Ever since I found your channel, I can’t listen to any of the other so-called narcissism “experts” on RUclips. They spend too much time on fluff and trying to relate to the victim, as opposed to providing valuable, substantive insight and information. I’ve also purchased your book.
I see what you mean. At some point the ‘hate fest’ against narcissists becomes unhelpful. I appreciate the analysis here of all the subtle complexities of narcissism to recognize it for what it truly is.
@@SoapsLuvr it's like some people want to take the narcissism word and apply it to many areas it doesn't belong to make themselves the victim of the other person the bad guy. I say this is a victim of a few narcissist and it's my fault for letting them into my life or with people like my mom across the country from where I live now 3500 miles away, giving into the reactive abuse bait and switch game
@@SoapsLuvr Another problem with the hate Fest, which believe me at one point WAS beneficial to my recovery is that it becomes silly when they start using LOUDLY AND PROUDLY use words like empath. The way that they use it, it's like another way to cover up the fact that they're being doormats and coming up with this black and white THINKING, which is ironically/ hypocritically what they accuse the narcissist does in this whole angel/devil mentality equaling "empath"/narccisist, perhaps exposes the narcissism of some of the people. Especially some of the females who just with real new substance like to just accused the X of being a narcissist because they didn't get weight things their way like the little spoiled girl. Everyone is a narcissist a scale of 1 to 10 and I don't have any of the cunning or other sorts of behaviors of the typical narcissist. But some of these other narcissists who CLAIM THEY'RE EMPATHS forget to look in the mirror. I who call others narcissist. what is supposed to be healthy recovery from being exploited by narcissist almost turns into a weird little victimey cult and I am as guilty of the rest of them for plane into that role myself I am trying to pull myself out of that trap because it just becomes too over simplistic the way the rest of the victim crowd which I am trying to kind of leave portrays it. Sword of Spirit, others in the common areas that I visit and other videos would call you the narcissist for saying that. I, on the other hand, see it as a fresh breath of air. One just has to learn to protect themselves from not being exploited nor ever inadvertently acting back out the behaviors they have received. thank you for your post. I needed it
For years I thought me ex-husband had bipolar disorder but after listening to your videos I now know that he has NPD. Thank you for providing your expertise. I now understand why he lost his law firm, his law license, had an affair with a borderline, lost his house, left me, and now lives off the grid in NM. I also understand why he does not call or have any interest in his son. This has helped me heal more than I can say!
I also thought my husband was bipolar for 24 years until the last few months and now I know that he is a covert Narcissist and his father is possibly a malignant narcissist thank you so much for sharing your knowledge!
Thank You! My ex boyfriend was married 4 times. He told me that he has Never been Faithful to anyone! He changes jobs constantly, never keeps any close friends. Is Anger is Explosive! And when his ex-wife came back into his life, at 1st I was mad and hurt. And After this Video I KNOW that his ex-wife did me a Favor!!!
I absolutely love your videos. I was watching this one and was saying out loud to my phone (to you) 'Yes, but then they abuse you after everything you do', and two seconds later you said, 'And the worst thing is that the narcissist devalues these people...' And I screamed 'Yes! Thank you!' No matter how many of your videos I watch I still struggle to get my head around how they can be so self destructive. You can give them everything and it will never be enough. More verbal abuse will come, always whsn you least expect it. Beautiful weekends or nights out or holidays, just ruined for no apparent reason. They need to be able to control your happiness and that is so toxic and sick. Thank you for your incredible intelligence on this subject.
Sam Vaknin is the only RUclips expert on the issue at hand. Thought provoking and excellent communication with his audience. I will look no where else!
Professor Sam Vaknin , you are absolutely right my ex husband is psychopath and boyfriend is a narcissist , the first one is horrible and reckless put us in so many problems and debt the second one had one island of stability it’s his business and the rest is Chios , I don’t deal with him in money but I would never wanna marry him coz he is also irresponsible and reckless it is just the first one more dangerous than the second but both have many mental problems , I don’t know how they find me sadly. I watch all your videos , I learned a lot from you , you r the most smartest one on you tube on this topic , only you solved my 25 years of mystery
@@marionheil9061 Really?...Pure curiosity! Wich university do you go to? Your last name sounds german, but even though he is a professor I am not sure they are close to their knowledge at most of universities, speaking to several students from dutch and german universities about narcissism, I've noticed they are "green" on this field, because apparently in their cases they do not really dive into it.
I must say that your explanations using metaphores have helped me immensley. I was raised by a malignant narcissist and had a front line seat to how they disolve human beings to nothingness. I needed to understand why and you have helped me , eloquently I might add, in this 'journey'. Thank you
Basically everything described about the narcissistic experience sounds quite like the every day experience of a 7 year old. It's fascinating how much of their mental development is forever ceased before they are even adolescents.
Hello Sam, I have been in therapy for a while and have been studying cluster B personalities for about 2 years. And I stumbled upon your videos today. While listening, I became enraged, i am at work and had to calm myself down. You have hit everything spot on. What, and how explain things resonate in me. When I look back at all the abuse all the "uncashed checks" the lies the manipulation, I am agry at myself and angry at them. Thank you so much for lifting the wool from my eyes, and dispelling the delusion that I believed for so long.
I’m a narcissistic man. I seem to always find myself attached to psychopathic women. The relationships are always toxic. I am provocative and she is violent. I am engulfing and she is cheating. I am indifferent and she is threatening to kill herself, calling the police or getting me fired from my work. I succeed somewhere and she tears me down. She injures me narcissistically and I go into a rage and throw her onto the streets. She leaves me and I beg for her return through suicidal gestures, promises of marriage, anything until she finally leaves for another man permanently. Then I find a new woman and if this cycle doesn’t repeat, I am bored and do not attach to her. I crave the emotional sadomasochistic cycle despite how painful and life ruining that it is and detrimental for me. I don’t want this form of love, but it’s all I ever receive. It seems to be reserved mostly for me, even psychopathic women treat other less provocative men significantly better than me. There is something about me that brings out the worst in women. A vileness.
You have to heal the wounded part that attracts this kind of women and then reprogram your mind so you will not feel bored by a normal and peaceful relationship. Its a big step that you are aware of your relationships patterns, you have just to release it...
I hope in this last 2 years you've improved this part of you. It's admiring how aware you are of your personality, if we all would be so rational this world would be better.
Would you date a man who told you he's always been alone and in pain.......probably why they lie Would you date a man who didn't pay for the first date......probably why love bombing exists I'm not sure if you have siblings or some kind of lifelong relationship ship......but wouldn't you do anything to keep it
I appreciate when you compare normal reactions with the differences in narcissist. Sometimes the projection over time confuses the mind when character has been called into question over decades. The chaos is uncomfortable but normal and what should be normal becomes uncertain/questionable. My narc is a career narc with 4 shared children.
Thank you so much for this video. I was raised by two narcissists (one that is probably actually borderline with a strong narcissist type) - so relationships of any importance in my life always involve some aspect of this personality type and I’ve learned to accept it - as long as I keep learning about it and how to cope with it. I think some people don’t understand that some of us were so strongly shaped by narcissists that it’s not really possible for us to leave this type no matter who it is that surfaces. And being with a non-narcissist type would NOT necessarily even work for us (or feel ‘right’).
Me too.... It’s hard to believe how this is even possible because most people don’t experience this. I’m trying to understand what that must be like not to live life with these people magnetizing to me and Why I’m not happy with out these people in my life. I don’t know it’s hard. I’m trying to understand.
it's due to the Toxic CODEPENDENCY, created in early age, due to being raised by two Narcissists. You are attracted to what is familiar, unfortunately your subconscious controls your decisions even though they maybe be familiar BUT not good for you. We bring to our lives what we need to heal until we healed 🙏 ... You have to break the toxic pattern to be able to learn the dynamics of healthy relationships! Demands lots of courage, perseverance, discipline and self love and... NEVER EVER GIVE UP , the road is not easy, but worth every second !!! 💛 🙏
Donna,same here, also 36 years at same job,although never married but had kids (commitments issues or didnt really care much for the woman to marry her, I never got to know). Great care about personal appearance, the facade, and a lot of criticism for how others looked , but his home messy, unloved, chaotic, everything in the way,like an obstacle course..Not like collectors, who have things all over the place, but just junk, everything out of place...that was the first dissonance, warning sign, but i didnt know who I was dealing with then..every textbook characteristic of a covert narc came to manifest themselves in due time..
Only yesterday I left someone with borderline personality disorder,a person who during our 8 months relationship had few anger rages coused by almost nothing. Once he hurted himself, once he woke me up after fight and had a episode of such rage I thought he will kill me ,he was always telling me he have abandonment issues and depression all his life,I tried everything to help him , but he wanted to almost make me constanly proving how much I love him almost he expected from me to nurse him. When I for example left to see a friend and told him it was good day,he would act numb and than sleep in another room. Almost every single argument he was telling me his episodes of rage anger was my foult, I suspected he suffers from borderline personality disorder and I was almost prepared to help but I realised he probably knows his diagnosis and hiding this from me. I felt completely trapped,I would be prepared to help but he continues to ignore to act and rejected antidepressants and despite being a teacher highly educated he smoked weed which I didn know at first about when I met him.simply I would never suspect that teacher can be smoking marihuanna so often( every day) I knew I will leave and cant be with him becouse of the addiction,but was prepared to help him. Situation went really bad when I realised he was trying to punish me via differen behavior towards me if I did something that he didt like. I didnt see myself as a victim couse I knew he is sick,however when I realised he doesn't take his self disstruction seriously I knew I have to leave. I recognised his manipulation and often he told me he doesnt want to be this person. I had no other option than leave, when I realised he and his behavior are taking controll of my life and the way I think. I made sure he doesn't know my new adress,and to be honest that s what my intuition was telling me to do,,,not to tell him. I really feel sorry for him,but,,if he doesn't care enough to care for this very serious mental sickness I couldn help. I would like to add he is a very good father but my only option was to leave. Also ,his father was a lawyer who was shot when he was only 8 and his mother had to work and almost left him to himself for a year. This is a scary very scary personality disorder but during covid I observed him a lot and I have a suspicion he only have his rages when he chooses to,that would suggest he is capable to control it! Very,very weird personality but also god person!!!
Wow themother having to workis so similar of a situation I know of, and no they couldn't control their angeroutbursts whatsoever. Its like swearing out loudfor people with tourettes
Bpd male here....first and foremost you did the best thing you could buy getting away for your own well being ..untreated bpd is never going to work in any relationship.,,,as for the weed ..(I can relate)most likely he used to calm himself or dissociate from anxiety, paranoia,or dysphoria...borderlines can smoke a ton of weed and or drink ALOT...I'm not advocating for chronic cannabis use as treatment but i cab telk you the experience would have been much more intense if he was a heavy drinker ...it's pure chaos and can get violent. Best wishes on your road back
I cant stop watching your videos since I found your channel a week ago. Your vivid and yet almost mathematically precise descriptions of very deep dynamics behind all theese phenomena are just stunning. Thank you for sharing!
Your video of the difference between a narcissist and physcopath was very enlightening. I can't wait to watch the rest of your videos. So, glad your channel is here to listen and learn. Thank you.
Thank you for humanizing these people. I find many fans of other channels get bogged down and stuck in a dark, vilifying, and vengeful place. Most commenters here seem to be very gracious and open to new, even unpleasant information. Much more constructive than seeking out another buzzword salad to seethe to.
Exactly that. The covert narc in my life is dedicated to hoarding money which he is good at but everything else is messed up (damaged relations with family, no friends, alcohol/porn abuse, no morals, depression/paranoia)
Terrifying is right. It's so very informative, but the accuracy of his descriptions of the psycho and the narc leave me to question... what in the hell was I in?😮 Minus the abusive language, everything else was spot on!
So true they have a base women/men but they keep tearing other people and hurting other precious souls. We are going through a custody issue. This is so helpful to understand their dynamics.
My mother is obsessed with her 200 boxes of books. She always says her books are her life. They are non-negotiable. Everything else is a whirlwind. Filthy, chaotic, hoarder of empty and filled boxes. She will fly into a rage if you touch anything of hers. She does hold on to my kids and tried me, but I got away. She still holds my youngest daughter as a way to get to me.
Thank you Sam!! Your the best to explain this. It’s very deep! Thanks again you are really making me understand! It is hard still on the soul and I guess the ego when you have loved and you wondered always why no reciprocation. Never understood till I found you on u tube. I just feel like I wasted my best years in life. On a positive note I’m young at heart and will be fine. Knowledge is everything !! Helps a lot!! Thank you!!
You might go into this later, but couple questions… 1. Do _narcissistic psychopaths_ have the NPD “island of stability”? If so, how does it look different from pure-NPD “islands”? 2. How you describe the psychopath - the constant chaos, no stability, living a life like you’re a quadriplegic who’s insisting on competing in track and field, etc - sounds…..kind of a lot like ADHD lol. Even as you continue speaking, the emotional dysregulation, dysregulated grandiosity, etc etc…so much like ADHD. I guess the question, then, is: how can we tell secondary psychopathy apart from adult ADHD? Additionally, how might comorbid ADHD-bipolar further complicate the differential diagnosis here (since bipolar can inject additional chaos into the adult ADHDer’s life, can generate severe grandiosity that alternates with severe self loathing via mania vs depression, etc)?
By far the best video I have watched by Sam Vaknin. Very interesting how narcissists can, for instance, behave like borderlines. My ex-girlfriend had a mother that was diagnosed with NPD, and she herself exhibited a lot of traits Vaknin describes about the borderline narcissist. Constantly looking for attention from other men, even though our relationship was fine and pretty uncontroversial and stable. She would switch jobs constantly, and act like a child if confronted. She had absolutely zero ownership of her faults, even though she did have empathy and was very emotional. Sometimes, she would acknowledge her mistakes, only to act as a victim and cry, begging me not to break up with her. She threatened me with suicide indirectly, should I have broken up with her. In the end, she simply discarded me and left me for another person, as that would warrant her "escape" from her narcissistic mother, as I don't have my own place to live and for her to live as well. She is now engaged to that person, who is actually a pretty successful musician. I am still a broke, struggling musician. I am in no way a psychologist or claiming she is definitely a narcissist, but I wondered if she was either borderline or narcissistic, and coming across this video, it has reinforced my beliefs about her. But, the main reasons why I favor this video, is the correlation between open relationships and the rise in narcissism, which was very interesting to me. I trust Sam Vaknin the most if it comes to conclusions made about this disorder, but I wonder if there is any more research regarding this. Another great subject here was the distinction between the "career narcissist" and "celebrity narcissist". If I understand correctly, the career narcissist is more correlated with the primary psychopath, who actually exhibits traits that can be useful for mankind, which is a theme I vaguely observed in online articles, but not quite precisely described like Vaknin did. I wonder, are primary psychopaths really all that evil as we perceive them to be? Kind of controversial to ask these kinds of questions, but I am curious. Thank you for your amazing work, Sam Vaknin. I hope to meet you some day.
I was reading ICE MANS biography recently and it amazed me how Richard Kuklinski, a psycopath of the most violent kind, was able to create and sustain the image of the good and honest familly man, never had any extramarital affairs, spend time at home with his children doing simple every day activities etc etc... And in his one words this is what he actually wanted, a stable famlilly and he made his hobby of murder a job in order to support them. Maybe this was do to his paranoid side (he was diagnosed antisocial +paranoid)? Mr. Vaknin, i believe some videos on PPD would be interesting. I have heard that some times can be mistaken for antisocials.
BTK was like this too. I believe he is considered to be a psychopath. I’m not sure Sam is correct in his definitions. I don’t think anybody has the absolute say on what defines the different personality disorders. Humanity is just beginning to understand them and much more work is to be done.
Thanks so much for this, Sam. I'm a bipolar female, but I relate to most of these descriptions. The part around 35 minutes where you talk about boredom with routine and the mundane. It really resonates with me. I just discovered you on an Amazon video documentary about this subject. I will have to search through your videos for anything on bipolar disorder and the connection / attraction to narcissists. I'm extremely curious about the effects of a relationship and reasons for this "cosmic" attraction between bipolar personalities and narcissists.
Hello J hall. I suggest you check out "The human Magnet syndrome" by Ross rosenburg. Your magnetic attraction to narcissists is likely caused by some form of codependency (or, Self love deficit disorder as rosenburg puts it) rather than your bipolarity. The magnetic attraction is apparently caused by a subconscious familiarity and comfort between narcissists and codependents, both of which are the products of childhoods that produced various forms of attachment trauma. As a recovering codependent who has a sister who is also bipolar as well as severely condependant, I am 100% confident that both conditions can exist simultaneously. Hope this helps.
I have a narcissistic alcoholic father..and guess who I married? A narcissistic alcoholic. I have 43 years of experience living with assholes. My mom passed away from cancer because she was so mentally damaged by abuse...I always repeated to myself " I am not my mom, I will fight "...and I am still fighting even though I am not in contact with both narcs. Prof. Sam Vaknin is the only one who knows what he is talking about.
It will be so helpful to have a book/ guide to easily teach my teen daughter about how to identify the mentally ill, so she does not have to learn the hard way. More than once I was involved with narcissistic people, I wish I knew what I learned with painful experiences. A book with examples of probably something teens like, love stories of people with this symptoms and how the wrong choice of boyfriend/ friends can destroy them. Teaching this early in once life can make a world of difference. Thank you for sharing such a valuable knowledge. ✨🌻
Def agree with you it can be dangerous to generalize and cater to victims without a much larger and better structure psychological profile of the experience. Thank you for being a voice of reason
Borderline I would argue is it's own thing. But I would argue that alot of people get misdiagnosed with it and actually just have psychopathy or narcissism.
That introduction malarky proper made me laugh! Nice 1.. and now having got to the end proper made me think too. My efforts to educate myself are paying off thanks to Sam Vaknin and his associate/ friend Richard Grannon. Everyday's a school day so they say, but these fellas must have helped so many. Discovering these two was a game changer and a serious personal leveller. Huge respect to both for such valuable and protective insights and the passion to raise awareness of not just the impacts of narcissistic abuse but offering the knowledge and understanding of why they are like that are. I've learnt a very valuable lesson in not to take it personally, so now I just object to being an object and that makes sense to me.
Wow, thank you for speaking about the island of stability! My husband is a narcissist, I'm his island...he's never cheated on me. He is completely indifferent about other people entirely, uses everyone, they are all objects, all except me. If someone hurt me, he'd kill them and feel nothing. I don't know what to do. You're so right! Everything else is absolute chaos. Cannot hold a job. Has no friends. All family has abandoned him. I'm afraid if I walk away, he will kill himself or someone else. Any suggestions? I can't do this anymore. And what is wrong with me that I find this kind of insane devotion flattering? I don't want an unhealthy relationship. I love him, I know he loves me. I'm deeply saddened and so confused.
If it’s me,IL stay. The main reason I leave my ex was he cheat so much and engage in reckless behaviour,I get diseases everytime...I’m scare one day he will come home with HIV,so I left since I cannot change this only behaviour...other behaviour,I can take it.
You find it flattering because he’s giving you a taste of what supply feels like to him. He wants you to be addicted. It’s nothing wrong on your part, but is exploitative and manipulative on his part. Leave ASAP as safely as possible.
does this island of stability change ? if its the partner then she died for example , or if its the family , is the narcissist capable of creating another island?
Thank you Sam , you are heaven sent, your knowledge has helped me understand what happened to me, and now I am healing my entire life and learning about what happened to my brain in the relationship, but it happened and I'm a survivor not a victim, thank you and God Bless you
Borderline narcissist is not a recognized diagnosis. It describes a NARCISSIST with borderline traits. A covert narcissist is a BORDERLINE with narcissistic traits.
How does one manage to get along with an odd bod of this description. I only ask after 50yrs of marriage and many years of longing and trying to help and hold our family together, to have my husband walk out saying he had feelings for a co-worker who was no spring chicken but I believe he needed her more than he needed me. We had a business together and it was my business to start with. He just took over believing, I guess, that he could do a better job. I thoroughly believed he loved me until our children left home when we were both about 45. Then things turned a little sour. I lost a new purpose built home, my job and my husband all in 1 year.
THANK YOU FOR THIS MATERIAL. I think a self-diagnosis can be tricky haha (of course) becouse I consider myself a stable, even sometimes boring person (definitely bored person) and without consultation with therapist and friends I would never think that I dont have an island of stability. But it's true and I see it now. Very interesting
yes. yes. yes. My mother graduated from a Naturopathic School and got a degree, but never could treat people. She worked for the last 30 years in min. wage jobs, but would tell anyone that she's a dr. She would consider herself an equal to any doctor she went to. She would challenge any doctor and grill them on their credentials. I finally realized that she hates me, because I always try to find the truth.
I have a question does the psychopath have any actually real sexual attraction to their targets? Or do they just get bored with everyone weather they are or not? Having A very hard time understanding how Hes gone from extremely unattractive people to extremely attractive and back seemingly treating the more attractive ones brutally
I agree! The exact words out of the narcissist in my life actually stated, “there is no such thing as color-it’s black or white.” Yet; the narcissist can have these tendencies-not all for each category. But, we all can certainly get the jest of the narcissists’ profile. Perfectionist, successful and confident in many avenues of life. responsible, pious, flirtatious, dutiful, workaholic, inventive, passionate, energetic, driven, seemingly truthful, intelligent, and gifted, but lives or might I say, instills fear in others. The negative aspects are with brut force, controlling, sadistic, abusive, lack of empathy, communication, understanding and compassion for the suppliers. But, still works to prove or set a good example with genuine aid, guidance and charity to others. With many foundations such as life long hobbies, stellar work performance, good relations outside of the home environment as in professional business interactions and social outings with travel, and fulfilling home duties. Love is strictly being available or present and transactional, or punishing, cruel, invasively intrusive out of internalized fear. Hurtful and sadistically abusive physically and verbally as well as emotionally. Critical and never personal-in getting to know close one’s intimately. More of a dictatorship, foundation-ally, stern on rules and duties but is neglectful of engaging in loving bonds. If so they are awkward and intrusive or scapegoating- Stepping on eggshells and escaping becomes the only foundation for the so called black sheep. Speaking one’s truth is halted immediately even when asked. Just a love/hate/fear type of unpredictability. There are no excuses but we all have our fault, weaknesses and quirks. Hopefully, we all can communicate, truly listen and understand our part and forgive for real change. We all need knowledge, time to heal, acceptance and love as well as to learn how to express our feeling for proper bonding. Even though it seems impossible; there is always hope-an effort. Talk therapy without toxic numbing, addictive substances is a healthy start. But to each their own. No judgments. We all have a voice and a choice to stand our ground. Everyone has their own set of circumstances to contend with and options. Understanding the drawbacks and seeing the signs is the first step to healing. Peace be with you all. 🕊♥️🕊 ETA🌹
So fascinating and I find myself many times thinking that in general human beings today fit a lot of these descriptions. As in the career narcissist so much of what you described seems like a typical job description of how are you should be in order to achieve success at that workplace. Also very interesting about black-and-white thinking of people especially on RUclips… I had never heard of a narcissist and now in the last several years it’s literally all you see on RUclips… Instagram it is a likely way over used buzz word. Most of the time when I’m listening to people describe it they just sound like they are angry and venting about some past relationship they had with a narcissist so now, everyone is a narcissist 🤷🏻♀️ I definitely take any content I listen to with a grain of salt.
But you are a good audience to thank the doctor. Your you're yore, we get the gist. I had to smile though, it was funny, the teacher had to comment, cute(he has a funny sense of humor) and you responded back. I'd hang out with you in the crayon box.
If you are pretty much trained from birth to follow your own ideas, no matter what anyone else says, because it will make you a legend...and everything you stated about Career Narcissist is what they teach in schools and life coaching as the ideal human? I've heard nothing my entire life but climb to the top, take no prisoners, you have to be ruthless...so how does one survive in that world with an actual heartbeat? I fear I may be a borderline psychopath because I refuse to be a career narcissist. You can't get a job unless you lie and cheat your way in and no one told me once I got in to sit down and twittle my thumbs for 20 years. I've been whipped to run hard and hot for my entire life...how am I supposed to decouple this psychopathy and narcissistic shell that's all broken and falling apart?
I think that entitlement is always a red flag because motives are important. NPD person can be super succesfull, sad thing is he/she would feel like imposter regardless.
Sam, I'm interessted in what you think about the phrase: It's our birthright to ... (be happy, live a life full of whatever). A lot of the so called spiritual teachers use such phrases . To me this is an example of a quite high sense of entitlement and sounds very narcisstic.
@@samvaknin ...very sad but true , and ironicly they claim to be in charge even after total collapse and suicide threats all over the place. Astounishing ! it seems that the false self is the only rescue.
Thank you so much Sam Vaknin! I believe chain changement arrives because of the new energy one can find in new things after the perceived (and denied) failure one feels after disrupting the first thing
My parent had a 'stable' marriage for over 50 years, but the marriage was dysfunctional and had frequent incidents domestic violence (usually every weekend.) ??? Narcissist or psychopath. I think there were elements of both- but I'm not an expert or a scholar- I just lived through it.
Ex said it’s either his job or relationship one or the other never works out, he said his jobs works out or relationships works only one succeeds . He said it’s hard to maintain both. Is he a narcissist?
So can the object of stability change over time? For instance, if work was the narcissists stability and he retires, would he seek stability in a relationship? Could he possibly do that when his fear of commitment to one woman was so strong?
@@samvaknin Thank you for your response. Ah, so interesting. I imagine the partner would go through a certain amount of emotional pain because the pattern of relating would not change. For instance, the hot and cold behavior, mood swings, etc. Also, emotional distancing, which I believe you mentioned.
So...a serial killer who is similar to the fictional character, Hannibal Lector, is both a narcissist & primary psychopath? I am thinking of a deceased person who was suspected to be a serial killer who could've been the real life Hannibal, one would almost think that the author had modeled his character after him, except that the author claimed that another person was his model--both the real 'suspected' serial killer & the fictional killer were highly intelligent & artistically/musically talented, extremely organized, in complete control of emotions, finances, businesses/practices, family & employees, no chaos, no disorder allowed. Unlike Hannibal, the real person believed in open marriages, sexual freedom/experimentation, mysticism, had multiple marriages & divorces, was accused of incest & relocated to different nations to escape reputation. What's the diagnosis of both fictional & nonfictional persons?
For me I was the only thing stable in his life , he was starting a new job (I helped him get by motivating him to try) and then I left him because he replaced me with a girl down the street from his new job. When I left He went insane, he stalked me would chase me down the street even when I had coworkers escort me out of my job. He kidnapped me eventually but he got away with everything in court, then two years later he contacted me to blame me ,love bomb me, told me I lied to the judge, then told me he found real love triangulating me with his new replacement then he blocked me when I got upset. I’ve been blocked for years
So a psychopath has no island of stability only chaos. Does this complete absence of logos typify all those who are diagnosed with anti social personality disorder, or only the most severe cases?
Thinking of Alex Murdaugh - he would be a Narcissist I think - one area of stability - his long term marriage. He said"I always want Maggie around me." Until he killed her, that is.
Maybe the psychopath and the narcissist see others as robots but honestly, most people are. I was 9 years old when I had the thought that maybe nothing in this world is real and I'm going through a simulation for learning something. Everyone around me seemed robotic to me. Their reactions were always the same, stuck in fear-patterns, predictable like machines. Indeed, there is little creativity in the mind of most people. I wondered if anyone else (especially any other child) is thinking about such stuff. Obviously not. Which proved to myself that they are really nothing more really than oblivious machines. They think they are real and they think their emotions are real, but they didn't really appear very real nor showed their behavior or thinking any sign of life (= creativity, consciousness). My mother said she loves us but I could feel it was not true. I only knew for myself that my consciousness is there and asks questions and perceives things no one else did. I was afraid of talking with someone about it because who knows what these machines all around me, playing that role play, start doing once they realize I figured them out? But it was obvious that there is a problem in the world, in the people, learning with 4 yrs about climate change and all these wars. It's obvious sth is seriously going wrong. Especially because no one seemed to see or understand that there must be the same dysfunctional psychological mechanism behind all the problems humanity is facing. And so I then told to myself: "I seethe problem. Hence I can understand it. Hence I can change it. Hence it's my responsibility." I didn't find others for a long time who had come to the same realization. So who is the sick one? Nowadays I don't feel like people are unreal anymore. But I've experienced things, also on emotional/cognitive level in protected intimate relationships or moments, that are far from what people think is even possible (spontaneous hypnosis with my very "psychopathic/narcisstic/borderline" SO (depending on the specific stage in the cycle), synaesthesia, fainting as a psychological reaction to intensity, hallucinative thinking....without drugs btw). Following the text book we as psychopaths or whatever we are are not supposed to have real emotions. But I guess it depends on if you're a puppet master looking for a puppet master (that's how I described it as a teen) or if you're looking for people to control. The latter is boring and in time makes you so frustrated that you get mean (which I fast learned to avoid due to uncomfortable situations in the social surroundings), while the first opens up new realms. There is something like an instinctive power status when people get together. Narcissists/psychopaths who never went for the real thing, who never found out how to create it in themselves, have zero real experience. They respectfully keep their distance. Often people think I'm manipulative because I'm gettin too fast into their head and they feel threatened, but one of my golden rules is absolute honesty, because there is already a power imbalance anyway between me and the people around me. And a world where you're the only one to see and understand or able to create certain things is a lonely place. There is no joy in the absence of mind, no real joy in power, and people being trapped in the societal normal-pathology is life threatening problem on this planet (Arno Gruen). If they were really healthy, why are their emotions so shallow, why do they cry for revenge, why are their bonds fragile, their understanding so limited, their behavior so ego-driven, their parenting so cruel, their disregard for other's needs and the worlds ecological collapse so obvious? I won't judge about myself here, as I'm just as much part and product of this society, but the normal people around me are not healthy, that's obvious. They bond incredibly quickly to me, yes, but not because I lie to them or reflect sth to them that is unreal but because I really see them and this activates the attachment system. The most beautiful thing I can imagine is a world where they are able to see as well, to create as well. There is too much to be done in this world, I can't save everyone. If everyone just cared for everyone, everyone would be cared for, billionfold. And there is a ton of work to do. I love the videos for the idea of the dynamic cycle that can be observed and that corresponds to what I've seen. But we're chasing the cat's tail when we're labeling something as disorder when really we're just traumatized enough to see the dysfunction in society and people and ourselves as what it is. We don't believe to be superior. We are. And it is no fun. It's lonely and the lack of consciousness in normal people is a real Problem. There is a reason npd, psychopaths, DID are highly intelligent. It means thinking out of the box. Trauma is information overload. I read in a Chinese paper about sinofuturism: "Aspire learning. Don't judge the information itself. It's all a training set. Information overload leads to consciousness." What we develop based on this ability can be abuse and delusions or sth else. The sickness is not the people, it's the delusional society and the wrong ideas of what to do with our abilities. Maybe we're just misunderstanding evolutionary adaptations that we're observing.
How do two borderlines treat each other after they meet each other? Do they recognize ones problem or do they identify with it or did it make them angry? Thank you.
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Ever since I found your channel, I can’t listen to any of the other so-called narcissism “experts” on RUclips. They spend too much time on fluff and trying to relate to the victim, as opposed to providing valuable, substantive insight and information. I’ve also purchased your book.
Thank you.
I see what you mean. At some point the ‘hate fest’ against narcissists becomes unhelpful. I appreciate the analysis here of all the subtle complexities of narcissism to recognize it for what it truly is.
@@SoapsLuvr Same here. Sam makes us understand what we are dealing with, and this is so helpful.
@@SoapsLuvr it's like some people want to take the narcissism word and apply it to many areas it doesn't belong to make themselves the victim of the other person the bad guy. I say this is a victim of a few narcissist and it's my fault for letting them into my life or with people like my mom across the country from where I live now 3500 miles away, giving into the reactive abuse bait and switch game
@@SoapsLuvr Another problem with the hate Fest, which believe me at one point WAS beneficial to my recovery is that it becomes silly when they start using LOUDLY AND PROUDLY use words like empath. The way that they use it, it's like another way to cover up the fact that they're being doormats and coming up with this black and white THINKING, which is ironically/ hypocritically what they accuse the narcissist does in this whole angel/devil mentality equaling "empath"/narccisist, perhaps exposes the narcissism of some of the people. Especially some of the females who just with real new substance like to just accused the X of being a narcissist because they didn't get weight things their way like the little spoiled girl.
Everyone is a narcissist a scale of 1 to 10 and I don't have any of the cunning or other sorts of behaviors of the typical narcissist. But some of these other narcissists who CLAIM THEY'RE EMPATHS forget to look in the mirror. I who call others narcissist. what is supposed to be healthy recovery from being exploited by narcissist almost turns into a weird little victimey cult and I am as guilty of the rest of them for plane into that role myself
I am trying to pull myself out of that trap because it just becomes too over simplistic the way the rest of the victim crowd which I am trying to kind of leave portrays it.
Sword of Spirit, others in the common areas that I visit and other videos would call you the narcissist for saying that. I, on the other hand, see it as a fresh breath of air.
One just has to learn to protect themselves from not being exploited nor ever inadvertently acting back out the behaviors they have received. thank you for your post. I needed it
1st♥️
The silver lining In this quarantine is Sam Vaknin putting out multiple videos even in 1 week! Ou lala
🎊 🏆 🎉
Hey, cool it! Sometimes she is not my cup of tea!
I'm starting to believe Sam is withholding the Corona Virus cure😅😅😅. Keep the Videos coming and thank you SIR
Intellectual treasure trove...😍🧠
For years I thought me ex-husband had bipolar disorder but after listening to your videos I now know that he has NPD. Thank you for providing your expertise. I now understand why he lost his law firm, his law license, had an affair with a borderline, lost his house, left me, and now lives off the grid in NM. I also understand why he does not call or have any interest in his son. This has helped me heal more than I can say!
I also thought my husband was bipolar for 24 years until the last few months and now I know that he is a covert Narcissist and his father is possibly a malignant narcissist thank you so much for sharing your knowledge!
Thank You! My ex boyfriend was married 4 times. He told me that he has Never been Faithful to anyone!
He changes jobs constantly, never keeps any close friends.
Is Anger is Explosive!
And when his ex-wife came back into his life, at 1st I was mad and hurt.
And After this Video I KNOW that his ex-wife did me a Favor!!!
They LOVE going back to ex-wives. Especially ths ones they smear and call "liars, psycho, ugly..." 3 years later....."I never said that" lol
4x married 😑😄
Live and learn.
Or their ex-girlfriends. Especially if they have trashed and thrashed them they string them along somehow.
@@brendaplunkett8659 ex sent me a nude photo of a woman with whom he'd been intimate. Weirdo.
I absolutely love your videos. I was watching this one and was saying out loud to my phone (to you) 'Yes, but then they abuse you after everything you do', and two seconds later you said, 'And the worst thing is that the narcissist devalues these people...' And I screamed 'Yes! Thank you!' No matter how many of your videos I watch I still struggle to get my head around how they can be so self destructive. You can give them everything and it will never be enough. More verbal abuse will come, always whsn you least expect it. Beautiful weekends or nights out or holidays, just ruined for no apparent reason. They need to be able to control your happiness and that is so toxic and sick. Thank you for your incredible intelligence on this subject.
Sam Vaknin is the only RUclips expert on the issue at hand. Thought provoking and excellent communication with his audience. I will look no where else!
This video should be mandatory in high school.
Sam you are real genius in this topic. Every narcissist I know have one island of stability. But the rest is chaos. Just as you have described.
You should see my work in physics, finance, and philosophy ...(sheepish) couldn't resist!
@@samvaknin 😆
Professor Sam Vaknin , you are absolutely right my ex husband is psychopath and boyfriend is a narcissist , the first one is horrible and reckless put us in so many problems and debt the second one had one island of stability it’s his business and the rest is Chios , I don’t deal with him in money but I would never wanna marry him coz he is also irresponsible and reckless it is just the first one more dangerous than the second but both have many mental problems , I don’t know how they find me sadly. I watch all your videos , I learned a lot from you , you r the most smartest one on you tube on this topic , only you solved my 25 years of mystery
The computer generated spectators is the most profound aspect of narcissism in my opinion. How they view the world is completely fascinating!!
Every time I watch one of your videos is like going to University
It's because I am a professor (my day job).
@@samvaknin Thank you Sam, this is gold!
Sam Vaknin - Thank you so much - for so many different perspectives. Dankeschön Mr. Vaknin
@@marionheil9061 Really?...Pure curiosity! Wich university do you go to? Your last name sounds german, but even though he is a professor I am not sure they are close to their knowledge at most of universities, speaking to several students from dutch and german universities about narcissism, I've noticed they are "green" on this field, because apparently in their cases they do not really dive into it.
@@samvakninthank you this is so insightful and so useful to have a different perspective especially the black / white thinking view
I must say that your explanations using metaphores have helped me immensley. I was raised by a malignant narcissist and had a front line seat to how they disolve human beings to nothingness. I needed to understand why and you have helped me , eloquently I might add, in this 'journey'. Thank you
Basically everything described about the narcissistic experience sounds quite like the every day experience of a 7 year old. It's fascinating how much of their mental development is forever ceased before they are even adolescents.
Trump is a perfect example of a narcissistic sociopath.
Hello Sam,
I have been in therapy for a while and have been studying cluster B personalities for about 2 years. And I stumbled upon your videos today. While listening, I became enraged, i am at work and had to calm myself down. You have hit everything spot on. What, and how explain things resonate in me. When I look back at all the abuse all the "uncashed checks" the lies the manipulation, I am agry at myself and angry at them. Thank you so much for lifting the wool from my eyes, and dispelling the delusion that I believed for so long.
Are you aware that he himself is a diagnosed Narcissis
@@someonespecial581 Who? Sam himself, right?
His mom is His island of stability.
Your explanations are amazing, your ability to read the narcissist's mind is absolutely amazing. No academic research comes close to your insights
He's apparently a diagnosed narcissist himself.
@@ghihbgyu Not apprently, he is. He's talked about it many times
Everything is scaringly true! The instability they cause, by themselves being the cause
I’m a narcissistic man. I seem to always find myself attached to psychopathic women. The relationships are always toxic. I am provocative and she is violent. I am engulfing and she is cheating. I am indifferent and she is threatening to kill herself, calling the police or getting me fired from my work. I succeed somewhere and she tears me down. She injures me narcissistically and I go into a rage and throw her onto the streets. She leaves me and I beg for her return through suicidal gestures, promises of marriage, anything until she finally leaves for another man permanently. Then I find a new woman and if this cycle doesn’t repeat, I am bored and do not attach to her. I crave the emotional sadomasochistic cycle despite how painful and life ruining that it is and detrimental for me. I don’t want this form of love, but it’s all I ever receive. It seems to be reserved mostly for me, even psychopathic women treat other less provocative men significantly better than me. There is something about me that brings out the worst in women. A vileness.
Have you considered therapy? You know it doesn’t sound consistent long term.
That's called codependency
please consider therapy! specialized mental health professionals might help you break the destructive cycle. stay safe and much love!
You have to heal the wounded part that attracts this kind of women and then reprogram your mind so you will not feel bored by a normal and peaceful relationship. Its a big step that you are aware of your relationships patterns, you have just to release it...
I hope in this last 2 years you've improved this part of you. It's admiring how aware you are of your personality, if we all would be so rational this world would be better.
Basically what I’ve learned is that anyone and everyone could possibly be a narcissist or psychopath
in other words, we became paranoid about it
Would you date a man who told you he's always been alone and in pain.......probably why they lie
Would you date a man who didn't pay for the first date......probably why love bombing exists
I'm not sure if you have siblings or some kind of lifelong relationship ship......but wouldn't you do anything to keep it
I appreciate when you compare normal reactions with the differences in narcissist. Sometimes the projection over time confuses the mind when character has been called into question over decades. The chaos is uncomfortable but normal and what should be normal becomes uncertain/questionable. My narc is a career narc with 4 shared children.
Thank you so much for this video. I was raised by two narcissists (one that is probably actually borderline with a strong narcissist type) - so relationships of any importance in my life always involve some aspect of this personality type and I’ve learned to accept it - as long as I keep learning about it and how to cope with it. I think some people don’t understand that some of us were so strongly shaped by narcissists that it’s not really possible for us to leave this type no matter who it is that surfaces. And being with a non-narcissist type would NOT necessarily even work for us (or feel ‘right’).
Me too.... It’s hard to believe how this is even possible because most people don’t experience this. I’m trying to understand what that must be like not to live life with these people magnetizing to me and Why I’m not happy with out these people in my life. I don’t know it’s hard. I’m trying to understand.
it's due to the Toxic CODEPENDENCY, created in early age, due to being raised by two Narcissists. You are attracted to what is familiar, unfortunately your subconscious controls your decisions even though they maybe be familiar BUT not good for you. We bring to our lives what we need to heal until we healed 🙏 ... You have to break the toxic pattern to be able to learn the dynamics of healthy relationships! Demands lots of courage, perseverance, discipline and self love and... NEVER EVER GIVE UP , the road is not easy, but worth every second !!! 💛 🙏
Wow. So true. He was at his job as an engineer for 36 years. Had two divorces and his home was like a horder. Everything was a mess and disordered.
Donna,same here, also 36 years at same job,although never married but had kids (commitments issues or didnt really care much for the woman to marry her, I never got to know). Great care about personal appearance, the facade, and a lot of criticism for how others looked , but his home messy, unloved, chaotic, everything in the way,like an obstacle course..Not like collectors, who have things all over the place, but just junk, everything out of place...that was the first dissonance, warning sign, but i didnt know who I was dealing with then..every textbook characteristic of a covert narc came to manifest themselves in due time..
Same here. His messiness chokes me, and my life with him. He isn't comfortable without a mess of junk and garbage (useless things) around him.
Same here! Narc has same job for 30 years but house was a dog kennel and slept on a filthy mattress on the floor.
Only yesterday I left someone with borderline personality disorder,a person who during our 8 months relationship had few anger rages coused by almost nothing. Once he hurted himself, once he woke me up after fight and had a episode of such rage I thought he will kill me ,he was always telling me he have abandonment issues and depression all his life,I tried everything to help him , but he wanted to almost make me constanly proving how much I love him almost he expected from me to nurse him.
When I for example left to see a friend and told him it was good day,he would act numb and than sleep in another room.
Almost every single argument he was telling me his episodes of rage anger was my foult, I suspected he suffers from borderline personality disorder and I was almost prepared to help but I realised he probably knows his diagnosis and hiding this from me.
I felt completely trapped,I would be prepared to help but he continues to ignore to act and rejected antidepressants and despite being a teacher highly educated he smoked weed which I didn know at first about when I met him.simply I would never suspect that teacher can be smoking marihuanna so often( every day) I knew I will leave and cant be with him becouse of the addiction,but was prepared to help him.
Situation went really bad when I realised he was trying to punish me via differen behavior towards me if I did something that he didt like.
I didnt see myself as a victim couse I knew he is sick,however when I realised he doesn't take his self disstruction seriously I knew I have to leave.
I recognised his manipulation and often he told me he doesnt want to be this person.
I had no other option than leave, when I realised he and his behavior are taking controll of my life and the way I think.
I made sure he doesn't know my new adress,and to be honest that s what my intuition was telling me to do,,,not to tell him.
I really feel sorry for him,but,,if he doesn't care enough to care for this very serious mental sickness I couldn help.
I would like to add he is a very good father but my only option was to leave.
Also ,his father was a lawyer who was shot when he was only 8 and his mother had to work and almost left him to himself for a year.
This is a scary very scary personality disorder but during covid I observed him a lot and I have a suspicion he only have his rages when he chooses to,that would suggest he is capable to control it! Very,very weird personality but also god person!!!
Wow themother having to workis so similar of a situation I know of, and no they couldn't control their angeroutbursts whatsoever. Its like swearing out loudfor people with tourettes
Bpd male here....first and foremost you did the best thing you could buy getting away for your own well being ..untreated bpd is never going to work in any relationship.,,,as for the weed ..(I can relate)most likely he used to calm himself or dissociate from anxiety, paranoia,or dysphoria...borderlines can smoke a ton of weed and or drink ALOT...I'm not advocating for chronic cannabis use as treatment but i cab telk you the experience would have been much more intense if he was a heavy drinker ...it's pure chaos and can get violent. Best wishes on your road back
Of all the videos and articles I've read on the issue of narcissism and psychopathy, this is by far the most concise. Thank you for your work!
I cant stop watching your videos since I found your channel a week ago. Your vivid and yet almost mathematically precise descriptions of very deep dynamics behind all theese phenomena are just stunning. Thank you for sharing!
"Play it again Sam" Thank you. Most readily understood of yours I've seen
Your video of the difference between a narcissist and physcopath was very enlightening. I can't wait to watch the rest of your videos. So, glad your channel is here to listen and learn. Thank you.
Thank you for humanizing these people. I find many fans of other channels get bogged down and stuck in a dark, vilifying, and vengeful place. Most commenters here seem to be very gracious and open to new, even unpleasant information. Much more constructive than seeking out another buzzword salad to seethe to.
Exactly that. The covert narc in my life is dedicated to hoarding money which he is good at but everything else is messed up (damaged relations with family, no friends, alcohol/porn abuse, no morals, depression/paranoia)
Your comment about the short-term memory: so, this is why, for the longest time, I wondered if he had ADD...
@A N soon to be ex
I have come only recently to your videos. I must say the mix of humor with often terrifying material is uniquely addictive.
Terrifying is right. It's so very informative, but the accuracy of his descriptions of the psycho and the narc leave me to question... what in the hell was I in?😮 Minus the abusive language, everything else was spot on!
All your videos have changed my life! Thank you for sharing your knowledge.
So true they have a base women/men but they keep tearing other people and hurting other precious souls. We are going through a custody issue. This is so helpful to understand their dynamics.
Best videos I've ever seen on narcissism, and I've seen a lot! Thank you so much
My mother is obsessed with her 200 boxes of books. She always says her books are her life. They are non-negotiable. Everything else is a whirlwind. Filthy, chaotic, hoarder of empty and filled boxes. She will fly into a rage if you touch anything of hers. She does hold on to my kids and tried me, but I got away. She still holds my youngest daughter as a way to get to me.
Thank you Sam for the explanation, making the difference between the celebrity narcissist and the accomplished narcissist.
Very useful information to deflect/shield oneself from such individuals.
Thank you Sam!! Your the best to explain this. It’s very deep! Thanks again you are really making me understand! It is hard still on the soul and I guess the ego when you have loved and you wondered always why no reciprocation. Never understood till I found you on u tube. I just feel like I wasted my best years in life. On a positive note I’m young at heart and will be fine. Knowledge is everything !! Helps a lot!! Thank you!!
Simply outstanding. Thank you very much for breaking down the complexities of narcissism in this highly enlightening way. 🙏
Great analogy at the beginning of the video!
You might go into this later, but couple questions…
1. Do _narcissistic psychopaths_ have the NPD “island of stability”? If so, how does it look different from pure-NPD “islands”?
2. How you describe the psychopath - the constant chaos, no stability, living a life like you’re a quadriplegic who’s insisting on competing in track and field, etc - sounds…..kind of a lot like ADHD lol. Even as you continue speaking, the emotional dysregulation, dysregulated grandiosity, etc etc…so much like ADHD. I guess the question, then, is: how can we tell secondary psychopathy apart from adult ADHD? Additionally, how might comorbid ADHD-bipolar further complicate the differential diagnosis here (since bipolar can inject additional chaos into the adult ADHDer’s life, can generate severe grandiosity that alternates with severe self loathing via mania vs depression, etc)?
By far the best video I have watched by Sam Vaknin.
Very interesting how narcissists can, for instance, behave like borderlines. My ex-girlfriend had a mother that was diagnosed with NPD, and she herself exhibited a lot of traits Vaknin describes about the borderline narcissist.
Constantly looking for attention from other men, even though our relationship was fine and pretty uncontroversial and stable. She would switch jobs constantly, and act like a child if confronted. She had absolutely zero ownership of her faults, even though she did have empathy and was very emotional. Sometimes, she would acknowledge her mistakes, only to act as a victim and cry, begging me not to break up with her. She threatened me with suicide indirectly, should I have broken up with her. In the end, she simply discarded me and left me for another person, as that would warrant her "escape" from her narcissistic mother, as I don't have my own place to live and for her to live as well. She is now engaged to that person, who is actually a pretty successful musician. I am still a broke, struggling musician. I am in no way a psychologist or claiming she is definitely a narcissist, but I wondered if she was either borderline or narcissistic, and coming across this video, it has reinforced my beliefs about her.
But, the main reasons why I favor this video, is the correlation between open relationships and the rise in narcissism, which was very interesting to me. I trust Sam Vaknin the most if it comes to conclusions made about this disorder, but I wonder if there is any more research regarding this.
Another great subject here was the distinction between the "career narcissist" and "celebrity narcissist". If I understand correctly, the career narcissist is more correlated with the primary psychopath, who actually exhibits traits that can be useful for mankind, which is a theme I vaguely observed in online articles, but not quite precisely described like Vaknin did. I wonder, are primary psychopaths really all that evil as we perceive them to be? Kind of controversial to ask these kinds of questions, but I am curious.
Thank you for your amazing work, Sam Vaknin. I hope to meet you some day.
You are my go to channel! I love all that you do!
Thanks Professor Vaknin for your educational and excellent work. You've helped me for years.
I was reading ICE MANS biography recently and it amazed me how Richard Kuklinski, a psycopath of the most violent kind, was able to create and sustain the image of the good and honest familly man, never had any extramarital affairs, spend time at home with his children doing simple every day activities etc etc... And in his one words this is what he actually wanted, a stable famlilly and he made his hobby of murder a job in order to support them. Maybe this was do to his paranoid side (he was diagnosed antisocial +paranoid)? Mr. Vaknin, i believe some videos on PPD would be interesting. I have heard that some times can be mistaken for antisocials.
BTK was like this too. I believe he is considered to be a psychopath. I’m not sure Sam is correct in his definitions. I don’t think anybody has the absolute say on what defines the different personality disorders. Humanity is just beginning to understand them and much more work is to be done.
Yes, humans are the most complex of all creation 😊
Thanks so much for this, Sam. I'm a bipolar female, but I relate to most of these descriptions. The part around 35 minutes where you talk about boredom with routine and the mundane. It really resonates with me. I just discovered you on an Amazon video documentary about this subject. I will have to search through your videos for anything on bipolar disorder and the connection / attraction to narcissists. I'm extremely curious about the effects of a relationship and reasons for this "cosmic" attraction between bipolar personalities and narcissists.
Hello J hall. I suggest you check out "The human Magnet syndrome" by Ross rosenburg. Your magnetic attraction to narcissists is likely caused by some form of codependency (or, Self love deficit disorder as rosenburg puts it) rather than your bipolarity. The magnetic attraction is apparently caused by a subconscious familiarity and comfort between narcissists and codependents, both of which are the products of childhoods that produced various forms of attachment trauma. As a recovering codependent who has a sister who is also bipolar as well as severely condependant, I am 100% confident that both conditions can exist simultaneously. Hope this helps.
@@MrRyannys very useful information, thank you. Can you recommend something to start healing from codependency?
Interesting and enlightening as always.
I have a narcissistic alcoholic father..and guess who I married? A narcissistic alcoholic. I have 43 years of experience living with assholes. My mom passed away from cancer because she was so mentally damaged by abuse...I always repeated to myself " I am not my mom, I will fight "...and I am still fighting even though I am not in contact with both narcs. Prof. Sam Vaknin is the only one who knows what he is talking about.
You chose to marry them.
@@towardsthelight220 Very funny.
It will be so helpful to have a book/ guide to easily teach my teen daughter about how to identify the mentally ill, so she does not have to learn the hard way.
More than once I was involved with narcissistic people, I wish I knew what I learned with painful experiences.
A book with examples of probably something teens like, love stories of people with this symptoms and how the wrong choice of boyfriend/ friends can destroy them. Teaching this early in once life can make a world of difference.
Thank you for sharing such a valuable knowledge. ✨🌻
Def agree with you it can be dangerous to generalize and cater to victims without a much larger and better structure psychological profile of the experience. Thank you for being a voice of reason
Borderline I would argue is it's own thing. But I would argue that alot of people get misdiagnosed with it and actually just have psychopathy or narcissism.
Your content is amazing at the moment. So helpful!
Just brilliant. Thank you, Sam.
well thank you for clarifying this for me, i am clearly a psychopath. no sign of stability, at all, this way
That introduction malarky proper made me laugh! Nice 1.. and now having got to the end proper made me think too. My efforts to educate myself are paying off thanks to Sam Vaknin and his associate/ friend Richard Grannon. Everyday's a school day so they say, but these fellas must have helped so many. Discovering these two was a game changer and a serious personal leveller. Huge respect to both for such valuable and protective insights and the passion to raise awareness of not just the impacts of narcissistic abuse but offering the knowledge and understanding of why they are like that are. I've learnt a very valuable lesson in not to take it personally, so now I just object to being an object and that makes sense to me.
Wow, thank you for speaking about the island of stability! My husband is a narcissist, I'm his island...he's never cheated on me. He is completely indifferent about other people entirely, uses everyone, they are all objects, all except me. If someone hurt me, he'd kill them and feel nothing. I don't know what to do. You're so right! Everything else is absolute chaos. Cannot hold a job. Has no friends. All family has abandoned him. I'm afraid if I walk away, he will kill himself or someone else. Any suggestions? I can't do this anymore. And what is wrong with me that I find this kind of insane devotion flattering? I don't want an unhealthy relationship. I love him, I know he loves me. I'm deeply saddened and so confused.
Have you maybe gone to a therapist? I know its difficult for you tubers to respond so maybe reach out to a personal or couples therapist
If it’s me,IL stay. The main reason I leave my ex was he cheat so much and engage in reckless behaviour,I get diseases everytime...I’m scare one day he will come home with HIV,so I left since I cannot change this only behaviour...other behaviour,I can take it.
Leave him
You find it flattering because he’s giving you a taste of what supply feels like to him. He wants you to be addicted.
It’s nothing wrong on your part, but is exploitative and manipulative on his part.
Leave ASAP as safely as possible.
Sad to say I wish I was my covert narcissist island of stability
As you described the career narcissists, what came to my mind was some of the sharks on "Shark Tank".
I agree name starts with a K 😂
Valuable information, thank you very much.
Iam speechless, love your videos.
does this island of stability change ? if its the partner then she died for example , or if its the family , is the narcissist capable of creating another island?
Yes.
Thank you Sam , you are heaven sent, your knowledge has helped me understand what happened to me, and now I am healing my entire life and learning about what happened to my brain in the relationship, but it happened and I'm a survivor not a victim, thank you and God Bless you
Is there a lecture available on the difference between a covert borderline and a borderline narcissist?
Borderline narcissist is not a recognized diagnosis. It describes a NARCISSIST with borderline traits. A covert narcissist is a BORDERLINE with narcissistic traits.
@@samvaknin Thanks for clarifying, Sam.
How does one manage to get along with an odd bod of this description. I only ask after 50yrs of marriage and many years of longing and trying to help and hold our family together, to have my husband walk out saying he had feelings for a co-worker who was no spring chicken but I believe he needed her more than he needed me. We had a business together and it was my business to start with. He just took over believing, I guess, that he could do a better job. I thoroughly believed he loved me until our children left home when we were both about 45. Then things turned a little sour. I lost a new purpose built home, my job and my husband all in 1 year.
That's terrible. Im so sorry.
THANK YOU FOR THIS MATERIAL. I think a self-diagnosis can be tricky haha (of course) becouse I consider myself a stable, even sometimes boring person (definitely bored person) and without consultation with therapist and friends I would never think that I dont have an island of stability. But it's true and I see it now. Very interesting
I like your sense of humor. Not sure everyone will get it
I somehow missed the minute in the video where Sam talks about a question to pose in order to establish whether someone is a Narc or Psycho...
Work in healthcare. The personalities are mind numbing. Brilliant people but watch your back for the knife.
yes. yes. yes. My mother graduated from a Naturopathic School and got a degree, but never could treat people. She worked for the last 30 years in min. wage jobs, but would tell anyone that she's a dr. She would consider herself an equal to any doctor she went to. She would challenge any doctor and grill them on their credentials. I finally realized that she hates me, because I always try to find the truth.
I have a question does the psychopath have any actually real sexual attraction to their targets? Or do they just get bored with everyone weather they are or not? Having A very hard time understanding how Hes gone from extremely unattractive people to extremely attractive and back seemingly treating the more attractive ones brutally
Watch the Narcissist's Sexuality playlist.
I agree! The exact words out of the narcissist in my life actually stated, “there is no such thing as color-it’s black or white.”
Yet; the narcissist can have these tendencies-not all for each category. But, we all can certainly get the jest of the narcissists’ profile.
Perfectionist, successful and confident in many avenues of life. responsible, pious, flirtatious, dutiful, workaholic, inventive, passionate, energetic, driven, seemingly truthful, intelligent, and gifted, but lives or might I say, instills fear in others. The negative aspects are with brut force, controlling, sadistic, abusive, lack of empathy, communication, understanding and compassion for the suppliers.
But, still works to prove or set a good example with genuine aid, guidance and charity to others. With many foundations such as life long hobbies, stellar work performance, good relations outside of the home environment as in professional business interactions and social outings with travel, and fulfilling home duties.
Love is strictly being available or present and transactional, or punishing, cruel, invasively intrusive out of internalized fear. Hurtful and sadistically abusive physically and verbally as well as emotionally. Critical and never personal-in getting to know close one’s intimately. More of a dictatorship, foundation-ally, stern on rules and duties but is neglectful of engaging in loving bonds. If so they are awkward and intrusive or scapegoating-
Stepping on eggshells and escaping becomes the only foundation for the so called black sheep. Speaking one’s truth is halted immediately even when asked. Just a love/hate/fear type of unpredictability.
There are no excuses but we all have our fault, weaknesses and quirks. Hopefully, we all can communicate, truly listen and understand our part and forgive for real change. We all need knowledge, time to heal, acceptance and love as well as to learn how to express our feeling for proper bonding. Even though it seems impossible; there is always hope-an effort.
Talk therapy without toxic numbing, addictive substances is a healthy start. But to each their own. No judgments. We all have a voice and a choice to stand our ground. Everyone has their own set of circumstances to contend with and options.
Understanding the drawbacks and seeing the signs is the first step to healing. Peace be with you all. 🕊♥️🕊
ETA🌹
So fascinating and I find myself many times thinking that in general human beings today fit a lot of these descriptions. As in the career narcissist so much of what you described seems like a typical job description of how are you should be in order to achieve success at that workplace. Also very interesting about black-and-white thinking of people especially on RUclips… I had never heard of a narcissist and now in the last several years it’s literally all you see on RUclips… Instagram it is a likely way over used buzz word. Most of the time when I’m listening to people describe it they just sound like they are angry and venting about some past relationship they had with a narcissist so now, everyone is a narcissist 🤷🏻♀️
I definitely take any content I listen to with a grain of salt.
Is there any chance to "grow" a narcissist or borderline to a more stable and adult mental functioning level?
Search the therapies playlist.
So glad I found your channel
Can someone have some of each….narcissistic, borderline, and psychopathic traits? My ex showed signs of all three.
Mercurial...what a great word!
Amazing everyday I learn something new from you’re videos ! You’re teaching skills are amazing . Thank you for you’re videos
Your, not you're.
Sam Vaknin yeah sorry I’m not the brightest crayon in the box.🤷🏻♀️
But you are a good audience to thank the doctor. Your you're yore, we get the gist. I had to smile though, it was funny, the teacher had to comment, cute(he has a funny sense of humor) and you responded back. I'd hang out with you in the crayon box.
@@samvaknin That was worth a laugh today
Amazing as usual 🌹
If you are pretty much trained from birth to follow your own ideas, no matter what anyone else says, because it will make you a legend...and everything you stated about Career Narcissist is what they teach in schools and life coaching as the ideal human? I've heard nothing my entire life but climb to the top, take no prisoners, you have to be ruthless...so how does one survive in that world with an actual heartbeat? I fear I may be a borderline psychopath because I refuse to be a career narcissist. You can't get a job unless you lie and cheat your way in and no one told me once I got in to sit down and twittle my thumbs for 20 years. I've been whipped to run hard and hot for my entire life...how am I supposed to decouple this psychopathy and narcissistic shell that's all broken and falling apart?
samvak.tripod.com/14.html
I think that entitlement is always a red flag because motives are important. NPD person can be super succesfull, sad thing is he/she would feel like imposter regardless.
Sam, I'm interessted in what you think about the phrase: It's our birthright to ... (be happy, live a life full of whatever).
A lot of the so called spiritual teachers use such phrases . To me this is an example of a quite high sense of entitlement and sounds very narcisstic.
Watch my video about gurus, mystics, coaches and other con-artists.
@@samvaknin I will, thank you.
Thank you. For your insight
Could it be that the one and only island of stability is constant, lifelong drug-abuse ?
Yes, of course. Drug abuse is an entire lifestyle.
@@samvaknin ...very sad but true , and ironicly they claim to be in charge even after total collapse and suicide threats all over the place. Astounishing ! it seems that the false self is the only rescue.
Thank you so much Sam Vaknin! I believe chain changement arrives because of the new energy one can find in new things after the perceived (and denied) failure one feels after disrupting the first thing
My parent had a 'stable' marriage for over 50 years, but the marriage was dysfunctional and had frequent incidents domestic violence (usually every weekend.) ??? Narcissist or psychopath. I think there were elements of both- but I'm not an expert or a scholar- I just lived through it.
How can borderline stick to the routine?
Therapy helps, especially DBT.
To the point!!!!! Great like always !
Ex said it’s either his job or relationship one or the other never works out, he said his jobs works out or relationships works only one succeeds . He said it’s hard to maintain both. Is he a narcissist?
Sam what about the fact that their are co occurring disorders with them? Can that mean that a psychopath can have an island of stability?
So a secondary psychopath then?
Depends what is the primary disorder.
This explains how I fell for it. Thank you!
So can the object of stability change over time? For instance, if work was the narcissists stability and he retires, would he seek stability in a relationship? Could he possibly do that when his fear of commitment to one woman was so strong?
Yes, it can.
@@samvaknin Thank you for your response. Ah, so interesting. I imagine the partner would go through a certain amount of emotional pain because the pattern of relating would not change. For instance, the hot and cold behavior, mood swings, etc. Also, emotional distancing, which I believe you mentioned.
Fantastic .mine was covert / elite 😟
So...a serial killer who is similar to the fictional character, Hannibal Lector, is both a narcissist & primary psychopath? I am thinking of a deceased person who was suspected to be a serial killer who could've been the real life Hannibal, one would almost think that the author had modeled his character after him, except that the author claimed that another person was his model--both the real 'suspected' serial killer & the fictional killer were highly intelligent & artistically/musically talented, extremely organized, in complete control of emotions, finances, businesses/practices, family & employees, no chaos, no disorder allowed. Unlike Hannibal, the real person believed in open marriages, sexual freedom/experimentation, mysticism, had multiple marriages & divorces, was accused of incest & relocated to different nations to escape reputation. What's the diagnosis of both fictional & nonfictional persons?
Hey Sam, can you do a video on the difference between the origin of celebrity and career narcissist? Can they be changed?
What happens when the narc losses it's only island of stability ?
For me I was the only thing stable in his life , he was starting a new job (I helped him get by motivating him to try) and then I left him because he replaced me with a girl down the street from his new job.
When I left
He went insane, he stalked me would chase me down the street even when I had coworkers escort me out of my job. He kidnapped me eventually but he got away with everything in court, then two years later he contacted me to blame me ,love bomb me, told me I lied to the judge, then told me he found real love triangulating me with his new replacement then he blocked me when I got upset. I’ve been blocked for years
SIR.
Is it possible to know become aware of being a narcissist or a psychopath? I believe I am one of the two.
So a psychopath has no island of stability only chaos. Does this complete absence of logos typify all those who are diagnosed with anti social personality disorder, or only the most severe cases?
Thinking of Alex Murdaugh - he would be a Narcissist I think - one area of stability - his long term marriage. He said"I always want Maggie around me." Until he killed her, that is.
Maybe the psychopath and the narcissist see others as robots but honestly, most people are. I was 9 years old when I had the thought that maybe nothing in this world is real and I'm going through a simulation for learning something. Everyone around me seemed robotic to me. Their reactions were always the same, stuck in fear-patterns, predictable like machines. Indeed, there is little creativity in the mind of most people. I wondered if anyone else (especially any other child) is thinking about such stuff. Obviously not. Which proved to myself that they are really nothing more really than oblivious machines. They think they are real and they think their emotions are real, but they didn't really appear very real nor showed their behavior or thinking any sign of life (= creativity, consciousness). My mother said she loves us but I could feel it was not true. I only knew for myself that my consciousness is there and asks questions and perceives things no one else did. I was afraid of talking with someone about it because who knows what these machines all around me, playing that role play, start doing once they realize I figured them out?
But it was obvious that there is a problem in the world, in the people, learning with 4 yrs about climate change and all these wars. It's obvious sth is seriously going wrong. Especially because no one seemed to see or understand that there must be the same dysfunctional psychological mechanism behind all the problems humanity is facing. And so I then told to myself: "I seethe problem. Hence I can understand it. Hence I can change it. Hence it's my responsibility." I didn't find others for a long time who had come to the same realization. So who is the sick one?
Nowadays I don't feel like people are unreal anymore. But I've experienced things, also on emotional/cognitive level in protected intimate relationships or moments, that are far from what people think is even possible (spontaneous hypnosis with my very "psychopathic/narcisstic/borderline" SO (depending on the specific stage in the cycle), synaesthesia, fainting as a psychological reaction to intensity, hallucinative thinking....without drugs btw). Following the text book we as psychopaths or whatever we are are not supposed to have real emotions. But I guess it depends on if you're a puppet master looking for a puppet master (that's how I described it as a teen) or if you're looking for people to control. The latter is boring and in time makes you so frustrated that you get mean (which I fast learned to avoid due to uncomfortable situations in the social surroundings), while the first opens up new realms.
There is something like an instinctive power status when people get together. Narcissists/psychopaths who never went for the real thing, who never found out how to create it in themselves, have zero real experience. They respectfully keep their distance.
Often people think I'm manipulative because I'm gettin too fast into their head and they feel threatened, but one of my golden rules is absolute honesty, because there is already a power imbalance anyway between me and the people around me. And a world where you're the only one to see and understand or able to create certain things is a lonely place. There is no joy in the absence of mind, no real joy in power, and people being trapped in the societal normal-pathology is life threatening problem on this planet (Arno Gruen).
If they were really healthy, why are their emotions so shallow, why do they cry for revenge, why are their bonds fragile, their understanding so limited, their behavior so ego-driven, their parenting so cruel, their disregard for other's needs and the worlds ecological collapse so obvious? I won't judge about myself here, as I'm just as much part and product of this society, but the normal people around me are not healthy, that's obvious. They bond incredibly quickly to me, yes, but not because I lie to them or reflect sth to them that is unreal but because I really see them and this activates the attachment system. The most beautiful thing I can imagine is a world where they are able to see as well, to create as well. There is too much to be done in this world, I can't save everyone. If everyone just cared for everyone, everyone would be cared for, billionfold. And there is a ton of work to do.
I love the videos for the idea of the dynamic cycle that can be observed and that corresponds to what I've seen. But we're chasing the cat's tail when we're labeling something as disorder when really we're just traumatized enough to see the dysfunction in society and people and ourselves as what it is. We don't believe to be superior. We are. And it is no fun. It's lonely and the lack of consciousness in normal people is a real Problem. There is a reason npd, psychopaths, DID are highly intelligent. It means thinking out of the box. Trauma is information overload. I read in a Chinese paper about sinofuturism: "Aspire learning. Don't judge the information itself. It's all a training set. Information overload leads to consciousness." What we develop based on this ability can be abuse and delusions or sth else. The sickness is not the people, it's the delusional society and the wrong ideas of what to do with our abilities.
Maybe we're just misunderstanding evolutionary adaptations that we're observing.
wow, spot on
Hit the nail on the head lol
How do two borderlines treat each other after they meet each other? Do they recognize ones problem or do they identify with it or did it make them angry? Thank you.
Their respective pathologies amplify each other. Search the channel for "odd couple".