Porsche 911 GT3 Touring | How Much Does a Manual Transmission Slow You Down?
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- Опубликовано: 11 окт 2024
- Carlos Lago tests and reviews the 2018 Porsche 911 GT3 Touring. We all know manual transmissions are slower than automatics. But have you ever wondered by how much? Or, more importantly, is that difference worth the premium a typical automatic commands over a manual transmission? That's exactly what we set to find out. In this video, we'll test and compare a Porsche 911 GT3 with a manual transmission against one with an automatic transmission to see what that difference is and whether it's worth anything.
Q: What kind of engine and transmission does the Porsche 911 GT3 Touring have?
A: The Porsche 911 GT3 Touring has a 4.0-liter flat-six and a six-speed manual transmission.
Q: How much does the Porsche 911 GT3 Touring cost?
A: The 2018 Porsche 911 GT3 starts at $145,650, including destination and gas-guzzler tax. The vehicle tested in this video has a few options ― including carbon-ceramic brakes, a front-axle lifting system and bucket-style seats ― that bring the price to $164,210. The Touring package that adds the manual transmission is a no-cost option.
Q: How quick is the Porsche 911 GT3 Touring?
A: During testing, the Porsche 911 GT3 Touring reached 60 mph in 3.8 seconds (3.6 seconds with a 1-foot rollout, as on a drag strip) and clocked a quarter-mile time of 11.7 seconds at 121.9 mph. That's half a second slower than the automatic-equipped 911 GT3 across the board.
Q: Should I buy a manual?
A: If you enjoy the act of driving, most definitely.
Read our review of the Porsche 911 here: www.edmunds.co...
Edmunds - we help you find your perfect car with unbiased and useful reviews, advice, pricing and tools. Visit us at www.edmunds.com/.
This may be the best video Carlos has done since joining Edmunds. This is very much like what he was doing at Motor Trend, and why I would imagine he was hired in the first place. More like this please. This is what Carlos should be doing.
Just depends on how much you sit in traffic and your own personal tolerance level.
Would say i miss Carlos on motortrend but motortrend doesnt really exist on youtube anymore besides ads for their paywall content.
Great vid tho
This is why Edmunds gained a subscriber, and Motor Trend lost one.
That is what I appreciate most about Porsche's push toward bringing back manuals. It's not about numbers and goes against all the internet trolls who simply look at specs and times without any comprehension of the feel and tactility that only a manual can provide.
A cliche comment sbout manuals. With the quality of top automatics and not having to take your hand off the steering wheel to shift i will take any Porsche in auto.
I agree so much. People also judge manual transmissions poorly for the belief that all manuals are born equal, they are not.
I've had a pletora of manuals and they all feel so different from one another. A car i've had in the past had a set so well made, so equilibrated that my friends used to say that "he shifts so smooth it feels automatic". I could manage shifting fast and smoothly, even driving that bogger in traffic was pleasant... Some other manuals make me feel suicidal, so badly matched, such poor equilibrium between flywheel damping characteristics, ratio drops, pedal positioning, shifter quality... like if the manufacturer couldn't care less about driving.
Most manuals are manuals for lower costs and people compare them to cars that are automatic as a comfort option. Try driving something manual as an option, something with atention to detail.
Funny thing, you know how people troll the americans for not knowing how to drive manual, well while most high end sports car company were shying away from manuals, in recent year I think only Porsche kept it and not in every model, american brand never stoped using it in their sports car. Hell, some of their top end sport car can only be had in manual, such as the Viper, C6 ZR1/Z06, any 1LE package Camaro, GT350 and many other. FFS you can get a convertible, manual C7 ZR1 with 755hp lol.
So if any brands can be hailed for keeping manuals alive, it's the american brands.
@@fredbrochu8322 WOW yes you're right Fred. Although European models add manuals to their non sport cars while American cars usually only add it to their sports and hatch cars.
Either way glad to see the manuals still breathing
I miss them in trucks so much
A manual is beastly in the dirt and mud.
My old square body chevy had a 454 and a Muncie bolted to it and I could go through ANYTHING in it if I kept the revs up.
I was really surprised how quick the 991.2 gt3 is at the top end. I drove it back to back with the new R8 and it was shocking that the GT3 FELT quicker. what a sleeper in a straight line
@2012日本語がわかりません a title reserved for ordinary road cars that have enormous power under the hood. usually this points to cars that have been tuned to hell without putting on a disgusting stupid outward appearance. there is nothing ordinary about any porsche, a damn GT car of all things. not a sleeper.
Crepitus the 911 is literally the most subdued performance car. The GT3 touring is somewhat of a sleeper because it has no wing, and it looks like the base model.
I miss those videos with Carlos.... we want more!!!
i miss motor trend carlos :C
This channel deserves more subscribers. Well done, Carlos. Being a fan of yours for many years.
Wonderful video which captures exactly why high revving great sounding manual transmission cars are so good to drive.
In a perfect world, I'd have both a manual and PDK version of the GT3. However, to put this manual vs automatic debate into perspective, even if the manual is "slower", it's still going to be faster than probably 95% of the sport cars you'll encounter on an everyday basis. So in the real world of driving, not only will you be faster than most anyone else, but you'll also be in control of your input at the same time.
That's a win-win-win-win everytime!
As a BRZ manual owner - ya I know only “200” hp, finally someone has described the feeling that I feel when I’m ripping gears through back roads that makes me smile! Well done sir!
And when I save/make enough with investing, I’m buying this exact car! Blue GT3 touring manual!
I'm a simple man; I see Carlos, I hit the like button.
I'm an even simpler man, I see a comment about Carlos, I reply and like the comment.
I hit dislike button when I see GT3 without rear wing.
@@mariusz76a you dont like having options?
@@mariusz76a I have a manual GT3 with the wing, and sometimes I wish I had the touring. I mean it is a manual, a car as Carlos said doesnt care about the numbers, so why is the wing a must? you really dont need that much more down force if is not a hardcore racer. You see a touring in the street and you have to respect the diver because you know it is a manual and you know it was bought to be properly driven and enjoyed, but when you see a regular GT3 you are not sure if its a manual or an automatic.
I agree. I Subscribed to this channel just so there is a CHANCE I will be able to see him do another one.
He needs weekly segments, if he does not already have them.
I can tell Carlos wants to keep the car..lol
You have captured and described so well the essence of the whole thing - Excellent and Thank you!
I'll take the "stick" and have a shitload of fun in every curve, every uphill, every downhill, I control what happens. NOT a program. BTW, Launching a manual Porsche, is an acquired skill ;)
Cheers
Totally agree that sensation on the upshift at redline is a special thing. I have only driven manuals for the last 20 years and will continue to do so as long as they are available.
One of your best videos yet! Great topic and analysis, with some interesting details and camera angles!
I’ll stay with the theme here....need more Carlos!!
Top Gear : Chris Harris, Henry Catchpole and Carlos
Harris is a joke
@@markjurczyk chris harris is one of the best reviewer there is.
This is my favorite car on Earth.
Heck yeah! More Carlos!
About the launch control. If you have traction control on and stomp on the gas pedal with first gear and the clutch pedal pressed (like in the video), you can just dump the clutch. The electronics will take care of the rest. No need to manage the clutch. It's in the instructions book. (y)
My dream car is GT3 with a manual. I really hope I will get my hands on one before I turn too old lol...
I saw Carlos i instantly subscribe to the channel . No questions ask !
That's my dream car.
I love how this GT3 looks clean just like the 911R. Manual for me.
It's the same manual found in the 911R and it's completely raw even when you drive it on the street!!!
Not entirely you can't get this with a single mass flywheel. I think the gearbox itself might have been updated for the 991.2
Souheib identical gearbox as R same ratios, R can option SMFW but .2 doesn’t need it as rev’s up just a strong with improved engine
@@souheib9343 True they had to go with the dual mass flywheel because of the cup variant engine oil being fed through the crankshaft they had trouble with the main bearing not standing up to the incredibly high RPM's in conjunction with the 911R single mass flywheel.
When you want a speed machine, they give you the PDK which can take 100 launch controls in a day. When you want the experience, they give you a NA engine that revs to 9000 with a manual gearbox. Seriously, Porsche make great sports cars.
Only 2 reasons to choose PDK over manual. Racing. And being a total bore quoting acceleration times to anyone in earshot. For drivers it's manual. Every time.
Carlos finally said something that makes so much sense. if you want to go fast off the line get a Tesla. If you want o enjoy driving to the fullest get a manual
Sports car for a back road a manual makes perfect sense. In the real world most of us can't afford a 3rd car and it certainly wouldn't be a porsche gt3, so we have to be able to daily our sports cars, and a manual just doesn't work with traffic being the way it seems to be everywhere.
Great to see you again, Carlos!
Fantastic video. 911 with a manual. Heaven
Unreal how the pdk version can launch at over 6k rpm without totally losing control. The rear engine weight distribution reall helps a lot. Awesome time for a 500hp n/a car.
Great video Mr lago! A joy to watch, and it made me feel good feels. You are so good at this. Too bad you don't get to do it that often.
Best video you have done yet .awesome car too
Love me some Carlos
I'm lucky enough to own one of these and I can't say enough great things about the driving experience. I had a 2015 GT3 PDK and these two cars are night and day. If you're tracking the car go for the PDK, if you're looking for a pure driving experience you can't do better than this car. The transmission and shifting engage the driver to the point that there is no care that a PDK is a bit faster. My dealer also told me almost 50% of all GT3's sold were manual so Porsche must have done something right. Great video and great review!
Firstly, the GT3T is the only Porsche for me personally for all the reasons mentioned plus, in reality, on a race course I'm probably faster in it than most in the PDK (not all, of course, but most). Second, I wondered what happened when Carlos (you?) disappeared a couple years ago as he (you) were the only one I kinda enjoyed on the MT channel ( I HATE john lebovic or whatever its name is). Glad I've found you and you're still in the auto-review business.
If you just subtitled the video and let us enjoying that glorious rev up and down shifting.. couldn’t be better... man that N. Aspirated flat six with the highest red rev-linge ..drive me nutSs.
Automatics may be quicker, but manuals are a must for a sports car. With automatic rev matching now a days, it makes it even easier to shift while still keeping the fun factor alive. Sports cars are about the thrill and excitement, not just speed. This is the same reason the Miata is so popular.
Rev-matching is part of the Thrill of using a manual shift. Having the car do it for you dilutes the experience.
@@Audidude I own an s2000 and wholeheartedly agree with you. However, my point was more directed to those that aren't very good at shifting manuals, have no interest, or prefer automatics.
Ow nono sir, automatic revmatching thats a no go. Notice how the word automatic comes in to play there. Nonononono no can do, you want to be engaging so why don't you revmatch yourself. Another mainstream bitch thats just what you are. If it is so good and needed in every "sportscar" than why do f1 cars haven't got manuals, or dtm cars, rally cars......they don't because manuals suck and if driving on the edge you already have engagement enough.
@@swansmeister F1 cars don't have manuals because lap times win races and winning races earns $$$. The average sports car driver isn't earning $ for their lap times which is why manual is still relevant to many of them. Having said that, auto-rev match does dilute the experience, but can be easily turned off in 99.9% of manual cars.
miata is popular because it's affordable and cheap to upgrade for speed should the owner fancy that
I only buy a Manual. I love the action of Shifting when I want and down shifting merging onto the highway of the Beltway and saving that $3,200 extra for that automatic for other things not financing it.
Damn Carlos. Wondered where u went! Really enjoy ur content and presentation style. Look forward to your future vids.
Carlos is great to watch driving and his knowledge and enthusiasm are wonderful. I hated what they did to Motor Trend, I unsubscribed ages ago. Have now subscribe toEdmunds to see more great videos like this.
Great review. Great reviewer. Great car. Thanks Carlos
You never mentioned that this transmission allows you to perform no-lift shifts. Keep your right foot buried in the gas while shifting up or down and experience perfect PDK like shifts at or near redline. It is available to you at all times with or without the Auto-blip feature activated or not. It should allow you to reduce your shift times even lower. Hopefully you got to try that as it is epic! Mark
That “hiccup” between shifts is what i dislike about manuals. I like the continuous nature of the PDK.
Dude, Carlos is awesome. Watched the video just because I saw him on the thumbnail! Lol
Makes me wanna buy a Porsche 911
Great review on why a manual experience is fun! Thank you
Nothing compares to the experience of driving a NA manual transmission Porsche 911 S or GT3👍
Great Video Carlos as always! I am enjoying my GTI M/T and most likely not going to buy a new vehicle till I can afford a GT3 Touring.
5:39 same feels!
Why do stateside journalists insist on calling a PDK an automatic. Its the furthest thing from a torque converted automatic transmission that you'd find in an SUV. The PDK is computer actuated dual clutch transmission. It is a two pedal manual transmission that can be put in an auto shift mode for if you're in traffic or on the phone, but otherwise is shifted by the driver using the steering paddles. Just like any modern race car. Automatics are never faster than clutch actuated manual transmissions, and clutch actuated manual transmissions are not automatics just because a computer makes the gear selections.
Both cars in this test have manual transmissions.
2:14 pretty much sums up why this is my dream car.
Carlos, if you read this, on the Touring (991.2 GT3 manual), you can no lift shift, which it doesn't look like you're doing....it's faster....and it's made to do it...(in owner's manual)
That would cause the engine to hit the RPM limiter if you used the clutch whilst pinning the throttle open? Would that 'stacato' action not impede your progress? Or are we talking about a clutchless shift, yikes? I couldn't do that to my new GT3 (if I had one).I just couldn't.
@Wayne Simpson The 991.2 will electronically cut the throttle when the clutch is depressed. Keep it pinned!
Yeah GM has the same thing on their newer manual performance cars. Still not sure if it actually helps in a really fast shift or not.
@@Dolby109 GM incorporated NLS in their 2008 Chevy Cobalt SS, a sub 25k car new
I'm not a Porsche purist, but this is probably the perfect 911.
That flat 6 sound ... god damn....
Good work, Carlos. Thanks.
Totally agree with you
Unless your talking infinity g35. I had an 06 with the 19's and the high performance package and it was an automatic. The 6 speed had higher horsepower for some reason but auto had more torque.
Great joy Carlos.
I feel you could have talked about how the GT3’s manual is special and has features such as not having to drop off the accelerator to shift up. Have never seen that before.
There's a key point to be aware of regarding the 991.2 GT3 Touring that is not mentioned in the video. The Touring is only available with the manual transmission discussed in this video. The GT3 (non-Touring) comes with either the manual or PDK transmission. If someone knows why the PDK is not an option for the Touring edition, I'm interested in understanding Porsche's rationale for that decision. I like the Touring because of the increased rear visibility as a result of the spoiler delete and because the toned down look makes it appear to be slightly more of a sleeper 911, but also feel the PDK option is more necessary than ever with the Touring because of the loss of downforce as a result of the spoiler delete, while still needing to effectively manage a 4.0L 500hp engine. The PDK would make the Touring the ideal 991.2 911 for my taste. I'll be interested to see if Porsche adds the PDK option for the 992 Touring, if the Touring edition continues.
The Viper is the only manual with very fast 0-60. All the other fast manuals, GT3, 911R, F40, F50 and new Vantage manual seem to all be around 3.7-4.0 0-60
further solidifies that if i get a 992 allocation (probably not) i'll be ordering a manual. so glorious.
That was a damn good launch.
Even though we know 0-60 isn't everything, 3.8 seconds from the manual is still pretty damn quick. Maybe it could even be improved on with more practice. In no way is that slow.
The manual can do 3.5 secs according to motortrend (no idea if it was no lift shifting or not) www.motortrend.com/cars/porsche/911/2018/2018-porsche-911-gt3-first-test-review/
How can you keep up the the shifting with car that fast? It going to be exhausting to drive in a lot of corner.
@@campkira ideally you downshift for the corner, not in the middle of it. It's not really exhausting if you're used to shifting, it's just more engaging. But it's not for everyone. If you're used to an automatic in your daily driver then I guess I could see how you'd find it exhausting.
awesome review
No burps here, just that satisfying...hiccup.
moses strathern hate those artificial backfires, sounds like a damn popcorn maker
I fully agree with the conclusions and I think I am going buy one....
Great video and I completely agree with your assessment. If there is one car that I would immediately buy if i had the money, it would be this. A naturally aspirated, 9000 RPM screamer with a manual. It is a dying breed of car, possibly the last. I would drive it till the wheels fell off.
EXACTLY........JUST FUN.......MORE SMILE PER MILE.
How does this car diff or compare to the 911R? That would be an interesting break down and comparison. It seems very similar idea and intent to the 911R. I fell in love the 911R at first sight...and it’s still a top 2 for my favorite modern Porsche 🤤
Subscribed because of Carlos.
Automatic...no skill to drive...manual is more engaging. Who cares if the manual is .5 second slower....I will take a .5 loss any day for the joy of driving. Great video, btw.
One of my goal cars.
With a "proper" driver the gap is minimal (most people aren't but just won't admit it) but overall automatics in general just give people more confidence in driving since they are easier and mostly faster.
In a F1 race (under 2 hours), a driver makes over 3600 gear changes.
Yes the differences are subtle when looking at a single shift, but over a greater distance, it’s a massive improvement to use an automatic. Plus you know the quality of each gear change is a given. 3600 manual changes will include some iffy ones, even with a professional driver.
You’re also removing one hand from the steering wheel, and this has further implications.
People need to stop holding onto manual cars and embrace this step forward in technology.
About fell and engagement, not speed. If you only care about speed get a Tesla S
great review.
5:44 That sound.
Would have been more interesting if you'd compared the two transmissions going around a track.
pdk and automatic are for people who want to show off. Manual is for people who like to drive. It's as simple as that.
No, it is not. Cabrios are for people who wants to showoff.
Okay but the auto driver will beat you on track.
Who gives a fuck about lap times?
Driving is about the engagement .. an automatic just cant give that.
When there is the option to choose, you're kind of right.
No it's not "as simple as that." I prefer a manual, definitely. But for serious track people, the auto wins EVERY time. C'mon people, not everybody likes what you or I do...Let's leave it at that.
What i really want to know is how much the wing helps. I suspect it helps not one iota
No. Not an electric Tesla. The thought is repugnant ! Great vid. New sub.
We need a GT3 Cabriolet and a GT3 Targa both in "Touring" configuration and with an optional manual transmission. Imagine dropping the top and hearing that engine.
That would lose the point of "GT" isn't it. The reason It sound good because You give it everything you got.
Why not compare using the manual's launch control and no lift shift? In that mode, you just dump the clutch at full throttle and floor it the whole time. The electronics control the engine output the whole time just like pdk
Hey Carlos you could be the first automotive journalist to use a roll race test when comparing head to head acceleration. 0-60 and 1/4 mile testing was fine back when cars made a lot less power but now days the launch is so critical that it heavily skews the rest of the performance data and doesn't paint the whole picture. Dig racing has become so unbalanced and out of reach for common cars that sanctioned roll races events have popped up are becoming more and more popular where competitors are lined up at 50mph.
More Carlos!!!!
Were you flat shifting the manual during the 0-60 run? The graph shows the shift points. But if you flat shift (which you can do in the GT3), I wonder if it would improve acceleration or maybe you were already doing it?
Driven right, this car is awesome!
Well automatic gear box ...you might as well buy a self driving car instead...
And what happens when the gear box stops working properly... automatic gear box will have to be entirely changed.... while manual can be fixed or use spare parts...
It depends how much money you're willing to spend on car maintenance... when things go wrong...
did you not try the flat shift feature on the car.?.. is amazing
Not all automatics are faster, most dual clutch automatics are - Porsche makes one of the best out there. The manual box was originally developed for the 911R, with plans to then fit it to the GT3 later which they did.
And what about traffic? the PDK is much more comfortable. I've owned 991s with both transmissions and the PDK is, by far, my favorite.
I do wonder, is it better than a 997 GT3 (RS)? The 991 has the electric steering, more weight and a longer wheelbase (if I'm not mistaken), so with this emphasis on feel, the 997 should be comparable
The 997 gt3 will feel much more analog, but not as capable as this newer chassis
@@papa_pt give me analogue and less weight any day!
Awesome video
Carloooooos!
I thought Carlos was dead. Didn't see him on motortrend for awhile
I have a miss shift phobia when I bought my first manual car (TT-rs) 1-2-1 scary ....... it only happens when i try to shift as fast as PDK😂
I will even take this over a *BUGATTI*
Henrik Ahlin Johnsen I would too
And I wouldn’t blame you.
Well then
Henrik Ahlin Johnsen I'd take the Bugatti, sell it, and buy more cars like this
I won't cause i won't spend 2.5 million bucks for a ugly boat.
All i want is a simple sportcar cause it's simple. Reason you ask?
Manual
RWD
9000 RPM FREAKING FLAT 6!!
And it's fun, very fun
I even test drove one.
How Much Does a Manual Transmission Slow You Down? Some for sure. But How much more pleasure it'll give you ? A LOT