So fun fact about "fat Thor" Chris Hemsworth was 100% willing to put on the weight for the role as he felt it would allow him to put on a better performance and connect with the character far more but Disney said no as they feared he would not be able to lose the weight again in time to film Thor 4. Also originally fat Thor wasn't supposed to be a joke, the directors wanted to play it straight and show an honest depiction of depression but once again Disney stepped in and demanded more jokes at Thor's expense.
Thor was a joke since Ragnarok. Which is such an ironic chain of events, as you'd think that, if there's a story where Thor should be at his most earnest and serious, it's the one where the world as he knows is about to end. Taika Waititi was a mistake.
@@antona.8659 I am gonna have to disagree with you here. In every movie staring Thor it has been shown that when things get serious and depressing he has a tendency to make light of those things and in Ragnarok he does just that but when he needs to actually be serious he is like when he is telling Loki how he thought the world of him. In my honest opinion Thor Ragnarok was the first truly good marvel movie since Captain American civil war.
I agree with everything you said. Especially the Assassin Creed version of her being Blue. That was a great point. But Krato's skin is Gray because Ares permanently covered his skin with his families Ashes. So Krato's was not Born with gray skin. He was just cursed to wear his families ashes on his skin. The red markings is a tattoo he put on to remember his brother who had Red Birth Mark that covered half his body. His brother was imprisoned and captured his entire life because there was a prophecy that a man with red markings would bring havoc upon the earth. People thought that was his brother . But little did they know... Capturing his brother would be the precursor for Kratos being the true Warrior in the prophecy. For the prophecy said he would bare red marks on his body, but it never said they would be intentionally put on.
Undoubtedly the game is supposed to be set in Europe. I am perfectly ok with black Angrboða but I can still not accept Atreus carrying an American White-tailed deer in the opening shot of the trailer.
Well, maybe someone went on vacation to Vinland, abducted the deer, and brought it home with them? That's about the only explanation I can come up with on that one...
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 the issue with Fringilla is we already know her apperance and by changing her apperance that of her uncle had ro be changed as well. I definitely believe black mages should be present but it might be better to create new characters. The mages recruit from all over the world so they will bw diverse.
I'd guess the only reason you could give for whatever looks Angrboða has in any depiction is: The mother of a giant sea serpent, a giant wolf, and Hel, could look like whatever.
Given that some of the jotnar in the myths had improbable numbers of heads...dark skin and textured hair as a casting choice should barely rate a mention. Well within the bounds of existing diversity in the myths. Not even pushing the boundaries slightly. Plus didn't she have a daughter who was half black...
I thought the dead half of Hel was blue cause of hyperthermia in the cold waters? EDIT: seems she was described as both half blue or half black because they only had one word for it back then. They could be using that idea to say Hel is mixed by having Angrboda be black
What I don't fully understand is: Is it just the color? So blue is fine but brown isn't? Or is it facial features aswell? So if they made this model green it would be fine? I'm confused.
It's depressing that I have to mention this but I'm black before anyone starts crying but I suspect people would be OK with her being green or blue because people aren't so it's impossible to be pandering, which seems to be the reason given. Personally as a black lad I get slightly embarrassed when they do these sort of things because it does come across as that and if in this day and age someone randomly put white people in the black panther crew (marvel films not the fist in the air black panthers) then even I'll admit that won't be seen as colourblind casting. So I can see peoplea point. I also strongly pleas with people to not jus go around labelling white people as racist for bringing up topics or pointing out double standards because I feel that it detracts from actual racism. No doubt some people just don't want to see a black person in their games in the same way they'd start crying over gay people but the very fact a lot love Kratos' voice actor does imply to me that they're motivations for questioning why there's animated black people in a norse mythology game does look like pandering and not just because they're white with an opinion, thus must be racist.
I should point out as well that I'm not against her personally but I can understand why people do think it's just pandering, especially because whatever people say, we do get used to tick boxes by rich white people who would rather lazily exploit our skin colour than create something new for us
@@me5969 Surely too it should go without saying that this Norse mythology which God of War is now based on, is the oldest faith and religion of many Europeans still alive today, the closest known thing to northern Europeans personification through poems, story telling and oral tradition, I get the feeling if it was any other demographics such myths and legends, they would be treated as sacred and wouldn't have any wild liberties taken at all, don't you think ? And if people use the defence it's just entertainment, unlike stage plays the visual cast can be anything, and other ancient faiths and traditions would never be lowered to the implied casualnessentrainment
Right, plus they say, well black people didn't live in Europe. Well Norse Gods technically by story are not from Europe. They are from a different Realm. Norse Mythology may have originated in Europe. But the God's were not considered part of the same realm as Earth.
As a dane myself, I see no problem in a jætte (Jotun) being of a darker complexion, she's a jotun, which according to stories, came in all shapes and sizes. Though the game takes some great liberties in other areas, but I see no problem with this one.
Hmm, Angrboða being blue made me think of something. Didn't norse cultures have the same word for blue and black? Letters of vikings coming across "blue" people, and Harold Bluetooth? Assassins Creed and the MCU both make jǫtnar blue... does that mean they could/should all be black? They're probably blue because people take the term "ice" giant too literally, but... Is there any description of Jotunn anywhere? Because if they're mentioned as being blue it would be an argument for being black. This of course makes the enemies of the gods black, which isn't great, but that's history.
As far as we know blue was indeed both blue and black back then as there was no actual word for black. Harald Bluetooth is an example for that too. He had a black tooth, not blue.
@@Nattfare "No word for black"? Did you miss svartr? As in svartalfr? Welsh, afaik, equals blue with black (in terms of skin color), but I've literally never heard of this in a Scandinavian/Nordic context. I'd love to see a source, as it's an interesting tidbit!
it wouldn't be a very *strong* argument for the Jotunn being black or connected to Africa somehow. There's figures in Greek myth who are said to have African origin (like Memnon a demigod Ethiopian prince who fights Achilles in the Trojan war) but 'Ethiopia' in Homeric myth seems to be used as a plplaceholder to basically mean 'far away', the ancient Greeks probably wouldn't have had the same understanding we do of 'a black man'. In the Irish language, black people are 'blue people' b/c 'black' has very insulting and evil connotations, it's usually reserved for Satan so calling an ethnic group 'black' would be racist/calling them evil. Maybe the Engish were occasionally called 'black' idk, though 'sasanach' sounds contemptuous enough already
@@GreenLarsen One that is described as being as pale as death from what little we know. Forget black or white, going off that alone she should be chalk white in appearance, to the point she makes white people look tanned, lol.
@Harald Hardrada First off, we aren’t living in the viking age. Second, the writers of the game can write the characters to be whatever they want because it’s their story.
@UCM3ZeWNPLwOTsGndwvmeHwg The fact that it’s mythology leaves it open to revision and interpretation. It’s myth and stories originally told by those with a limited view and knowledge of the world, or what they may have seen. And in most mythology Gods would take strange forms when interacting with humans. In Marvel Gods of other cultures would go to Asgard for refuge. Could be something similar here. Keep in mind these guys are telling a story and world building, they’re designs and interpretations of various Gods and cultures aren’t meant to be taken as factual. Think of it like Hercules the Legendary Journey or Xena or Marvel and DC comics. Anything goes. And yes they could make Black Panther white if they wanted to as that’s the go to argument. Shadowhawk was an original black hero, who was later made white.
Some guy was complaining about Thor’s look and then ranted about a darker complexion Angrboda. I just responded with: “she’s a Jötunn therefore can look however she wants. Her having the form of darker complexion doesn’t make her ethnically African, because she’s a Jötunn. Just as the Asgardians aren’t ethnically Nordic because they are Asgardians”
@@Psycorde there’s a theory she’s actually Egyptian in the game. Or well it could be a reference to Nordics calling black people “blue” and making some of their mythological characters blue people. Angrboda apparently likes to looks distinguished
@@blackflagsnroses6013 I think it's in Welsh that black skin color = blue skin color, but I've literally never heard of this happening in Scandinavian (much less Danish; my own) languages. Do you have a source?
@@7913AJunior blámaður Icelandic Etymology From Old Norse blámaðr, equivalent to blár (“blue”) + maður (“man”). Cognate with Swedish blåman. Pronunciation IPA(key): /ˈplauːmaːðʏr/ Noun blámaður m (genitive singular blámanns, nominative plural blámenn) a black person Usage notes Has a lot of historical literary usage, but may now be considered derogatory by some. Synonyms (a black person): svertingi, blökkumaður, negri
I'm TIRED of the media shoehorning Southern Europeans into Northern European history! Kratos should have stayed in Greece with the rest of those Southern Europeans! >:C /s
My first impression when I saw her in the trailer was: cool, other pantheons are joining the party. It was later that I discovered that she was Angrboda and something clicked in my head, probably a continuation of that first impression. A bit of a loose theory. Previously her few depictions have been blue for giants. Krishna is represented in blue. In older depictions he is depicted as black. And Kratos is a greek god who has migrated into the nordic pantheon's 'area'. God migrations might be more common than we think. Also, there is not much known of the giants, we haven't had first hand information in the game for now, other than that apparently they were nice people (if memory serves right from the previous game). There might have been migrations of other deities which might be used as also some real world social comentary in the game. Or she just likes that form and I'm overcomplicating things thinking there's a global gods thing going on. *shrug* She looks great regardless and I have confidence that the team developing the game know what they are doing. (also, love the bunny mug!)
You are probably overcomplicating things actually. Convergent evolution is a thing even for sociological phenomenons. :) Not even the roman/greek gods are the same despite the romans being heavily influenced by greek culture. :) Giants in norse mythology are not described as being blue. :)
Krishna was never depicted as black, you probably just saw his likeness carved into black stone, which is considered a sacred stone, not because its black, but because of its origin, geographically speaking. Black people be tryna black wash history now, it went from everyone is white, to everyone is black.
@@GeekRaj shaitan is the devil in Islam and the word for it in Arabic in general. Also D'jinn is the word for demons in Arabic. Just some fun facts to support your theory.
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 Why? Not even the myth Angrboda was blue lol, the GoW universe is their own setting, even the major characters are vastly different, God of Light and "Prettiest of the Gods" Baldur looked scuffed af, Thor who is more or less a hero god and protector is acting like a sadistic thug, Loki wasn't half olympian, Farbauti(Kratos) was a giant and not the Greek God of War. So idk what the complaint's about, if you want accuracy, go read the Eddas. Cause the ones in GoW are their own different interpretations of the characters. Even your Starfire comment can be remedied, she's orange in the main universe, but dc has a multiverse and some characters look different, Black Superman for example, just to name a few.
thank you so for educating people about these things, it may seem small, but to me it genuinely brings me happiness to know people pike you exist and advocate for my people
Heathen here - love Angrboða's depiction in the game. No issue with it at all. Bring it on. Interested to see if Hel pops up at some point, on a similar note. We have no idea who Heimdall's nine mothers are (not absolutely, though what's new there) though it's theorised that they're Aegir and Ran's nine daughters.
Hit the nail on the head. I was thinking why are people ok with a fictional story about these gods and characters but not with one of them having a skin color different from the one they see in their heads? Especially since you mentioned there isn't too much to go off of.
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 Black people die too, so Death being played by Kirby Howell-Baptiste is fine. And if the creator of Sandman Neil Gaiman likes her that should end any questions
It's truly sad that this needed addressing. Tell me where in the Prose Edda, Völuspá, or Gylfaginning that it explains the correct melanin level of Angrboða the jötunn, I must have missed it...🙄
@@god_hand576 Darth Vader's voice makes the character. I am being specific about James Earl Jones' incredible voice performance, its well known that JEJ was Vader's voice, how is that a dishonest take? Just because Jones didn't wear the suit and mask, are you saying his performance doesn't count? And what do the later movies have anything to do with it? You sound like you mostly want to be rude. Ask yourself this, if you think James Earl Jones performance didn't create a convincing Darth Vader, Would Vader have been as impressive and foreboding if he had the voice of Wallace Shawn?
@@permiebird937 “The voice of Wallace Shawn” If anyone reading this hasn’t heard his voice (before they cut it and dubbed over with JEJ) go do it. It’s hilarious.
@@god_hand576 No, I do not see those situations as being "very different". I think you are dishonest by slicing and dicing the technical meaning of who performed what role. We can agree to disagree, because its obvious we will never agree.
I love your Medieval bunny mug! Knights vs rabbits vs snails are some of my favourite subjects in Medieval illuminations. Mr Judge did a video reading Dad jokes in Kratos voice. It is a most excellent video.
Hyper Jim is the best Jim. Anyway, I think we can survive having a woman from a giant race of largely unspecified appearance (hell, sometimes they aren't even big) that gives birth to a giant wolf, a giant snake and a half-corpse girl not being nordic in a series where Baldur looks like an unwashed hippie with blue tattoos. Because nothing says she is meant to look nordic.
@@anglerfish4161 because everyone complained about a black woman playing the Blue Fairy in the Pinocchio remake so why should black Angrboda get a pass
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 Clearly it wasn't everyone, since demonstrably there are plenty of people that are ok with black people being cast into roles that were previously only assigned to white people. Unless there was something in particular that set the Pinocchio case apart. Which I wouldn't know, since I didn't even know there was a remake.
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 Lol it is a different case, you plank. BLUE FAIRY is a BLUE FAIRY. Pinocchio is a wooden puppet. Smaug is a dragon. Of course people will be angry if such clear cut characters are suddenly changed. But Angrboða has never been told as blue in the real life myth. Kratos' wife isn't blue despite being a Jötunn. Why should Angrboða be blue when the other Jötunn is not, you twit? Laufey looks black in the prophetic mural, too
Last time I went to Jorvik Viking centre in York, they had a skeleton on display from the Norse settlement there that had been interpreted as a Black person. The Norse famously travelled very extensively, and even if that skeleton wasn't very representative or has been misinterpreted, it'd actually be very strange if people who visited Italy, Anatolia and North Africa didn't mix with Sub-Saharan Africans at some point, given the longstanding patterns of trade.
@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl ok so my point still stands ... Egyptians are melinated ...dark skin people .. I agree Egyptians are not black only amaricans are black ... But Egyptians are the same in skin color as black people ...👍
a) Every comment is constructive, cause it helps with exposure. b) Iiiiii feel you! (So much I bought the whole freakin box set a couple of months ago)
I'm sorry, what source do you have that from? A bunch of comments make the same claim here, but I've literally never heard of this. Welsh does it, sure. I've never run into it in a Scandinavian, much less Danish (my own) context. But it's a fun fact, so I'd like to know where you got it from c:
Oh yes, Christopher Judge has such an amazing voice! And thanks for the description of colourblind casting, it's good to have the proper terminology to describe the phenomenon 👍
@@TheWelshVikingYeah the out-rage is pretty dumb in my opinion I read very funny comment on God of War sub-reddit that claims this is insulting because Angrboda gives birth to monsters that brings about the apocalypse hence will send subliminal messages to children about black mothers and children ruining society.
But, I think we can all agree that not liking a character design is totally fine. I do not like Týr's design in this game. He looks... meh, plus that leather armor he is wearing.
@@TheWelshViking Hey, Hamster is also my favourite animal! Aside from dog and dinosaur I had hamsters named Viscount and Viscountess Kritt (because their fur was white). They had 3 children named Gunn, Gunnar, and Gunnhildr. They fought each other everyday, I had to take the chance to name them that, lol. Unfortunately I couldn't take them with me when I moved to Japan...
cos you said you didn't know, the d with a slash is called an eth, it makes a voiced dental fricative in Icelandic and IPA, apparently (according to Wikipedia, this is all according to Wikipedia) it's been used in some welsh sources instead of dd, it was used in old English apparently interchangeable with the thorne, and both were much the same as th is used, it's also used in Faroese and the romanisation of kmer, but I'm not sure I really understand those bits of the article, I'm not a linguist
Personally i think it is deliberate and has more depth than just colourblind acting cuz though this is just something i think, i think they are going to make her half Jotunn, half egyptian god
@@drageben145 I think it may have to do with Hel. She's described as half black or blue (dead) but for this series purposes they may be interpreting her to be a mixed person.
You know what's ironic about that theory? That's probably what Santa Monica were trying to do for *YEARS!* ▫️From God Of War 1 with the Desert of Lost Souls ▫️The original ending idea with God Of War 3's ending of how both the Norse and Egyptian Gods would appear on Mount Olympus in order to take it over because of the Power Vacuum(The Greek Pantheon no longer existing after Kratos killed them) ▫️And an *OFFICIAL* God Of War Comic Book Series(God Of War Fallen God) by Dark Horse Comics has a story of Kratos ending up in *EGYPT* after God Of War 3! 😃😊 ▫️Oh and as an Added Bonus,I saw a video where the Game Director was talking about the original idea of how they'd introduced a different Kratos(The Older One),with short deleted cutscenes,with him showing up in a strange place,... *Egypt...* So having Angrboda as an Egyptian-Scandinavian hybrid while being a magical creature would make sense in this regard as a way to introduce Egyptian Mythology(And probably other mythologies as well) to the audience in the game. 😊 Talk about convenience. 😂
@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl Have you skipped class or something because that's what it originated. It's been always been a part of history. I mean where did you think that the higher ups calls black people African-Americans,or even *Black* for that matter came from? From Africa. 😂 However,if you're referring to the modern day Black people,then... *SHEESH.* What planet do you live on? Because it's astounding that you even managed to come to this conclusion. Let alone thought of it. Either way,both points,whether side you're going with or even sticking with is bad enough that it makes you look like an unorganized racist. 🤣 Read a book about your history dammit! HA! 😂🤣
@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl Coming from a guy who gets offended by a character skin color change in a *video game* no less. 😂 Even more for the fact that The God Of War Franchise has been 50-50 when it comes to the mythologies they're making their games(Or even Comics and Novels) from in terms of accuracy and non-accuracy. So why even dare to take skin color seriously *AND* an issue? It's not even *THAT* important. Especially if you're making a video game where imagination runs free in games,even in mythologies. 🤣 The God Of War Games,Comics,and Novels had never been 100% Accurate when it comes to mythology,Greek,Norse,and even Egyptian. They've been somewhat accurate,while the rest of it that they just came up with just gave it a new spin on it so that it fits the narrative for Kratos' Story. 😅
@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl Huh. I actually got you mixed up with someone else. Sorry! 😅 And second,While I was weirded out at first about Angrboda,but looking at it at 2nd glance,I know what they're doing here: They're trying to introduce Egyptian Mythology to the God Of War Game,which is awesome! 😃 And third,I'm actually a Black American,and even *I* don't get offended,because I don't give a damn. 😂 I don't even focus on my nationality or even Ethnicity on that matter, because it'll just be a waste of time for me. I'd rather focus on wanting to achieve my dreams and focus on life in general instead of getting offended on something so small,like Identity Politics and all that crap. Although I see what you're coming from,but even then,you shouldn't let that bother you dude. 😊
@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl yes well you’re a modem Arabic Egyptian. Ancient Egyptians are ethnically diverse and a hub for cultural exchanges from Greek, middle eastern, African etc…. The order of Medjay started as elite Nubians hired, considered so good they became a staple inclusive order of elite warriors to be the closest protectors of the Pharaoh
Hey Jimmy, I just wanted to say that I love your channel and your content, it's really interesting and entertaining. Keep up the good work! Greetings from a fellow historian (not a researcher though) from Italy!
ngl at first I also assumed it was just a pandering move but the way you described it made a lot of sense, not just about how we don't actually have any physical description of her so it's not like they're deviating from history, but the thing about the theater casting, it made me reflect a lot. In the vein of video games, have you ever considered making a video sharing your opinion about Bloodhound from Apex Legends? I can't think of any other game that does a 'vikings in space/futuristic vikings' theme and I think it would be really interesting to hear your thoughts as someone who actually understands the culture/history, since it's very different to the games/shows that try to depict actual historical vikings
You know it's a good day when The Welsh Viking uploads. Precisely, you should hire the best actor for the role, no matter the person. Anyone that doesn't like that simply based on skin should sit down and shut up, the world is a wonderful and diverse place and they can get over it or go to Mars.
I thank Jamie of The British History Podcast for dispelling me of any thought that everyone on every vikingr crew was Norse, or even white. There were an impressive array of both land and sea trade routes - and therefore, people of any ethnicity could encounter a vikingr crew - since vikingrs are very connected to trade centres. They’ve got to sell the stuff they stole somewhere. If someone had strength or skills that would benefit the crew. Why not take them on? The goal is fast, easy, money. Sure. Some individuals, or captains may have been bigoted against particular ethnicities, but I suspect “happened to be there when we needed someone, useful, and not a backstabbing pain in the arse” we’re more important qualifications.
You're not wrong about Christopher Judge, I could listen to that man all day. My favourite line of his as Teal'c is "undomesticated equines could not remove me". Or the Jaffar joke about Setesh Guards.
I went to see a play featuring a family of five. Mother, blue-eyed blonde sounded eastern european, father brown-hair and eyes and vaguely home counties, eldest son an Irish redhead, middle son south-london asian, little sister nigerian. It's theatre, that's the resident ensemble, so everyone just goes with it. I've also seen a dude in his 50s playing a naughty schoolboy opposite a 20-something teacher. Like, the room is a painted curtain and sometimes people are reacting to ABSOLUTELY NOTHING but skin colour is the part you struggle with? Get out of the theatre.
Thank you for this video. I have been saying exactly what you said in this video to other people ever since this whole god of war going woke bs started.
aaaayy denzel washington as don pedro!! lovely reference. and thank you for speaking up on this and other difficult topics. it's super important! people are really out of touch, some don't even realise it's racist to be so pick-and-choosy about what kind of accuracy they're getting mad at. and others are just... ew. so the more people online point out it's not ok to make a ruckus over a fictional character being black, the better. thank you!
I'm norse pagan. I have been told she has pale skin. However am I bothered about this whole thing. No not really I will admit I was shocked but like you said it was interpretation. She's a jotun for all we know there could have been black jotun but we don't know (though typically they are known to have pale ice like skin so her being a tint of blue does make sense however darker skin is a possibility) . A great example of a black person playing a norse god is idris elba. He played heimdallr in the marvel films and I thought his interpretation was excellent. My answer to people kicking off over her being black is stop being self righteous about stuff you know little about. If you don't like it don't buy the game but I think you'll be a fool if you don't
“Fat Thor” caused me to have a discussion with my therapist as it triggered my anorexia and other body/mental health issues, so: Thank You for calling it out
Well put, Sir. I don't understand how people misinterpreted your last video as a stab at us fattys - at no point do I think it can even be argued that was even alluded to in your talk - I can say from my own point of view you were very clear what you meant when you were speaking of the lazy costume for Thor - it was a lazily thought out by the creators, not a 'lazy Thor' - that was very clear. I have absolutely no truck with people who fuss over this person from that game being whatever colour and that is all I have to say about that. Also, hi to your hair, which seems to be going its own way today and good on it 😉 And I would run you over to snatch your bunny cup - that cup is wonderful and I love it beyond all things!
Christopher Judge will always be Teal'c to me, but he does do an amazing Kratos. Such a beautiful voice. ❤ He was a Jaffa, not a Goa'uld. :) The whole bitching about actors or characters having the "wrong" skin color... There's nothing to argue over, really. Travelling far and wide isn't a recent thing; Set of the Egyptian pantheon was described as a god of foreigners who is more "wild" than the other gods with red hair (and I heard somewhere green eyes, but I don't think this is accurate) and Thoth was in some stories said to have come from elsewhere. I don't remember Angrboda (I don't know how to make the proper character) being described with any particular skin tone, but that doesn't mean a fictional interpretation of her can't be black. It's a beautiful depiction of her and this is going to sound weird, but I think the visage of a black woman suits what little we know of her objective personality. Objective personality as in what can be discerned of the mythological jotunn's personality separate from the subjective, very Aesir lens we see the myths through, which is then passed through a Christian lens. Come to think of it, I think that's what the GOW devs have been trying to do, bypass the historically accepted lenses we look at myths through while trying other possible lenses. Though the Christian sources that remain to us seem to have tried to make light of it, you can see the perception lens shift back and forth in the telling of Loki's story. You can even see Loki's own perception change when the Aesir kidnap his and Angrboda's three children. He's no longer dicking around for the hell of it or at the behest of people he's "adopted" as his own, he's out for blood or at least revenge. Why the hell can't I flap my jowls about Angrboda without bringing up Loki? Here's my text wall complete with paragraphs. This is a nod to a comment by Cato a little further down that I responded to earlier. :) Just read Valsif's comment further down and (insert preferred pronoun here) reminded me of what I had forgotten to mention here pre-edit. Feel free to wander down and find the one about Aegir and Ran's daughters being Heimdallr's mothers.
Susinct, all we needed on that topic :) Although I would hapily watch some more valhiem playthrough to talk about the design at higher levels ^_^ just saying : p p.s. swift healing to your thub
In the episode when Teal'c is dying and shares the symbiont with Bra'tac, he speaks in his normal voice. Totally threw me off. Excellent episode. I think I took on his voice inflections for a few days after I binged 3 seasons over winter break one year. Only my friends who watched the show understood. Good fun.
I NEED that mug! My brother-in-arms is a historian, loves the medieval era (focuses on Roman period, but still loves him some medieval knights and such), and uses a rabbit as his crest for reenactments. I must gift him a mug like this!
Just an awesome video. No matter color as long as they play the character well then they're doing awesome. She looks amazing. Great, successful acting.
No matter color (btw race is more than color) when you make a character, however when you take one that already exists and even has cultural significance and spit all over it, that's insulting and should be called out as it has.
I may be wrong on this, but don't the Jötnar in the sagas often have varying appearances? So that could potentially leave more room for interpretation by the developers than just going by colorblind casting.
You are right. Also, Angrboda is the mother of Fenrir and Jörmagandur. So, in the minds of the whining people, it's within reason that she gave birth to awolf and a serpent, but she can't be black. My two cents in this, it's a fantasy game and a fun re imagining of the norse myths (which, by the way, is part of my heritage being Swedish).
I pronounce Kratos the way you do because he is Greek. I don't americanise people's name, unless their name is indeed American. That is also true for brand names and companies, like I pronounce Adidas the way Germans do (I mean, I think almost all brits pronounce it the way Germans do? idk) Also, I love Angrboða's depiction here, nothing to complain about. Especially after your argument of, "There have never been any description of Angrboða's appearance details anyway." But I have to admit it was a bit shocking. I've always imagined a Jötunn to be pale bluish in colour with coarse white hair. But I guess it was just a dumb prejudice of mine. Also, this is the first time I've ever heard the term "Color-blind Casting." That's such an interesting thing to know. Thank you!
Eh, I mean it's more like the Jotunn were from another realm. They've been depicted in various ways over various media as well as what we have of Norse myth, which shows that they have no solid form, so they could be white, black, blue, green, whatever. Though some of the same folks are clamoring that Thor was blonde when he was clearly depicted as a redhead, and ripped drinking beer and eating full oxen for supper every day. People are just trippin, the Santa Monica team's doing well.
About color-blind casting, I love the cast of Hamilton! Best actors and actresses I’ve ever seen! And I’m so glad they were chosen!! Their portrayals were so on point that it took no time at all to see the characters through them. ❤
ΚΡΑΤΟΣ as you correctly pronounced it, means Power. Later it came to mean also ''the power of the state'' and state itself. So today in Greece (which actually is properly called ''Hellas'' btw) if you want for example to refer to the state (country) of France, you say (sorry for the capital letters, but I think most people are more familiar with them) TO KΡΑΤΟΣ ΤΗΣ ΓΑΛΛΙΑΣ (to kratos tis Gallias). There is a series of names comming from the etymological root of Kratos. For example ''Krateros'' (powerfull). Personally I dont mind colorblind casting when it comes to theater or media inspired by mythological or historical sources. The more artistic license the more accepting I am. I mean you have a movie like ''The Warriors'' trasporting Xenophon's Anabasis, into late 70's american gang wars. You could have a post apocalyptic setting for Antigone, or an epic space opera about the siege of space station Ilion. And in that context it would be perfectly fine to cast anyone. Where I draw the line is in productions that aim to at least look ''historical''. For example you go and build more or less believable sets, get decent costumes, bring in an army of extras, reproductions of historical accurate props, hundreds of horses, to the point of making a believable world. And then you go and make a ''colorblind'' cast and fuck up any sort of immersion you where struggling for. Because the production as a whole looks too real and any oddities will stand out like a sore thumb. For example, sorry you cant cast a black Achilles, when we have a specific description about his looks. At the same time not including Memnon who could be black probably says more about the production's motives. Cheap shock value. I wouldnt mind at all a black Kratos. Its basically a fantasy game extremely loosely inspired by hellenic mythology. I do agree with you on your point of a black woman being ''exotic'' from a norse pov. Its exactly why many of the Gods and Heroes of hellenic mythology are blonde or blue eyed. It was something quite rare. In fact up until very recently it was still rare. Today you might find more fair haired people due to the massive immigration from the ex-eastern bloc countries, but up until the mid 90's, boy you could have the face of a rat but if you were natural blonde with blue eyes, chances were that you would have great success flirting wise. Personally though if I called the shots in Angrboda's design, I would go for an otherwordly look of a character that you could not place in todays ethnic boundaries. Like James Earl Jones' Thulsa Doom appearence in Conan the Barbarian. He was black with straight hair and blue eyes, looking so different (and perhaps mystical/ancient) from anyone around him.
Angrboda the wolf mother, high chisel cheek bones with yellow eyes. Since it is a video game have her with shifting skin tones to different shades of wolf pelts. Along with her breathing like a dog/wolf or sounding like a husky talking. Doesn't help that they used a young woman when Angrboda is refer to as a mother of many children, she should show some age.
I think diversity really depends. Games - go ahead, I'm happy and laughing at right-wing feckers' outrage. Fantasy stuff - I'm happy. But history stuff, like in the Vikings series (I think the continuations) where a jarl, a Scandinavian man, was was made into a black woman, is just silly. If I'm watching something that's trying portray a historical period, it's highly preferrable they stick to how they looked in the day. For example, if someone makes a serious drama about Ivan the Terrible, it would be silly if he would be portrayed as a black actor, and his wives would be closet lesbians.
@@pavelstaravoitau7106 Do you hold other aspects of historical accuracy to the same standards? Clothes? Hair styles? Tattoos? Interactions across different social classes? Food? Architecture? Depictions of religious believes and practices? Women wearing modern makeup?
@@pavelstaravoitau7106 Right-wing or not, if you're Scandinavian (like me) and don't see anything wrong with this, keeping in mind how we're spouting cultural appropriation every 2 seconds, then you simply lack self-respect. Also, there seems to be a trend against redheads specifically, no European with dignity should bend for the sake of a little entertainment. A positive from this is once more leftists feckers hypocrisy on full display, so there's that at least.
@@occupyvenus4868 yes, actually. I'd prefer hairstyles and clothes be accurate too. I'd prefer as accurate as possible, unlike many modern film-makers and other creative positions. Not to say that I think there's no place at all for PoC. In a historical setting I'm happy with them being travellers, merchants (imagine Viking Age Dublin), and some unfortunate souls that could have ended up in Scandinavia through slavery, along with slaves from other ethnic groups throughout Europe. I absolutely love cultures coming together and interacting in history. Aside from the Viking Age, I always found a story of a black person ending up in 17th Russia to be a fascinating concept, one we also have a historical basis for.
@@pavelstaravoitau7106 the Jarl is not a black woman, she is a mixed race woman, her grandfather returned from the middle east with a black wife. The thing about history is it's never what you think it is. One of Ivans wives was what today would be considered a lesbian. Anastasia zakharyina Yurleva. Her brother would found the Romanov dynasty . Peter the Great would go on to adopt a black African boy and make him a Russian Prince, the great Russian General Ganibal, who of course was Pushkin's grand father. The problem with telling world history is that 19th century Victorian's decided to erase black people from it. Today we dig up skeletons of African Roman soldiers in Wales, and everyone is shocked , when in reality no one should be, the Romans have frescos of black soldiers on their walls,at least one should have been assigned to Britain. Conversely the Caucasian imagination can, has and does place them anywhere in the world at any time period and usually at the center of the transpiring events. One would be shocked to discover that Europeans we're a global minority for most of human history by the historical representation they have allowed themselves.
@@TheWelshViking This is before the Romans even But don’t take it to think I don’t like the design, I do. It’s just not accurate to the time this is set in
My whole thought process in the last weeks was this: 1. Ooooh who is this girl at the end of the trailer? She looks so cute! Also cool to have a dark-skinned character in a norse-themed game!! Love that! 2. Oh, this is Angrboða? Hell yeah! Wait...wait...all the norse gods are white, but Angrboða, the "evil witch" who births Loki's "monstrous children" is the one they made a person of color? Hmm....kinda racist 3. Then again, Kratos and Atreus go against the gods so those are the bad guys in GoW, and Atreus is Loki and Angrboða is gonna be on our side and possibly already his love interest(?), so guess it's not racist if the whole narrative is flipped. 4. Thor and Angrboða character designs are cool as hel and I'm excited for the game. :D
A vast number of people need to realize that fictional media is fictitious, meaning a white actor in a Thor costume, and a black actor in the same costume, are both equally, to the same degree, not actually Thor. Then they can proceed to grow the hell up.
I know nothing about the game or its historicity (or not, heck the reason I'm here is to learn about a culture I'm fascinated by), but the character looks absolutely badass and a black actress suits the look *perfectly*.
What I don't get is people are getting pissy about this but not that Loki was fathered by a Greek god or that that under the ashes of his murdered family that Greek god is black. People are crazy man
@@metamind8674 I put that down to the lighting in the 1 scene we ever see him without the ash. In concept art at the time he is shown to be black or at the very least he isn't ethnically white. This is why I am convinced that the people who are complaining about angrboda have never played a god of war game and have no intention of playing one.
@@tehCostHD I mean he is though. Go play god of war 1 before you say stupid shit like that. Seriously all you are doing is proving my point that the people complaint about the race of angrboda have not played the first 3 games also you do know that a black man and a white woman can have a child that is still white in appearance right? Like not only do albino people but those born from "mixed" relationships can be born with "white" skin in fact in one rather famous case a woman had a set of twins and one was born with white skin pigment and the other was born with black skin pigment. The idea that a child born of a mixed relationship will be born darker skinned is a myth that originates in old propaganda against interracial marriage.
I knew the beads would please you!! 😂 you have taught us that this is the authentic look for female look in the Vikings age. Thanks for all your information man ❤️❤️
I've heard so many people say it's racebending Angrboda, but like she is not human in the myths??? Jötunns were literally born out of armpits of Ymir, I'm pretty sure they don't have same methods of passing down genes of skin color as we do. And I think the fact that she gives birth to all the weird children also kinda shows that? Like genetics don't mean a shit in the world of Norse mythology :'D And I think she's been described vaguely as "ugly and shapeless" so like why are they not mad about she being so pretty??
So... this might be GoW devs interpreting LITERALLY the fact that Hel (the goddess) is described as being half black (or blue but translators always change this to black). Half black on ONE SIDE OF HER BODY, but still.
I love Jimmy, one of many reasons is that he cares how you pronounce things! I dated a Greek for a long time, and have a lasting love of the Greek language, and boy oh boy I get worked up when people mispronounce Scandinavian words but Greek gets butchered just as much by those darn dasky English speakers
I have two things to say. 1. I pronounce Kratos the way you do because I was teached to do that by the german dub of GoW. Same goes for all the other greek names witch were pronounced not english in germany. 2. Angrboda is a Jötun, a mystical creature in north mythology. You can show her how ever the hell you want. No on called the police when she had blue skin in AC Valhalla. Being black skined and have a named that means 'the one who brings grief', is kind of strange don't you think?
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 You're talking about the DC Character right? Why not? What would speak against it? She is not realy white but, as I sad fictional characters have no limits how they could appear in different works.
@@seb24789 You can't compare JUNGE with BOY. But yes I see your point, nevertheless Tobias Brecklinghaus did a good job for Kratos in the german cast, in my opinion.
Snort, Thank You for another excellent video. SG-1 Fangirling? A1 ☆☆☆☆☆ always appreciated. Doesn't matter a humans gender, color, derivation etc... we all breathe the same air and all bleed the blood of our ancestors. We honor them by our actions or disgrace them by our words. You Sir, are honorable. Hugs, from Minnesota USA.
I love the direction the team have taken with this Norse God of War. I don't know if it's just me but most of the time (let me emphasize that I don't mean always, but most times), if there is something evil or dangerous to be portrayed, it's always black or Dark pigmented. You need a evil dangerous werewolf, make it black. You need a new breed of orcs that are stronger, more evil and dangerous (Lord of the Rings), make it black. The titans in the immortals were black. You portray your villains and antagonist as black or dark and no one bats an eye, but you decide to make one hero and protagonist black or dark and everyone f*cking loses their minds. I know our ancestors evolved to identify the darkness as dangerous because with poor visibility we become easy prey for predators, but not every thing dark is bad. Not gonna lie, when I first saw the dark elves attacking the defenseless light elves I thought the director was doing the same thing but when I heard the possibility that Kratos had aided the wrong side it just made me happy. I think I read somewhere that it was intentionally done that way. So yeah, I can understand people being offended on behalf of Norse people but like he said, there is no clear description of her skin colour so the creators have freedom to do what they like. I believe this might be a case of what enabled our ancestors to survive has now become detrimental to our survival. I am telling you, if aliens suddenly show up and they black or dark pigmented we are attacking them, no questions asked. Maybe that's why they are still avoiding us.
Its interesting u say this, some people lose their minds if there are non-enslaved blacks among say norse folk but if there are enslaved blacks they are ok. Even blacks whether enslaved or not are almost unheard of among the Norse. So the issue is usually not the blacks themselves rather their role.
So correct me if I’m wrong, did you just compare black people to evil orcs? Nobody sees orcs with grayscale black skin and thinks “Oh look, black people,” that sounds like something a racist would do, if YOU see evil orcs and dark elves and think, “Ah yes because of their grayish-black skin, monstrous features and evil nature, I think of black people,” then I think you got some of your own problems to work out, the rest of us just see mythical, fictional creatures
@@a.m928 Your talking about 1% of the population that sees orcs that way, there’s always gonna be racists that exist in this world and they’re not going anywhere. Don’t try to to turn a non-issue into an issue like these racists are running rampant lol
I mean, it's nice to see clothing and architecture inspired by what we know of real history. And if this was an attempt to present norse culture in a particular period as accurately as possible (like in a museum), then yeah a prominent black character would be strange. But this isn't history, it's fantasy. And there are so many other aspects of the game (like the clothing and the architecture) that have nothing to do with the culture or period. So the fact that this is where people draw the line... It's a bit like when people scoff at the athletic feats of female action heroines, as if the athletic feats of male action heroes are completely realistic... We all know what those people are really upset about.
![[DRAGON BALL LEGENDS REVEALS ＆ STUFF] LEGENDS FESTIVAL 2024 Special Edition Part 1](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/mV5bGIswTtQ/mqdefault.jpg)
So fun fact about "fat Thor" Chris Hemsworth was 100% willing to put on the weight for the role as he felt it would allow him to put on a better performance and connect with the character far more but Disney said no as they feared he would not be able to lose the weight again in time to film Thor 4. Also originally fat Thor wasn't supposed to be a joke, the directors wanted to play it straight and show an honest depiction of depression but once again Disney stepped in and demanded more jokes at Thor's expense.
Yes, if you ignore the jokes, what is there is some good stuff, the "I'm still worthy" line makes me tear up every time
It was offensive I think
Thor was a joke since Ragnarok. Which is such an ironic chain of events, as you'd think that, if there's a story where Thor should be at his most earnest and serious, it's the one where the world as he knows is about to end. Taika Waititi was a mistake.
That is... Very depressing. Executives just ruin everything, don't they?
@@antona.8659 I am gonna have to disagree with you here. In every movie staring Thor it has been shown that when things get serious and depressing he has a tendency to make light of those things and in Ragnarok he does just that but when he needs to actually be serious he is like when he is telling Loki how he thought the world of him. In my honest opinion Thor Ragnarok was the first truly good marvel movie since Captain American civil war.
I agree with everything you said. Especially the Assassin Creed version of her being Blue. That was a great point. But Krato's skin is Gray because Ares permanently covered his skin with his families Ashes. So Krato's was not Born with gray skin. He was just cursed to wear his families ashes on his skin. The red markings is a tattoo he put on to remember his brother who had Red Birth Mark that covered half his body. His brother was imprisoned and captured his entire life because there was a prophecy that a man with red markings would bring havoc upon the earth. People thought that was his brother . But little did they know... Capturing his brother would be the precursor for Kratos being the true Warrior in the prophecy. For the prophecy said he would bare red marks on his body, but it never said they would be intentionally put on.
Excellent point, well made!
Correction it wasn't ares that cursed Kratos but an old lady (I think she was like a seer)
Undoubtedly the game is supposed to be set in Europe. I am perfectly ok with black Angrboða but I can still not accept Atreus carrying an American White-tailed deer in the opening shot of the trailer.
You are my kind of nerd and I'm so pleased you spotted that
Well, maybe someone went on vacation to Vinland, abducted the deer, and brought it home with them? That's about the only explanation I can come up with on that one...
@@Amy_the_Lizard And they're gods, which is it's own excuse lol.
Are you ok with Fringilla Vigo being black in the Witcher show?
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 the issue with Fringilla is we already know her apperance and by changing her apperance that of her uncle had ro be changed as well.
I definitely believe black mages should be present but it might be better to create new characters. The mages recruit from all over the world so they will bw diverse.
I'd guess the only reason you could give for whatever looks Angrboða has in any depiction is: The mother of a giant sea serpent, a giant wolf, and Hel, could look like whatever.
Can Death of the Endless look like whatever?
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979
Well….as long as she’s half skeleton….yes🤷🏻♂️
@@HandlingYou Human are all part skeleton, too
@@chie970
Aesthetically……don’t try to be smart on something benign👌🏻
@@HandlingYou my apologies. I can't help myself
Given that some of the jotnar in the myths had improbable numbers of heads...dark skin and textured hair as a casting choice should barely rate a mention. Well within the bounds of existing diversity in the myths. Not even pushing the boundaries slightly. Plus didn't she have a daughter who was half black...
I thought the dead half of Hel was blue cause of hyperthermia in the cold waters?
EDIT: seems she was described as both half blue or half black because they only had one word for it back then. They could be using that idea to say Hel is mixed by having Angrboda be black
What I don't fully understand is: Is it just the color? So blue is fine but brown isn't? Or is it facial features aswell? So if they made this model green it would be fine?
I'm confused.
Yeah, to them she can be anything but black becuase that changes everything somehow lol.
*whispers* it's the racism
It's depressing that I have to mention this but I'm black before anyone starts crying but I suspect people would be OK with her being green or blue because people aren't so it's impossible to be pandering, which seems to be the reason given. Personally as a black lad I get slightly embarrassed when they do these sort of things because it does come across as that and if in this day and age someone randomly put white people in the black panther crew (marvel films not the fist in the air black panthers) then even I'll admit that won't be seen as colourblind casting. So I can see peoplea point.
I also strongly pleas with people to not jus go around labelling white people as racist for bringing up topics or pointing out double standards because I feel that it detracts from actual racism. No doubt some people just don't want to see a black person in their games in the same way they'd start crying over gay people but the very fact a lot love Kratos' voice actor does imply to me that they're motivations for questioning why there's animated black people in a norse mythology game does look like pandering and not just because they're white with an opinion, thus must be racist.
I should point out as well that I'm not against her personally but I can understand why people do think it's just pandering, especially because whatever people say, we do get used to tick boxes by rich white people who would rather lazily exploit our skin colour than create something new for us
@@me5969 Surely too it should go without saying that this Norse mythology which God of War is now based on, is the oldest faith and religion of many Europeans still alive today, the closest known thing to northern Europeans personification through poems, story telling and oral tradition, I get the feeling if it was any other demographics such myths and legends, they would be treated as sacred and wouldn't have any wild liberties taken at all, don't you think ? And if people use the defence it's just entertainment, unlike stage plays the visual cast can be anything, and other ancient faiths and traditions would never be lowered to the implied casualnessentrainment
Hold, on... Are you saying that's it's perfectly reasonable for a Magical Giant from Another Dimension to have dark skin? Preposterous!!! /s
Right, plus they say, well black people didn't live in Europe. Well Norse Gods technically by story are not from Europe. They are from a different Realm. Norse Mythology may have originated in Europe. But the God's were not considered part of the same realm as Earth.
Generally speaking, most human groups tend to depict their gods in forms most like themselves. The Egyptians are like the only real exception to this.
As a dane myself, I see no problem in a jætte (Jotun) being of a darker complexion, she's a jotun, which according to stories, came in all shapes and sizes. Though the game takes some great liberties in other areas, but I see no problem with this one.
Hmm, Angrboða being blue made me think of something. Didn't norse cultures have the same word for blue and black? Letters of vikings coming across "blue" people, and Harold Bluetooth? Assassins Creed and the MCU both make jǫtnar blue... does that mean they could/should all be black? They're probably blue because people take the term "ice" giant too literally, but... Is there any description of Jotunn anywhere? Because if they're mentioned as being blue it would be an argument for being black. This of course makes the enemies of the gods black, which isn't great, but that's history.
As far as we know blue was indeed both blue and black back then as there was no actual word for black.
Harald Bluetooth is an example for that too. He had a black tooth, not blue.
@@Nattfare "No word for black"? Did you miss svartr? As in svartalfr?
Welsh, afaik, equals blue with black (in terms of skin color), but I've literally never heard of this in a Scandinavian/Nordic context. I'd love to see a source, as it's an interesting tidbit!
Just commenting to have update on sources hehe
@@Nattfare Came for review, leave with review + fun fact. Thanks!
it wouldn't be a very *strong* argument for the Jotunn being black or connected to Africa somehow. There's figures in Greek myth who are said to have African origin (like Memnon a demigod Ethiopian prince who fights Achilles in the Trojan war) but 'Ethiopia' in Homeric myth seems to be used as a plplaceholder to basically mean 'far away', the ancient Greeks probably wouldn't have had the same understanding we do of 'a black man'. In the Irish language, black people are 'blue people' b/c 'black' has very insulting and evil connotations, it's usually reserved for Satan so calling an ethnic group 'black' would be racist/calling them evil. Maybe the Engish were occasionally called 'black' idk, though 'sasanach' sounds contemptuous enough already
Small correction. Teal'c was a Jaffa, not a Goa'uld. Also, I now need you to do a review of Dr. Jackson as an archaeologist :)
Oh yeah. Also: he's terrible, but not Indiana Jones terrible
Oohhh...fictional archeologist tier list?
@@LetsDanceRedding yes please
Isn't Crawford a linguistic?
Came to the comments to see if someone else corrected this already
Things I learned in this video:
1. Racism is bad
2. Jimmy loves Christopher Judd
Angrbođa is aJotun. Jotuns come in all shapes, sizes, appearances, whatever. I don't see a problem. Good commentary.
That is pretty much the same thing, I sad to some racist jerk the other day. Thank you very much!
I was just about to comment this. She is a bloody jötunn ffs :D
@@GreenLarsen One that is described as being as pale as death from what little we know. Forget black or white, going off that alone she should be chalk white in appearance, to the point she makes white people look tanned, lol.
@Harald Hardrada First off, we aren’t living in the viking age. Second, the writers of the game can write the characters to be whatever they want because it’s their story.
@UCM3ZeWNPLwOTsGndwvmeHwg The fact that it’s mythology leaves it open to revision and interpretation. It’s myth and stories originally told by those with a limited view and knowledge of the world, or what they may have seen.
And in most mythology Gods would take strange forms when interacting with humans.
In Marvel Gods of other cultures would go to Asgard for refuge. Could be something similar here. Keep in mind these guys are telling a story and world building, they’re designs and interpretations of various Gods and cultures aren’t meant to be taken as factual.
Think of it like Hercules the Legendary Journey or Xena or Marvel and DC comics. Anything goes.
And yes they could make Black Panther white if they wanted to as that’s the go to argument. Shadowhawk was an original black hero, who was later made white.
Some guy was complaining about Thor’s look and then ranted about a darker complexion Angrboda. I just responded with: “she’s a Jötunn therefore can look however she wants. Her having the form of darker complexion doesn’t make her ethnically African, because she’s a Jötunn. Just as the Asgardians aren’t ethnically Nordic because they are Asgardians”
Can Death of the Endless look anyway she wants?
But why would you choose...
@@Psycorde there’s a theory she’s actually Egyptian in the game. Or well it could be a reference to Nordics calling black people “blue” and making some of their mythological characters blue people. Angrboda apparently likes to looks distinguished
@@blackflagsnroses6013 I think it's in Welsh that black skin color = blue skin color, but I've literally never heard of this happening in Scandinavian (much less Danish; my own) languages. Do you have a source?
@@7913AJunior blámaður
Icelandic
Etymology
From Old Norse blámaðr, equivalent to blár (“blue”) + maður (“man”). Cognate with Swedish blåman.
Pronunciation
IPA(key): /ˈplauːmaːðʏr/
Noun
blámaður m (genitive singular blámanns, nominative plural blámenn)
a black person
Usage notes
Has a lot of historical literary usage, but may now be considered derogatory by some.
Synonyms
(a black person): svertingi, blökkumaður, negri
I'm TIRED of the media shoehorning Southern Europeans into Northern European history! Kratos should have stayed in Greece with the rest of those Southern Europeans! >:C
/s
XD
Agreed- but he had to fight Thor eventually.
@GanargXKraken Not particularly. Are you? :D
My first impression when I saw her in the trailer was: cool, other pantheons are joining the party.
It was later that I discovered that she was Angrboda and something clicked in my head, probably a continuation of that first impression. A bit of a loose theory.
Previously her few depictions have been blue for giants. Krishna is represented in blue. In older depictions he is depicted as black. And Kratos is a greek god who has migrated into the nordic pantheon's 'area'. God migrations might be more common than we think. Also, there is not much known of the giants, we haven't had first hand information in the game for now, other than that apparently they were nice people (if memory serves right from the previous game). There might have been migrations of other deities which might be used as also some real world social comentary in the game.
Or she just likes that form and I'm overcomplicating things thinking there's a global gods thing going on. *shrug* She looks great regardless and I have confidence that the team developing the game know what they are doing.
(also, love the bunny mug!)
You know what in Hindi the devil is called shaitan which is very similar to satan. So yeah migrations are possible.
You are probably overcomplicating things actually. Convergent evolution is a thing even for sociological phenomenons. :) Not even the roman/greek gods are the same despite the romans being heavily influenced by greek culture. :)
Giants in norse mythology are not described as being blue. :)
Krishna was never depicted as black, you probably just saw his likeness carved into black stone, which is considered a sacred stone, not because its black, but because of its origin, geographically speaking.
Black people be tryna black wash history now, it went from everyone is white, to everyone is black.
Not to mention Mimir and his accent which are both foreign to Midgard and its pantheon
@@GeekRaj shaitan is the devil in Islam and the word for it in Arabic in general. Also D'jinn is the word for demons in Arabic. Just some fun facts to support your theory.
Good explanation of what “color blind casting” means. Well done. Too bad it is needed.
Can Starfire be any skin color?
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 no
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 She's orange
@@bakedgoods7116 and Angrboda should be blue
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 Why? Not even the myth Angrboda was blue lol, the GoW universe is their own setting, even the major characters are vastly different, God of Light and "Prettiest of the Gods" Baldur looked scuffed af, Thor who is more or less a hero god and protector is acting like a sadistic thug, Loki wasn't half olympian, Farbauti(Kratos) was a giant and not the Greek God of War. So idk what the complaint's about, if you want accuracy, go read the Eddas. Cause the ones in GoW are their own different interpretations of the characters. Even your Starfire comment can be remedied, she's orange in the main universe, but dc has a multiverse and some characters look different, Black Superman for example, just to name a few.
thank you so for educating people about these things, it may seem small, but to me it genuinely brings me happiness to know people pike you exist and advocate for my people
I'm really glad that this is positive for you, and thank you so much for telling this was ok and helpful.
Heathen here - love Angrboða's depiction in the game. No issue with it at all. Bring it on. Interested to see if Hel pops up at some point, on a similar note.
We have no idea who Heimdall's nine mothers are (not absolutely, though what's new there) though it's theorised that they're Aegir and Ran's nine daughters.
Oh and fantastic video Jimmy! As always
I knew I'd forgotten something in my own comment... Tyvm for the reminder. :)
@@darthplagueis13 we'll go with that. That's a graceful solution.
@@darthplagueis13 and thous Ikea came into this world
Hit the nail on the head. I was thinking why are people ok with a fictional story about these gods and characters but not with one of them having a skin color different from the one they see in their heads? Especially since you mentioned there isn't too much to go off of.
Are you alright with a black woman playing Death of the Endless?
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 Black people die too, so Death being played by Kirby Howell-Baptiste is fine. And if the creator of Sandman Neil Gaiman likes her that should end any questions
@@HotDogTimeMachine385 My thought exactly, if Gaiman loves the casting that should be it, he’s the fucking writer for The Gods sake.
I love the bunny mug! I have needle felted the bunny riding the snail as a mug mat, and now, I clearly need the mug to put on it….
.
I also need this mug. It is awesome.
It's truly sad that this needed addressing. Tell me where in the Prose Edda, Völuspá, or Gylfaginning that it explains the correct melanin level of Angrboða the jötunn, I must have missed it...🙄
The hair style is documentable back to c1000BC so not really an issue tbh
James Earl Jones was amazing as Darth Vader, why should this be any different.
@@god_hand576 Darth Vader's voice makes the character. I am being specific about James Earl Jones' incredible voice performance, its well known that JEJ was Vader's voice, how is that a dishonest take? Just because Jones didn't wear the suit and mask, are you saying his performance doesn't count? And what do the later movies have anything to do with it? You sound like you mostly want to be rude. Ask yourself this, if you think James Earl Jones performance didn't create a convincing Darth Vader,
Would Vader have been as impressive and foreboding if he had the voice of Wallace Shawn?
@@permiebird937
“The voice of Wallace Shawn”
If anyone reading this hasn’t heard his voice (before they cut it and dubbed over with JEJ) go do it. It’s hilarious.
@@god_hand576 No, I do not see those situations as being "very different". I think you are dishonest by slicing and dicing the technical meaning of who performed what role. We can agree to disagree, because its obvious we will never agree.
@@god_hand576 he means his voice genius.
I love your Medieval bunny mug! Knights vs rabbits vs snails are some of my favourite subjects in Medieval illuminations.
Mr Judge did a video reading Dad jokes in Kratos voice. It is a most excellent video.
Thank you for sharing this information with us. I will find this video. No matter what. You just made a family very happy :)
Link please? 🤣
Hyper Jim is the best Jim.
Anyway, I think we can survive having a woman from a giant race of largely unspecified appearance (hell, sometimes they aren't even big) that gives birth to a giant wolf, a giant snake and a half-corpse girl not being nordic in a series where Baldur looks like an unwashed hippie with blue tattoos. Because nothing says she is meant to look nordic.
Do you like that a black woman was cast as the Blue Fairy?
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 When? Where? And why is that relevant?
@@anglerfish4161 because everyone complained about a black woman playing the Blue Fairy in the Pinocchio remake so why should black Angrboda get a pass
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 Clearly it wasn't everyone, since demonstrably there are plenty of people that are ok with black people being cast into roles that were previously only assigned to white people. Unless there was something in particular that set the Pinocchio case apart. Which I wouldn't know, since I didn't even know there was a remake.
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 Lol it is a different case, you plank. BLUE FAIRY is a BLUE FAIRY. Pinocchio is a wooden puppet. Smaug is a dragon. Of course people will be angry if such clear cut characters are suddenly changed.
But Angrboða has never been told as blue in the real life myth. Kratos' wife isn't blue despite being a Jötunn. Why should Angrboða be blue when the other Jötunn is not, you twit? Laufey looks black in the prophetic mural, too
Last time I went to Jorvik Viking centre in York, they had a skeleton on display from the Norse settlement there that had been interpreted as a Black person. The Norse famously travelled very extensively, and even if that skeleton wasn't very representative or has been misinterpreted, it'd actually be very strange if people who visited Italy, Anatolia and North Africa didn't mix with Sub-Saharan Africans at some point, given the longstanding patterns of trade.
@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl they may not be black but they are dark skinned just like black people they're heavily melanated and dark skin brown skin...
@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl ok so my point still stands ... Egyptians are melinated ...dark skin people .. I agree Egyptians are not black only amaricans are black ... But Egyptians are the same in skin color as black people ...👍
Man I miss Stargate. (Yes, extremely constructive commentary here. I don't have anything to add to what the video already says lol)
a) Every comment is constructive, cause it helps with exposure.
b) Iiiiii feel you! (So much I bought the whole freakin box set a couple of months ago)
@@cakeeeetime 1) yes that is why I commented anyway haha 2) oooh lucky
also jotunns being blue might have connection to the danish “blaa mand” meaning blue man that was used to describe black people
I'm sorry, what source do you have that from?
A bunch of comments make the same claim here, but I've literally never heard of this. Welsh does it, sure. I've never run into it in a Scandinavian, much less Danish (my own) context. But it's a fun fact, so I'd like to know where you got it from c:
Oh yes, Christopher Judge has such an amazing voice! And thanks for the description of colourblind casting, it's good to have the proper terminology to describe the phenomenon 👍
Oh my god, Chris Judge is the voice of Kratos? I may have to buy a console.
Right?!
@@TheWelshVikingYeah the out-rage is pretty dumb in my opinion
I read very funny comment on God of War sub-reddit that claims this is insulting because Angrboda gives birth to monsters that brings about the apocalypse hence will send subliminal messages to children about black mothers and children ruining society.
@@hamizanyunos1502 When you know that Angrboda means "Bringer of grief" or "Grief bringer" is seams much more insulting.
But, I think we can all agree that not liking a character design is totally fine.
I do not like Týr's design in this game. He looks... meh, plus that leather armor he is wearing.
Yeah, I'm not a massive fan of all the leather armour in games and movies generally tbh
Agreed.
I can totally see Tyr betraying kratos 20 min after they free him.
I’ve been watching your stuff for a while and I’m always happy when you speak out on these topics :) also cool mug! Are bunnies your favorite animal?
Maybe? Kitties and hamsters and capybaras as well though :3
@@TheWelshViking Opinions on foxes they're my favourite
@@TheWelshViking Hey, Hamster is also my favourite animal! Aside from dog and dinosaur
I had hamsters named Viscount and Viscountess Kritt (because their fur was white). They had 3 children named Gunn, Gunnar, and Gunnhildr. They fought each other everyday, I had to take the chance to name them that, lol. Unfortunately I couldn't take them with me when I moved to Japan...
@@TheWelshViking "Maybe? Kitties and *hamsters* and capybaras as well though :3"
Minsc approves.
cos you said you didn't know, the d with a slash is called an eth, it makes a voiced dental fricative in Icelandic and IPA, apparently (according to Wikipedia, this is all according to Wikipedia) it's been used in some welsh sources instead of dd, it was used in old English apparently interchangeable with the thorne, and both were much the same as th is used, it's also used in Faroese and the romanisation of kmer, but I'm not sure I really understand those bits of the article, I'm not a linguist
Personally i think it is deliberate and has more depth than just colourblind acting cuz though this is just something i think, i think they are going to make her half Jotunn, half egyptian god
Or i could be totally wrong and they just based the design on the actress
@@drageben145 I think it may have to do with Hel. She's described as half black or blue (dead) but for this series purposes they may be interpreting her to be a mixed person.
I like the theory that she’ll actually come from the Egyptian world like Kratos came from the Greek
You know what's ironic about that theory? That's probably what Santa Monica were trying to do for *YEARS!*
▫️From God Of War 1 with the Desert of Lost Souls
▫️The original ending idea with God Of War 3's ending of how both the Norse and Egyptian Gods would appear on Mount Olympus in order to take it over because of the Power Vacuum(The Greek Pantheon no longer existing after Kratos killed them)
▫️And an *OFFICIAL* God Of War Comic Book Series(God Of War Fallen God) by Dark Horse Comics has a story of Kratos ending up in *EGYPT* after God Of War 3! 😃😊
▫️Oh and as an Added Bonus,I saw a video where the Game Director was talking about the original idea of how they'd introduced a different Kratos(The Older One),with short deleted cutscenes,with him showing up in a strange place,... *Egypt...*
So having Angrboda as an Egyptian-Scandinavian hybrid while being a magical creature would make sense in this regard as a way to introduce Egyptian Mythology(And probably other mythologies as well) to the audience in the game. 😊
Talk about convenience. 😂
@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl Have you skipped class or something because that's what it originated. It's been always been a part of history. I mean where did you think that the higher ups calls black people African-Americans,or even *Black* for that matter came from? From Africa. 😂
However,if you're referring to the modern day Black people,then... *SHEESH.* What planet do you live on? Because it's astounding that you even managed to come to this conclusion. Let alone thought of it.
Either way,both points,whether side you're going with or even sticking with is bad enough that it makes you look like an unorganized racist. 🤣
Read a book about your history dammit! HA! 😂🤣
@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl Coming from a guy who gets offended by a character skin color change in a *video game* no less. 😂
Even more for the fact that The God Of War Franchise has been 50-50 when it comes to the mythologies they're making their games(Or even Comics and Novels) from in terms of accuracy and non-accuracy.
So why even dare to take skin color seriously *AND* an issue? It's not even *THAT* important. Especially if you're making a video game where imagination runs free in games,even in mythologies. 🤣
The God Of War Games,Comics,and Novels had never been 100% Accurate when it comes to mythology,Greek,Norse,and even Egyptian. They've been somewhat accurate,while the rest of it that they just came up with just gave it a new spin on it so that it fits the narrative for Kratos' Story. 😅
@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl Huh. I actually got you mixed up with someone else. Sorry! 😅
And second,While I was weirded out at first about Angrboda,but looking at it at 2nd glance,I know what they're doing here: They're trying to introduce Egyptian Mythology to the God Of War Game,which is awesome! 😃
And third,I'm actually a Black American,and even *I* don't get offended,because I don't give a damn. 😂
I don't even focus on my nationality or even Ethnicity on that matter, because it'll just be a waste of time for me. I'd rather focus on wanting to achieve my dreams and focus on life in general instead of getting offended on something so small,like Identity Politics and all that crap.
Although I see what you're coming from,but even then,you shouldn't let that bother you dude. 😊
@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl yes well you’re a modem Arabic Egyptian. Ancient Egyptians are ethnically diverse and a hub for cultural exchanges from Greek, middle eastern, African etc…. The order of Medjay started as elite Nubians hired, considered so good they became a staple inclusive order of elite warriors to be the closest protectors of the Pharaoh
Hey Jimmy, I just wanted to say that I love your channel and your content, it's really interesting and entertaining.
Keep up the good work!
Greetings from a fellow historian (not a researcher though) from Italy!
The things people get worked up about never cease to surprise me. It’s a game and shouldn’t matter!! Have fun playing!!!
ngl at first I also assumed it was just a pandering move but the way you described it made a lot of sense, not just about how we don't actually have any physical description of her so it's not like they're deviating from history, but the thing about the theater casting, it made me reflect a lot.
In the vein of video games, have you ever considered making a video sharing your opinion about Bloodhound from Apex Legends? I can't think of any other game that does a 'vikings in space/futuristic vikings' theme and I think it would be really interesting to hear your thoughts as someone who actually understands the culture/history, since it's very different to the games/shows that try to depict actual historical vikings
I actually hadn't, but that's a really good shout. Thanks for the idea! Glad you enjoyed :)
@Glockjaw might wanna work on your reading comprehension champ
Was that the Rabbit of Caerbannog on your mug? I need one. *)
You know it's a good day when The Welsh Viking uploads. Precisely, you should hire the best actor for the role, no matter the person. Anyone that doesn't like that simply based on skin should sit down and shut up, the world is a wonderful and diverse place and they can get over it or go to Mars.
Mars would probably get diverse pretty quickly to, since currently no country has a monopoly on it...
Do you like brown skinned Starfire?
Reminds me of the whole controversy over MCU's Heimdall being Black
My answer to that is "Then show me a person with more gravitas than Idris Elba. He was amazing for the part."
Yes, he's supposed to be incredibly pale and they decided to do that. Very insulting as well.
really good video, bringing some sense into the conversation
Some days just aren't made for words😅 (I've barely moved myself). Having said that, you did pretty well after that rough start😉
I thank Jamie of The British History Podcast for dispelling me of any thought that everyone on every vikingr crew was Norse, or even white.
There were an impressive array of both land and sea trade routes - and therefore, people of any ethnicity could encounter a vikingr crew - since vikingrs are very connected to trade centres. They’ve got to sell the stuff they stole somewhere.
If someone had strength or skills that would benefit the crew. Why not take them on? The goal is fast, easy, money. Sure. Some individuals, or captains may have been bigoted against particular ethnicities, but I suspect “happened to be there when we needed someone, useful, and not a backstabbing pain in the arse” we’re more important qualifications.
Aah, I need that mug! Incredible.
...also, excellent video, as usual :)
My daughter and I were just discussing this. I shared this video with her. I hope she becomes a fan too.
You're not wrong about Christopher Judge, I could listen to that man all day.
My favourite line of his as Teal'c is "undomesticated equines could not remove me". Or the Jaffar joke about Setesh Guards.
For the love of gods! Can anyone explain that joke to me????!!!!???
So glad you have the bunny mug as I spotted it and thought of sending one to you. Great minds think alike. Also, Angrboða rocks!
You're awesome 👌, just wanted you to know that 😉 a laugh everyday is what I needed.
Right on. :) nice little vid and high five for the scary bunnies mug . :)
I went to see a play featuring a family of five. Mother, blue-eyed blonde sounded eastern european, father brown-hair and eyes and vaguely home counties, eldest son an Irish redhead, middle son south-london asian, little sister nigerian. It's theatre, that's the resident ensemble, so everyone just goes with it. I've also seen a dude in his 50s playing a naughty schoolboy opposite a 20-something teacher. Like, the room is a painted curtain and sometimes people are reacting to ABSOLUTELY NOTHING but skin colour is the part you struggle with? Get out of the theatre.
Thank you for this video. I have been saying exactly what you said in this video to other people ever since this whole god of war going woke bs started.
aaaayy denzel washington as don pedro!! lovely reference.
and thank you for speaking up on this and other difficult topics. it's super important! people are really out of touch, some don't even realise it's racist to be so pick-and-choosy about what kind of accuracy they're getting mad at. and others are just... ew. so the more people online point out it's not ok to make a ruckus over a fictional character being black, the better. thank you!
Thanks for the video always great to watch. I can't wait to play the new game myself.
Thoroughly enjoyed! You are so right! You Rock (and I love your medieval bunny mug)!
Okay that is the coolest thumb injury story I've ever heard. Driving a steam train. As you do.
Great video, completely agree. But also, AMAZING kickass bunny mug, man.
I'm norse pagan. I have been told she has pale skin. However am I bothered about this whole thing. No not really I will admit I was shocked but like you said it was interpretation. She's a jotun for all we know there could have been black jotun but we don't know (though typically they are known to have pale ice like skin so her being a tint of blue does make sense however darker skin is a possibility) . A great example of a black person playing a norse god is idris elba. He played heimdallr in the marvel films and I thought his interpretation was excellent. My answer to people kicking off over her being black is stop being self righteous about stuff you know little about. If you don't like it don't buy the game but I think you'll be a fool if you don't
“Fat Thor” caused me to have a discussion with my therapist as it triggered my anorexia and other body/mental health issues, so: Thank You for calling it out
Well put, Sir. I don't understand how people misinterpreted your last video as a stab at us fattys - at no point do I think it can even be argued that was even alluded to in your talk - I can say from my own point of view you were very clear what you meant when you were speaking of the lazy costume for Thor - it was a lazily thought out by the creators, not a 'lazy Thor' - that was very clear.
I have absolutely no truck with people who fuss over this person from that game being whatever colour and that is all I have to say about that.
Also, hi to your hair, which seems to be going its own way today and good on it 😉 And I would run you over to snatch your bunny cup - that cup is wonderful and I love it beyond all things!
Absolutely! Spot on!!
Christopher Judge will always be Teal'c to me, but he does do an amazing Kratos. Such a beautiful voice. ❤ He was a Jaffa, not a Goa'uld. :)
The whole bitching about actors or characters having the "wrong" skin color... There's nothing to argue over, really. Travelling far and wide isn't a recent thing; Set of the Egyptian pantheon was described as a god of foreigners who is more "wild" than the other gods with red hair (and I heard somewhere green eyes, but I don't think this is accurate) and Thoth was in some stories said to have come from elsewhere.
I don't remember Angrboda (I don't know how to make the proper character) being described with any particular skin tone, but that doesn't mean a fictional interpretation of her can't be black. It's a beautiful depiction of her and this is going to sound weird, but I think the visage of a black woman suits what little we know of her objective personality. Objective personality as in what can be discerned of the mythological jotunn's personality separate from the subjective, very Aesir lens we see the myths through, which is then passed through a Christian lens.
Come to think of it, I think that's what the GOW devs have been trying to do, bypass the historically accepted lenses we look at myths through while trying other possible lenses. Though the Christian sources that remain to us seem to have tried to make light of it, you can see the perception lens shift back and forth in the telling of Loki's story. You can even see Loki's own perception change when the Aesir kidnap his and Angrboda's three children. He's no longer dicking around for the hell of it or at the behest of people he's "adopted" as his own, he's out for blood or at least revenge.
Why the hell can't I flap my jowls about Angrboda without bringing up Loki?
Here's my text wall complete with paragraphs. This is a nod to a comment by Cato a little further down that I responded to earlier. :)
Just read Valsif's comment further down and (insert preferred pronoun here) reminded me of what I had forgotten to mention here pre-edit. Feel free to wander down and find the one about Aegir and Ran's daughters being Heimdallr's mothers.
Susinct, all we needed on that topic :)
Although I would hapily watch some more valhiem playthrough to talk about the design at higher levels ^_^ just saying : p
p.s. swift healing to your thub
In the episode when Teal'c is dying and shares the symbiont with Bra'tac, he speaks in his normal voice. Totally threw me off. Excellent episode. I think I took on his voice inflections for a few days after I binged 3 seasons over winter break one year. Only my friends who watched the show understood. Good fun.
I NEED that mug! My brother-in-arms is a historian, loves the medieval era (focuses on Roman period, but still loves him some medieval knights and such), and uses a rabbit as his crest for reenactments. I must gift him a mug like this!
Oh, and he is "addicted" to his coffee.
Just an awesome video. No matter color as long as they play the character well then they're doing awesome. She looks amazing. Great, successful acting.
No matter color (btw race is more than color) when you make a character, however when you take one that already exists and even has cultural significance and spit all over it, that's insulting and should be called out as it has.
I need a link for the "bunny mug", please & thank you ! 😊
I may be wrong on this, but don't the Jötnar in the sagas often have varying appearances? So that could potentially leave more room for interpretation by the developers than just going by colorblind casting.
They are supernatural beings. They have pretty much all kind of shapes, forms and sizes, not all of which are humanoid.
You are right. Also, Angrboda is the mother of Fenrir and Jörmagandur. So, in the minds of the whining people, it's within reason that she gave birth to awolf and a serpent, but she can't be black.
My two cents in this, it's a fantasy game and a fun re imagining of the norse myths (which, by the way, is part of my heritage being Swedish).
Why do I love the chaos of the beginning so much lol
I love your hair today.
Plenty of tea.
I pronounce Kratos the way you do because he is Greek. I don't americanise people's name, unless their name is indeed American. That is also true for brand names and companies, like I pronounce Adidas the way Germans do (I mean, I think almost all brits pronounce it the way Germans do? idk)
Also, I love Angrboða's depiction here, nothing to complain about. Especially after your argument of, "There have never been any description of Angrboða's appearance details anyway." But I have to admit it was a bit shocking. I've always imagined a Jötunn to be pale bluish in colour with coarse white hair. But I guess it was just a dumb prejudice of mine.
Also, this is the first time I've ever heard the term "Color-blind Casting." That's such an interesting thing to know. Thank you!
Aaaaaand landsknecht are being mentioned! Drink up!
Also, again straight ( hehe) and to the point! Top notch for the delivery))
I keep hearing "saucepan" in the opening tune
Eh, I mean it's more like the Jotunn were from another realm. They've been depicted in various ways over various media as well as what we have of Norse myth, which shows that they have no solid form, so they could be white, black, blue, green, whatever. Though some of the same folks are clamoring that Thor was blonde when he was clearly depicted as a redhead, and ripped drinking beer and eating full oxen for supper every day. People are just trippin, the Santa Monica team's doing well.
About color-blind casting, I love the cast of Hamilton! Best actors and actresses I’ve ever seen! And I’m so glad they were chosen!! Their portrayals were so on point that it took no time at all to see the characters through them. ❤
ΚΡΑΤΟΣ as you correctly pronounced it, means Power. Later it came to mean also ''the power of the state'' and state itself. So today in Greece (which actually is properly called ''Hellas'' btw) if you want for example to refer to the state (country) of France, you say (sorry for the capital letters, but I think most people are more familiar with them) TO KΡΑΤΟΣ ΤΗΣ ΓΑΛΛΙΑΣ (to kratos tis Gallias). There is a series of names comming from the etymological root of Kratos. For example ''Krateros'' (powerfull).
Personally I dont mind colorblind casting when it comes to theater or media inspired by mythological or historical sources. The more artistic license the more accepting I am. I mean you have a movie like ''The Warriors'' trasporting Xenophon's Anabasis, into late 70's american gang wars. You could have a post apocalyptic setting for Antigone, or an epic space opera about the siege of space station Ilion. And in that context it would be perfectly fine to cast anyone. Where I draw the line is in productions that aim to at least look ''historical''. For example you go and build more or less believable sets, get decent costumes, bring in an army of extras, reproductions of historical accurate props, hundreds of horses, to the point of making a believable world. And then you go and make a ''colorblind'' cast and fuck up any sort of immersion you where struggling for. Because the production as a whole looks too real and any oddities will stand out like a sore thumb. For example, sorry you cant cast a black Achilles, when we have a specific description about his looks. At the same time not including Memnon who could be black probably says more about the production's motives. Cheap shock value.
I wouldnt mind at all a black Kratos. Its basically a fantasy game extremely loosely inspired by hellenic mythology. I do agree with you on your point of a black woman being ''exotic'' from a norse pov. Its exactly why many of the Gods and Heroes of hellenic mythology are blonde or blue eyed. It was something quite rare. In fact up until very recently it was still rare. Today you might find more fair haired people due to the massive immigration from the ex-eastern bloc countries, but up until the mid 90's, boy you could have the face of a rat but if you were natural blonde with blue eyes, chances were that you would have great success flirting wise.
Personally though if I called the shots in Angrboda's design, I would go for an otherwordly look of a character that you could not place in todays ethnic boundaries. Like James Earl Jones' Thulsa Doom appearence in Conan the Barbarian. He was black with straight hair and blue eyes, looking so different (and perhaps mystical/ancient) from anyone around him.
Angrboda the wolf mother, high chisel cheek bones with yellow eyes. Since it is a video game have her with shifting skin tones to different shades of wolf pelts. Along with her breathing like a dog/wolf or sounding like a husky talking. Doesn't help that they used a young woman when Angrboda is refer to as a mother of many children, she should show some age.
A refreshing take. I was kind of disappointed with Metatron's recent complaints about diversity.
I think diversity really depends. Games - go ahead, I'm happy and laughing at right-wing feckers' outrage. Fantasy stuff - I'm happy. But history stuff, like in the Vikings series (I think the continuations) where a jarl, a Scandinavian man, was was made into a black woman, is just silly. If I'm watching something that's trying portray a historical period, it's highly preferrable they stick to how they looked in the day. For example, if someone makes a serious drama about Ivan the Terrible, it would be silly if he would be portrayed as a black actor, and his wives would be closet lesbians.
@@pavelstaravoitau7106 Do you hold other aspects of historical accuracy to the same standards?
Clothes? Hair styles? Tattoos? Interactions across different social classes? Food? Architecture? Depictions of religious believes and practices? Women wearing modern makeup?
@@pavelstaravoitau7106 Right-wing or not, if you're Scandinavian (like me) and don't see anything wrong with this, keeping in mind how we're spouting cultural appropriation every 2 seconds, then you simply lack self-respect. Also, there seems to be a trend against redheads specifically, no European with dignity should bend for the sake of a little entertainment.
A positive from this is once more leftists feckers hypocrisy on full display, so there's that at least.
@@occupyvenus4868 yes, actually. I'd prefer hairstyles and clothes be accurate too. I'd prefer as accurate as possible, unlike many modern film-makers and other creative positions.
Not to say that I think there's no place at all for PoC. In a historical setting I'm happy with them being travellers, merchants (imagine Viking Age Dublin), and some unfortunate souls that could have ended up in Scandinavia through slavery, along with slaves from other ethnic groups throughout Europe. I absolutely love cultures coming together and interacting in history. Aside from the Viking Age, I always found a story of a black person ending up in 17th Russia to be a fascinating concept, one we also have a historical basis for.
@@pavelstaravoitau7106 the Jarl is not a black woman, she is a mixed race woman, her grandfather returned from the middle east with a black wife. The thing about history is it's never what you think it is. One of Ivans wives was what today would be considered a lesbian. Anastasia zakharyina Yurleva. Her brother would found the Romanov dynasty . Peter the Great would go on to adopt a black African boy and make him a Russian Prince, the great Russian General Ganibal, who of course was Pushkin's grand father. The problem with telling world history is that 19th century Victorian's decided to erase black people from it. Today we dig up skeletons of African Roman soldiers in Wales, and everyone is shocked , when in reality no one should be, the Romans have frescos of black soldiers on their walls,at least one should have been assigned to Britain. Conversely the Caucasian imagination can, has and does place them anywhere in the world at any time period and usually at the center of the transpiring events. One would be shocked to discover that Europeans we're a global minority for most of human history by the historical representation they have allowed themselves.
They probably should’ve gone with making her look Scandinavian
But I do think her design is really pretty
There are black Scandinavians
@@TheWelshViking ik
Just not back then
@@TheWelshViking This is before the Romans even
But don’t take it to think I don’t like the design,
I do.
It’s just not accurate to the time this is set in
@@TheWelshViking As I said
It’s inaccurate to the time it’s set in,
But it is very far from a bad design
My whole thought process in the last weeks was this:
1. Ooooh who is this girl at the end of the trailer? She looks so cute! Also cool to have a dark-skinned character in a norse-themed game!! Love that!
2. Oh, this is Angrboða? Hell yeah! Wait...wait...all the norse gods are white, but Angrboða, the "evil witch" who births Loki's "monstrous children" is the one they made a person of color? Hmm....kinda racist
3. Then again, Kratos and Atreus go against the gods so those are the bad guys in GoW, and Atreus is Loki and Angrboða is gonna be on our side and possibly already his love interest(?), so guess it's not racist if the whole narrative is flipped.
4. Thor and Angrboða character designs are cool as hel and I'm excited for the game. :D
A vast number of people need to realize that fictional media is fictitious, meaning a white actor in a Thor costume, and a black actor in the same costume, are both equally, to the same degree, not actually Thor.
Then they can proceed to grow the hell up.
I know nothing about the game or its historicity (or not, heck the reason I'm here is to learn about a culture I'm fascinated by), but the character looks absolutely badass and a black actress suits the look *perfectly*.
What I don't get is people are getting pissy about this but not that Loki was fathered by a Greek god or that that under the ashes of his murdered family that Greek god is black. People are crazy man
Hmm.. more like Tan-ish brown than black but I get your point.
@@metamind8674 I put that down to the lighting in the 1 scene we ever see him without the ash. In concept art at the time he is shown to be black or at the very least he isn't ethnically white. This is why I am convinced that the people who are complaining about angrboda have never played a god of war game and have no intention of playing one.
@@tehCostHD I mean he is though. Go play god of war 1 before you say stupid shit like that. Seriously all you are doing is proving my point that the people complaint about the race of angrboda have not played the first 3 games also you do know that a black man and a white woman can have a child that is still white in appearance right? Like not only do albino people but those born from "mixed" relationships can be born with "white" skin in fact in one rather famous case a woman had a set of twins and one was born with white skin pigment and the other was born with black skin pigment. The idea that a child born of a mixed relationship will be born darker skinned is a myth that originates in old propaganda against interracial marriage.
I knew the beads would please you!! 😂
you have taught us that this is the authentic look for female look in the Vikings age.
Thanks for all your information man ❤️❤️
I do not agree with everything in this video, but it was still very interesting to se.
I couldn't help it....love you jimmy...all in good jest my man...get better
Where did you get the bunny mug from????? I didn’t know I needed a bunny mug till now!!!!
I might be going on a video binge so commenting years after this was published...but i now NEED a medieval bunny mug!
I still can’t remember where it’s from! I need to do a deep dive down this violent rabbithole
I've heard so many people say it's racebending Angrboda, but like she is not human in the myths??? Jötunns were literally born out of armpits of Ymir, I'm pretty sure they don't have same methods of passing down genes of skin color as we do. And I think the fact that she gives birth to all the weird children also kinda shows that? Like genetics don't mean a shit in the world of Norse mythology :'D And I think she's been described vaguely as "ugly and shapeless" so like why are they not mad about she being so pretty??
So... this might be GoW devs interpreting LITERALLY the fact that Hel (the goddess) is described as being half black (or blue but translators always change this to black). Half black on ONE SIDE OF HER BODY, but still.
I love Jimmy, one of many reasons is that he cares how you pronounce things! I dated a Greek for a long time, and have a lasting love of the Greek language, and boy oh boy I get worked up when people mispronounce Scandinavian words but Greek gets butchered just as much by those darn dasky English speakers
First nine mothers.. what?! I need to do more research. Second I think the whole thing is awesome
I actually thought she was Inuit like Katara at first
I have two things to say.
1. I pronounce Kratos the way you do because I was teached to do that by the german dub of GoW. Same goes for all the other greek names witch were pronounced not english in germany.
2. Angrboda is a Jötun, a mystical creature in north mythology. You can show her how ever the hell you want. No on called the police when she had blue skin in AC Valhalla. Being black skined and have a named that means 'the one who brings grief', is kind of strange don't you think?
Can Starfire be black skinned?
@@thetruthroomwherenothingis4979 You're talking about the DC Character right? Why not? What would speak against it? She is not realy white but, as I sad fictional characters have no limits how they could appear in different works.
I couldn't play GOW in german. Nobody says BOY like Christopher Judge. Well, maybe the guy from Phantasm, but i digress....
@@seb24789 You can't compare JUNGE with BOY. But yes I see your point, nevertheless Tobias Brecklinghaus did a good job for Kratos in the german cast, in my opinion.
I agree with everything you have just said and I luv the bunny mug.
Snort, Thank You for another excellent video.
SG-1 Fangirling? A1 ☆☆☆☆☆ always appreciated.
Doesn't matter a humans gender, color, derivation etc... we all breathe the same air and all bleed the blood of our ancestors.
We honor them by our actions or disgrace them by our words. You Sir, are honorable.
Hugs, from Minnesota USA.
I've always love Teal'c!! *joins in with squealing*
I love the direction the team have taken with this Norse God of War. I don't know if it's just me but most of the time (let me emphasize that I don't mean always, but most times), if there is something evil or dangerous to be portrayed, it's always black or Dark pigmented. You need a evil dangerous werewolf, make it black. You need a new breed of orcs that are stronger, more evil and dangerous (Lord of the Rings), make it black. The titans in the immortals were black.
You portray your villains and antagonist as black or dark and no one bats an eye, but you decide to make one hero and protagonist black or dark and everyone f*cking loses their minds.
I know our ancestors evolved to identify the darkness as dangerous because with poor visibility we become easy prey for predators, but not every thing dark is bad.
Not gonna lie, when I first saw the dark elves attacking the defenseless light elves I thought the director was doing the same thing but when I heard the possibility that Kratos had aided the wrong side it just made me happy. I think I read somewhere that it was intentionally done that way.
So yeah, I can understand people being offended on behalf of Norse people but like he said, there is no clear description of her skin colour so the creators have freedom to do what they like.
I believe this might be a case of what enabled our ancestors to survive has now become detrimental to our survival. I am telling you, if aliens suddenly show up and they black or dark pigmented we are attacking them, no questions asked. Maybe that's why they are still avoiding us.
Its interesting u say this, some people lose their minds if there are non-enslaved blacks among say norse folk but if there are enslaved blacks they are ok. Even blacks whether enslaved or not are almost unheard of among the Norse. So the issue is usually not the blacks themselves rather their role.
So correct me if I’m wrong, did you just compare black people to evil orcs? Nobody sees orcs with grayscale black skin and thinks “Oh look, black people,” that sounds like something a racist would do, if YOU see evil orcs and dark elves and think, “Ah yes because of their grayish-black skin, monstrous features and evil nature, I think of black people,” then I think you got some of your own problems to work out, the rest of us just see mythical, fictional creatures
@@tommytommy4899 several groups of racists do indeed picture orcs, easterlings and haradrim as non-whites.
Tolkien didnt intednd for that though.
@@a.m928 Your talking about 1% of the population that sees orcs that way, there’s always gonna be racists that exist in this world and they’re not going anywhere. Don’t try to to turn a non-issue into an issue like these racists are running rampant lol
Teal'c...Yes!! Loved Stargate. Thanks, once again, Jimmy, for telling people to get over themselves.
as someone else has commented, James Earl Jones was the voice of Darth Vader
And yes, do tell us where the medieval bunny mug cones from
I mean, it's nice to see clothing and architecture inspired by what we know of real history. And if this was an attempt to present norse culture in a particular period as accurately as possible (like in a museum), then yeah a prominent black character would be strange. But this isn't history, it's fantasy. And there are so many other aspects of the game (like the clothing and the architecture) that have nothing to do with the culture or period. So the fact that this is where people draw the line... It's a bit like when people scoff at the athletic feats of female action heroines, as if the athletic feats of male action heroes are completely realistic... We all know what those people are really upset about.
Love this guy