Though it is certainly a lot of characters to do this for, the math is definitely skewed. For instance: Daredevil can never land two Devil's Deliverance's in a turn because the attack will push the targets out of range.
Not necessarily. Yes they will be pushed, but you ‘could’ be in a position where you have your own characters in place to stop them (plus terrain can do the same). Yes it is very, very unlikely- but not impossible.
Damage isn't always the problem. Mobility, damage, status effects, etc. CGR is a perfect example of this. Going anywhere he wants, pulling someone to him (which may be more mobility), providing incinerate, then huge hits. While also being able to count skulls, a ton of immunities, etc. Damage is certainly not everything. But it is a factor. Because his average amounts is enough to take out 2 activations R1 and possibly killing them R2. EDIT: I should say though, this is a really cool way to rethink the game and stop just talking about damage.
Your edit there is the exact reason why I make videos like this - it is to highlight that whilst Carnage is 'on average' doing the most damage, there are so many other factors that win games, with damage often being one of the least effective ways (Web Warriors and Wakanda can testify to that)!
For Klaw, was it 2 spenders, or did you think to include his Tactic Card that gives him the A5 attack? might not really make a difference, but would be fun to see.
The crisis card "Spider-Infected Invade Manhattan" has a condition that when met states "advance S". When that is in affect, do I have to move the entire S distance or anywhere within S?
I know it would be difficult to automate but i disagree on the methodology for dr strange here. While it is a reroll all, the player makes the decision on when to use it or not. The average would go up if you were to only use it with a below par first roll. Think of it like using ‘advantage’ in dnd 5e. You’re not increasing the spike potential at all but you ARE increasing the average successes if you use it every time you roll below par
We we're using average damage, not highest possible damage. The ability to reroll all doesn't increase the Average amount of damage a character can do - but you are correct, being able to reroll all whilst in an actual game is an advantage, as if you fluff the roll completely, it gives you an extra chance to get a better result that previously rolled - but what it doesn't do is change the average result if you rolled the same dice a million times.
@@RichMidGaming if you take a d20 and roll it a million times, the average is 10.5. If you take the same d20 and roll it a million times with advantage, the average is 13.8. Obviously, mcp ‘reroll all’ doesn’t let you do it with perfect information like this but if you choose to reroll all every time you roll fewer than than 3 successes, the total average DOES go up. You’re decreasing the likelihood of a subpar roll by half Similarly, if you had 10 coins to flip, the odds of getting 5 heads is 50%. If you added the ability to scrap a roll if it was under 5 and re-do it, the average number of ‘successful attempts’ goes up
@@bertboxer1 The only problem with that example is that the D20 is rolling twice and taking the highest, where as Dr. Strange is taking the second result. This is why the average jumps up with the D20 as the results are dependent on each other while it wouldn't affect Dr. Strange's avg because the results are completely independent.
OK, so many things here mate, but your math here is just wrong. The 'odds' of getting 5 heads from 10 coins is not 50%, its 0.246% - if we are talking about the average (which is what I use in all my calculations) then yes, it would be 50/50 over say a million or so attempts - being able to reflips all coins when you only get 4 heads (or indeed 6 heads), does not change the average overall - it gives you a second flip of all 10 coins, which ultimately gives you another chance of hitting the 0.246% shot, but it doesn't effect the average one iota. As for the single dice, this isn't a comparable result, as you are only talking about 1 die - which if it rolls less than 10, you would get to reroll, so it effectively doubles your odds of getting over the average result (again, it still doesn't change the average, but it increases your chance of doing better than it). With Stranges ability, it is 6 die and reroll ALL - that means any successes you had previously are also rerolled, and yes, it does increase the percentage chance in a single instance of getting a better result, it once again does not increase the average in any way, shape or form.
@@drowssapism i’ll run some numbers later today but, while the rolls are independent, the player chooses when the reroll happens or doesnt happen. If you only select it when you roll 3 or fewer successes on 6 dice, it is mathematically favorable to increase the average. Also, crits add dice to the reroll that don’t exist in the initial roll. An initial roll that has 2 crits and no other successes will let you reroll 8 dice if neither crit explodes
The real problem is the way you do the math. Averages my friend. On average you only hit 2-3 people with an area or beam attack. No chance in hell of hitting 5-6. Your own list should have told you your math is skewed.
You may get one good area or beam attack off per game, especially if the opponent isn’t familiar with the character you’re using and don’t know to watch out for it. Certain situations do mitigate a bit, ie Dynamo boosting to line up an optimal beam, or SS Strange scalpeling himself or someone else within range to do his Shining Circle (of course you’ll blow through 10 power just for that one move if you do it that way). I’ve found that’s where crisis selection is really important, especially for secures. If you have a beam or a AOE that requires people to be relatively close together to be effective, having objectives where people are standing all over the board won’t be conducive for it. Gamma, Demons, Dark Portals, researcher, or anything that lines people up in a straight line or clumps them together will go a long way to making things easier.
@@thegreyinitiate3680 you may? I agree, you may. If your opponent even brings 5-6 characters, you may. If your opponent brings 5-6 characters to an E map, you may. Besides, maybe getting 1 off per game is not getting two off in a turn or even every turn. I would personally rather see the list with beams and area attacks calculated at around 2.5 targets regardless of range, because that’s much more realistic.
Though it is certainly a lot of characters to do this for, the math is definitely skewed. For instance: Daredevil can never land two Devil's Deliverance's in a turn because the attack will push the targets out of range.
Not necessarily. Yes they will be pushed, but you ‘could’ be in a position where you have your own characters in place to stop them (plus terrain can do the same). Yes it is very, very unlikely- but not impossible.
@@RichMidGaming Can’t argue with that. I admittedly hadn’t considered using my own characters to stop forced pushes before.
Great breakdown!! I love playing carnage, I think with the new doc ock he has more legs, still risky but definitely fun!
I spent 10 power and rolled 88 dice with Daredevil last weekend. That was frigging incredible.
I would love to see this done with a zero power start. Would be really interesting to see who can generate damage from nothing.
Great idea for another video!!
Damage isn't always the problem. Mobility, damage, status effects, etc.
CGR is a perfect example of this. Going anywhere he wants, pulling someone to him (which may be more mobility), providing incinerate, then huge hits. While also being able to count skulls, a ton of immunities, etc.
Damage is certainly not everything. But it is a factor. Because his average amounts is enough to take out 2 activations R1 and possibly killing them R2.
EDIT: I should say though, this is a really cool way to rethink the game and stop just talking about damage.
Your edit there is the exact reason why I make videos like this - it is to highlight that whilst Carnage is 'on average' doing the most damage, there are so many other factors that win games, with damage often being one of the least effective ways (Web Warriors and Wakanda can testify to that)!
Sure, this is just a pure number crunch activity. Damage isn't everything by any means, but it's a fun video :)
Can’t wait for detailed video on turn one strategies.
Point for point I'd say it's Bullseye.
Great list Rich! Some real surprises in there but shouldn't Gambits b4 have targeted 3 characters and not 5?
Moonknight is the real hero of mcp
not all heroes wear capes, but this one does!
For Klaw, was it 2 spenders, or did you think to include his Tactic Card that gives him the A5 attack? might not really make a difference, but would be fun to see.
The crisis card "Spider-Infected Invade Manhattan" has a condition that when met states "advance S". When that is in affect, do I have to move the entire S distance or anywhere within S?
Your opponent gets to make that advance, they can choose to move them anywhere along the S movement tool.
That makes perfect sense, thanks. I wondered what the text "opposing player resolves " meant. Now I get it.
You would not think those heros based on the comics would be so deadly other than gambit
I’m so confused by Crimson Dynamo out damaging Vision
Are you able to make the results available in a shared doc?
I will do mate yeah, just needs a tidy up and they’ll get published in the discord.
I know it would be difficult to automate but i disagree on the methodology for dr strange here. While it is a reroll all, the player makes the decision on when to use it or not. The average would go up if you were to only use it with a below par first roll. Think of it like using ‘advantage’ in dnd 5e. You’re not increasing the spike potential at all but you ARE increasing the average successes if you use it every time you roll below par
We we're using average damage, not highest possible damage. The ability to reroll all doesn't increase the Average amount of damage a character can do - but you are correct, being able to reroll all whilst in an actual game is an advantage, as if you fluff the roll completely, it gives you an extra chance to get a better result that previously rolled - but what it doesn't do is change the average result if you rolled the same dice a million times.
@@RichMidGaming if you take a d20 and roll it a million times, the average is 10.5. If you take the same d20 and roll it a million times with advantage, the average is 13.8. Obviously, mcp ‘reroll all’ doesn’t let you do it with perfect information like this but if you choose to reroll all every time you roll fewer than than 3 successes, the total average DOES go up. You’re decreasing the likelihood of a subpar roll by half
Similarly, if you had 10 coins to flip, the odds of getting 5 heads is 50%. If you added the ability to scrap a roll if it was under 5 and re-do it, the average number of ‘successful attempts’ goes up
@@bertboxer1 The only problem with that example is that the D20 is rolling twice and taking the highest, where as Dr. Strange is taking the second result. This is why the average jumps up with the D20 as the results are dependent on each other while it wouldn't affect Dr. Strange's avg because the results are completely independent.
OK, so many things here mate, but your math here is just wrong.
The 'odds' of getting 5 heads from 10 coins is not 50%, its 0.246% - if we are talking about the average (which is what I use in all my calculations) then yes, it would be 50/50 over say a million or so attempts - being able to reflips all coins when you only get 4 heads (or indeed 6 heads), does not change the average overall - it gives you a second flip of all 10 coins, which ultimately gives you another chance of hitting the 0.246% shot, but it doesn't effect the average one iota.
As for the single dice, this isn't a comparable result, as you are only talking about 1 die - which if it rolls less than 10, you would get to reroll, so it effectively doubles your odds of getting over the average result (again, it still doesn't change the average, but it increases your chance of doing better than it). With Stranges ability, it is 6 die and reroll ALL - that means any successes you had previously are also rerolled, and yes, it does increase the percentage chance in a single instance of getting a better result, it once again does not increase the average in any way, shape or form.
@@drowssapism i’ll run some numbers later today but, while the rolls are independent, the player chooses when the reroll happens or doesnt happen. If you only select it when you roll 3 or fewer successes on 6 dice, it is mathematically favorable to increase the average. Also, crits add dice to the reroll that don’t exist in the initial roll. An initial roll that has 2 crits and no other successes will let you reroll 8 dice if neither crit explodes
Let Carnage use Doomed Prophecy again you cowards!
Fix Carnage as he is total garbage
he does need some extra defence, he is the ultimate glass canon in this game, but it just doesn't work!
Carnage needs minimum 5-2-2 Def + extra help elsewhere on his card. Total travesty giving him 1s on any Def stat
Title is a bit click baity, but I'll allow it. This is really measuring how well characters convert power into multi-target damage, though.
Answer: whatever Quinn is using
nah, he's a pussycat ;-)
i will save everyone about 4 minutes: top 5 are medusa, gambit, daredevil, claw, and carnage.
The real problem is the way you do the math. Averages my friend. On average you only hit 2-3 people with an area or beam attack. No chance in hell of hitting 5-6. Your own list should have told you your math is skewed.
You may get one good area or beam attack off per game, especially if the opponent isn’t familiar with the character you’re using and don’t know to watch out for it. Certain situations do mitigate a bit, ie Dynamo boosting to line up an optimal beam, or SS Strange scalpeling himself or someone else within range to do his Shining Circle (of course you’ll blow through 10 power just for that one move if you do it that way). I’ve found that’s where crisis selection is really important, especially for secures. If you have a beam or a AOE that requires people to be relatively close together to be effective, having objectives where people are standing all over the board won’t be conducive for it. Gamma, Demons, Dark Portals, researcher, or anything that lines people up in a straight line or clumps them together will go a long way to making things easier.
@@thegreyinitiate3680 you may? I agree, you may. If your opponent even brings 5-6 characters, you may. If your opponent brings 5-6 characters to an E map, you may.
Besides, maybe getting 1 off per game is not getting two off in a turn or even every turn.
I would personally rather see the list with beams and area attacks calculated at around 2.5 targets regardless of range, because that’s much more realistic.
Keep in mind I’m also the guy that loves his Nightcrawler video, but the way beams and Area attacks were calculated just isn’t realistic in this one.
There’s a non-binary Captain Marvel?! 😂 🏳️🌈