Our First Look at Tennant's Return!
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- Опубликовано: 20 ноя 2023
- Harry reacts to the Doctor inventing the Dalek.
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David Tennant is a top class actor. Great to see him return to this role even if it's just a few minutes
Yeah, hopefully they're able to get him back for a cameo in the 60th.
I like seeing younger pre-accident Davros.
What I hate is the implication that this is ‘fixing’ Davros because the way he always looked before is somehow ‘wrong’. The claims he’s making here is that from now on he will always look like this because Davros being a withered figure with cybernetic modifications in a life support vehicle is in some way offensive and harmful.
As if Davros is a negative outdated depiction of a disabled person, when in reality he’s a resilient and perseverant evil genius who refused to let near death disability stop him waging war and engineering weaponry.
He’s not ‘an example of a disabled person’, he’s a character who is disabled.
Being in a wheelchair doesn’t define him, and he certainly doesn’t define being in a wheelchair.
The whole issue feels ridiculous. Who was complaining about this before?
Frankly it makes me a little worried about the next era of the show, my faith in RTD is being shaken.
We hoped his new version of the show would be a return to form but out the gate he’s already doing things like this.
Retconning the entire design of one the show’s biggest villains in an attempt to virtue signal (and even then he crammed in a very forced line about Jodie being a “really great woman” like they’ll never leave the matter of 13 being a bad version of the character alone until the public magically change their mind)
I will have to state (as a major fan of RTD1 era along with Classic Who) that while I did like seeing Davros pre-disability was interesting from a curiosity perspective, I hope RTD bears in mind the REASON that Davros was originally designed as he was and it wasn’t to paint disabled people in a negative light.
The choice was a story-conscious one as it drew a strong through line between creator and creation. In short, Davros’ own disabled condition inspired the form that he would use for his ultimate creations and drove his insane, narcissistic desire to put his own people into a condition very much similar to his own. Davros thought himself a god and, as a god, desired a creation made in his own image. Of course, this very literal explanation can get tiresome to repeat every time one sees the character on-screen, so one makes the explanation visual instead. Davros’ life-support/wheelchair unit looks identical to the base of a Dalek “travel machine”, a device which also serves as a life-support unit to the Dalek mutant contained inside as Davros ensured that the Kaled’s supposedly “superior” ultimate genetic form would be rendered unable to survive on its own in open air for very long. This renders the Dalek mutant creature effectively disabled, similar to how Davros is also disabled…a creation made in the image of its creator. Add to that Davros using his advanced technology to quite literally overwrite the minds of the hapless Kaleds who got mutated into the very first Daleks and you now effectively have an entire race of Davros’, primed and ready to rain death and destruction upon every single thing that they perceive as not being Dalek…or even, not Dalek ENOUGH.
By making such a strong visual through line between Davros (creator) and Dalek (creation) while still making Davros himself stand out as unique…thus also being representative of such a leader elevating themselves over their followers by allowing themselves freedoms forbidden to everyone else, in this case, being clearly NOT a Dalek yet desiring the loyalty of the Daleks, all the while knowing that said Daleks were literally DESIGNED to exterminate anything that ISN’T Dalek…works wonders in exploring the full psychological reasoning of the character without having to go into a long drawn-out dissertation on the subject every time the character appears. How Davros looks says EVERYTHING you need to know regarding the sort of individual you’re dealing with. A full-on grandios narcissistic sociopath with not so much delusions of grandeur as much as straight-up delusions of GODHOOD who managed to forcefully create his own deadly psycho cult with ambitions vast enough to make the Nazis wet themselves, the capabilities to bring these horrors about and the zeal to stop at nothing to do so.
I highly recommend the tie-in comic adventure “Liberation of The Daleks” to see just how frighteningly tenacious the Daleks can be…and then picture the madman who brought them into existence.
A Davros who doesn’t at all resemble his creations, I’m afraid, will not and cannot have the same impact long-term as, while it is clear the madness is still present, the strong visual through line isn’t. It makes the Dalek design lack its reasoning, why make them look like oversized pepper pots and be functionally disabled? It doesn’t make quite the same narrative sense as it does when you see Davros strongly resembling a Dalek even before the Daleks THEMSELVES come into being.
Davros works best when creator resembles creation…
It's wrong because in the novelization of Genesis of the Daleks, it is said that Davros had his accident before creating The Daleks
Completely agree that seeing Davros like this is refreshing for the show and enjoyable. The issue is the reasons for doing so. Watching the clip for the first time, I immediately thought it was a really cool and interesting design of the classic villain.
RTD seems to imply that post-accident Davros will never return, making the "new" Davros a retcon and a permanent replacement. It may also already be a retcon because somewhere I've seen it said that Davros' chair inspired the design of the daleks, which this special contradicts straight up. And on top of that I've not seen a single disabled person comment on the videos saying "I'm disabled and I agree with the change", only people saying "I'm disabled and this change was unnecessary". There are numerous other comments explaining how RTD's description of Davros as a "wheelchair user" is nonsense - who asked for this?
I've seen a couple of disabled people agree (notably someone writing for Radio Times on the subject) but there seems to have been more objecting to it.
I had the thought that Dalek Technology could easily rustle up a duplicate body or download Davros' memories elsewhere - maybe the almighty creator sought to update his methods? Maybe that's the direction RTD goes down so as not to contradict existing story. There's a way for it all to work but it remains to be seen how it will play
i like how russel always says ABsolutely
Julian's still got it as Davros and I kinda like seeing the character pre-accident. I'm just choosing to ignore RTD's latest interview about the chair.
He didn’t age a day
Well it was his birthday when they filmed this
While it was cool to see Davros pre-irradiation, finding out the simpering right-on reasoning they decided to do it is just nauseating.
It’s stupid but it’s fun, perfect for raising money for children having a tough time. Can’t wait for the full episodes this weekend and beyond.
Missed opportunity to not make a joke about the 456 being the opposite of Children in Need, because they are in Need of Children
I NEVER associated disability with evil or villains, though I didn't hate seeing Davros before the injuries.
I love harry
"Brilliant woman"?! Certainly not.
Yay
I think the Davros change was mandated by Disney, since they are giving BBC extra money for the budget, since he had not had any trouble with Davros in his original run.
I do like the change but davros was never a fully wheelchair bound person originally, he's in one from war injuries same as the face scars
I think many people are getting the wrong idea. He's not retonning what has been done. The way he speaks about it, sounds like if be ever brings Davros back, it will either be in tnr past, pre accident, or in the tbe future, possibly patching himself up.
I had some of the same reaction REALLY enjoying this over Chibnall's era.
How’s the Korean salad bread go?
After the second Wilderness Years period known as the Chibnall/Whitaker era I was highly anticipating the return of RTD and then I watched the children in need Mini episode and the behind the scenes special with RTD lecturing the audience and my emotions have gone from anticipation to dread! 😮
He’s always been this way, not sure why you were expecting otherwise.
@@Sparx632when has he ever been this way.
@@wardjunior1450 when he revived the show he changed everything via a progressive lens and didn’t care what fans had to say about it, for example changing the role of the companion to be more active with character development rather than just the screaming sidekick with an undeveloped backstory, which they only very slightly did away with right at the end with Ace, or adding in romance and kissing scenes literally commenting in Confidential that he knew people would come out with “this isn’t the Doctor Who I grew up with” but not caring what people said about it. Only difference now is the issues that concern society, such as representation and diversity.
@@Sparx632The kissing started in the TV movie
@@MichaelM28 and disability representation started with Moffat. My point was simply that RTD has the same attitude he always has.
It's a comedic little skit for Children in Need. I thought it was already miles better than Chibnall's writing. I dunno why so many people want to ruin a good thing. Just enjoy it.
It's hard to enjoy it after Russell T Davies permanently ruined Davros
Yes, it would just be a stupid, (not very funny, embarassing and cringy) comedy sketch, not worth more than an eye roll, if it wasn't for RTDs condescending and sanctimonious justification for Davros' complete redesign.
@@MichaelM28 They haven't permanently ruined him, nor have they retconned him. This is *before* he's ripped up his cells to create the Daleks.
@@couruu
He didn't rip up his own cells. He was a victim of a bomb attack from the Thals.
Hold on, what? So this is before he ripped up his cells to create the daleks?!? Is what you are saying? Can I point out to you the pepper-pot shaped elephant literally in the centre of the room here?!
@@markpostgate2551 Ah, my mistake - was mixing up the story he tells in The Stolen Earth to be about how he created the Daleks, not to be about the *new* Daleks
5:00 People change, people learn. 15 Years passed.
6:00 I do agree, that I kinda don't understand explaining yourself. But you know RTD will do what he will do.
Because it's a Children In Need special. For a charity that (amongst other things) helps disabled kids. You don't want to be showing disabled kids that people in wheelchairs or otherwise disabled are evil.
Anyone telling you otherwise is someone who grew up in a generation (including the one I'm from) where calling people "cripples" or "spastics" or "retards" wasn't that big a deal and haven't moved with the times - you can see someone of them in these very comments.
@Jayfive276
so you opt for disabled childern to be wrapped up in cotton wool to the point where seeing a disabled vilian upsets them?.
childern arent dumb, they can just see a character as character and dont need to make a big fuss something as trival as character in wheelchair as they know it a part of there character
So...handicapped man here - I walk with a cane due to a stroke and Multiple Sclerosis, not in a wheelchair YET, but according the government, I still qualify. I will not say I represent all the handicaps and handicapables out there, but personally I do not feel discriminated against because handicapped people can be evil in shows. For crying out loud, we had Professor X from X-Men give us our "heroic representation." A man who was useful with his mind, since his body crapped out on him.
Just...let minorities be good, let them be evil. Let them be ANY trait, it's fine. We're big boys and girls; you don't need to pander to us.
The universe is microorganism neuron bacteria the the bacteria.
Yay, getting lectured by RTD on how bad we are. That is dissapointing.
RTD litterly removes diversity for the sake of diversity. Not because he wants to show us davros in his humoid form pre-daleks.
What an awesome champ. After departure of Tennent, i'm pretty sure I'll depart again.
I would be quite stoked for a pre-dalek serial set on war torn Skaro with an uncrippled Davros; a kind of game of thrones/breaking bad/house of cards/1984/starship troopers/richard iii/the stars my destination/goodfellas/tinker tailor soldier spy/gotham/i, claudius dystopian fantasy charting his descent from human being to monster, but not written by the current team. I don't think he has the insight for it. A Terry Nation or Robert Holmes could do it. Maybe some of the writing team from The Expanse or Alan Moore.
Firstly, the kaleds are not the only fascists on Skaro; the condition of unending multigenerational war and the totalitarianism and propaganda and authoritarianism that entails means the entire planet is radicalised muttos against norms, thals against kaleds - it should be nightmarish.
If you think it is as simple as the Thals were the goodies and Kaleds were the baddies you need to go back and watch Genesis again. Also, for a full length serial there can afford for the story to be more complex than a tale of two warring nations; there would be different factions within each, political coups and dissident cells and conspiracies and assassinations and competing ideologies.
It can't be Allo Allo on an alien planet. But all political intrigue and backstabbing.
Davros can walk around unscarred and able-bodied for most of that. His injuries and physical deteriation would be a climax point in the third act.
Addendum: I have got a really good tagline to pitch: "Davros created the Daleks but Skaro created Davros."
what about this was a lecture? He himself was showrunner when they showed Davros in a wheelchair...
He's even clarifying that he's not blaming anyone, but that this is a different time so he doesnt feel it would be right
i think russell is coming from a legitimate place about taking davros out of his unit! i saw a lot of people (mostly classic who supremacists) pretty mad about the change, so i think maybe he was anticipating that. but also in some ways it acts as an acknowledgment that that's an issue? idk!
Going from Children of Earth to a silly Children in Need special is such a whiplash 😂
My god, this comments section is dramatic 😂
It's truly a cross-section of the best to worst aspects of the fandom. How did you manage that? 🤣
As someone who has been in and out of wheelchairs for 10 years, I'm tired of you all already 😂
No but seriously what I'd personally like (from a broad media perspective) is more disabled heroes to balance out the disabled villain issue
Dude you look so much better with long hair. Grow it back
the
I'm getting the feeling that there's a large portion of the fanbase that straight up thinks that RTD retconned Davros to have always been standing. Also some people should just watch the Unleashed clip and not blindly hating on everything they get told about.
How have you all still not seen the unleashed episode yet, that is literally what happened, RTD says exactly that
RTD said that he had Davros standing as there’s supposedly a negative correlation between disability and evil when Davros is in a wheelchair.
@@jamescarr1265
RTD is Davies. Do you mean Davros?
I don't like this new design of RTD2, I tell you; what was wrong with the classic design in Star Wars? Oh he can't speak in beeps and whistles now because current year, I suppose!.~ 😉
@@markpostgate2551Um, what?
@@HOTD108_
You know Davies is now commonly being referred to as RTD2 to distinguish him from... er himself... in 2008, when he was routinely referred to as RTD (on account of those being his initials, following the tradition of JNT or John Nathan-Turner; also a chubby gay man who broke the glass ceiling by being the first chubby gay showrunner of Doctor Who to be known specifically by his three letter initials, back in the dark times before the enlightenment. Enlightenment being a four part serial in the middle of season 20 and written by a woman which was unheard of in those days, but I digress)..
R2D2 (very similar name, see?) was a dome headed cylindrical robot, about waist high, that ran on casters in a science fiction franchise that was popular from the late 70s until the mid 80s called "Star Wars". I suppose a lot of people have forgotten about it now, but back in the day it was very popular. He was white and metallic with blue decals and he couldn't speak; he had to communicate by bleeps and whistles that would be interpreted by his companion, a bronze, slightly affected and supercillious (a word which implies the existence of an antonym; subcillious) android called C3PO.
So, the conceit of the joke is that I have incorrectly assumed that RTD2 (who is the man who is the new showrunner of Doctor Who) is a redesign of R2D2, the iconic little robot (or "droid" as they would call them in this "Star Wars" of which I speak. I think it might be available on DVD.)
Hence, imagine this cute little robot (he was considered to be cute because he was small and kind of cheeky and headstrong) has been redesigned as a chubby bespectacled welshman and all they have kept is the dome shaped head!
That's the joke.
The joke was inspired by James inadvertantly calling Davros, "Davies". Now Davros has also been redesigned, because he used to be in a mobile life support like the bottom half of a dalek, but now he is just a man, bipedal, looking roughly like the main character in Despicable Me if he was an extra in, funnily enough, Star Wars - it's all come Full Circle... which was another four parter in JNT's first season as showrunner (kind of spooky isn't it?).
So talking about Davies aka RTD2 being a redesign of an iconic character (R2D2) is a parodic allegory for talking about Davros as an iconic character being redesigned as something more mundane and unremarkable.
It was complex; there is a lot of levels going on here. Much like RTDs writings my jokes require a comanion series in which I get to talk about how I made them, what inspired me and how brilliant I am and how jokes prior to mine were products of their time but we have moved on since then! (This too is parody still. See it's got a bit meta now. Because now I am making a joke about me explaining my joke that is also making allusion to the fact that Russell T Davies always has a companion series to tell you how brilliant the thing he has just made is and how it is better than Doctor Who used to be, and he doesn't understand why the fans, (people who have loved the programme from when it was as it used to be because that was when it was being...) would find that slightly insufferable.)
If this had been made by a group of fans it would have been great, but as It is It just came across as embarrassing to me....
It's a Children in Need special. They're always a bit jokey.
commented this somewhere else so i'll paste here too
my partner is a wheelchair user and after watching the skit genuinely mentioned they didn't really like when evil characters such as Davros are disabled and specifically in wheelchairs like that (Davros is essentially in a Dalek wheelchair let's not pretend that it's not because he can't walk(which we see in that Capaldi 2 parter)) RTD did it himself with John Lumic too. Personally, I think with Davros there's some level of intentional irony and nazi satire. like he has this eugenics vision of a perfect race but the Daleks hate him. he's not a part of his own vision. and I don't think this means we won't ever see Davros in a chair again. I think they might do stories before his accident or condition like this is, but they wouldn't change the canon like that.
I'll say this. it's not about saying an individual disabled character can't be a bad guy because it's bad representation. that's not the issue and it's not limited to just doctor who I'm afraid. it's about a long-running ableist trope of disabled bad guys (often higher bad guy representation than good or neutral) and the disabilities essentially turning the characters evil (hence showing Davros was evil before the chair here, probably)
and thats not considering the children in need context and the fact this probably isn't a retcon, it's just a time thing
Wouldn’t the solution be to have positive disabled characters in addition to evil ones? Rather than taking away already evil disabled characters?
@@amelialikesfrogs5778It is a retcon as originally he had his accident before he started work on the Daleks
@@MichaelM28 in the show? the expanded canon has never been beyond being retconned by the main show, it happens all the time. just one glance at the wiki you'll realize how difficult it is to pin down Doctor Who Canon. the phrase "according to one account" is used alot because alot of canon is conflicting already
Are you going to go full Olly London and get the surgery?
Strong contender for one of the greatest shitposts of all time
iPads?
On Skaro?
Are you serious?
Sci-fi has been using tablet tech for years. Now that it actually exists IRL it's suddenly unrealistic.
Didn't they used to have everything written on acetate, presumably because they had run out of paper during the war of attrition? "Memo: due to rationing and supply shortages, it is requested that staff refrain from using paper to print important documents. However since the overhead projectors have been scrapped and recycled as part of the war effort our surplus supplies of acetate shall hereby be used as substitutes until further notice."
Or maybe I am thinking of one of the other classic Who stories.
The decor here is looking a bit flash given there is a war of attrition on. I seem to remember kaled laboratories in Genesis were a bit sparser and less like the set of a rock musical.
We could mention multiculturalism on Skaro too. The whole planet is literally two racist city-states at war with each other because one lot has brown hair and the other lot has blonde hair.
Now apparently they really don't mind racial differences. Makes you wonder why they irradiate their entire planet in a neutronic war.
Man dressed as a Nazi gets excited at the suggestion of the word "extermination" and its played as light hearted comedy.
But... we have to get rid of Davros' dalek half because that could be potentially offensive!
Hmmm... making light of the holocaust... depicting a malevolent disabled character... which of these two things will cross the line in the sand, I wonder.
"I am very smart"
@@Jayfive276
Bless you, is that what your mummy tells you?
So far RTD has ruined Davros, Tegan and Nyssa and his first episode hasn't even aired yet
stop being dramatic
How has he ruined Tegan and Nyssa?
@@Sparx632By retconning their husbands and children in Big Finish and making them a couple
@@PD-gt1dmNo!
@@MichaelM28 there are far bigger retcons in the show’s history and they’re in the main show itself. Big Finish is side media that gets thousands of listeners compared to the show’s millions of viewers. Plus it’s even easier to ignore canon you don’t like there than it is in the main show.
“How is this 2 minute clip better than the entirety of the Chibnall era?”
Maybe Chibnall randomly gender swapping the doctor for literally no reason has something to do with it…
That and his awful writing
Are you referring to the "brilliant woman"?
When has the Doctor ever had something positive to say about a previous incarnation? ("Time Crash" my inner devil's advocate just uttered. Oh yeah, I suppose that is similar circumstances, but even so...) that is him saying that about himself; he is saying "I was brilliant as a woman" does he mean a brilliant version of himself or a brilliant version of woman? Because if it's the latter that is quite misogynistic. Oh because you're a man you can do a better job of being a woman than a woman? Who are you, Dylan Mulvaney? 😂
but why did they need a reason to justify the gender swapping in the first place?
Shame he came back but story just kick u in balls but thing is In his mind he doesn’t wanna offend anyone, because Davos is a wheelchair dam disabled people stealing our parking spots 😂😂😂 is annoying tho. And now 2 doctor. Black doctor young trailing Well old doctor stay at earth protecting it grow old regenerate. Now 2 same world now force trans people
I was hoping that RTD would breath new life into Doctor Who after Chinballs killed the show, not rape it's corpse!!! 🤢
Very strong opinion considering we haven’t seen a single actual episode from his second era yet.
@@Sparx632No but he's already retconned Tegan and Nyssa into a lesbian couple and absolutely ruined Davros.
@@MichaelM28 so because some side characters have been “ruined” in side media the show itself is being “raped”. I’m not changing my statement.
@@MichaelM28
How can Nyssa and Tegan be a lesbian couple. Nyssa was left on Terminus and Tegan was left in Southwark, I think. Looked like Southwark. Near the Thames, at any rate. How did they hook up? Space-time Tindr?
That is some fanboy shipping going on there! When is Davies going to grow up?
@@Sparx632 Tegan and Nyssa aren't side characters