I got to work on a Cummins CNG engine and believe me, Cummins is REAL PROUD of it's replacement parts! However, STAY AWAY from tuners, unless you own stock in the Cummins Corporation! I sincerely hope this truck's owner does not install that tuner again! Thanks for showing the company that specializes in ECM/PCM rebuilds, and thank you for this video Ivan.
Wow. Nice work Ivan. I totally get the hesitance in calling bad part when the costs are so high. And in the end it is your reputation as a diagnostic technician on the line. I was glad to see you confirm your diag with checking and ruling out the potential ground issues before making that call. I really enjoy watching these videos and learning mostly understanding why you do things in a systematic way to reveal a given problem. I worked pretty much the same way in my Air compressor service career with very good results. I found consistency was the key for factual results. Keep up the great work.
My 1992 Dodge D-350 has a Cummins and it stopped charging. The alternator relay is commanded only when ECM sees the crank is spinning. Thought about bypassing it, but watching Ivan and Eric 'O' convinced me to find the problem and fix it properly. The signal wire from the crank position sensor was grounded out.
Ivan, you stated in your last video with the Audi, "You have to pay to play." (We know that is a very old saying.) I have owned 2 diesel trucks for over 20 years and I can tell you I have had every problem a person can have with a diesel. They aren't cheap. That price for the engine computer is INSANE! Back-in-the-day, we had Hypertech and Superchips and Banks-6-Gun and I was told not to mod my truck with those if I wanted it to be reliable. (I have two 6.0 liter Ford diesels.) Good diagnosis. GREAT VIDEO!
I’m amazed at this point. Eric O would say “it’s just not satisfying without the “money shot”….but green crusty’s or not the crimp connection wasn’t good. Pastry Van from Hell gave one sweet and delicious Christmas gift for sure. Bravo Ivan.👏 👏 👏
I'm happy that places such as that exist. A seller with high quality replacement parts that have fair and reasonable prices. Nott that BS yaking advantage dealer shit! It's such niche market that has so much potential!! Shout out to them for making the world just a little a bit better for people 👏✊💪
Nice work Ivan! I always hated to tell a customer that a high dollar was needed when the customer was on fixed income. Always looking outside the box for any help.
Good video, Ivan. I had a 14 Cummins that was also deleted. The delete kit was from a sketchy company out of the Caribbean 😂 It's such a gamble with those tunes. They did something to mine that ramped up trans line pressures and cooked the transmission in 6 months. You have no idea what you're getting when you buy a delete kit. The day I sold that truck was a good day! If you don't tow heavy everyday, it's honestly cheaper to rent a 3/4 or 1 ton truck from Enterprise when you need it. Owning those heavy duty trucks will drain your wallet so fast lol
Yes, they can have crazy high repair costs. Guy who delivers my wood just bought a new Chevy and got hit with a nasty $3500 repair bill because he got a tank of bad diesel.
I am not a diesel guy, but I had one for a friend back in Summer that had the delete and tune on it and it had running issues. He got sent to Down the Road Motors. I was trained as a heavy equipment mechanic in the military and when I got out I said nope. Went into automotive instead. That was in the late 90's and I've been doing auto repair ever since, with no education in automotive systems. Never been to auto repair school. I did take a Napa class on fuel systems once, because the boss made us go after work.
Another thought I had... He should just convert it to an external regulator system that triggers the field wire using a relay dependent on battery voltage and drive it the way it is without putting an ECU in it. But glad he got the ECU for $800
@@tschuuuls486 If it was a mechanical diesel and not electric diesel injection I would agree. It is putting a lot of pressure on the components though so there will be wear /tear from excessive pressure though.
I'm glad the owner found a cheaper alternative, if ony he came to you in the first instance. There is nothing wrong with some computation in vehicles, but it's gotten ridiculous. IMO, the sweet spot for vehicles was the late 90s to mid 2000's when there was a nice blend of older and new tech. Cars back then were far less complex and more durable. Just my ten cents.
I agree, I have a 1996 Dodge Ram 2500 Turbo Diesel 12 valve. I have put a Banks kit on it but it is all mechanical, no electronics involved. It is likely that the truck will out live me.
My taurus is the last year before they stuffed computer controls in the transmission. rx7 last year before the government forced 2 seater's to be taxed to death. Friend had the 86 model, and it was flashing a code that doesn't exist. The electrical mechanical switches on it are neat I think. That and the look on inspections stations face when they can't read any emissions from the tailpipe. After burners are the way to go. Not god awful platinum everyone wants to steal.
@@johncooper4637 I'm learning to control a diesel since I want the diesel engine for my car but they don't sell it in the US. If you can't get it with the engine, it's a given you can't get the electronics either. Just need to buy one from junk yard in canada. Twice the mileage for less than 20% more in fuel costs. Not even a close call.
If you need ECM repair, failure analysis, cloning, or investigative analysis Maic Salazar Diagnostics in VA does this. View his web page & videos but understanding what failed in the computer would/may help avoid duplicate problems in the future. Also, the tune can be archived and loaded into replacement if repair is not possible. Understanding can assure accurate judgement and direction point forward if software was even a factor (factory or tune). Corrosion inside ECM's also cause component failure.
No it's not. What it is "worth" is only what an idiot would be willing to pay for it. To have to shit can an entire truck because the manufacturer has decided to screw the owner AGAIN should be criminal, if you ask me.
These aftermarket tunes cause more issues than people realize. The only advice I can give is to leave the tuner in the glove box, because if your vehicle ever needs in depth repairs, that tune can absolutely affect the technician's ability to work on the vehicle. Several times I have been unable to program replacement modules on Fords due to a non-factory ECM flash, and the options are to use the original tuner to return the ECM to factory condition, or replace the ECM.
Great to see you confidently & correctly call the pcm! The tests you performed absolutely guaranteed that the pcm was dead. Great job mate! Wow the great news he could get a pcu for ⅙th the price! Hey Ive you seem to be well versed in electronics theory. What electronics training have you had? - if you don't mind me asking? As an electronics tech myself, I see you have a great grasp & use of test equipment & analysing the readings, far beyond those of a 'regular' mechanic.
Tuning is so common nowadays... this is my profession as well and I can't find any logical reason to condemn software for a hardware failure in this instance. Not to mention this ECM is mounted to the engine block and subject to the heat and vibrations no matter how well they designed it 😅... never understood mounting them there and I used to work on these daily and have worked on deleted ones as well. I applaud this guy for doing a delete kit to give his engine much better performance and longevity from the suffocating EGR system and particulate filter etc. Who needs to have their expensive diesel disabled because of DEF or Emissions fault?
As I have come to realise is that messing around with aftermarket tuner & lots of other performance parts are really not worth it basically it is you pay to play (sometimes with complete engine destruction.)I now do not modify anything unless there is no other way to fix a problem Cheers Ivan & Happy Holidays.Oh by the way love you step to reach up under to engine bay😂
Can't wait to see if Maic can repair it. Modules are not always repairable. PS: How would you proceed if this was intermittent short killing the module : The real example of such case is "automotive diagnostics and programming" video named - "This Silverado Keeps Killing BCMs" case study. This video will remind in my mind for the rest of my career. Just like i remember your video names "Power Locks gone NUTS! (Toyota) -Part1" till this day. Holy macaroni !!
I HATE AFTERMARKET TUNER GARBAGE!!!!! Honestly the stuff I've seen over the years caused by junk that isn't OE is staggering. We spent 16 hours trying to diagnose a vehicle that the customer told us after the fact that he had an Eprom put into his computer (back when it was a thing) and it turned out that he caused all the problems. It took so long because the vehicle was 1/2 primative and 1/2 new electronic control at the time so it wasn't easy to just get codes and figure out a starting point. He didn't want to pay the bill after that because "We should have known he had that in there if we were any kind of credible shop"... Needless to say we put a lien against his title and that was that.
Yeah, it’s 20 F snowing and blowing now. Not nice, but don’t bother me so much now that I don’t have to work in it, except I do have to get on that cabless Ford tractor to clear the driveway. 🤬🤬😅
It seems that modifying the ECM/PCM may work for a while but really, are the performance gains so important that it is worth risking other failures? Nice job in confirming the engine computer but really, you do that every time regardless of how much a replacement computer costs. Kudos to you!
The data PID you where looking for is "alternator or charging system duty cycle". at least that's what it is on WiTech. I had a similar issue on my 2013 minivan (same electrical architecture). But the alternator was making noise and not charging. Same problem with no alternator light or message. In my case, I saw the alternator duty cycle at 90% so I knew the PCM was asking. New alternator fixed it. I asked the Stellantis Tech advisor why no alternator light? he did not know.
Wow! $6,300, plus programing? Holy smokes! That sounds more like the "I don't want to do this job" price. And what makes this worse is that it's a fairly common problem on Ram trucks when the alternator fails to charge.
That was the price before programming. Just ask yourself what kind of PC you could buy for that kind of money. I suppose that ECM went through about 5 stages of markup after it left China.
I had a similar problem on a 97 Dodge and they sold an aftermarket voltage regulator that hooks to the alternator on a Ford type external regulator I found them online and it fixed my truck hope this might help seems like they've had this problem for quite a few years
All regulators used to be external, which made everything so much easier. In some respects, regulators were the first modules ever used on cars. And it was all downhill from there :-)
Yea i got a 95 4x4 diesel was having all kinds of problems, electrical. I checked everything i knew to check . Went to the forums ect . I was told the computer rarely fail . I finally found a on line discount Dodge dealer . Bought a rebuilt computer for i think 400 dollars . Yep fixed all of the problems except one . Loose cruise control while driving . I noticed if i placed my foot under the brake pedal the problem stopped. So i added a spring to the brake peddle. Fixed worked for years . On the older truck like mine there work arounds for the things the company controls ... i going to keep my 12 valve cummins . Pretty reliable truck with the g56 transmission
Tall trucks Ivan!!! My kid took a pic of me and a Silverado I had in here a couple months back. I was standing next to it and the hood was level with the top of my head. SMH. When I pulled it in the shop and climbed back down from it, I said "Now I know that can't be fun to do all the time." When my kid came in he said "Oh, that looks like fun." XD
Every Dodge with charging issues that I've seen is PCM from crossing booster cables, most people don't know that charge only goes into one battery so if splitter battery cables aren't good it won't charge either
In PCM design it is much less expensive to PWM duty cycle encode a command than it is to generate an actual analog output voltage. The digital PWM command output can have the pull up in the alternator and since the signaling is digital the inevitable ground potential offsets do not corrupt the signal (information).
When the other shop bypassed the pcm for the fielding test to battery voltage, they should have unplugged the plug at the alternator and run a jumper to the alternator from the battery on the drivers side of the truck. Thats how that test is supposed to be done. I do that one all the time when I test for the charging sense codes.
That idea you had with faking a current to get the alternator to put out a charge will work, just needed a little more circuitry and a relay to cut it off at a certain level.
Why did it fail? Because it is a Stellantis product that was monkeyed with. Thank you for the very informative video, Ivan. You always show us the reasonable diagnosis and what not to do.
Man, that would make me sick. Outrageously priced parts. That ought to be against the law. Nice that he found an alternative, more reasonably priced part. Now I wonder if he will have another one "tuned"?
Lets be honest, that PCM probably failed because its a Chrysler product more than because of the tune. I worked in the parts department of a Chrysler dealership for almost 10 years and couldn't even begin to count how many PCMs I sold. And as far as the price is concerned, I am not surprised to see that crazy number. A dealer probably would have quoted a factory remanufactured part and it would have been way less than the almost 7k.
Owning a diesel that you don't make money with is a losing proposition as you can see with the ECM cost. All the parts pricing on these things is insane. "it's been running with a tune for six years." As you said "so what, want to buy a computer every 6 years?" Electrics are funny. I had a new '03 Porsche 914/2.0 electronic fuel injection engine and was trying to figure out how to "hot rod " it some, so one of the things I did was replace all the spark plug connectors with just basic clip ons, removing the factory ones that had a 100 ohm resister in each, no problem, radio wasn't getting interference so I ran them. Close to a year later was on a trip to Sebring Florida from Chicago, stayed overnight in Columbus Indiana, next morning the 914 would barely run, nursed to a VW/Porsche dealer on the outskirts of town, they took a look and asked about the spark plug connectors, I told them I replaced them about a year ago, said that was problem, they are supposed to have 100 ohm resistor in each for injection system to run properly, ok, $75 later was on road to Sebring with factory spark plug connectors and never another problem. Why take the engine a year to figure out what I had done?
so Maic Salazar Diagnostics confirmed this is fault is corrosion not a tune "2014 RAM 2500 6 7 Diesel Diagnosed by Pine Hollow Auto PCM test for David B in PA"
So the owner had to get a new computer, but because of the emissions delete, had to use the sketchy tuner again...I hate all the emissions stuff too, but that's part of what you're purchasing with added maintenance such as DEF. I've seen aftermarket tunes fry alts, blow up turbos, and fry shift solenoids. And I've seen some that seem to do nothing. High $ call, but the diagnostics are the same.
I've used a ecm repair company before, they'er great! On the 90s dodge dakotas we used to put a voltage regulator in the alternator and cut a wire going to the computer. Sorry i forget what wire. Would something like that have worked?
John Deere has been attempting to stop farmers repairing their tractor electronics except through JD dealer. However their are some specialists who have fought and won and now do their own and any one elses .
Deere is closing plants and shipping work overseas. Their proprietary computers fail and you are stuck with a farmer $100k boat anchor in the field. Glad that third party repairs are still allowed.
Honestly we seen a lot of Dodge and Chrysler products come through here that have computer issues, I'm sure that's really the bottom line is that the components aren't as quality as they should be, but using a tuner and pushing certain components to the max for having drivers utilize more power than they should probably doesn't help but I think the main thing is that the electronics and the components that stalinis Dodge Chrysler whatever uses aren't as quality as they should be. I don't think I've seen any other company come in with more computer issues than Chrysler on this channel especially..
Let's say an ECM wasn't available. Perhaps you could find an older GM alternator with an internal regulator and simply wire it in to work? You'd have to make special brackets...
That’s the route I took when I had to replace the pcm in my 94 Camry. Ivan repaired the old one for Me and I put it back in . Still 100% and I have a spare. The OEM reman was a thousand bucks without the core refund, but worth every cent to me.
Ivan, obviously the ECM had failed since replacing it fixed his problems. I was curious about what test locations you were using for the scope? It looked like you were checking at the sensor or device and not right at the ECM or did I miss that part? Wouldn't you want to check at the ECM for these signals, maybe check ecm pins for corrosion before making the call on it?
I recommend the owner to lawsuit the company for putting the ignition transistors inside the ECM and not outside a 5 dollar module easy to replace, if we all do that, these crooks will stop stealing our money, but nobody does it, and evilness never stops...
Blairsville Pa, 10 minutes from me. I told you it's hard to find reliable mechanic around here. Wanna move close to us, Please! Have a good day! What's crazy here in Pa Blairsville doesn't have to get emissions, me 8 miles away has to. 🤦
Oh I feel you on the emissions test crap, Im in Monessen (also Westmoreland County) , and if I wind up and throw a rock as hard as I can from my house I can land it in "lower" Belle Vernon, which is in Fayette County and doesn't require emissions. Just one big money grab.
Sometimes, tuners have to open the ECU or drill a hole somewhere. I suspect that this is what happened to this ECU and then it got water damage. I don't expect that software is what caused this issue. Did you do a visual inspection? It's crazy to drill a hole in a modern ECU that costs thousands of euro's, but that doesn't stop them.
I don't know if I trust that rebuilt computer,, I think I would just spring for a shiny brand new one !! WAIT !! Apparently I just had a stroke,,, never mind.... :)
If it had been only the alternator not charging, you could wire up an old Chrysler voltage regulator conversion kit. Unfortunately it has other issues. Yeah, diesels are expensive! Some injectors are $750 to over 2 grand a piece. If you not a big time farmer construction company or hauling commercially, better stick with the 1/2 ton pick-up trucks and gas engines. There's a reason the F150 is best seller! You don't have to get a loaded one or even a brand new truck. The half ton trucks will do a lot of work. My grandpa owned a small farm and a Dodge D100 long bed was all he ever had.
Wow that's ridiculous money for the engine computer. There's an 80 something year old electronics guy on the IATN that helps members on there with installing external VR's on those trucks and other Mopar stuff with pcm controlled alternators. He says there's 2 kinds, type A and type B. One gets a Ford VR and the other gets the prehistoric Mopar VR. The VR has to be capable of higher amperage than stock, so he sources one that can handle it.
Service life is key here. Engineers do not want to run anything at 'max' capacity or ability designing in a safety factor. A designed load of 80 or 90% within the ECM would allow it operate 20+ years, over clocking it will reduce the life of the unit.
Blairsville, yeah, home of that great tech school I won’t mention the name of . A while back I let a nephew use my garage to work on his Ram Cummins, older one with mechanical fuel injection . He replaced the injection pump and wasn’t sure about the timing, so he got his buddy (He knows his s:;t on these Cummins, I was told, grad. from aforementioned school) to set the injection timing. I was on another project, but watching what was going on. They had the front valve cover off and claimed he set it to #1tdc. I could plainly see it was not because one of the valves was not closed, don’t remember the exact scenario, but I told my nephew his buddy definitely didn’t know his (stuff). Pretty elementary to set tdc when you can see the valves, one would think. Nephew politely excused his nhs buddy and we got the job done after I did a little web research on the injection pump timing, which was pretty simple. Moral of the story which I touched on with someone in the last video, for the most part, IMHO, these tech schools are a joke. Great stuff Ivan. 👍👍🇺🇸. ( yeah, I always got a story up my sleeve😅)
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Working and recording all by yourself is a lot of time, then editing and uploading.
Hats off to you Ivan!
Imo Ivan is best in game and deserves some fame! Subs should be triple! Like and share with your friends ❤
I got to work on a Cummins CNG engine and believe me, Cummins is REAL PROUD of it's replacement parts! However, STAY AWAY from tuners, unless you own stock in the Cummins Corporation!
I sincerely hope this truck's owner does not install that tuner again!
Thanks for showing the company that specializes in ECM/PCM rebuilds, and thank you for this video Ivan.
this is true of most modern diesels. You'd better know what you're doing if you tune them.
@@adotintheshark4848 The only tune EVERY newer car needs is.... if (CEL_request) CEL_light = off; .
Wow. Nice work Ivan. I totally get the hesitance in calling bad part when the costs are so high. And in the end it is your reputation as a diagnostic technician on the line. I was glad to see you confirm your diag with checking and ruling out the potential ground issues before making that call. I really enjoy watching these videos and learning mostly understanding why you do things in a systematic way to reveal a given problem. I worked pretty much the same way in my Air compressor service career with very good results. I found consistency was the key for factual results. Keep up the great work.
reminded me of the head unit with no way to tell which of the $3K parts is the problem.
My 1992 Dodge D-350 has a Cummins and it stopped charging. The alternator relay is commanded only when ECM sees the crank is spinning. Thought about bypassing it, but watching Ivan and Eric 'O' convinced me to find the problem and fix it properly. The signal wire from the crank position sensor was grounded out.
Lucky options are available, Thank God for ECM rebuilder's 🇺🇸💪, Another successful DIAGNOSIS 👍.
Ivan, you stated in your last video with the Audi, "You have to pay to play." (We know that is a very old saying.) I have owned 2 diesel trucks for over 20 years and I can tell you I have had every problem a person can have with a diesel. They aren't cheap. That price for the engine computer is INSANE! Back-in-the-day, we had Hypertech and Superchips and Banks-6-Gun and I was told not to mod my truck with those if I wanted it to be reliable. (I have two 6.0 liter Ford diesels.) Good diagnosis. GREAT VIDEO!
I’m amazed at this point. Eric O would say “it’s just not satisfying without the “money shot”….but green crusty’s or not the crimp connection wasn’t good. Pastry Van from Hell gave one sweet and delicious Christmas gift for sure. Bravo Ivan.👏 👏 👏
I'm happy that places such as that exist. A seller with high quality replacement parts that have fair and reasonable prices. Nott that BS yaking advantage dealer shit! It's such niche market that has so much potential!! Shout out to them for making the world just a little a bit better for people 👏✊💪
Nice work Ivan! I always hated to tell a customer that a high dollar was needed when the customer was on fixed income. Always looking outside the box for any help.
The best one handed diagnostician on the planet😊
Agree with this.
Just imagine the cost saving to the customer if he used 2 hands!😂
@@jws3925 that would be Keith DeFazio... I learn from the best 😉
A perfect PHAD case study. Thanks Ivan!
We have in the past removed the control from the pcm and installed a stand alone voltage regulator to manage the voltage
Good video, Ivan. I had a 14 Cummins that was also deleted. The delete kit was from a sketchy company out of the Caribbean 😂 It's such a gamble with those tunes. They did something to mine that ramped up trans line pressures and cooked the transmission in 6 months. You have no idea what you're getting when you buy a delete kit. The day I sold that truck was a good day! If you don't tow heavy everyday, it's honestly cheaper to rent a 3/4 or 1 ton truck from Enterprise when you need it. Owning those heavy duty trucks will drain your wallet so fast lol
Yes, they can have crazy high repair costs.
Guy who delivers my wood just bought a new Chevy and got hit with a nasty $3500 repair bill because he got a tank of bad diesel.
Yea new trucks add more than $10k to a new truck for diesels. So buy it for making money to pull heavy.
Agreed. Renting makes a lot of sense.
I am not a diesel guy, but I had one for a friend back in Summer that had the delete and tune on it and it had running issues. He got sent to Down the Road Motors. I was trained as a heavy equipment mechanic in the military and when I got out I said nope. Went into automotive instead. That was in the late 90's and I've been doing auto repair ever since, with no education in automotive systems. Never been to auto repair school. I did take a Napa class on fuel systems once, because the boss made us go after work.
My typing sucks. I went into auto repair in 1989, not the late 90's. ;)
Another thought I had... He should just convert it to an external regulator system that triggers the field wire using a relay dependent on battery voltage and drive it the way it is without putting an ECU in it. But glad he got the ECU for $800
Running the HP Diesel rail pressure out of spec seems like a recipe for melted pistons.
@@tschuuuls486 If it was a mechanical diesel and not electric diesel injection I would agree. It is putting a lot of pressure on the components though so there will be wear /tear from excessive pressure though.
I'm glad the owner found a cheaper alternative, if ony he came to you in the first instance. There is nothing wrong with some computation in vehicles, but it's gotten ridiculous. IMO, the sweet spot for vehicles was the late 90s to mid 2000's when there was a nice blend of older and new tech. Cars back then were far less complex and more durable. Just my ten cents.
I agree, I have a 1996 Dodge Ram 2500 Turbo Diesel 12 valve. I have put a Banks kit on it but it is all mechanical, no electronics involved. It is likely that the truck will out live me.
My taurus is the last year before they stuffed computer controls in the transmission. rx7 last year before the government forced 2 seater's to be taxed to death. Friend had the 86 model, and it was flashing a code that doesn't exist. The electrical mechanical switches on it are neat I think. That and the look on inspections stations face when they can't read any emissions from the tailpipe. After burners are the way to go. Not god awful platinum everyone wants to steal.
@@johncooper4637 I'm learning to control a diesel since I want the diesel engine for my car but they don't sell it in the US. If you can't get it with the engine, it's a given you can't get the electronics either. Just need to buy one from junk yard in canada. Twice the mileage for less than 20% more in fuel costs. Not even a close call.
Yes he have the video on his channel , Ivan like always you have the right diagnostic❤
If you need ECM repair, failure analysis, cloning, or investigative analysis Maic Salazar Diagnostics in VA does this. View his web page & videos but understanding what failed in the computer would/may help avoid duplicate problems in the future. Also, the tune can be archived and loaded into replacement if repair is not possible. Understanding can assure accurate judgement and direction point forward if software was even a factor (factory or tune). Corrosion inside ECM's also cause component failure.
He knows about Maic Salazar Diagnostics.
Salazar got a shout out at the end of the video.
That ECM is worth more than my car! 2007 Toyota Camry with 54,000 miles on it. Original owner! That is insanity!
That car is worth way more than that IMO!
No it's not. What it is "worth" is only what an idiot would be willing to pay for it. To have to shit can an entire truck because the manufacturer has decided to screw the owner AGAIN should be criminal, if you ask me.
My first thought on the additional wiring under the dash....crazy box of frogs RUN!!!
Ivan, nice job. These computer issues can be a bit unnerving. I guess we all need to get use to it. Thanks for Sharing! 🙃🙂
Wearing a PHAD shirt watching PHAD what a lovely Saturday morning :)
Thanks Ivan for all the work you do.!!!
Great work Ivan. Thanks for giving us the update.
These aftermarket tunes cause more issues than people realize. The only advice I can give is to leave the tuner in the glove box, because if your vehicle ever needs in depth repairs, that tune can absolutely affect the technician's ability to work on the vehicle. Several times I have been unable to program replacement modules on Fords due to a non-factory ECM flash, and the options are to use the original tuner to return the ECM to factory condition, or replace the ECM.
Always a pleasure.
Great to see you confidently & correctly call the pcm! The tests you performed absolutely guaranteed that the pcm was dead. Great job mate!
Wow the great news he could get a pcu for ⅙th the price!
Hey Ive you seem to be well versed in electronics theory. What electronics training have you had? - if you don't mind me asking? As an electronics tech myself, I see you have a great grasp & use of test equipment & analysing the readings, far beyond those of a 'regular' mechanic.
Tuning is so common nowadays... this is my profession as well and I can't find any logical reason to condemn software for a hardware failure in this instance. Not to mention this ECM is mounted to the engine block and subject to the heat and vibrations no matter how well they designed it 😅... never understood mounting them there and I used to work on these daily and have worked on deleted ones as well. I applaud this guy for doing a delete kit to give his engine much better performance and longevity from the suffocating EGR system and particulate filter etc. Who needs to have their expensive diesel disabled because of DEF or Emissions fault?
Fantastic, great job good news at the end, thank you Ivan.
As I have come to realise is that messing around with aftermarket tuner & lots of other performance parts are really not worth it basically it is you pay to play (sometimes with complete engine destruction.)I now do not modify anything unless there is no other way to fix a problem Cheers Ivan & Happy Holidays.Oh by the way love you step to reach up under to engine bay😂
Can't wait to see if Maic can repair it. Modules are not always repairable.
PS: How would you proceed if this was intermittent short killing the module : The real example of such case is "automotive diagnostics and programming" video named - "This Silverado Keeps Killing BCMs" case study. This video will remind in my mind for the rest of my career. Just like i remember your video names "Power Locks gone NUTS! (Toyota) -Part1" till this day. Holy macaroni !!
Sitting in those new big-ass pickup trucks makes me feel like I'm a little boy again. 😂
An excellent diagnose ❤ as usual your the man 😀👍👍👍
I HATE AFTERMARKET TUNER GARBAGE!!!!! Honestly the stuff I've seen over the years caused by junk that isn't OE is staggering. We spent 16 hours trying to diagnose a vehicle that the customer told us after the fact that he had an Eprom put into his computer (back when it was a thing) and it turned out that he caused all the problems. It took so long because the vehicle was 1/2 primative and 1/2 new electronic control at the time so it wasn't easy to just get codes and figure out a starting point. He didn't want to pay the bill after that because "We should have known he had that in there if we were any kind of credible shop"... Needless to say we put a lien against his title and that was that.
Truly a tough call! Making a bad call on a part like that would be a nightmare..... Wonder what the ECM for a Lambo costs.....
Great job as always. Who knew Chrysler used Apple computers to run those beasts?
The weather is nice at your place Here, 6 inches of fresh snow 😁 and 25 F
Date on the laptop read something like Oct. 22
Yeah, it’s 20 F snowing and blowing now. Not nice, but don’t bother me so much now that I don’t have to work in it, except I do have to get on that cabless Ford tractor to clear the driveway. 🤬🤬😅
Good job Ivan.
well done young man
It seems that modifying the ECM/PCM may work for a while but really, are the performance gains so important that it is worth risking other failures? Nice job in confirming the engine computer but really, you do that every time regardless of how much a replacement computer costs. Kudos to you!
Wow. Makes me love my old 94 Chevy Silverado tbi engine
The data PID you where looking for is "alternator or charging system duty cycle". at least that's what it is on WiTech. I had a similar issue on my 2013 minivan (same electrical architecture). But the alternator was making noise and not charging. Same problem with no alternator light or message. In my case, I saw the alternator duty cycle at 90% so I knew the PCM was asking. New alternator fixed it. I asked the Stellantis Tech advisor why no alternator light? he did not know.
THAT DIESEL SOUND.. MADE ME TO FALL ASLEEP.. GREW UP WITH DIESELS AND IN MY BLOOD!
Wow! $6,300, plus programing? Holy smokes! That sounds more like the "I don't want to do this job" price. And what makes this worse is that it's a fairly common problem on Ram trucks when the alternator fails to charge.
That was the price before programming. Just ask yourself what kind of PC you could buy for that kind of money. I suppose that ECM went through about 5 stages of markup after it left China.
@@JamesAgans I think I could build 2 high end gaming PC's for that kind of money. And I wouldn't doubt the markups either.
You clowns never diagnose it right. 90% are not TIPM faults...
I had a similar problem on a 97 Dodge and they sold an aftermarket voltage regulator that hooks to the alternator on a Ford type external regulator I found them online and it fixed my truck hope this might help seems like they've had this problem for quite a few years
@@jonathancoughran9463 that would actually make it more reliable vs sending so many Amps through the ECM 👌
All regulators used to be external, which made everything so much easier. In some respects, regulators were the first modules ever used on cars. And it was all downhill from there :-)
Yea i got a 95 4x4 diesel was having all kinds of problems, electrical. I checked everything i knew to check . Went to the forums ect . I was told the computer rarely fail . I finally found a on line discount Dodge dealer . Bought a rebuilt computer for i think 400 dollars . Yep fixed all of the problems except one . Loose cruise control while driving . I noticed if i placed my foot under the brake pedal the problem stopped. So i added a spring to the brake peddle. Fixed worked for years . On the older truck like mine there work arounds for the things the company controls ... i going to keep my 12 valve cummins . Pretty reliable truck with the g56 transmission
Tall trucks Ivan!!! My kid took a pic of me and a Silverado I had in here a couple months back. I was standing next to it and the hood was level with the top of my head. SMH. When I pulled it in the shop and climbed back down from it, I said "Now I know that can't be fun to do all the time." When my kid came in he said "Oh, that looks like fun." XD
And those things are so enjoyable to do anything under the hood.
Great result !
Every Dodge with charging issues that I've seen is PCM from crossing booster cables, most people don't know that charge only goes into one battery so if splitter battery cables aren't good it won't charge either
In PCM design it is much less expensive to PWM duty cycle encode a command than it is to generate an actual analog output voltage. The digital PWM command output can have the pull up in the alternator and since the signaling is digital the inevitable ground potential offsets do not corrupt the signal (information).
Thanks for sharing.
When the other shop bypassed the pcm for the fielding test to battery voltage, they should have unplugged the plug at the alternator and run a jumper to the alternator from the battery on the drivers side of the truck. Thats how that test is supposed to be done. I do that one all the time when I test for the charging sense codes.
That idea you had with faking a current to get the alternator to put out a charge will work, just needed a little more circuitry and a relay to cut it off at a certain level.
Why did it fail? Because it is a Stellantis product that was monkeyed with. Thank you for the very informative video, Ivan. You always show us the reasonable diagnosis and what not to do.
Its a Cummins computer, it failed from corrosion due to water intrusion. Stop commenting nonsense.
@@bleachinuri Go back to your cat-girl anime.
Man, that would make me sick. Outrageously priced parts. That ought to be against the law. Nice that he found an alternative, more reasonably priced part. Now I wonder if he will have another one "tuned"?
will the tuner destroy the new ECM too ? Can it be untuned ?
In this case, I would have liked to see you check the powers and grounds at the computer.
Tuned. Oh Lord...
Lets be honest, that PCM probably failed because its a Chrysler product more than because of the tune. I worked in the parts department of a Chrysler dealership for almost 10 years and couldn't even begin to count how many PCMs I sold. And as far as the price is concerned, I am not surprised to see that crazy number. A dealer probably would have quoted a factory remanufactured part and it would have been way less than the almost 7k.
Owning a diesel that you don't make money with is a losing proposition as you can see with the ECM cost. All the parts pricing on these things is insane. "it's been running with a tune for six years." As you said "so what, want to buy a computer every 6 years?" Electrics are funny. I had a new '03 Porsche 914/2.0 electronic fuel injection engine and was trying to figure out how to "hot rod " it some, so one of the things I did was replace all the spark plug connectors with just basic clip ons, removing the factory ones that had a 100 ohm resister in each, no problem, radio wasn't getting interference so I ran them. Close to a year later was on a trip to Sebring Florida from Chicago, stayed overnight in Columbus Indiana, next morning the 914 would barely run, nursed to a VW/Porsche dealer on the outskirts of town, they took a look and asked about the spark plug connectors, I told them I replaced them about a year ago, said that was problem, they are supposed to have 100 ohm resistor in each for injection system to run properly, ok, $75 later was on road to Sebring with factory spark plug connectors and never another problem. Why take the engine a year to figure out what I had done?
Nice work!
Nicely done🥋💯
so Maic Salazar Diagnostics confirmed this is fault is corrosion not a tune "2014 RAM 2500 6 7 Diesel Diagnosed by Pine Hollow Auto PCM test for David B in PA"
There's a lot of misinformed people on here commenting about deleting and tuning.
So the owner had to get a new computer, but because of the emissions delete, had to use the sketchy tuner again...I hate all the emissions stuff too, but that's part of what you're purchasing with added maintenance such as DEF. I've seen aftermarket tunes fry alts, blow up turbos, and fry shift solenoids. And I've seen some that seem to do nothing. High $ call, but the diagnostics are the same.
GREAT VIDEO IVAN!!!❤❤
I've used a ecm repair company before, they'er great!
On the 90s dodge dakotas we used to put a voltage regulator in the alternator
and cut a wire going to the computer. Sorry i forget what wire. Would something like that have worked?
John Deere has been attempting to stop farmers repairing their tractor electronics except through JD dealer. However their are some specialists who have fought and won and now do their own and any one elses .
Deere is closing plants and shipping work overseas. Their proprietary computers fail and you are stuck with a farmer $100k boat anchor in the field. Glad that third party repairs are still allowed.
Honestly we seen a lot of Dodge and Chrysler products come through here that have computer issues, I'm sure that's really the bottom line is that the components aren't as quality as they should be, but using a tuner and pushing certain components to the max for having drivers utilize more power than they should probably doesn't help but I think the main thing is that the electronics and the components that stalinis Dodge Chrysler whatever uses aren't as quality as they should be. I don't think I've seen any other company come in with more computer issues than Chrysler on this channel especially..
I have ran into some issues with dodge loosing grounds on the alt and wipers it’s a common issue.
Bad grounds have been a problem with Chrysler products basically forever.
Let's say an ECM wasn't available. Perhaps you could find an older GM alternator with an internal regulator and simply wire it in to work? You'd have to make special brackets...
Hi Ivan,
The replacement ECM did not need to return a core? If no and his original ECM can be repaired, that would be a nice backup.
That’s the route I took when I had to replace the pcm in my 94 Camry. Ivan repaired the old one for Me and I put it back in . Still 100% and I have a spare. The OEM reman was a thousand bucks without the core refund, but worth every cent to me.
They are prone fail it seems if they're that available. Thanks Ivan!
Ivan, obviously the ECM had failed since replacing it fixed his problems. I was curious about what test locations you were using for the scope? It looked like you were checking at the sensor or device and not right at the ECM or did I miss that part? Wouldn't you want to check at the ECM for these signals, maybe check ecm pins for corrosion before making the call on it?
Good video Ivan. Why didn't the guy or send the computer from the truck to Mike and have it repaired?
I recommend the owner to lawsuit the company for putting the ignition transistors inside the ECM and not outside a 5 dollar module easy to replace, if we all do that, these crooks will stop stealing our money, but nobody does it, and evilness never stops...
Too much pressure, I'm going nuts with you and totally in the dark with what is happening.
I can’t believe there wasn’t a full field test on the scan tool 🤷🏼♂️
Blairsville Pa, 10 minutes from me. I told you it's hard to find reliable mechanic around here. Wanna move close to us, Please! Have a good day! What's crazy here in Pa Blairsville doesn't have to get emissions, me 8 miles away has to. 🤦
Oh I feel you on the emissions test crap, Im in Monessen (also Westmoreland County) , and if I wind up and throw a rock as hard as I can from my house I can land it in "lower" Belle Vernon, which is in Fayette County and doesn't require emissions. Just one big money grab.
We had this happen at work to a 5500 chassis cab when some hangover young man attempted to jump start it and had the booster pack reversed.
Ivan I thought you were going to use the Phoenix plus?
Good one
Ian, did the customer remove the aftermarket tune?
Nice video Ivan.
There you go again. You have the problem and the customer did more research and find a company selling computer for less than EOM. Good job.
Sometimes, tuners have to open the ECU or drill a hole somewhere. I suspect that this is what happened to this ECU and then it got water damage. I don't expect that software is what caused this issue. Did you do a visual inspection?
It's crazy to drill a hole in a modern ECU that costs thousands of euro's, but that doesn't stop them.
I don't know if I trust that rebuilt computer,, I think I would just spring for a shiny brand new one !!
WAIT !!
Apparently I just had a stroke,,, never mind.... :)
I wouldn’t call a computer at that price, I’d send it to you to call it. Lol
Cool video nice job!!!👍
Did the owner delete the aftermarket tune?
If it had been only the alternator not charging, you could wire up an old Chrysler voltage regulator conversion kit. Unfortunately it has other issues.
Yeah, diesels are expensive! Some injectors are $750 to over 2 grand a piece. If you not a big time farmer construction company or hauling commercially, better stick with the 1/2 ton pick-up trucks and gas engines.
There's a reason the F150 is best seller! You don't have to get a loaded one or even a brand new truck. The half ton trucks will do a lot of work. My grandpa owned a small farm and a Dodge D100 long bed was all he ever had.
Wiping out the drivers is very odd. You just have to change/adapt the parameters in an ECU. Clearly that tuner was kid living around the block.
You can get an external regulator for it
Your outside work area is pretty cold this week.
mopar trucks in the early 90' had ecm charge problems and the fix was to install a std mopar alternator regulator bypassing the ecm control
Wow that's ridiculous money for the engine computer.
There's an 80 something year old electronics guy on the IATN that helps members on there with installing external VR's on those trucks and other Mopar stuff with pcm controlled alternators. He says there's 2 kinds, type A and type B. One gets a Ford VR and the other gets the prehistoric Mopar VR. The VR has to be capable of higher amperage than stock, so he sources one that can handle it.
That OBD2 plug hanging under dash actually looked liked a Banks product to me?
Ivan get you old dodge style voltage regulator put test leds on it use it for testing purposes
Service life is key here. Engineers do not want to run anything at 'max' capacity or ability designing in a safety factor. A designed load of 80 or 90% within the ECM would allow it operate 20+ years, over clocking it will reduce the life of the unit.
Blairsville, yeah, home of that great tech school I won’t mention the name of . A while back I let a nephew use my garage to work on his Ram Cummins, older one with mechanical fuel injection . He replaced the injection pump and wasn’t sure about the timing, so he got his buddy (He knows his s:;t on these Cummins, I was told, grad. from aforementioned school) to set the injection timing. I was on another project, but watching what was going on. They had the front valve cover off and claimed he set it to #1tdc. I could plainly see it was not because one of the valves was not closed, don’t remember the exact scenario, but I told my nephew his buddy definitely didn’t know his (stuff). Pretty elementary to set tdc when you can see the valves, one would think. Nephew politely excused his nhs buddy and we got the job done after I did a little web research on the injection pump timing, which was pretty simple. Moral of the story which I touched on with someone in the last video, for the most part, IMHO, these tech schools are a joke. Great stuff Ivan. 👍👍🇺🇸. ( yeah, I always got a story up my sleeve😅)
That's why that school closed. Their students couldn't even identify basic hand tools.😂
Oh, didn’t know it closed, not surprised though.
OUCH in all caps. $6245 for a new ECM. That's crazy
Phad is awesome scanner Danner is awesome too and would have been closed to you.