random matches are very powerful in FM as otherwise you only have 2 guaranteed flares. One nice thing about the hacksaw in certain regions is access to a lot more metal for fishing hooks. Although you also need a prybar or hammer for clearing the fishing holes and those aren't renewable long term(unless you have both the hacksaw and hammer.) For that reason I think the "infinite survival" portion of this challenge is usually going to be naked scurvy + rabbit trapping. By the way, I don't know if you're interested in this but one version of this challenge is to play normally for 50 days, then outlaw anything that's non-renewable. This simulates the extreme lategame where you've used all the resources, and you can play for just ~20 more days and track stocks of food/fuel/etc to see if it's sustainable. Obviously much easier in regions with beachcombing+workbench as that's the only way to have renewable clothing.
On another note, ddrjake also did a whole series called “single region survivor” that was really awesome to watch. Sorry if I shouldn’t have posted that here
To survive, you have to use whatever resources are available to you. In my opinion, that includes resources in connecting caves and mines, (just don't exit the other side), as well as any loot you find. After all, how many regions have a guaranteed hacksaw spawn? So if you find one, use it! You do need a hacksaw after a deer kill by a wolf. There isn't an incision, although you'd think there should be. ADDED NOTE: Your character doesn't know about things like rng or guaranteed or not, etc, so just do what you gotta do lol
i agree, getting everything you can get your hands on is fair game. just saying if this were real life and you were stuck in the wilderness in one area you would try to get everything you can.
I'd love to see these as a series after the update. I've been following your advice on building map knowledge. I've been playing at Stalker for some time, but never felt like I REALLY knew where I was or how to navigate to safety when caught out in bad weather. I lost several runs to freezing because of this. I always admired your map knowledge and remembered your advice to spend 30 days in each region to learning it. I started a new Voyager run and I'm spending 30 days in each specifically to build my region memory. I'm also concentrating on the bow. I've always relied on firearms, but on these runs I'm using the bow. I made my first wolf and bear kills with it and it was empowering. Thanks for your sage advice and entertainment.
When I do one region challenges, I don't allow entrance into transition caves. The dam is an exception because the transition notification to Winding River doesn't pop until you're going down the stairs outside of the dam, which allows looting of the dam itself if the starting zone is ML (and I use custom to set my starting zones). If a new zone pops, the run is over under my rule set. Also under my rule set, anything found within the zone is fair to use whether or not it is guaranteed or random. Survival is challenging but generally not brutal once a person gets used to just using rocks (now that one can harvest rabbits again without a weapon). It's the unique and rare chance items that add some variety into each region. The cougar may or may not make any difference. In my mind, it depends on how long a player has to be in the zone before it makes an appearance. The short 10-day ones almost certainly will never see a cougar. Once they do become interested in the player I'm anticipating that they will be impossible to just avoid while staying in the zone and, of course, killing one would be impossible. Looking forward to it.
i think anything that spawns is fair game, rare loot chance or not. RNG is a part of gaming, and it feels more enjoyable to use yourr luck to your advantage when possible. i dont think we need to start trying to standardize things because honestly each region is different and we should lean into that, embrace the advantages and disadvantages that each region possesses. looking forward to the series!
I like the idea of this challenge, but needing to map the region before you can leave. This would force you to go outside instead of hibernating 50 days.
If you don't find a hammer then survival isn't indefinite because of having to break the ice to fish. Eventually your crowbar will be done with no ability to repair it.
You are technically correct..which is the best kind of correct 😉 But you will run out of ways to break the ice long before you are out of scrap for hooks. Either way yes not infinite. Yay birch bark.🎉
As I kept watching the video, I noticed is says "leave pleasant valley" when you entered the connecting cave to the dam. In my opinion that's clear enough that connecting areas are not part of the areas they connect... Otherwise you wouldn't have this "leave" message. There's nothing like that when you enter a cave in HR or the mine in Desolation point
I once survived 180-something days in TM on interloper, which to be fair did include the summit. I'm pretty sure I could've survived forever, that region is so easy(and fun). Eventually I just got bored and left lol.
Oh and for the connector caves i think they should be allowed from both sides. And there is a good reason for it: if you have to stay „forever“ in one region, you are probably not able to stay in a connector cave, which imho define them as „NOT a region“ so technically you are not entering a „new“ region by going into a mine.
You can harvest more meat by hand if you first harvest the smallest amount and take the penalty on that. Then you can harvest the remaining meat without penalty.
Did this sort of challenge years ago when Timberwolf Mountain first came out. I only every played Stalker, but it was a fun challenge filling up the hut.
I decided to play along with this one. Initially I was going to run through the connector caves for coal. When I got there I was reminded of the text that appears in the center of the screen when entering the cave: "Leave Pleasant Valley". That makes it seem wrong so I noped out 😅
I think both special items and caves should be allowed. Would be great to have a tips/strategies video on mid/late game working around resource constraints. How do you work around a wolf pack spawn when you out of matches, no knife, no hatchet, no bow? I guess the late game of lot of runs will end up being a perma-fire near a fishing hole and rabbit spawn if you have a bed roll. When the cougar mechanic hits maybe the escape challenge is you can't leave a region until you encounter the cougar?
Some of the connector caves give a "Leaving [region]" message when you enter them. I think those should be off limits but the others are fair game. I would prefer you make use of lucky finds as that gives the runs more variety.
I think you can use whatever you find. For such experienced player as You, Zak, you know which one has chance, which is guaranteed... For me, they are not possible to distinguish... I believe, luck is also part of this game. If you have bad luck... you won't survive ;) It is not an science experiment, so we don't have to have same conditions :D
My cat really likes the intro music to your video! Just saying... (also, he hates it when he hears the Long Dark wolves howl). PS: you've inspired me to try this challenge. PPS:I started in HRV, no workbench so no crafted clothes😮
I get the standardizing, but to me, so much of the game is randomized, that the challenge is just: how long can YOU survive in the region YOU get, with the loot YOU get. As in, these game challenges are more so for the individual player, not just in general. How long Zak can survive in PV is a diff challenge than how long I can survive bc we’re totally different players who will make diff choices and get dealt diff rng. So, I think any loot you find is 100% fair game (literally)! You could find 6 boxes of matches but never find a good coat…you’ll always have certain advantages and other disadvantages.
What if, for science, you use the MOD that you use to do the fly overs, and give yourself and set load out of gear for each run, one hammer, one hacksaw, one bed roll and so on, level the playing field so that RNG is greatly reduced and your test is more geared on the way you try to survive. As for the tunnels, you could consider what the screen says when you attempt enter the cave, if it tells you, "leaving region X" it is not allowed. Looking forward to post DLC 6 for more of this run
Rabbit hat on day 1 or 2, that's pretty lucky but still I think you should be allowed to use whatever the region offers as advantages. It won't make a big difference for you anyway since you already did runs with only craftable or naked run, etc, so you'll manage anyway with or without special loot. And if region don't have advantages, the challenge would be pretty repetitive. 1:00:00 You didn't have to "risk it", you already had a torch ;) I get triggered whenever you pass time instead of preparing mushrooms, rose hip and birch :D So many rabbit on so little days, I remember struggling to get enough for my gloves and hat on timberwolf mountain.
I agree with other comments that all loot is fair game. Every zone will have some advantages. In TWM you might get container loot and in AC you will get 2 arrow heads (dont remember if you need a knife to craft a bow) It makes no sense to add additional rules to every zone when you start it and will make it just more complicated As for the caves I say you can only enter the ones that stay same zone in the log. So one cave will be usable only from one zone
I think you should do snares on this challenge, they could be really strong. It´s renewable food, and getting a couple of rabbits every day basically allows for indefinite survival.
@Zaknafein I thought breaking down a ruined snare yielded you back the reclaimed wood. And assuming enough rabbits, replacing the cured gut to make a new one should be a non-issue. 😎
Hi Zak, love the videos. My opinion to the questions you've asked in the video: I don't think you should be allowed to enter connecting caves and mines. This makes it a bit more difficult a challenge for someone who's already an excellent TLD player. I do however believe that you should be allowed to use any item you find in the area to which you are restricted. If not, all zones become more similar and therefore repetitive to watch. If you have a chance at finding a hacksaw in TM, use it, it's awesome and will make the run different from a Blackrock run or a FM run.
About the topic what you can Use in what region. You should use what you find. Maybe this makes some regions „easier“ than others… than it is so. But I am not sure that is true, because there are more ups and downs between the regions than the loot. And speaking from a survival point, no one in a survival situation finds a hacksaw and think „nah, that helps me too much, I will leave it behind…“
Just what I've been waiting for.. thx for the fast response @zak... Was asking cuz I'd like to learn the regions better without doing my own work 😅.. Been watching DDR for single region survivor, but got frustrated so fast cuz he don't know what he's doing compared to u.. Can't wait to watch..❤😊 👍 Edit while watching.. If u find it in the region it's urs to use.
I think finding a lucky Mackinaw would make it a great run. And a lot of fun. :) Leaving it behind and go the way of forced suffering only pleases those that like to watch others suffer. I'd hope you rob them of their joy, every time.
I think it’d be fun if the shelters deteriorated over time and you can repair them with sticks or logs or metal. Leave a place too long and it becomes too taken over by snow.
That cave on the river near the Birch Forest and Thomson's Crossing is my favorite place to base up in PV. Close access to the work bench at the Barn, possible bear spawns in the bear forest or just up above past the Derelict Cabins, and that grass bed saves my bedroll. :)
Hi, Thanks as always. Just a FYI: In at least two streams now I have watched you loot the kitchen in the Community Centre in Thompsons Crossing and bypassed two of the upper cabinets in the kitchen. So many fire barrels in this zone for eternal fire, in fact someone did a can you live forever in TLD and decided that you could in PV, but it would be an eternal fire, naked run (you would run out of cloth), and an eternal loop of collecting rabbits from snares and picking up birch bark - I actually thought it was your challenge but I guess not. I think that chance spawns are fair game, and connector caves should be allowed. To standardise runs I would say use Developer Console to spawn in a hacksaw at the start off every region run where a hacksaw spawn is random rather than excluding them. Cheers, Kayos. - Possible Bedroll in Picnic Cave
I agree with everyone that you should take and use all the loot you get. As for connector caves I'd totally allow myself to go there in such challenge, but "leave [region]" prompt is a pretty solid argument to not do that.
Pleasant Valley and it's Farmhouse is probably the region and location, I spent most time in. I do remember Pleasant Valley being a bit annoying, when I was new to it, because one can easily get lost, during low visibility weather. But as soon as you know the region well, that is not an issue anymore. So now I do like the region. The only two things I find annoying, at the Farmhouse, are the fact that you need to go through a loading screen (originally two), to get to the workbench in the cellar and the incredibly loud rattling noises in the Farmhouse, during storms. Before they added those noises, it was my favorite base and I'm quite annoyed, that they added that. The stumbling around the farmhouse in the dark and accidentally walking upstairs, without noticing, was indeed hilarious. I totally agree with your love for the denser birch forest, in Pleasant Valley and your wish for a very densely forested area. I love dense forests, be it in reality or games. If you ever want to check out a game with a lot of beautiful forests, you might take a look at Kingdom Come - Deliverance. It also has some nice hunting mechanics.
I feel like it would still be worth it to craft a bow even if you can't forge. If only for ptarmigan hunting for broth with fire hardened arrows. Broth is great for stretching the limited food supplies like flour. Stews only use .05 flour and give pretty good calories. And the bow doesn't chase off the other birds so it makes hunting them much easer imo.
If you wanna know yes it's possible to survive a infinite amount of time in a region because of fishing but you would need the magnifying lens if you don't have it well you can't but anyways great vid as always
1:37:22 PV is by far the region I know best after playing literally more then 1000 hours Long Dark. But I never ever would find my way from the bunker to the cabin in a Night Blizzard… and I never ever have the balls to try it 😂…
I find this region really fun for spending lots of time exploring. I related too hard to the internal struggle of over-engineering something like you are with how to standardize this challenge in a game lol. I think your decision on what rules to follow will come down to what question you really want answered: "can you survive in one region only?" (spoiler alert, answer = yes...sort of...depends on region and vitC availability), or "how well can you survive in one region only?" (QoL being comparison point) There are a handful of things I think of as necessary to near-infinite survival in this game: mag lens, bedroll, workbench, hammer+forge, hacksaw (or axe if you have hammer+forge). If the transition from early game to mid/late game is considered that point where you now have a weapon to hunt large game (deer w/o wolves, bear, moose) and make full late-game clothing gear, then you could either decide not to allow items that transition you to mid/late game or you could set a run deadline for the region (e.g. 30-50 days like you mentioned in video) or just mile mark how long it takes to hit setup milestones. And then you accept the full extent (randomness and all) of what the region has to offer and judge/compare the regions based on how well equipped/setup you are by Day 30/50/whatever or how long it takes you to get to late game setup. Any options can be fun. Just gotta figure out what you'd enjoy most :) P.S. This challenge needs a feature like Don't Starve's Krampus where when you kill too many bunnies too quickly it attacks you 😂
IF you are unfamilliar with PV then I would suggest spending 50hrs just running around PV on Pilgrim or Voyager, you vvery quikly get used to a zone. That being said Misery is like WTF BUT at least you start at the same spot each run. For me its goto airplane and get 1 or 2 items, pop into the Bunker for the Makinjaw then to Draft Dodgers cabin, and head off to get the matches from the crossing
I think a lot of people don't know or forget about the 'bedroll' cave next to the waterfall in PV. (Zak included in this video) It has an internal waterfall you need to pass before you get to the dead end that AFAIK has a guaranteed bedroll. I think PV is one of the easiest regions for this challenge as it is very big, so you don't have to wait for the wildlife to respawn and of course you get the plane crash so you get a good chance for finding good clothes. A large amount of metal and cloth in this region to sustain your clothes and gear.
Definitely NOT guaranteed. It used to be, but in recent adventures it's been missing. Kycko's loot list (on Steam Community) says 29% chance, and I trust him.
I saw this video and thought it was a good idea so I decided to do it while watching your video and I spawned in the exact same place and I also heard that weird bear noise at the little market
To answer your question in standardizing, I believe that you play the region with what it has. If you spawn into TWM and you find a hacksaw, you have the containers at your disposal. That would be like dis-allowing any guaranteed matches and it just doesn't equate to me. If it's there, then use it. The only consideration I thought about is BI. If you spawn in the lower area,.is it acceptable to circle around to open the radio tower, only being allowed to directly travel to that portion of the region. I expect that to be a collective "no."
Great video! Pleasant Valley is definitely my favorite region in TLD. It’s great for having several little bases spread out, and for hunting. On another note, I say if you find something in a region then you should be able to use it. I don’t think you should punish yourself on a run for having good RNG
I feel you should be allowed to use whatever you find, and you should also be allowed to enter and loot connector caves and mines. On another note, you mentioned something about losing the canned corn ... um .... that was in your road to 500 days where you accidentally put a ruined canned corn into the travois you were loading at the mine area to take back to your base.... Love your stuff!
in terms of how many days to survive in each region, i think it would be cool to see how long it's possible (endless) but only to the point of hibernation. so like once theres less active activities to do and you're just gonna start passing time and sleeping (and whatever else happens when you hibernate) then just make like an educated guess of if it would be possible to live indefinitely or how long would be reasonable based on the supplies you have managed to gather, etc :)
1:11:00 You can drop meat in this section...how to call it, this place behind doors, but but before you enter the building. It degrades the same as completly outdoors. I tested it
Great video ,Zac, I think if you're a beginner like me ,it's best to play on custom,take out every animal except the deer and the bear,and just explore the whole map without fear of wolves,etc but once you become an expert like yourself,then add all the animals to the game,right?😊😊
My first thought about transition caves was "if and only if the log tells that you enter another region, then this transition caves should be out of scope". The more I think about it, such a rule puts kind of stress in general on the player - consider you being followed by a wolf, you enter a cave and it turns out the log tells it's a different region. So what, are you obliged to leave (a) immediately and (b) into the predator at the cave entrance? It would feel unfair, especially that rule would kind of demand that player knows upfront which transition caves belong to which region to intentionally avoiding entering such a cave when followed by a wolf. So my vote goes for either (1) allow all transition caves fully (with looting etc) but deny exit at the other end or at least (2) allow to enter, move and stay/sleep in all transition caves with only looting allowed if the transition caves belongs to the same region.
Interesting thoughts about RNG. As a viewer/player, I say loot and use everything. If your goal is specifically figuring out how long you can survive on a region's resources, then why not just use what drops are guaranteed and leave out all the luck? I'm not sure it'd be as fun or interesting, but you'd have a big ol lucky trophy case at the end at least.
I feel that caves that connects you should use the loot and any un guaranteed.stuff of course should be used! Thats the whole point, its random,. so you.use what you are given. Also, when you were stumbling around in the dark Inwas talking outloud to the TV! You had so many matches, you could have just lit a torch and then the fire and cooked all the raw rabbit that you had! Anyway, you do you! I love watching and I'm hanging out for the mext instalment of Misery. But its probably that I'm waiting for that that I'm catching up on some older stuff! I hope your injury has gotten better.
I feel whatever you find in that region is fair game so if you find a hammer on airfield go ahead and make weapons/tools and a hacksaw for crates etc. its a part of that map and the name of the game is to stay on that region so i think its fair, transition caves however no I view them as kinda mini transition regions if that makes sense. All up, caves are a no go but anything within the region is fair game.
Thanks for all the great content! I think using hacksaws would be fair - cause there is always the chance to find it. But maybe try to go for 30 days survival? cause i enjoy watching you explore a map to the fullest! if you want to make a series out of it just set a time goal of survival - with rules of like good clothing at least or anything to have a ruleset and a goal to achieve - wether it may be timespecific or maybe gearspecific like have decent cloth - 10.000 calories in reserve or something like that :)
I think that if you use a random spawn, you should be able to use anything and everything that you find in that region. To me, that's only fair since you spawned randomly and can't leave.
In my opinion part of the challenge is already chance: where do you spawn, when, etc. So chance spawns should count, that is part of the game. Otherwise you'd have to make a list of usable things per region. I mean, let's keep it reasonable and simple :)
Since you are in the field, more or less: you want a pragmatic trial, not a supercontrolled one. The answer to the question "how long can you survive in a single region" or equivalent has to factor in the differences between the regions, that is just how the regions are. So you have a guaranteed mackinaw in HRV but no way of repairing it. That's part of the experiment, if you start controlling what you can and cannot use it's not about "how long can you survive" but it's about "can you survive with this predefined allowed loot", which is a different question.
I have one in desolation point. Interloper. Day 33. Have made deer pants and crampons. Found hacksaw but no hammer. I’m out of matches now and only have 6 marine flares left 😬
The cave system isn't Mystery Lake either, though. "Carter Hydro Dam and Environs" is actually the official name for the transition region, which Winding River is just a subregion of. This technically also means that the dam itself is part of Winding River, not Mystery Lake. Of course, what you make of that is up to you.
Great challenge, IMO connecting caves should be off limit because you prompt a ''leave the region'' As for the rest it's fair game. I played that challenge to learn maps on stalker.. Do you think Cougars will spawn in Ravine or small connection area? Thank you for your dedication to the game and community and as always best wishes to you and familly. Cheers!
@Zaknafein I think they might mean 'caves' like the ash canyon gold mine, both entrance/exit lead back into ash canyon. not sure of any other caves that work like that though, maybe the secret aurora cave too
standardising the resources in the way you're considering would take away the interesting part which is the different regions and their nuances, imho :)
I think using whatever you find is fair game! I mean, that's part of the challenge, isn't it? Every region is different it's part of your luck. I also think transition caves should be off limits OR should only be considered part of one region and not the other (whatever it says on the log/map tab).
Random loot, if a possibility of spawning in that region, should be allowed. It's not the same as glitch loot that shouldn't be there in the interloper difficulty imo.
Secondary thought when thinking about using the connecting cave systems: Could that not potentially reset the cougar? Might be best to avoid connecting cave systems until the community has done some testing if you want to see if the cougar will trigger.
i would consider connector regions the same region,,in death stalker the toxin fog is in connector region same as the region you just left,, this is what i recall
Hacksaw/rabbit hat etc> personally I feel if you find something in a region you should be able to use it, otherwise I feel it starts to become “difficult for the sake of difficulty” misery-fest, rather than creating something that both you and the viewer are enjoying, but YMMV.
Yeah, use all loot. I mean if you were on a coast would you omit things washed ashore? Nah, you would want to be able to use em
Agreed. At some point you're not 'playing the game' anymore.
I agree!
I agree
I agree. At that point it is difficulty for difficulty's sake - which I personally find not enjoyable to watch.
Connector caves and ALL of the loot you find should be allowed, IMO. Take care and I enjoy your channel so much!
connector caves are seperate. iMO
A wise man once said "You play the game the way you want to play the game. There is no right or wrong way to play." So, if I'm playing this challenge, I would keep it quite simple. Any and all connector mines, caves, bunkers, etc. are fair game and in play. I don't care what the game displays as you enter, as long as you have not entered a new region, you are good. If I spawned in Pleasant Valley, I would not be able to enter Winding River, Timberwolf Mountain, Coastal Highway, or Keeper's Pass. As for items found, if I found them, they are in play. If I have the DLC, then those additional items are in play.
Sounds like wise words!
@@Zaknafein Very wise.
I also liked the way Athenon did it where he had to survive 50 days in every zone and couldn't go back(unless he had to run through it to the next zone but he wasn't allowed to touch anything). And when he goes to the next zone he can only take his full pack full of gear and not be in the red and everything else was abandoned. Should also use anything you find because random chance and luck are part of the game.
Wonzandonly has done it too. I like his cavalier attitude that somehow seems to come off!
3:05:20
Astrid: "I think my stomach is eating itself 😢"
Zak: "...so as I was saying about how much food I have"
Knowing what does and doesn't spawn in regions kind of removes the thrill and unpredictability that the long dark perfected as a survival game. Many things are based on RNG even if you restrict loot.
Every element in the game is supposed to be used to its fullest potential, so allow yourself everything you find!
I’d say connector caves and whatever you find is fair game. Feels more organic and also approachable as a challenge.
Key question on which gear to use and which not:
As a not so frequent player, how shall I know which matches are guaranteed and which not, which hacksaw is always there and which not?
To make conditions equal for all players, how experienced they ever are, the only answer to your question is that ALL findings are allowed to use.
Good point
To be fair i was about to make the same comment but then i saw yours so thank you ❤😂😂
Im trying to figure out how zak can walk around with all of the stink bars and yet not a single predators cares yet I take one piece of cooked meat out side and every predator within 3 regions tells me how they feel about it lol. This is good please keep this challenge going because I want to do this after I get the 500 days achievement, im currently on day 402 on my 2nd interloper run.
The hacksaw is almost always (75%) somewhere in TWM so it would be weird to disallow it. I think that rule makes more sense for things like the Maglens and hammer(at least in the regions where those are rare finds.) Also random matches are very powerful in FM as otherwise you only have 2 guaranteed flares.
One nice thing about the hacksaw in certain regions is access to a lot more metal for fishing hooks. Although you also need a prybar or hammer for clearing the fishing holes and those aren't renewable long term(unless you have both the hacksaw and hammer.) For that reason I think the "infinite survival" portion of this challenge is usually going to be naked scurvy + rabbit trapping.
By the way, I don't know if you're interested in this but one version of this challenge is to play normally for 50 days, then outlaw anything that's non-renewable. This simulates the extreme lategame where you've used all the resources, and you can play for just ~20 more days and track stocks of food/fuel/etc to see if it's sustainable. Obviously much easier in regions with beachcombing+workbench as that's the only way to have renewable clothing.
Wow Zak, you must have been practicing your aim, accuracy was off the charts this video!
On another note, ddrjake also did a whole series called “single region survivor” that was really awesome to watch. Sorry if I shouldn’t have posted that here
No thats fine, shoutouts to other TLD creators always welcome
@@Zaknafein Zak you are a really chill and humble guy. Thanks for all you do for this community
@@Jiraiya_9142 Seconded! I've spent many hours cooking or washing up (IRL) while enjoying your videos.
I feel like this is a good challenge for learning a region
Thats a really good idea
To survive, you have to use whatever resources are available to you. In my opinion, that includes resources in connecting caves and mines, (just don't exit the other side), as well as any loot you find. After all, how many regions have a guaranteed hacksaw spawn? So if you find one, use it!
You do need a hacksaw after a deer kill by a wolf. There isn't an incision, although you'd think there should be.
ADDED NOTE: Your character doesn't know about things like rng or guaranteed or not, etc, so just do what you gotta do lol
i agree, getting everything you can get your hands on is fair game. just saying if this were real life and you were stuck in the wilderness in one area you would try to get everything you can.
I'd love to see these as a series after the update. I've been following your advice on building map knowledge. I've been playing at Stalker for some time, but never felt like I REALLY knew where I was or how to navigate to safety when caught out in bad weather. I lost several runs to freezing because of this. I always admired your map knowledge and remembered your advice to spend 30 days in each region to learning it. I started a new Voyager run and I'm spending 30 days in each specifically to build my region memory. I'm also concentrating on the bow. I've always relied on firearms, but on these runs I'm using the bow. I made my first wolf and bear kills with it and it was empowering. Thanks for your sage advice and entertainment.
I’ve been hoarding potatoes until I get the recipe for Coastal Fishcakes. In my opinion those fishcakes are one of the strongest in the game.
When I do one region challenges, I don't allow entrance into transition caves. The dam is an exception because the transition notification to Winding River doesn't pop until you're going down the stairs outside of the dam, which allows looting of the dam itself if the starting zone is ML (and I use custom to set my starting zones). If a new zone pops, the run is over under my rule set.
Also under my rule set, anything found within the zone is fair to use whether or not it is guaranteed or random. Survival is challenging but generally not brutal once a person gets used to just using rocks (now that one can harvest rabbits again without a weapon). It's the unique and rare chance items that add some variety into each region.
The cougar may or may not make any difference. In my mind, it depends on how long a player has to be in the zone before it makes an appearance. The short 10-day ones almost certainly will never see a cougar. Once they do become interested in the player I'm anticipating that they will be impossible to just avoid while staying in the zone and, of course, killing one would be impossible. Looking forward to it.
i think anything that spawns is fair game, rare loot chance or not. RNG is a part of gaming, and it feels more enjoyable to use yourr luck to your advantage when possible. i dont think we need to start trying to standardize things because honestly each region is different and we should lean into that, embrace the advantages and disadvantages that each region possesses. looking forward to the series!
I like the idea of this challenge, but needing to map the region before you can leave. This would force you to go outside instead of hibernating 50 days.
If you don't find a hammer then survival isn't indefinite because of having to break the ice to fish. Eventually your crowbar will be done with no ability to repair it.
fish hooks eventualy break as well
You are technically correct..which is the best kind of correct 😉
But you will run out of ways to break the ice long before you are out of scrap for hooks.
Either way yes not infinite. Yay birch bark.🎉
As I kept watching the video, I noticed is says "leave pleasant valley" when you entered the connecting cave to the dam. In my opinion that's clear enough that connecting areas are not part of the areas they connect... Otherwise you wouldn't have this "leave" message. There's nothing like that when you enter a cave in HR or the mine in Desolation point
I once survived 180-something days in TM on interloper, which to be fair did include the summit. I'm pretty sure I could've survived forever, that region is so easy(and fun). Eventually I just got bored and left lol.
I like the item randomness. Heck, my main interloper run had a hunting knife spawn in error and I use it. It’s my most prized possession 😂
Oh and for the connector caves i think they should be allowed from both sides. And there is a good reason for it: if you have to stay „forever“ in one region, you are probably not able to stay in a connector cave, which imho define them as „NOT a region“ so technically you are not entering a „new“ region by going into a mine.
You can harvest more meat by hand if you first harvest the smallest amount and take the penalty on that. Then you can harvest the remaining meat without penalty.
Did this sort of challenge years ago when Timberwolf Mountain first came out. I only every played Stalker, but it was a fun challenge filling up the hut.
I decided to play along with this one. Initially I was going to run through the connector caves for coal. When I got there I was reminded of the text that appears in the center of the screen when entering the cave: "Leave Pleasant Valley". That makes it seem wrong so I noped out 😅
I think both special items and caves should be allowed. Would be great to have a tips/strategies video on mid/late game working around resource constraints. How do you work around a wolf pack spawn when you out of matches, no knife, no hatchet, no bow? I guess the late game of lot of runs will end up being a perma-fire near a fishing hole and rabbit spawn if you have a bed roll. When the cougar mechanic hits maybe the escape challenge is you can't leave a region until you encounter the cougar?
Some of the connector caves give a "Leaving [region]" message when you enter them. I think those should be off limits but the others are fair game.
I would prefer you make use of lucky finds as that gives the runs more variety.
29:44 Now I'm imagining Zak running around with a pair of deer legs like the deer version of a satyr.
I chuckled at the use of his comment about deer legs!! 😂
I think you can use whatever you find. For such experienced player as You, Zak, you know which one has chance, which is guaranteed... For me, they are not possible to distinguish... I believe, luck is also part of this game. If you have bad luck... you won't survive ;) It is not an science experiment, so we don't have to have same conditions :D
My cat really likes the intro music to your video! Just saying... (also, he hates it when he hears the Long Dark wolves howl). PS: you've inspired me to try this challenge. PPS:I started in HRV, no workbench so no crafted clothes😮
Give your cat a hug from me
I agree with the heavy forest area. I'd really like more of that too. It would feel a little more realistic if there were some heavily forested areas.
I get the standardizing, but to me, so much of the game is randomized, that the challenge is just: how long can YOU survive in the region YOU get, with the loot YOU get. As in, these game challenges are more so for the individual player, not just in general.
How long Zak can survive in PV is a diff challenge than how long I can survive bc we’re totally different players who will make diff choices and get dealt diff rng. So, I think any loot you find is 100% fair game (literally)! You could find 6 boxes of matches but never find a good coat…you’ll always have certain advantages and other disadvantages.
What if, for science, you use the MOD that you use to do the fly overs, and give yourself and set load out of gear for each run,
one hammer,
one hacksaw,
one bed roll and so on,
level the playing field so that RNG is greatly reduced and your test is more geared on the way you try to survive.
As for the tunnels, you could consider what the screen says when you attempt enter the cave, if it tells you, "leaving region X" it is not allowed.
Looking forward to post DLC 6 for more of this run
Great idea about the leaving part
Rabbit hat on day 1 or 2, that's pretty lucky but still I think you should be allowed to use whatever the region offers as advantages. It won't make a big difference for you anyway since you already did runs with only craftable or naked run, etc, so you'll manage anyway with or without special loot. And if region don't have advantages, the challenge would be pretty repetitive.
1:00:00 You didn't have to "risk it", you already had a torch ;)
I get triggered whenever you pass time instead of preparing mushrooms, rose hip and birch :D
So many rabbit on so little days, I remember struggling to get enough for my gloves and hat on timberwolf mountain.
I agree with other comments that all loot is fair game. Every zone will have some advantages. In TWM you might get container loot and in AC you will get 2 arrow heads (dont remember if you need a knife to craft a bow)
It makes no sense to add additional rules to every zone when you start it and will make it just more complicated
As for the caves I say you can only enter the ones that stay same zone in the log. So one cave will be usable only from one zone
I think you should do snares on this challenge, they could be really strong. It´s renewable food, and getting a couple of rabbits every day basically allows for indefinite survival.
Yes though eventually you run out of reclaimed wood
@Zaknafein I thought breaking down a ruined snare yielded you back the reclaimed wood.
And assuming enough rabbits, replacing the cured gut to make a new one should be a non-issue. 😎
@@wildernessrick9278 maybe it does haha. I almost never use them
Hi Zak, love the videos. My opinion to the questions you've asked in the video:
I don't think you should be allowed to enter connecting caves and mines. This makes it a bit more difficult a challenge for someone who's already an excellent TLD player.
I do however believe that you should be allowed to use any item you find in the area to which you are restricted. If not, all zones become more similar and therefore repetitive to watch. If you have a chance at finding a hacksaw in TM, use it, it's awesome and will make the run different from a Blackrock run or a FM run.
About the topic what you can Use in what region. You should use what you find. Maybe this makes some regions „easier“ than others… than it is so. But I am not sure that is true, because there are more ups and downs between the regions than the loot.
And speaking from a survival point, no one in a survival situation finds a hacksaw and think „nah, that helps me too much, I will leave it behind…“
lol true
I approve of using connector areas/caves. Also using rare random chance items.
Just what I've been waiting for.. thx for the fast response @zak... Was asking cuz I'd like to learn the regions better without doing my own work 😅..
Been watching DDR for single region survivor, but got frustrated so fast cuz he don't know what he's doing compared to u..
Can't wait to watch..❤😊 👍
Edit while watching..
If u find it in the region it's urs to use.
I think finding a lucky Mackinaw would make it a great run. And a lot of fun. :) Leaving it behind and go the way of forced suffering only pleases those that like to watch others suffer. I'd hope you rob them of their joy, every time.
I think it’d be fun if the shelters deteriorated over time and you can repair them with sticks or logs or metal. Leave a place too long and it becomes too taken over by snow.
Related, have you seen the lengths some players will go through to patch the hole in the timberwolf mountain lodge? XD
Will be even more interesting after cougar appears in game
That cave on the river near the Birch Forest and Thomson's Crossing is my favorite place to base up in PV. Close access to the work bench at the Barn, possible bear spawns in the bear forest or just up above past the Derelict Cabins, and that grass bed saves my bedroll. :)
Hi, Thanks as always.
Just a FYI: In at least two streams now I have watched you loot the kitchen in the Community Centre in Thompsons Crossing and bypassed two of the upper cabinets in the kitchen. So many fire barrels in this zone for eternal fire, in fact someone did a can you live forever in TLD and decided that you could in PV, but it would be an eternal fire, naked run (you would run out of cloth), and an eternal loop of collecting rabbits from snares and picking up birch bark - I actually thought it was your challenge but I guess not.
I think that chance spawns are fair game, and connector caves should be allowed. To standardise runs I would say use Developer Console to spawn in a hacksaw at the start off every region run where a hacksaw spawn is random rather than excluding them.
Cheers, Kayos.
- Possible Bedroll in Picnic Cave
1:48:52 Zak exposes himself to The Long Dark by dropping his trousers.
The scandal!
I probably spend most of my time in Coastal Highway. Kept spawning there in my earlier playthroughs. Great region for self-sufficiency.
YES YES FINALLY I WAS HOPING TO GET SOMEONE TO DO MORE OF THIS
I agree with everyone that you should take and use all the loot you get.
As for connector caves I'd totally allow myself to go there in such challenge, but "leave [region]" prompt is a pretty solid argument to not do that.
Pleasant Valley and it's Farmhouse is probably the region and location, I spent most time in. I do remember Pleasant Valley being a bit annoying, when I was new to it, because one can easily get lost, during low visibility weather. But as soon as you know the region well, that is not an issue anymore. So now I do like the region. The only two things I find annoying, at the Farmhouse, are the fact that you need to go through a loading screen (originally two), to get to the workbench in the cellar and the incredibly loud rattling noises in the Farmhouse, during storms. Before they added those noises, it was my favorite base and I'm quite annoyed, that they added that.
The stumbling around the farmhouse in the dark and accidentally walking upstairs, without noticing, was indeed hilarious.
I totally agree with your love for the denser birch forest, in Pleasant Valley and your wish for a very densely forested area. I love dense forests, be it in reality or games.
If you ever want to check out a game with a lot of beautiful forests, you might take a look at Kingdom Come - Deliverance. It also has some nice hunting mechanics.
I feel like it would still be worth it to craft a bow even if you can't forge. If only for ptarmigan hunting for broth with fire hardened arrows. Broth is great for stretching the limited food supplies like flour. Stews only use .05 flour and give pretty good calories. And the bow doesn't chase off the other birds so it makes hunting them much easer imo.
Thats true
You need a knife to make both the bow and fire arrows so would have to forge first anyway.
@@mh060168 Oops. You're 100% correct. I forgot about that. Good call.
If you wanna know yes it's possible to survive a infinite amount of time in a region because of fishing but you would need the magnifying lens if you don't have it well you can't but anyways great vid as always
Its possible without the mag lens but its tricky
1:37:22 PV is by far the region I know best after playing literally more then 1000 hours Long Dark. But I never ever would find my way from the bunker to the cabin in a Night Blizzard… and I never ever have the balls to try it 😂…
I find this region really fun for spending lots of time exploring. I related too hard to the internal struggle of over-engineering something like you are with how to standardize this challenge in a game lol.
I think your decision on what rules to follow will come down to what question you really want answered: "can you survive in one region only?" (spoiler alert, answer = yes...sort of...depends on region and vitC availability), or "how well can you survive in one region only?" (QoL being comparison point)
There are a handful of things I think of as necessary to near-infinite survival in this game: mag lens, bedroll, workbench, hammer+forge, hacksaw (or axe if you have hammer+forge). If the transition from early game to mid/late game is considered that point where you now have a weapon to hunt large game (deer w/o wolves, bear, moose) and make full late-game clothing gear, then you could either decide not to allow items that transition you to mid/late game or you could set a run deadline for the region (e.g. 30-50 days like you mentioned in video) or just mile mark how long it takes to hit setup milestones. And then you accept the full extent (randomness and all) of what the region has to offer and judge/compare the regions based on how well equipped/setup you are by Day 30/50/whatever or how long it takes you to get to late game setup. Any options can be fun. Just gotta figure out what you'd enjoy most :)
P.S. This challenge needs a feature like Don't Starve's Krampus where when you kill too many bunnies too quickly it attacks you
😂
Can't wait to see you play misery mode and face off against some cougars 😊.
This sounds like fun. I play on Xbox so I can't really juggle the outcome. On console we're very limited to what we can manipulate. Good luck Zak.
Using this to help with my pleasant valley misery runs, got a lot to learn about the region!
IF you are unfamilliar with PV then I would suggest spending 50hrs just running around PV on Pilgrim or Voyager, you vvery quikly get used to a zone. That being said Misery is like WTF BUT at least you start at the same spot each run. For me its goto airplane and get 1 or 2 items, pop into the Bunker for the Makinjaw then to Draft Dodgers cabin, and head off to get the matches from the crossing
I think a lot of people don't know or forget about the 'bedroll' cave next to the waterfall in PV. (Zak included in this video) It has an internal waterfall you need to pass before you get to the dead end that AFAIK has a guaranteed bedroll.
I think PV is one of the easiest regions for this challenge as it is very big, so you don't have to wait for the wildlife to respawn and of course you get the plane crash so you get a good chance for finding good clothes. A large amount of metal and cloth in this region to sustain your clothes and gear.
Definitely NOT guaranteed. It used to be, but in recent adventures it's been missing. Kycko's loot list (on Steam Community) says 29% chance, and I trust him.
Hey Zac, Keep up the great Videos. Whenever I come back to the game you're my go to for guides and background gameplay.
It would be interesting to have a standardized setup until day 50, and afterwards high tier chance spawns can be used.
I saw this video and thought it was a good idea so I decided to do it while watching your video and I spawned in the exact same place and I also heard that weird bear noise at the little market
Talking about noise... I don't like the sound the tactical backpack does.. sounds like a wolf sometimes..
@@vincedige2727thank you…
@@AmplifyChris you're welcome?!?
@@vincedige2727 I thought I am the only one who get always scared when I open the inventory in the game… thank you for mention it.
To answer your question in standardizing, I believe that you play the region with what it has. If you spawn into TWM and you find a hacksaw, you have the containers at your disposal. That would be like dis-allowing any guaranteed matches and it just doesn't equate to me. If it's there, then use it.
The only consideration I thought about is BI. If you spawn in the lower area,.is it acceptable to circle around to open the radio tower, only being allowed to directly travel to that portion of the region. I expect that to be a collective "no."
The in-region route is terrifyingly long and treacherous XD
Great video! Pleasant Valley is definitely my favorite region in TLD. It’s great for having several little bases spread out, and for hunting. On another note, I say if you find something in a region then you should be able to use it. I don’t think you should punish yourself on a run for having good RNG
I used to like PV until I realized how often it had blizzards 😅 highest frequency in Great Bear, if I'm not mistaken
I feel you should be allowed to use whatever you find, and you should also be allowed to enter and loot connector caves and mines. On another note, you mentioned something about losing the canned corn ... um .... that was in your road to 500 days where you accidentally put a ruined canned corn into the travois you were loading at the mine area to take back to your base.... Love your stuff!
You missed the skillet on the tall cabinet in the community hall kitchen.
in terms of how many days to survive in each region, i think it would be cool to see how long it's possible (endless) but only to the point of hibernation. so like once theres less active activities to do and you're just gonna start passing time and sleeping (and whatever else happens when you hibernate) then just make like an educated guess of if it would be possible to live indefinitely or how long would be reasonable based on the supplies you have managed to gather, etc :)
I was doing that for every region and most fun was Forlorm Muskeg i think. You need to be lucky tho with hammer and hacksaw spawn :D
1:11:00 You can drop meat in this section...how to call it, this place behind doors, but but before you enter the building. It degrades the same as completly outdoors. I tested it
Great video ,Zac, I think if you're a beginner like me ,it's best to play on custom,take out every animal except the deer and the bear,and just explore the whole map without fear of wolves,etc but once you become an expert like yourself,then add all the animals to the game,right?😊😊
This is what I used to do and it’s a completely valid way to learn and play!
Luck is part of survival. Use whatever you find :)
My first thought about transition caves was "if and only if the log tells that you enter another region, then this transition caves should be out of scope".
The more I think about it, such a rule puts kind of stress in general on the player - consider you being followed by a wolf, you enter a cave and it turns out the log tells it's a different region. So what, are you obliged to leave (a) immediately and (b) into the predator at the cave entrance? It would feel unfair, especially that rule would kind of demand that player knows upfront which transition caves belong to which region to intentionally avoiding entering such a cave when followed by a wolf.
So my vote goes for either
(1) allow all transition caves fully (with looting etc) but deny exit at the other end or
at least (2) allow to enter, move and stay/sleep in all transition caves with only looting allowed if the transition caves belongs to the same region.
Interesting thoughts about RNG. As a viewer/player, I say loot and use everything. If your goal is specifically figuring out how long you can survive on a region's resources, then why not just use what drops are guaranteed and leave out all the luck? I'm not sure it'd be as fun or interesting, but you'd have a big ol lucky trophy case at the end at least.
I feel that caves that connects you should use the loot and any un guaranteed.stuff of course should be used! Thats the whole point, its random,. so you.use what you are given.
Also, when you were stumbling around in the dark Inwas talking outloud to the TV! You had so many matches, you could have just lit a torch and then the fire and cooked all the raw rabbit that you had! Anyway, you do you! I love watching and I'm hanging out for the mext instalment of Misery. But its probably that I'm waiting for that that I'm catching up on some older stuff! I hope your injury has gotten better.
I feel whatever you find in that region is fair game so if you find a hammer on airfield go ahead and make weapons/tools and a hacksaw for crates etc. its a part of that map and the name of the game is to stay on that region so i think its fair, transition caves however no I view them as kinda mini transition regions if that makes sense. All up, caves are a no go but anything within the region is fair game.
Watching you try to find your way with pants had me dying lmao
Thanks for all the great content! I think using hacksaws would be fair - cause there is always the chance to find it.
But maybe try to go for 30 days survival? cause i enjoy watching you explore a map to the fullest! if you want to make a series out of it just set a time goal of survival - with rules of like good clothing at least or anything to have a ruleset and a goal to achieve - wether it may be timespecific or maybe gearspecific like have decent cloth - 10.000 calories in reserve or something like that :)
I think that if you use a random spawn, you should be able to use anything and everything that you find in that region. To me, that's only fair since you spawned randomly and can't leave.
In my opinion part of the challenge is already chance: where do you spawn, when, etc. So chance spawns should count, that is part of the game. Otherwise you'd have to make a list of usable things per region. I mean, let's keep it reasonable and simple :)
Since you are in the field, more or less: you want a pragmatic trial, not a supercontrolled one. The answer to the question "how long can you survive in a single region" or equivalent has to factor in the differences between the regions, that is just how the regions are. So you have a guaranteed mackinaw in HRV but no way of repairing it. That's part of the experiment, if you start controlling what you can and cannot use it's not about "how long can you survive" but it's about "can you survive with this predefined allowed loot", which is a different question.
50:00 yes, if a wolf kills a deer you dont have to make a incision anymore
2:50:21 Perhaps a 'Campfire Chat' on recipes? A tier list video would be great.
BladesTLD has a good video about it
22:51... apart from a whole new region, yes you're right.
Fantastic challenge, please, do more 👍👍👍
I have one in desolation point. Interloper. Day 33. Have made deer pants and crampons. Found hacksaw but no hammer. I’m out of matches now and only have 6 marine flares left 😬
There is the shore looting after blizzards for more flares.
@@AmplifyChris I’m hoping to find a flare or something beach combing before I run out of time ⌛️ 😂
There's a stove in Idle Camp in Zone of Contamination.
The cave system isn't Mystery Lake either, though. "Carter Hydro Dam and Environs" is actually the official name for the transition region, which Winding River is just a subregion of. This technically also means that the dam itself is part of Winding River, not Mystery Lake. Of course, what you make of that is up to you.
Missing the code word for watching till point X... 😊
I think we could use a double barrel, cause theyre adding a new predator so new gun would be usefull
Hi, perhaps checking the archery target near the red barn would yield you some arrows? Making a bow, then, could make the run more satisfying.
They dont spawn on interloper :)
Great challenge, IMO connecting caves should be off limit because you prompt a ''leave the region'' As for the rest it's fair game. I played that challenge to learn maps on stalker.. Do you think Cougars will spawn in Ravine or small connection area? Thank you for your dedication to the game and community and as always best wishes to you and familly. Cheers!
Thank you so much! Not sure about the cougars and connectors - have to see. My guess is that it doesnt go there.
Rare loot yes as it's spawns in the region but only cave that connect back to the same region you came from not to a new region.
Can you clarify what you meant with that second part? Most caves leads both ways
@Zaknafein I think they might mean 'caves' like the ash canyon gold mine, both entrance/exit lead back into ash canyon. not sure of any other caves that work like that though, maybe the secret aurora cave too
15:39 I'm pretty sure canned corn only appears in Signal Void bunkers and the Far Territory.
Used to be, but they are on the main island too. Just rare.
Looking forward to you dlc update 5 play through in the future
standardising the resources in the way you're considering would take away the interesting part which is the different regions and their nuances, imho :)
I think using whatever you find is fair game! I mean, that's part of the challenge, isn't it? Every region is different it's part of your luck. I also think transition caves should be off limits OR should only be considered part of one region and not the other (whatever it says on the log/map tab).
Random loot, if a possibility of spawning in that region, should be allowed. It's not the same as glitch loot that shouldn't be there in the interloper difficulty imo.
Secondary thought when thinking about using the connecting cave systems: Could that not potentially reset the cougar? Might be best to avoid connecting cave systems until the community has done some testing if you want to see if the cougar will trigger.
Good point
I've come across a bed roll at three farm a few times
i would consider connector regions the same region,,in death stalker the toxin fog is in connector region same as the region you just left,, this is what i recall