565miles… in a day… in electric cars… in BAD weather! Incl New Tesla Highland v Old Model 3 convoy
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- Опубликовано: 18 фев 2024
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This video…
We’ve seen what the new 2024 Tesla Model 3 Long Range and Standard Range can do in winter but in reasonable weather conditions and they can be very efficient with great real-world capable range.
But… here I have a big day on a road trip in awful very bad weather. Constant heavy rain plus snow really affects efficiency and range so what is the WORST CASE efficiency and range going to be.
As part of this trip I also can show how a Mercedes EQC happens to compare but then also a previous version of the Model 3 Long Range (the revised pt 1 version WITH heat pump).
That’s a 75kwh model compared to what we believe is the 79kwh battery in our Highland Long Range. The 2023 Model 3 LR in the UK was also a 79kwh but I don’t think we’ve ever had the 82kwh in a Long Range, only for a time during c.2021/2022 in the performance version (unlike rest of Europe which got LR with 82kwh)
This was a long day on the road but the distance and charging. Really wasn’t an issue. The car performance brilliantly with just a couple of exceptions - the lack of matrix headlights (since implanted after filming, video on that soon) and the rubbish auto wipers…
I made a 1,000 mile review video and I’ll follow that up soon with a further update and what I like/don’t like about the Highland.
Thanks for watching.
Richard Symons
R Symons LTD "RSEV"
EV Specialist based in New Milton, Hampshire on the South Coast near Southampton and Bournemouth
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My partner and I took a road trip from Inverness in Scotland down to Sheffield at the end of December in a 2023 Model Y Standard Range RWD after visiting family for Christmas. There was a huge snowstorm that day, and a lot of the roads south were closed, we had to take a 200 mile detour around Fort William and the Highlands.
The temperature never reached above -2C the whole trip, down to -5C in some parts. The snow was hammering it down most of the trip, and changed to freezing rain by the end. The car coped with it all. There were simply no dramas. Despite being a heavy, powerful, RWD car it just held on through the ice and snow without even really changing my driving style at all. Once I had put in a couple of waypoints to avoid the closed roads, the Supercharger stops were all planned in by the car and we always got a charge bay without any waiting, in some of the most remote areas of Scotland, which was quite simply incredible to see. Superchargers just literally out in the middle of nowhere, beside lochs, in tourist trap spots, and tucked away behind country hotels, down roads you would never even consider looking for a charger if the satnav was't guiding you there.
I had been conditioned to expect the worst from an EV on a long road trip in the snow. But in the end we did 10 hours of driving, 600 or so miles, all in intense snow or freezing rain and fog, heating blasting the whole time, it was really surprising how well it performed in sub-zero conditions.
Just when I think there’s nothing that can top what I’ve already seen on highland content, this channel surprises me. 😂
One of the best realistic review content channels. Great work guys 🎉
Wow, thanks!
Great video as always! And what a bonus for me….. that’s my new white M3SR with 19” alloys at the Leeds store 🎉😂
That is a brilliant comparison video in atrocious weather. Well done to you both a great job 👏 👏
Cheers for the video! I have the previous Model 3 and my concern with the Highlands lack of stalks wasn't the drive selector of the indicators, it was the lack of button on left hand stalk to put the wipers on. I was a bit concerned I'd be driving down the road and a lorry would drench the windscreen and I'd have to look on the screen to put the wipers on, so thank you for addressing that at the end of your video!
You do the trips that others don’t. Great work guys. So slightly better efficiency but not huge.
When you already produce one of, if not the most efficient car in the class, improvement trends towards incremental.
The efficiency difference between the two Teslas was remarkable. Tyre pressures on the older one? Great video btw. Many thanks for being heroes in the awful weather. I bet Ginz didn't mind staying at home this time. 😉👍
Improved aerodynamics, tyres, and lots of smaller improvements really pay off in worst conditions. Gotta love efficiency. 😊
it was somewhere around 7% more efficient in the 2024 car vs. the 2020 car, which is nice but not what I'd call overly remarkable. The heat pump is a few generations newer which would account for some of that, and better insulation in the cabin, a more efficient battery heating system, slightly better aero, harder tyres and a more sorted suspension setup potentially account for the rest.
The 2024 car gained ~5% range from having a bigger battery ~7% from efficiency, giving it ~12% more range overall in the cold, which is pretty decent. In the end it would have been significant on this trip, since the 2020 car needed to charge one extra time. At the end they both stopped at the final charger, but the 2024 car didn't need to.
@@OneThousand98 7% doesn't sound very impressive, but it is. Remember, this is going from what was already one of the most efficient cars in its class. Also 85% more distance per kWh than the EQC is honestly embarrassing for Mercedes! Even a Y will likely be at least 60-75% better.
@@mkkm945 yes, for a model refresh it’s quite impressive, also the older Model 3s are very efficient already, so gains are in many ways marginal.
@@OneThousand987% on same basic shape is incredible me thinks.
Tough day. Thanks Richard and Sergiu. Best regards Martin
I despair about the wipers 5 years down the line.
Mercedes are more comfortable to drive, EQC has a softer ride. The highland is better. EQC is a much heavier car. As usual Richard a great video, the weather was ideal to show that electric cars can weather the storm.
Great job Richard and Serge, That was a really great demonstration of worst case. Very impressive to maintain 3.5 miles per kWh in those conditions and majority of motorway. it is really bizarre that such a technical EV still has problems with the auto wipers, maybe over engineered?
Tesla says they're working on the auto wipers.....
When?
@@kjelle5350 Elon says two weeks….
Cost saving. They took out the rain sensor to rely on cameras
Excellent content and firmly based in the real world. Thanks for posting.
Great real world data. Thanks so much, guys!
14:45 Gotta keep in mind that's a 4 year old car, there's going to be a decent chunk of degradation on it, so comparing range figures from percentage used on the trip isn't a good method. Just use the efficiency numbers and then multiply by battery size: 274Wh/mi * 79kWh = 288 miles for the Highland and 292Wh/mi * 75 kWh = 257 miles for the 2020 one.
They tell us the older model used 50kwh and that was equal to 79% - that works out to be a remaining usable kwh of 63-64kwh (50/.79 or circa 16% / 12kwh lost)
@@TB-up4xi There's capacity hidden under zero percent. It's going to be around 66-67kWh, just over 10% degradation.
Interesting vid. We've got a 2019 M3 lr (non heat pump) and travelled at new year fully loaded (2 adults 2 kids plus boot full) in apocolyptic wet, windy and just above zero weather... 155 miles on 90% battery 😮 😮😮
A long day lads, but another great review, with an interesting comparison and useful data, a very honest evaluation.
Nice video….that wiper shortcut from the scroll wheel works on my 2019 M3 as well 😜👍
Great video! Really appreciate the conversions - we are kWh per 100km here in Canada, which is at least an easy conversion from the displayed Wh per km.
Fantastic test. My Ioniq 5 would get about 2.6-3.0 mi/kWh or worse , in those conditions so to get an overall 3.5mi/kWh is fantastic. Weird how Tesla cannot sort the auto wipers out. A persistent criticism from all Tesla owners over the years and can be quite dangerous, trying to fiddle with the screen or buttons in poor visibility to get the preferable wiper speed.
As Richard said you can select it by the pressing left or right on the left scroll wheel. This is on all teslas running the latest software.
Based on 3.5 miles per kwh and 57.5kwh usable battery for the SR highland, that would give it a range of 201miles in these UK wintery conditions.
I've got one on order, good to get a feel for my worst case range, thanks!
The RWD highland is ever so slightly more efficient than the LR
@@rndmchannel7251 This is true, however its always nice to know I'll have at least 200 miles of range from a full charge (driving normally)
Great video which shows the gradual improvement in Tesla models, thank you. 👍
Hilarious when you called that “worst conditions”. I live in Sweden and we have that shit 4-5 months per year. 2 months we get -15-30 degrees minus (C). Problem is not the car’s efficiency, problem is everything freezing. Door handles, windows, frunk etc.
Model Y in Finland here, with everything from +5 to -30 this winter. No issues with freezing. The door handles do freeze after going through a car wash, but pressing on the opposite end of the handle clears the ice. It's alse a good idea to test the brakes in the parking lot before setting off after a wash, like with any car.
I was recommended Würth rubber treatment (gummivård) and applied it to the door/window seals in October, and have had zero issues with them freezing or sticking. Same for the frunk and trunk seals. I also pre-emptively degreased the frunk latch and applied a thin film of gun oil, and that has worked flawlessly in any temperature. I recommend you try these simple maintenance measures too.
Great vid mate well done
Great Video me and the misses love watching them hence why we got a Tesla Model 3 LR 2021…Her only comment on this video was why a Tuna Subway????
Thanks for your review. I too made the same move from Note 10 Plus to S24 Ultra which has just arrived - I am feeling hopeful as I am about to switch it on for the first time....!
Great video, Richard. Thanks for all the pertinent facts and the distillation down to yes, the Highland is better. Too bad Tesla's renowned engineering can't solve the wipers issue. It annoys me particularly (23 MYLR) that when in autopilot and the wipers decide to go wonky, I have to disengage and go to icon. It's irritating.
You haven't heard about the coming update?
Another great video. Thanks. P.s. I've just sold my Model Y for a Long Range Plus Model X. A bit retro, but I love the big screen, proper reversing sensors etc.
How do you find road noise vs the Y?
@@0-Will-0 About the same. 22's on the X create a lot of tyre 'slap'
Great video! You should do this with the Model x and like you did the different generations of the Model 3 comparison with the Model X. Say a 2018 vs a 2020 vs a 2023
Those Wh/mile are great 👍. I Can’t get that in good weather in 2016 MS if I remember right. Great gains in 8yrs.
Good to see some service stations being kitted out with lots of chargers. Just need to keep expanding!
160+ Tesla locations in the UK now.
@@rogerstarkey5390 2 in the whole of the North East...
Regarding the scroll wheel/wipers setting adjustment - this is true for any "window" appearing in the same place as the wipers setting, e.g. accepting calls/hanging calls, probably lights as well (haven't tried that, so I'm not 100 percent sure). Either you move through the options left and right by tilting the wheel (like with wipers) or the button on the screen is directly pressed by the tilt (such as hanging up the phone call).
Great video Richard on what must have been one of the worst days to do that trip. Quick question. I've a Model 3 LR 2019 version and I don't use the aero covers because I like the look of the alloys. In your experience do they make much difference to the range?
Good video.
I have 2020sr+ not facelift model. Just did yesterday trip from lake District to Leeds. Started at 99%get home with 18% 120miles trip. Very disappointed with range
Very interesting vlog. Missing me ev but hopefully later this year I can return to the fold. Best wishes
Again a brilliant video.
There is a reason why you feature in my newest video as one of the top10 youtube channels on electric cars (sadly it is in German, so you might need the automatic captions to follow).
Would love to know how the 70 plate car’s battery has degraded. I reckon ours is 8kWh down on new.
I’ve had a 70 reg long range for a month now and my automatic wipers don’t work either. I had a Ford Focus for 12 years with auto wipers which were perfect. Come on Tesla sort it out !
The wipers programmers must be on holiday since 2014
On a Tesla one should be able to set any adjustment, when summoned, by using the left scroll-wheel, not just the wipers - temperature and fan speed as a minimum, too. Also, how hard would it be to summon such adjustments with a voice command? e.g. “Adjust… (temperature)” would summon the temperature dialog box, then scroll up or down with the left wheel.
Long road trip there!
Does the Tesla app, tell you if a supercharger site is open to all?
Just wondered why you paid premium cost for the Merc at Banbury, when the Tesla chargers are cheaper and open to all??
great video, find your vids all very informative. One question - would the older long range not be suffering from some battery degradation compared to the 2024 therefore would that not effect the max range?
Yes I did mention it’s probably lost some kWh but it goes to show that 8 minutes difference isn’t exactly bad!
@@RSEV Not a little - a fair bit = if you used 79% and that's 50kWh that makes the remaining battery capacity around 63-64kWh (50/.79) or around 15-16% degradation (11-12kwh lost) , for the new model 47/0.63 = roughly 75 kwh usable.
Phew, there is metric system written in video :-) So even I can enjoy this :-) Thank you :-)
Good news!😇 From Sr. engineer YUN-Ta Tsai at Tesla : New and improved auto wiper software upgrade going out soon to customers. Date:Feb 19th 2023.
Lets see if this software upgrade actually solves the wiper problem.
🤞
I watched this immediately after the MATRIX lights.
100,000 subscribers here you go!
Another great informative and enjoyable video. Thank you.
I don't expect you to comment on other youyube videos, but I was disappointed with the recent one from Harry's Garage.
Was it just me?
I don't watch him but purposely watched that one. The way I interpreted it was that he was at the end of a lease so had to do something, tows a large trailer a lot.
Diesel makes sense.
The rest of his chuntering was the usual tired stuff
No it was not just you. If he must have a Range Rover, he could afford to get another PHEV. In fairness, Harry does run his classic fossil cars on sustainable fuel and he has a lot of solar panels. Maybe he will run the new Range Rover on biodiesel.
Yes, I was disappointed too. If Harry wants a Range Rover, then that is fine. However, peddling a few myths in justification is disappointing. I perceive it to be an increasing trend from him, so I unsubscribed. I also feel that he has moved into reviewing £100k plus cars almost exclusively and that isn't my space. It's a shame really, as I used to find him quite balanced.
Where are you it’s sunny in Dorset!
Could any differences in air-conditioning account for some efficency drop? Heating seats?
Hi Richard, how come you didn’t both charge at the Tesla chargers at Banbury as I thought that the Tesla charges there were open to all….?
They are open - charged my ix3 several times on way to Yorkshire - Banbury is such a great stop - always been Tesla chargers free, as well as osprey and a ton of instavolt down the road 😊
Was going to ask that myself, open to all and a fair bit cheaper than Osprey.
Telsa is a good project with their new upgrades
I suspect it's because the port is on the wrong side but you can usually get away with using one of the end chargers and I'd have done it anyway as it was really quiet.
I'm an account manager for Red Bull
I have a VW ID.4 52kwh battery
Somehow I survive 😂
I do about 500 miles a week on average (sometimes 1000 miles a week).
The cold weather KILLED my ID.4
I average about 170miles of range
Garbage haha
Never been there but that pizza hut must be world famous by now
Why take the VW TM feature Matrix when talking about adaptive headlights?
Great video. I guess you did not use the Instavolt Rapid charging hub in Banbury just off the M40 down the A422 because you also needed Tesla chargers?
Instavault are 10p or more more expensive with certain cards
Have used them before but yes can charge next to Tesla and I have an account that gives me cheaper at the Osprey
Serg rolling with his climate cranked up to 25c
Wipers and lights not unusual features on a car still crap on a Tesla my biggest gripes ( apart from ride comfort)
wonder how long it is before some after market stalks appear?
Is there any major differences between the latest and a 2018 RWD long range ?
… in the cold.
Richard - did you need the AWD with the bad weather?
Wish I had seen you fellas in Leeds. Richard you look exactly like my mate, it’s uncanny, but 10 years younger.
Not much difference in efficiency.
Why does the older LR charge faster?
“Worst possible conditions”… as an ex-Brit these things make me chuckle. Plenty of Model 3’s running around out here in Canada, -30c, several feet snow storms… lol.
Snow and proper cold is nicer than slushy rain in UK.
@@HarrythehunNicer? The colder the air the less range.
This UK weather is like spring here in Sweden lol.
To be fair he did clarify the second time he said it that it was "worst possible weather in the UK"
@@starvictory7079 I rather have real winters than UK rain.
Great video Richard. Do you know if a 22 MY LR will get Matrix headlights?
At some point
I bet you both must have been shattered I enjoyed the video 👍👍
auto wipers are getting a big update soon.
Hi how much you spend £££ on charge during the trip ?
"Terrible weather conditions"? You need to come up here to the nordics....
I know that banbury charger well, as my dad lives 15 mins from there.
Thank you Richard & Serge. This is very useful. 👍🏾👏🏾😘
keep it up with the conversions to kWh/km ! EU says thank you :-)
Thanks, will do!
Why does the Highland charge more slowly than the older car? Do charging speeds improve with age? I am not an EV owner, but looking to get my first EV this year so I am genuinely interested.
How about weight of car difference and cost of charging for the trip. so cost difference between cars.
I do find it hard to pick any car that costs more to buy than a tesla. and even more if the efficiency of it is worse.
How much did it cost for both cars to do the 500 miles?
Auto wipers - I’ve always found that some glass sealant makes the world of difference to how auto wipers perform
2miles per kwh thats what Ive got when was pulling an RV with my TMY LR at around 8degrees C at around 60mph. 😂
I’d love to see a comparison of the highland vs a 2023 LR RWD. They share the same tyres so we could see how much difference the aerodynamic changes make.
I hope to do that one day
On a mild day mine shows 343 miles at 100%
@@jimbojonesshef The weather does not change the reading it's always estimated kwh battery remaining / EPA Wh per mile
Awesome content and have been watching since the Carwow challenge. Luckily we don’t have to deal with those conditions here in Australia (unless you are in the State of Victoria and the snow resorts) looking to get a M3 highland this year and saw the white with the alloys and that is our option but a bit concerned about the range loss? Maybe should stick with the aero wheels? Long trips here and not enough charging stations yet but getting better.
New Tesla Model 3 is quite a bit more efficient than the older version. About a 50 mile difference in real world driving conditions.That's massive. Thank you for another great informative video.
More like 30 miles when removing degradation from the picture, and that's when compared to the old one with a smaller 75kWh pack. Otherwise it's 18 miles difference with the old one that has the same pack.
Thank you , I always appreciate your videos,I suggest you make one change and that is to present your findings on one or more slides at the very end so it is easy to capture to the full results more easily.
Serious error calculating efficiency without accounting for battery degradation in the older car. The degradation can be checked with an OBD adapter and ScanMyTesla.
what's the conclusion?
We have an EQC (Premium Plus) and a MY. The MY is by far the most practical car, in terms of interior space and efficiency, the EQC is surprisingly compact inside by comparison, despite exterior dimension being very close indeed.
But the EQC is always the one we go to for day to day driving and pretty much anything where we don’t need the range or space of the MY, it is, by far, the nicer place to be. Much quieter, rides much better, (it wafts over bumps and potholes, where the Tesla ‘thunks’), and has switches, stalks, for all the regularly used features. It exudes that ‘luxury’ feel that the MY lacks. Someone described the feel of the Tesla as a US rental car, and I feel that’s a fair assessment. It’s a great mile-muncher, but it doesn’t have a premium feel to it.
I’d like to see a car with the efficiency of a Tesla, and the quality of the Merc. Whoever is first to market with something like that will have the premium market sewn up.
It took me a couple of visits before I discovered the Costa. Not the best Costa but it's OK.
I will be traveling from southern Spain to the north of the Netherlands doing the speed limit (this weekend). We will be leaving Spain with 20 degrees C and arrive in cold wet Netherlands. Let me know if you want the stats and if you want them to be measured in a particular way :) the trip will be like 2300km or 1429,153 miles. 2023 model Y LR
"The wipers are on"... if they feel like it.
What is the cathode chemistry, cell manufacturer, and cell form factor in the new model 3?
I think it’s NMC, CATL, Prismatic.
Google is your friend (apparently)
Look it up yourself?
@@rogerstarkey5390 Google is conflicted, and Tesla doesn’t say.
Some forums think they’re NMC, LG, Cylindrical, and others say it’s either CATL M3P, or CATL LFP.
They don’t qualify for the tax credit in the US, which suggests they aren’t from LG or Panasonic, leaving only CATL and BYD.
Mercedes & BMW are both still playing catch up with Tesla.
They must have lost a heck of a load of sales to Tesla particularly when the Model 3 came out judging by the number of Teslas there are around here in Bournemouth
Still have no idea why in the UK the registration plate has to co-incide with the year of the vehicle. Is it the year of manufacturer or first registration? Eg, if it was a December 2023 build but first registered in Feb 2024? Ireland is the only other country that I am aware of that does this.
The Brits have done this for decades, first with a letter at the end, then with a letter at the start, and now with a number in the middle that jumps twice a year. One of the reasons is to help the police. In the old days, witnesses would often at least remember the registration year letter when reporting miscreants. The other reason is to help the motor trade, since people upgrade more often to show off they can afford a new car.
As above and yes all to do with when first registered.
Sometimes you get cars that can be months or even years old but they’ll get the plate when first registered on the road.
@@RSEV Okay thanks. That makes the system even more pointless than I thought. None of this matters in Australia, its almost like cars get new registrations numbers by the month. Move states, new plate; have plates stolen, new plate, take off custom plates, new plate, change style, new plate.
Sorry if I missed this info, but how much time took this trip ?(904km) with charging and other stops. Since its real world scenario
It’s in the video what time I started and got home. Also in the video how bad traffic was
I saw the traffic. But can you tell me how many hours you spent for the trip?@@RSEV
Are those particular Tesla chargers, at Banbury, open to all vehicles? Charge connector on the wrong side, mind?
They are. £0.53-£0.58/kwh
@@RSEV But the Ospreys are much more costly! I would try to fit in on the Superchargers if atvall possible - they didn’t look busy.
The EQC has an atrocious range, particularly in winter. The very poor efficiency is partly due to excessive weight, energy managemett and battery design/ management.
I always thought the older the car the range got lower
Did you save money by buying a footlong tuna sub and then eat in from both directions?!
Or is that just me?!
Cheers guys
I'm not sure about needing to stop more than the car... I used to drive 320 miles up to Newcastle from London with either 1 fast stop or often no stop.
But not in those conditions....?
@@rogerstarkey5390certainly had bad conditions sometimes! Even if I did stop it was for 5-10 mins - point being I don't really agree with the 'person needs more stopping than the car' statement.
I own an EV by the way!
And by the way each too their own.
I could do the same, in fact I did last week. Needed toilet by the time I got to Grantham, had a quick wee then that was enough for Newcastle
@@RSEVit's certainly a trip! My EV in reality does 190 miles, the 250-300 of the Tesla's is good without having huge batteries. Not sure why all other EVs are less efficient?!
To be fair even my ID.4 gets about 3.5mi/kw and i drive that like i stole it
You could have charged the Mercedes on those Tesla chargers in Banbury.
Cheaper on the Osprey ones
Tesla ❤
Jeeeez 2mi/kWh on standard home electricity prices is more expensive than diesel!!
One thing that has puzzled me, is how often you have to stop for comfort breaks. I now have a theory. Is it because you eat and drink terrible processed junk food? Subways, Mcdonalds, Costa coffee. I never eat any of that crap, and I can go 6 or 7 hours without needing to stop. I am now 69 and still travel for 6 hours without thinking about my bladder. I would love you to test this out. Stop the processed junk food and see how you do.
Headlights - the best I've ever used are the matrix headlights on the Vauxhall Corsa-e. Absolutely fantastic.
Those big expensive first(ish) gen EVs like the EQC and arguably the IPACE are going to be a massive problem - increasingly outdated charging tech and degrading efficiency must be making them depreciate like a rock
Some of the best efficancy I have got out of my model 3 was during a snow storm. I drove for 340 km starting with 95% and ending with 10 out of a battery with 12,5% degradation. Because driving that slow, slow as it may be, your range incrases in spite of going through slush and wind. Please consider that EVs use a fraction of the energy of fossil fuel vehicles. So talking about kWhrs or percent is always misleading. In terms of money spent, I always travel cheap.