DUN TOLD BARB WE A INT HITRIN KORTOR MILES ION HAVE A BBC INNIT TIL SHE DIES N I GET THAT LIFE INSHRUNSE CHECK TULL DEN IL KEEP CRANKIN THA HOG GOBBLESS HEY ALEXA ,,,,,,,,,, DEBRA
Not really accomplishing the same thing lol This is increasing engine toque at low rpm when cylinder fill is low, it needs more timing for a complete burn at the right time.
I can work with both no problem…. But prefer the near infinite adjustments you can do with a ECM/digital controls. And especially prefer fuel injection…. Carbs are a restriction… they wouldn’t work if they weren’t!
@@musewolfman sort of… it’s the mechanical equivalent…. Although nowhere near the same capability in terms of adjustments… some timing adjustments are beyond what a mechanical system can do.
Yea muscle cars are just about dead. These last couple years were the death throws of the muscle cars. I don’t think people are paying close enough attention. The Camaro is gone again, dodge is going electric, ford has one more mustang that will be gas powered. That’s it folks. End of an era. Everything will be electric which is shit.
I remember those days when I was a kid and tried so hard to get my one wheel wonder Monte Carlo to spin both tires.. but a nitrous huffing big block and upgraded axles tied together with a mini spool did the trick lol.. I miss that car 😔
Obviously you've never driven a classic with a really shitty suspension and steering. That's just steering slop his wheels went straight the whole time most likely😂
Good old mechanical ignition curve mods . I have welded and machined distributer parts for that same reason . Never got to see how it ended up , knowing where I live it knocked itself into oblivion.
Retired Professional Mechanic. Your way can cause hard cranking especially hot. Or you can go buy a performance spring kit for the weights on inside the distributor that brings in full advance a lot earlier for around 10 to 15 dollars. I believe they give you 3 different choices. Much much better.
You can see the 2 little springs as u move the weight, you can see the spring tension. In the kit you get springs that are not as stiff to bring full advance in at lower rpms. Your idea STINKS
@@701garage it doesnt lose power on the top. its wherever the cam stops making power along with the heads.if anything the car likes more initial timing because its where the engine wants it to be at. you have to set it with highest vacuum then take that reading off the light and then limit your mechanical and bring it all total in by about 2000-2500 RPM. if anything he'd not ping because hes putting total where it needs to be. making even more advance would make it ping and that would be bad.
@KingJT80 execpy you don't want 20 degrees of timing at idle that's way to much and will be prone to detention especially if you smash the gas at 1600 rpms with 20 degrees of timing and no were near enough fuel
@@701garage that depends on the setup You give it as much initial as it wants without pinging or dragging it he starter. The last thing you wanna do is take initial timing out if you don't need to it'll be a dog as demonstrated
Yup! Same reason I’m eliminating the variable timing in my Raptor 6.2. Makes it a little more of a challenge to tune in a dyno but there are noticeable power gains. Eliminating everything added for emissions and gas mileage give you the true maximum performance out of an engine
Yup this is legit. Although "Faster" is the wrong adjective. It makes it Quicker off the line! I make limters for MSD distributors out of a little rectangle of aluminum. I cut a slot in it and file it longer till I like the results. It helps doing this especially if you have a large (lots of duration) cam. It allows you to run manifold vacuum instead of ported source. Set intial timing lower for easier hot starts but as soon as it fires up and the vacuum comes in, then you'll have your desired idle timing!
That would be cool. I did install lighter springs already and stretch them out a bit too. This is more for the guy who is just trying to make do with what they got lol
I melted down some lead tire weights and used a carved out 2×4 for a mold. I put the centrifugal weights in the mold and pour molten lead in there. Then I filed the weights til they were identical. Put it back in the distributor and it made a pretty noticeable difference when you stepped down on the gas! I was surprised those weights didn't fly off and wedge between the distributor housing and bust the distributor to pieces! High school days! Making a hotrod out of a 71 Datsun truck! Lol 🤣
Your really not limiting by that much…rather just advance the entire distributor 10-15 degrees, tighten the gap on the spark plugs…and run 91 octane or add a fuel additive. Floor it and spin those tires, instead of crawling off the line. Check the transmission fluid also. Beautiful car, have fun like we did back in the day. Cheap way to make it quicker but if you want it faster then…🤫👍🤙
Problem was i couldn't advance the distributor anymore or i would be up at 40° total timing lol. It was at 10° initial and 38° total in at 4000 rpm. Now it is at 18° initial and 35° total at about 2600 rmp (i replaced the old spring on a different video and ended up stretching them a bit too) 91 every time and tran is full lol 👍
@@newguysgarage6802 pretty sure you were increasing initial advance which raises cylinder pressure increasing low rpm power and throttle response yet limiting total advance so it won’t hit a wall and start shooting ducks or detonate like crazy at high rpm.
Thats it! Low compression low vacuum motors want more initial timing to get a complete burn at the right time due to incomplete cylinder fill due to low vacuum (big cam motors especially) But to do that you need to limit the amout of machanical advance you have so your not running 50° total lol. Im not the first guy by any means to come up with this outlandish theory lol 😂
Suggestion. Instead, just do lighter springs or take one spring off. The latter method of course, requiring your ignition hot to be run separately from your starter circuit so you don’t break the bendix off the starter when she fires over.
For 36 degrees advice to help you have to have the fuel, compression and cam overlap to make it useful. Take it to a drag strip or a chassis dyno if you want to get anything close to an accurate result. Unless you've got something special in that motor, it's max advance would be 28-30 with 9:1 comp ratio. To make 36 BTDC work at all you need race gas.
8s compression ratio......not 1/4 1/8th mile then ya 8s Hey cant please everybody, and im certainly not gonna try to eather lol 😆 As far as seat of the pants is concerned....i spend more time feeling that than i do on a drag strip so...if seat of the pants improves that is more important in my book 👍
3.73 would be the best for performance or 4.10s Giving up just a little all out performance with the 3.55s in the name of lower rpms on the highway lol. (Not by much i know) And a 3000 stall would make it all the better too!
@@newguysgarage6802 3:73 will still give you good highway rpms. If you really want a good highway rpm car. Look into the gear vendors overdrive system. They can handle amazing power and if you can find one used. It's usually not that expensive to do.
@@newguysgarage6802 i respect this more than the guys trying to make v8 power in a 4 banger with bolt on displacement… lol. Bolt on some displacement onto a v8. Get real power.
Actually helps down lower when there is low cylinder filling from low compression and low vacuum motors. Limited the advance. Was 10° initial 38° total Now 18° initial 34° total
Say goodbye to fuel mileage and hello to possibly running hot and detonation as well as hard starting. I'd want to see time slips or dyno sheets, just an interior sound bite of spinning tires isn't proof of anything. This is sold drag racer's trick and for full throttle runs, it works because you don't drop enough RPM to come off full advance anyway. In a street, road race or stock car, it isn't optimal. I worked on a sportsman-class stock car on a 1/4 mile track which had a locked distributor. The first thing I did was install a good curve kit with proper curve from 10 to 36 degrees at 2600 and picked up a .1 second average lap time. Next, I changed another drag trick, replacing the power valve plug with a 2-stage power valve which improved throttle response and dropped another .2 seconds off lap times. The great thing was that the driver had no issues with starter kickback, restarting if in an accident and at the end of the race we were running 190 - 200 degrees while other guys running big timing were pumping water through their rads to try to cool down from 220+. On a dyno, a 2-degree up or down adjustment from optimum timing lost power.
What he did was good for performance, fuel mileage, and cooler running engine. The strain on the starter motor shouldn't be excessive as long as initial timing isn't TOO drastic. It should be an improvement just as long as the piece that he used to limit the timing can't come loose & fall off. His Mustang DOES sound like it needs a bit more tuning, though. I'm only guessing but I have a feeling that it still has breaker point ignition and the distributor is worn out making the point adjustment constantly vary.
@@mickangio16 He has limited the timing advance requiring more initial, which gives the same effect, too much initial timing, which does what I described. You can add a certain amount of initial without much detrimental effect, but it is usually a few degrees, not 10 or more. GM even gives a proper performance spark curve in their performance manual; It starts at about 10 degrees initial and builds to 36 degrees at around 3000. Look at the curve in an aftermarket distributor like MSD and you'll see roughly the same curve. At idle and up until the engine can use 20 degrees or more, the flame front is fighting against the piston, costing power. Brake standing brings the RPM up to get into that range, but you don't brake stand all the while you are driving. A good curve and a mild stall convertor will keep more drivability and give response. On street cars with milder cams, you also have a vacuum advance that helps throttle response and mileage. When we drag race, we disconnect the vacuum and bump initial up since we are running full throttle and at full advance through the whole race anyway. I know from dyno runs that too much of anything is detrimental to power and if this was good for anything other than a drag race, it is how all performance shops would curve their distributors and all muscle cars would have a curve like this. A proper "fast" curve will give you just as good a result and better driveability.
MSD distributors when bought new are very conservatively tuned. You can almost always get better performance from them by putting a bigger limiter bushing in them.
@@mickangio16 Yes, curving to an engine always improves performance, but the point is that it has to be a proper curve. Even MSD shows how to modify the curve, not throw a bunch of initial at it and set the total at 36. This "clip trick" is an old drag racer's trick that has fallen away as recurving produced better results in driveability and performance. A good curve is going to be at about 20 degrees at about 2000 anyway, which is probably where this brake stand is running and you don't have the disadvantages of a lot of initial. I know stockcar mechanics who swear that you need 42 degrees or higher total, and yet, on a dyno, the best (on a 355 Chevy) was 36 degrees @2800 with 38 not much worse. This was on a Sportsman engine at 285 HP @5200 and an ACT engine with 466 HP @6300, both with the same basic curve and initial of 12 degrees. If you are drag racing, other than a stocker with no convertor, do what you want because you are well into the curve on launch anyway, but, for street driveability and performance, you want a good timing curve. In Fords, there may even be a difference in requirements between a 302 and a 289 because the 302 has a shorter connecting rod, but, it should still be a proper curve. Back in the late '70s, my 289 rod 302 with 4-speed ran the same curve as above with 10 degrees initial and 38 total in a dual point Mallory distributor, and it was damn snappy.
To hell with all that work man. I have an even better idea. Add an "R" to the badge to make it go faster or you can go balls out and add "GT" to make it go lightning quick. I caution anyone to take extra precautions when adding "GT", and to maybe kiss their loved ones one last time cause it's that serious.
Im going to bet you i can make this glass of water more drinkable with nothing but this single H2O molecule. **Drinks before & after different angles** 😂😂
I do not recommend following this advice to anybody reading this. Although he is technically correct as you are essentially screwing with your advance, really shouldn't put anything inside the distributor if it comes loose it can destroy things inside a stock distributor, Points type distributors are generally relatively cheap at 60 or 80 bucks (if you can find one remanufactured they're getting pretty old). And most more modern distributors ranging from the mid-70s to the mid-90s are going for a little over a hundred bucks these days. Anyways if that terminal end comes loose and bounces around in the distributor it can destroy a ton of the internal parts. If you want performance by an aftermarket distributor or find different advance Springs. Also, not being a critic but preloading that engine before you launch will help that low RPM bog that it appears to have.
You know.....everybody always talks about the lighter springs 🙄 I DID THAT IN THE VIDEO I POSTED RIGHT BEFORE THIS ONE! 😅 😆 🤣 😂 I should have mentioned it in the video i guess, just assumed they would have seen the last one i did to. But as far as damaging anything....there is nothing down there that could get damaged really. I mean were is it going to go? cant go up because there is a plate that sits directly above it, Cant go down because it is sitting on that arm it is clipped around (arm bends and connects to the center shaft), Cant go forward because the tab is in the way, cant go back because the slotted plate is right up next to it. Cant really move. If it did come loose it would just bounce around on top untill finding its way to the bottom of the distributor where it would just lay down there, its probably not going to Sawzall the weights and springs in half lol. And if it came off....you would know it immediately, idle would come down a noticeable bit and it would be lazy again.
I don't kbow about this one... that vaccum advance is there for a reason. You'll probably just go back and forth between being under powered and getting a bunch of spark knock now.
Your just changing timing on your old distributor! Are you going to update it when that Walmart spade connector spins off that post shreds your mechanical advance 😆?!
Fun fact 🫵 Did you know that… Tint on your car adds on 50bhp, Decals stripes - extra 50bhp, Decorative spoiler - another 50bhp, And let’s not forget cheap alloys☝️ Those are at least 200bhp and if you paint them black with the spray can it’s extra 50bhp on top of 200. So… 400bhp on top of the stock setup brings you to around 600 - 650bhp on average. And that’s without even looking under the bonnet 🫵
I drilled and tapped my distributor body and inserted a machine screw to keep the timing from coming back down. Now i can run 18 initial and 36 total it runs alot better now
@@newguysgarage6802 in their defense, most of them have never seen the inner workings of a distributor, let alone know how any of it works. Haha my carbed 5.2 magnum would only idle well at about 20 degrees or so but the distributor had alot of timing built into it almost 30 degreees. So at 20 initial i was seeing almost 50 total! (Not including the vaccum advance at cruise speed) So i turned down the distributor to 36 total and had an initial of like 6. It was a turd. Haha i liked your video. Nice mustang by the way. Im not a big ford guy but i really like the pony cars.
Ya thats fair lol 😆 not to many kids learning the details of how this all works. Lot of guys only know how to open a laptop to tune there cars anymore.....don't even get there hands dirty, were is the fun in that? 🤣
@@newguysgarage6802 i cant imagine just being able to hook a laptop to a car and change stuff. I have no idea where to start. I only use my smart phone. I dont think ive touched an actual computer in over 10 years since i left high school.
How to pit your valves with 1 simple connector. I mean how much could a head rework cost anyway. Yes, the correct way is to swap out your springs, not limit the amount of total ignition advance.
@@newguysgarage6802 There's a reason why your idle advance and final isn't the same; spark front and discharge time. Think about it, if your engine could theoretically turn at 0 rpm, then you would want your ignition timing to be 0 deg, or exactly tdc. but in reality it takes time from igniting the mix to it actually building combustion pressure. At idle, you don't want to over compensate for that delay, cuz combustion pressure btdc is literally the recipe for ignition knock. Small amounts of this will certainly pit valves, large amounts will over time destroy the rotating assembly completely. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying you're 0,2mm away from teaching people how to ruin their motors. So for the love of whatever god you believe in, at least be transparent about this. You made this video in the theme of "here's something cool I bet you never knew about your car". And yeah it is cool that you can do this, but if your target audience is people that had no clue, wouldn't you also agree that would be the same people that has no clue how to properly advance timing safely? Not to mention knowing how to properly drive a motor with limited advance. P.S. I'm an old school guy, I like tuning for fuel then trimming in advance. So I prefer being a bit rich and allowing a for a little bit of ignition headroom. I would rather have an abundance of advance at my disposal with a wet tune, and let it go lean as I trim in some more advance. Then only when I'm happy with the when and where the advance influenced torque will I clean up the tune and still retard everything by 2 degrees.
ruclips.net/video/7b7vdCWQLi8/видео.html Ok im not gonna lie, i didn't have time to read the entire thing but here is a video on timing from my own perspective 🙃
@@newguysgarage6802 BS. It takes 2 minutes to read that, now you want to waste more of my time because you can't be bothered to read. I'm a business man, with an engineering shop specializing in engine rebuild/modding and it goes without saying, do regular ecu tuning. You're not going to BS or educate me on this. You're telling non car experts how to limit ignition advance, most of the comment section here won't even know what 10-20btdc even means, and the difference between 10 and 20 could be an engine rebuild in their case....Again, I'm not saying you're incorrect, because you CAN make power like this, but it's far, FAR, from a safe street mod. And you're literally now refusing to own up to that. I didn't write any of that shit for you, its for the people reading this without chiming in. It's for the people you told to do something that could hurt their engines without even warning about the dangers thereof. Your practice is dangerous, and WILL cost someone money sooner or later, and you don't even have the transparency to read those opinions of yourself, let alone man up about it.
"Im not saying your wrong because you CAN make power like this" Ya i know...worked for me lol. Night and day difference in fact. You disapprove and that is fine.......everyone is entitled to there opinion.
Dude if you want to make a 289 run you need to get your power band between 4000 and 7500 rpm you need a cam a 4spd and 4:11 gears been running them for 40 years
But you need money 💰 to do all that....which i have non lol 😂 (you have no idea how much i would love that combo though!) Technically you would need better flowing heads with stiffer valve train too. But i have to work with what i got and what i can afford to get so i have to really use my head rather than my wallet 😆
Lambda sensors? I dont think i have those lol 😂 And i did alter the ignition timing thats what i was doing in the video! (I assume there was sarcasm in your comment but im too out of loop with new stuff if flew right over my head lol)
Correct me if I’m wrong, won’t that limit your overall timing advance at higher RPM? So the car will snap but when at high revs the piston is hauling ass to tdc and that spark needs fire quicker, if it doesn’t, you’re igniting later than you should and the outcome is reduced power. No? I dunno just a thought.
Not exactly let me explain lol 🙂 Yes, it is limiting the total machanical advance so it dosnt advance as far thats correct. But your not limiting the advance at the top of the rpm your limiting it at the bottom. So at high rpm's it is the same as it normally would be. But at the bottom like idle and just off idle it will have more advance than normal making it snap. The reason it snaps is because at the lower rpms on a low compression low vacuum motor the cylinder dosnt get filled as full because of the low vacuum and the low mixture dosnt get compressed together as tightly because of the low compression ratio (static / or dynamic compression ratios) So to get that loosely low mixture to ignite and fully burn at the right time to deliver the most power (toque) you need to light it earlier (advanced) so it has time to fully burn (less fuel / air mixture and low compression = slow burn) So thats why having more advance early on improves bottom end performance especially with big cam low vacuum motors or low compression stock motors for that matter. ........i hope that makes sense lol 😅
What? Vacuum advance and machanical advance do not correlate with eachother.... Vacuum advance is ADDED to your machanical......dose not determine your machanical.
I could be wrong as hell because I only built one car but is your torque converter high rpm? Also is your kickdown on your transmission properly hooked up. I feel like there's something wrong with that thing I just don't know what it is. That thing should have way more power than that
The problem is a 2.80 gear, 28in tall tire, and a worn 190hp 289 lol 😆 2200 stall converter, manual valve body Just posted a video of me putting 3.55 gears in it yesterday and will have a full test video sometime this week of that 👍
Wow people really did not like the two different camera angles... You can clearly hear the difference so i thought that was good enough..... I did make a part 2 since this....
@@newguysgarage6802 sorry buddy its just better in my eyes if your doin a comparison to do them the exact way. Idk im goin to try it for myself. Thanks for the idea
Had a locked out distributer on a 306 at 36 degrees all the time starting it while hot was a bitch had a kill switch for ignition so would crank car get it spinning then hit switch and have ignition come back on to get spark. Cold starts we’re fine but once you ran it for a bit was a bitch
Yes! I already put new lighter springs in it! Lol 😆
Those are not lighter springs. Those are what my $80 mattress came with.
I just came here to point out you can buy the springs... 😆
...........yup i could have 😂
@@newguysgarage6802 😆
Build that car with proper built hi reving 289 hi po or 347 stroker no o t her way to own older mustang or of course a topnloader 4 speed to boot
I threw my wife out of mine. Not only is it faster it is so much quieter.
And you lived to tell the story😂
🤣 🤣 🤣
Confirm that this works, great tip 👍🏻
DUN TOLD BARB WE A INT HITRIN KORTOR MILES ION HAVE A BBC INNIT TIL SHE DIES N I GET THAT LIFE INSHRUNSE CHECK TULL DEN IL KEEP CRANKIN THA HOG GOBBLESS
HEY ALEXA ,,,,,,,,,, DEBRA
and that drone is gone too i bet
I just add stickers to make my car faster 🤣✌️
Nice! That will do it 😆
don't forget the AutoZone hood scoop for that extra airflow
I spray painted a racing stripe on my truck and got another 10 mph
I got racing hub caps on mine
Nice 👌
Somebody busted out all of my windows for weight saving! Cool to see the neighbors come together to see me go faster
Good ol country boy just showing us the nits and tricks to life 💯
Dam straight lol 😆
@@newguysgarage6802 you bet you come across and 67-68ish Camero or Plymouth for decent price let me know ✌️
Sure 👍
The only thing he's showing is how insecure he is about his moobs by wearing 2 shirts
@@WTC7 well that and the fact its like 40° outside up here in MN. Lol 😆
There is now a Part 2!
With some numbers lol 😆
ruclips.net/user/shortsGONj3oMFDHA?feature=share
. Doesn't power braking do The same get-up & go. Ha.Ha.Ha
Not really accomplishing the same thing lol
This is increasing engine toque at low rpm when cylinder fill is low, it needs more timing for a complete burn at the right time.
Proper old school mechanics, not a laptop or ECU in sight. Love it!
Oh you are going to love my new video that is uploading 😆 🤣
Sounds like its going to right up your alley 👌
@@bobbyblair6862 Also...
...you're troll af... XD
Love the car and the old school “mod” but this couldn’t beat an 8th gen civic si with like $3k-$5k in mods.
.....ok?
I don't have 3-5k in mods so not really a comparison lol 😆
Best car has ran is 13.7 in the quarter mile 👌
@@isaiah1660 maybe, but it's still a civic, who the hell wants that🤣🤣
*laughs in fully adjustable timing maps*
I can work with both no problem…. But prefer the near infinite adjustments you can do with a ECM/digital controls. And especially prefer fuel injection…. Carbs are a restriction… they wouldn’t work if they weren’t!
aye. it's free. can't beat that.
Is that not basically what this is? Just without the computer.
@@musewolfman sort of… it’s the mechanical equivalent…. Although nowhere near the same capability in terms of adjustments… some timing adjustments are beyond what a mechanical system can do.
Yep lol
I am the computer!
Gone are these days when life was easy to modify
Fords were never easy.
Its just as easy, even easier but you have to be smarter.
@@nowthatsfunny1 you just need more money
Hptuners
Yea muscle cars are just about dead. These last couple years were the death throws of the muscle cars. I don’t think people are paying close enough attention. The Camaro is gone again, dodge is going electric, ford has one more mustang that will be gas powered. That’s it folks. End of an era. Everything will be electric which is shit.
I'd you gotta shake the wheel to burnout you need more torque brotha
I remember those days when I was a kid and tried so hard to get my one wheel wonder Monte Carlo to spin both tires.. but a nitrous huffing big block and upgraded axles tied together with a mini spool did the trick lol.. I miss that car 😔
Obviously you've never driven a classic with a really shitty suspension and steering. That's just steering slop his wheels went straight the whole time most likely😂
Thats is exactly right lol 😆
how to tell someone youve never driven an old car without saying it completely.
I was expecting a "lid flip"
Im sorry to disappoint 😞
However i cant flip what isnt there lol 😂
@@newguysgarage6802 yeah its more of a chevy thing
Didn't see anything like that under my oil filter but put it in there anyway and now my 2012 Subaru sounds like a Diesel. Thanks!
😂 good one 👍
🤣🤣
I told my gramma she can't sleep in my back seat anymore. Now my car goes alot faster.
That will do it lol 😆
This is that shit people wanna see! The REAL cars!!! Good stuff! I hate the new Tupperware on wheels...this was refreshing to see
Thank you 👍
Good old mechanical ignition curve mods . I have welded and machined distributer parts for that same reason . Never got to see how it ended up , knowing where I live it knocked itself into oblivion.
Retired Professional Mechanic. Your way can cause hard cranking especially hot. Or you can go buy a performance spring kit for the weights on inside the distributor that brings in full advance a lot earlier for around 10 to 15 dollars. I believe they give you 3 different choices. Much much better.
You can see the 2 little springs as u move the weight, you can see the spring tension. In the kit you get springs that are not as stiff to bring full advance in at lower rpms. Your idea STINKS
I do have lighter springs on.....and they are stretched a bit too.
Great job, Keep going boys,,,, eventually you'll make the Ford worth driving.
😂 I like that 👍
Timing is everything! ❤️👍
Really is lol 😆
hows you AFR when you limit your timing like that? why did you loose so much power on the top end because you are now down 4 degrees of timing.
@@701garage it doesnt lose power on the top. its wherever the cam stops making power along with the heads.if anything the car likes more initial timing because its where the engine wants it to be at. you have to set it with highest vacuum then take that reading off the light and then limit your mechanical and bring it all total in by about 2000-2500 RPM. if anything he'd not ping because hes putting total where it needs to be. making even more advance would make it ping and that would be bad.
@KingJT80 execpy you don't want 20 degrees of timing at idle that's way to much and will be prone to detention especially if you smash the gas at 1600 rpms with 20 degrees of timing and no were near enough fuel
@@701garage that depends on the setup
You give it as much initial as it wants without pinging or dragging it he starter.
The last thing you wanna do is take initial timing out if you don't need to it'll be a dog as demonstrated
Yup! Same reason I’m eliminating the variable timing in my Raptor 6.2. Makes it a little more of a challenge to tune in a dyno but there are noticeable power gains. Eliminating everything added for emissions and gas mileage give you the true maximum performance out of an engine
Yup this is legit. Although "Faster" is the wrong adjective. It makes it Quicker off the line! I make limters for MSD distributors out of a little rectangle of aluminum. I cut a slot in it and file it longer till I like the results. It helps doing this especially if you have a large (lots of duration) cam. It allows you to run manifold vacuum instead of ported source. Set intial timing lower for easier hot starts but as soon as it fires up and the vacuum comes in, then you'll have your desired idle timing!
Mallory and Accel sell cheap spring kits. A dual point distributor.
Tighten the gap a hair and drop a super coil in the mix with heavier wires.
That would be cool. I did install lighter springs already and stretch them out a bit too.
This is more for the guy who is just trying to make do with what they got lol
Putting a giant spoiler will add another 50 horsepower.
I melted down some lead tire weights and used a carved out 2×4 for a mold. I put the centrifugal weights in the mold and pour molten lead in there. Then I filed the weights til they were identical. Put it back in the distributor and it made a pretty noticeable difference when you stepped down on the gas! I was surprised those weights didn't fly off and wedge between the distributor housing and bust the distributor to pieces! High school days! Making a hotrod out of a 71 Datsun truck! Lol 🤣
Also stretched the springs a little bit to weaken their pull.
Looks like he did that too!
That's cool!
Would have never thought of doing that lol 😆
I did stretch the springs! Thats old school 👍
Yup some good old fashioned engineering 👌
Man dude that ol mustang sounded good
Your really not limiting by that much…rather just advance the entire distributor 10-15 degrees, tighten the gap on the spark plugs…and run 91 octane or add a fuel additive. Floor it and spin those tires, instead of crawling off the line. Check the transmission fluid also. Beautiful car, have fun like we did back in the day. Cheap way to make it quicker but if you want it faster then…🤫👍🤙
Problem was i couldn't advance the distributor anymore or i would be up at 40° total timing lol.
It was at 10° initial and 38° total in at 4000 rpm.
Now it is at 18° initial and 35° total at about 2600 rmp (i replaced the old spring on a different video and ended up stretching them a bit too)
91 every time and tran is full lol 👍
@@newguysgarage6802 I don’t think he gets it.
Thats ok.....a lot of people dont get it but hey win some loose some lol.
Some people believe it was all just to raise the idle rpm 🙄
@@newguysgarage6802 pretty sure you were increasing initial advance which raises cylinder pressure increasing low rpm power and throttle response yet limiting total advance so it won’t hit a wall and start shooting ducks or detonate like crazy at high rpm.
Thats it!
Low compression low vacuum motors want more initial timing to get a complete burn at the right time due to incomplete cylinder fill due to low vacuum (big cam motors especially)
But to do that you need to limit the amout of machanical advance you have so your not running 50° total lol.
Im not the first guy by any means to come up with this outlandish theory lol 😂
Still sounds like Scooby-Doo's mystery van.
Suggestion. Instead, just do lighter springs or take one spring off. The latter method of course, requiring your ignition hot to be run separately from your starter circuit so you don’t break the bendix off the starter when she fires over.
ruclips.net/user/shortsT2oe9NGAEco?feature=share
I replaced the springs before i did this video lol
One spring would be good. Starter will be fine.
Sounds less snappy and slower after. Especially when you are not trying in the before
For 36 degrees advice to help you have to have the fuel, compression and cam overlap to make it useful.
Take it to a drag strip or a chassis dyno if you want to get anything close to an accurate result. Unless you've got something special in that motor, it's max advance would be 28-30 with 9:1 comp ratio.
To make 36 BTDC work at all you need race gas.
Its at 34° and i would be surprised if it is 9:1
Probably down in the 8s.
Did you watch P2?
@@newguysgarage6802 Terrible. Seat of the pants is not how to see if it's better. 8's eh?
I'll believe that when I see a time slip.
8s compression ratio......not 1/4
1/8th mile then ya 8s
Hey cant please everybody, and im certainly not gonna try to eather lol 😆
As far as seat of the pants is concerned....i spend more time feeling that than i do on a drag strip so...if seat of the pants improves that is more important in my book 👍
36° is a good number on that little Ford. Even try 38°.
My 4 banger camry takes off quicker than that
@@TheClamy8911 I just have a twin brother that cross dresses on the weekends. So I guess that makes you gay.
Probably, thats what a 2.80 rear gear and low stall gets ya lol.
@@newguysgarage6802 you probably need 3:73 gears and a high stall converter. You'd probably shave atleast 2 seconds off your 1/4 mile
3.73 would be the best for performance or 4.10s
Giving up just a little all out performance with the 3.55s in the name of lower rpms on the highway lol. (Not by much i know)
And a 3000 stall would make it all the better too!
@@newguysgarage6802 3:73 will still give you good highway rpms. If you really want a good highway rpm car. Look into the gear vendors overdrive system. They can handle amazing power and if you can find one used. It's usually not that expensive to do.
I painted Good Year in yellow over my Ironman tires and been undefeated ever since 🏎
Define "faster" 😂
it was micro. but it was betterish....lmfao
"I dont care if its by an inch or a mile. Wining is wining"
Fast and furious haha 😄
@@newguysgarage6802 i respect this more than the guys trying to make v8 power in a 4 banger with bolt on displacement… lol.
Bolt on some displacement onto a v8. Get real power.
I appreciate it man 👍
Making what i got work with what i got lol 😆
You can also change the curve and get an even better results
I changed the springs in an earlier video, i ended up stretching them out a little bit too.
Ya because before it wasn't all in until like 4000 rpm!
Thats why we love our old trucks and cars
So simple even i can do it lol 😆
I have 30 air fresheners. Each one gives me 1 HP. So I have a extra 30 horsepower right now !!! 🔥
They make a kit with weights and springs, used to be real cheap, bet it still is
The old way is to weld them. Uncle tonys garage explains this perfectly
Another tip.. but a car that does not use a distributor. Much snappier
Thats called reducing the "dwell" factor...that may effect power at high end
Actually helps down lower when there is low cylinder filling from low compression and low vacuum motors.
Limited the advance.
Was 10° initial 38° total
Now 18° initial 34° total
When you’re doing a comparison, it makes sense to do them from the same angle. Otherwise it isn’t a comparison.
There is a part 2 on the channel.
Say goodbye to fuel mileage and hello to possibly running hot and detonation as well as hard starting.
I'd want to see time slips or dyno sheets, just an interior sound bite of spinning tires isn't proof of anything.
This is sold drag racer's trick and for full throttle runs, it works because you don't drop enough RPM to come off full advance anyway. In a street, road race or stock car, it isn't optimal.
I worked on a sportsman-class stock car on a 1/4 mile track which had a locked distributor. The first thing I did was install a good curve kit with proper curve from 10 to 36 degrees at 2600 and picked up a .1 second average lap time.
Next, I changed another drag trick, replacing the power valve plug with a 2-stage power valve which improved throttle response and dropped another .2 seconds off lap times.
The great thing was that the driver had no issues with starter kickback, restarting if in an accident and at the end of the race we were running 190 - 200 degrees while other guys running big timing were pumping water through their rads to try to cool down from 220+.
On a dyno, a 2-degree up or down adjustment from optimum timing lost power.
What he did was good for performance, fuel mileage, and cooler running engine. The strain on the starter motor shouldn't be excessive as long as initial timing isn't TOO drastic. It should be an improvement just as long as the piece that he used to limit the timing can't come loose & fall off. His Mustang DOES sound like it needs a bit more tuning, though. I'm only guessing but I have a feeling that it still has breaker point ignition and the distributor is worn out making the point adjustment constantly vary.
Exactly lol 👍
The clip was not really the point of the video (more of the wow factor)
the point was raised initial timing can help bottom end tourqe.
@@mickangio16
He has limited the timing advance requiring more initial, which gives the same effect, too much initial timing, which does what I described. You can add a certain amount of initial without much detrimental effect, but it is usually a few degrees, not 10 or more. GM even gives a proper performance spark curve in their performance manual; It starts at about 10 degrees initial and builds to 36 degrees at around 3000. Look at the curve in an aftermarket distributor like MSD and you'll see roughly the same curve.
At idle and up until the engine can use 20 degrees or more, the flame front is fighting against the piston, costing power. Brake standing brings the RPM up to get into that range, but you don't brake stand all the while you are driving. A good curve and a mild stall convertor will keep more drivability and give response.
On street cars with milder cams, you also have a vacuum advance that helps throttle response and mileage.
When we drag race, we disconnect the vacuum and bump initial up since we are running full throttle and at full advance through the whole race anyway.
I know from dyno runs that too much of anything is detrimental to power and if this was good for anything other than a drag race, it is how all performance shops would curve their distributors and all muscle cars would have a curve like this. A proper "fast" curve will give you just as good a result and better driveability.
MSD distributors when bought new are very conservatively tuned. You can almost always get better performance from them by putting a bigger limiter bushing in them.
@@mickangio16
Yes, curving to an engine always improves performance, but the point is that it has to be a proper curve. Even MSD shows how to modify the curve, not throw a bunch of initial at it and set the total at 36. This "clip trick" is an old drag racer's trick that has fallen away as recurving produced better results in driveability and performance. A good curve is going to be at about 20 degrees at about 2000 anyway, which is probably where this brake stand is running and you don't have the disadvantages of a lot of initial.
I know stockcar mechanics who swear that you need 42 degrees or higher total, and yet, on a dyno, the best (on a 355 Chevy) was 36 degrees @2800 with 38 not much worse. This was on a Sportsman engine at 285 HP @5200 and an ACT engine with 466 HP @6300, both with the same basic curve and initial of 12 degrees.
If you are drag racing, other than a stocker with no convertor, do what you want because you are well into the curve on launch anyway, but, for street driveability and performance, you want a good timing curve.
In Fords, there may even be a difference in requirements between a 302 and a 289 because the 302 has a shorter connecting rod, but, it should still be a proper curve. Back in the late '70s, my 289 rod 302 with 4-speed ran the same curve as above with 10 degrees initial and 38 total in a dual point Mallory distributor, and it was damn snappy.
It’s little known fact that putting racing stripes on the car does the same thing
Nice to see a channel where the shorts aren't ridiculous bs.
I try lol 😅
Load up that low speed full throttle with a bunch of advance and see how long those rod bearings live.
Any takers?
This advanced timing at idle will foul the spark plugs
I'm not usually into American cars but this one is AWESOME
That Stang in red looks like a ticket machine
I must have an angel over my shoulder because i have never been pulled over in her!
In....in that car......my daily oh geez different story lol 😆
Bro the end screen 😂
To hell with all that work man. I have an even better idea.
Add an "R" to the badge to make it go faster or you can go balls out and add "GT" to make it go lightning quick.
I caution anyone to take extra precautions when adding "GT", and to maybe kiss their loved ones one last time cause it's that serious.
Lol
Until the starter motor breaks from to much advanced timming while cranking to start
You my have had a point if it was a locked out distributor.
But only 18° advance? Not gonna hurt nothing.
Goodbye points. Hello electronic ignition
Now you taking weights and make them together or they won't move then set the timing at 32° and it'll run better than that
Use lithum grease on the distributor gears
Thats the slowest v8 ive heard on u tube but i still like it.😂
That is thanks to the 2.80 gears and 28in tall tires 😆
Im going to bet you i can make this glass of water more drinkable with nothing but this single H2O molecule. **Drinks before & after different angles** 😂😂
Verry creative 👌
Sport mode, essentially
I put a fart can on mine to turn it into a weed wacker to let people know how fast my car is.
I do not recommend following this advice to anybody reading this.
Although he is technically correct as you are essentially screwing with your advance, really shouldn't put anything inside the distributor if it comes loose it can destroy things inside a stock distributor,
Points type distributors are generally relatively cheap at 60 or 80 bucks (if you can find one remanufactured they're getting pretty old). And most more modern distributors ranging from the mid-70s to the mid-90s are going for a little over a hundred bucks these days.
Anyways if that terminal end comes loose and bounces around in the distributor it can destroy a ton of the internal parts.
If you want performance by an aftermarket distributor or find different advance Springs.
Also, not being a critic but preloading that engine before you launch will help that low RPM bog that it appears to have.
You know.....everybody always talks about the lighter springs 🙄
I DID THAT IN THE VIDEO I POSTED RIGHT BEFORE THIS ONE! 😅 😆 🤣 😂
I should have mentioned it in the video i guess, just assumed they would have seen the last one i did to.
But as far as damaging anything....there is nothing down there that could get damaged really. I mean were is it going to go?
cant go up because there is a plate that sits directly above it,
Cant go down because it is sitting on that arm it is clipped around (arm bends and connects to the center shaft),
Cant go forward because the tab is in the way, cant go back because the slotted plate is right up next to it.
Cant really move.
If it did come loose it would just bounce around on top untill finding its way to the bottom of the distributor where it would just lay down there, its probably not going to Sawzall the weights and springs in half lol.
And if it came off....you would know it immediately, idle would come down a noticeable bit and it would be lazy again.
U need more Gear, n a higher stall converter
Absolutely! Just put up a video yesterday of me putting in 3.55 gears.
Good luck getting it to cold start…
Actually it cold starts better now 😅
Its not locked out at 34° or anything lol
I've always heard sawdust in engine and trans, makes everything super duper fast.
You should do that! Let us know how it works!
Put some 88mm turbos and we'll see if there's a difference.
Idle will be high as a kite though. That's the only issue
Great for a '65 mustang with big wheels.
But what about my '49 Star Chief 4-dr sedan with 3-on- the- tree & dog dishes?😎
Probably would just make the advance come in quicker with lighter springs for something like that 🤔
But idles higher at “all “ times making it more ready to take off faster , yep
I'm sure your starter is going to appreciate 20° of initial timing on a cold start
Starts right up lol.
Got a video of a cold start and a hot start up on my channel if you are interested
Maybe try using the same angle before and after.
I add a playing card to my wheels to sound like a turbo
I don't kbow about this one... that vaccum advance is there for a reason. You'll probably just go back and forth between being under powered and getting a bunch of spark knock now.
Not running vacuum advance.
I could if i had an adjustable one, then you just adjust it down so it doesn't give too much timing.
Your just changing timing on your old distributor! Are you going to update it when that Walmart spade connector spins off that post shreds your mechanical advance 😆?!
Limiting machanical avance actually.
Do it however you like but the end result is what we are looking for.
You also need to flip the air cleaner cover over
Dont even have it on lol 😆
Fun fact 🫵
Did you know that…
Tint on your car adds on 50bhp,
Decals stripes - extra 50bhp,
Decorative spoiler - another 50bhp,
And let’s not forget cheap alloys☝️
Those are at least 200bhp and if you paint them black with the spray can it’s extra 50bhp on top of 200.
So… 400bhp on top of the stock setup brings you to around 600 - 650bhp on average. And that’s without even looking under the bonnet 🫵
@@ded12021 but you forgot the most important part.......
Performance parts stickers are worth a solid 300hp! 🤣
yeah because we all got a point and condenser style distributor on our cars nowadays
If you have a hotrod.
Same exact principal for an electronic ignition.
I drilled and tapped my distributor body and inserted a machine screw to keep the timing from coming back down. Now i can run 18 initial and 36 total it runs alot better now
See!
I bet its not hard to start either lol 😂
Man you look through some of the comments ive been getting and people just dont get it 😅
@@newguysgarage6802 in their defense, most of them have never seen the inner workings of a distributor, let alone know how any of it works. Haha my carbed 5.2 magnum would only idle well at about 20 degrees or so but the distributor had alot of timing built into it almost 30 degreees. So at 20 initial i was seeing almost 50 total! (Not including the vaccum advance at cruise speed) So i turned down the distributor to 36 total and had an initial of like 6. It was a turd. Haha i liked your video. Nice mustang by the way. Im not a big ford guy but i really like the pony cars.
Ya thats fair lol 😆 not to many kids learning the details of how this all works.
Lot of guys only know how to open a laptop to tune there cars anymore.....don't even get there hands dirty, were is the fun in that? 🤣
@@newguysgarage6802 i cant imagine just being able to hook a laptop to a car and change stuff. I have no idea where to start. I only use my smart phone. I dont think ive touched an actual computer in over 10 years since i left high school.
Lol 😆
Most of us just connect our laptop to it and don't even have to open the hood. Beat that!
Might as well just play a video game at that point.
Most of the fun is opening the hood.
@@newguysgarage6802 true but you still have to know what's going on and what happens you stroke the key
Ya i know lol.
Just giving you some shit 😆
The new stuff is very convenient for sure, NOT my cup of tea but dosnt mean it cant be yours.
Steering wheel looking for wheels to turn.
How to pit your valves with 1 simple connector. I mean how much could a head rework cost anyway. Yes, the correct way is to swap out your springs, not limit the amount of total ignition advance.
Springs step 1
Limited advance step 2
Locked out distributor step 3
The three levels of performance 👏
@@newguysgarage6802 There's a reason why your idle advance and final isn't the same; spark front and discharge time. Think about it, if your engine could theoretically turn at 0 rpm, then you would want your ignition timing to be 0 deg, or exactly tdc. but in reality it takes time from igniting the mix to it actually building combustion pressure. At idle, you don't want to over compensate for that delay, cuz combustion pressure btdc is literally the recipe for ignition knock. Small amounts of this will certainly pit valves, large amounts will over time destroy the rotating assembly completely.
I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying you're 0,2mm away from teaching people how to ruin their motors. So for the love of whatever god you believe in, at least be transparent about this.
You made this video in the theme of "here's something cool I bet you never knew about your car". And yeah it is cool that you can do this, but if your target audience is people that had no clue, wouldn't you also agree that would be the same people that has no clue how to properly advance timing safely? Not to mention knowing how to properly drive a motor with limited advance.
P.S. I'm an old school guy, I like tuning for fuel then trimming in advance. So I prefer being a bit rich and allowing a for a little bit of ignition headroom. I would rather have an abundance of advance at my disposal with a wet tune, and let it go lean as I trim in some more advance. Then only when I'm happy with the when and where the advance influenced torque will I clean up the tune and still retard everything by 2 degrees.
ruclips.net/video/7b7vdCWQLi8/видео.html
Ok im not gonna lie, i didn't have time to read the entire thing but here is a video on timing from my own perspective 🙃
@@newguysgarage6802 BS. It takes 2 minutes to read that, now you want to waste more of my time because you can't be bothered to read. I'm a business man, with an engineering shop specializing in engine rebuild/modding and it goes without saying, do regular ecu tuning. You're not going to BS or educate me on this.
You're telling non car experts how to limit ignition advance, most of the comment section here won't even know what 10-20btdc even means, and the difference between 10 and 20 could be an engine rebuild in their case....Again, I'm not saying you're incorrect, because you CAN make power like this, but it's far, FAR, from a safe street mod. And you're literally now refusing to own up to that.
I didn't write any of that shit for you, its for the people reading this without chiming in. It's for the people you told to do something that could hurt their engines without even warning about the dangers thereof. Your practice is dangerous, and WILL cost someone money sooner or later, and you don't even have the transparency to read those opinions of yourself, let alone man up about it.
"Im not saying your wrong because you CAN make power like this"
Ya i know...worked for me lol.
Night and day difference in fact.
You disapprove and that is fine.......everyone is entitled to there opinion.
I'm not sure about this, but isn't that the same as keeping the throttle slightly pressed while you're not moving?
No this is changing the timing
Dude if you want to make a 289 run you need to get your power band between 4000 and 7500 rpm you need a cam a 4spd and 4:11 gears been running them for 40 years
But you need money 💰 to do all that....which i have non lol 😂 (you have no idea how much i would love that combo though!)
Technically you would need better flowing heads with stiffer valve train too.
But i have to work with what i got and what i can afford to get so i have to really use my head rather than my wallet 😆
You could also just alter the ignition timing and set the lambda sensors to 0.87 the sweet spot come on guys it’s a good idea but come on
Lambda sensors? I dont think i have those lol 😂
And i did alter the ignition timing thats what i was doing in the video!
(I assume there was sarcasm in your comment but im too out of loop with new stuff if flew right over my head lol)
Feels nice to fix an engineers dipshittery
Well to be fair to the engineers they didnt intend you to hotrod the car either lol 😆
Correct me if I’m wrong, won’t that limit your overall timing advance at higher RPM? So the car will snap but when at high revs the piston is hauling ass to tdc and that spark needs fire quicker, if it doesn’t, you’re igniting later than you should and the outcome is reduced power. No? I dunno just a thought.
Not exactly let me explain lol 🙂
Yes, it is limiting the total machanical advance so it dosnt advance as far thats correct.
But your not limiting the advance at the top of the rpm your limiting it at the bottom.
So at high rpm's it is the same as it normally would be.
But at the bottom like idle and just off idle it will have more advance than normal making it snap.
The reason it snaps is because at the lower rpms on a low compression low vacuum motor the cylinder dosnt get filled as full because of the low vacuum and the low mixture dosnt get compressed together as tightly because of the low compression ratio (static / or dynamic compression ratios)
So to get that loosely low mixture to ignite and fully burn at the right time to deliver the most power (toque) you need to light it earlier (advanced) so it has time to fully burn (less fuel / air mixture and low compression = slow burn)
So thats why having more advance early on improves bottom end performance especially with big cam low vacuum motors or low compression stock motors for that matter.
........i hope that makes sense lol 😅
@@newguysgarage6802 yep. That makes sense. I was thinking a high compression cylinder like on a ricer, you need that advance at 7k. ✊🏼
Broke guy : “I just add gasoline to make my car faster”
Been there lol 😆
Locked out dizzy is much better!
That makes no sense to me. Set the initial timing and adjust the total by adjusting the advance diaphragm via the vacuum port.
What?
Vacuum advance and machanical advance do not correlate with eachother....
Vacuum advance is ADDED to your machanical......dose not determine your machanical.
I put MSD stickers on mine and got an extra 20 horsepower
I just remove the governor from the transmission and I also remove the rev limiter for better rpm range
Why is there so much oil inside of that distributor?
Did I see this on Fast and Furious with a pop can lid?
Na that was a turbo boost controller thing i think 🤔
Pulled the vacuum line off the waste gate?
Or, hold down the brake and pedal and get those revs up.
Did both times lol
I put big tires on the back so I’m always going down hill
I could be wrong as hell because I only built one car but is your torque converter high rpm? Also is your kickdown on your transmission properly hooked up. I feel like there's something wrong with that thing I just don't know what it is. That thing should have way more power than that
The problem is a 2.80 gear, 28in tall tire, and a worn 190hp 289 lol 😆
2200 stall converter, manual valve body
Just posted a video of me putting 3.55 gears in it yesterday and will have a full test video sometime this week of that 👍
@@newguysgarage6802 awesome!
Thank you!
Won’t make it faster, but that’ll make it quicker.
The old dizzy
I believe that IS a problem.
Mine has launch control. And I can use it, when I want to. Plus, I won't completely fuck up my car.
ahh the magic of editing
Wow people really did not like the two different camera angles...
You can clearly hear the difference so i thought that was good enough.....
I did make a part 2 since this....
@@newguysgarage6802 sorry buddy its just better in my eyes if your doin a comparison to do them the exact way. Idk im goin to try it for myself. Thanks for the idea
just do the oil filter delete it takes like 2 minutes max
Had a locked out distributer on a 306 at 36 degrees all the time starting it while hot was a bitch had a kill switch for ignition so would crank car get it spinning then hit switch and have ignition come back on to get spark. Cold starts we’re fine but once you ran it for a bit was a bitch
Also partially flooding it (pump gas two three times) helps to, gets it spinning then lights 👍
If only it were this easy with modern cars..
Ya thats why i like the classic's lol
Since I don't have a distributor I do this with HP tuners .
Nice 👍