EDIT: What are the odds that I release a video on ammo, of all things, only to have a blostpost about ammo funnel release the same day? Funny, isn't it. Anyway, everything I say in the video was true at the time of release, the blogpost dropped 3 hours or so after I released the video. Wouldn't be a video from me if there wasn't a small error I don't notice until the video goes live... 04:39 has the skill be called 'Ammo Funnel 2.0', I meant to write 'Replenish 2.0', I have no clue how that one slipped me.
What’s funny is PD:TH was doing what PD3 is trying to do, except way better despite being a decade older PD:TH is all about staying in cover and not overextending, but ammo pickups constantly force you out of cover to get them Not only does this pair well with the old armor system where it’s all about losing health as punishment for poor play or using health as a currency of sorts to do things you otherwise couldn’t, it gives ammo bags a use- you can place it somewhere you know you’ll be defending in depth to save yourself some trips We have truly learned nothing
It should be noted that while ammo pick-ups are now instanced, they are generally giving far less in comparision to what they did in PD1 and PD2, basically to compensate for the instanced ammo now being a thing. And personally, I think that it's an improvement, as I remember it being way too common at times, where in PD2, I was low on ammo and couldn't get any pickups because my teammates all ate them in front of me. Meaning I couldn't kill cops myself to get some back, relying more on teammates to get ammo drops, which they ate before I could, ect. That is, of course, if I didn't also pick one of the weapons that could nearly one-shot most cops, making ammo a non-issue for most of the game anyways. And with ammo bags in PD3 also pulling double duty as a reliable way to gain throwables back as well, they're always going to have some use for every build. And PD2 did rely on the lazy "just double health" method to balance things, which ended up causing Death Wish and especially Death Sentence to be "Meta or fuck off"-difficulties that just killed the fun (alongside also reducing the headshot multiplier. So the set from Overkill to Death Wish didn't just double the cops health, it effectively quadrupled it - with Mayhem and Death Sentence only making it worse when they came out), which makes me VERY glad that they didn't go for that route in PD3 at all.
To recap .. launch was a disaster, the unlock system was a disaster, first paid DLC over priced disaster, community first event was dumpsters 🔥 + med bag update started to fix things but wait, hold on let's fix that with a nerf.. 😂 oh you got to love the consistency
Just sayin the Skill tree is SEVERELY flawed as it has extremely strong crutch perks along with extremely useless perks that dont change the gameplay but rather makes it harder to get Trifecta buffs back and etc.
I agree with you massively! At some point I'm wanting to make a big video on skills, because in it's current state the 1-skill-point-per-skill with flat lines leads to a lot of issues. (Minmaxxing is even easier, some skills are worth way more than 1 point etc)
The whole balancing of the game is in complete shambles imo, however to stay on the topic of ammo; Whilst it is generally no problem to get enough ammo in a full player lobby, the absolute god-awful weapon balancing shines through when you are playing solo, or in a 2-3 player lobby with mates with sub-optimal builds, just having fun. Someone looking at the game and seeing the mk14 one shot cops to the body whilst the northwest b9 requires 4 fckin headshots to kill a single dude and going "yeah, this is ok." is baffling to me. There is a clear winner in every single weapon category of the game that makes the other weapons completely obsolete, the new g3 is just a better scar with no recoil and so on. With the imbalance between weapons and the damage they deal, higher damage dealing weapons that can one shot are always favoured in this game. I have tried countless builds trying to play with some of the worse guns in the game and it just isn't fun to play with them. The enemies just soak up bullets with low damage dealing weapons and you cannot get enough ammo to make your time worthwhile if you are playing solo. I don't know, there are a lot of issues with the game currently that I'd like to get off my chest, but I don't plan to waste more time and energy by writing a long-ass essay if this wasn't already considered one lol.
high grain would be cool if the ammo bag was used for actually gaining ammo instead of a buff thats mostly useless and can be replaced by other skills/strats
I think an interesting difficulty tweak related to ammo would be to reduce the total ammo of weapons, the higher the difficulty. The ammo bag could in turn provide some sort of overheal, where you gain twice your maximum total ammo when you use it simmilar to adrenaline. Ammo drops could not then get you back to the increased state of ammo capacity, only ammo bags.
Ngl i thought that is what PD3 wanted to do, since you never start with full ammo in game, but pickups allow you to go above what you started with. It could work but my only issue is wanting the difficulties to all play by same rules rather while having higher tension than having specific rules that player has to adapt, so perhaps have such change apply to all difficulties, and then work on other solutions to make ammo managment a priority on higher diffs.
bro predicted today's blog post and called for a replenish nerf like a prophet Good video! The current state of ammo could definitely use some changes so I'm glad you sparked this conversation up. It shows me that today's blog post (replenish and ammo funnel nerf) has more merit when there are other people talking about it.
I don’t mind the ammo situation atm. It sucks when I started. I ran out of ammo on hard difficulty 💀. But now I can breeze thru overkill without ammo being an issue other than the start of road rage. I think the issue is just the tankiness of police. Why do I need to mag dump with an AR to kill one guy. I get yeah aim for head but the aiming on pc feels odd
I rarely go loud but that is a big thing I've noticed from 2 to 3. In 2 on the higher difficulties I had to use specific guns so I didn't run out, while in 3 I don't think I've had that issue regardless of gun or difficulty
Man I have been occasionally playing since launch, I don't think I have ever ran out of ammo once since the best secondaries are usually revolvers you can just one tap a guy and get like 5-10 rounds and your revolver shot back immediately
Ammo is scarce in payday 2 and armor is scarce in payday 3. I don’t know I think people just don’t like it because it’s different. Running out of ammo in an FPS isn’t fun.
the problem isnt running out of ammo, the problem is having full ammo and needing to spray my gun so i can walk over pickups to refill my overcooked flashbangs
What about having skills in the ammo bag tree that makes your ammo type more powerful, like incendiary rounds, electric rounds or high explosive rounds, like interacting with a ammo bag turns your ammo type to X mode for 30 seconds or make it last for X bullets
You are a noob. Ammo bags are great in stealth for the ability to restock on knifes to lure guards away. Replenish aka ammo Funnel. Is also Balance. Because the game has Permanent Armor Damage. If you want to change a skill mabye have the ammo dropped by dead cops go into the ammo bag then have the bag be able to put down the ammo boxes found in the lockers. Working with the new pick up skill we currently have. I am happy they reverted on the idea of the change. This video gets to do.
While I agree it is a bit of an issue, I don't agree with all the suggestions you mention here. I disagree with your ammo funnel 2.0 suggestion because if you look at the bigger picture, that just nerfs the long range weapons like the DMR and snipers. And I argue PD2 did have a similar skill for these long range weapons in ammo efficiency, even if they are not as powerful as what we have in ammo funnel right now. 10% reduction on higher difficulty doesn't really work because the ammo pickup for all of the guns is between 1-9, meaning even at the highest pickup, you need a minimum reduction of 11% but that just nerf the highest pickup SMGs. Then you got to consider guns like R900 which only has 1-2 ammo pick up and you simply can't reduce the pickup or you will start getting 0 pickup. Finally FYI, you copied the timestamps from your armor video in your description.
...shit I forgot to remove that, I usually copy paste a lot of description text, thanks for that lol But yeah, I appreciate you sharing your ideas, I will admit that all of my ideas aren't completely perfect (more holes than swiss cheese in a shooting range lol) so it is always nice to get other people's inputs and opinions on them.
Maybe if you make a video about talking about skills they’ll start removing skills But for real I hope you talk about it and share some insights. As a day one hater of the entire skill system I’ve gone through so many debates with friends who just don’t get it and just dip out of the conversation when I get into the details or pull up some numbers. Like how poorly designed skills and heists are tidally locked to each other. I think it disproportionately doesn’t get talked about enough compared to its detrimental effects on the game.
It seemed like a minor issue to me at first, but when I started to look deeper into it it made me realise how much of the game feels unnescessarily weird and easy.
Good video i never thought how much ammo I was getting during heists because, well yeah I've never run out its too easy to get and its way to much per drop maybe they can tweak drop rates making ammo a lot rarer, so even with the funnel ability so that its a concern but not the top priority, I would suggest dropping it to low numbers but because of lack of alternatives to guns (aka no melee and overkill weapon's not always being on standby) it would be good to have it on 30-45% drop chance per cop rather then 100, or so it feels like 100 if they add more ways of attacks cops say melee that's useful or better secondary's, I'm not saying the ones in game right now are bad but they are certainly lacking, then maybe ammo drops can go down to 10-25% drop chance with perks to increase it. anyway lovely video I'm leaving a like
1. I made this video before the Ammo Funnel blogpost 2. I hate the ammo funnel change as much as the next guy 3. The game isn't that hard bruh replenish is OP as SHIT it deserves a nerf
EDIT: What are the odds that I release a video on ammo, of all things, only to have a blostpost about ammo funnel release the same day? Funny, isn't it. Anyway, everything I say in the video was true at the time of release, the blogpost dropped 3 hours or so after I released the video.
Wouldn't be a video from me if there wasn't a small error I don't notice until the video goes live...
04:39 has the skill be called 'Ammo Funnel 2.0', I meant to write 'Replenish 2.0', I have no clue how that one slipped me.
Thank god they reverted it.
What’s funny is PD:TH was doing what PD3 is trying to do, except way better despite being a decade older
PD:TH is all about staying in cover and not overextending, but ammo pickups constantly force you out of cover to get them
Not only does this pair well with the old armor system where it’s all about losing health as punishment for poor play or using health as a currency of sorts to do things you otherwise couldn’t, it gives ammo bags a use- you can place it somewhere you know you’ll be defending in depth to save yourself some trips
We have truly learned nothing
yeah i get what pd3 wants to be, but you dont add a fuckin slide feature and not expect me to rampage through cops
No, we didn't learn nothing. We actively forgot
I sacrificed the goat, what next?
My chupacabra associates will be in contact with you shortly.
@@cookiedou3 I'll be on the lookout!
how much did you have to upset the gods to completely ruin ammo funnel lmao
@@TheKknowleyBut did you put in the muriatic acid, caustic soda and hydrogen chloride?
It should be noted that while ammo pick-ups are now instanced, they are generally giving far less in comparision to what they did in PD1 and PD2, basically to compensate for the instanced ammo now being a thing.
And personally, I think that it's an improvement, as I remember it being way too common at times, where in PD2, I was low on ammo and couldn't get any pickups because my teammates all ate them in front of me. Meaning I couldn't kill cops myself to get some back, relying more on teammates to get ammo drops, which they ate before I could, ect.
That is, of course, if I didn't also pick one of the weapons that could nearly one-shot most cops, making ammo a non-issue for most of the game anyways.
And with ammo bags in PD3 also pulling double duty as a reliable way to gain throwables back as well, they're always going to have some use for every build.
And PD2 did rely on the lazy "just double health" method to balance things, which ended up causing Death Wish and especially Death Sentence to be "Meta or fuck off"-difficulties that just killed the fun (alongside also reducing the headshot multiplier. So the set from Overkill to Death Wish didn't just double the cops health, it effectively quadrupled it - with Mayhem and Death Sentence only making it worse when they came out), which makes me VERY glad that they didn't go for that route in PD3 at all.
tldr: mio is a awful game designer
Who’s mío?
@@christophermoore6110 the lead dev/ game designer of payday 3
To some degree, I'm convinced just being the game designer of a PAYDAY game is just cursed. Jules, Denka and now Mio.
@@cookiedou3 goldfarb noises
To recap .. launch was a disaster, the unlock system was a disaster, first paid DLC over priced disaster, community first event was dumpsters 🔥 + med bag update started to fix things but wait, hold on let's fix that with a nerf.. 😂 oh you got to love the consistency
Just sayin the Skill tree is SEVERELY flawed as it has extremely strong crutch perks along with extremely useless perks that dont change the gameplay but rather makes it harder to get Trifecta buffs back and etc.
I agree with you massively! At some point I'm wanting to make a big video on skills, because in it's current state the 1-skill-point-per-skill with flat lines leads to a lot of issues. (Minmaxxing is even easier, some skills are worth way more than 1 point etc)
@@cookiedou3 You should try a build with Pain Asymbolia and Threat assessment along with Death kneel and youll see how overpowered Adrenaline is!
This aged more than a forgotten bottle of Red 😭
Just my luck that on the day I drop a video about ammo, they release one of the most controversial blogposts lol
@@cookiedou3 I mean it’s fine now…
Wait what happened?
@@Griffonki The core skills of this build got completely reworked in an update. After loads of community backlash it was reverted.
@@KookyC cringe!
The whole balancing of the game is in complete shambles imo, however to stay on the topic of ammo; Whilst it is generally no problem to get enough ammo in a full player lobby, the absolute god-awful weapon balancing shines through when you are playing solo, or in a 2-3 player lobby with mates with sub-optimal builds, just having fun. Someone looking at the game and seeing the mk14 one shot cops to the body whilst the northwest b9 requires 4 fckin headshots to kill a single dude and going "yeah, this is ok." is baffling to me. There is a clear winner in every single weapon category of the game that makes the other weapons completely obsolete, the new g3 is just a better scar with no recoil and so on. With the imbalance between weapons and the damage they deal, higher damage dealing weapons that can one shot are always favoured in this game. I have tried countless builds trying to play with some of the worse guns in the game and it just isn't fun to play with them. The enemies just soak up bullets with low damage dealing weapons and you cannot get enough ammo to make your time worthwhile if you are playing solo. I don't know, there are a lot of issues with the game currently that I'd like to get off my chest, but I don't plan to waste more time and energy by writing a long-ass essay if this wasn't already considered one lol.
high grain would be cool if the ammo bag was used for actually gaining ammo instead of a buff thats mostly useless and can be replaced by other skills/strats
agreed high grain should give u like 60 or more ap ammo instead of a measly buff
I'm sorry but I must do this, THEY'RE MAGS NOT CLIPS!
🤓
"Three ways to get ammo"
- Dead Cops
- Loot around the map
- Ammo Bags
- Skills
... Three?
I always forget Mag Throw is actually a skill in this game lol, nice eye for detail on that one
Payday3 ammo bag.
**Squint eyes**
Ordinace bag 2.0
I think an interesting difficulty tweak related to ammo would be to reduce the total ammo of weapons, the higher the difficulty. The ammo bag could in turn provide some sort of overheal, where you gain twice your maximum total ammo when you use it simmilar to adrenaline. Ammo drops could not then get you back to the increased state of ammo capacity, only ammo bags.
That's actually a very interesting idea, thanks for sharing that!
Ngl i thought that is what PD3 wanted to do, since you never start with full ammo in game, but pickups allow you to go above what you started with. It could work but my only issue is wanting the difficulties to all play by same rules rather while having higher tension than having specific rules that player has to adapt, so perhaps have such change apply to all difficulties, and then work on other solutions to make ammo managment a priority on higher diffs.
bro predicted today's blog post and called for a replenish nerf like a prophet
Good video! The current state of ammo could definitely use some changes so I'm glad you sparked this conversation up. It shows me that today's blog post (replenish and ammo funnel nerf) has more merit when there are other people talking about it.
I was genuinely so suprised to see the blog post today be about ammo, I fear Almir himself may be spying on me
I don’t mind the ammo situation atm. It sucks when I started. I ran out of ammo on hard difficulty 💀. But now I can breeze thru overkill without ammo being an issue other than the start of road rage. I think the issue is just the tankiness of police. Why do I need to mag dump with an AR to kill one guy. I get yeah aim for head but the aiming on pc feels odd
I rarely go loud but that is a big thing I've noticed from 2 to 3. In 2 on the higher difficulties I had to use specific guns so I didn't run out, while in 3 I don't think I've had that issue regardless of gun or difficulty
Man I have been occasionally playing since launch, I don't think I have ever ran out of ammo once since the best secondaries are usually revolvers you can just one tap a guy and get like 5-10 rounds and your revolver shot back immediately
I came from the kknowley video about ammo funnel.
congrats on the 1k subs, get that cash
Ammo is scarce in payday 2 and armor is scarce in payday 3. I don’t know I think people just don’t like it because it’s different. Running out of ammo in an FPS isn’t fun.
And they just announced they are nerfing ammo funnel great
the monkeys paw curls once more
I think the main problems for all 3 deployable is that the favors only have 2, I think the deployable should be max out version.
the problem isnt running out of ammo, the problem is having full ammo and needing to spray my gun so i can walk over pickups to refill my overcooked flashbangs
What about having skills in the ammo bag tree that makes your ammo type more powerful, like incendiary rounds, electric rounds or high explosive rounds, like interacting with a ammo bag turns your ammo type to X mode for 30 seconds or make it last for X bullets
Even if they wanted to make this change we all know they'll just mess it up like they have with everything in this game
Sad but true, especially with the ammo funnel change :/
You are a noob.
Ammo bags are great in stealth for the ability to restock on knifes to lure guards away.
Replenish aka ammo Funnel. Is also Balance. Because the game has Permanent Armor Damage.
If you want to change a skill mabye have the ammo dropped by dead cops go into the ammo bag then have the bag be able to put down the ammo boxes found in the lockers. Working with the new pick up skill we currently have.
I am happy they reverted on the idea of the change. This video gets to do.
congratulations on 1000 subs chief, production process has greatly evolved since you started, shit looks good
Praying for Jack of all trades
mio saw this video and listened for once
it is genuinely spooky I released this video and the blogpost about ammo funnel dropped today
While I agree it is a bit of an issue, I don't agree with all the suggestions you mention here.
I disagree with your ammo funnel 2.0 suggestion because if you look at the bigger picture, that just nerfs the long range weapons like the DMR and snipers. And I argue PD2 did have a similar skill for these long range weapons in ammo efficiency, even if they are not as powerful as what we have in ammo funnel right now.
10% reduction on higher difficulty doesn't really work because the ammo pickup for all of the guns is between 1-9, meaning even at the highest pickup, you need a minimum reduction of 11% but that just nerf the highest pickup SMGs. Then you got to consider guns like R900 which only has 1-2 ammo pick up and you simply can't reduce the pickup or you will start getting 0 pickup.
Finally FYI, you copied the timestamps from your armor video in your description.
...shit I forgot to remove that, I usually copy paste a lot of description text, thanks for that lol
But yeah, I appreciate you sharing your ideas, I will admit that all of my ideas aren't completely perfect (more holes than swiss cheese in a shooting range lol) so it is always nice to get other people's inputs and opinions on them.
Maybe if you make a video about talking about skills they’ll start removing skills
But for real I hope you talk about it and share some insights. As a day one hater of the entire skill system I’ve gone through so many debates with friends who just don’t get it and just dip out of the conversation when I get into the details or pull up some numbers. Like how poorly designed skills and heists are tidally locked to each other. I think it disproportionately doesn’t get talked about enough compared to its detrimental effects on the game.
I find myself using ammo boxes loads in one of my builds. I use it in the ac130 build i made lol. I just spam grenades
I don’t really get it, isn’t this a minor issue compared to the glaring ones?
It seemed like a minor issue to me at first, but when I started to look deeper into it it made me realise how much of the game feels unnescessarily weird and easy.
What materials are u using on your weapon? It looks really cool
Ammogonising
bravo vince
Good video i never thought how much ammo I was getting during heists because, well yeah I've never run out its too easy to get and its way to much per drop maybe they can tweak drop rates making ammo a lot rarer, so even with the funnel ability so that its a concern but not the top priority, I would suggest dropping it to low numbers but because of lack of alternatives to guns (aka no melee and overkill weapon's not always being on standby) it would be good to have it on 30-45% drop chance per cop rather then 100, or so it feels like 100 if they add more ways of attacks cops say melee that's useful or better secondary's, I'm not saying the ones in game right now are bad but they are certainly lacking, then maybe ammo drops can go down to 10-25% drop chance with perks to increase it. anyway lovely video I'm leaving a like
there is a Payday 3?
unfortunately using ammo bags and turrets is just trolling
Yea, because maybe you want medic or armor instead. I can run turret and ammo bags without any additional help tyvm
I mean if they're struggling to give people cosmetics it's no wonder this is still flawed.
ammo pickup suck
This RUclipsr trying to nerf the game even more. Please don’t listen to this ammo nerf opinion.
1. I made this video before the Ammo Funnel blogpost
2. I hate the ammo funnel change as much as the next guy
3. The game isn't that hard bruh replenish is OP as SHIT it deserves a nerf