308 Winchester vs 30-06 - Which is the BEST?
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- Опубликовано: 17 окт 2024
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Who is Ron Spomer
For 44 years I’ve had the good fortune to photograph and write about my passion - the outdoor life. Wild creatures and wild places have always stirred me - from the first flushing pheasant that frightened me out of my socks in grandpa’s cornfield to the last whitetail that dismissed me with a wag of its tail. In my attempts to connect with this natural wonder, to become an integral part of our ecosystem and capture a bit of its mystery, I’ve photographed, hiked, hunted, birded, and fished across much of this planet. I've seen the beauty that everyone should see, survived adventures that everyone should experience. I may not have climbed the highest mountains, canoed the wildest rivers, caught the largest fish or shot the biggest bucks, but I’ve tried. Perhaps you have, too. And that’s the essential thing. Being out there, an active participant in our outdoor world.
Produced by: @red11media
Welcome to the RSO Podcast! In this episode, I read an article I wrote about an amazing pronghorn hunt I went on in Colorado.
Links:
Website: ronspomeroutdo...
Facebook: / ronspomeroutdoors
Instagram: / ronspomer
Who is Ron Spomer
For 44 years I’ve had the good fortune to photograph and write about my passion - the outdoor life. Wild creatures and wild places have always stirred me - from the first flushing pheasant that frightened me out of my socks in grandpa’s cornfield to the last whitetail that dismissed me with a wag of its tail. In my attempts to connect with this natural wonder, to become an integral part of our ecosystem and capture a bit of its mystery, I’ve photographed, hiked, hunted, birded, and fished across much of this planet. I've seen the beauty that everyone should see, survived adventures that everyone should experience. I may not have climbed the highest mountains, canoed the wildest rivers, caught the largest fish or shot the biggest bucks, but I’ve tried. Perhaps you have, too. And that’s the essential thing. Being out there, an active participant in our outdoor world.
Produced by: @red11media
Disclaimer
All loading, handloading, gunsmithing, shooting and associated activities and demonstrations depicted in our videos are conducted by trained, certified, professional gun handlers, instructors, and shooters for instructional and entertainment purposes only with emphasis on safety and responsible gun handling. Always check at least 3 industry handloading manuals for handloading data, 2 or 3 online ballistic calculators for ballistic data. Do not modify any cartridge or firearm beyond what the manufacturer recommends. Do not attempt to duplicate, mimic, or replicate anything you see in our videos. Firearms, ammunition, and constituent parts can be extremely dangerous if not used safely.
Lived in Alaska 37 years, shot probably 60 Big Game animals with many different calibers. But in the end the 30-06 was my do it all go to caliber...
Same here. Just not the 37 year part. 👍
7mm rem mag is my go to
Starlings tremble at the sight of my pellet rifle.
Even for brown bear?
@@Sam-cf9iw 30-06 rem, you sure about that 🧐😂 but fair enough. I think the big fad with all the new cartridges is because everyone already knows how good the 30-06 is and just wants to play around and say they own something different. I’ve got my eye on Hornadys 7mm PRC when I rebarrel my rem mag
Ive been carrying a 30.06 for 29 years and it has always done the job. Love the 30.06
absolutely
From mice to Mastidon ...
Regardless of what cartridge we hunt with, I think we can all agree that you're a class act Ron. Thanks for the content!
Many thanks DW.
Could not agree more. Sending love from Nova Scotia. And by the way I’m going elk hunting in the south east kootenays in two weeks and I will be carrying my 30-06. Cheers
@@RonSpomerOutdoors Been watching you for a while now. Subscribed after seeing consistent, relevant, accurate, and timely info.
For .308, if hand loaders want more velocity, they can use Palma brass with small rifle primers. Lapua makes the best brass for that. You start to see why Hornady developed the 30 TC.
Biggest advantage I find with .308 Win is short action for shooter-rifle interface from positions, as well as carrying.
I like 7-08 and .260 Rem better than pretty much any .30 bore, unless I need bigger bore for ELR, and I'm still more of a fan of 7mm for ELR, particularly the 195gr EOL.
I’m a 308 fan, but I have no doubt the 30-06 performs better. I sold my 270, and 30-06 and went with 308 because you can buy 308. In general large amounts of ammo are more available. For me the 308 is more utility than a 30-06.
If you like to practice, plink, and shoot a lot. The 308 is just more easy on the budget.
Yup and won’t rattle your teeth..
My dad came back with a black, blue and yellow shoulder from his 30-06. I’ve been shooting a 308, without the bruised shoulder. You know, we can nerd out on numbers; but, a good gun, a well placed shot…is gonna kill, every time. Love a gun, throw the rounds down range and it’ll do the deed. Thanks for this information…from East Tennessee.
If you are afraid of recoil don't shoot.
Some of you people are seriously bitches
30-06 is amazing. But I use 308 more often because it takes less powder when reloading which means I can load more rounds for the same price. And for my purposes, 308 has plenty of power.
But again, the 30-06 is a wonderful cartridge and I’m sure I’ll buy another 30-06 rifle again someday.
wow. -- such a simple idea !! never thought of that--- great point---they're NOT giving the reloading stuff away cheap !!
I shoot heavy large magnums mainly Weatherby. Putting in a whole can of Powder never bothered me. If you don't run them hot it's like keeping a Ferrari in 1st gear. If I wanted efficiency I would shoot a 22 short. Have a good day. By the way I have had severe MAGNUMITIS all my life. Usually, you grow out of it but I'm 70 and thinking of a 577 T-Rex or 600 Nitro. Hunted Elk with 340, 375, 378 Wby, 458WinMag, 375 H&H. Had a 460 Wby never got to hunt Elk with it. Had a reputation at the range of shooting BIG GUNS.
I use the .308 because it is much friendlier to shoot, and is more than enough for any game I hunt.
I believe NATO and the UN forces use 308. In case we fight NATO or UN we can get ammo from the dead soldiers
I have a 308 but for some reason i cant kick wanting a 30-06. Probably just the history of the cartridge... And the money sitting in the bank doing nothing 😅
The 30-06 has been around for more than 100 years and has been in every type of rifle/action system. It has been in three wars and is the benchmark to all other cartridges to be measured by. The 308 runs close in terms of ballistics and does excellent for hunting as well.
WW1, WW2, Korean, and some use in Vietnam.
@@themountainraven Correct
In Vietnam they used the Remington 700 and the Winchester 70. Both rifles are known for great accuracy. I can tell you know your history and firearms.
Is it possible to take big game with a 308?
Facts.
Thank you Ron. I came back to 30-06 after hunting with 308, 7RM, 300WM. It's just so practical for hunting almost everything (what I want to eat anyway).
The difference is not that much in fps.
308 will do whatever 30-06 will. 7mag is much better. 30-06 & the 270 are the most overhyped rounds in history. Anything over 200 grains is a joke in 30-06. Time for 300 mag at that point.
@@talisikid1618 I'd much rather take an elk with a 30-06 than with a 308. Also, 6.5 CM is way more overhyped than 30-06 lol. 6.5CM is essentially a short action 6.5 Swede... nothing new
I’d take the .30-06 over a .308 any day of the week. Have rifles chambered in both bolt and semi auto.
As for a smaller caliber, I don’t believe you can have a better cartridge than the .25-06. It mirrors the 6.5 Creed which has much better bullets available for wind drift. The .25-06 hits like a .270, but with the kick of a .243.... but hey, I own plenty of other calibers. ✌🏽. This just what has worked for me.
@@richardsabo7917 except a higher twist rate and much longer streamline bullet.
I inherited my fathers 1903A3 Springfield. He used it for hunting. He was a World War II veteran and just like many others from his generation they bought these surplus rifles to hunt with. Many of these working class guys never bothered with scopes. My father grew up on a ranch in Colorado. I took his rifle out to shoot at targets and was amazed by the accuracy with iron sites. When I got home and told dad about how good a shot his comment was “ well son, in World War I infantry man we’re getting head shots with those rifles and the trenches were about 800 yards apart in some places” he mentioned that the Germans had an equally as good rifle in the 98K. Of course the Springfield is an American rip off of the Mauser.
My father n law gave me his just before his death but the hired help stole it with other items and disappeared. Great loss. 😮
What a beast of a gun ! My uncle brought his out of world war 2 and had it modified
My uncle’s had a peep sight
I see your profile pic! Strike hold fellow devil! AATW!
Almost every bolt action rifle is a rip off of the Mauser
When the 308 was first adopted by the US military as 7.62 Nato...it WAS the equivalent of the then 30-06 M2 loading. Of course the 06 has more case capacity so can drive heavier bullets faster in commercial and handloads.
Bingo! Historical context matters.
Bingo, the source of the myth rooted in fact.
Correct and this is due to the M1’s operating system putting a cap on how hot of a load it could handle. Too much and the op rod can and will bend rendering the gun a club. This is remedied with aftermarket adjustable gas plugs for the M1. Also most load data for older cartridges (30-06 among them) is conservative based on the older rifles they were originally chambered in. In modern rifles with improved action design and metallurgy they can be pushed pretty far.
Numbers and references?
@@DrewEdwardBacklas 3006 was designed for the bolt action 1906 Springfield rifle. About 35 years before the M1 was invented, but 7.62x51 Nato ammo doesn't have near the energy as the 3006 M2 ammo. The 3006 was 150gr bullet at 2887 fps with 2776 lbs of energy. 7.62x51 nato was a 147gr bullet at 2800 fps and 2559 lbs of energy. They are not equal.
Owning both rifles I would lean more towards the 06 for big game however with the shortages and increased price of ammo I’ve found the 308 to be more available and less expensive. Both great choices!
Absolutely !!
I've taken multiple bull elk, mule deer and antelope with my 30-06. It has NEVER let me down. Best do it all caliber in my opinion. Thank you for the excellent video, Ron S.
Thanks for watching, Jeremy.
@@RonSpomerOutdoors happy birthday my Good Sir, thank you for all that you do here
Way too much for deer
@@daggerg8451 I can handload the 30-06 to replicate 308 ballistics .
@@daggerg8451 why? Mule deer or whitetail? What makes it too much?
Great video Ron! An Old School senior hunter, there are three things I carry into the field with me; my trusty 30-06, .45 long colt revolver, and my favorite hunting knife. They have never let me down no matter what I'm hunting.
Excellent. -- yeah -- my ( OG ) input is only one deviation ... it's is a .45 1911..( jus do to familiarity).. (not knockdown). but I'm THERE !!
Can we just agree these are both American Staples and two of the best all-around cartridges available?
No, because debating cartridges is half the fun! 😂
I believe 30-06 is a worldwide standard....African game to US deer hunters and moose hunters worldwide ....course 6.5 x 55 is THE moose load through out Northern Europe
Tell em boss
also the 7.62 is way easier and plentiful than both 30-06 and .308. But everyone hates on the 7.62, still gets the job done though up to 800 meters and further with a skilled riflemen
Great to see you recommending who tee who, he's done so much testing, deserves props
I'm 49 years young and I have always loved the 308 Winchester and with that said I've always known that at best it's about 90 % of what the 3006 is I've never understood why anyone would think it's as powerful as the 3006 . Kinda like thinking a really hot 44 special is as good as a mediocre 44mag it just isn't. Thanks Ron for another great video.
you are right-by their logic a 38 is a powerful as a 357 and a 300 blackout should be as powerful as a 308
Thanks for watching, Todd.
One of my friends shot a eland with a 308 he said he will never do that again if it was not for the ph that helped him with his 3006 with a 200 grain that animal would have run away in case you may say that the placement was wrong after the inspection his placement of the bullet was right the moral of the story 3006 is better for bigger animals those of you who don't know the eland they are big and can be heavier than the cape Buffalo
@@martinlabuschagne3205 if they can be bigger than a Cape buffalo I don't think the 308 or 3006 either one would be my first choice. You have to use a little common sense when choosing the right caliber for the particular type of game you are after.
no argument
Hi Ron
My Brother and I have chronographed a 30-06 and a 308 and found it really does depend on the ammonium you are using we saw good quality 308 going 50fps fastest than cheap 30-06. But the good quality 30-06 went 150fps faster than cheap 30-06.
You get what you pay for.
Thanks for another great video, looking forward to the Savage/ Mauser video
06 is hard to beat for versatility. Great do anything North American cartridge. Great work Ron.
Good video. The way I look at it is, for hunting purposes (150 gr - 180gr), both the .308 and .30-06 are so close that either is a great hunting round. I don’t know if one actually has the “edge” over the other unless you are shooting very heavy bullets. I have used both and prefer the .308 over the .30-06…just because it has a little bit less recoil and can pretty much accomplish what the .30-06 can. A deer will never know the difference between these two great cartridges.
Thanks Ron. My first personal firearm was a Winchester Model 70 in 30-06.
I like both cartridges... they'll drop a moose, bear, deer or anything else you want to shoot with them with one shot. I've used both hunting in the Maine woods along with Montana and Texas. I've also used the .308 in combat. Both are extremely reliable.
I prefer the compactness and the slight recoil advantage on the .308 over the fps gains on the 30-06 but everyone has their own requirements
The only rifle I ever sold for too much recoil was a .308. My '06 is a pussycat.
The .308 was just 5.8 lbs.
The '06 weighs 9.
@@jacobmccandles1767 you answered your own question. The increased recoil was because of the difference in the weight of the rifles. If you had a 5.8lb rifle in 30-06 it would recoil more than the .308. Not rocket science.
@@MysteriousMarsupial You're right but he actually posed a statement and not a question stating weight difference as being the obvious cause of the higher recoil, just in different words. Another big contributor to recoil can be the design and dimensions of the stock though where a lighter gun 'can feel' like it actually recoils less than a heavier gun of the same calibre.
@@MysteriousMarsupial i didn't have a question. I didn't purchase the .308, I knew it would be a handful the first time I touched it, and that's literally why I sold the light rifle: because I knew what the problem was.
The 9 lb '06 was custom built for the purpose of light revoil and steadiness in a wind.
That said, your typical .308 will weigh a quarter to 1/2 pound less than an otherwise identical 30-06, thus negating much of the minor increase in power in the recoil equasion. This due to the longer action required.
Now, as far as things that "aren't rocket science" goes, statements end with a period, like this. Questions end with a question mark, like this: ?
Manners... that's harder to teach.
@@jacobmccandles1767 get a 12 pound rifle! less recoil too.
My Weatherby Vanguard in .30-06 has always out shot me. And if I'm doing my part, has always taken the animal cleanly. The options for bullet weight is hands off better than .308 Win and .270 Win. Thanks for your great videos.
I have one of those. My last elk was 236 yards away when I shot it in the back of the head. That is where I aimed with a 1.5 to 5 power dangerous game scope. I am a believer of GunBlue490 when he says less is more when it comes to scope power.
Great job comparing both cartridges, Ron. I have both: a Remington 788 in .308 with 18" barrel for brush hunting and a Remington 700 in 30-06 with 22" barrel for plains/mountain hunting. Each one perfectly suited for different whitetail hunting scenarios.
Thanks Dibos.
VERY true ..."snapshotting". close.... I would choose shorter barrel !!
Nice Video Ron. Like you I've been doing Long Range shooting, Hunting and reloading for over 55 years. I've had the 300WM and the 300RUM, 7MM RUM, 270Win, 243 Win. , 7MM Rem Mag 220 Swift and many more. I ended up selling my 300 WM and went back to the 30-06. My favorite of all of them was the 270 Win. I've done alot of load developing for all of those cartridges. But the good old 270 is to me my favorite. But, now as I said I went back to the 06. It's a Remington LR 26 inch barrel factory rifle. I can shoot under a 1/2 inch groupings with that rifle. I've got lots of powder, primers, bullets and brass to support it and the 270 win. For me I've always been able to kill both Elk and Mule deer with both cartridges. The old War Horse 06 and the 270 have been around for a very long time. I can handload both at much higher velocities than the factory rounds but I've been able to sub 1/2 inch moa with them too. For now I'll stick with what works, and has been for over 100 years. The 308 is a breat cartridge. But there is just something about that 06 that has made me a believer.
Well now this was a interesting video and the debate goes on and on. I own both a 308 and a 30-06 and I like them both very well, but I don't hunt anything bigger than whitetail deer. So for me it's all about shot placement and felt recoil and that's reason I usually take the 308.
My 270 feels like lighter recoil than my 06 and 308. If white tail is as big as you go, you'd probably love a 270.
Mind you my 270 is a heavier wood stock while my 308 is a Ruger American synthetic stock.... so that may make a difference in felt recoil
@@OldSchoolParatrooper 270 is a fine caliber but not for me.
Same here. I know that the various 6.8’s & 7mm’s will do good things. But for me I’d just as soon go up to 30 or down to 264. If I absolutely need the extra weight of the heavier 7’s they are still lighter than the 30’s, and not as ballistically efficient as the 6.5’s.
If you hunt just white tail and recoil is a factor why not buy 7-08.
@@russellkeeling9712.
Hi Ron, thanks for this podcast. Back in 89 I purchased my first deer 🦌 rifle- Winchester model 70 .308. My dad served in the New Zealand Air Force and got me the odd box of free FMJ 308 ammo. I recall his advice was to buy a 3006…(which I ignored) .308 is a great calibre and very popular where I live. I got many deer with mine. These days I have a great sako 3006 semi custom Ackley Improved. It shoots 165 grains at just over 3000 fps. Much better than my old 308. I am sold on 3006. The professional pest destruction guys where I live tend to stick to 308 as they don’t need the extra power. I love my 3006. The 300 and 7mm mags are very good too. Thanks Dave
300 wsm 😉
The .308 has always been hard on the heels of the 06. I've never known anyone that hunted with a .308 or a 30-06 that used bullets heavier than 180 grains for Elk or black bear. Whether they were hunting in heavy timber or semi-open woods. I've used both calibers and prefer the .308 because I believe that it provides a little better inherent accuracy overall. I prefer 150 -165 grain bullets.
Having said that, any seasoned hand loader can take the 06 far enough past the .308 to make a difference in the field where even small advantages can make the difference! But the .308 isn't a 30-06... close, but no cigar! Good video Ron, Thanks!
@Fraser Fir Recoil is not a factor from a 30-06 unless you are soft. It isn't bad at all to me. When I fill a 30-06 case with fast burning powder and put a 35 cal. bullet in front of it then it begins to have felt recoil. Even when turkey hunting with a ten guage shotgun I don't feel recoil when shooting at an animal.
I love the 220 grain .30-06. Outstanding bone crushing penetration.
@@russellkeeling9712 What, are you 12? Ok, we all know you're a tough guy.
Ron, i truly enjoy these caliber comparison videos and learn something with each one. Thanks for putting them on.
I've got both of them and there's not a nickels worth of difference between them. I will say that I have found the 308 rifles I own are alot less fussy - accuracy wise with factory ammo.
You'll find a lot more than a nickels worth of difference when you get to 180 grain and above bullets. But yes, on the whole they seem to be less fussy for the most part but once dialed in no difference in accuracy I've ever seen.
Yep, the similarities for 99% of uses is so identical that i'd rather go with the .308. For anything above 180grains, the 300 WSM performs much better than the 30-06 that I would rather go with that.
For match shooting or if I wanted a shorter gun with a short action I would use 308 but I don’t do that so 30-06 it is!
Cheers
@@Simon-talks Yup 300 WSM and SAUM make .30-06 pointless unless you're feeding from factory ammo, local sources with known availability.
For normal deer hunting or Target shooting the 308 is equal to or better than the 06. But bigger or more dangerous game needs larger heaver bullets! The 06 is the choice here. Both are widely available.
No replacement for displacement. I appreciate your videos Ron!! Very common sense approach and I appreciate it. I'm a handloader and have been using the 30-06 since I was 12 years old. I have an appreciation for both cartridges. They both work very well, but I prefer the 200gr Nosler partition in the 30-06 for hunting elk. When I'm shooting precision, I'll grab the 308 with a 168 match grade bullet. Short action vs. long action doesn't mean squat to me. It's like comparing belted cartridges to non belted "magnums". In the whole scheme of things, it doesn't make a hill of beans. Some of these arguments are quite laughable at best. Keep up the good work Ron!!
I own a 30'06 and my brother has a 308. The '06 seems to kick harder, not a lot, but it's noticeable. If I had it to do again, I'd get the 308. I have a 300 Win mag if I want a big boomer. The short action is nice and the difference in velocity & energy is minimal.
You just highlighted the weakness of all these cartridges that have a slight advantage over their close competitors. By the time you stretch them to the point where they're acceptable and their close competition isn't, they're usually just barely acceptable and you quickly realize you'd have been better off with a different class of cartridge. This is the main problem I have with the 6.5 Creedmore cult. By the time the Creedmore is pushed to distances where it can outshine its close competition, its resultant energy is borderline at best and you realize if you were going to be shooting at such distances you should have used another cartridge like a 7mm Rem Mag or 6.8 Western.
The ranges and bullet weights where .308 and 30-06 match each other, they both perform extremely well. Once you stretch 30-06 to the point where it really outperforms the .308, you should have used a .300 Winchester or Weatherby Magnum instead.
You know it doesn’t matter one bit to me.......have used them both and the deer do not know the difference. Both are outstanding cartridges and you could never go wrong with either one of them......
@@bdwilcox personally where i think the 6.5 grendel really shines is: fits in an AR-15, deer/hog capable to whatever distance you really want, cheap enough to plink with, very low recoil, lets you take your gun to the 600 yard mark at the range cheap and easy with plenty of accuracy to do so. honestly just an amazing dedicated deer cartridge. what its not is an elk gun, and i wouldnt choose it for black bear either. by chance, did you mean to say creedemore not grendel?
I have noticed the same thing, the 30-06 has noticeably more recoil than the 308.
@@hotramen5952 Grendel has become my favorite cartridge. Fairly inexpensive ammo that does almost everything I need. I own a few of them in barrels from 12-20 inches. I may even but a 22" just because😀
As always, great video Ron! I live in Northern Mi and all of my north woods hunting happens in the 50-200 yard range. On few instances out to 300 yards if I specifically look for it. Almost any cartridge is going to be a clean one shot kill. With that said, my go to round is absolutely the 308. It is very ubiquitous everywhere you look and is in almost all cases interchangeable with the 7.62 Nato which I believe helps keep the cost down. Lately many people get fixated on the 6.5 Creed more but it simply does not make sense for most people. The 6.5 only bests the 308 in very long range applications. @500 yards and under the 308 gives up nothing to the 6.5 and at most of those ranges carries more energy on target. There I go falling into the trap of nonsensical ballistics etc. To clarify, those things are largely irrelevant at the distances myself and many other shoot. Hey, I'm in Northern Mi, not any of the plains or mountain States. You can't go wrong with either the 308 or the 30-06.
As a national Match shooter for 20 years back in the day I started out with a Garand and eventually moved to an M1a and loaded thousands of rounds for both. IMHO the 30/06 is the better hunting cartridge. It can do anything the 308 can do plus handle heavier bullets if needed. I have found that the 308 will edge it out in accuracy but in the long run you're just splitting hairs.
The .30-06 will send the 180 gr bullet at same velocities or greater as the .308 sends 168 grainers....
@@mdd1963 doesn't kill a deer any deader
I would be delighted to have either one.
🤠 Great Video! Even though I have a 30-06, for the type of hunting I do with that particular rifle, you actually confirmed for me why my replacement gun for my 30-06 will be - a 308 Winchester! The places I plan to use it, my shots would never exceed 300 yards and with a 165 grain bullet, it would do exactly what I need it to do for elk hunting! Except it will be in a lighter recoiling and handier (more compact rifle - for easy target acquisition in thick timber)! Thanks Ron! 😁👍
Hunted with 30:06 for over 40 years. Went to .308 because can't find 30:06 ammo readily. For deer hunting in MO, I'm happy with how the .308 performs. I guess in the end, it will really depend on what you are hunting, and where, that will be the biggest factor in what will be the best for an individual.
Really does come down to this:
If you believe 30 cal is the right place for you, then....
You must choose whether a small, medium, large, or x-large chamber of power is your happy zone, and take the nuances of rifle design that goes with those.
Ron Great comparison on the 3006 & 308. In years past you could find 3006 anywhere as well as the 308. But lately it seems that the 308 is in more places than the 3006. Since I do Hand load for both cartridges it's not to concerning for me Hopefully the shelves will be full this year before Deer Season.
Unless you're taking game more than a quarter mile away... there's probably very little real difference. Personally I like the 308 as you can still have a short action and ammunition is cheaper than the 30-06. For handloads the 308 is a bit more economical as well, its at the point of diminishing returns, like many multi-role military cartridges which tend to have a focus on efficiency.
In grizzly and Bigfoot country I would rather have the 06.
Some facts from Ron Spomer. Thanks. Have that old Model 70 Win in 06 all these years for a reason.
I have hunted with the same bolt action rifle in 30-06 for 25 years. When I bought it I wanted a rifle in a caliber that I could buy in any gas station in West Virginia. That meant a choice between 30-30 and 30-06, with 308 a distant third. Other than the current ammo craziness, that has always held true. 30-06 hunting ammo has always been more plentiful than 308. Both are great cartridges and I could have easily picked the 308 back then, but I don't regret my choice. My bolt action 30-06 has never failed me.
I've used both, loved them both.
30-06 was always my favorite until I had my shoulder replaced. My doctor, an avid shooter, told me that my new shoulder would never handle the recoil impulse. I was bummed. Had to sell my guns due to health issues and I no longer shoot. But I thoroughly enjoy these videos! Great mention of WHO_TEE_WHO! Really enjoy his channel too!
Can you shoot a lighter caliber or switch hands shooting? You have 2 shoulders. I trained myself decades ago to shot ambidextrously, just to be more versatile. Sometimes it is better to shoot right handed, sometimes left. It works real well for handguns too. I am right handed and injured my right wrist one year. No problem, I just shot my handgun left handed that year hunting, and let my right wrist heal. Maybe you could just switch shoulders and resume hunting, and you still have the option of using a milder recoiling rifle. It is a shame for you to have to give up something you enjoy. Just practice handling the gun in your other hand/shoulder and after a while it will start to feel natural, then go out and try it actually shooting. Good luck. Hope to see you in the woods again.
Dr Froghopper... you should give 6mm ARC a try
@@tythomps give the .22-250 with 60 grain Federal Nosler a try. They are awesome and drop deer and hogs quickly.
@@DaveL9170 agreed, another good option for him
Try 22 250
My daughter is 5'4" n she loves to hunt! She uses .308 in a youth gun n had taken good mulies n good sized bull elk ever since she was old enough to hunt (12). Some shots out to 300 yrds of course with a hold over.We love it n it does da job.
I have both, I load the 30-06 with 220 grain round nose thumpers for tight timber running open sights.I load 168 grain in .308 for medium range work and .300 win mag with 208 eldm for long range work. Great content Ron ! Cheers from North Idaho
Thanks Joe. And howdy to you up there in my old stomping grounds. Got my 1st ID turkey near Bonner's Ferry.
They’re fairly close in performance(even though 30-06 still keeps a slight edge there), until you get into hand loading. The 30-06 pulls away with its potential/versatility at that point. Between 30-06 and 270win, you can’t beat them in that particular category. If you need any more than that for most anything in North America within a reasonable distance, you should hit the range and practice shot placement.
Another great video Ron. I'm a 30/06 fan. I harvested my first deer with my 30/06. I also watch who tee who's videos he really has some great comparison videos.
You can do almost anything with the .30-06 rd. a true American classic !! 👍
I love to watch/listen to you share your knowledge and experiences. I also enjoy watching who-tee-who, so it was nice to hear you recommend his content to your viewers. I also hunt with an old Winchester Model 70 in 30-06 and it is a fantastic rifle.
Negligible difference! But if you are an accuarcy aficionado the 308 wins every time. I can not see 50- 300 fps making a significant difference when killing game but I could see accuarcy being the more important variable! Love your videos and easy style of explaining things!
Ever shoot a tree with a 308 vs 30-06? My 30-06 blows holes through trees. While my 308 doesn't even pass through smaller trees🤷♂️
@@delvine13 please reread what I wrote. And I'm killing game not trees! The advantage with the 308 is its inherently more accurate. Its disadvantage is its 50-300 fps slower. Pick your poison.
Some other advantages for the 308 are as follows
Smaller shells eaiser to carry/store
Shorter action eaiser to rack another round
Less recoil which improves accuarcy and is less pounding on the shoulder
Lighter overal weight eaiser to haul around in the field
For me all things considered I prefer a 308.
But if I had a 30 06 I would not care and would still be smiling ! Because I like them all! I never walked off the firing range with a frown on my face.
Question for you about killing trees,
Are you comparing the same style/weight bullet and distance with your tree test ?
In a perfect world we would pick a rifle bullet combo based on what we are hunting and at what distance and what your particular accuarcy is for said bullet . But most ordinary folk don't have the resources to buy a set up for everything. So we make do with what we have.
Very nice shout out for WHO_TEE_WHO. I'm a 308 fan mainly due to the short action and availability. I love my 270 and 25-06 which are long actions. I have nothing against the 30-06, I've just never owned one. Thanks for the info as always.
Cervus !
@@scottodonahoe9505 Hi Scott O
@@cervus-venator Shot my almost virgin M1 today and it didn't give me the thumb loading it ! the kick not so much ! Old iron still rocks !
@@scottodonahoe9505 Now is that the M1 Garand? A good ol 30-06? Sure would have loved to have seen that. I'm looking to take the old Mauser action 25-06 out this weekend. My friend has a couple of old Mauser's he wants to shoot.
@@cervus-venator Yes . I bought it from a retired Navy officer 4 years ago still packed in cozmoline and wrapped in paper . I can see where people got the saying Garand thumb from , I just haven't done it yet .
Another good video well done 30/06 is the go in my books
I like them both, but my 270 is my favorite. Excellent video
Mine too!
6.8 Western shaking things up.
🤔 Did you ever do the math? I am rooting for the 6.5 to succeed, because I want more 0.277 heavy caliber bullets! But thier is nothing wrong with the 270 Winchester! Just run the numbers! Using the factory velocities of 6.8 with the 165 grain ABLR (B.C. of 0.620) at 2,970 ft/s to the 150 grain ABLR (B.C. of 0.591) at the same velocity (using Reloader 26 powder) and see what you get! The 270 Winchester give you all the performance you need out to 700 yards (I'm not recommending shooting game animals that far either, just demonstrating it's capabilities) fir elk sized game! Use the Horneday ballistics calculator and see what you get! 😁
I'm always thinking before the technology in the weapons we have today about famous marksman and what it really comes down to is practice.
Reading stories of famous hunters and each of them had a favorite spot on a animal to take them. Some of them pictured a dot on them
My Grandfather took over 500 elk with open sights, on the firing line near Yellowstone park! He also killed Boone and Crockett Record book animals in a variety of species with that old 270 Winchester! The proof is on the Wall and in the Record Books!
Once again your analysis is correct. Both cartridges are wonderful
This began when the military wanted to adopt the 308, they claimed it was practically equal to the m2 however, the 3006 they were comparing it to was the scaled back 3006 being loaded for the m1 garland to properly cycle the action. The 3006 is capable of a lot more than the military loading....
I'm looking forward to your upcoming video on the .300 Savage, a cartridge now slowly fading into obscurity, but still a fine deer round nonetheless.
Love my savage model 99
@@humpy936 Oddly enough, my 99 in said cartridge, made in 1952, is the most accurate centerfire rifle I own. It will put three rounds of 150 gr. Hornady Interlocks powered by a max. charge of H4895 into well under one inch, and do it consistently.
Great job Ron since I reload 308 will get the job done with well constructed bullets while saving my powder your content is on point👍
I have a early 80’s Model 70 Winchester 30-06 light weight not a featherweight. Love my gun !
Six of one half a dozen of the other. Both excellent proven rounds. Owned and loved both. Excellent commentary as always Ron, and really excited to hear you'll be tackling the .300 Savage and it's history, next.
You're destruction of the phrase
, OMG
30-06 has been my choice and has worked for 27 years for coyote, whitetail, mule deer, black bear, and elk here in Washington State. Still the best caliber choice for "one rifle" you can make hands down. 55 grain to 220 grain and everything in-between. LONG LIVE THE 30-06! 👑
Eh, if youre gonna go with .30cal then you might as well use a 300 win mag, it shoots the same bullets but faster and harder, not much more recoil.
Never seen a 55gr 30cal load. Must be Biden's Pecker
30-06 was my first hunting rifle for anything in North America. I'm building a custom .308 because I already had all the dies, brass and of course bullets for .308 In my opinion both are great cartridges.
Ron great video. I have always hunted wit a 30-06. I have shot the 308win. I prefer the 30-06. It hits harder.it all comes down to personal choice.
For whitetails at 300yds and less, the '06 & 308 are both about the same with 150/165g factory stuff - both kill deer!
The 308 recoils less and that matters to some folks. The good ol' 30-06 shines with heavy loads, especially with the 220g!
For short to medium range on thin skin whitetail deer, the 308 is perfect. For game that will hunt you while you're thinking you're the hunter, the 30-06 w/ 220's is the clear winner!
Very interesting video. I have an Interarms .30-06, I remember when I was a teen my Dad and uncle were taking a hunting trip to Colorado and my uncle who had a .308 borrowed my .30-06 because he thought it would be more effective vs the mule deer over the distances they were expecting.
I have an older remington 700 in 30-06 that I love and hunted with for years it did it all and did it well . after having spinal surgery in my neck I was unable to handle the recoil of my 06 so i bought a 308 and it works well both are fine calibers . A friend of mine talked me into putting a muzzle break on my 06 needless to say I am back hunting with my 06 . the 308 is more accurate but the game does not notice the difference . great video
Yes a muzzle brake works, also if you don't like the 30-06 recoil because of health problems, do "not" waste money and go to a 308, 7mm-08, 260, 6.5 Creedmore, etc. to obtain less recoil. But instead do like I did, buy several boxes of 30-06 Hornady "Custom Lite" ammo which has about 1/2 the (about 50% less) "recoil". It is good for deer up to 200 yards.
Thanks Ron, no substitute for experience, love the 06! one of the oldest is still one of the very best!
Great video as always Ron. I've owned both at the same time and the 308 will NOT equal the 30-06 anywhere up and down the bullet weight range. Give me a 30-06 any day. Just a quick perusal of Hodgdon's site shows an average of 100- 250 fps advantage for the 30-06 with equal weight bullets of 125, 150, 165 and 180, and it does it with an average of 2-3000 psi less. To me, the 308/30-06 is very similar to the 44 sp/44 mag when both are loaded to their potential. More capacity always wins everything else being equal.
Thanks again Nitro.
Sometimes, bigger really is better....
Got my Remington 700 .06 in 1974 and never looked back! Update the optics, triggers, and ammunition but never been disappointed! Can find a combination to kill any game and anywhere?
I've always, when asked, described the 308/30-06 as "kissing cousins" - same family, same general characteristics, individual differences, with the '06 mostly about 100 fps faster for any given bullet weight.
They will run neck and neck until you get to 200 grain bullets and above. At that point the '06 has a clear advantage.
The '06 has always been my favorite with one exception. It took me several years to get my box of 240 grain bullets used up. My gun at the time had a fancy stock with a steel buttplate. Steel buttplate and 240 grain bullets don't mix well.............⚠️
They do not run neck and neck! The 30-06n is faster at every level!
I have both. A 308 precision rifle and a 30-06 with iron sights for in the timber. Love them both.
Yep. It just doesn’t. I have and really enjoy one of each. The 06 really extends its advantage when loading heavier bullets, as do many longer action examples in the same diameter bullet. Another example is the 300wsm v. 300wm.
I use both of the to very good effect. Both are excellent rounds. I can't imagine any serious gun owner would not include both of these rounds into their collection. My very first center fire rifle was a Ruger M77 all weather with iron sights topped w/ 3x9 40mm scope in 30-06 caliber. Great rifle. My 308 is a Weatherby Vanguard Sporter topped with Leupold 3x9 40mm. Another great rifle. I like and use both 30-06 and 308.
Great video. These are my 2 favorite cartridges. I hunt with both. However, when I want an extra punch, I choose the 30-06. I shoot the .308 more often, due to the availability of cheaper military -rounds. It would be interesting to add the 7.62x54R to the mix.
I chose 7.62x54r over getting a 308 cause I already have a couple /06
@ Trapper John - A lot of FA authorities consider the 7.62x54R to be the equal of the 30-06, or at least its near-equal, if you look at its performance. The '06 gets a slight nod for the greater range of bullet styles and weights it can handle, but the difference isn't all that great. Hard to argue with something that has been working since 1891...
@@GeorgiaBoy1961 Exactly, that's why I suggested it be added to the mix.
I was raised on a 30-06 and have never really cared for the 308. For the 30-06, I load bullets from 90 to 240 grains. Getting ready to get the 160 gr Hammer Hunter for testing and then hunting. Good luck and stay safe!
Another great video Ron. The good thing is, they're both old workhorses that aren't going anywhere! You're right about "Who T Who's" channel being a lot of fun to watch. He loves suggestions for testing cartridges and bullet performance. Much like yourself Ron.
I've shot an owned both, an like them. I also look at availability of ammo,reloading components etc. Same stuff, until recently you could find all of that where I live. Lots of animals an America's enemies fell to these,an I don't think they couldn't tell the difference. Keep this up Ron.
The 30/06 Achley Improved is a great round as it Maximizes velocity and still shoots 30/06 cartridges in a pinch.
wl was shooting the 3006 back in the 1950's Thanks young man...!
No. Heavier bullets push too far down into the shorter case of the 308 Winchester. The 30/06 handles heavier bullets better and pulls away from the 308 Winchester in that regard.
If that’s the case then that’s why .308 was made for Solid Copper rounds
@@ChiquitaSpeaks That make no sense. Solid copper bullets are longer and take up even more case capacity!
The 30-06 pushes everything faster! many load books play a little game of listing the 308 loads with 24 inch barrels and the 30-06 barrels with 22 inch barrels. On top of that the 308's would get HOT loaded and the 30-06 would get under loaded. The 30-06 because of 115 year old Springfields where rated at a lower pressure so it is under loaded!
Just like Hornady campaigns fro the 6.5 Creedmore, the old boys would campaign hard for the 308 but I prefer the 30-06 as a hunting weapon and the 308 is clearly a better semi auto platform!
@@leeeng478 but if the bullet is lighter and of equal length it is pushed faster
@@leeeng478 I think this argument is myopic and could be made for anything, the .30-06 as well. Sure, in some instances there are narratives pushed for an agenda, but at the end of the day both of these cartridges work. Both have pros and cons. The .308 will do everything the .30-06 will do at ranges; however, you can do more with the .30-06 in terms of bullet weights, powder charges, etc. In that regard, of course, one has to give the nod to the .30-06, but that does not mean that the .308 is an inferior round. There is a reason it is the most utilized round for snipers for long range shots. No doubt the .30-06 is a fantastic round. It just works. But there are better rounds than both for hunting. I’d argue that the .270 and 7-08 both beat the .30s for longer range shots, but at the end of the day they’re all exceedingly successful and popular for their own reasons. For the average guy/gal hunting, it won’t matter except in terms of preference. They’ll all work.
Reasons for preferring the .30/06?
Personal preference
Heavier bullets; 180 grain and up
If anyone rolls into a guided hunting camp with either a 308 or 30-06, shooting MOA groups 200-300 yards and a quality bullet, the guide is going to say: "Ok. Let's go." Fun debates that will never end. 😁 My father has a 300 Savage that he uses in Maine. It was his uncle's and at some point, I'll probably have it.
Doubtful that the guide is going to care one way or the other about whether it shoots moa or not.
Thank you for backing my decision to purchase my B.A.R , I already had a few 308 competition rifles. And was looking for something new...
I'm a fan of both.... personally I prefer the 30-06, but for 90% of shooters the 308 will do what is needed, and do it well. Most everything Elk size and down can be taken with a well constructed 168grain bullet and the 308 can typically push those bullets from 2700-2800fps which is plenty of power out to the majority of hunting ranges. Of course hand loads and heavy bullets the 30-06 will always push faster. I wish he showed a 175 grain comparison.
Back around 2005 my step son had the second highest sniper rating in the Marine Corps, and he said they shot 308's because they were the most accurate bullet ever made. He got to where he could shoot a cantaloupe at 500 yds. with iron sights. He said he could hit it almost every time.
308 for me. Does almost the same as 30.06 with way less recoil. And more accurate.
I did a test, I took my M1 in .30M2, 150 gn FMJ, and my Browning semiautomatic 1919-A4, in 7.62 147 gn FMJ, to the range, set up my chronograph, fired 6 rounds through each, remember the Garand is a gas port operation where the Browning is a delayed blow back, both barrels are standard GI, 7.62, 2770, .30M2, 2751.
I've always understood there was about a 5% difference between 30.06 and .308 but there is no comparison with the heavy bullets... 30.06 has greater versatility there. It used to be that .308 had better inherent accuracy because common loads used the full case capacity and 30.06 might have less than a full case. But with the variety of modern powders that has gone out the window. The one big advantage that .308 has is that 7.62x51mm is still in use as a military cartridge and surplus ammo and brass are readily available. As for me? I own both... why limit yourself?
I also have both. Do you know if military and police .308 (7.62 x 51) FMJ (Full Metal Jacket) or Ball Ammo bullets hurt (damage) the >barrel rifling< in "hunting rifles".??
@@royjohnson465 Military ammo is full metal jacket but it's still a copper jacket and won't harm a thing. I do not believe police are restricted to FMJ because it's a Geneva Convention requirement and pertains to war fighting. There are some types of 7.62 x 51ammo, typically foreign made, that use a steel jacketed bullet that will degrade rifling much faster than copper. Sometimes the steel jacket bullets are copper washed so if in doubt, hold it to a magnet and see.
@@royjohnson465 FMJ will give no damage to your rifles barrel. I have shot thousands and thousands of FMJ bullets and can tell you that even after a close inspection with a quality bore scope they don't hurt the rifling.
I have both AS WELL AS 7.62x54r
I have both and don't shoot them. Also have .270 Win and .260 Rem. Haven't shot either of those in a long time.
I've owned and shot both. I think it really depends on what the end goal is in order to truly determine what caliber better suites a certain individual. For whitetail and similar sized animals 300 yards and in, imo, the 308 and 30-06 are equal. For longer ranges shots or hunting larger game, that's where having a heavier bullet comes in handy and imo, that's where the 30-06 tends to be the better performer. Have we seen this done with smaller and faster calibers, most certainly. Another common issue with 308 rifles, many of them may not have a fast enough twist rate to handle the heavier bullets well where the 30-06 does. Another thing to consider for those getting into the game, make sure to check everything on the caliber and so forth to meet your needs.
I settled on the 7.62x54R. It's a middle ground between the 308 and 30-06 as far as velocity and energy, but most of the Mosins will easily handle and actually prefer the heavier rounds so it makes for better long range performance with deep penetration.
The average 308 hunting round is 150 grain sp, sometimes one can find 160 grain. The average for 30-06 and x54R is 180 grain sp, but also common to find 150 grain in 30-06. Both the 30-06 and x54R, you can find 200 grain sp and 220 grain sp for the 30-06, so being a better overall choice for energy transfer and penetration on large game. In the end, it really just depends on what people's preferences are and what their end goal is.
Both should work for about anything, I have always felt prepared for anything with a 30.06.
I always wondered if the .308 velocity would be higher than the ‘06 in a 16” or 18” barrel. I never wanted a .308 but love other cartridges based on it. Especially the .243, (I’m getting recoil shy as I get older). Good video!!!
Only problem with the .243 is if you’re hoping for factory loads right now you won’t find any.
Absolutely! And the price if you do find it! I haven’t bought a factory load in over 30 years. Wait! Dang I’m old!
@ Bryan Schwertner - The answer depends on what propellant is being used, specifically how fast it burns. Both the .308 Winchester and 30-06 can be loaded with faster-burning propellants or slower, it just depends on your needs and wants. All things being equal, the 30-06 is going to push that pill faster, on the basis of the long action case alone, whereas the .308 is a short-action.
Very true. I use a fast powder, IMR4198, in my 10” 7mm TCU and 14” .222. Easy to get higher velocity (relative to short barrel length). Haven’t really experimented with my .243 22” vs wife’s 18” except with medium burn rate IMR4350 and H414. Would be interesting to run 3031 in the shorty to see if I can get to 3000 with 85game king.
@@GeorgiaBoy1961 I use a .35 Whelen which is an expanded 30-06 case. I can push a 225 grain bullet at an average of 2816 fps without maximum loads. I use 4064 powder for that but I can't use it in my 30-06 and push a 220 grain bullet anywhere near that velocity. I think in my case the diameter of the bore has to do with that.
Hi Ron
Thanks for the great entertainment!
I agree to all you mentioned and I am using 308 as well as 30-06 myself and would say: most game will not recognise the difference.
However, some guys claim the 308 will surpass the 30-06 in short barrelled rifles.
Given the higher chamber pressure of the 308: could that be a fact?
Yes it could, Oliver. Depending on bullet weight and powder burning rate, you could find loads wringing more MV from a short-barreled 308 than 30-06.
Great shout-out to Whoo tee who. I absolutely love that guys channel and that's how I found yours. I enjoyed this video
Both great cartridges. But to me neither are superior long range cartridges. Ill take the lighter 308 with a short action and a shorter barrel for practically the same performance in 150-168 class bullets. Id bet that load data probably was using a longer barrel on the 06
if my intent is shoot further i’ll pack a 7mag or a 300 win. No doubt the 06 is a one gun to do all but where is the fun in that lol. Cheers!
Your last sentence had me laughing !!!! And I couldn't agree more about how you said it !!!🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
@Cody William - Re: "Both great cartridges. But to me neither are superior long range cartridges."
You might be surprised what the old 30-06 can do employing modern high-BC projectiles and propellants. Using a 208-grain Hornady ELD-M or A-Max, plus a good powder and primer, and you are looking at a bona-fide 1500-yard supersonic load. That's firmly in 300WM territory. Granted, with those same tools, the big 300WM can push out further, but can your shoulder handle it? For high BC numbers and excellent LR performance, a lot of guys use something in 6.5-7mm anyway. Unless throw weight is an issue, in which case 300WM, 300 NM, 338 LM, etc.
@@GeorgiaBoy1961 So much to explore with ballistics .... I only wish I had the time, resources, and suitable range to go investigating the options for their effectiveness ...sigh ...
@@GeorgiaBoy1961 I get your point and just like you said about 6.5-7mm my little 7mm08 prs rig with a 162 gr ELD M at 2750fps does the same. I have shot it to 1600m but 1200m and in is where its most comfortable. For ELR i have a big custom 338 but half of that game is just being able to spot impacts and the big 300gr bullets help
@@paulreid2223 - Yeah, isn't that the truth?
Ive owned 308 my whole like. I have a308 1938 Winchester model 70 featherlight in pristine condition my father gave me 33 years ago. It has some very rare parts on it so I have decided it will be a safe queen for generations to come. I just ordered a Weatherby 30-06 per their customer service help, as my goal was to hunt elk and deer int the future. I have never shot a 30-06 but I will trust the pros and Ron in this video to assure myself I made the right choice.
Thanks for the help.
Man you have the best sign-off on RUclips!! Love it. Interesting video. Not a big fan of either but had no idea the 308 is as close in performance to the 30-06 as it is. I think an advantage as well for the 308 is the availability of rifles in the AR platforms also.
Thanks Sako. I figure it never hurts to remind ourselves of our responsibilities as shooters/hunters representing our long sport hunting heritage. Practicing respect for gun safety and sustainable use of wildlife are essential. Cheers.
I love your Channel Ron I've been shooting for 43 year's and I learn something new All the time 👍🏽 Very entertaining and informative 🇺🇸🦅💪🏽
Great video Ron, and that is a great looking Model 70 at 7:35. I am looking forward to your 8 x 57 video. I have always liked that cartridge and I hope you can find good things to say about it.
Preach! 30-06 is probably the best all around hunting cartridge
My experience has born this out to be true. I’ve loaded 195’s in 308 up to 2550 in a 20” barrel and 200’s up to 2700 in a 22” 30-06. I do think the 30-06 is ideally loaded with 180-200 gr bullets. With sleek 190’s and 200’s its trajectory is creedmoor like but with more authority. No one should be mad at that.
@ K Bob - Cutting edge high BC bullets and modern propellants have really give life to the old gal, the 30-06. Work up a good 208-grain ELD-M load with a suitable powder and primer and you are looking at a bona-fide 1500 yard capable cartridge, which is firmly in 300WM territory. Sure it will kick you harder than 6.5 CM, but that slug will arrive with considerably greater authority, too. Pick your poison...
@@GeorgiaBoy1961 you’re preaching to the choir. My 06 load is a 200 gr Sierra game king, which oddly enough has a better form factor than the matchkings, over a good stuff charge of reloader 16. Ive seen claims of ppl getting 215 Berger’s up to 2800 with RL 26, but my load does what I need it to
@@K-bob_45 - Okie dokie. Always good to see another '06 man in the house!
I love both of these 30s.