Dragon's Dogma Enchanted Weapons

[@raven75257]

Dear god... At this point you can be called the number 1 fan of this game

[@SylemGistoe]

holy shit, the amount of downtime that goes into testing stuff like this with having to constantly load out and reload- this game never gave proper information on abilities and no decent way to test things out- thank you so much for putting in the effort on stuff like this.

[@Nihil0.0]

It's true. These take some time to arrange and setup and I always test more than once, just for solid results.

[@HeyzDexy]

@@Nihil0.0 Do you have multiple game saves (characters)?

[@xGarrettThiefx]

This just goes to show that the ppl that made this game poured a lot of love and attention to detail into it !!

[@layerp]

I guess this wouldn't be possible without dinput8

[@dirtlord7257]

wouldn't saving and then godsbaning save like, a lot of time? i know this is in hindsight at this point but i think that would be faster right

[@DoctorJRedBeard]

Great video! I can actually shed some light on a few things. It's been a long time, but there are a few spreadsheets online that show basic formulas for most attacks, and I have played hundreds of hours of this game and can confirm their accuracy.
Split damage is inferior, except when exploiting a weakness. When any class uses a sword, bow, longbow, longsword, mace, or daggers, the *exact* damage calculation is as follows:
[(Arisen Str + Wep Str) - Enemy Def] + (Wep Mag - Enemey Mag Def)
Notice how Arisen base mag is completely ignored for all standard attacks, meaning split classes still recieve no enhanced effects from split weapons. For all, and I do mean all, physical-based skills, base Mag continues to have no effect whatsoever.
The *ONLY* time base Mag is calculated for split classes, much like your own discovery, is for their magic-based skills. Let's take, for instance, Great Cannon, Mystic Knight's most popular, and almost undebatably most powerful, skill. The formula is as follows:
[(Wep Str × 0.5) + (Wep Mag × 0.5) + (Arisen Mag × 1.5)] - Enemy Mag Def
Notice how both weapon str and mag are multiplied by 0.5? This means, without question, that the total of a weapon's Str and Mag is the only factor in determining the damage of the skill. The strongest pure Phys weapon is higher than the cumulative stats of the most powerful split weapon for every class except Mage and Sorc, meaning pure Phys is still the best option. I've not noticed split weapons making magic based skills significantly more powerful, except when exploiting weaknesses.
The kicker here, for Great Cannon at least, is that while the cannon doesn't reflect it in its appearance, split damage weapons do impart their elemental effect to the cannon, so exploiting enemy weaknesses can be profoundly effective.
Even Magick Archer's Immolation dagger skill completely ingores Mag, scaling all it's damage on Str.
Now, AFAIK, we don't have exact formulas for every skill, but pure phys is the most base damage in nearly 100% of circumstances. Note how in the standard attack formula, both the enemy's def and mag def are calculated. This means you need to pass 2 Def checks to deal damage. Let's say you deal 100 damage, 50 Phys, 50 Mag, and you strike an enemy with 25 Def and 25 Mag Def.
(50 - 25) + (50 - 25) = 50 total damage dealt.
Now, what if you dealt 100 pure phys?
(100 - 25) + (0 - 25) = 75 total damage dealt, since you can't deal negative damage.
Now plug all that in while noting that base Str is calculated, but base Mag is not.

[@zhanusheaperd5728]

DoctorJRedBeard Thank you for the information. I always felt like I did less damage with Split Damage weapons.

[@TheRaiko777]

Your explanation using Magic Cannon seems flawed. By the calculation you provided, you're adding the halved values of a weapon's phys and mag damage, then adding the Arisen base magic boosted by 1.5 times, then totalling those values together and subtracting the enemy magic resistance.
So in that case, take an Arisen with 450 base magic attack. The Great cannon scaling should add 675 value to the formula. Now try the Cursed Bite (phys: 1524 gold forged) and calculate.. 1524 ÷ 2 (same thing as × 0.5) = 762 , adding the 675 value = 1437
Now take Cursed Light ( the magic equivalent sword, gold forged phys 974 and magic 708) and calculate with the same 675 Arisen value.. 974 × 0.5 = 487 phys, then 708 ÷ 2 = 354, added together equals 841, adding arisen's 675 = 1,516
And you said you take whatever the total value is and subtract it solely from enemy's magic defense, not including their phys defense, so if that is the case then the Split/Enchanted weapon would do more damage... provided the enemy does not have a resistance to the element. Although the Devil's whatever sword, the Daimon level sword, would end up calculating to 1,599 damage eking it out to slightly more damage than the split weapon.
That aside, it seems like Arisen base magic value plays a significant part in the damage calculation if this is true.
But the Dragon's Dogma wiki page for Great Cannon describes the damage calculation differently (using more vague.. approximate calculations), so what led you to believe your calculations? I wont deny that using physical weapons seems generally more successful unless using a Split Class's magical abilities, Nihil's video proves as much, or exploiting elemental weaknesses, because of the high defense thresholds need to be overcome with a high singular damage output rather than a split damage that doesnt break through.

[@tmy8711]

Interesting. So how is weakness calculated? Lower physical/magical defense to certain damage types? In your example it seems that physical is better because you can not deal negative damage.

[@DoctorJRedBeard]

@@TheRaiko777 straight up necromancy on this post but whatever
So, like you pointed out witg the Lv 3 Bitterblack sword doing the most damage. Yes, because the total damage of the weapon is higher, which is all that matters since Phys and Mag get reduced by 50%
Cursed Bite does 1524 Phys and 0 Mag, a total of 1524. So for the purpose of the formula, 762 damage.
Cursed Light does 974 Phys, 708 Mag, a total of 1682. For the purpose of the formula, 841 damage
As you pointed out, Devilsbane does 1848 Phys and 0 Mag, a total of 1848. For the purpose of the formula, 924 damage
So the *cumulative* number is all that's important, and since the best weapons for all but Magick Bow, Staff, and Archistaff are all pure physical, then that's the best
As far as where I found the info... I can't remember and I'm not going to go on the goose chase to find out. Information on Dragon's Dogma is hard to find in most cases anyway, and even harder to verify with legitimate formulas. What can be said with absolute certainty is that Virve of Madness, a 2001 Physical Damage mace, is objectively the strongest weapon for a MK to use, and Great Cannon reflects this in a way that feels reasonably consitent with the formula I was informed of. Again, I am not 100% certain, and nobody but Capcom is going to be since information is so scant
However, omitting Great Cannon, pure phys weapons still win out on the field of regular attacks. Since a standard attack needs to pass both Phys and Mag defense, and the Arisen's base Mag is not calculated for melee weapons, bows, or longbows even if they are split damage weapons, pure Phys weapons only get mitigated a single time, by the opponent's Phys Def. Split Damage weapons' solo Mag stat is pitted against the opponent's Mag Def, which, unless exploiting a weakness, will almost always deal less damage, but with a few exceptions. Obviously this falls under the caveat that the weapons being tested need to have similar cumulative damage stats, but the point stands. This is something you can test easily by just looking at the "Damage Dealt" tab in your Arisen's info page after each attack against the same enemy
Edit to add: Base Mag does seem to be the most important attributor to Great Cannon damage, hence the 1.5x multiplier in the formula
However, Great Cannon itself does split damage on it's own *regardless* of weapon used. This can be confirmed because they can destroy Golem Medals, which are immune to all magick, and Ghosts, which are immune to Physical. The wiki claims this is approximately a 2:3 damage ratio if I understand it correctly, but I genuinely have no idea and cannot even begin to make a guess. Capcom is crazy

[@DoctorJRedBeard]

@@tmy8711 So... I have no idea! And as far as I can tell, there are absolutely no concrete numbers on how weakness works. Hell, my formula for Great Cannon is still speculation I got from a spreadsheet years ago, we know surprisingly little about the inner machinations of damage and defense overall
Pure Phys is typically the best choice because it only has to pass an enemy's defense once: their Physical Defense. Split Damage weapons do not take your base Mag into account, so the weapon's innate Mag Atk stat is all that gets pitted against the opponent's Mag Def.
For example: you have 250 base STR and a sword with 250 STR and 500 MAG. Since your base Mag is ignored, it is irrelevant. This gives you 500 Str and 500 Mag Atk. Your opponent has 500 Phys Def and 500 Mag Def. If you attack them, they mitigate your Phys and Mag separately. Obviously, this results in you dealing 0 damage.
Now, let's say you have a sword with 750 Phys and 0 Mag, and still 250 base Str. This is 1000 Phys Atk, that only gets pitted against the opponent's 500 Phys Def, meaning you instantly deal 500 damage, quite a bit more than 0
Negative damage is not a thing afaik, since that would be "healing". If your Phys/Mag Atk is lower than their relevant Def, you simply deal no damage.

[@grayKT]

*takes enchanted daggers away from my strider pawn*
M. Archer: "Im keeping these"
Pawn: "What about your physical daggers?"
M. Archer: "...I'm keeping those too."
Pawn having been with me for 100 levels: "Fuck you"

[@varunjagaddeb108]

Now that does give us a good knowledge about the correct usage of enchanted weapon

[@lucasrv2630]

And the wonderful knowledge that you actually CAN level up 1-10 fighter and 11-200 Assassin without worries.
*Evil hysterical laugh* ..."I'll take a potato chip...and EAT IT."

[@josephmarina2883]

@@lucasrv2630 Hahahahaha, good one

[@LordBovyn]

13:42 according to the Fandom, banshee have 300 physical resistance but *1600* magical resistance

[@demetrius9291]

Your gonna make me start playing dragons dogma again... 🙂

[@Nihil0.0]

Good. That is one of my primary objectives

[@ivanmartinez714]

Bro you look like a business man. You play dogma?

[@zwaffless]

So pretty much, enchanted weapons for physical classes are next to useless since all (with few exceptions i.e. toss and trigger) skills take your strength stat and not your magic stat, but for split vocations who have skills that make use of your magic stat elemental weapons are useful to exploit enemy weaknesses and in lower levels add a bit of oompf to some abilities.

[@Nihil0.0]

Yep pretty much. Physical vocations (even though stats imply split) typically will result better with physical weapons. And split vocations typically can go either way, but I myself prefer an Enchanted MK and an Enchanted MA. ANd then Magic vocation don't benefit enough with a perma enchanted staff, as it only effects the core attacks, and also does not apply the piercing factor of Holy Focused Bolt would, when wielding a Holy staff.

[@josephmarina2883]

Thanks for these videos dude, they make me apreciate the game even more

[@Nihil0.0]

Nice, Thanks Joseph

[@redeye259]

Just started playing DDDA on PC for the first time, I’m glad you’re still putting out such helpful content after all this time the game has been out. It’s really helpful for a new player like me! New sub.

[@Nihil0.0]

Nice. I am happy that they help Rushane

[@redeye259]

​@@Nihil0.0 So I'm just trying to make a general summary for myself to understand how to use enchanted and physical weapons with the different vocations (i.e. physical vs split). I get that on a physical class 90% of the time it's better to stick with a physical weapon, with the other 10% being fire/holy vs undead. For a split vocation when is it better to use a physical weapon? The examples you showed with MK vs Banshee and MA vs Elder Ogre both seem to be such rare cases that I think it's an even lower percent than using enchanted weapons on a physical class. My opinion it's like 99% of the time I'd want to run with an enchanted weapon on a split class, are there more cases outside of what you showed that I should be aware of?

[@Nihil0.0]

@@redeye259 correct for the physical vocations. For split vocations, well.... for MK physical is best for enemies that have high magic defense (usually) like Banshee, Goblin Shamen, or Thunderwywern. For MA it's similar, BUT only the dagger skills Scension and Sunflare truly benefit from Enchanted Daggers. The cutting wind or kisses will be best with physical. Then immolation is mostly best with physical, unless they have a weakness to fire, then Enchated immolation. MK has more skills than MA that benefit with Enchanted, mostly because MK has basically 5 Ruinous sigil options and 5 Cannon options, with the Element produced.

[@ural0304]

Started playing DD again and I really appreciate your videos.

[@trippyofthemelons2873]

2years after the video was made and i still watch them to learn. Love em man

[@stefanandrei0208]

Greetings Nihil0.0.
Thank you for creating and sharing this videos on youtube. I appreciate your efforts.
The video touches the points of interest regarding the chosen subject. The ideas are well structured and presented.
I dare say, this video is the best source of information on the enchanted weapons from Dragon's Dogma. Well done, man! Well done. :)

[@Nihil0.0]

Thank you Stefan. I do spend lots of time with some of these videos. Testing, and evaluating alone takes some time. I appreciate your words friend.

[@TheRaiko777]

Your videos are very inspiring because I love so much about this game.
I'm doing some damage calculations based off of the formulas provided on the fan wiki site (although they admit the damage is never perfect). Mystic Knight is my favorite class, so I've been picking through its skills versus the various baddies of Bitterblack Isle. You're definitely right about the Magic based fighting vocations benefiting well from the permanent enchanted weapons.
If I'm doing the calcs right, for instance, while doing basic attacks on the Elder Ogre with raw damage Cursed Bite versus enchanted swords Cursed Light or Caladbolg, Bite can do damage and the other weapons fall off hard or do nothing at all (depending on Arisen base stats).
But then you take the M.K.'s favorite ability Great Cannon.. And the Caladbolg, thanks to E. Ogre's weakness to lightning, will end up doing significantly more damage with each magic orb than ones that the Cursed Light (because of E. Ogre being resistant to Holy) or even the Devilsbane which has the highest raw damage, despite how Caladbolg (gold forged) is a vastly weaker base weapon.
I've only been able to try these out on paper, but I'm eager to explore if this is true when I get the chance.

[@travispaskiewicz2663]

Split damage is a weird beast, but only because defenses are straight forward. If you weren't aware, defenses are just straight up subtracted from an attack. As a simple example: if you have a total of 100 weapon+base strength, but your opponents physical defense is 100, you deal 0 damage. You have to have enough damage to defeat thier defenses or you do nothing.
And that is why split damage is either super disappointing or absolutely game breaking. If you're relying on base strength and magic with an enchanted weapon, you will often barely beat these defense thresholds to deal damage. However... skills have damage multipliers, as do augments and items. If you can get both your strength and magick multiplied to vastly defeat defensive thresholds, you'll start to see a huge power curve favoring split damage.

[@cloudbloom]

I remember farming wandering sorcerer pawns (outside of towns) using master thief skill to hopefully steal a set of kunai daggers. You can get a shitload of good items from pawns by using that skill, for example stealing from a warrior pawn gives you sour ambrosial meat. You can steal from the same pawns on the road just by going far enough away from them where they disappear on screen, go back to where they were and once they appear you can use the master thief skill on them again. Each pawn vocation gives you different types of items, kunai is a rare steal you can only get from a sorcerer etc

[@Vladarius.]

Its kinda hard to hear what youre saying bro, the background is a bit too high i guess

[@poynt100]

Lol he's the Bob Ross of Gaming!

[@garlicexpress5008]

nah that silky sultry voice is perfection.

[@Vladarius.]

@@garlicexpress5008 it is but the background noise is too high so it hard to hear him talk.

[@garlicexpress5008]

@@Vladarius. I hear ya buddy im just makin jokes. no harm.

[@Vladarius.]

@@garlicexpress5008 i see, alrighty bro take care o7

[@ryangray8392]

For boons and affinities from what I've gathered it adds a percentage of the magic stat of the caster to the target. But if the target has a higher magic stat then the caster it actually reduces the targets magic stat.
I play MK and my pawn is a pure support mage. If my MK casts a boon/affinity/pact the party's damage goes up, when my mage does it my damage goes down. Not by much but it's noticeable.

[@Nihil0.0]

That sounds like the case. I don't have pawns very often, so I haven't tested that, but I do know between the 3 levels, not much is increased with damage numbers, mostly just duration, I think.

[@mekudu-man3804]

dunno man, I always have a Sorcerer with me to give me boons and I do tons more damage with them than with physical attacks alone (I literally shred through enemies that normally take abysmal damage in comparison w/o them).
This worked for me so far as a strider, ranger and even as a warrior (but I do tons of damage with warrior regardless lol).
I also noticed that ice eboons let me shred through these lizardmen with spears (instant freezes them and I kill them in no time) and even fire boons let me deal more damage to them than without boons.
There is also something that both this video and you failed to mention - the additional side effects that enchanted weapons can have on enemies.
Fire daggers can set enemies on fire, causing additional damage, ice weapons can freeze, thunder weapons can stun etc.
I think that this also has a big impact of the usefulness of said enchanted weapon or boon.
Just a thought.

[@ryangray8392]

@@mekudu-man3804 boons key off the caster's stats. So while any boon will increase overall damage, it's better to have the pawn or character with the higher magic stat cast it. Mechanically how it works: let's say the target a stat of 1200 while the caster stat is 900 and it's a boon (10% increase), it will increase the target's magic stat by 10% of 900 then lower it by 10% of 1200. Thus only benefit of having a lower magic stat pawn cast is the secondary effect of boons (taking advantage of enemy weaknesses).

[@SoftBoiledArt]

Necro posting but wiki states that boons stop scaling after 300 mag and after reaching a certain character level (lets say 54 for the sake of it) what you're noticing is Trance being WAY stronger than Boon/Aff.

[@dmac93065]

Nice video. I learned a lot about the split vocations and split weapons. I like using the Almace in New Game+ and on BBI. Have long noticed my damage output vs banshees was always low when wielding that weapon at sub-50 levels. Glad to know there was a reason for it. I usually had to switch to a sword like Dragon's dogma. This game never ceases to amaze me with how intricately designed it was. They could have created specific versions of MK & MA that either debilitated or exploited elemental weaknesses. Most of us gamers just built our characters around what we liked doing most but if were a character type this game may have had more universal appeal. Nice job again on this video I learned something new.

[@Nihil0.0]

yeah, the enchanted weapons and the boons are still confusing with many regards. I think a big thing is that the game's stat progress is misleading with Ranger and Strider, leaving us to believe it is considered as a split vocation, where enchanted weapons make sense, but instead it's just an easy way to level a balance of strength and magic. I still favor Ranger's stats for that beautiful stamina pool though. I will take stamina over strength any day. But yes, MK and MA I still go as a split, with enchanted weapons as the primary. MK has about 10 skills that can utilize enchanted weapons while MA only has 2 or 3, but I typically don't go for MA as an Immolation Climber, if I want to climb I will always go for Strider.
That's why MK is considered a struggle in early levels with lower tier weapons, the split attack vs split defense doesn't always break through, compared to the pure strength or pure magic attack vs the defense, it is higher and so, it breaks through. Banshee was a good example of this, but still she should take Ice damage. But then we see the opposite with Garm and lighting vs pure strength, where the split of sigil couldn't break the defense. So yeah, still a little confusing, the enchanted weapons

[@dmac93065]

@@Nihil0.0 It is confusing. I like to think game developers were going somewhere with this mechanic bit release dates and pressure to beat other titles to their target audience. I like that we can to keep with it a bit but it does feel somewhat unfinished.

[@NihilisticAkuma]

I've always been very curious about this since my first playthrough where I though having the right type of weakness on said weapon would instead multiple the dmg, Great video.

[@Nihil0.0]

In earlier levels, when we have low tier weapons anyways, the Enchanted weapons do sometimes stand out, but eventually, we surpass them with other weapons, and then they become truly only useful or needed for Ghost enemies. But still each element has it's use. The ability to freeze an enemy and get a knockdown bonus is nice, or to immobilize some enemies when they are caught on fire is nice, stunning and keeping an enemy stunned from shock is nice, and the crits from Dark can be a good surprise, healing with holy.

[@mekudu-man3804]

@@Nihil0.0 you should've mentioned this in the video.
I just wrote a whole pargraph detailing it and finding you commenting on it here just made it all for naught...

[@willberk85]

Hi! Relatively new to the channel but really enjoying it. Re: banshee, her m def is almost 5x her physical, so that's why cannon did more with phy weapon. Even only using 50% was still 700 dmg post mitigation

[@Lancia444]

You sir, deserve to be employed by Capcom for your efforts! DD2!

[@tralhas]

great video... as ever. I Love this game and I play regularly since it's release.
But you, sir, is a hero for the people of Gran Soren.

[@Nihil0.0]

Thanks Tales. I try.

[@gurixd100]

What I know about it is:
Enchanted weapons do not scale with your magic stat, so if they have 500 fire damage, they will do 500 fire damage, period.
Affinities boost the damage of your weapon, thus increasing the damage they deal. It's a flat value that increases with rank, sorcerer boons increase rather weakly per rank while MK gets big boosts each rank.
I guess that's it, really. BTW if I may say so, shame on capcom for not releasing one single drenched status weapon and not a single lightning enhanted bow! It would be so freaking cool! Imagine casting Frazil with Drenched staff and freezing everything around you for CC.

[@edorsi84]

Nihil putting on a clinic!

[@jaydenlobbe7911]

So in regards to the Banshee, it's not actually weak to Ice, it is just resistant to Fire, Thunder and Dark
And you are right about your weapon not meeting it's Magick Defense threshold, it has 1,600 Magick Defense, no way you could reach that with an Elemental Weapon, you can however reach the Physical Defense threshold with the weapon you're using, the Almace, however it must be Gold Dragonforged, the Banshee's Physical Defense is only 300

[@thecrawlingchaos1424]

These videos are so helpful! Thanks for all the content.

[@Nihil0.0]

Thanks Minerva

[@InfernoRodan]

Did this really go up within minutes of me asking about it in the other video? Talk about timing, lmao. Anyway, this is exactly what I was looking for. Excellent video. Makes me a bit sad that my plans for a "Magick Warrior" Pawn are bust, though. I know magick-focused physical builds were a thing back in the days of vanilla DD, but I wasn't sure if they'd still work with the much tougher BBI enemies. Didn't realize there was a patch that made the magick stat not apply to physical attacks. Oh well, I guess this saves me from making a fourth account.

[@Nihil0.0]

Crazy timing indeed. A Magic Warrior sure does sound cool, or even the though of a Strider splitting with Elements, but sadly no. Unless the enemy has an extreme weakness to the element, the pure strength will be the better choice

[@redmen47]

Thanks for this it help greatly in BBI also thanks for recommending eggression it saved my life against that eliminator grab

[@Nihil0.0]

Egression is good for Fighter and MK. I hate when an Eliminator can do his foot stomp even with you standing. Only some Eliminators can do this in some locations, especially the Fallen City

[@babayaga4320]

I'm glad I found this I love ASMR.

this video gives us an idea of the process of making a video like yours, what a long process
great video btw

[@Nihil0.0]

Thanks ED. I do spend alot of time on these videos sometimes, especially the ones that are more about information rather than just a run. I appreciate the praise

No problem.
Thank you for putting so much effort in those videos and for doing such a great job!

[@jimmyjams5038]

I do know that different attacks have different motion values that multiply physical and/or magic damage by a certain percentage so that will also determine whether and attack will or won't surpass the damage threshold. Especially if you're using a weapon with an element a creature is weak to. I don't remember the specific motion values but I remember finding them a long time ago.

[@effekttion4459]

Hello Nihil
13:21 i observed: i use great canon with 2 sword types:
1) pure physical
2) enchanted weapons
please test also:
3) - pure physical but with magic boon enchanted weapon
4) - enchanted weapon and with magic boon enchanted.
You see that the orbs are still white (physical) when you hit the great canon with an enchanted (fire) weapon (but not extra enchanted). And when it hits the enemy they causes also fire dmg.
But if you enchant the weapon witch magic boon and you hit the canon, the orbs are pure magic (glowing).
That means, the physical value from the weapon should have changed to magic
or it is completely blocked and the magic value from your magic stat (from your character) was added to the weapons magic value.
Or there is a fix value, when you enchant a weapon with magic - that i dont know. But worth to test.
Hope you understand what i mean (sorry my englisch ist not that well)
The weapon got 2 numbers. Physical and magic values. Well, in fact there are magic elements like fire and lightning/ice/datk/holy/earth?
But also physical elements blunt, slash and pierce (bow). You said it, blunt causes more dmg to skeletons.
I think, that the great canon ist a great skill, it reflects completely the element from your (enchabted) weapon, even blunt or slash/pierce dmg.
And now i think, that an enemy got resistances to all elements, no matter if magic or physical. If your value to the respective element is higher that the enemies resistance you do "more" dmg. That formula i dont know either. Maybe its a factor like x1,2 if your falue is 120% higher or something, that must be you obsere how much fire dmg you cause to an undead dragon. But there is for every single enemy a threshold definitely, and i think for every element.
My sorc kills a banshee in one hit with holy magic. It breaked throw her resistance. Same with the goblin caster, it is said, they are immune to magic, not true. They have a very high magic resistance, but if your magic is higher, well you onehit 'em.
And you are completely right, skills are also based on elements. As strider you could kill ghosts with splinter dart easily, but use an encanted bow for more magic(fire) dmg.
'Advanced Trigger' should work the same.
Its like monster hunter.

[@noordinaryjoe9972]

I'd like to put my own little research I did over hear since I'm still kinda confused.
I tested a fully charged Deathly Arrow into a cursed dragon's weakspot with two longbows.
GF Savage Fang equipped:
Strength: 2021
Fully charged Deathly Arrow: a little over 1 bar of health
GF Dragon's Glaze (ice): [cursed dragon takes 70% of damage from all ice attacks]
Strength: 2056
Magic: 1087
Fully charged Deathly Arrow: roughly 2 and 1/10 bars of health
Your research suggests that physical skills don't factor in the weapon's magic but I'm confused as to why there's such a drastic increase in damage between the two

[@Nihil0.0]

hmmmmm, not sure. I usually stay away from Dragon Hearts when testing, because the results can varrie, but Deathly arrow is a high damage skill, where physical will attack the physical defense and magic will attack the magic defense. I tested Comet shot with this setup on sitting Eliminator's head (between the eyes) and with that the Savage Fang out did the Glaze, and I have tested the single core arrow from the longbow with the same results of Savage Fang performing better. I will usually avoid testing on Dragon Hearts, and avoid using charged timing skills, as I can't always confidently say that I did time it exact, but I can try this setup and target and see what comes of it. My favorite test subjects are Poisoned Undead, because their core hitbox is very big, and their head (bonus) hitbox is so small, I can confidently say the tests were exact. And then I always test everything at least twice, but typically 3 times, to ensure the results are constant.

[@noordinaryjoe9972]

This whole enchanted weapon debacle is pretty confusing but I'm glad I got your input in this

[@Nihil0.0]

It is confusing. Fire is an easy one with Undead, because they take so much extra damage from Fire attacks, and then the Dark is so random because of the Critical value

[@chriskim9289]

deathly arrow has different dmg multipliers based on the timing of your release. (i think there are like 2-3 increments of multipliers) this is visually represented by sparks and a bit of slow-mo when you release the skill.

[@verboten8]

Man, what is it with you and shooting multiple arrows to that Ogre's crotch?
Jokes aside, it reminds me of our conversation about damages on Great Cannon. I am thankful you actually make this kind of information into a video. Awesome :D

[@Nihil0.0]

It's not my fault that they fall alseep with their legs open, i'm just going with consistency, and that happens to be consistent. Wouldn't that be funny if that was their weak spot rather than the head/neck

[@Keius]

Wow... it didn’t occur to me that an enemy’s defenses would essentially double dip if you use enchanted weapons (or any attack that’s split between physical and magical).

[@ARCHER-ch4xn]

Has gold rarefied gears...
Lvl 54
Me: WTF?

[@Pedro_Kantor]

These results are disappointing...I like using Enchanted weapons for the cool visual effects.

[@Nihil0.0]

Yeah, it is disappointing. I always liked the idea of Enchanted Daggers, but I would always see better results from pure physical. But MK still benefits greatly from Enchanted weapons.

[@guntervanstraaten4562]

Nihil dude, man its been a while, i see i have. A lot of catching up to do, great vid by the way, I've been trying a warrior build but its sooo out if my comfort zone😂

[@Nihil0.0]

Yeah, Warrior can do that. But still super fun

[@guntervanstraaten4562]

@@Nihil0.0 Coming from ranged to this, its a challenge, but fun ill give you that, it is.
Wonder if eventually they'll make a remastered edition for DD

[@VicheBuche]

Really good video! Pls next time be sure ur voice can be hear over the gameplay, ty

[@zamfielis]

Still playing this game. From 0 now.

[@justiciar1964]

So same reason you don't use a split weapon in Dark Souls: Going through two defenses with two weak damage values, unless you're built to do nonphysical damage.

[@Nihil0.0]

Yep. Split = Split. I still cringe when I see pawns with Enchanted weapons

[@justiciar1964]

rip. one of mine does. To be fair it's a level 2 cursed and I personally never play with mages/sorcs.
Maybe I'll remove it tho, since living armor and the red ghosts have way too much def/hp to be worth fighting (especially the latter).

[@Nihil0.0]

Wraiths are the worst. I hate that we need magic to kill them. We don't truly need magic for Living Armor, as they can be killed through gravity, and also, often there is a Light Beacon where the Living Armors are located. But I hate Wraiths. Cheap enemy

[@justiciar1964]

My best method of dealing with wraiths or any spooky ghost for that matter (besides running) is to be possessed by them, and then throw a throwblast at a wall. 2-3 does em in.
Problem is they're pretty erratic and like to go full on ark of the covenant on my ass and 2-shot me. >_>
Also that means I need like 12 throwblasts in my inventory, and hope i dont get too many duds.
I found shattering earth scrolls or a lucky shot with Goddess Cameo are good for living armor if you can't put a dent in em.

[@RIBAYRO]

Tbf a Dragon's Glaze or Dragon's Ire are what I'll use for now until I get the lvl3 longbow and shortbow. These have pretty much the same str value of Blink and Rancor, respectively, with added magic damage (granted enemies that resist the element will make them worse in those cases).

[@glencunningham552]

That banshee damage difference is due to the magic defence being so high at 1600 and the physical defence being so low at 300. Won't breach the magic defence with magic attack at 1300 but will breach the physical defence with an attack of 2000

[@thehumanity3324]

I did all those sorcerer levels for nothing?? So basically there is no merit in developing your magic stat if you are going to play as a phys character?
Btw i have to say that I absolutely love your vids, I have been watching them ever since the DDDA hype was still real on the 360 back in like 2012, so cool to see that you still make vids

[@an_ordinary_goose]

Moral of the story: just beat the hell out of it till it dies. Kinda disappointed to hear that advanced trigger works the way it does, I find that's one of the cooler attacks

[@Nihil0.0]

Yeah, there is a claim that Toss and Trigger has a magic value to it. But if it did then a physical dagger should be able to damage a ghost form. Unfortunitely not. Dazzle blast has a magic value, even with physical, but even with 4 periapts it still only does 1 hp on ghosts.

[@tomidomusic]

Banshee 100% holy & ice and slash and bash are at 100% too. Cursed light and Mage Breaker period w/cannon (but these are extremely and effectively strong).

[@7synns384]

best intro yet, loved those movies, and long story short, the dragons glaze and dragons ire are mostly useless sadly

[@Nihil0.0]

Those are some funny movies. And yeah, the enchanted bows are lesser over the pure strength.

[@warxd1238]

Woot I'm early awesome job man I'm always looking forward to ur videos

[@Nihil0.0]

Thanks. Early bird gets the wyrm

[@warxd1238]

@@Nihil0.0 XD

[@bigguccisosa9908]

If you check the gamefaq forum for ps4, they have all the stats for how enchanted weapons are split

[@sixtyninemangler]

Good video but can't hear your voice over the game sound effects

[@EveryTimeV2]

This goes against wikia knowledge that raising sorcerer levels for extra magic is useful when making an assassin in the base game. The logic being that the heaven's key is a holy enchanted weapon and so it benefits from that increase in magic. Though a pure physical build will simply do more damage.

[@ffffdsd]

Good video but the mixing wasn't great. It was hard to hear you over the gameplay

[@victorchavezjr4786]

Hey NihiL...been watching your videos recently an recently subscribed..just started playing DD I know I'm hella late but hey I'm here now An get to try this gem that I missed last time..NiHiL after finishing campaign first the first what should I do next do the campaign again right ..I'm not leveled or strong enough for BBI yet right after first campaign play thru..Sorry so much to say but I just wanna have an idea what to do next an have fun..Thanks NiHIL

[@Nihil0.0]

Thanks Victor. Yeah, play new game +, go through the main story again, but defeat Grigori as a new vocation so that you get the weapon rewards from him. Those weapons from Grigori will carry through BBI. But definitely don't worry about your stats, just play what you are best with and what you want to play as

[@victorchavezjr4786]

@@Nihil0.0 thank you so much for dropping knowledge for me..just started my female character last night I will definitely check out more of your level setup an what augments 2 get ..so thanks again you got my support

[@LeonBorodaty1]

Well that pretty much solves some issues I had with weapons. I noticed long ago some enchanted weapons work good on early levels. Grigori the dragon gets fucked with kunai daggers. Not so much with physical daggers. Anyway thanks man always a pleasure watching you test and share results about my favourite game

[@Nihil0.0]

Grigori does take quite a bit extra damage from Dark. Kunai and Strider are terrific for Grigori. And Kunai have some fairly high physical numbers, it's just a shame that they do nothing to ghosts.

[@majormoron605]

I love sunflare cause it's so flashy, but it's also a bit disappointing, compared to skull splitter... Ma needs a powerful melee skill!

[@nomadicscrotum7515]

What about when a physical damage weapon is enchanted by pawn?

[@mekudu-man3804]

you mean boons? They are pretty good and usefeul - use them.

[@oneeyemonster3262]

it makes a different..if you're doing a route figthing different types of bosses.
So you're not constantly equiping different weapons..messing up the flow of game play.
Even though if they're not as powerful...
Example. As magic knight.. i use the Alamac..after you forge it..it'll be always ICE and LIGHTING enchant..So I can easy kill the Cyclops, Lion, Lizzard...
When I fight Ghost..I use Holy trance....Becuase I have Forst....Abyssal Anguish and HOLY Trance....It's set up so I can enchant my PAWN's weapon ...
So if I fight Lizzard/Cyclopes..i dont have trance...the swore is enchanted ALREADY
Becuase there;s only 3 buttons I can assign.
When Im FARMING and LOOTING....if I switch buttons around...it'll mess me up
Or I"LL FORGET to Equip the proper weapon's enchant for the proper enemies.
When I change VOCATION...I basically have to TRAIN..until I get used to buttons layout...it dosnt matter..if the Game gives me HP or SKILL POINTS....If i suck at certain
skills. Im still going to suck even if Im at level 100.
i suck at the BOW at the moment..Until I get used to playing
it..Or the BUTTONS are WACKed..My brain thinks SHIELD...but it'll bring out the BOW.lmao

[@pepito6795]

Where do u find good enchanted weapons??

[@scynx]

I'm probably too late to get a replay on this, but based on the video: Aren't pawn provided weapon enchantments effectively useless if all of this is true? If I'm dealing zero damage until I can bypass a defense threshold (and as a physical vocation my magick stat will be low as a baseline and never get up there even with buffs) that would mean I can never damage a monster immune to physical damage (Living Armors etc.) even with an elemental buff?
Not sure how to deal with this on my current fighter run when I get to BBI, in my mind I was still thinking of elemental swords or elemental buffs as a fallback option.

[@ZeriocTheTank]

So outside of taking advantage of the elemental status effects like burning, shock and frost, my warrior doesn't need to carry around all those extra weapons then, correct? I lucked out and did See Berne's quest rather early, and have a really good sword, but if I don't have to lug around all that fire hammer I'll gladly throw it in storage.

[@kiencancap]

What about the case when the enchanted weapon has higher physical value than closest the physical equivalent? Is it still better for physical classes?

[@Nihil0.0]

Probably, I think so. It's still a physical skill, so the physical is the primary. The only time that the magic value should be higher than the physical value, is if you leveled much more magic than physical, or you only have magic augments and no strength augments. If that's the case then while standing magic may be better. But climbing or jumping, physical will be better even with magic value higher.
I think

[@enoctiskokorotis5236]

in case of your physical voc. The game in the start say-if you haven't magical damage or M.support rages await you
after become stronger-whatever! you have physical d. don't you?

[@alejodavies]

What?

[@enoctiskokorotis5236]

Alejo Davies the right is whatever I'm still learning :v

[@alejodavies]

@@enoctiskokorotis5236 I'm still unclear about your post, you'll get there. Learning is good.

[@enoctiskokorotis5236]

Alejo Davies thanks man^^ im just trying put a funny coment about "after-game" physical vocation have no use for magic stats

[@alejodavies]

@@enoctiskokorotis5236 Aha, nice! Good edit :)

[@sychodelicstorm5592]

Im doing a magic archer flame build for more aesthetic fun, using scalding razors and immolation and sunflare, is there a build that i could do to make it decent? i want to use fire for aesthetic fun even if its harder

[@I_hunt_lolis]

If only they added more maps and areas for this game... So little to do after finishing it...

[@kurecore7501]

so what about strider?Im using enchanted daggers and bow all the time ,allways thought hes also split ,because he geting 3dmg+ 3mag each level

[@iiStryker360]

Does the vocation stat growth have a great impact on damage output?
For instance I started as strider until lvl 10 then switched to MA until about lvl 30 or so and the Sorcerer until 50 and then I completed play through #1.
Play through 2 I’ve been jumping from vocation to vocation for the augments. I’m lvl 85 or so now unlocking Assassin with warrior and MK being last.
I’m probably gonna enjoy the split vocations more but I do like the physical vocations as well. is my vocation hopping fucking up my stat growth

[@Nihil0.0]

Our innate stats typically are only 20 to 25% of our total output. Weapons are 50 to 60% and the augments are about 30%

[@geert574]

I have 417 strength and 722 magic so can use whatever, framaes on my MA

[@jaredcrabb]

If augments increase the base stat, then doesnt that mean the weapon stats dont matter for these purposes? Also, isnt Immolation physical damage?

[@MarztheStoic]

Hey Nils did you hear about the Dragons Dogma anime being made?

[@Nihil0.0]

Oh yeah. And I know that you would love to see it. Me? I will watch it, but normally I probably would not care for it. You know me, and my anime preference

[@MarztheStoic]

@@Nihil0.0 Yea I know. Im hopping that this will influence capcom to do another game

[@DonutSwordsman]

Can you reupload with the game volume quieter?

[@lucasrv2630]

So, if I play a physical vocation, having a good Magic stat is pointless? Like, ranger gets decent magic per level. Is that not gonna help at all unless I use atacks that involve some Magic like Toss and Trigger?

[@Nihil0.0]

Correct. Sad news, but correct. It used to matter with Ghosts, but it was still capped at around 350 or so, but now, not at all. Not for Fighter, Warrior, Ranger, Strider or Assassin at least

[@lucasrv2630]

@@Nihil0.0 Damn'. Than I think what people call "the Assassin trap" doesn't sound that bad at all. Good stamina, good atack... Yeh

[@Nihil0.0]

It used to apply. But no more problem with that 258 magic attack.

[@lucasrv2630]

@@Nihil0.0 it's not going to matter anyway, right? Might as well level up by getting the stats that are useful. I'm glad I saw this vídeo. I understand that the game Works perfectly without needing the "best" stats and min/maxing is completely unecessary but it's something I enjoy. I like having the best character possible and I'll have tons of fun. Thanks Nil ^_^

[@SquirrelGamingProductions]

Base MAG is completely unusable for any vocation that doesn't include Blue outside of (lol) Dazzle Blast, and even when a vocation includes Blue more than 300 MAG is inefficient because that's where the enchantment bonus stops (supposedly). Besides that, the two classes you level to focus on MAG have terrible overall stat gain. MAG is the worst base stat for all of those reasons combined. Playing a Ranger or Strider is a reasonable way to get just enough base MAG for a minmaxed Sorcerer or Mage, with far superior stats elsewhere except MDef.

[@SquirrelGamingProductions]

Can u test the armor bonuses from BBI level 3

[@Nihil0.0]

No need really. Stamina replenishes 100 stamina per kill, unless it's a Corrupt Pawn (does not apply) Extends duration is between 5 and 10 seconds for sigils and elemental boons for 50% longer. Helmet that boosts strength starts at 5% for 2 enemies, and 10% for 4 enemies, capped at 25% for 10 enemies. Stability augment for boots, Sinew augment for Boots. The only enhancement in need of testing was the Shield boost, which I did do a video on -
ruclips.net/video/08d5cEufN_8/видео.html
The health armor replenishes 1 hp per second or 4 hp's per second.
dragonsdogma.fandom.com/wiki/Dark_Arisen_Bonus_Enhancements

[@lucamaffini1747]

hi where have u find mask.pants and arms?

[@coreykuehl8519]

How do you deal with the red phantasms in dark arisen sewers? It seems like they take no damage, and even bringing a pawn doesn't help

[@Nihil0.0]

I have a video for just about everything Corey. You need enchanted weapons, or throwblast.
ruclips.net/video/HGaqVeg3NrU/видео.html

[@fatthor2396]

How do you have entire black gear?

[@phoenixarchon178]

I know this vid is old, but I gotta admit I noticed somthin’ wrong with toss and trigger. I remember playin’ this game way the hell back before the dlc came out and toss and trigger did good damage with physical weapons. It was my favorite way to deal with some annoyin’ enemies. Launch them, hit them with the boom, let them fall, repeat. As I played MA though I moved away from it. When I finally got it on ps4 and got back into it I noticed it was crap....makes me sad

[@AtypicalWarrior]

So it's better for a mage to enchant your weapon then you getting an enchanted weapon right?

[@Nihil0.0]

It's close to the same. In earlier levels a mage's enchant is slightly better. A big pro to enchanted weapons are that they are permanent, while a mage's buff wears off.

[@jimmyting1103]

What are your thoughts on gimmick spells? Like the one that is suppost to one shot if an enemy stays in range long enough?

[@Nihil0.0]

I like exequy, but only with no stamina curetives. If I can't kill it with my current stamina then it wasn't meant to be

[@jimmyting1103]

@@Nihil0.0 is it possible to one shot all bosses with it? Or are there some bosses that arent affected

[@Nihil0.0]

Some are not. I know UR is immune, maybe Daimon, I have never tried, maybe Death

[@sandro108]

@@Nihil0.0 I love Exequi, especially on BBI , it digs up those hidden leapworms and Pre Daimon vile eyes, lol

[@GordonGordon]

Geez... How is your almace so much better than mine?

[@Nihil0.0]

It's not the sword. The weapons will always have same numbers depending on it's upgraded level. The augments are what increase them, I usually have Autonomy, Clout and Acuity, which closely gives it a 50% boost in physical and magic

[@GordonGordon]

@@Nihil0.0 aha... Thanks

[@zerodemonx8888]

So running a 10-200 assassian I should be using normal weapons and not enchanted? Sounds good to me.

[@Nihil0.0]

Yep. The only time that Assassin, Warrior, Fighter, Strider and often Ranger should use enchated is Fire or Holy for Undead and Holy for Ghosts. Everything else, pure physical

[@zerodemonx8888]

@@Nihil0.0 if I'm running solo what should I do for holy? I'm not too familiar with enchanted weapons , could you direct me towards holy weapon I could use?

[@Nihil0.0]

Well, Holy is best for Ghosts, but Ice and Fire and Lightning will work too. Holy is difficult to get, and takes some time. Below is a video for many weapon locations, not including any Holy. Holy weapons are primarily from UR Dragon, and takes some frustration sometimes.
ruclips.net/video/OBFoAW6VsTg/видео.html

[@zerodemonx8888]

@@Nihil0.0 Gotcha thanks for the info man.

[@dickdork6483]

I can barely hear you over the game

[@MarztheStoic]

So basicly your saying certain abilities like toss and trigger are better with an enchanted weapon on a physical class correct?

[@Nihil0.0]

Nah, even with those Skills, physical is still better. The magic value is very low with those skills, but there is a magic value when enchanted are used.

[@MarztheStoic]

@@Nihil0.0 ok I gotcha

[@AtypicalWarrior]

So what happens if both numbers surpass the threshold?

[@Nihil0.0]

If enemy has 100 physical defense and 100 magic defense and your attack is 140 physical and 120 magic, then you are damaging enemy 60 total. If said enemy has 100% weakness to the appropriate element, such as lightning, then your lightning enchantment magic is 240 rather than 120, so a total of 180

[@ATNBCat]

Hey can anyone te me how to get "Carnation" the sword?

[@thomasaitken7495]

One stop shop for all items, etc... go to this link if you haven't. dragonsdogma.fandom.com/wiki/Carnation

[@315am]

So my fighter pawn is beter of with a regular sword then with the almace?

[@Nihil0.0]

In early levels, pre lv50, Almace is sometimes better for Hellhounds, or sometimes better for Drake. After the level of around 50, physical is mostly 90% better. Undead with fire is an exception.

[@315am]

@@Nihil0.0 allright thanks

[@czaetc.8743]

is there a holy bow that assassin's can use?

[@azuliot]

nope only a fire one exists

[@dangerzone5828]

I'm level 80 and I dont have those stats you have

[@Nihil0.0]

Augments make a huge difference.

[@arcanjogamerplay]

Tem only problem in this game is the flat damage calculation system.
Monster has 1000 Dmg.
Char has 500 Def.
Normal mode you take 500 Dmg
Hard mode you take 1500 Dmg.
Dmg shoud be calculated by % , this flat system sucks.

[@AtypicalWarrior]

Sooo ima just sell all my enchanted weapons

[@bladethrough2645]

Glad I'm not the only person watching these videos nowadays lol

[@AtypicalWarrior]

@@bladethrough2645 yea im playing the game and I love it

[@bladethrough2645]

@@AtypicalWarrior Same here. I never knew just how much I didn't know about this game lol

[@AtypicalWarrior]

@@bladethrough2645 damn but ima either sell them or farm them then sell those and keep just 2 pairs for me and my pawn

[@jamming8519]

You're playing dark arisen. NOT the first game so...

[@HamsterPants522]

It is the first game, just a patched version.