When SHOULD the Doctor have cried in Season 1? | Doctor Who
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- Опубликовано: 22 июл 2024
- The 15th Doctor cried tears in almost every episode of Doctor Who's new Season 1. But was it TOO much?
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Chapters
00:00 - Intro
01:15 - The opposing polar viewpoints
02:03 - Recapping when he crys
05:59 - My main issue
07:41 - Normalisation Vs Dramatic effect
10:22 - when he SHOULD have cried. 
Развлечения
It loses impact if he does it every other scene!
Exactly!
But that’s the point. It normalises it as a way to express emotion. And we shouldn’t look at it as crying, we should look at what he’s expressing. Is it anger, sadness despair?
Have you ever heard anyone say The Doctor needs to shout less it loses impact when he makes a big speech? Because we don’t take the same emotion every time he shouts.
@@MsJaytee1975 I actually do think if the Doctor starts shouting every episode in a season that also loses its impact. Much like the crying you need to pick a few moments for it each season for it to retain its impact.
@Cheeses_K_Riced she’s mostly mean girls levels of nasty rather than psychopath … until she throws Rickey September under the bus to save herself - which the Doctor doesn’t know about.
Yeah, this is more or less how I feel, if he'd kept it to just the end of Dot and Bubble and the moment he's screaming out of the tardis then those two moments would have been extremely powerful for it, but in both cases we'd had it so much that it lessened the sense of how upsetting that moment is for him. If he bursts into tears at the smallest prompt it makes the big things feel smaller rather than the smaller things feel bigger. There is a lot of weight to be mined from holding back a little, we saw that when they filmed Tennant's regeneration into Smith, they did four takes of various degrees of holding back and concluded that the doctor completely breaking down was ultimately going to take away from how much the audience would feel the emotion of the scene, and they seem to have unlearned that. Tennant was really good at showing really strong emotion while remaining stoic, scenes like the ending to girl in the fireplace when he's back in the tardis or at the end of Midnight talking to Donna, you can see the amount of emotion he's holding back and in some ways it's more impactful than if he was crying. I think for sure it's good to show him crying, holding back emotion can be impactful and dramatic but it's not a healthy thing to do all the time, but I think picking and choosing your moments you'd get a much stronger reaction.
I think I’d add Boom to you list of ones where it was absolutely needed.
I completely agree. There's nothing wrong with the Doctor crying, but for it to have the desired impact, with it being so frequent, you kind of just shrug it off as oh here he goes again. In saying that, it's so frustrating when some fans complain about a character crying even once because said character is meant to be "strong and in control of their emotions". Like, it's okay and not a sign of weakness if the character lets a tear out once in a while. Let them have that moment, jeeze.
Absolutely. No character should be beyond crying ever.
Whenever previous Doctor's deviated from their normal baseline into extreme emotion it meant something. It forced the audience to pay attention. And it's not just tears.
I'm thinking of when 13 got angry with her companions in Villa Diodoti (talking about being on the summit alone to make the hard decisions). 11 getting mad in the Beast Below (saying no one human has anything to say to him). 12 getting angry over Clara's death. 11 crying at the loss of Amy. The tears shed by 10. 9 joyously laughing when everybody lives (just this once). 14 getting emotional talking to the fake Donna on the spaceship (angsting over his role in the Flux destroying the universe).
So for 15 to devolve into the same type of tears and extreme emotion over and over (with one slow tear as he appears to slowly crumble inside) was definitely too much.
I get that some people want to defend it. But us saying the crying was too much for a fictional character is not the same as judging someone for crying in real life. And people defend 15 by saying they would have cried all the times he did, in the same circumstances. Well, the 15th Doctor is not human. He's an alien with genius level intelligence, who's lived over a dozen lives (maybe dozens) and has been in a lot of dangerous situations.
And it's when he cries too. Crying at the end of Dot and Bubble, as he watches the people going off to their doom, when there's nothing more to be done? Appropriate. Crying in fear, defeat or sorrow before even trying to solve the problem? Not okay. Not for the Doctor.
Yes, I think some people in these comments have indicated I would t say the same about any other behavior that’s there to envoke an emotional response from the audience but I would absolutely apply the same to passionate shouting, the Doctor being dark and scary etc..
A brave video, my friend! :P Seriously though, I do love that this post-rehab Doctor expresses *every* emotion forthrightly, rather than bottling up or waving away as recent incarnations did. I do think that Ncuti's performance earned it every time - his performances were all full of integrity and being-in-the-moment. I do think there's the wider issue of the shorter episode count (I'm with Vera of Council of Geeks on this!). A lot of emotional pay-off wasn't earned with on-screen time e.g. the Doctor's friendship with Ruby. If we'd had the "standard" Doctor Who episodes in between the high-stakes universe-ending moments, the pay-off would have been earned. And then there's the Murray Gold in the room. I actually really enjoyed some of his work this season e.g. in The Devil's Chord, but he really is one of those composers who's telling you what you're meant to feel in every scene. That, to me, is a much bigger culprit for emotional fatigue than Ncuti's tears.
Oh it’s absolutely no shade on Ncuti’s acting an any of those scenes. He performs them all very well.
Yes the music might be a culprit here. It’s a big part of why I think the scenes are framed to evoke a reaction in US rather than the crying just being something happening in the scene to normalise people crying
Beat me to the punch and far more eloquently put!
@@YourQueerGreatAuntie agree completely with you 👍 as I wrote in my comments. He pulls it off bc he’s a fantastic actor and his take on the doctor is wonderful. I hadn’t thought about the music, I’ll pay attention to that next time through.
I feel like he does it too much
Exactly. It’s not the fact that he does cry, it’s the frequency and the lessening of the effect of the crying because of the frequency
I think you hit the nail on the head, in a really nuanced, well balanced video. Haven’t checked out your channel in a while really, in fact I drifted away from a lot of the whotube community as of late, but I’ve enjoyed watching your recent videos and rediscovering your channel again
Well welcome back 🙂
I agree with you on all but one scene, the scene with the kind woman realising her baby was dead did warrant the small amount of tears he shed. Otherwise yes in Boom and Dot and Bubble the tears would have had far more impact if he hadn't cried almost every single episode since he started out on his own.
I am happy he is an emotional doctor BUT it's lost its impact even on me by the point's it should have impact.
I agree on the example with ten and to be honest the What, What, What was used far too much too and kinda irritated me in the end 😂
That’s fair about the woman in the tent. While i think it would have worked without it I can see that it does still make sense there
I agree. I definitely think it was a bit too much. Even if we'd had 12 or 13 episodes with that same amount of crying it would be verging on too much IMO. With only 8 episodes (9 with Xmas) it loses it's impact after a bit. It would be no different if he got really angry each episode (or the example I just heard you use). I like that he cries a bit, it shows that this Doctor is an emotional Doctor, he feels empathy towards others. So I don't want him to stop, just use it when it'll have the most impact.
It might have been ok with 12 episodes if they were spread out enough. Hard to tell.
@@CulturePhilter Yeah, that's why I say verging on too much as it would depend on the spread.
I agree. Less crying, although Dot and Bubble was still powerful, maybe because it wasn't just tears coming down, but more expression because of the situation.
Less is more as they say.
Oh absolutely it worked in Dot and Bubble. For me the impact only really started to lessen with Rogue.
Doctor Who is set up as a parent figure and protector of their companions,. Parents of any gender often hide their fear, vulnerability and upset for the sake of their children. .This was often the case with the doctor- which made it more powerful when the doctor's mask slipped and the companions the doctor's raw emotions. This dynamic has changed in this season because it is often the doctor who presents as vulnerable, afraid and emotional and Ruby who has had to maternally comfort and reassure the doctor.
An interesting point. I wonder if same dynamic will exist with next companion.
He cries in every episode. The Doctor can cry but not in every episode. Remember he’s not human.
It’s not even that he’s not human. Ruby, or any companion, shouldn’t cry every episode either because that too would lessen the dramtic effect each time.
A great analysis. Spot on.
Thank you
I'm with you on this, and I love the detailed episode-to-episode ideas at the end, thank you!
It's been a bit difficult to parse my feelings on it, because - as you kind of touch on here - our bodies' stress response isn't really under our control, so some people are just fundamentally criers and I totally accept that. My body likes to shed stress by laughing, which is usually less appropriate and annoys people even more!
But directors can mould actors' performances, and Gatwa has the range to express the Doctor's feelings in other ways too.
Yes, and I hope I explained that I understand that these might all be instances an individual would cry in real life and it was just for reasons of maintaining dramatic effect that I think he shouldn’t have as much.
@@CulturePhilter Oh yes, no worries, I think you did a great job of explaining that and tying it into creative decisions 👍.
I think they just need to have more ways to show the doctor as emotionally venerable and I love it when they do it. I think moments like in the devils cord where he’s crying because he’s scared aren’t really like the doctor because we have seen him take gods like her before and he’s kept his cool relatively. But also 15 has been put in some very emotional situations all season so maybe next he will have an easier time
Yes it does feel unnecessary when fear is the motivator for the tears
Nailed it. Nothing more to be said.
It gets kinda exhausting that if u argue the obvious point that from an audience investment perspective, The Doctor crying every episode lessens its impact, people deliberately choose to misinterpret is as an attack on men being allowed to cry.
Of course The Doctor can cry. Why wouldn’t he? But the abundance of it just feels like they’re just exhausting Ncuti’s natural ability to do it as an actor, cause he can, rather than doing it when it feels right.
Some people do jump to that conclusion. I don’t think it’s everyone that is pro him crying as much as he dues though.
What a skill to have though, I’d love to be able to cry like that on cue when I’m acting.
I do hear what people are saying that maybe 15 does have too many crying scenes, and yeah perhaps they do need to die it down, not completely obviously but just a little bit, although overall I really like the fact that he shows his emotions more than past Doctors did because it makes him unique, fresh, new and different as well so yeah!
Absolutely. He shouldn’t NOT cry ever. Just not every episode 🤷♂️
Problem solved - Mrs Flood = The Doctors Tears
😄 they collect on the floor and gain consciousness.
@@CulturePhilter Makes more sense than most :D
He’s emotionally rehabilitated-he’s not repressed any more
Sure. And I think that’s fine, but that could be shown without AS much crying which would then keep the dramatic impact when he did.
To me, there's a difference between shedding a tear or two and "crying". I do agree that it shouldn't be almost literally every episode, but there's a difference between just letting some tears out and outright sobbing. 15 only really ugly-cries shortly after Ruby exits the TARDIS in Empire, and I think that was beautiful cause it appeared that he was trying to hold back the pain of not seeing his granddaughter and failing.
Again, I do agree that he shouldn't be shedding tears all the time, but I would be much more annoyed with it if he was crying to a point of being useless during major plot developments, which 15 does not. The way he does it makes it seem like he's just letting it out in the moment and then moving on as best he can.
Thanks for sharing your point of view. Yes it would be more of a problem if it was inhibiting him in some way.
Personally, it didn't effect my viewing experience, and the ending of dot and bubble was still very impactful, but I think that was more to do with Ncuti's acting in the scene and the crying just added to that, but every other time it did almost nothing for me emotionally. For example, in Boom and Empire of Death, it did nothing for me, because I knew that Ruby and the entire universe would get brought back to life.
For me it had lost its impact by Rogue. Which I feel would have hit harder if he hadn’t been crying ever episode. Since the start.
@@TheMuppetDon his first scenes on Who
Have to agree with many of your own points Phil, and thank you, it's great that you're not discounting the positive masculine comments on the crying. And I can't disagree with the idea that it was being used to make US feel something.
Cheers Jack
i have a totally different take on this. Why on earth are we counting and judging each expression of sadness at all? I think we are over analyzing it.The actual important question is Does he sell it? He is an amazing actor with a very expressive personality. When he felt it and shows it, we feel it BECAUSE he gets us there through his acting.
There is NO acting performance that perfectly matches every single viewer's personal feelings and expressions! Imagine this type of analysis with every actor with different styles... we all could point to moments where the "average" person would look and act differently, or miss all expression totally. Point is, he is a great actor, we get to care about him , so it completely works.
I didn’t go back and count them until I found myself noticing it just naturally while watching.
And yes, he is a fantastic actor and any of those scenes considered by itself does work. But, and this is down to the individual viewer as everyone is different, towards the end of the season I DIDN’T feel it. And it has nothing to do with Ncuti’s acting, it’s because it had happened in almost every episode. It had desensitized me to it by its frequency.
@@CulturePhilter I grant you it is a Lot, I just felt like in general it works for him bc it’s so well done. I don’t know what is the correct amount I just think we are all worrying about it too much!😹 I thoroughly enjoyed the season and I think he brought a lot of passion and life to the role.
@@anndorar1383 that’s fair. We’re all different and how much is too much will be different for everyone. For me this was too much, for yourself it doesn’t sound like it was. Which is fine. 🙂
I couldn't agree with you.... More Phil.. 🥲
It’s ok man, let it out, you’re not a TV drama.
@@CulturePhilter 😂😂😂 yaas!
There was far too much anguish, screaming / shouting / drool and closed off emotions and communication (rubys exit and in rogue kissing that dude he didn’t want to talk about)… for him to be this post therapy version of himself. He seems to be as emotional and messed up as before… I don’t get what they were trying to do!
Post therapy doesn’t mean never having negative emotions again. He was letting go of past trauma… not inoculating himself from future trauma.
Some people are just more outwardly emotional. It doesn’t have to have an effect on you. If he was laughing instead, would people be as bothered?
It’s great that 15 is a doctor that is more in touch with his emotions. I am glad that we have a protagonist who cries without any kind of apologizing for itself or then trying to counteract the vulnerability the character shows. But if he’s crying every single episode it just doesn’t feel like it matters when he does it anymore. Real people can and should cry as much as they need to because that’s healthy. Fictional characters should cry when it’s most important or impactful in their story. I love 15, I love Ncuti as 15, I don’t think they need to make him cry on command every episode.
The problem is the doctors emotional state should have an effect on the audience and it doesn’t imo, those moments need build up
Ian’s reply pretty much summed up what I would have said and what I did try and say (perhaps not clearly) in the video.
I don't remember the 10th doctor saying that that much??
It wasn’t all in one season like the crying has been but over his whole era it was enough to become a “oh here we go again” moment… at least for me. Someone did a montage of a bunch of times he said it on RUclips.
It's a non-verbal catchphrase, and catchprhases are usually annoying to most people but not merchandisers and their fandom signalling customer base. Even "brave heart, Tegan" was annoying.
Yes, catchphrases can also get tired very quickly if over used.
As you and others have said, it's fine that he cries, he just did it far, far too much! it lost all impact very quickly and just made him seem like he would cry if a waiter said “sorry, we don't have Pepsi, is Coke ok?”. Then again i also thought in a lot of this series he didn't really come across as being particularly smart either, sure, there were some scenes, but overall there seemed to be quite few scenes of the Dr being several steps ahead of everyone, knowing what's happening and how to solve it. Similarly to the crying, some moments like that are fine to make sure we know a situation is really bad as even the Dr doesn't know what to do, but when it happens so often, he just comes across as, almost, a bit thick. Then again i'm not a massive Dr Who fan, only a casual watcher so my opinions might not be the best, and with dot and bubble i seem to be the only person who didn't pick up the ending was meant to be racist, i thought it was meant to be because he was "poor", so maybe i'm a bit thick as well.
I think the Doctor often doesn’t actually knows what he’s doing and just fakes the confidence that he knows what he’s doing. I think it was the 12th Doctor that admitted as much once. So maybe 15 is just dropping the act that he has a solid plan from the outset instead of pretending he does and still just making it up as he goes along like the others. 🤷♂️
@@CulturePhilter That could be, but i find it takes away from him as a character when he's not the one leading the way, or doesn't at least have some sort of idea what's happening. Not to mention, i can't really see it as convincing that he inspires people to believe and follow him when he appears to not have a clue what he's doing and spent a lot of time just running away from things scared, when he wasn't crying.
Disappointed they couldn't squeeze it into 73 yards.
Where would you have added it? Be creative! 😄
@CulturePhilter Easy. Either in both appearances, when he mentions Roger Ap Williams, or second appearance when Ruby is about to read the notes: "Don't read them. People's hopes and dreams are so beautiful 😭😭😭".
See? Didn't even need to resort to a flashback!
Having said that, crying over getting a splinter from the Tardis might have fit in well with the series arc.
@@petebellamy1962 it’d have been Sutekh’s fault of course
@CulturePhilter That's the answer! The Doctor has a dog allergy!!!
@@petebellamy1962 I hope that doesn’t apply to robot dogs too
We find out it’s bill’s SO making cameos 😅
I see what you did there 😄
The Doctor cries.
He also dances.
He even Falls
The problem in my opinion is 2 fold.
1- the stories themselves. They don't have the requisit emotional weight for crying to work, and the fact he does it so often makes him seem overly thin skinned and immature.
2- the problem with the fandom. The fsndom has weaponised the idea that being against him crying so much in any clmpacity regardless of what you say is "toxic masculinity" or whatever. Which... fuck that, that's not a valid argument.
Absolutely spot on.
I wouldn’t say NONE of the stories have the request emotional weight. Boom and Dot and Bubble in particular are two episode where it was absolutely justified.
@CulturePhilter a few of them sure but they're diluted by the rest, which only adds to the issue.
@@ms.antithesis indeed
I definitely agree it does lose it's impact when he cries every episode sometimes multiple times in an episode, I feel similar at the start of the series when the Doctor runs away from the Bogeyman I think it loses abit of the impact when Maestro arrives in the next episode. I agree with all your choices of when he should have cried
Yes having him run away in the 2nd episode and Ruby actually say “but you never run” when he literally did just the episode before was a bit odd
@@CulturePhilter I think that line was 'hide' not run but if he didn't run from the Bogeyman but he runs from Maestro it would make Maestro feel more dangerous
@@kylerees3491 ahhhh my dodgy memory there. But yes, absolutely.
The only crying man for me is Rembrandt Brown.
A Sliders reference in 2024. Love to see it!
@@CulturePhilter
I can really imagine Ncuti Gatwa doing this: ruclips.net/video/VGEMjjdyeTc/видео.htmlsi=UpNHYDHmENhhpndH
@@CulturePhilter Hey, the first two seasons of Sliders was the closest thing to a 90s Doctor Who, even more than the TV movie.
@@mayotango1317 I loved Sliders at the time. And rewatched them on DVD around 2006/7 as well.
The point of a hero is that a hero acts in adversity. In at least the Rogue episode, the Doctor stood crying instead of acting in adversity. The Doctor's character traits include judgement, fast thinking, scientific problem solving, and leadership. Those are all hindred by crying. Characters in relationship based dramas can show more emotion as they don't need to save the world in the next 5 minutes. Dr Who hasn't the screen time to be both a relationship based drama and a life and death adventure in every episode.
Personally I’m of the opinion that all dramas are relationship dramas. If there is no relationship developed (not talking romantic just any relationship) between the characters any action feels hollow.
@@CulturePhilterMy point stands. If someone was crying I wouldn't want them driving a car in real life, let alone saving the world in action fiction.
It’s because in every outfit the Doctor carries an onion
That’s a lot of onions given how many outfits he has.
I disagree. Crying is not displaying one emotion. In your recap you show scenes of sadness, anger, despair, fear, happiness, and sometimes a combination. I like that it normalises a man crying, or frankly anyone crying. It’s supposed to lose its impact a bit. I mean people whose reaction is to cry at every emotion do exist.
I said in another comment, we never hear The Doctor should shout less.
Thanks for your comment. It’s interesting to hear different viewpoints on this.
I totally get what you mean about it not showing just one emotion. That crying can represent different emotions depending on the context.
I think though, with the way most of these are framed and presented to us the intention is to evoke emotion in the audience rather than normalize an act which like you say is perfectly common. So if I’m right their intended reaction is less effective. But that is just my interpretation of it and I appreciate hearing yours.
I'm not convinced that the majority of people hold those two extreme views. Those who don't like the crying just want it to be used sparingly to give it more meaning. It's quite simple
I don’t think the majority of viewers of Doctor Who do, no. they just talk the loudest. Most people just aren’t talking about it at all.
I've never seen anyone say the Doctor should never cry. But get out there and kick that strawman's ass.
It is not a sign of being a healthy adult if you are constantly crying. Normal people cry infrequently.
The Doctor was the real space baby all along.
I’ve certainly seen people say the Doctor should be stronger than than to cry in those situation from this season. And the way they phrase it certainly makes it sound like kind think he either shouldn’t have it should VERY rarely.
But I may be wrong🤷♂️
Hold on, who is saying "he should never cry"?
(I have to say, using the phrase "extreme camp" in a discussion on Ncuti's Doctor is just bait! How am I supposed to resist putting a punchline to that feed?!? 😂 I will exert all my will power like Noah in battle with his own wirrn-infected arm in Ark In Space.)
But I think both your extreme camps are strawmen; I don't think anyone is saying he has to be a rod of iron. The Doctor is hardly a Clint Eastwood character anyway. And why privilege tear shedding over other forms of expressing grief or sadness? Just because someone does not shed tears as their form of expressing doesn't mean they are not expressing. The 5th Doctor is shell shocked when he delivers the line "there should have been a better way" in Warriors of the Deep. I think it is wrong to tell people they are not expressing their grief properly if tear-shedding is not their form of expression. But the tenth Doctor cried occasionally; so did the ninth in End of the World so if they were truly against that they would have abandoned Doctor Who before the telemovie. It is not as though we have never seen the Doctor express grief before.
I will admit I have seen the “it’s good he cries this much because it’s a good example to set that men can cry” a lot MORE than the “he should never cry” one. So appologies if I have the impression that I saw them equal amounts.
But I have definitely seen both. In fact I’ve literally just replied to a comment on here about from one person saying that he should never cry.
The Doctor shouldn't cry at all in my opinion I didn't even like it with Eccleston or Tennant because it takes the alieness out of the Doctor he shouldn't be like everyone else his emotions and customs should be indifferent to a human call me old fashion but the crying makes the Doctor a weak character you never see Batman cry and I like it like that it's out of character and Ncuti's Doctor is doing it far too often and it just makes his character boring.
I also don't think men should cry full stop atleast not in public.
I don’t think to be Alien like you need to be emotionless. And when characters don’t have emotion, especially your lead, it doesn’t make for very interesting drama. Hell, even Spock on Star Trek is most interesting when he STOPS surprising his emotions.
Oh and Batman has absolutely cried in the comics. I couldn’t give you a specific issue number or graphic novel title but i know I’ve seen it. It’s probably very rare but it has happened.
As for your view that no men should cry in public… why? That sounds like a recipe for mental health issues by bottling everything up and repressing everything.
But hey, thank you for at least giving me a solid example of someone saying all this I can point to to the other person in my comments that was saying they hadn’t see anyone say the Doctor should never cry and I was. Creating a strawman 😄
I've always been able to understand The Doctor, from 9 to 13. I just don't get 15. He doesn't feel like The Doctor, and it has nothing to do with his color or even his preference for men. His changing outfits every episode does not help. And his crying in just about every episode is the worst part. As I said elsewhere, if I wanted to hear about it being okay to cry, I would watch episodes of "Mister Rogers' Neighborhood". And I don't blame Ncuti Gatwa. He's just doing his job. It is RTD's bad writing. He use to have some of the most amazing stories. Now he can barely put together a complete season that makes sense. Just my opinion.
He’s still managed to get some fantastic stories in there, but yes the overall season Arc was his weakness with this season.
I think 15 changing outfits and crying more often than previous Doctors is a great thing, it makes him unique, fresh, new and different, plus it shows that he has evolved and learned to try new things rather than just sticking to the same one as well as not hide his emotions all the time either. Maybe there has been a bit too many scenes where he has cried, but I don't think a few hurt at all to be honest, I really like it as I said before so yeah. Also, to me, the majority of episodes were utterly AMAZING for this series, including The Devil's Chord, Boom, 73 Yards and The Legend of Ruby Sunday. All the others I still very much liked but they had a few weak points in their own little ways compared to the ones mentioned above.
@@adammarrs9266 I’m loving the varied outfits too. And I absolutely don’t mind him crying more than previous Doctors. If he’d cried half as much this season I think he still would have achieved that AND each instance would have carried more weight.
Classic Doctors never cried and they certainly never tried to get into another man’s pants within minutes of meeting them whilst their friend was about to have her brain fried! This version of Who is garbage.
So? What
Hole the classic series was great for its own reasons, Pre-1996 Doctor’s barely showing any emotion was not one of those reasons.
And your other criticism is just nonsense. He didn’t know his friend was in imminent danger. And it’s certinally no worse than the 10th Doctor leaving Rose and Mickey on a broken ship in deep space to go flirt and snog Madam De Pompadore in 17th Century France. Almost getting stuck there in the process.
@@CulturePhilter When RTD brought it back in 2005 he changed the characterisation. If you’d have grown up on Classic Who you’d know there are certain things that are out of character in new Who. Now we have the dreadful bi-generation the Doctor is behaving like an emotional mess and a randy teenager. RTD could never write the Doctor in the way he should be. To have the Doctor hitting on someone within minutes of knowing him made him look more like Captain Jack than the Doctor. My criticism isn’t nonsense and I suspect you’re one of these fans who don’t mind nor care about the character being changed totally.
@@PaulRichards-vz4pl if you compare Tom Baker to William Hartnell then the charactisation had massively changed too. The show has always been changing the main character. There is no reason that should stop. It’s fine to prefer one take on the character over another but don’t pretend it was absolutely constant through classic Who.
Also bold of you to assume I wasn’t already watching Doctor Who before. 2005.
@@CulturePhilter Tom Baker never cried nor did he hit on anyone. There’s change by tweaking the Doctor’s character and there’s totally altering him to be more emotional than a human. It’s damaged the show. RTD is a very shallow man and he and Julie Gardner said in the past that the actor chosen is best young and attractive. It’s all about sex appeal now which goes against what the Doctor was originally supposed to be. Verity Lambert expressed this herself when she said you don’t want anyone too good looking and the actor needs an eccentricity about them. Tom Baker was her second favourite after Hartnell. When fans say it’s all about change they forget that the change was never too excessive.
@@PaulRichards-vz4pl the change between Hartnell and Baker was huge.
And he’s changed again since. You have just decided in your head what is allowed to change and what isn’t. But don’t pretend that the character was consistent in classic era. There was just as much change just in different areas. And the in 1996 they changed to introduce a more romantic angle.
It’s fine not to be a fan of it but do t pretend that it’s any different to any of the other changes they have made since the 60s.
it's shite
The crying?
I am an absolute cry baby. I cry at nearly every episode of dr who (or tv in general). I have no problem with the doctor crying (quite the opposite- I generally enjoy it), but when he does it more than me I do get a bit uninterested.There is just no way after the whole 14th therapy the doctor is less resistant than me, it seems unrealistic! It takes me out of the story and it makes me feel almost like the goal is to get the viewer emotional and not just to write a scene so emotional it makes them feel it. Like they are taking us by the hand telling us what to do instead of letting the actual substance of the story do the work.
I hope the way I worded it makes sense
Yes, it’s not the fact that he cries it’s really the frequency.
I've realised I watch TV completely different to you... You said that all the scenes are ones where it would be appropriate to cry, but you don't like it because there's too much for you as an observer... but I don't watch as an observer; for those 45 minutes I am the Doctor or Ruby, and I would be in tears where he is. I don't think I agree that the Doctor's empathy can be shown in some situations (like the woman and the baby) without crying... it maybe can, but I'm not sure the depth of that empathy can be shown without the tears. To be fair, some of those tears were barely a line of liquid on a face - pretend it's sweat if that makes you feel better about it 🙂
That’s valid, and very interesting. We are not a monolith after all and all watch TV differently. It’s all subjective.
@CulturePhilter I'm sorry Phil, Reading that back, it sounded more abrasive than I intended. It was early in my morning, if that's an excuse. Yours is by far the most balanced review of this that I've seen, and I do agree that there might have been ways to make the point without that single tear... I wonder if I found it less of an issue because I'm not an analyst or commentator. Again, apologies for being rude.
@@T320SNU oh I didn’t read it as rude or abrasive at all. So you’ve mother to apologise for. 🙂
The crying was so non Doctor. His tears did not have the desired affect making audience do similar. The Doctor with all his abilities and vulnerabilities, but it was too much... we need an alien mad scientist. Not a weeping alien
I’m not sure I’d use the word boring. It just became less effective at evoking an emotional response in me over time.