You're the best at many projects ,especially electrical. I've been watching all these guys who say they're electricians and they leave so much out of theie projects. Don't stop.
Great job man! I hand dug my trench too. About 90 feet long and 2 feet deep... Definitely a good workout haha. Great to see a lot of guys doing this kind of project, it'll definitely add value to the property.
This is an excellent overall video. I may do things a bit differently on the conduit but I really appreciate where you went into the pros and cons; and the description of the panel box and the overall electrical information “behind” the project. Thanks for sharing.
As a long time electrician I can say is You did a great job. PVC would have been cheaper. As soon as you hit that hard pack I would would have (A) rented a trencher or (B) ran RMC after doing a value study. RMC only needs 6 inch cover.
Your compliment as a professional means a lot, thank you. I had a bit of a masochistic streak and was looking forward to the trench digging. I'd probably do something a bit different in the future. Good suggestions.
I just did a 23 foot trench for our new shed and hit a section of rock only 2 inches below the surface. Oops, I guess I'm not using UF. ;) I rented a big rotohammer and blasted a deep-enough trench through the rock for a 6 inch cover, and used IMC instead.
A couple things to consider when doing this project. Talk with a pro about permit requirements and maybe exchange some cash for some knowledge on how to do it smartly. There are plenty of electrical rules. Someone that does that work may have already solved your future problem 5 times last month. While your trench is open consider 11/2 in conduit for a future up to about 200 Amp service and several 3/4 or 1 in conduits for future use: One conduit for a data connection to your home office / server for your business One conduit for cable tv One conduit for 2 warning lights....one in the house for problems in the garage and one in the garage for problems in the house (a dinner bell in a noisy garage). With the trench open, any depth requirement can be met, but do it later and re-dig your trench.
Good video. But it did make my back hurt while you were digging and picking the dirt. You also answered my question about the grounding rods. Thanks again...
NM cable has to be secured within 12 inch NEC 334.30. Unless the box does not secure the cable. NEC 314.17(2) and the Exception. If the box does not have a way to secure the NM cable to it, then it must be fastened with in 8 inches. Going through a 2X4 is not fastened because the 2X4 provides Supporting but not fastening. Only a very few inspectors ever catch this. Good video, I give you a thumbs up.
You did an excellent job of following the NEC. I would have preferred a purchased ground bar rather than removing the link for the two neutral bars. Questions, Why did you not connect the neutral to the lug on the left bar? Did you install the bonding screw or tab from the right bar to the can of the panel? I could not see that in the video. Again, very well done video and project!
Looks good, been doing stuff like this recently. I love how "14 inches" isn't code but clearly enough.. like bruh... those last 4 inches are the worst yo
Great video! What size wire do I need to bury for a 60ft line, it's gonna power up a 15 amp mini split, AC/HEAT, its 110 v and 15 amps, I also want to power 8 outlets and 3 lights, no appliances will be hooked up in my shed, at the most a 60 inch TV, no major tools or anything, the shed is basically a gym/entertainment area, it's a straight shot, therefore I'm thinking of using pvc conduit, also, I will not have it inspected, any ideas?
Hey Art. I would recommend just running a 20 amp (12ga) circuit from one of your external GFCI outlets. Generally distance isn't an issue until you get to around 100ft. See this article for a detailed description. practicalhomeprojects.com/?p=138
if your a/c is drawing 15 amps, 20 amps is the minimum. i would usualy recommend 30 amps. but your sayong you have low power devices so its ur choice you could always run bigger wire with a smaller size breaker and then upgrade the breaker if you need to
Hi Shazad. Yes UF direct burial wire would work just fine. You'll probably have to bury 24" deep instead of just 18". I don't remember if code required, but you probably want to protect the cable where exposed outside above ground as well.
@@practicalhomeprojects You are correct, UF cable alone would have to be 24 inch unless it fit another rule in the table, like under building, under concrete, ect. NEC Table 300.5. For anyone that does not want to buy an NEC, a picture of this table can be found by google search. Also I am using the 2020 version for NC, some states use a different year( I just had to throw that in).
When you back feed a breaker and intend to use it as a main disconnect for your panel the breaker has to be bolted in even if it is a snap in or plug in type breaker.
Hi there. There's no back-fed breaker in this project. The subpanel power is being supplied through it's own main breaker which is permanently fastened by the manufacturer. The breaker in our main panel functions just as any other breaker supplying a circuit or appliance.
Great video! But I am confused/surprised by one thing. You installed two ground rods at the shed and also tied your subpanel grounding bus back to the main panel ground bus. Doesn't this create a ground loop? I.e., if you had a lightning strike nearby there could be a voltage difference in the ground between the ground rods at your shed and at your main panel. That would cause current to run through your grounding system. I'm curious if any electricians reading this can comment: don't you want to have your grounding system have only one path to ground? It sounds like you had your work inspected and it passed inspection. Presumably your electrical inspector knows more about this than I do, so maybe I am missing some detail. Just thought I'd ask... Thanks for the video!
Hey Stephen, Everything I did here was following my local code and was passed by a local inspector. I don't know enough to give a confident answer, but here's my thoughts. The two patches of dirt may have potential differential of a few mV, but since we bonded the two grounding systems, by definition there can be no difference in electric potential between the sets of grounding rods. If lightening strikes, it's just trying to get to ground and will take the least resistant path, hopefully through the shortest amount of wire. Best of luck!
I've done the same thing, however I didn't use ground rods just installed the bonding screw in my sub panel bc that's what my inspector wanted. it's worked with no problems for 10 years
Yeah. I was confused by this exact same point. I thought that the subpanel should not have an earth ground. It should definitely not have the neutral-ground bond, but I also thought that there should be only one earth ground and it should be at the main panel
Pvc would have been soo much easier to pull. And 3/4 pvc is really flexible for minor turns or just use a beat gun to manipulate it. Sealtite is really bad for pulling long distance. U could transition to flex on the ends. Works good. Otherwise great work
Yeah all good valid points. I'd only add Use a much bigger conduit then you need , and go at least one or two more awg size then you need. (Within reason) Because the few $ you spend up front saves you from triple the cost and having to dig yet another trench . I went with a 8awg for about $6 more than 10. Now if I want to put a bigger breaker I'm set . So $150 vs another 156 for wire cost 🤔 (306 total)
You should have rented a "trencher" - a glorified chainsaw, which cuts a slot no wider than the conduit or than is necessary and very much deeper, rather than the full width of your spade.
Hey Andrew, Thanks for the idea; that would have saved us a bit of time and back ache. We looked at getting a trencher or ditch witch and it would have been >$500 after rental, insurance and delivery so decided not to go that route.
We used a 60amp breaker in the main panel to match the permitted capacity of the conductors. The sub-panel has a 100amp breaker which doubles as a shutoff.
Yes. We received three types of inspection, and the inspector was able to do them all at the same time. Burial inspection to ensure correct depth, rough inspection and final inspection. In our county, residents can pay $45/visit for inspections.
How did you transition the conduit thru the shed exterior wall? I'm also running my subpanel on exterior wall between studs and need to come thru wall with conduit.
Hello, I just ran the entire conduit right through the floor of my shed and spray foamed it back. You could also do a junction box on the outside with a connection through to the subpanel.
@@practicalhomeprojects I figured it out yesterday, ended up with: 1.5" PVC conduit > threaded male adapter > metal conduit LB > chase nipple thru wall into knock out in back of panel.
The feeder wires need to be enclosed in conduit or a junction box at all locations. I ran the conduit through the floor of my shed. I made the hole at an angle so that it would miss the joist and still come up inside the wall cavity.
Couple of quesyions : 1) if you went through all the trouble to dig a trench why not run another conduit with CAT6 wire for Internet Jacks or an Access Point in the shed? 2?) Did you bury Yellow Caution Tape six inches above the conduit when you filled in the trench? 3) Was the wire you ran in the conduit underground rated in case the conduits leaks and gets water in it?
Hi Jay, Thanks for the questions. 1) You could run ethernet in the trench as well. Like you mentioned it does need a separate conduit. The distance was close enough that I still get wifi in the shed, so I didn't think about it. 2) They actually make special red tape to indicate electrical wire that you might put 6" above the conduit. amzn.to/3tuZlMv. Not a bad idea to include, but not required by code in our area. 3) Yes, You have to use wire rated for wet conditions, so not your everyday romex. We used THHN/THWN-2 wire. Here's a link to the vendor to show the conditions of use. www.southwire.com/wire-cable/building-wire/simpull-thhn-copper-wire/p/BW1
Hello Elias, You definitely don't want to hook your sub panel up directly to the main lugs of your main panel. Any connections bringing power out of your main panel need to be protected by a breaker. I don't know if there is any rule against it, but I would not have a single circuit with the same capacity as my entire panel. Maybe just use a 100amp breaker even if the subpanel is rated for more. Good Luck.
I have been trying to run a project like this but haven't figured out a way to get the wire from inside my garage on the opposite side of the house where my main panel is located to the back yard to where I will dig my trench leading up to the shed.
That is a bit tricky. Do you have access to the attic space above the garage? Or at least a ceiling cavity? You could always run conduit on the side of your house all the way around, but it would be a bit ugly and expensive.
Thank you for the great information!! What gauge wire would you recommend for 130ft to a shed that will need 120v? Just need lights, vacuum, sprinkler timer etc. Can a guy get away with #8 or is this long enough for #6? I also notice you opt for individual wires rather than a cable. Is there a reason for this other than it's what you have on hand or is it less expensive and maybe easier to pull through conduit? I'm in a situation now where I have a shed coming in a month but running both conduit and wire/cable right now may be too costly. Yet, in three days I am renting a trencher for water lines and it would make sense to run conduit for electrical even if I do not run wire/cable yet simply because of cost and the logistics of where I am trenching near the house. My thought is that as long as I am there I might as well lay the proper conduit with string and junction boxes even if I can't quite afford the wire right now. But I also know that #6 is tougher to pull than #8... Thanks for any advise on wire size! I prefer to do this trenching and conduit work myself and then pay a pro to connect both ends.
Hi Scott, Good Questions. I'm not a professional electrician, but here are my thoughts: It sounds like you don't expect any heavy duty equipment, so 20amp 120V service is probably sufficient for your application. On our website we outline how to set up a single 20 amp circuit. It's much simpler since you won't need a subpanel and all of the extras that come with it. practicalhomeprojects.com/?p=138 The distance might affect the gauge wire you need to safely operate that 20amp circuit. For shorter distances, you'd use 12gauge wires. At around 100ft, the voltage drop becomes significant enough that you'll want to do some quick voltage drop calculations to make sure that it doesn't drop more than 5%. Be sure to use the distance the wire will travel rather than just distance between sides of the buildings. You'll most likely step up to 10 gauge wires. www.southwire.com/calculator-vdrop Individual THHN wires vs. a cable is up to your preference. The correct type of cable can be direct buried with no conduit, which saves a bunch of time. However if you are going to use conduit, you'll have to use a much wider diameter with cable rather than with wire due to the fill calculation. Also THHN is coated to be low friction whereas cables are not, so wire will pull much more easily.
If you have not dug yet, consider putting a bigger pipe in there. Today, you can run a 15 Amp 14-2 through a 2 inch conduit (way oversized). You could easily fit a 200 Amp sub panel feeder in that same pipe. Just use one wire as a rope to pull the other. Second, consider extra pipes like 3/4 or 1 inch. Cable tv, hardwired 8nternet, an alarm fir diner, security cameras, whatever else you can think of. Burial depth is based on the voltage plus some extra stuff. But a few dollars today might mean not having having to re-dig the same trench later. Hope I got you ontime.
If you said it, I missed it. What gauge wire are you running and how big was your conduit? I'm just about to do this same project but I'm gonna need to run 8 awg wire for 240 v.
Hey there. You can see a written description of the project here: practicalhomeprojects.com/?p=138 We used three 6AWG conductors with a 10AWG ground conductor. All in a 1" PVC conduit. A fill calculator like this one is very helpful: www.southwire.com/calculator-conduit
What electrical panel (make/model) did you end up using? I'm planning to do the same thing. Thanks for sharing.. Looking forward to the next episode...
Hey Joe. I grabbed this one. It was cheap and I already have GE breakers. I wanted to make sure it had at least 16 spaces for future improvements. Also you'll want a main breaker panel. If you use a main lug panel, you'll have to additionally use a power shut off switch. Let us know what type of videos you'd like to see in the future! www.lowes.com/pd/GE-125-Amp-24-Spaces-24-Circuit-Convertible-Main-Breaker-Panel-Load-Center-Value-Pack/3150199
@@practicalhomeprojects Perfect. Thanks for the info. We still have some work to complete before starting on electrical. Just want to gather supplies in advance.. Thanks again...
This is a much better installation than an extension cord. They are not weather/dig proof, and cannot provide the amperage that an independent subpanel can...
Good job without using the ditch digger machine of course next time you will use the machine if you can rent one or hopefully, you will never need to do this job again.
If you go to the NFPA website, you can purchase a version of the code, or read it one page at a time through their viewer. Be sure to check your state for any variances from the National Code. www.nfpa.org/codes-and-standards/all-codes-and-standards/list-of-codes-and-standards/detail?code=70
Can't use LFNC in this application. How are you going to "securely fasten" it every 3' underground? 356.10(50 and 356.30(1). Not dangerous, but it is a code violation.
Interesting take John. Fortunately, the NEC included section 300.5 to instruct on safe conduit burial. Accordingly, this is not a code violation, otherwise all types of conduit would be subject to the same problem. Just be sure that your conduit is labelled as "rated for direct burial" and you'll be all set.
@@practicalhomeprojects It is, according to the language of the NEC, absolutely a code violation. It's not an electrical problem, but it is a violation. 300.5 addresses general rules for underground locations but, as anyone who uses the NEC knows, it is common to have to look at multiple code references to apply to any particular installation. One must look into the article dedicated to LFNC. 356.10(5) says, specifically, that if LFNC is longer than 6' it must (operative term, shall be permitted) be secured in accordance with 356.30. 356.12, Uses Not Permitted, says if longer than 6' it must comply with 356.10(5). Other underground conduits, IMC, PVC, etc, say not such thing about limited lengths UNLESS secured. In other words, LFNC is allowed for direct burial in lengths up to 6'. Beyond 6' must be secured. Not my rule, but the language is specific and clearly states this. A public input proposal may bring clarity, but it says what it says.
Hello again John, I appreciate the detailed response. I'm still inclined to interpret the code as permitting direct burial of LFNC, but I agree that a bit more clarity could be added. 356.10(4) specifically permits direct burial when the LFNC is rated for such a purpose. I imagine this use was added to clear up confusion and would end the conversation with any inspector. 356.12(3) calls on the use outlined in 356.10(5) OR "where a longer length is approved as essential for a required degree of flexibility." This is where I think you are claiming that my application does not pass the code. I'm going to claim that direct burial requires a longer length for flexibility; a word I do not see defined in this context. 356.30 explains how to secure the conduit, but does not specifically require the conduit to be secured (the requirement coming from 356.12(3). It is telling, however, that "Securing or supporting of the conduit shall not be required where it is fished" indicating that the governing body felt that securing was only intended where practical to do so.
Hi Thomas. You're right. The flexible conduit plus connections were probably $60 over a simple schedule 40 PVC solution. I chose the flexible option so that I wouldn't have to deal with multiple partial angles and because I imagine the connections would make it more difficult to pull the wire.
When you dig your trench about 18 inches deep, what kind of climate area are you in? Does it snow there, or freeze? Does that make a difference on depth?
The depth is laid out in the National Electric Code. I think section 300.4. Climate does not matter. Your local building office can adjust, bend, or throw out the nec rules and not everyone is under the nec, even in America. If you are about to do this job, a phone call to a local electrician or building Inspector should get you plenty of answers.
@@phendrix9476 yes sir, you are correct. The voltage, the use of the area above, gfci protection and more play in to the required depth and concrete above your pipe can also effect depth. This is why I encourage people to consider other items while the trench is open. Cable tv or high speed internet I believe only needs to be under the surface, but it could be deeper or the piping used for something else. Security cameras, some kind of flashing light in your shop to alert you of diner time or some emergency in the house may allow you to "get a message" in a noisy work envirnment. If you have extra pipes in your trench, they can be deeper than the minimum and prevent a re-dig. Slip a string in the pipe when you install it and use it for a wire pull in the future.
Keith is correct. Check 300.5 in the NEC. The depth is more related to "how likely is someone to cut this with a shovel or trencher" than it is to freeze/thaw cycles.
You're the best at many projects ,especially electrical. I've been watching all these guys who say they're electricians and they leave so much out of theie projects. Don't stop.
Really appreciate your feedback, thanks!
Great job man! I hand dug my trench too. About 90 feet long and 2 feet deep... Definitely a good workout haha. Great to see a lot of guys doing this kind of project, it'll definitely add value to the property.
Nice! There's a sense of pride with doing the dirty work yourself too. Good luck on your project.
This is an excellent overall video. I may do things a bit differently on the conduit but I really appreciate where you went into the pros and cons; and the description of the panel box and the overall electrical information “behind” the project. Thanks for sharing.
I appreciate your comment, thank you!
Best video on RUclips about installing a sub panel! Straight to the point. And you explain everything really nicely. Thanks you
Thanks for the kind words!
As a long time electrician I can say is You did a great job. PVC would have been cheaper. As soon as you hit that hard pack I would would have (A) rented a trencher or (B) ran RMC after doing a value study. RMC only needs 6 inch cover.
Your compliment as a professional means a lot, thank you. I had a bit of a masochistic streak and was looking forward to the trench digging. I'd probably do something a bit different in the future. Good suggestions.
I just did a 23 foot trench for our new shed and hit a section of rock only 2 inches below the surface. Oops, I guess I'm not using UF. ;) I rented a big rotohammer and blasted a deep-enough trench through the rock for a 6 inch cover, and used IMC instead.
Very helpful, thank you.
Honestly one of the best tutorials I've seen for this topic. Thank you
You're very welcome! Thanks for your kind words!
as soon as I saw the Spectrum box on the outside of your home , I knew it was a good video. all kidding aside . great video.
Glad you liked it!
A couple things to consider when doing this project.
Talk with a pro about permit requirements and maybe exchange some cash for some knowledge on how to do it smartly.
There are plenty of electrical rules. Someone that does that work may have already solved your future problem 5 times last month.
While your trench is open consider 11/2 in conduit for a future up to about 200 Amp service and several 3/4 or 1 in conduits for future use:
One conduit for a data connection to your home office / server for your business
One conduit for cable tv
One conduit for 2 warning lights....one in the house for problems in the garage and one in the garage for problems in the house (a dinner bell in a noisy garage).
With the trench open, any depth requirement can be met, but do it later and re-dig your trench.
Good video. But it did make my back hurt while you were digging and picking the dirt. You also answered my question about the grounding rods. Thanks again...
Thank you. Yeah, I was sore for a while. It was fun, but definitely not going to start digging trenches for a living.
Great video. Thanks for the info. I am getting ready to do this job from my shed to my shop. 👍
Awesome video! A lot of good information that was clear and to the point!!
Thanks for the kind words Jon!
Great job on the tutorial very informative.
Glad it was helpful!
Great Video. Very helpful.
Glad to hear it!
Very helpful indeed, thanks.
Glad it was helpful!
Good presentation
Thank you!
Excellent video!
Thank you!
NM cable has to be secured within 12 inch NEC 334.30. Unless the box does not secure the cable. NEC 314.17(2) and the Exception. If the box does not have a way to secure the NM cable to it, then it must be fastened with in 8 inches. Going through a 2X4 is not fastened because the 2X4 provides Supporting but not fastening. Only a very few inspectors ever catch this. Good video, I give you a thumbs up.
Excellent. I appreciate you providing those code citations Jason, and responding to some other comments.
very informational bro, subbed!
Thanks for the sub!
Nice work. Thanks for making the video.
Thanks for your feedback!
Looks good... nice explanations...Would have liked to seen HOW you put the grounding rods in!?
Hi, thanks for your comment. We also have a video on how to drive the grounding rods, here is the link: ruclips.net/video/AshkMHYphbM/видео.html
Nice job brother...
Thanks! And welcome to our channel!
Yeah about the string , rum multiple strings, and then tie the string to a heavy rope and then you will have no problem at all
You did an excellent job of following the NEC. I would have preferred a purchased ground bar rather than removing the link for the two neutral bars. Questions, Why did you not connect the neutral to the lug on the left bar? Did you install the bonding screw or tab from the right bar to the can of the panel? I could not see that in the video. Again, very well done video and project!
Excelent Job ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐
Thank you!
Looks good, been doing stuff like this recently.
I love how "14 inches" isn't code but clearly enough.. like bruh... those last 4 inches are the worst yo
Great video! What size wire do I need to bury for a 60ft line, it's gonna power up a 15 amp mini split, AC/HEAT, its 110 v and 15 amps, I also want to power 8 outlets and 3 lights, no appliances will be hooked up in my shed, at the most a 60 inch TV, no major tools or anything, the shed is basically a gym/entertainment area, it's a straight shot, therefore I'm thinking of using pvc conduit, also, I will not have it inspected, any ideas?
Hey Art. I would recommend just running a 20 amp (12ga) circuit from one of your external GFCI outlets. Generally distance isn't an issue until you get to around 100ft. See this article for a detailed description. practicalhomeprojects.com/?p=138
if your a/c is drawing 15 amps, 20 amps is the minimum. i would usualy recommend 30 amps. but your sayong you have low power devices so its ur choice you could always run bigger wire with a smaller size breaker and then upgrade the breaker if you need to
Could you have also used UF direct burial wire instead of running wire through the conduit?
Hi Shazad. Yes UF direct burial wire would work just fine. You'll probably have to bury 24" deep instead of just 18". I don't remember if code required, but you probably want to protect the cable where exposed outside above ground as well.
@@practicalhomeprojects You are correct, UF cable alone would have to be 24 inch unless it fit another rule in the table, like under building, under concrete, ect. NEC Table 300.5. For anyone that does not want to buy an NEC, a picture of this table can be found by google search. Also I am using the 2020 version for NC, some states use a different year( I just had to throw that in).
When you back feed a breaker and intend to use it as a main disconnect for your panel the breaker has to be bolted in even if it is a snap in or plug in type breaker.
See NEC article 408.36d. Back fed devices.
Hi there. There's no back-fed breaker in this project. The subpanel power is being supplied through it's own main breaker which is permanently fastened by the manufacturer. The breaker in our main panel functions just as any other breaker supplying a circuit or appliance.
Do you happen to know a general idea of what an electrician would charge to do this? Thanks.
It's going to largely depend on your area. Maybe $2k-$4k?
Great video! But I am confused/surprised by one thing. You installed two ground rods at the shed and also tied your subpanel grounding bus back to the main panel ground bus. Doesn't this create a ground loop? I.e., if you had a lightning strike nearby there could be a voltage difference in the ground between the ground rods at your shed and at your main panel. That would cause current to run through your grounding system. I'm curious if any electricians reading this can comment: don't you want to have your grounding system have only one path to ground? It sounds like you had your work inspected and it passed inspection. Presumably your electrical inspector knows more about this than I do, so maybe I am missing some detail. Just thought I'd ask... Thanks for the video!
Hey Stephen, Everything I did here was following my local code and was passed by a local inspector.
I don't know enough to give a confident answer, but here's my thoughts. The two patches of dirt may have potential differential of a few mV, but since we bonded the two grounding systems, by definition there can be no difference in electric potential between the sets of grounding rods. If lightening strikes, it's just trying to get to ground and will take the least resistant path, hopefully through the shortest amount of wire. Best of luck!
I've done the same thing, however I didn't use ground rods just installed the bonding screw in my sub panel bc that's what my inspector wanted. it's worked with no problems for 10 years
Yeah. I was confused by this exact same point. I thought that the subpanel should not have an earth ground. It should definitely not have the neutral-ground bond, but I also thought that there should be only one earth ground and it should be at the main panel
Pvc would have been soo much easier to pull. And 3/4 pvc is really flexible for minor turns or just use a beat gun to manipulate it. Sealtite is really bad for pulling long distance. U could transition to flex on the ends. Works good. Otherwise great work
Yeah all good valid points.
I'd only add
Use a much bigger conduit then you need , and go at least one or two more awg size then you need. (Within reason)
Because the few $ you spend up front saves you from triple the cost and having to dig yet another trench .
I went with a 8awg for about $6 more than 10. Now if I want to put a bigger breaker I'm set .
So $150 vs another 156 for wire cost 🤔 (306 total)
Thanks for the tip Dustin. I thought it was surprisingly hard to pull considering I had
❤how do you hooked up the power from your house 😊
You should have rented a "trencher" - a glorified chainsaw, which cuts a slot no wider than the conduit or than is necessary and very much deeper, rather than the full width of your spade.
Hey Andrew, Thanks for the idea; that would have saved us a bit of time and back ache. We looked at getting a trencher or ditch witch and it would have been >$500 after rental, insurance and delivery so decided not to go that route.
So did you use a 60 Amp breaker at the main breaker and at the subpanel?
We used a 60amp breaker in the main panel to match the permitted capacity of the conductors. The sub-panel has a 100amp breaker which doubles as a shutoff.
Did you call for inspection and how much? Thanks for your video
Yes. We received three types of inspection, and the inspector was able to do them all at the same time. Burial inspection to ensure correct depth, rough inspection and final inspection. In our county, residents can pay $45/visit for inspections.
How did you transition the conduit thru the shed exterior wall? I'm also running my subpanel on exterior wall between studs and need to come thru wall with conduit.
Hello, I just ran the entire conduit right through the floor of my shed and spray foamed it back. You could also do a junction box on the outside with a connection through to the subpanel.
@@practicalhomeprojects I figured it out yesterday, ended up with:
1.5" PVC conduit > threaded male adapter > metal conduit LB > chase nipple thru wall into knock out in back of panel.
How did you pass the wire through the shed wall?
The feeder wires need to be enclosed in conduit or a junction box at all locations. I ran the conduit through the floor of my shed. I made the hole at an angle so that it would miss the joist and still come up inside the wall cavity.
Couple of quesyions :
1) if you went through all the trouble to dig a trench why not run another conduit with CAT6 wire for Internet Jacks or an Access Point in the shed?
2?) Did you bury Yellow Caution Tape six inches above the conduit when you filled in the trench?
3) Was the wire you ran in the conduit underground rated in case the conduits leaks and gets water in it?
Hi Jay, Thanks for the questions.
1) You could run ethernet in the trench as well. Like you mentioned it does need a separate conduit. The distance was close enough that I still get wifi in the shed, so I didn't think about it.
2) They actually make special red tape to indicate electrical wire that you might put 6" above the conduit. amzn.to/3tuZlMv. Not a bad idea to include, but not required by code in our area.
3) Yes, You have to use wire rated for wet conditions, so not your everyday romex. We used THHN/THWN-2 wire. Here's a link to the vendor to show the conditions of use. www.southwire.com/wire-cable/building-wire/simpull-thhn-copper-wire/p/BW1
Of mine main panel is a 200 amps, and my subpanel is a 200 apms also can i connect it in to the main lugs?
Hello Elias, You definitely don't want to hook your sub panel up directly to the main lugs of your main panel. Any connections bringing power out of your main panel need to be protected by a breaker. I don't know if there is any rule against it, but I would not have a single circuit with the same capacity as my entire panel. Maybe just use a 100amp breaker even if the subpanel is rated for more. Good Luck.
@@practicalhomeprojects thank you very much, still learning!
Those Elvis sideburns ....ARE .... clip-ons, right?
What size breaker did you use to run to your shed.
Hi Tim, The beaker on the main panel is 60 amps to match the maximum allowable loading of the feeder wires.
I have been trying to run a project like this but haven't figured out a way to get the wire from inside my garage on the opposite side of the house where my main panel is located to the back yard to where I will dig my trench leading up to the shed.
That is a bit tricky. Do you have access to the attic space above the garage? Or at least a ceiling cavity? You could always run conduit on the side of your house all the way around, but it would be a bit ugly and expensive.
@@practicalhomeprojects No access above the garage. I plan to cut an access point to run 250V lines in my garage. Unsure what I'll find up there yet.
I put an 8 ft rod in the ground in about 60 seconds using a hammer drill in the hard central Georgia clay. Let a tool make your job easy.
60 amp sub panel in shed. What size breaker did you use in main panel in house?
Hey there. The panel is rated up to 100amps. The breaker in the house is a 60amp.
Thank you for the great information!! What gauge wire would you recommend for 130ft to a shed that will need 120v? Just need lights, vacuum, sprinkler timer etc. Can a guy get away with #8 or is this long enough for #6? I also notice you opt for individual wires rather than a cable. Is there a reason for this other than it's what you have on hand or is it less expensive and maybe easier to pull through conduit?
I'm in a situation now where I have a shed coming in a month but running both conduit and wire/cable right now may be too costly. Yet, in three days I am renting a trencher for water lines and it would make sense to run conduit for electrical even if I do not run wire/cable yet simply because of cost and the logistics of where I am trenching near the house. My thought is that as long as I am there I might as well lay the proper conduit with string and junction boxes even if I can't quite afford the wire right now. But I also know that #6 is tougher to pull than #8...
Thanks for any advise on wire size! I prefer to do this trenching and conduit work myself and then pay a pro to connect both ends.
Hi Scott, Good Questions. I'm not a professional electrician, but here are my thoughts:
It sounds like you don't expect any heavy duty equipment, so 20amp 120V service is probably sufficient for your application. On our website we outline how to set up a single 20 amp circuit. It's much simpler since you won't need a subpanel and all of the extras that come with it. practicalhomeprojects.com/?p=138
The distance might affect the gauge wire you need to safely operate that 20amp circuit. For shorter distances, you'd use 12gauge wires. At around 100ft, the voltage drop becomes significant enough that you'll want to do some quick voltage drop calculations to make sure that it doesn't drop more than 5%. Be sure to use the distance the wire will travel rather than just distance between sides of the buildings. You'll most likely step up to 10 gauge wires. www.southwire.com/calculator-vdrop
Individual THHN wires vs. a cable is up to your preference. The correct type of cable can be direct buried with no conduit, which saves a bunch of time. However if you are going to use conduit, you'll have to use a much wider diameter with cable rather than with wire due to the fill calculation. Also THHN is coated to be low friction whereas cables are not, so wire will pull much more easily.
If you have not dug yet, consider putting a bigger pipe in there. Today, you can run a 15 Amp 14-2 through a 2 inch conduit (way oversized). You could easily fit a 200 Amp sub panel feeder in that same pipe. Just use one wire as a rope to pull the other.
Second, consider extra pipes like 3/4 or 1 inch.
Cable tv, hardwired 8nternet, an alarm fir diner, security cameras, whatever else you can think of. Burial depth is based on the voltage plus some extra stuff. But a few dollars today might mean not having having to re-dig the same trench later.
Hope I got you ontime.
If you said it, I missed it.
What gauge wire are you running and how big was your conduit? I'm just about to do this same project but I'm gonna need to run 8 awg wire for 240 v.
Hey there. You can see a written description of the project here: practicalhomeprojects.com/?p=138
We used three 6AWG conductors with a 10AWG ground conductor. All in a 1" PVC conduit.
A fill calculator like this one is very helpful: www.southwire.com/calculator-conduit
What electrical panel (make/model) did you end up using? I'm planning to do the same thing.
Thanks for sharing.. Looking forward to the next episode...
Hey Joe. I grabbed this one. It was cheap and I already have GE breakers. I wanted to make sure it had at least 16 spaces for future improvements. Also you'll want a main breaker panel. If you use a main lug panel, you'll have to additionally use a power shut off switch. Let us know what type of videos you'd like to see in the future!
www.lowes.com/pd/GE-125-Amp-24-Spaces-24-Circuit-Convertible-Main-Breaker-Panel-Load-Center-Value-Pack/3150199
@@practicalhomeprojects Perfect. Thanks for the info. We still have some work to complete before starting on electrical. Just want to gather supplies in advance..
Thanks again...
Link to the cabling?
I used www.wireandcableyourway.com/ It was the cheapest place I saw with all of the wires I needed for the project.
how long was the trench?
Lol. How much fun did you have pulling your wire lol.
In my country we have extension cords.
This is a much better installation than an extension cord. They are not weather/dig proof, and cannot provide the amperage that an independent subpanel can...
What size breakers did you use?
We used a 60amp double pole breaker.
Good job without using the ditch digger machine of course next time you will use the machine if you can rent one or hopefully, you will never need to do this job again.
Where’d you get your code information?
If you go to the NFPA website, you can purchase a version of the code, or read it one page at a time through their viewer. Be sure to check your state for any variances from the National Code.
www.nfpa.org/codes-and-standards/all-codes-and-standards/list-of-codes-and-standards/detail?code=70
Can't use LFNC in this application. How are you going to "securely fasten" it every 3' underground? 356.10(50 and 356.30(1). Not dangerous, but it is a code violation.
Interesting take John. Fortunately, the NEC included section 300.5 to instruct on safe conduit burial. Accordingly, this is not a code violation, otherwise all types of conduit would be subject to the same problem. Just be sure that your conduit is labelled as "rated for direct burial" and you'll be all set.
@@practicalhomeprojects It is, according to the language of the NEC, absolutely a code violation. It's not an electrical problem, but it is a violation. 300.5 addresses general rules for underground locations but, as anyone who uses the NEC knows, it is common to have to look at multiple code references to apply to any particular installation. One must look into the article dedicated to LFNC. 356.10(5) says, specifically, that if LFNC is longer than 6' it must (operative term, shall be permitted) be secured in accordance with 356.30. 356.12, Uses Not Permitted, says if longer than 6' it must comply with 356.10(5). Other underground conduits, IMC, PVC, etc, say not such thing about limited lengths UNLESS secured. In other words, LFNC is allowed for direct burial in lengths up to 6'. Beyond 6' must be secured. Not my rule, but the language is specific and clearly states this. A public input proposal may bring clarity, but it says what it says.
Hello again John, I appreciate the detailed response. I'm still inclined to interpret the code as permitting direct burial of LFNC, but I agree that a bit more clarity could be added.
356.10(4) specifically permits direct burial when the LFNC is rated for such a purpose. I imagine this use was added to clear up confusion and would end the conversation with any inspector.
356.12(3) calls on the use outlined in 356.10(5) OR "where a longer length is approved as essential for a required degree of flexibility." This is where I think you are claiming that my application does not pass the code. I'm going to claim that direct burial requires a longer length for flexibility; a word I do not see defined in this context.
356.30 explains how to secure the conduit, but does not specifically require the conduit to be secured (the requirement coming from 356.12(3). It is telling, however, that "Securing or supporting of the conduit shall not be required where it is fished" indicating that the governing body felt that securing was only intended where practical to do so.
Pvc pipe would have been a lot cheaper
Hi Thomas. You're right. The flexible conduit plus connections were probably $60 over a simple schedule 40 PVC solution. I chose the flexible option so that I wouldn't have to deal with multiple partial angles and because I imagine the connections would make it more difficult to pull the wire.
Dude. Rent a trencher. It’s worth it for that distance.
When you dig your trench about 18 inches deep, what kind of climate area are you in? Does it snow there, or freeze? Does that make a difference on depth?
The depth is laid out in the National Electric Code. I think section 300.4.
Climate does not matter.
Your local building office can adjust, bend, or throw out the nec rules and not everyone is under the nec, even in America.
If you are about to do this job, a phone call to a local electrician or building Inspector should get you plenty of answers.
The voltage you run can also affect the depth required by your local code.
@@phendrix9476 yes sir, you are correct. The voltage, the use of the area above, gfci protection and more play in to the required depth and concrete above your pipe can also effect depth.
This is why I encourage people to consider other items while the trench is open.
Cable tv or high speed internet I believe only needs to be under the surface, but it could be deeper or the piping used for something else. Security cameras, some kind of flashing light in your shop to alert you of diner time or some emergency in the house may allow you to "get a message" in a noisy work envirnment.
If you have extra pipes in your trench, they can be deeper than the minimum and prevent a re-dig. Slip a string in the pipe when you install it and use it for a wire pull in the future.
Keith is correct. Check 300.5 in the NEC. The depth is more related to "how likely is someone to cut this with a shovel or trencher" than it is to freeze/thaw cycles.
What was your total cost on this project?
Hi Marc, it was around $700.
We also shared the detailed breakdown of the cost at the end of the video if you are interested to find out more, hope it helps!
glad i dont have to adhere to some over protective code bs
Great video!
Thanks!