i dont thing majora's mask is great for subverting expectations . i think majora's mask is great because of how much the argument they made by subverting expectations resonates as truth. Majora's mask is saying something deep about the nature of growing up. its funny how few people notice fierce deity mask is a representation of adult hood .. at the same time Majora's is a kid that refuses to grow up and through your confrontation with him ...you force him to grow up (you see this in his different stages as a boss )
Philip kelton oh yeah. In earlier drafts of the script, I went in to skull kid being the opposite of link with adulthood. He messes everything up like a small child. Link cleans up after him, the adult. Very clever.
Sincerely good arguments regarding how the themes serve to aid the experience of the story which is also accompanied by how it affects gameplay. I'm glad I took the time to watch! Definitely worth a rewatch.
Thank you for putting this into words. I've been trying to verbalize how profound Majoras mask is for a very long time and this clarifies several points. Thank you for including monomyth!
I love listening to you detail games and anime like this, i get a newfound appreciation for the content and learn more about story telling elements and how to apply them.
GoatJesus yeah its like being shadowbanned on twitter. But with your content. *Sigh* RUclips's behavior has been bad since spring of 2016 but this is just a new low.
Not a very original point, but it's still true and well made. Good to see you back. Unsure if there really is a monomyth. Well, there is one now, but it may have been constructed by the scholars who 'described' it rather than actually existing in real myth. Ocarina seems to have used the monomyth but maybe only because it's based on stories based on the idea because they're based on Hero with 1000 faces, or even because the myth is so abstractly described that almost any story can be said to fit it. While your story-based explanations for removing power at the start of the game make sense, I think you're over analyzing things as a lot of games (e.g. Meteoroid Prime, Castlevania Symphony of the Night) give you loads of power (to show the player what he can do eventually) then take it away (so the player feels acomplished getting back that initial power and getting even more). I suspect these gameplay reasons were the real reason for the intro.
...Holy. shit. That's incredible! I never would've thought of this game that way! At least, I don't think I would've... I played it when I was in my early teens, before I knew much about metaphors and subtext. I've learned a whole lot since then (seriously, I majored in English and am constantly analyzing), but even so... I don't think this perspective would've ever occurred to me.
I tried majora's mask once and like most people i was turned off at first, but nowadays hearing many praise for the game did grab my interest I also heard that the 3ds remake improves alot from the original release but i'm not sure if it convice me to buy new system, then again anything will do then using the awful n64 controller again
I hate the 3ds version, tbh. It changes too much. The boss battles are laughable with giant eyeballs added and there's strange changes like the Happy Mask Salesman giving you the Bomber's Notebook. Plus, you're able to save during the opening...which kinda ruins the tense-ness tbh. It's stuff like that everywhere. I'd honestly recommend playing it on N64 with a new Retro Fighter's controller. retrofighters.com/
Personally id love to hear you talk more about other mediums rather then anime. Though you and sudosef (still miss his videos) made the absolute best eva videos, id like to hear your opinion of other stuff while at work. OoT is the better zelda game but majora wasnt trying to be better, it was trying to be its own story.
Dugon man I think Majora is the best Zelda game. Best side quests, good dungeons. Not the best bosses. Rad atmosphere. Innovative time system that has yet to be replicated. Overall, if someone to ask me which was the better, I’d say Majora personally. But Ocarina...oh man, the nostalgia is just so real. Whenever I think of Zelda I remember being 5 and playing OoT. It’s probably my personal favorite Zelda for sure. The dungeons and bosses are so spot on. Both are games are brilliant ofc. I personally don’t really like what the franchise has become. It’s lost it’s identity ever since Twilight Princess tried so desperately to recreate the magic. Has been struggling ever since, especially with Fujibayashi at the helm. At least imo.
GoatJesus it's pretty hard to be completely objective on a franchise that hits home with so many people and creates such personal experiences with varying different games in the franchise. To me Ocarina hit that near perfect balance of story and gameplay that no other zelda has imitated as well yet. Wind waker may have a better story but its gameplay was lacking (less dungeons, tedius sailing at times, that triforce fetch quest) while twilight princess might be the best at gameplay but its story and setting leave you underwhelmed (oh boy, this gannon fight doesnt feel tacked on and forced at all). Now I have my own subjective view on ocarina (it helped a 13 year old boy cope in a extremely bad time and didnt let him commit suicide) but i think I can put those aside and see OoT as the game id say IS legend of zelda. Thats why Majoras mask is so fricken good. All the other zeldas tend to ape on ocarina but Majora said "screw that, we're gonna do our own thing!" And they crafted an insane surreal experiance that doesnt live on its predecessors legacy but forged its own.
Hmm thinking about it, if we look at the sword as the symbol of power which comes with adulthood, in the monomyth based stories generally but also to A Link To The Past, Ocarina starts to be somewhat subversive as those kind of stories rarely show the bad side of growing up and importance of childhood, they just tell you grow up as fast as possible because there are no upsides to being a kid, might be do to the fact that children were often seen as lesser beings through history (Christianity going against this was big deal) for example, in ancient Rome the "patriarch" of the family could the kill any family member, which meant children and women and in ancient Greece it was acceptable by their religion to kill babies if you leave them alone for the nature to do the job. Compared to ancient stories like King Arthur and stuff and even contemporaries like A Link To The Past and Star Wars it's pretty incredible, especially when you factor in the meta narrative of Ocarina, Link goes 7 years into the future because that was how long it took from ALTTP to Ocarina, and when you consider that Links reward in the end is going back to his childhood, you realize that that's exactly what fans got for their wait, a new Zelda game, bigger, better(shut up, at the time everyone thought that) and more developed. Not just a return, but a continuation. To go even further, games were(and still are to some extent) considered just for children, and if you were old enough to beat ALTTP yourself when it came out, you'd be an adult by the time Ocarina comes out, and there it is telling you it's ok to not only play video games, but keep to some of you childhood. Link was based on Peter Pan after all... And then Majora comes out... Now that I realize this, Majora's themes of loss of innocence make even more sense. Zelda games really are powerful stuff. Thanks for opening my eyes to this!
Like these shorter analysis videos, gone of majora's mask honestly replayed it recently and that middle section is brutal and not in a good way, nice to see affirmations on why I loved it in the first place. Anime youtube is a fucking hole at the moment probably for the best that you diversify, look forward to some film videos. :)
I see it this way: Game takes away your achievements to not build on top of them and instead make you achieve what you already did. If i will ever want to play game emulating the feeling of washing dishes, majora's mask will be my first choice.
I like more and think Majora's is better than Ocarina. I think it is more complex and mature, but people always say "nah Ocarina it's the best game ever because everywhere says it is" and that's the only reason they will give you when you say Majora's is better. I mean, can you think for yourselves?
Ocarina is predestined to be more liked, it is THE ULTIMATE INTERACTIVE MONOMYTH, something mutual to almost every human, Majora is deeper but not necessarily more well made, it's just like Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back.
GoatJesus Oh man... you really should continue it, that game is mindfucked & heartfelt, has characters you would care about and it's basically Evangelion the game so it's open to interpretation of all sorts.
GoatJesus this video seems mostly dedicated to how the beginning shapes your views, you talk about its philosophies and how different it all is. A title that isn't "best story" I honestly almost avoided this video for such a title. Seeing such a thing + Zelda game = a bit obnoxious (seeing as you'll kinda see that every where.) I'm not going to tell you what to name the video, but "Majoras Mask subversion and narrative brilliance " or something out there. Those RUclips "essays " tend to title there videos in a way that calls attention to the specific things they plan to focus on, this isn't always the case of course but I think you can piece together what I'm getting at. Side note I don't think that Angel Luis Ruiz first name is pronounced that way.
GoatJesus Actually, the new title is so much better. I would have skipped just another Majora's Mask story video, but i love in depth analysis videos into its underlying themes. New title is the only reason i watched, its an attention grabber. You made a good call.
Umm Epona didn't get murdered but maybe I misunderstand. Also the more eccentric or disturbing stuff in Majora works because the gameplay itself communicates its themes very well which makes you resonate with it more as a player, than say some fancy movie cutscenes will. It honestly baffles me how game designers or analysts don't take notes from Majora's Mask in designing engaging sidequests that make you actually care about the game world you play in.
Homer J. Simpson “presumed murdered” as in-we are meant to think she is. It’s obvious she isn’t. It’s a requirement to get her back to finish the game.
i dont thing majora's mask is great for subverting expectations .
i think majora's mask is great because of how much the argument they made by subverting expectations resonates as truth.
Majora's mask is saying something deep about the nature of growing up.
its funny how few people notice fierce deity mask is a representation of adult hood .. at the same time Majora's is a kid that refuses to grow up and through your confrontation with him ...you force him to grow up (you see this in his different stages as a boss )
Philip kelton oh yeah. In earlier drafts of the script, I went in to skull kid being the opposite of link with adulthood. He messes everything up like a small child. Link cleans up after him, the adult. Very clever.
Hey great video. Always nice to see different takes on how they saw Majora's Mask's intro.
Sincerely good arguments regarding how the themes serve to aid the experience of the story which is also accompanied by how it affects gameplay. I'm glad I took the time to watch! Definitely worth a rewatch.
Thank you for putting this into words. I've been trying to verbalize how profound Majoras mask is for a very long time and this clarifies several points. Thank you for including monomyth!
Great video! Majora's Mask has always been my favorite Zelda game, its nice to get new insight on the game
one of the best game ever made
I just wanted to say that I'm SO happy that you're back!!!
I love listening to you detail games and anime like this, i get a newfound appreciation for the content and learn more about story telling elements and how to apply them.
I loved both but I loved majora’s mask even more
I am happy that you focused on the end and whole game like everyone else does this very was more unique and fun.
Goat boy at it again with another great analysis!
Shame about the copyright strikes. I LOVE your Erased series, so sad to see parts 1 and 4:have been erased :'(
Perfectly balanced just as all things should be.
still the best zelda story, despite the title change lol
leave me alone yeeeeeppppp.
Didn't even know you uploaded. Nice job reviewing different mediums Mikel!
Thanks so much! Yeah. People haven't been getting my vids in their sub box. p_p
GoatJesus yeah its like being shadowbanned on twitter. But with your content. *Sigh* RUclips's behavior has been bad since spring of 2016 but this is just a new low.
Not a very original point, but it's still true and well made. Good to see you back.
Unsure if there really is a monomyth. Well, there is one now, but it may have been constructed by the scholars who 'described' it rather than actually existing in real myth. Ocarina seems to have used the monomyth but maybe only because it's based on stories based on the idea because they're based on Hero with 1000 faces, or even because the myth is so abstractly described that almost any story can be said to fit it.
While your story-based explanations for removing power at the start of the game make sense, I think you're over analyzing things as a lot of games (e.g. Meteoroid Prime, Castlevania Symphony of the Night) give you loads of power (to show the player what he can do eventually) then take it away (so the player feels acomplished getting back that initial power and getting even more). I suspect these gameplay reasons were the real reason for the intro.
Thank you for the video it's fantastic
...Holy. shit. That's incredible! I never would've thought of this game that way! At least, I don't think I would've... I played it when I was in my early teens, before I knew much about metaphors and subtext. I've learned a whole lot since then (seriously, I majored in English and am constantly analyzing), but even so... I don't think this perspective would've ever occurred to me.
I tried majora's mask once and like most people i was turned off at first, but nowadays hearing many praise for the game did grab my interest
I also heard that the 3ds remake improves alot from the original release but i'm not sure if it convice me to buy new system, then again anything will do then using the awful n64 controller again
I hate the 3ds version, tbh. It changes too much. The boss battles are laughable with giant eyeballs added and there's strange changes like the Happy Mask Salesman giving you the Bomber's Notebook. Plus, you're able to save during the opening...which kinda ruins the tense-ness tbh. It's stuff like that everywhere. I'd honestly recommend playing it on N64 with a new Retro Fighter's controller. retrofighters.com/
I could only finish it on the gamecube because the N64 controller seemed designed to blister your hands
Worthless Winner it is a wretched controller and should be cast into Mordor.
GoatJesus liessssss that controller is amazing 😂
This video is underrated.
Thank you! :)
im glad u changed the title of the video
Ocarina is Nadia, Majora is Evangelion, Wind Waker is FLCL, SO PLEASE DO WIND WAKER!
Personally id love to hear you talk more about other mediums rather then anime. Though you and sudosef (still miss his videos) made the absolute best eva videos, id like to hear your opinion of other stuff while at work.
OoT is the better zelda game but majora wasnt trying to be better, it was trying to be its own story.
Dugon man I think Majora is the best Zelda game. Best side quests, good dungeons. Not the best bosses. Rad atmosphere. Innovative time system that has yet to be replicated. Overall, if someone to ask me which was the better, I’d say Majora personally. But Ocarina...oh man, the nostalgia is just so real. Whenever I think of Zelda I remember being 5 and playing OoT. It’s probably my personal favorite Zelda for sure. The dungeons and bosses are so spot on. Both are games are brilliant ofc. I personally don’t really like what the franchise has become. It’s lost it’s identity ever since Twilight Princess tried so desperately to recreate the magic. Has been struggling ever since, especially with Fujibayashi at the helm. At least imo.
GoatJesus it's pretty hard to be completely objective on a franchise that hits home with so many people and creates such personal experiences with varying different games in the franchise.
To me Ocarina hit that near perfect balance of story and gameplay that no other zelda has imitated as well yet. Wind waker may have a better story but its gameplay was lacking (less dungeons, tedius sailing at times, that triforce fetch quest) while twilight princess might be the best at gameplay but its story and setting leave you underwhelmed (oh boy, this gannon fight doesnt feel tacked on and forced at all). Now I have my own subjective view on ocarina (it helped a 13 year old boy cope in a extremely bad time and didnt let him commit suicide) but i think I can put those aside and see OoT as the game id say IS legend of zelda.
Thats why Majoras mask is so fricken good. All the other zeldas tend to ape on ocarina but Majora said "screw that, we're gonna do our own thing!" And they crafted an insane surreal experiance that doesnt live on its predecessors legacy but forged its own.
Definitely. I think Ocarina is the definitive version of...itself! BUT Majora was totally different while being very much a Zelda game.
Thank you
Hmm thinking about it, if we look at the sword as the symbol of power which comes with adulthood, in the monomyth based stories generally but also to A Link To The Past, Ocarina starts to be somewhat subversive as those kind of stories rarely show the bad side of growing up and importance of childhood, they just tell you grow up as fast as possible because there are no upsides to being a kid, might be do to the fact that children were often seen as lesser beings through history (Christianity going against this was big deal) for example, in ancient Rome the "patriarch" of the family could the kill any family member, which meant children and women and in ancient Greece it was acceptable by their religion to kill babies if you leave them alone for the nature to do the job. Compared to ancient stories like King Arthur and stuff and even contemporaries like A Link To The Past and Star Wars it's pretty incredible, especially when you factor in the meta narrative of Ocarina, Link goes 7 years into the future because that was how long it took from ALTTP to Ocarina, and when you consider that Links reward in the end is going back to his childhood, you realize that that's exactly what fans got for their wait, a new Zelda game, bigger, better(shut up, at the time everyone thought that) and more developed. Not just a return, but a continuation. To go even further, games were(and still are to some extent) considered just for children, and if you were old enough to beat ALTTP yourself when it came out, you'd be an adult by the time Ocarina comes out, and there it is telling you it's ok to not only play video games, but keep to some of you childhood. Link was based on Peter Pan after all... And then Majora comes out... Now that I realize this, Majora's themes of loss of innocence make even more sense. Zelda games really are powerful stuff. Thanks for opening my eyes to this!
This is an excellent video
Like these shorter analysis videos, gone of majora's mask honestly replayed it recently and that middle section is brutal and not in a good way, nice to see affirmations on why I loved it in the first place.
Anime youtube is a fucking hole at the moment probably for the best that you diversify, look forward to some film videos. :)
Yeah. I'd love to cover more stuff. Other anime youtubers do it, so why not me?
Fantastic video!
I see it this way:
Game takes away your achievements to not build on top of them and instead make you achieve what you already did.
If i will ever want to play game emulating the feeling of washing dishes, majora's mask will be my first choice.
Great video.
xD you made a video on majora's mask, ye i love this game
I like more and think Majora's is better than Ocarina. I think it is more complex and mature, but people always say "nah Ocarina it's the best game ever because everywhere says it is" and that's the only reason they will give you when you say Majora's is better.
I mean, can you think for yourselves?
Ocarina is predestined to be more liked, it is THE ULTIMATE INTERACTIVE MONOMYTH, something mutual to almost every human, Majora is deeper but not necessarily more well made, it's just like Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back.
RIP: Profile pic
media.discordapp.net/attachments/457177054652399644/457898785704509452/ThunderCats_GoatHorse.png
Im doing the calarts style.
GoatJesus 2012 - 2018
Since you make game videos lately, I suggest doing a video on *Xenogears!!!*
Waffles Amazing Game!
I'm playing through it right now. That's going to take a long time if he were to do it. It won't help keeping a constant flow of content.
I tried playing Xenogears once. I didn't finish it, tho.
GoatJesus Oh man... you really should continue it, that game is mindfucked & heartfelt, has characters you would care about and it's basically Evangelion the game so it's open to interpretation of all sorts.
ha ha HA!
Patrons
Thanatos388
Thantos388 o_O
I think this video needs a better title
Like what?
GoatJesus this video seems mostly dedicated to how the beginning shapes your views, you talk about its philosophies and how different it all is.
A title that isn't "best story" I honestly almost avoided this video for such a title. Seeing such a thing + Zelda game = a bit obnoxious (seeing as you'll kinda see that every where.)
I'm not going to tell you what to name the video, but "Majoras Mask subversion and narrative brilliance " or something out there. Those RUclips "essays " tend to title there videos in a way that calls attention to the specific things they plan to focus on, this isn't always the case of course but I think you can piece together what I'm getting at.
Side note I don't think that Angel Luis Ruiz first name is pronounced that way.
I changed it (for some reason) lol.
If I get less views from a not-click-bait title, I'm blaming you tho.
GoatJesus Actually, the new title is so much better. I would have skipped just another Majora's Mask story video, but i love in depth analysis videos into its underlying themes. New title is the only reason i watched, its an attention grabber. You made a good call.
ha *HA!*
Wow..you just totally ignored the mask salesman
Umm Epona didn't get murdered but maybe I misunderstand.
Also the more eccentric or disturbing stuff in Majora works because the gameplay itself communicates its themes very well which makes you resonate with it more as a player, than say some fancy movie cutscenes will.
It honestly baffles me how game designers or analysts don't take notes from Majora's Mask in designing engaging sidequests that make you actually care about the game world you play in.
Homer J. Simpson “presumed murdered” as in-we are meant to think she is. It’s obvious she isn’t. It’s a requirement to get her back to finish the game.
GoatJesus My bad, nice vid, there really isn't enough indepth talk on this game compared to OOT :)
Thanks!
Why does your profile pic look like a Cartoon Network reboot?
MonsterMike because I’m already a demon.
Your a boy?!?!