Do not advertise the game, the company with keep supporting Russian aggression against Ukraine. Advertising games of these companies = support of Russian terrorism!
I really wanted him to talk about Web of Shadows swinging.. The webs don't attach to buildings but the swinging feels so good and it does require skills.
It doesn't attach to buildings, but it crucially *still* attaches, even if it's to the sky. It's still 100% physics based. Less realistic, but still fun and beautiful, capturing the Spider-Man experience pretty well
The speed issue has actually been explained by insomniac as a streaming issue, the PS4 couldn't handle loading so much detail when speeds got too high so they limited his maximum speed. In the remaster they did increase his speed but only slightly. With Spiderman 2 coming exclusively to PS5 the issue will likely be gone and the speed and momentum issues you stated will probably be gone.
It won't, the PC mods already proven it. 2018 it had a speed of 1, their plan is to upgrade to 2, which has already shown to be not even close to older games' speed, which were somewhat closer from 3 to 4, and even then that won't change the fact the game doesn't have physics, so making it faster won't fix an issue that anyone can do now with the mods. Now the least they can do is raise the speed.
@@radrno7 For most mods it felt like you were flying across the city. The moment Peter let’s go of the webs he’s halfway across another building. That’s not all the mods just some.
I think it's a shame you didn't mention Web Of Shadow's web swinging system, since I consider it to be just as good as SM2's system. The webs themselves I think are the best part, they feel so elasticky and visually look amazing, while the physics are refined while still feeling realistic
fr Web of Shadows always had an amazing web swinging and wall sliding movements that makes you want to practice how you maneuver quickly to buildings and enemies, god I miss wall combat and it's unique combat system aswell. I hope the sequel adds that or perhaps shows more of it's new unique moves
@@inkchariot6147 im so glad you guys mention the knee-sliding mechanic when you go up and down buildings. it genuinely feels like a pro-skater move and its amazing.
I think it's a shame Web of Shadows wasn't mentioned. It's web slinging system and more importantly Peter's movement on the walls and air is fantastic.
I still remember I use to to that same sliding animation in real when I was kid. It's soooo good. There was a rotating puch animation too that was also coool
I think having the freedom to swing any way you want is a great feature as it allows you to do cool moves on your own instead of being able to swing and do some generic move intended by the game but I hope they improve it in the next game
That's why real-time physics based swinging is so much better. It presents some challenge and reward by releasing the swing too late, too early or spot on.
@@Blueslyfox But it's still a gimmick that gets old quickly. Like how many times can you watch Miles open his phone while falling before you get bored? Physics-based swinging is superior, as literally every swing is unique since it depends on your location in space relative to the building, the forces acting on you, e.g. gravity, momentum, etc.
@@fernandowong371 Yup, outside the tricks the game still has the core issue the previous game had. It barely feels like I'm in the shoes of Spider-Man and rather the game is partly being Spider-Man whilst I'm just there for the ride
The one thing I think makes the whole, "just hold forward and R2 and spiderman will do it for you" in Spider-Man PS4 because Peter isn't just going to let himself smack into a wall, he's been Spider-Man for 8 years, he's skilled, which makes it seem more immersive and flow better than if he just slammed into a wall like an idiot. But I get that people want to have a challenge.
came to this video right here just to say that they added a new realistic swinging slider into spiderman 2:) it causes peter to hit obstacles more frequent, swing in the direction of the buildings that peter’s web latch onto as well as having him fall to the ground if he gets too low!
I like the idea that swinging could be exactly like skate 3 physics with actual damage. I enjoy the web swinging in the game but I would love to actually be able to have that tense feeling of cutting it as close as I can by falling and shooting my web at the last second for a crazy amount of speed only to dodge everything else coming at me. One thing I kinda get bothered by is being able to move him in mid air so easily.
Something I like about spider-man 2 is that you don't have to face plant into the wall when your swinging. If you react fast enough, you can wall run up it like in spider-man ps4, except you actually meant to do it
In Spider-Man 3 and Web of Shadows, you do faceplant into walls if you swing too fast. They need to have that in the sequel. It shows as a consequence for you being reckless. Same thing with fall damage.
The amount of control they give you in SM2 is incredible and it feels awesome to play. You can even control the speed of your mid-air flips. If you hold the jump/air trick button (X) instead of just tapping it, you do a slow version of whatever air trick is next in line, and you control how long it lasts by how long you hold the button. Not really a crucial gameplay mechanic but i just love the amount of freedom they give the player. I don't really care about doing the flip tricks but it has a gameplay element as well, it builds your spidey-sense meter, which slows down time (You can also build it up by doing "clean swings" where you don't hit any buildings)
The swinging on Fortnite during the Spider-Man event was surprisingly one of the most satisfying swingings I ever played. You also had a lot of control over the web and could mess up. My favorite thing was being able to do loops with the webs on certain buildings like bridges. I felt like in one of the swinging scenes of Spider-Man 1 when Peter is going after Green Globlin to save Mary Jane. Spider-Man 2018 was great animation wise, but there were definitely something about its swinging physics that wasn't that much satisfying. Specially when jumping from the highest building and swinging on the last possible moment. It didn't felt as fast as it was supposed to.
Just so you know, if you miss that swinging, there's actually a few creative maps that have the "Grapple Glove" which is basically the same thing. I can find one of the maps if you're interested
I'm glad I'm not the only one who appreciated having to learn how to swing well in Spiderman 2. Another thing I like about the Spiderman 2 swinging is that the building blocks themselves are so simple, you can shoot a web, hang on to it, jump from it, wall run etc. and the cool stuff you can do is a result of the "systems" and physics put in place by the game, making it feel like I discovered some cool move even if it was 100% intended by the devs. The newer game doesn't have that kind of discovery, I think, but it does have an insane amount of handcrafted animations and motions that look sweet.
I love the structure of your videos. Good visuals, you speak well. I find myself listening through the whole thing. Your efforts are not wasted. Very entertaining and I wish game developers took your suggestions.
Insomniac should add two systems similar to what was done in SM2 where you could choose automatic or manual swinging Where one could be more controlled like it is in previous games and the other is how it is fully player based so it can be preferable for two kinds of players
As much as I love 2018 Spiderman I have to agree with everything you said. Its great, its what I want, but Spiderman 2 still dose it better in some areas. If they combined both and had options like turning off the wall colliding animation then it would be absolutely perfect.
Spiderman 2 also had an easy mode. They could've implemented something similar to the 2018 release. I was a bit disappointed that you could not even do loops as spiderman would release the web automatically. I agree with you on everything here.
Web of Shadows might be a good thing to look at as a frame of reference for, what I feel is, the best Spider-Man physics a game has ever received. While I think the swinging in Insomniac’s Spider-Man is serviceable and holds enough weight, it definitely feels pretty automated at certain points that you’ve mentioned. Great video!
This. So much this. IMO, WoS had the best aspects of SM2 and SM 2018 combined: satisfying physics based swinging that's easy to learn yet hard to master.
For me, the best Spider-Man game to fully master web swinging is Spider-Man 3. Spider-Man 3 was a super good game because it had such a good variety of swinging, Like dual swinging, running on poles, And also, the way they made air-tricks so useful to the game is mind blowing, Most people hate it but they don’t fully understand how the game wanted you to swing. Keep in mind that web of shadow is 95% taken from Spider-Man 3. Also: the goddam speed in that game was so good. Like you could get so far by swinging but it didn’t feel weird.
YES! The advanced swinging is something i’ve always wanted. I always wished i could be punished for bad swinging, because it makes the good, skillful swinging much more rewarding!
@@indedgames4359Says a lot more about the play testers than the mechanics themselves. I loved swinging through the city in Ultimate Spider-Man & I was 9 years old. That game had full pendulum physics & fall damage.
@@god_number4 Soooo don't turn the (hypothetical) option on You can keep the swinging you like, others can keep the swinging they like, and everyone is happy
I wish you at least mentioned the swinging mechanic of Tasm 2. They added one feature that i wished every spiderman game had. Left and right trigger their respective web shooters. I think in the discussion of freedom to swing this is an important aspect as you actually have control over which side you want to move and are punished for accidentally using the wrong trigger in certain areas like around the edges of cities or around central park where you want to fire your webs on one specific side. This also helps reduce the whole "hold one button to move straight forward automatically" as your webs will swing to one direction based on the the trigger. It is such a shame that you just disregarded those games like that.
That idea was cool but the main problem with TASM 2's swinging is that the animations were very repetitive plus the momentum felt off compared to past gamws
@@DatPRGuy2017 thats why i only mentioned the triggers and nothing else. The web zip mechanic that goes into first person is also nice but i think I prefer Insomniac's web zip.
That's definately something I'd want in an advanced swinging mode, I may be swayed by nostalgia, as I joined the spidey fandom around 2013-ish (my first marvel comic books, if memory serves, was the last few issues of Superior Spider Man, where the real Superior Spidey, Peter, returned) but I do have fond memories of the TASM 2 game, it does a lot wrong, but there are a few things it did well, and the swinging controls were one of them.
@@medafan53 Imagine how a swinging control like that effects boss battles like in Vulture & Electro fight where you're swinging around most of the time
Thank you for at least mentioning Ultimate Spider-Man but I still stand by it being the most underrated spider-man game. The combination of the swinging and the web zipping made you feel so agile just like you should as a superhero that relies so much on his movement
Another amazing video! Awesome. Insomniac developers mentioned in a GDC talk on YT, that they initially went all physics based for the first iteration of their web swinging but it didn't feel good and was difficult. So they added some invisible helpers to really make you "feel like Spider-man". I do hope that they allow you to touch the ground while swinging in Spider-man 2. Btw, I can link to the talk if anyone wants to see that.
Looks like the developer understands the problem and tried to fix it with an adjustable swinging assist in Marvel Spiderman 2. By turning off the swinging assist, there is a possibility of losing momentum when you hit something. It's a neat feature. Even tho if it's not gonna be the same as OG Spiderman 2 level, at least it's there
Spider-man 2 (PS5) does have the ability to adjust swing assistance. It does feel more momentum based but I don't think it's enough. I don't think adding a web suit builds on the swinging. They didn't fix the low swinging issue. And if you set the assistance to 0 with fall damage and try to swing low, there isn't much saving you from the ground since there isn't the ability to run on the ground or if the arc is too low you'll hit the ground since you can't control the web length or climb the lines.
Treyarch's Spider-Man 2 definitely has the best swinging control by far. Because hitting a wall or being too close to the ground results in lost speed in that game, players are constantly encouraged to improve their skills in order to go as fast as possible. It was a system based on meritocracy, but because Insomniac doesn't prioritize that philosophy, swinging in their Spider-Man games can feel boring after several minutes, as your speed varies less often.
Also it being a PlayStation exclusive too was a benefit and a curse. Sure it got the big budget required to make the game look and feel polished but because it's a huge game, they have to downgrade mechanics so that a 5 year old kid can easily go through most of the game
You had me up until the last part.... It bugs me how Insomniac's Spider-Man wants to hold your hand when it comes to web swinging. But to say it's boring? I mean it's still enjoyable and very satisfying I think!
How did you not mention the splat animation from spiderman 2? If you're ripping along at max speed (as far as I know it's impossible to get the animation to play without a few swing speed upgrades) and you slam into a wall spiderman halts all momentum and pancakes across the wall, arms and legs splayed out. It's a hilarious way to punish players for getting extra careless, because you have to hit a wall nearly dead on ad well.
In Spider-Man Miles Morales, they also had that dollar animation. Also while I do understand the points the video made, I do think of PS4 Spider-Man's web swinging and why he wall runs if you swing towards a wall in a narrative way. In Spider-Man 2, he's only got 2 years of swinging under his belt and therefore can't fully maneuver swinging into walls. PS4 Spider-Man, has over 8 years to get it down so of course his parkour skills are a bit higher. However, I do agree that the swinging right over the street is a little wonky. Plus the point about Miles and how he's more interested in looking cool than getting there fast, he's a brand new Spider-Man so of course he's going to look and feel slower. However if you notice the swing animation and speed from the beginning of the game to the end, you'll notice a pretty decent difference.
@@jasonmsanchez No, Spider-Man should be punished for carelessly swinging, it doesn't have to be like ps2 where you just plant your face in the building, but encourage smart swinging. If you swing straight into a building, then you should be punished with losing your momentum. Not face planting, but the fast impact means that spider-man has to stop for a moment before he starts wallrunning up, and he shouldn't be at full wallrunning speed, when he does. it should build up. but the player should be able to circumvent these momentum killer animations/moves by smart swinging. if the player wants to wallrun, but they don't want to have their momentum ruined, they could "tactically" attach their web in such a way, that they are not forced to crash into building. instead they swing up next to the building so that their movement is close to parallel to the building's walls, when they player then lets go, all the momentum they have can be easily tranferred to a wallrun without losing speed.
@@DatAsianGuyNo he is saying “Y’all be picky.” Because you guys want all of the mechanics just for web-swinging which will prob to very time consuming and almost impossible to do. But at the end of the day it’s still just a video game and it does not have to be completely realistic.
@@Kacpa2 ultimate Spider-Man and web of shadows. web of shadows tried to do so much . aside from webs floating near to buildings, the swinging system is pretty great. it looks great ,feels flat, you fuck you'll feel the fuck up.
idk whhy people are complaining about the autocorrect when hitting walls. If anything I enjoyed that aspect because it meant I could chill and enjoy swinging instead of having to worry about calculating wether my swinging was precise enough to not hit the buildings.
This reminds me of the "Normal" vs "Novice" controls topic on Ace Combat. One let's you fully control the aircraft, i.e. manually do rolls and loops with complete freedom. The other feels like driving a car that can go up and down.
i know attention to detail in miles morales is top notch. i remember doing trick falling all the way to the ground and boucing off the concrete leaving an imprint of the bounce in the snow. THAT WAS DOPE AS FUQ.
It's crazy to think games are getting so advanced that they can leave imprints in the snow for every action you can possibly do along with the full accurate reflections, higher pedestrian count, and the fluidity in general it's such a cool concept to me that we went from 2 sticks and a bouncing ball to what we have now.
Agree to 100%! This is why I like Spider-Man 2 on PS2, you were rewarded for good gameplay but also punished for swinging poorly and lost your speed. This will NEVER happen in Insomniacs SM games though :(
I appreciate your take on this! Your absolutely right about having a more advanced swing system for people who want to feel the mistakes, or feel more control.
Watching this after the Spider-Man 2 gameplay reveal, sadly it seems like Insomniac played it safe and didn't iterate on the web swinging. Still need proper free roaming gameplay to come to a conclusion, but it seems like we're stuck with artificial and automated swinging.
Tbh that decreases a lot of the excitement I had for that game. Cuz I've already sunk hours in that swinging system and am quite bored by it, I don't need to spend money to get the same swinging system because I can play that right now.
I was really looking forward to seeing an improved version of the web swinging in Spiderman 2, but from the gameplay trailers, it still has the same problems as the first two games, which was extremely disappointing to me. Oh well. Maybe they’ll improve it in Spiderman 3
They are people who like to please everybody... they can still add it as an option, becuase they are people who love to give players veriety on what they can do when it comes to accessibility. They have said that we only got a taste on what we saw. So we shall see... Just have faith.
This is what happens when all feedback gets immediately shut down sadly was hoping for a swinging overhaul the swinging is way way way on rails for a character that thrives off the thrill of freedom and freeflow
I love when people mention features from prototypes to be added in games as if it was a drag and drop of content. AI models are incredibly hard to make. Like really hard. I’m a data scientist and we need around thousands of training data before we are able to fully test and build our models. How much data do you think nvidia needed to have to train their model? Also, spiderman is a fully blown video game with various textures/materials as well as other systems. If you want a game to come out in a 5-7 year period, don’t expect “AI” animations in your AAA games lol
This was an interesting video, well done too. For my own thoughts on swinging I think Insomniac did really well with the mechanics. Personally I like that it holds my hand to a degree with the swinging. I have a disability and only the use of my left hand. (I'm playing it on PC by the way). I can set all the controls to the left side of the keyboard and just go full bore through the city at amazing speed. There are points where the game gives me a hand, but I don't really notice it. Partly because Insomniac worked really hard to hide that behind the scenes. But more to the point that helping hand made me feel like Spider-Man to such a degree that it didn't matter. (Though I agree with what you said about Central Park). To add onto what you suggested I think that perhaps there could be, three levels of swinging. Perhaps you could select one from the accessibility menu. The first would be what we got in Insomniac's SM1 and presumably Miles Morales. The second could be a bit more intensive where you get a greater level of freedom to pull of the tricks and swinging mechanics with less handholding and helps you get used to the tougher mechanics unaided. The third, could be advanced and incorporate the parkour and movement animations that Insomniac got right, but gives the player more total control over swinging, running, diving etc.
Holy heck what is this production value? In the first 15 seconds I’ve already seen more effort than any RUclips video I’ve seen today, and I just watched a Mark Rober video.
You definitely spot on the problem with insomniac spider man swinging, especially on web control and momentum also the willingness of let player fail and stumble upon swinging. At first I thought the lack of dedicated wall attach button,you know so that I could stop swinging whenever I wanted to, is the problem, but after seeing your explanation its all about web control and momentum and insomniac definitely need to see this video.
It happened! Spider-Man 2 for PS5 has this implemented! Although it’s a slider setting so you can adjust how much swinging assist you want. It is very cool.
Ehhh... I hope in SM3 they do the actual "Select your swinging mode" thing, since everyone complained that it wasn't worked on because they didn't know about the assist slider. They should give it to you as an option on the new game menu instead of going into accessibility, and you still should have things like loop-de-loop and corner tether as basic movement abilities, not unlockable skills.
Having played Spider-Man 2 and not being good at swinging beforehand, i can ASSURE u the swinging is better in this one and i DEFINITELY lose momentum when i hit a wall or hit the ground now. Its realistic and makes my failure hurt💀
Finally a criticism of most these games I can fully get behind. I think the reason they don't make the swing system more realistic is to streamline the experience for players. But I think what they miss is a swing system that emphasized momentum would feel more fun and make traversal more strategic and interesting.
My fear is that since it's coming too fast, Spider-Man two will basically have the same exact swinging physics as the first game. Which is fun, but they can and should do better.
@@CANELA-cnm I have the same concern, I'm not really holding my breath on that aspect of the game unfortunately, I feel like it'll just be flashier animations with no actual improvement to the physics :/
Can we talk about why fall damage is the boogeyman? My palms still sweat when I'm swinging atop the highest buildings in Spider-Man PS2 but in the PS4 game I can be in any difficult situation barreling towards the ground and feel nothing because it's 0 risk. 100% the new Insomniac game needs lethal fall damage but 100% they won't implement that.
@@christopherjohnsonthe2ndch644 Maybe not lethal fall damage then but like 90%-95%, then just tweak the game so it’s harder to leave combat scenarios with full health and there you go, looming threat of death and once again thrilling movement.
@@pepe_s1lvia I played dark souls 1, 3, in progress of 2, finished Sekiro twice, beat Bloodborne countless times. If they do that I would not have any 'its too hard' gripes
Honestly in Spider Man 2 they should make it where the speed increases by a percentage every time you do a perfect swing. And it shouldn't have a limit. This will challenge players to try and get the fastest speed.
Insomniac did a really good job with Spider-Man (2018) and Miles Morales and were improved for the PS5 versions for sure, but some ragdoll physics other than when Spider-Man dies would be nice
Another thing I wanted was like the force of the web pulling on spiderman,so basically like in the opening of the amazing spiderman 2 when hes in first person,you can see how hes getting pulled by the webs,also his body is turning and not always facing forward
I still think the best "web swinging" comes from the 2013 Attack on Titan Unity "tribute game" where you have to aim your hooks and you can play with momentum. Yes, it is difficult. Yes, it has a leaning curve. But it is rewarding.
I honestly dont find anything wrong with the swinging in this game. I think it overall feels the best. But that doesn't mean, it cannot be improved. I do understand your take man. Love this video
Spider-Man 2 to this day, still has the best swing system to date. Insomniac’s system is far too hand holding and gets very boring very quickly since there’s no need for skill. Hopefully marvels Spider-Man 2 changes that and takes the reign as having the best swing system
You could make the same video for 3D sonic games and momentum. This is the time where realism is no longer tied to graphics and world size/scope only... PHYSICS is now probably thee most important aspect of video games, but its kind of neglected. In Sonic games, In Skateboarding Games, In GTA like games, and in the new Spider-Man. Physics is so important. But I feel like we are still in the 7th gen era when it comes to physics (with GTA5 its worst cos they went backwards.)
The new spiderman game has something to do with where the camera is facing, if you follow with the camera up at the end of the swing, pete or miles doesn't let go the web and you can perform something similar, but yeah, i wish they had an option activate/deactivate the swing assists. Thanks for the video btw!
One of my favorite bits about SM2 was using two webs to turn yourself into a slingshot. I forgot how fast you could go in that game until these clips. In the newest ones, I find myself avoiding getting too close to a street or roof if it means it makes spidey float. I do appreciate the callbacks to the older games, though. "My boy lost his balloon and Spiderman didn't get it back. #JJJatHome was right! He's a menace!"
I understand that this is different from your typical GTA content, but I'd really like to see you make more videos like this, whether it be Spider-Man or something else. Also, I really appreciate you making this video as not enough people criticize Spider-Man PS4's web swinging. But the unfortunate fact of the matter is that as these Spider-Man games are AAA, it also means they have to be accessible to even the worst player. Casual gamers dislike challenge and that means unless Insomniac incorporates a separate mode for challenging web swinging and easy web swinging like Spider-Man 2, then I doubt Spider-Man 2 PS5 is going to be more challenging.
Finally a video that summerizes all my opinions about Spider-Man PS4 in relation to PS2 covering everything I have ever thought. Just one thing you did not mention Is that at the beginning of a new game in Spider-Man 2 for PS2 you could choose between 2 kinds of swinging mechanics, an "arcade" one, simpler, and a physics based one. I hope Marvel's Spider-Man 2 will feature a "phisics mod" for swinging.
In spiderman 2018, if you dont let go of r2 and push the left stick to the opposite direction, peter turns around and geta slower. If you continue that, you can fet him to stop swinging and hang from his web.
So that's why the swinging didn't appeal to me in the new Spider-man games. It was okay, but didn't have the joy of the Ps2 Spider-man which had me playing it for hours, just to go swinging.
Having two or more options for swinging mechanics is a perfect solution, give players the choice. Many videos like this I've seen ask for risk but don't consider its very difficult for the game to tell if you wall running was a failed swing or something intentional but with options that allowed for a more easy and higher risk option they can have their cake and eat it too
This may sound weird but my favorite swinging mechanic is the one in Fortnite. There you have complete control of your swing, you can actually aim where you want to attach the webs. I really hope this kind of swinging mechanic to be explored more in spider man games.
I Subscribed on your channel just yesterday. And for today I watched a lot of your videos and liked it. I am not even English speaker, and not used to watch content on foreign language. But your videos are unique and interesting, so I truly watch it with curiousity. So much right things you saying, and talks about not ordinary themes. Thanks for your work! Nice job you did 👍🏻
@@DarkSpaceStudios It depends on which one you prefer. I saw translated Nostalgia Critic content, this is just Russian channel, that make dub on every critic video. And second way, is subtitles on your videos
Someone played Spider--Man 2000 on Kid Mode x,D The swinging in that game was actually deeper than people think. If you went into manual aiming mode and were at the right distance from your target destination you could swing very precisely in that game. You could also extend your web swinging by cancelling it with the jump button to start a new and if you did it right you could get 3-4 consecutive swings. Enter Electro had some short comings but one thing that was good about that sequel was Xavier's danger room challenges which taught you tricks you might not have learned while beating the first game.
Sudden Idea: Give him the "advanced" swinging, with all the safeties off... until he puts on the symbiote. So long as post-game allows you to freely alternate, it could be a cool way to showcase the sheer power and invincibility of the symbiote, while also subtly suggesting that the suit is in control.
The problem with physics engines like Euphoria is the massive amount of bugs that come with it, we all remember Niko falling flat on his face in GTA for daring to bump into a stationary car, swinging should be a power fantasy.
Thank you so much I’ve been saying Spider-Man 2 was still elite swing and to this day or until they do something like this to perfect it in the future. People where biased with Spider-Man ps4 swinging mechanics and I argued and argued and argued. Nobody was getting it. The way you articulated this was what I’ve been trying to explain. I thought I was crazy. I hate the fact the Spider-Man has unlimited agility and ways to get around and with style but it’s held back disrespectfully. Spider man 2 and I’ll say, even Spider-Man web of shadows and ultimate Spider-Man had something going with the physics that are true to Spider-Man’s nature. Especially climbing on the web while swinging I loved that so much. That’s why I love his poses while he’s swinging on his web and threw the air and multiple ways of agility and speed. But people that I spoke too were very little minded and wasn’t looking at the big picture about Spider-Mans web swinging in PlayStation 5. Like even from the movies adaptations of Spider-Man’s winging I wished where implemented in games today. Spider-Man ps5 (4) even miles morales could’ve just used what they have already but just add it with Spider-Man 2’s mechanics. But for some reason no. I’m glad there’s people like you that recognize this. This is not a knock to Spider-Man ps5 but I feel like it still could’ve been better. Especially with the technology today. Like cmon Spider-Man 2 did it on ps2 like for real. You mean to tell me a highly advanced console and the technology we have today can’t even compete with something that was made a decade ago? Cmon now stop playing with my boi Spidey and get his swinging correct.
It's not that they couldn't have collisions, they obviously can. The game recognises that there will be a collision so does something to prevent it whilst still looking natural. I do prefer it like that to be honest. The question which the devs obviously asked themselves during development is should they. Not every aspect of a game needs to be punishing, swinging in a Spider-Man game should involve some hand holding so that players can look good doing it and get that satisfaction, remember even the original reasoning behind a physics based system was to not be realistic, but to make players feel like Spider-Man, spider-man doesn't crash into buildings, he does break his swing and run up them. The real punishment should and does come in the form of the combat. Insomniacs swing system is a great balance between giving players control, but also having preset animations and hand holding to keep the swinging looking good and maintain momentum. I think a genuine improvement to be made will be to in regards to swinging low and redirecting to go through pipes and gaps. Low swinging doesn't look good sometimes when the game forces it, neither does this strange float redirection when you go to webzip through a small gap, so there's no loss in preventing that from happening. But I don't think building collisions should be a thing, perhaps running or even sliding along the ground when you launch a web when low to the ground whilst swinging would be a cool aesthetic change.
i think to this day that spider-man 2‘s and wos web swinging and traversal options are absolutely the peak of movement for me the reason why spider-man 2‘s animations don‘t seem that flashy is due to the way tobey‘s spidey moves. while yes you can see the occasionial air acrobatic he‘s pulling off he usually tries to be at his destination as fast as he can. his movies show why that is since usually whenever you see a swinging scene it evolves around him trying to save i think sm2 (the game) encapsulated that style of swinging with you getting from a to point b if you‘ve haven‘t mastered swinging that well yet, however there is a insane skill gap in sm2 showing a newbie and a master controlling the game a newbie will hit the walls often and slip the opportunity to catch yourself from falling with a swing. he won‘t memorize the city‘s layout yet since he still hasn‘t grasped the mechanics while a master takes full advantage of the traversal options making it look like one of these clips you can see at the cinema of a dev doing an „insane“ level race. he memorized the city‘s layout due to him spending alot of time swinging,looping, flipping, climbing, wall sliding, wall running, pole swinging web ziping and more. while wos takes it a little more user friendly i‘ll always argue that the learning curve of sm2 is essential for wanting to be better and be an absolute beast at moving in extremely fast pace without hitting a while once without him going for it
So what I’ve always wanted is a smaller scale swing. Like in the amazing Spider-Man 1 movie how he because “unlocked” big swings with the cranes. Limited to walls and small swings could make a city feel 10x bigger
Don’t know about anyone else but I love the swinging in Miles Morales. All the animations and just how it feels is so nice to me. Speed feels perfect in it. I’m just now hearing about people wanting to go Sonic 06 speeds lol. Those speed mods look crazy
I just want to say beenox are not that bad yes tasm and tasm2 had flaws like the cloud swinging from the first game, But to be fair these games were underdeveloped because of activision's greed, but they still managed to pull off good stuff like spider man shattered dimensions which is a fucking masterpiece and edge of time that was also underdeveloped but still had and amazing story not to mention that they are more familiar with linear level design like in shattered dimensions and edge of time so it makes sense for them to not have much experience with open world games and realistic swinging, also one great thing that I have to give them credit for: they once asked fans what character they wanted to see in tasm2 and everyone chose carnage so they added him into the game for fan service, Yes tasm and tasm 2 ARE bad games but I think you were a little rude when talking about the devs of beenox, Also shouldn't spider man web of shadows be in this video?
On one hand, things like levitating off the ground while swinging can definitely be immersion breaking. On the other, I don't want to have my swinging completely fucked because Central Park just happens to be between me and my objective. That's how you kill a player's fun while traversing
LMAO or you could simply know how to swing around there. You're making this seem like a huge chore when in Spider-Man 2, Ultimate Spider-Man and Spider-Man 3, swinging in Central Park wasn't so difficult as long as you stay low
I remember someone telling me once, “A dude can climb walls using only his bare hands and you’re concerned about the physics of his swinging?” Glad to know I’m not the only one. 😂
I always really hated that logic. Yes, asshole, I do expect the world with dragons flying about and people shooting fire from their fingers to at least follow its own established rules; otherwise, it's just not a great piece of media.
I think you hit the nail on the head with Spiderman 2018. It has the best swinging of any spiderman game so far yet there is still room to improve. The new swinging should require a bit more skill to master. Would love to see some fall damage as well from tall heights to add a bit more risk.
Play War Thunder now, and gain access to a free bonus pack which includes vehicles, Boosters, and more- by using my link: playwt.link/darkspace
Already play it on my pc lol it’s fun too much grind tho
Dont do it if you want to keep your sanity
Do not advertise the game, the company with keep supporting Russian aggression against Ukraine. Advertising games of these companies = support of Russian terrorism!
Do not play it, the snail will consume your soul.
Crappy game, stop being a sellout.
I really wanted him to talk about Web of Shadows swinging.. The webs don't attach to buildings but the swinging feels so good and it does require skills.
they do attach to buildings but they hover a few feet away so it looks a bit wonky
nah
@@DaRealViso you're both correct, that happens sometimes too
@@thisbubblygoodness7611 yea I'm pretty sure the only times the web attaches to the air is if the objects you can swing on are to low to the ground
It doesn't attach to buildings, but it crucially *still* attaches, even if it's to the sky. It's still 100% physics based. Less realistic, but still fun and beautiful, capturing the Spider-Man experience pretty well
The speed issue has actually been explained by insomniac as a streaming issue, the PS4 couldn't handle loading so much detail when speeds got too high so they limited his maximum speed. In the remaster they did increase his speed but only slightly. With Spiderman 2 coming exclusively to PS5 the issue will likely be gone and the speed and momentum issues you stated will probably be gone.
So that's why it felt different
It won't, the PC mods already proven it. 2018 it had a speed of 1, their plan is to upgrade to 2, which has already shown to be not even close to older games' speed, which were somewhat closer from 3 to 4, and even then that won't change the fact the game doesn't have physics, so making it faster won't fix an issue that anyone can do now with the mods. Now the least they can do is raise the speed.
@@radrno7 so just play on PC and mod the game, n quit bitching
@@radrno7 I don’t think it needs to be 3-4 times faster that’s a little absurd
@@radrno7 For most mods it felt like you were flying across the city. The moment Peter let’s go of the webs he’s halfway across another building. That’s not all the mods just some.
I think it's a shame you didn't mention Web Of Shadow's web swinging system, since I consider it to be just as good as SM2's system. The webs themselves I think are the best part, they feel so elasticky and visually look amazing, while the physics are refined while still feeling realistic
The way you can slide up the building over the peak before you fall down to the next swing is reeeaally addicting..
@@AfroV The best thing is when you knee slide up a building and spiderman just backflips into a swan dive.
fr Web of Shadows always had an amazing web swinging and wall sliding movements that makes you want to practice how you maneuver quickly to buildings and enemies, god I miss wall combat and it's unique combat system aswell. I hope the sequel adds that or perhaps shows more of it's new unique moves
@@inkchariot6147 im so glad you guys mention the knee-sliding mechanic when you go up and down buildings.
it genuinely feels like a pro-skater move and its amazing.
TASM 2 Crying in the Background for not even being mentioned at all 😂😂neither the video nor the. comment section
I think it's a shame Web of Shadows wasn't mentioned. It's web slinging system and more importantly Peter's movement on the walls and air is fantastic.
Sliding on walls was the most fire shit I've ever seen in a Spider-Man game
I still remember I use to to that same sliding animation in real when I was kid. It's soooo good. There was a rotating puch animation too that was also coool
Insomniac has the best swinging rn
@@RMCUU youre wrong
@@enz666 then what does💀 it ain't wos definitely 😂 you literally just swing onto air insomniac has better fundamentals etc while swinging
I think having the freedom to swing any way you want is a great feature as it allows you to do cool moves on your own instead of being able to swing and do some generic move intended by the game but I hope they improve it in the next game
That's why real-time physics based swinging is so much better. It presents some challenge and reward by releasing the swing too late, too early or spot on.
Did you not play miles morales and see how free form the web swinging and animations were?
Just go look at the web swinging in that game and you’ll see they already improved it a ton but how fluid his body moved
@@Blueslyfox But it's still a gimmick that gets old quickly. Like how many times can you watch Miles open his phone while falling before you get bored? Physics-based swinging is superior, as literally every swing is unique since it depends on your location in space relative to the building, the forces acting on you, e.g. gravity, momentum, etc.
@@fernandowong371 Yup, outside the tricks the game still has the core issue the previous game had. It barely feels like I'm in the shoes of Spider-Man and rather the game is partly being Spider-Man whilst I'm just there for the ride
The one thing I think makes the whole, "just hold forward and R2 and spiderman will do it for you" in Spider-Man PS4 because Peter isn't just going to let himself smack into a wall, he's been Spider-Man for 8 years, he's skilled, which makes it seem more immersive and flow better than if he just slammed into a wall like an idiot. But I get that people want to have a challenge.
came to this video right here just to say that they added a new realistic swinging slider into spiderman 2:) it causes peter to hit obstacles more frequent, swing in the direction of the buildings that peter’s web latch onto as well as having him fall to the ground if he gets too low!
I have it on 0 swinging assistance
I like the idea that swinging could be exactly like skate 3 physics with actual damage. I enjoy the web swinging in the game but I would love to actually be able to have that tense feeling of cutting it as close as I can by falling and shooting my web at the last second for a crazy amount of speed only to dodge everything else coming at me. One thing I kinda get bothered by is being able to move him in mid air so easily.
I think they should add it as an option, or part of a new difficulty
Honestly fr, halfway through Spider-Man ps4 the swinging doesn't feel satisfying anymore and you start to notice that he moves like a fucking plane.
im glazing just cause 3, but i love the wingsuit in that game for the same reason, especially combining it with the grapple
Movement mods can make the swinging more realistic
Something I like about spider-man 2 is that you don't have to face plant into the wall when your swinging. If you react fast enough, you can wall run up it like in spider-man ps4, except you actually meant to do it
Truth! Really makes it feel like the split decisions are significant + impactful
In Spider-Man 3 and Web of Shadows, you do faceplant into walls if you swing too fast. They need to have that in the sequel. It shows as a consequence for you being reckless. Same thing with fall damage.
@@ultimatecontagion yes. But it would be cool if you could easily avoid it when you're skilled
The amount of control they give you in SM2 is incredible and it feels awesome to play. You can even control the speed of your mid-air flips. If you hold the jump/air trick button (X) instead of just tapping it, you do a slow version of whatever air trick is next in line, and you control how long it lasts by how long you hold the button. Not really a crucial gameplay mechanic but i just love the amount of freedom they give the player. I don't really care about doing the flip tricks but it has a gameplay element as well, it builds your spidey-sense meter, which slows down time (You can also build it up by doing "clean swings" where you don't hit any buildings)
The swinging on Fortnite during the Spider-Man event was surprisingly one of the most satisfying swingings I ever played.
You also had a lot of control over the web and could mess up. My favorite thing was being able to do loops with the webs on certain buildings like bridges. I felt like in one of the swinging scenes of Spider-Man 1 when Peter is going after Green Globlin to save Mary Jane.
Spider-Man 2018 was great animation wise, but there were definitely something about its swinging physics that wasn't that much satisfying. Specially when jumping from the highest building and swinging on the last possible moment. It didn't felt as fast as it was supposed to.
Just so you know, if you miss that swinging, there's actually a few creative maps that have the "Grapple Glove" which is basically the same thing. I can find one of the maps if you're interested
Well, you got what you wanted. You can now incrementally turn down the Swinging assist from 10 to 0 in Spiderman 2.
Nice
Insconmiac delivered
Copium
@@Jurgir09?what
this much cope is dangerous for your heart, Tim
This video is the Spider-Man version of Sonic Fans talking about Sonics slope physics
I was thinking the exact same thing while watching this video.
@@Reen40020 a man of culture i see
I'm glad I'm not the only one who appreciated having to learn how to swing well in Spiderman 2. Another thing I like about the Spiderman 2 swinging is that the building blocks themselves are so simple, you can shoot a web, hang on to it, jump from it, wall run etc. and the cool stuff you can do is a result of the "systems" and physics put in place by the game, making it feel like I discovered some cool move even if it was 100% intended by the devs. The newer game doesn't have that kind of discovery, I think, but it does have an insane amount of handcrafted animations and motions that look sweet.
Insomniac will definitely make you disciver thos time when it comes to their physics.
I love the structure of your videos. Good visuals, you speak well. I find myself listening through the whole thing. Your efforts are not wasted. Very entertaining and I wish game developers took your suggestions.
100% agreed. His editing is perfect for these showcase and/or analysis a concept videos, it inspires me everytime.
He should teach a class.
Thank you for the kind words! It is nice to see someone enjoys it :D
@@StuartLugsden I'd love to watch that masterclass.
@@DarkSpaceStudios What editing software do you use? I'm genuinely curious.
Insomniac should add two systems similar to what was done in SM2 where you could choose automatic or manual swinging
Where one could be more controlled like it is in previous games and the other is how it is fully player based so it can be preferable for two kinds of players
This 👏🏻
Either way, that's not happening becuase they fixed their swinging to be controlled.
But you can make swinging harder within the settings, though.
As much as I love 2018 Spiderman I have to agree with everything you said. Its great, its what I want, but Spiderman 2 still dose it better in some areas. If they combined both and had options like turning off the wall colliding animation then it would be absolutely perfect.
Spiderman 2 also had an easy mode. They could've implemented something similar to the 2018 release. I was a bit disappointed that you could not even do loops as spiderman would release the web automatically. I agree with you on everything here.
Web of Shadows might be a good thing to look at as a frame of reference for, what I feel is, the best Spider-Man physics a game has ever received.
While I think the swinging in Insomniac’s Spider-Man is serviceable and holds enough weight, it definitely feels pretty automated at certain points that you’ve mentioned.
Great video!
Its still surprising that people dont mention Web of Shadows when it comes to swinging.
This. So much this. IMO, WoS had the best aspects of SM2 and SM 2018 combined: satisfying physics based swinging that's easy to learn yet hard to master.
For me, the best Spider-Man game to fully master web swinging is Spider-Man 3.
Spider-Man 3 was a super good game because it had such a good variety of swinging,
Like dual swinging, running on poles,
And also, the way they made air-tricks so useful to the game is mind blowing,
Most people hate it but they don’t fully understand how the game wanted you to swing.
Keep in mind that web of shadow is 95% taken from Spider-Man 3.
Also: the goddam speed in that game was so good.
Like you could get so far by swinging but it didn’t feel weird.
The physic is not that good since buildings are not taken into account when swinging..
@@ahadullahalimi9332 I hate it how everyone be sleeping on both USM and SM3. The web swinging from SM2 all the way to WoS is the same system.
YES! The advanced swinging is something i’ve always wanted. I always wished i could be punished for bad swinging, because it makes the good, skillful swinging much more rewarding!
ah yes id love to face plant into a wall at mach 2 instead of just keeping my movement
Ther testet that at insomniac found it wasnt fun and replaced it with a fun systhem instead
Spiderman 2 ps2
@@indedgames4359Says a lot more about the play testers than the mechanics themselves.
I loved swinging through the city in Ultimate Spider-Man & I was 9 years old.
That game had full pendulum physics & fall damage.
@@god_number4
Soooo don't turn the (hypothetical) option on
You can keep the swinging you like, others can keep the swinging they like, and everyone is happy
I wish you at least mentioned the swinging mechanic of Tasm 2. They added one feature that i wished every spiderman game had. Left and right trigger their respective web shooters. I think in the discussion of freedom to swing this is an important aspect as you actually have control over which side you want to move and are punished for accidentally using the wrong trigger in certain areas like around the edges of cities or around central park where you want to fire your webs on one specific side. This also helps reduce the whole "hold one button to move straight forward automatically" as your webs will swing to one direction based on the the trigger.
It is such a shame that you just disregarded those games like that.
That idea was cool but the main problem with TASM 2's swinging is that the animations were very repetitive plus the momentum felt off compared to past gamws
@@DatPRGuy2017 thats why i only mentioned the triggers and nothing else. The web zip mechanic that goes into first person is also nice but i think I prefer Insomniac's web zip.
@@lamedrawings I like the Concept tho of Web Rush
That's definately something I'd want in an advanced swinging mode, I may be swayed by nostalgia, as I joined the spidey fandom around 2013-ish (my first marvel comic books, if memory serves, was the last few issues of Superior Spider Man, where the real Superior Spidey, Peter, returned) but I do have fond memories of the TASM 2 game, it does a lot wrong, but there are a few things it did well, and the swinging controls were one of them.
@@medafan53 Imagine how a swinging control like that effects boss battles like in Vulture & Electro fight where you're swinging around most of the time
Thank you for at least mentioning Ultimate Spider-Man but I still stand by it being the most underrated spider-man game. The combination of the swinging and the web zipping made you feel so agile just like you should as a superhero that relies so much on his movement
Web zipping was so satisfying in that game! I also loved the style. Combat was lacking but the story made it worth it
Another amazing video! Awesome. Insomniac developers mentioned in a GDC talk on YT, that they initially went all physics based for the first iteration of their web swinging but it didn't feel good and was difficult. So they added some invisible helpers to really make you "feel like Spider-man". I do hope that they allow you to touch the ground while swinging in Spider-man 2. Btw, I can link to the talk if anyone wants to see that.
Looks like the developer understands the problem and tried to fix it with an adjustable swinging assist in Marvel Spiderman 2. By turning off the swinging assist, there is a possibility of losing momentum when you hit something. It's a neat feature. Even tho if it's not gonna be the same as OG Spiderman 2 level, at least it's there
Spider-man 2 (PS5) does have the ability to adjust swing assistance. It does feel more momentum based but I don't think it's enough. I don't think adding a web suit builds on the swinging. They didn't fix the low swinging issue. And if you set the assistance to 0 with fall damage and try to swing low, there isn't much saving you from the ground since there isn't the ability to run on the ground or if the arc is too low you'll hit the ground since you can't control the web length or climb the lines.
Treyarch's Spider-Man 2 definitely has the best swinging control by far. Because hitting a wall or being too close to the ground results in lost speed in that game, players are constantly encouraged to improve their skills in order to go as fast as possible. It was a system based on meritocracy, but because Insomniac doesn't prioritize that philosophy, swinging in their Spider-Man games can feel boring after several minutes, as your speed varies less often.
Also it being a PlayStation exclusive too was a benefit and a curse. Sure it got the big budget required to make the game look and feel polished but because it's a huge game, they have to downgrade mechanics so that a 5 year old kid can easily go through most of the game
@@DatPRGuy2017 they can improve heavily in Spider-Man 2.
You had me up until the last part.... It bugs me how Insomniac's Spider-Man wants to hold your hand when it comes to web swinging. But to say it's boring? I mean it's still enjoyable and very satisfying I think!
@@huliniswhoiam yeah, for the 1st 2 hours.
@@Cure4Brains I disagree. I thoroughly enjoyed the swinging throughout the city.
How did you not mention the splat animation from spiderman 2? If you're ripping along at max speed (as far as I know it's impossible to get the animation to play without a few swing speed upgrades) and you slam into a wall spiderman halts all momentum and pancakes across the wall, arms and legs splayed out. It's a hilarious way to punish players for getting extra careless, because you have to hit a wall nearly dead on ad well.
In Spider-Man Miles Morales, they also had that dollar animation. Also while I do understand the points the video made, I do think of PS4 Spider-Man's web swinging and why he wall runs if you swing towards a wall in a narrative way. In Spider-Man 2, he's only got 2 years of swinging under his belt and therefore can't fully maneuver swinging into walls. PS4 Spider-Man, has over 8 years to get it down so of course his parkour skills are a bit higher. However, I do agree that the swinging right over the street is a little wonky.
Plus the point about Miles and how he's more interested in looking cool than getting there fast, he's a brand new Spider-Man so of course he's going to look and feel slower. However if you notice the swing animation and speed from the beginning of the game to the end, you'll notice a pretty decent difference.
@@jasonmsanchez
No, Spider-Man should be punished for carelessly swinging, it doesn't have to be like ps2 where you just plant your face in the building, but encourage smart swinging.
If you swing straight into a building, then you should be punished with losing your momentum.
Not face planting, but the fast impact means that spider-man has to stop for a moment before he starts wallrunning up, and he shouldn't be at full wallrunning speed, when he does. it should build up.
but the player should be able to circumvent these momentum killer animations/moves by smart swinging.
if the player wants to wallrun, but they don't want to have their momentum ruined, they could "tactically" attach their web in such a way, that they are not forced to crash into building. instead they swing up next to the building so that their movement is close to parallel to the building's walls, when they player then lets go, all the momentum they have can be easily tranferred to a wallrun without losing speed.
@@DatAsianGuyy'all be so picky
@@crashjetto wanting an improved system for the sequel is now being picky?
@@DatAsianGuyNo he is saying “Y’all be picky.” Because you guys want all of the mechanics just for web-swinging which will prob to very time consuming and almost impossible to do. But at the end of the day it’s still just a video game and it does not have to be completely realistic.
I believe they will improve web swing physics in Spider-Man 2.
So far they dont even try to replicate it.
@@Kacpa2 What does that even mean? How would you know what they're doing in a game we've seen zero gameplay of?
@@gavo7911 No game after Spiderman 2 tried to replicate its web slinging physics so far.
@@Kacpa2 I believe the commenter you replied to was referring to Insomniac’s Spider-Man 2, not the old one
@@Kacpa2 ultimate Spider-Man and web of shadows. web of shadows tried to do so much . aside from webs floating near to buildings, the swinging system is pretty great. it looks great ,feels flat, you fuck you'll feel the fuck up.
idk whhy people are complaining about the autocorrect when hitting walls. If anything I enjoyed that aspect because it meant I could chill and enjoy swinging instead of having to worry about calculating wether my swinging was precise enough to not hit the buildings.
ikr like who cares about how spiderman will hit a wall beacuse you didnt swing correctly
so cool that they actually made it optional to have the swing assist in the sequel.
Still - zero physics
This reminds me of the "Normal" vs "Novice" controls topic on Ace Combat. One let's you fully control the aircraft, i.e. manually do rolls and loops with complete freedom. The other feels like driving a car that can go up and down.
i know attention to detail in miles morales is top notch. i remember doing trick falling all the way to the ground and boucing off the concrete leaving an imprint of the bounce in the snow. THAT WAS DOPE AS FUQ.
YESSIR!
It's crazy to think games are getting so advanced that they can leave imprints in the snow for every action you can possibly do along with the full accurate reflections, higher pedestrian count, and the fluidity in general it's such a cool concept to me that we went from 2 sticks and a bouncing ball to what we have now.
now it's everything good in new spider man 2
Agree to 100%!
This is why I like Spider-Man 2 on PS2, you were rewarded for good gameplay but also punished for swinging poorly and lost your speed.
This will NEVER happen in Insomniacs SM games though :(
I appreciate your take on this! Your absolutely right about having a more advanced swing system for people who want to feel the mistakes, or feel more control.
Watching this after the Spider-Man 2 gameplay reveal, sadly it seems like Insomniac played it safe and didn't iterate on the web swinging. Still need proper free roaming gameplay to come to a conclusion, but it seems like we're stuck with artificial and automated swinging.
i think they just overhauled the web sound effects, it seemed the exact same "holding your hand" type swinging unfortunately
Tbh that decreases a lot of the excitement I had for that game. Cuz I've already sunk hours in that swinging system and am quite bored by it, I don't need to spend money to get the same swinging system because I can play that right now.
I was really looking forward to seeing an improved version of the web swinging in Spiderman 2, but from the gameplay trailers, it still has the same problems as the first two games, which was extremely disappointing to me. Oh well. Maybe they’ll improve it in Spiderman 3
They are people who like to please everybody... they can still add it as an option, becuase they are people who love to give players veriety on what they can do when it comes to accessibility.
They have said that we only got a taste on what we saw.
So we shall see...
Just have faith.
This is what happens when all feedback gets immediately shut down sadly was hoping for a swinging overhaul the swinging is way way way on rails for a character that thrives off the thrill of freedom and freeflow
I love when people mention features from prototypes to be added in games as if it was a drag and drop of content. AI models are incredibly hard to make. Like really hard. I’m a data scientist and we need around thousands of training data before we are able to fully test and build our models. How much data do you think nvidia needed to have to train their model? Also, spiderman is a fully blown video game with various textures/materials as well as other systems. If you want a game to come out in a 5-7 year period, don’t expect “AI” animations in your AAA games lol
This was an interesting video, well done too. For my own thoughts on swinging I think Insomniac did really well with the mechanics. Personally I like that it holds my hand to a degree with the swinging. I have a disability and only the use of my left hand. (I'm playing it on PC by the way). I can set all the controls to the left side of the keyboard and just go full bore through the city at amazing speed. There are points where the game gives me a hand, but I don't really notice it. Partly because Insomniac worked really hard to hide that behind the scenes. But more to the point that helping hand made me feel like Spider-Man to such a degree that it didn't matter. (Though I agree with what you said about Central Park).
To add onto what you suggested I think that perhaps there could be, three levels of swinging. Perhaps you could select one from the accessibility menu. The first would be what we got in Insomniac's SM1 and presumably Miles Morales. The second could be a bit more intensive where you get a greater level of freedom to pull of the tricks and swinging mechanics with less handholding and helps you get used to the tougher mechanics unaided. The third, could be advanced and incorporate the parkour and movement animations that Insomniac got right, but gives the player more total control over swinging, running, diving etc.
Holy heck what is this production value? In the first 15 seconds I’ve already seen more effort than any RUclips video I’ve seen today, and I just watched a Mark Rober video.
This video perfectly captures the small issues with the swinging system, amazing job as always
You definitely spot on the problem with insomniac spider man swinging, especially on web control and momentum also the willingness of let player fail and stumble upon swinging. At first I thought the lack of dedicated wall attach button,you know so that I could stop swinging whenever I wanted to, is the problem, but after seeing your explanation its all about web control and momentum and insomniac definitely need to see this video.
Spider man 2 definitely improved in this aspect
It happened! Spider-Man 2 for PS5 has this implemented! Although it’s a slider setting so you can adjust how much swinging assist you want. It is very cool.
Bro got his wish 🙏🙏
now you have those options
??? No
@@ianfrankegordon4182yes
Ehhh... I hope in SM3 they do the actual "Select your swinging mode" thing, since everyone complained that it wasn't worked on because they didn't know about the assist slider. They should give it to you as an option on the new game menu instead of going into accessibility, and you still should have things like loop-de-loop and corner tether as basic movement abilities, not unlockable skills.
Having played Spider-Man 2 and not being good at swinging beforehand, i can ASSURE u the swinging is better in this one and i DEFINITELY lose momentum when i hit a wall or hit the ground now. Its realistic and makes my failure hurt💀
Also they even added a fall damage option
Wait until u die due to loop swing 😂
Finally a criticism of most these games I can fully get behind. I think the reason they don't make the swing system more realistic is to streamline the experience for players. But I think what they miss is a swing system that emphasized momentum would feel more fun and make traversal more strategic and interesting.
i think the ability to stay held onto a web should totally be added in. i wanna do a full loop dude!
10 months later, and wow, theyve definitley improved it, especially if youve seen the leaks
My fear is that since it's coming too fast, Spider-Man two will basically have the same exact swinging physics as the first game. Which is fun, but they can and should do better.
Miles was released not too far from the 1st game, yet it still made pretty noticable improvements to the swinging. At least the looking cool part.
@@insertnamehere658 Yeah, but looking cool is all about animations. I hope they improve on the physics and mechanics.
@@CANELA-cnm I have the same concern, I'm not really holding my breath on that aspect of the game unfortunately, I feel like it'll just be flashier animations with no actual improvement to the physics :/
@@Cybernyde yep. I hope we're very wrong!
It'll be 5 years since the first one by the time Spider-Man 2 comes out...
you can contol nd steer while swinging, shifting weight does so. you can also steer a bowling ball with rotation
Can we talk about why fall damage is the boogeyman? My palms still sweat when I'm swinging atop the highest buildings in Spider-Man PS2 but in the PS4 game I can be in any difficult situation barreling towards the ground and feel nothing because it's 0 risk. 100% the new Insomniac game needs lethal fall damage but 100% they won't implement that.
Personally, I wouldn’t think Spider-Man could die while falling. He’s superhuman after all.
@@christopherjohnsonthe2ndch644 Maybe not lethal fall damage then but like 90%-95%, then just tweak the game so it’s harder to leave combat scenarios with full health and there you go, looming threat of death and once again thrilling movement.
If they implement that, people will go fucking nuts and complain because the game would be "too hard".
@@pepe_s1lvia I played dark souls 1, 3, in progress of 2, finished Sekiro twice, beat Bloodborne countless times. If they do that I would not have any 'its too hard' gripes
This isn’t elden ring
Honestly in Spider Man 2 they should make it where the speed increases by a percentage every time you do a perfect swing. And it shouldn't have a limit. This will challenge players to try and get the fastest speed.
Insomniac did a really good job with Spider-Man (2018) and Miles Morales and were improved for the PS5 versions for sure, but some ragdoll physics other than when Spider-Man dies would be nice
Another thing I wanted was like the force of the web pulling on spiderman,so basically like in the opening of the amazing spiderman 2 when hes in first person,you can see how hes getting pulled by the webs,also his body is turning and not always facing forward
Bro rly foreshadowed Spiderman 2 swing physics
I still think the best "web swinging" comes from the 2013 Attack on Titan Unity "tribute game" where you have to aim your hooks and you can play with momentum. Yes, it is difficult. Yes, it has a leaning curve. But it is rewarding.
and this is why you voice your criticisms folks
Also, in web of shadows you’re able to hang onto and swing around the lamp posts
Now this is interesting
Dude your content is amazing there some of the best videos I’ve ever watched on youtube didn’t expect to see you here lol 😂
@@ToastedHeadcrab Eyyy nice to see a fan here
Legends say Spiderman's webs were stuck to Uncle Ben in the initial Games
He predicted spider man 2 swing assist
Nah... people asked, and they listened.
Though, there's still more WORK to be done upon it! They truly do listen to us fans.
this video aged so well after marvels spiderman 2's release
I honestly dont find anything wrong with the swinging in this game. I think it overall feels the best. But that doesn't mean, it cannot be improved. I do understand your take man. Love this video
Spider-Man 2 to this day, still has the best swing system to date. Insomniac’s system is far too hand holding and gets very boring very quickly since there’s no need for skill. Hopefully marvels Spider-Man 2 changes that and takes the reign as having the best swing system
The moment I saw Mile's glide suit in the trailer a few weeks back I was like, "does Insomniac even want us to enjoy their spider-games?"
You could make the same video for 3D sonic games and momentum.
This is the time where realism is no longer tied to graphics and world size/scope only... PHYSICS is now probably thee most important aspect of video games, but its kind of neglected. In Sonic games, In Skateboarding Games, In GTA like games, and in the new Spider-Man.
Physics is so important. But I feel like we are still in the 7th gen era when it comes to physics (with GTA5 its worst cos they went backwards.)
The new spiderman game has something to do with where the camera is facing, if you follow with the camera up at the end of the swing, pete or miles doesn't let go the web and you can perform something similar, but yeah, i wish they had an option activate/deactivate the swing assists. Thanks for the video btw!
One of my favorite bits about SM2 was using two webs to turn yourself into a slingshot. I forgot how fast you could go in that game until these clips. In the newest ones, I find myself avoiding getting too close to a street or roof if it means it makes spidey float.
I do appreciate the callbacks to the older games, though. "My boy lost his balloon and Spiderman didn't get it back. #JJJatHome was right! He's a menace!"
So do we just forget the amazing Spider-Man 2 game existed? I like the swinging there
I understand that this is different from your typical GTA content, but I'd really like to see you make more videos like this, whether it be Spider-Man or something else. Also, I really appreciate you making this video as not enough people criticize Spider-Man PS4's web swinging. But the unfortunate fact of the matter is that as these Spider-Man games are AAA, it also means they have to be accessible to even the worst player. Casual gamers dislike challenge and that means unless Insomniac incorporates a separate mode for challenging web swinging and easy web swinging like Spider-Man 2, then I doubt Spider-Man 2 PS5 is going to be more challenging.
What I think should be a swinging system is to have R2 as right swing with right arm and L2 with the other arm giving that feeling of web swinging
Tasm games did it but it feels unnecessary
Finally a video that summerizes all my opinions about Spider-Man PS4 in relation to PS2 covering everything I have ever thought.
Just one thing you did not mention Is that at the beginning of a new game in Spider-Man 2 for PS2 you could choose between 2 kinds of swinging mechanics, an "arcade" one, simpler, and a physics based one. I hope Marvel's Spider-Man 2 will feature a "phisics mod" for swinging.
In spiderman 2018, if you dont let go of r2 and push the left stick to the opposite direction, peter turns around and geta slower. If you continue that, you can fet him to stop swinging and hang from his web.
So that's why the swinging didn't appeal to me in the new Spider-man games. It was okay, but didn't have the joy of the Ps2 Spider-man which had me playing it for hours, just to go swinging.
8:12 more accurately, the death of uncle ben holding web swinging.
spider-man 2 answered your prayers
Having two or more options for swinging mechanics is a perfect solution, give players the choice. Many videos like this I've seen ask for risk but don't consider its very difficult for the game to tell if you wall running was a failed swing or something intentional but with options that allowed for a more easy and higher risk option they can have their cake and eat it too
Looks like insomniac watches your video
i like how in spider man 2, when you hit a building, it still holds onto his web while running sideways. It's awesome.
This may sound weird but my favorite swinging mechanic is the one in Fortnite. There you have complete control of your swing, you can actually aim where you want to attach the webs. I really hope this kind of swinging mechanic to be explored more in spider man games.
I hope Insomniac's Spider-Man 2 actually improves on its predecessors' flaws, and makes it closer to the OG Spider-Man 2.
I Subscribed on your channel just yesterday. And for today I watched a lot of your videos and liked it.
I am not even English speaker, and not used to watch content on foreign language. But your videos are unique and interesting, so I truly watch it with curiousity. So much right things you saying, and talks about not ordinary themes.
Thanks for your work! Nice job you did 👍🏻
Thank you! I would like to get my videos translated but i'm not really sure how to do it honestly.
@@DarkSpaceStudios It depends on which one you prefer.
I saw translated Nostalgia Critic content, this is just Russian channel, that make dub on every critic video.
And second way, is subtitles on your videos
Someone played Spider--Man 2000 on Kid Mode x,D
The swinging in that game was actually deeper than people think.
If you went into manual aiming mode and were at the right distance from your target destination you could swing very precisely in that game. You could also extend your web swinging by cancelling it with the jump button to start a new and if you did it right you could get 3-4
consecutive swings.
Enter Electro had some short comings but one thing that was good about that sequel was Xavier's danger room challenges which taught you tricks you might not have learned while beating the first game.
@@zion6680 yea, I did all of those things. It's still rudimentary
Sudden Idea: Give him the "advanced" swinging, with all the safeties off... until he puts on the symbiote. So long as post-game allows you to freely alternate, it could be a cool way to showcase the sheer power and invincibility of the symbiote, while also subtly suggesting that the suit is in control.
I like this idea
Interesting
If insomniac can physics from a game like Just Cause, it would fit so well
Congrats on 159k subs
Thank you! Unreal!
The problem with physics engines like Euphoria is the massive amount of bugs that come with it, we all remember Niko falling flat on his face in GTA for daring to bump into a stationary car, swinging should be a power fantasy.
Thank you so much I’ve been saying Spider-Man 2 was still elite swing and to this day or until they do something like this to perfect it in the future. People where biased with Spider-Man ps4 swinging mechanics and I argued and argued and argued. Nobody was getting it. The way you articulated this was what I’ve been trying to explain. I thought I was crazy. I hate the fact the Spider-Man has unlimited agility and ways to get around and with style but it’s held back disrespectfully. Spider man 2 and I’ll say, even Spider-Man web of shadows and ultimate Spider-Man had something going with the physics that are true to Spider-Man’s nature. Especially climbing on the web while swinging I loved that so much. That’s why I love his poses while he’s swinging on his web and threw the air and multiple ways of agility and speed. But people that I spoke too were very little minded and wasn’t looking at the big picture about Spider-Mans web swinging in PlayStation 5. Like even from the movies adaptations of Spider-Man’s winging I wished where implemented in games today. Spider-Man ps5 (4) even miles morales could’ve just used what they have already but just add it with Spider-Man 2’s mechanics. But for some reason no. I’m glad there’s people like you that recognize this. This is not a knock to Spider-Man ps5 but I feel like it still could’ve been better. Especially with the technology today. Like cmon Spider-Man 2 did it on ps2 like for real. You mean to tell me a highly advanced console and the technology we have today can’t even compete with something that was made a decade ago? Cmon now stop playing with my boi Spidey and get his swinging correct.
It's not that they couldn't have collisions, they obviously can. The game recognises that there will be a collision so does something to prevent it whilst still looking natural. I do prefer it like that to be honest. The question which the devs obviously asked themselves during development is should they.
Not every aspect of a game needs to be punishing, swinging in a Spider-Man game should involve some hand holding so that players can look good doing it and get that satisfaction, remember even the original reasoning behind a physics based system was to not be realistic, but to make players feel like Spider-Man, spider-man doesn't crash into buildings, he does break his swing and run up them. The real punishment should and does come in the form of the combat.
Insomniacs swing system is a great balance between giving players control, but also having preset animations and hand holding to keep the swinging looking good and maintain momentum. I think a genuine improvement to be made will be to in regards to swinging low and redirecting to go through pipes and gaps. Low swinging doesn't look good sometimes when the game forces it, neither does this strange float redirection when you go to webzip through a small gap, so there's no loss in preventing that from happening. But I don't think building collisions should be a thing, perhaps running or even sliding along the ground when you launch a web when low to the ground whilst swinging would be a cool aesthetic change.
It be best if they just did like spiderman 2 and give actual options between casual and skilled swinging.
i think to this day that spider-man 2‘s and wos web swinging and traversal options are absolutely the peak of movement
for me the reason why spider-man 2‘s animations don‘t seem that flashy is due to the way tobey‘s spidey moves. while yes you can see the occasionial air acrobatic he‘s pulling off he usually tries to be at his destination as fast as he can. his movies show why that is since usually whenever you see a swinging scene it evolves around him trying to save
i think sm2 (the game) encapsulated that style of swinging with you getting from a to point b if you‘ve haven‘t mastered swinging that well yet, however there is a insane skill gap in sm2 showing a newbie and a master controlling the game
a newbie will hit the walls often and slip the opportunity to catch yourself from falling with a swing. he won‘t memorize the city‘s layout yet since he still hasn‘t grasped the mechanics
while a master takes full advantage of the traversal options making it look like one of these clips you can see at the cinema of a dev doing an „insane“ level race. he memorized the city‘s layout due to him spending alot of time swinging,looping, flipping, climbing, wall sliding, wall running, pole swinging web ziping and more.
while wos takes it a little more user friendly i‘ll always argue that the learning curve of sm2 is essential for wanting to be better and be an absolute beast at moving in extremely fast pace without hitting a while once without him going for it
*Exaggurated swagger of a black teen intesifies*
15:22 especially
So what I’ve always wanted is a smaller scale swing. Like in the amazing Spider-Man 1 movie how he because “unlocked” big swings with the cranes. Limited to walls and small swings could make a city feel 10x bigger
I think they should save that swinging mechanic for Daredevil, if they ever actually make that game.
Don’t know about anyone else but I love the swinging in Miles Morales. All the animations and just how it feels is so nice to me. Speed feels perfect in it. I’m just now hearing about people wanting to go Sonic 06 speeds lol. Those speed mods look crazy
Don't forget faster wallcrawling, it kinda kills then momentum of traversal the way it is currently.
I just want to say beenox are not that bad yes tasm and tasm2 had flaws like the cloud swinging from the first game, But to be fair these games were underdeveloped because of activision's greed, but they still managed to pull off good stuff like spider man shattered dimensions which is a fucking masterpiece and edge of time that was also underdeveloped but still had and amazing story not to mention that they are more familiar with linear level design like in shattered dimensions and edge of time so it makes sense for them to not have much experience with open world games and realistic swinging, also one great thing that I have to give them credit for: they once asked fans what character they wanted to see in tasm2 and everyone chose carnage so they added him into the game for fan service, Yes tasm and tasm 2 ARE bad games but I think you were a little rude when talking about the devs of beenox, Also shouldn't spider man web of shadows be in this video?
On one hand, things like levitating off the ground while swinging can definitely be immersion breaking.
On the other, I don't want to have my swinging completely fucked because Central Park just happens to be between me and my objective. That's how you kill a player's fun while traversing
LMAO or you could simply know how to swing around there. You're making this seem like a huge chore when in Spider-Man 2, Ultimate Spider-Man and Spider-Man 3, swinging in Central Park wasn't so difficult as long as you stay low
I remember someone telling me once, “A dude can climb walls using only his bare hands and you’re concerned about the physics of his swinging?”
Glad to know I’m not the only one. 😂
Because they can't argue half the damn time. It's just deflection
I always really hated that logic. Yes, asshole, I do expect the world with dragons flying about and people shooting fire from their fingers to at least follow its own established rules; otherwise, it's just not a great piece of media.
Cool it with the beenox slander. They gave us the gem of Shattered dimensions.
some f ur ideas r imported in spiderman 2 (not sure i watched this vid long time ago)
15:29 Miles Morales air tricks are inspired and almost based on free fallers, parachuters
I think you hit the nail on the head with Spiderman 2018. It has the best swinging of any spiderman game so far yet there is still room to improve. The new swinging should require a bit more skill to master. Would love to see some fall damage as well from tall heights to add a bit more risk.
It’s flying with swinging animations. Only Spider-Man 2 and USM have swinging.
@@burner3185 ???